Newbie 1433 - Game Over
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- Nominull
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Nominull Mafia Scum
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Why isn't 2Pac going to happen? I don't understand this. If you're casting around for a compromise lynch he's the obvious choice. Even if you don't agree with my case on him, he's obnoxious and we'll all breathe easier once he's dead. If all you want is a lynch, any lynch, why not go with that lynch? If people would stop saying "it's never gonna happen" it would happen in a heartbeat.- Skelda
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Skelda he/himZee Retiree
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Nomni, if we can get enough people to vote 2Pac, I will. I'd prefer Satan, but if he doesn't have the votes 2Pac is next best for me.
I'm not sure if the people on me agree, however, since 2Pac could potentially be Satan's partner, but the idea that he could be my partner is ridiculous. For me, he is a big question mark, he might just be a bad, bad townie, though.- Nominull
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Nominull Mafia Scum
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With you me and Regfan that's 3 already. The problem is everybody sees nobody voting for him, says "oh he doesn't have the votes" and then doesn't vote for him, so nobody else sees them voting for him.In post 501, Skelda wrote:Nomni, if we can get enough people to vote 2Pac, I will. I'd prefer Satan, but if he doesn't have the votes 2Pac is next best for me.- Regfan
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So, so, so hungover.
I still need to read Post 471 a few more times, will do it later. Satans whole "A real claim, what do you mean" confuses me, there's really only two ways I can see it; 1) Town not really paying attention or 2) Scum that doesn't know that people get specific roles and therefore thinks when it comes to 'claim time' they just have to say town. That said Ree does somewhat have a point that Satan not wanting to switch to Nom is a town-tell, Scum!Satan would do so to save himself in this situation. Still think he's scum but not sa confident.
Skeldas Post 475 actually reads as genine and town and I remember reading that they lost their last newbie game as town becasue there was no lynch D1 so his demeaner here is really understandable.
Ree, I'm not lynching Nom. He's town. Very confident in that. If you think Satan is town can we compromise and lynch 2Pac?
Unvote, Vote: 2Pac- Regfan
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- Mr_Ree
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Whoops found a hole...
I thought 2pac was supposed to be scum with Satan. How does town Satan mean scum 2pac?
Has anyone actually made a case against 2pac that doesn't involve his gimmick? I think its pretty clear he intended on posting like that regardless of which alignment he drew. In fact, he would have stopped doing it if he was scum so he wouldn't get lynched. Since it would be playing against wincon and all..
I gave you two perfectly viable candidates for scum. I listed reasons why they could be scum. What makes them so town to you that you wouldn't consider it? Please share, because if for some reason you die tonight, I will still be pushing my suspects tomorrow. If I die, I would want people to focus on you, Nom and Skelda. Especially if this silly 2pac mislynch goes through.Knowledge is the key to understanding.- Ranawey
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Ree, you're actually starting to piss me of a large part of the reason I joined this game was because I saw your posts inside the win % thread and thought it meant that you'd be highly competent as town but your play isn't showing that at all (And yes; I'm fairly damn positive you're town).
I have a scum read on Satan. I have a scum read on 2Pac. I think Satan and 2Pacs interactions work as partners. Satan not voting Nominull does read townish and does make me second guess my read on him (I still think he's scum but aren't 100% positive as I was before) and since you don't want to lynch Satan it leads the only move to lynch 2Pac since I have a scum read on him and you never stated a town read on him previously.
And yes, I have stated why I think 2Pac is scum ignoring Satan - he's attempting to misrepresent and decredit my reads by creating bullshit like "All based on meta" "All based on interactions" and I've pointed out that they were lies, his response was "Yes, you're right I was lying, I wanted to make you look bad". Town don't attempt to make people look bad for no reason. Scum do. Then there's also the fact that he's been lurking throughout a decent portion of the game and recently stated a town read on Satan with no explanation (And this doesn't change regardless of Satans alignment). And no, he came into this game with the intention of using this gimmick that means he'd stick with it regardless of his alignment and regardless of the position.
I've literally told you why I think your scum read is wrong. I've told you how your reasoning is wrong. God.- Mr_Ree
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Mr_Ree Mafia Scum
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In post 398, Regfan wrote:Okay, answer me this then; How is him not posting for three days any different to the following situations:
1) Mr Ree not posting from the 13th to the 16th
2) Sthar not posting in the last 3 days
3) Skelda not posting from the 18th to the 20th
4) Satan not posting from the 12th to the 15th and from the 18th to the 20th
The answer is that it isn't any different and you're fabricating reasoning to continue pushing towards 2Pac for what really is a policy lynch. And what about his posts do you read as fluff other than his rap-sections because there is actual stances and reads in his ISO. None in yours though.Knowledge is the key to understanding.- Regfan
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In post 400, Regfan wrote:Look I'm not going to argue that continuously lurking and not being in the game isn't scummy because in truth it is, also I just checked Satan and 2Pacs profile and both logged on last night and didn't post. I also checked this is both of their only games. That means they logged on, read the thread and didn't post. It also means they logged on, saw they were voted and didn't post. That's actually a relatively strong scum tell but I think you're just tunnel-visioning 2Pac a little too much and not paying enough attention elsewhere.For instance please take a step back for one second (Please, I'm trying to work with you here) and read and comment on Post 363 and Post 365 because I've caught Satan in a 100% lie here and one that makes zero sense coming from town but a lot coming from scum. Also 2Pac blew it of as him being "newb" and not "scum" with zero reasoning so if you're as confident as you claim you are about 2Pac being scum then that makes Satan a super likely partner to him with him attempting to defend his partner with terrible reasoning and not comment on the case. So yeah, please do one thing for me and read those posts and actually converse with me about it.- Regfan
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Seriously you're not working with meat allhere. I've told you why I think Nom is town. I've told you what I think of Skeldas recent posting is town though there's a lot of his early game that I do read as scummy so if you're right about either of the two of them it's this guy.
So now answer the following two:
1) Why is Satan town (Bar him not voting Nom here)?
2) Why is 2Pac town?- Regfan
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The truth is you're opposing a 2Pac lynch becauseI'mleading it and you don't want me to be right.
Want to make a deal? We lynch 2Pac; he flips scum you sheep me for the rest of the game or if I die you lynch Satan and if that doesn't end the game then perhaps Skelda afterwards. If he flips town I'll vote whoever you want tomorrow. Do we have a deal?- Nominull
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More nonsense from Mr. Ree, Townie Extraordinaire. It's never playing to your wincondition to get lynched for your disruptive behavior, scum or town. If he were playing to wincon and the town displayed any willingness to lynch him for his behavior, either wincon would stop. But up until a few hours ago I was a lonely voice crying out in the wilderness for his lynch, and from that perspective, if you can get away with it, a gimmick like that helps you slide under the radar. Because of that gimmick, people like Mr. Ree, The Best Town Player In The World, dismiss the case on him as solely based on his gimmick and don't give any thought to his other scummy behaviors. From that perspective it's perfectly good play for the scum wincon, and the town that doesn't lynch him have only themselves to blame for getting outplayed.In post 507, Mr_Ree wrote:Has anyone actually made a case against 2pac that doesn't involve his gimmick? I think its pretty clear he intended on posting like that regardless of which alignment he drew. In fact, he would have stopped doing it if he was scum so he wouldn't get lynched. Since it would be playing against wincon and all..- Nominull
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Don't feed me that AtE. My win ratio is that high because I won't compromise on my reads, I defend my townreads and I keep an open mind. Nobody has truely given me any reason to suspect 2pac. What you are saying about him now contradicts what you said earlier.
What would you like me to do? Abandon my reads and tell people to follow you? I said at the beginning that i was goin to show people how the game is meant to be played. Abandoning my reads for the sake of a wagon I don't believe in is not how one plays town. If you joined to see if you can win against me, I've beaten better. If you joined to see how awesome I am at catching scum, listen up. This isn't something to get mad about. If you truely are town, treat me as an obstacle or change my mind. It's not just me you have to convince, you need 2 more to get your 2pac lynch. If it turns out you are wrong, you can swallow your pride and try again. If it turns out I'm wrong, I'll do the same.
Do you not see the benefit of a counterwagon? Do you not see the benefit of forcing people to take hard stances on their reads?
Overcome my questions with answers. Counter my points with facts. Guide me with the truth.
If I just lay down and die, I cannot show you what you wanted to see in me. You wanted to learn but you cannot learn from one who teaches nothing.Knowledge is the key to understanding.- Regfan
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There is no benefit to a counterwagon at this position at all. There's one day until the deadline hits, literally one day and we'd have to factor in 1) Having the person we want to lynch claim 2) Assessing the legitimacy of their claim 3) Garnering votes to move the wagon if we believe the claim and 4) Actually having people come on and given how people have shown they're not super active in this game that won't be easy.
And again you're ignoring me. You're not working with me at all. ANSWER THER MOTHERFUCKING QUESTION; WHY IS 2PAC TOWN? GO. ANSWER. Because you state you're defending you're town reads but you've stated no reasoning behind him being town at all. The entire reason you won't lynch him is becauseIhave him as scum which is petty and stupid. I have given you facts, you're ignoring them. I have given you information I have attempted to guide you to get there and attempted to converse with you but you're not working with me at all.- Nominull
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Nominull Mafia Scum
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That's an inspiring speech, but the problem is that you're not demonstrating how awesome you are at catching scum at all. I'm town, and that ought to be obvious if you know what you're doing. Sticking to your reads even in the face of evidence to the contrary is not how one plays town. Refusing to say anything that might contradict what you said earlier is not how one plays town; it is in fact how one plays scum. It has been said, a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.In post 516, Mr_Ree wrote:Don't feed me that AtE. My win ratio is that high because I won't compromise on my reads, I defend my townreads and I keep an open mind. Nobody has truely given me any reason to suspect 2pac. What you are saying about him now contradicts what you said earlier.
What would you like me to do? Abandon my reads and tell people to follow you? I said at the beginning that i was goin to show people how the game is meant to be played. Abandoning my reads for the sake of a wagon I don't believe in is not how one plays town. If you joined to see if you can win against me, I've beaten better. If you joined to see how awesome I am at catching scum, listen up. This isn't something to get mad about. If you truely are town, treat me as an obstacle or change my mind. It's not just me you have to convince, you need 2 more to get your 2pac lynch. If it turns out you are wrong, you can swallow your pride and try again. If it turns out I'm wrong, I'll do the same.
Do you not see the benefit of a counterwagon? Do you not see the benefit of forcing people to take hard stances on their reads?
Overcome my questions with answers. Counter my points with facts. Guide me with the truth.
If I just lay down and die, I cannot show you what you wanted to see in me. You wanted to learn but you cannot learn from one who teaches nothing.- Regfan
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Regfan Jack of All Trades
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Also I didn't join to "learn" shit from you. I joined because I thought if there's a competent player in the room I might have someone listening to me for once. But nope. Isn't happening, instead you're being stubborn and refusing to converse and instead want to just sit around with a no lynch likely happening (And oh watch, it will or we'll have some blitz lynch in the last minutes potentially hitting a PR).- Mr_Ree
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Mr_Ree Mafia Scum
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This is absolutely 100% wrong. I want you to be right. I can swallow my pride and 70% of day 1 lynches are wrong anyway.In post 513, Regfan wrote:The truth is you're opposing a 2Pac lynch becauseI'mleading it and you don't want me to be right.
Want to make a deal? We lynch 2Pac; he flips scum you sheep me for the rest of the game or if I die you lynch Satan and if that doesn't end the game then perhaps Skelda afterwards. If he flips town I'll vote whoever you want tomorrow. Do we have a deal?
I just don't see it. Others don't see it. Lead us to water and maybe we will drink.
Thing about going after a player who plays sporadically is, at this stage, he may not even get the chance to claim or defend himself. Perfect specimen for a late day mislynch.
Nom on the other hand is an active player who does nothing but tunnel, refuses to make any other reads and discredits attackers... Perfect candidate for scum.
What it sounds like to me is that you are trying to one up me. If that's the case, you have to be right. Are you sure you are?Knowledge is the key to understanding.- Nominull
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Nominull Mafia Scum
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I hope you don't regret replacing in, I have great respect for your play in this game, scum or town.In post 519, Regfan wrote:Also I didn't join to "learn" shit from you. I joined because I thought if there's a competent player in the room I might have someone listening to me for once. But nope. Isn't happening, instead you're being stubborn and refusing to converse and instead want to just sit around with a no lynch likely happening (And oh watch, it will or we'll have some blitz lynch in the last minutes potentially hitting a PR).
(I wanted to say this, I felt like I should say this, as one human being to another. Mafia is an adversarial game and sometimes it is easier to put someone down than to give them credit for what they do. I would like to oppose this state of affairs, please take this in the spirit that it is given so that we can all work toward a more friendly environment to play in.)- Mr_Ree
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Did I mention I play by phone >_>
Look Reg, I have NOTHING against you so please stop thinking I do. This is getting weird and personal.
What is it that you want me to do?
You are getting all psycho on me for not sharing your reads when you, yourself only solidified your reads a few pages ago. I've seen nothing to change my mind.... yet. When I ask you to enlighten me, you don't.
@Nom: How is it exactly that I'm supposed to know you are town when you don't act like it. Please make a towncase on yourselfso I can see what you are seeing.
2pac towncase incoming.Knowledge is the key to understanding.- Mr_Ree
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- Regfan
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Thanks Nom but I'm growing a little tired of replacing into games, being ignored, being nightkilled and watching loses. Or replacing in and not being 'trusted' and ignored due to it. It's not a fun pattern.
Ree, I'm pretty positive I'm right on 2Pac being scum here; solid scum read on him and a lot of town reads that I'd put a lot of money on. And the "70% of D1s are mslynches" isn't the case I've found (I normally die N1 or N2) but during D1 or D2 we have about 70% correct lynches.But again, you're not answering me; Why is 2Pac town?(Awaiting the case) And the concept of "Lets not lynch people who post sporadically" is a dreadful one since it incentives scum to lurk and means that scum don't have to be active, it's bad in theory and bad in practice.
What I want from you Ree is not much to ask; it's to work with me, talk with me about why you think my town-tells on X / Y are wrong. Why you think my scum reads on A / B are wrong. Why A / B are town and why we shouldn't lynch them. It's really not much to ask for. And I have "Enlightened" you as to what my reads are and the reasoning behind it, do you really need me to go and quote all of them? - Regfan
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