Mafiascum.net

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:07 am**

ICE wrote:Did Tierce notice that Jason breadcrumbed his role? If breadcrumbing a role is supposed to be a town tell, why is her vote on Jason? If it is not a town tell, why would she do it?

Did he? show me where. Thanks...

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:09 am**

Vote Count 1.16 - As of post 501

Tierce (3) - GreyICE, Starbuck, jasonT1981
Greenknight (1) - triangle123
jasonT1981 (5) - Tierce, Iecerint, CryMeARiver, kortul, Korlash
Acosmist (1) - T-Bone
Starbuck (1) - Greenknight
T-Bone (1) - Acosmist

Not Voting (1) - Zang

The Current deadline is July 17, 2012 at 10:00 am EDT. Countdown is (expired on 2012-07-17 10:00:00).

With 13 active votes - 7 are required to lynch.

Activity Check - greenknight has been prodded.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:11 am**

No mine! (This post loses it relevance in 5...4...3..)

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:14 am**

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:Now, im off to wash my long blonde hair (yes, its been dyed) and I am away for weekend...I plan on being so drunk I end up on the planet Messaline (or find myself in a void HAHAHA)

jason claimed Jenny, the Doctor's daughter, VT.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:16 am**

Did he himself point out that crumb or did you have to look for it after he claimed?

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:19 am**

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
↑ GreyICE wrote:Fuck this.

Not a single one of Jason's posts reads with anything resembling genuine feeling. Not genuine defense, not genuine frustration, not genuine confusion, not genuine conviction, not genuine anything.

Last post said his feeling was that Zang was town due to his reaction to my claim.

Zang... the person he was voting... and wanted me to 1v1... was probably town... due to my claim.

Zang - the person who my RVS vote was on.

Not a single onew of my reads resemling gen feeling? pot calling kettle black anyone?

L-1. Im VT, Jenny the Drs daughter. crumbed it a few times.

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
↑ Starbuck wrote:
triangle123 wrote:Jason, where did you bread-crumb?
Oi, was this ever answered?
Missed this, sorry.
↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
be still my beating hearts!
LOLGrayICE
↑ jasonT1981 wrote:But to push I was fence sitting is BS.
Now, im off to wash my long blonde hair
(yes, its been dyed) and I am away for weekend...
I plan on being so drunk I end up on the planet Messaline
(or find myself in a void HAHAHA)

tootdles!

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:22 am**

well that changes some things then... *scribbles on paper* Not enough to unvote though... But I do feel a fifth element quote coming on...

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:31 am**

Korlash, this is where he was asked about it and responded with it.

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
↑ Starbuck wrote:

triangle123 wrote:Jason, where did you bread-crumb?

Oi, was this ever answered?

Missed this, sorry.

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
be still my beating hearts!
LOLGrayICE

↑ jasonT1981 wrote:
But to push I was fence sitting is BS.
Now, im off to wash my long blonde hair
(yes, its been dyed) and I am away for weekend...
I plan on being so drunk I end up on the planet Messaline
(or find myself in a void HAHAHA)

tootdles!

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:32 am**

Oh oops, Tierce got it before me.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:38 am**

Starbuck wrote:Zang, you are the only person not voting for anyone. Who do you think is scum?

I just explained this.

I try to only vote somebody who I am confident in my scum read on them. I don't see how deadline really matters. I'm going to be on later before the deadline so there isn't really any reason for me to vote now.

I'll probably vote for Tierce but I am trying to delay my vote until somebody gives me a case on him. I don't really see any town motivation in his posts and I don't like his interaction with triangle but that doesn't make him scum. I also don't like how he says that he will refuse to do a fullclaim but I do think that is scummy.

As for who I think is scum, I explained my position on greenknight in one of my previous posts. I'm also getting increasingly suspicious of Korlash and Acosmist.

Korlash wrote:We've already covered it way back

No we didn't. You said why you thought I was scum, went on V/LA and then I responded to your case. Now, you come back, ignore my responce and continue to call me scum. That is scummy.

Korlash wrote:But you add in my past suspicions with the fact you are not currently voting anyone even with the pressing deadline plus the fact I cannot remember the last person you DID vote, and your comments about how you have some people you would vote for but wont because they haven't done anything just sounds whack.

So it's scummy that I don't vote somebody because of the deadline and it's also scummy that I consider voting somebody because of deadline?

This reasoning is contradictory.

Korlash wrote:You say you might vote for Teirce and even show to have some understanding of a case on her what with adding your own bit about her FoS being weak, but you stick to simply 'asking for a case on her' without taking ANY pro-active action in either finding the case, or making your own conclusion.

Obviously I know some things about the Tierce case that I have picked up by myself. But GreyICE is calling him obvious scum everytime after he posts and I would like to know how he came to that conclusion.

Korlash wrote:This close to deadline with NO ONE you're willing to vote for, to say "you would vote for Teirce" but not actually look/find a reason to does not sound like a town action

First you say that I'm not willing to vote for anybody and then you say that I am willing to vote for Teirce.

Again, This reasoning is contradictory.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:00 am**

For the (n+1)th time, I'm female.

↑ Zang wrote:I'll probably vote for Tierce but I am trying to delay my vote until somebody gives me a case on him. I don't really see any town motivation in his posts and I don't like his interaction with triangle but that doesn't make him scum. I also don't like how he says that he will refuse to do a fullclaim but I do think that is scummy.

This whole section is awful.

- No town motivation? There's plenty of town motivation in them because I'm town and I'm trying to lynch scum.
- My interaction with triangle? Is your issue with it that I reacted with 'just' a FoS? So you only move your vote in extreme circumstances, but it's bad for me to give triangle the benefit of the doubt while inquiring whether or not she's

breaching game integrity

?
- Where did I say not-fullclaiming was scummy? I'm not fullclaiming because 1) I'm at L-4 and 2) it's not beneficial for the whole game to have information on my role. The last two games I played as scum (Paranoia and ERM), we got screwed over in one and I almost lolsuicided in another because we didn't have

full and correct

info on town roles. I am definitely not going to out mine at this stage and make it easier for scum to know what to do to hinder the town.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:45 am**

Busy last couple of days, picking up prod and catching up now

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:48 am**

Finished

Tierce

ISO. She remains my town read, though not that strong, mostly because of the general absence of activity on her part during last week (i know, it more indicates priorities elsewhere, but i subtract town points for this). I don't follow the Grey view on Tierce, maybe it is more based on his experience with her. Half claim is ok with me, since she wasn't at danger range, but leaves in Europe (ie there are chances to be lynched while asleep).

I am going to bed, and don't see anything on Jason part to change my opinion on him. Of all the things to comment or answer he just deflected one thing and disappeared.

If in the morning we will be still in Day 1, i may have more thoughts based on new content. And during the Night 1 i will try to do a research on Iecerint, to see whether something useful is hidden in his meta, he is my town read but i have a feeling he is staying under radar.

Almost forgot, i noticed one thing -

Tierce

never mentioned or commented on

Acosmist

(and he pretty much did the same towards her). I don't view this as scummy or indicates connection, just curious. So, what are your reads on each other?

And if we are talking about reads -

Korlash

, if your strongest scum reads are based on tells, can you share those tells? Nobody can be sure to live through the night (that's why i try to explain my reads before the night).

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:43 am**

↑ Tierce wrote:You're joking, right?

I didn't fullclaim at L-4--wow, what an absurd notion. I'm indicating that there are breadcrumbs for my role. Yes, I'm claiming PR. Preeeetty obvious that if I'm breacrumbing it's because there may be important stuff revealed
after I die
that people will need to detect. -_-
The more you know.
Go reread MLP, Grey.

Weren't you scum in MLP?

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:56 am**

Blasphemer!

I was. Not talking about me.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:00 pm**

Zang wrote:No we didn't. You said why you thought I was scum, went on V/LA and then I responded to your case. Now, you come back, ignore my responce and continue to call me scum. That is scummy.

And waiting until I go V/la to respond to it isn't scummy? Certainly not responding to your comments wouldn't be something I'm proud of, but don't try and call that action scummy if you are saying you didn't make those responses until after I left mate. I might not feel the need to respond to them at the moment, but that's hardly ignoring something I wasn't here for.

If memory serves you made those responses right before I left and I never had time nor the notion to respond to them. Perhaps that is slight ignoration, but I don't care. Right now I'm merely calling you scum, not pushing you as it. Perhaps you should care less about why I think you are scum right now and focus more on who YOU think is scum. This whole self preservation attitude preceding deadline is never a good sign.

Zang wrote:So it's scummy that I don't vote somebody because of the deadline and it's also scummy that I consider voting somebody because of deadline?

This reasoning is contradictory.

No it isn't, you've either taken me out of context or as misrepresenting my comments. Not voting before deadline (and preceding that quite a ways as well) is not normally seen as a town move. Our only power during the day is a vote and it tends to be used quite readily by most. Now that is not to say that town don't do this, I have seen many town not use their votes, but this creates a style of play.

IF, your town style of play is to not use your vote even with the impending deadline, than it stands to reason that your play would reflect this in some way. AS it stands, it doesn't. You verbally say you are willing to vote Teirce and even pose towards her what appears to be a fragmented attack aimed at her but you constantly are asking 'what the case on her is' and using that as a reason not to vote. This implies to me that you are not the type of person who doesn't readily use their vote, but are instead actively looking for a reason NOT to use your vote.

Are you admitting then that you said you would vote for people 'because of the deadline'? I don't believe that was what I said so I'd like to know if that is really how you felt when you said it.

Zang wrote:Obviously I know some things about the Tierce case that I have picked up by myself. But GreyICE is calling him obvious scum everytime after he posts and I would like to know how he came to that conclusion.

Then why didn't you ask him directly? If memory serves, I thought you posted that question to the thread not to a specific person. Why have you not gone back three pages and read up the Teirce case? With time running out, if you truly cared, it seems like a risk to simply ask... especially when the first time you asked you didn't get a response.

zang wrote:First you say that I'm not willing to vote for anybody and then you say that I am willing to vote for Teirce.

Again, This reasoning is contradictory.

This is just stupid, you see what you think looks like a contradiction and instead of actually reading it you choose to use it as an attack. You can add 'pointlessly choosing to attack the people attacking you instead of reading what they post' to reasons I think you are scum now.

YOU say there is no one you're willing to vote as evidenced by your comment earlier about it AND the fact you are not voting anyone, and YOU say you 'might be willing to vote Teirce' but hide behind an ignorance surrounding her case. There is no contradiction because YOU said all of it, not me.

A townie who isn't voting someone but sees someone they MIGHT be willing to vote for should take an active approach in finding reason to either remain voteless or to in fact vote them. YOU choose to sit there and wait to be told what to do. That is stalling scum who wants other people to do the work for him. You are not scum hunting, you have focused more on defending yourself than finding scum these last few posts, and above all you show no interest in actually understanding what is perhaps the most important thing a townie should know right now, the main lynch wagons.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:08 pm**

Zang wrote:I'll probably vote for Tierce but
I am trying to delay my vote until somebody gives me a case on him
. I don't really see any town motivation in his posts and I don't like his interaction with triangle but that doesn't make him scum. I also don't like how he says that he will refuse to do a fullclaim but I do think that is scummy.

Town don't let other people make their cases for them. I'm beginning to see a point where I can just rest my case and let you hang yourself.

did you ever ask her to full claim? Have you commented on her interaction with triangle before? Have you actually done any of your own discussion involving Teirce at all? (Aside from the fos thing)

Teirce wrote:For the (n+1)th time, I'm female.

damn straight you are. Rawl...

Kortul wrote:And if we are talking about reads - Korlash, if your strongest scum reads are based on tells, can you share those tells? Nobody can be sure to live through the night (that's why i try to explain my reads before the night).

I wont give my reads immediately before deadline 'just for the hell of it'. It would take me an hour to discuss with you the benefits vs. the risks of posting them but I'd rather not. The fact is the scum have to CHOOSE who to nightkill. I would rather risk my input being silenced over helping them make that choice anyday.

I will say that as far as 'tells' go, it's a shitty thing to say because a 'tell' is not a good definition for anything. I think scum would do thing A, does that make thing A a tell? *shrugs* I think the people I have called scum are scum for things they have done, I choose to leave it at that for now. Given Zang's recent stuff though, I may find time to delve into my read on him before deadline passes though.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:28 pm**

Argh. I don't like a Jason lynch nor a Tierce lynch. I've had a town read on Jason this whole day, and though I have a basically null read on Tierce because I still wanted to hear more from her about her thoughts on players other than Jason, I'm definitely not up for lynching a claimed power role. But I know it's too late for a GK or T-Bone lynch to go through, so:

Unvote

Vote: Jason

It's preferable to a no-lynch. Jason is now at L-1.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:43 pm**

Literally been going back and forth between Jason and Tierce for the past hour.

Ok I see Tierce's 444 where she explains her earlier stance on me as convincing enough - I looked over that and her original posts regarding me for inconsistencies a few times. Didn't find anything. Really don't see what the point of claiming "unspecified PR" at L-4 is though. my problem is she SOUNDS town, and if she is town she'll be a lot more of an asset than Jason would be, but something just FEELS off.

I can't believe I'm doing this,

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:50 pm**

because I'm not even a gut-feeling type of player normally and I'm pretty sick of Jason's lack of content posts, but

vote: Tierce

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:54 pm**

Vote: Tierce

It's clear that neither GreyICE or anybody else is going to explain their case to me.

And apparently, it's also a big deal if I vote now instead of two hours from now.

Also, I prefer this too a jason lynch.

Tierce wrote:No town motivation? There's plenty of town motivation in them because I'm town and I'm trying to lynch scum.

This is terrible reasoning. Please explain to me how that can be proven.

Tierce wrote:My interaction with triangle? Is your issue with it that I reacted with 'just' a FoS? So you only move your vote in extreme circumstances, but it's bad for me to give triangle the benefit of the doubt while inquiring whether or not she's breaching game integrity?

That is a good point. Although, I still don't understand what your FoS was supposed to accomplish.

Tierce wrote:- Where did I say not-fullclaiming was scummy? I'm not fullclaiming because 1) I'm at L-4 and 2) it's not beneficial for the whole game to have information on my role. The last two games I played as scum (Paranoia and ERM), we got screwed over in one and I almost lolsuicided in another because we didn't have full and correct info on town roles. I am definitely not going to out mine at this stage and make it easier for scum to know what to do to hinder the town.

Where did I say that you said it? I am saying that I think it is scummy.

1. You will refuse to claim later in the game too, correct?
2. That is possible but it is also possible that you are scum and just saying this to avoid getting lynched. I think it is scummy because we are going to find out whether you claim or you are lynched. So if you get to L-1, it is more beneficial to the town if you claim.

Korlash wrote:And waiting until I go V/la to respond to it isn't scummy? Certainly not responding to your comments wouldn't be something I'm proud of, but don't try and call that action scummy if you are saying you didn't make those responses until after I left mate. I might not feel the need to respond to them at the moment, but that's hardly ignoring something I wasn't here for.

What are you talking about? On the same day, I posted 3 hours after you called me scum and 1 hour after your last post. How is that waiting to respond until you are V/LA?

Korlash wrote:Perhaps you should care less about why I think you are scum right now and focus more on who YOU think is scum. This whole self preservation attitude preceding deadline is never a good sign.

How is it self preservation? You're not even voting me. I just hate it when terrible cases are made against me. And how does deadline even matter?

Korlash wrote:IF, your town style of play is to not use your vote even with the impending deadline, than it stands to reason that your play would reflect this in some way. AS it stands, it doesn't. You verbally say you are willing to vote Teirce and even pose towards her what appears to be a fragmented attack aimed at her but you constantly are asking 'what the case on her is' and using that as a reason not to vote. This implies to me that you are not the type of person who doesn't readily use their vote, but are instead actively looking for a reason NOT to use your vote.

I explained my reason for doing this in that post.

Korlash wrote:Are you admitting then that you said you would vote for people 'because of the deadline'? I don't believe that was what I said so I'd like to know if that is really how you felt when you said it.

I guess neither of us said it but it is what I meant when I originally posted it.

Korlash wrote:Then why didn't you ask him directly? If memory serves, I thought you posted that question to the thread not to a specific person. Why have you not gone back three pages and read up the Teirce case? With time running out, if you truly cared, it seems like a risk to simply ask... especially when the first time you asked you didn't get a response.

Isn't it fun to accuse people of things that they haven't done without reading the thread? (sarcasm)

I specifically asked him in post 423 and I thought he would tell me after I mentioned it again in post 469.

Also:

"She's angry that people think she's scum FOR THE WRONG REASONS.

My god, town-tierce would be like "fuck you, it's a town tell because I'm town, so lets move on and I'll do some really good analysis of this game." Scum-Tierce is like "well, I've totally done this as town before, really folks, this is a TERRIBLE reason to lynch me!" "

How could that be the case when he voted her the page before that even happened?

Korlash wrote:This is just stupid, you see what you think looks like a contradiction and instead of actually reading it you choose to use it as an attack. You can add 'pointlessly choosing to attack the people attacking you instead of reading what they post' to reasons I think you are scum now.

I think I might have misunderstood what you were saying. I'm really tired.

Korlash wrote:YOU say there is no one you're willing to vote as evidenced by your comment earlier about it AND the fact you are not voting anyone, and YOU say you 'might be willing to vote Teirce' but hide behind an ignorance surrounding her case. There is no contradiction because YOU said all of it, not me.

I am not sure what comment you are talking about. However, if deadline was a week away, I wouldn't be voting anyone. But deadline isn't and I prefer a Tierce lynch to a no lynch.

Korlash wrote:A townie who isn't voting someone but sees someone they MIGHT be willing to vote for should take an active approach in finding reason to either remain voteless or to in fact vote them. YOU choose to sit there and wait to be told what to do. That is stalling scum who wants other people to do the work for him. You are not scum hunting, you have focused more on defending yourself than finding scum these last few posts, and above all you show no interest in actually understanding what is perhaps the most important thing a townie should know right now, the main lynch wagons.

How am I just sitting here?

Korlash wrote:Town don't let other people make their cases for them. I'm beginning to see a point where I can just rest my case and let you hang yourself.

did you ever ask her to full claim? Have you commented on her interaction with triangle before? Have you actually done any of your own discussion involving Teirce at all? (Aside from the fos thing)

Once again, I just explained this in the post that you quoted.

1. Why would I want a full claim when she's not at L-1? I think it's scummy that she is saying that she will refuse to claim when at L-1.
2. Her interaction with triangle is the FoS thing.
3. As you just stated in the same sentence but somehow ignore now, I also think that him refusing to claim is scummy.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:04 pm**

I apologize Zang, I've been pulling my hair out due to these term papers. For me, I haven't liked Tierce's constant focus on Jason and nearly no one else. I feel that she misrepresented Jason in order to start a wagon, which can be seen in my post #287.

I also didn't like Tierce's complete overreaction at triangle who, in my eyes, was defending her and completely misrepresenting what triangle had to say. That's two misrepresentations and we are only on Day 1. Tierce has also spent more time going on about how she isn't lurking and how much she hates meta/outside influence than she has actually providing content to the game. She also said that she doesn't lurk as scum, which definitely seems to be what she is doing.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:14 pm**

I also am of the belief that if you are going to claim then you claim everything about your role or you don't claim at all. Now, I'm not all the way caught up on Doctor Who, but I know who River is. I think she could easily be a cover and I'm not believing her one bit.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:39 pm**

I wouldn't regard the character names as being any evidence of alignment even if true.

Posted: **Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:56 pm**

↑ Zang wrote:
Tierce wrote:No town motivation? There's plenty of town motivation in them because I'm town and I'm trying to lynch scum.
This is terrible reasoning. Please explain to me how that can be proven.

The hell? You say my posts have no town motivation, I say they have, and you're asking me to

prove how I'm town?

You do realize I can't do that without posting my role PM/claiming masons with someone, right? No, YOU have terrible reasoning; you say my posts have no town motivation, then show where you think they are lacking it, don't ask

me

to prove otherwise.

↑ Zang wrote:
Tierce wrote:My interaction with triangle? Is your issue with it that I reacted with 'just' a FoS? So you only move your vote in extreme circumstances, but it's bad for me to give triangle the benefit of the doubt while inquiring whether or not she's breaching game integrity?
That is a good point. Although, I still don't understand what your FoS was supposed to accomplish.

Pushing her when we're close to deadline, while not shifting from a wagon that I believe will hit scum. FoSes are minor signs of suspicion.

↑ Zang wrote:
Tierce wrote:- Where did I say not-fullclaiming was scummy? I'm not fullclaiming because 1) I'm at L-4 and 2) it's not beneficial for the whole game to have information on my role. The last two games I played as scum (Paranoia and ERM), we got screwed over in one and I almost lolsuicided in another because we didn't have full and correct info on town roles. I am definitely not going to out mine at this stage and make it easier for scum to know what to do to hinder the town.
Where did I say that you said it? I am saying that I think it is scummy.

Oh, I see, I misinterpreted the following due to the unnecessary padding:

Zang [with clauses separated] wrote:[X] I don't really see any town motivation in his posts and I don't like his interaction with triangle [1] but that doesn't make him scum.
[Y] I also don't like how he says that he will refuse to do a fullclaim [2] but I do think that is scummy.

No, it's not scummy. I'm refusing to fullclaim because at this stage I would

really

, really rather not fullclaim. It brings no benefit for the town if I out my role now, and a lot of benefit to scum. My role name can be confirmed via any name/flavor cop, so there is interest in doing a partial claim and say I have a PR because it would be

really stupid

to get lynched over a scummy, survivalistic, claimed VT

on D1

, if I say so myself.

↑ Zang wrote:1. You will refuse to claim later in the game too, correct?

Unlikely that I'll

never claim

. But the timing and circumstances are my choice, not anyone else's.

↑ Zang wrote:2. That is possible but it is also possible that you are scum and just saying this to avoid getting lynched. I think it is scummy because we are going to find out whether you claim or you are lynched. So if you get to L-1, it is more beneficial to the town if you claim.

Or you could drop the wagon, let me do my job, do your own and everyone will be one big happy town family. Lynching jason would be a good start.

↑ Zang wrote:
Korlash wrote:Town don't let other people make their cases for them. I'm beginning to see a point where I can just rest my case and let you hang yourself.

did you ever ask her to full claim? Have you commented on her interaction with triangle before? Have you actually done any of your own discussion involving Teirce at all? (Aside from the fos thing)
Once again, I just explained this in the post that you quoted.

1. Why would I want a full claim when she's not at L-1? I think it's scummy that she is saying that she will refuse to claim when at L-1.
2. Her interaction with triangle is the FoS thing.
3. As you just stated in the same sentence but somehow ignore now, I also think that him refusing to claim is scummy.

So... what exactly is there for me to address here?

↑ Starbuck wrote:I apologize Zang, I've been pulling my hair out due to these term papers. For me, I haven't liked Tierce's constant focus on Jason and nearly no one else. I feel that she misrepresented Jason in order to start a wagon, which can be seen in my post #287.

I also didn't like Tierce's complete overreaction at triangle who, in my eyes, was defending her and completely misrepresenting what triangle had to say. That's two misrepresentations and we are only on Day 1. Tierce has also spent more time going on about how she isn't lurking and how much she hates meta/outside influence than she has actually providing content to the game. She also said that she doesn't lurk as scum, which definitely seems to be what she is doing.

Yes so I would be attacking a person who is defending me for kicks. GOOD JOB, Starbuck, really. How many times do I have to repeat that I have issues with game integrity? You interpreted it in a different manner, I'm playing with triangle elsewhere, I'm entitled to see different things from you. Have you seen my reaction to Nobody Special in Mafia with the Kitties (did I link that?)? When I HAMMER someone over game integrity, then you can say something about overreactions. I was trying to tone it down because I know this disrupts games, and you call it overreaction? It wasn't a misrep, I was WRONG. I admitted it and backed off. Wow, that is really scummy.

↑ Starbuck wrote:So this moves me onto Tierce, who caused this whole rush onto Jason with her #70, and she's still riding this train as is GreyICE who hasn't even given a reason for voting Jason.

Tierce wrote:These two posts are written with completely different frames of mind.
This bothers me. You cannot assume that you know where Jason's mind is when he posts. Also, given the above and the fact that he DID take a stance, it debunks your entire case.

Hell

no. Yes, I can assume. That's what mafia is all about--trying to put ourselves in people's minds and assuming if that would be the position/motivation/action we would take if we were town in their place. And no, he did not take a stance, not when he is suggesting a 1v1 to force Grey to take a position himself, or when bringing up daycops and lynchers--he's not dismissing it, so jason was NOT "not believing GreyICE for one second". He was showing all these ~positions~ and not really taking any, despite his claim--because his previous words say otherwise.

↑ Starbuck wrote:I also am of the belief that if you are going to claim then you claim everything about your role or you don't claim at all. Now, I'm not all the way caught up on Doctor Who, but I know who River is. I think she could easily be a cover and I'm not believing her one bit.

This logic does not follow. I believe there is no issue with nameclaiming and any possible flavor cop can confirm me, BUT fullclaiming would give info to the scum I don't want them to have.

↑ kortul wrote:Almost forgot, i noticed one thing -
Tierce
never mentioned or commented on
Acosmist
(and he pretty much did the same towards her). I don't view this as scummy or indicates connection, just curious. So, what are your reads on each other?

At the beginning of the day, Acosmist had scumreads on both jason and greenknight. He poses questions to players, which is a good way of showing interest/curiosity/intent of lynching scum, but I don't see follow-up to these. Like Post 81 to greenknight. He interacts more with kortul and Starbuck, but it still feels mostly empty. For someone who had a scumread on jason and greenknight, he isn't pushing either--and the questions to others fall mostly flat.

However, Post 284 is absolutely fierce. It feels genuine in that he is actually pissed that someone is misrepresenting him; he seems truly outraged at T-Bone's accusations. Post 286 finally comes around as to why he thinks jason and greenknight are scummy, and while I think the read on greenknight is wrong, I can see where it could come from from a town perspective more than an opportunistic scum mindset. It's explored, it's looking at motivations--it's good analysis.

And he hates M:tG walls, he's obvtown.

My problem here is--he's voting T-Bone. For someone who has this kind of developed read on jason, why isn't he voting jason when jason had 4 votes? Why did he feel the need to push a competitive 2p wagon with Korlash, who wasn't even around? Three days to deadline, he was still on that wagon, and his activity completely dropped off the map in terms of content. It's a null-town read, but I definitely want more activity from this slot.

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