Signs and Void (Game Over) [TM2015]

[Cheetory6]

I've started kind of caring again, if it makes you feel better?
Wanna talk about things?
Scumreads? Townreads?
Politics?

[Cheetory6]

Would you be down to help start a wagon on Aronis?
I want him to talk about his TSOtownread that he had and if he's being a jerklurk I would appreciate helping put pressure there.

[Oversoul]

No. I don't want anymore fucking vanity wagons.

Too many people are pulling in too many directions. This was my main issue Day 1 and why I only wanted those select few people to get lynched so we could at least consolidate our abysmal effort into something salvageable.

UT is literally not scumhunting. Since I joined the game, all of his play has been reactive. No one is really putting in any true effort to get their suspects lynched other than Singer with Titus, which is unfortunately just a read I disagree with.
Sure, would I lynch DV for lurking and being a nonpresence, yeah. I don't understand why DV's nonpresence is somehow worse than UT's nonpresence when so much more support exists for a UT lynch than a DV lynch.

I wanted to appease Singer, for the sake of town unity, but it isn't worth it given how everyone else is playing. This game badly needs an injection of activity. Lynches/death is the solution.

Sorry Singer.

VOTE: UT

[ChannelDelibird]

Tomorrow. Definitely. Tomorrow. Probably.

Still strongly want UT dead anyway.

[Shadoweh]

Why is it so hard to make people give a shit about this game.

Because the people caring the most are the ones fighting with each other and ignoring the ones that don't. The best way to float in this game is to do nothing at all while town tears itself apart. Even UT imo is engaging people more then certain fish that will remain foxless.

Formerfish: I don't really feel like feeding you reads when the problem I've had with your slot as a team thing is that it has nothing but fluff. Did Marquis not leave you any reads in your Team's PT? Was he too busy talking in the scum PT and ignoring talking about his game because there's nothing to talk about? You're screaming that you have nothing but the person who was in your slot is someone who's thoughts you should actually have access to and I find it extremely concerning that you replaced in like this was a non-team game in which no one left you anything.

[DeasVail]

Ok guys, here's the deal. I'm going to spend this evening really really trying to get back on top of the game. If I feel good about where I'm at after tonight, then I'll stay, but if I don't like my chances of getting back to my previous engagement, then I'll begin looking for a replacement, as it's not fair on you or my team or anyone who'd like to have the opportunity that I have for me to stay. I'm not sure how willing I am to subject one of my team to having to catch up on a 200-page game, so it may be someone else, I don't know yet. But my hopelessness ends tonight, one way or another.

[DeasVail]

TIME TO KILL THE SCUM!

You're probably all incredibly sick of the list of townreads I feel the need to talk about in every second post I make, but I sort of need to do it to give me the confidence that "Hey! I already have reads on X number of people!". So here goes.

I don't know for sure that ChannelDelibird is town, but he can be a tentative super townread given that I booned him (I did actually have reasons for that though!) and I'll review that read when it matters. Maybe this is me just getting off to a lazy start, but I'm just going to go with it.

Espeonage is town. I've gone on and on about why I think Espeonage is town. The reasons I've stated before still hold and there are probably more than that given the fact that I've read more of his posts while retaining my strong townread. Don't lynch him please! I've said before and I'll say again that his play makes no sense coming from scum and would have to be a super impressive masterminded tactic where he relies on me thinking this to be coming from scum.

I haven't read much to impress from Formerfish, but Marquis was SUPERTOWN. The more I think about it the more confident I become in his alignment. I've gone on and on about my reasoning for this too. People seem to want to lynch Formerfish which I think is ridiculous because just like with me the whole "he hasn't been very inactive for the last 100 pages despite being active for the 100 before that -> SCUMMMMM" seems to be a thing and it's stupid. But hey, if it takes lynching me to realise that then fine, I don't care a whole lot. TTH has promised that she's going to get me lynched today and she's apparently confirmed town so she wouldn't break a promise surely! But if you lynch me/my slot and

then

you lynch Formerfish, that will make me angry.

Mastin2 I can't see as anything other than town. Thankfully this is a pretty widespread opinion so awesome and I don't even need to explain the read! Score!

Oversoul = Tammy = TOWNTOWNTOWN etc.

Vezok is really town too and most people seem to recognise that so cool!

:O And that's it! My super town list has shrunken. I can't be as lazy anymore!

So all of the above didn't really take much effort. If all I had to do was post that over and over again (which I've sort of been doing), then I wouldn't need to replace out! But now comes the hard stuff.

As promised, I will go through my read of Titus. I will sort of ISO her but I'm so not reading all of her posts.

And here it comes. I've realised that the main reason I haven't replaced out yet is the guilt I would feel replacing out, and this game is not something I want to play anymore, especially with my life only going to get busier over the next month. And I've decided that this all means that I should replace out if possible. I will continue my thoughts on the players, but they will be very low effort and based on previous thoughts. I'm sorry to everyone for not doing this earlier and allowing someone that could have contributed a lot more than I have to be playing for the last 100 or so pages. I seriously think each and every one of you is a fantastic person, and you were all part of what made this game really fun for me at the start, and it's my own RL situation that has caused my disengagement and not any of you. You're all great <3

So take-home messages that you maybe should or maybe shouldn't listen to! How fun!

I've struggled with my read on ActionDan throughout the game because I'm trying to act confident about my scumread yet someone who I'd expect to read him correctly (Shadoweh) has been strongly townreading him, so it's like internal conflict AHHHHH. I previously made it ok by thinking Shadow was scum too, but I'm not so sure anymore. I forget exactly why my read on her changed but it was probably gut-based. I did read her ISO quickly, but I probably came across as doing more than I actually was, which already wasn't that much sooo, sorry for that.

Aronis was a slight townread for no real reason except guessing. I wouldn't take that read as anything more than it is.

Bulbazazk I think is scum but really I don't know. I still think his weird posts to me early on seemed over-the-top manipulative so I'd recommend looking at that, but again, my read on him is not very up to date. Is you decide my points are not valid they probably aren't! I did read the thing about Shadoweh and that seems somewhat genuine on first glance.

Cheetory is only not in my supertown list because I don't have the confidence to call him supertown right now for some weird reason, but hey, he's probably town.

I thought Gamma was town on my most recent read of him because of the way he attempted to negotiate with other players and the way he talks about his reads. It's not a confident read though, but the things that I was sort of weakly scumreading him for no longer apply I think.

Singer's recent posting hasn't made me feel too crash hot about her, but I think Zar and Empire were pretty decent in my mind, and as much as I complain about it the decline in reads of me probably is understandable.

You know my reservations with TTH but they're only minor for now.

Now Titus! I didn't end up getting through much of her ISO before deciding I really should be replacing out, but the one time where I had a confident correct read on her was in the Teen Wolf mini theme where I thought she was town until she tried suspecting me for lack of town pizzazz, which was the complete opposite of what made sense and the way she responded to that strenghtened my scumread. I initially townread her for not being so closed to everyone else in her stances, and this was supported by ffery and co. but now I'm back at the I don't know stage that I'm usually at with Titus.

Day 1 I thought UT was an important town power role which is why I was townreading him for seeming to care about the game but not being incredibly pro-active about anything. I have no qualms with saying this though, because he's given the opposite impression and me saying this is unlikely to change anything because hey, I'm not even properly caught up with the game! Now I don't know what to think between him seemingly not caring what people think of him (which seems town) and his complaining about the town only to not do anything about it (which seems scummy) considering that I'm running out of townread spots I'd probably be good with lynching him if I was staying in the game, though it's possible I'd favour a more pet scumread such as ActionDan or Bulbazak.

Oh and another thing I've just realised about Shadoweh is that her interactions with me are exactly what I'd expect, which also makes me feel good. I feel like she'd be more likely to white-knight me as scum.

And I think that's it. I'm sorry to be leaving you all, but you're probably all jumping up and down all excited and rejoicing. I have no idea yet who will be replacing me but I'm going to begin organising it now. It's possible I won't find anyone who wants to replace into a 200-page game in which case I'll do my best, but if someone does do it then I can pre-emptively say that they're super cool so be nice.

[Oversoul]

You could have voted someone. Good luck with life DV!

[Titus]

Why? The first thing most replacements do is Unvote.

[Oversoul]

His vote could still be applying pressure while looking for a replacement. Would at least help move the game state forward.

[ChannelDelibird]

Sad to see you go, DV, but fair enough. Good luck with stuff!

The sooner that UT is dead and we can move onto the second lynch, the better.

[Gammagooey]

started rereading bulba but haven't finished yet, will tonight.

from what I have reread:

-his very early posts felt more like telling people things than scumhunting to me (#341 in particular) and his conversation with deas sure is a lot of not-scumhunting and he had a lot of little shitty jabs at people in his quote walls that felt pretty bad (#1207)
-#372 talks about not wanting to bane UT for him being a wait and see read and makes more jabs at Deas, and I could actually use someone else's opinion on this

Look, I get that you're lost right now, but can you please not let yourself form judgements around who appeals to your emotional side. You're doing an awful lot of that right now, and I'm afraid you're not looking at things objectively. Cheetory was not being indecisive about Zar. He was trying to dismantle Tammy's push on Zar while telling Zar to stop scumming it up.

Because I do actually like the bluntness of the explanation but could see it maybe coming from scum that's just trying to project a sense of "i'm clearly not scum and everyone who's thinking that is obviously wrong".


His recent stuff looks fairly good from what I remember- the confidence he's showing in his reads seems genuine to me and his sort-of explanation of his read on vezok looked good. I think he's slightly more likely to be town than not but also that a lot of what he's doing is capable of being faked by scum. I'll be back with more late tonight.

Also UT is still obvscum.
No, seriously. I don't fuck around with false confidence bullshit like tons of people will with every read they push. His attack on me was HORRIFICALLY bad, was and is completely unsupported, and is blatantly more likely to be coming from a scum mindset of 'say gamma could be scum but maybe isn't and is just dumb to discredit him' instead of a town one of actually weighing/considering my pushes on singer and CDB, or literally anything else I've done in the game or any feelings he had about my previous posts and taking that into account and mentioning what was bad about them while saying I'm scum.

[Cheetory6]

Hey UT.
Can you start taking the game seriously so I can actually get a read on you?
Because like, jesus I'm feeling really tempted to sheep this wagon on you because of how garbage you're being at engaging literally anything in this game and if it weren't for the odds being so high that there are tryhard-as-fuck scum directing the game right now, I would be getting on board as well. [and I mean the fact that I don't want to be on another wagon without actually agreeing with it from here on out because holy fuck the VCAheads are probably just licking their chops at the idea of a UT townflip as an excuse to devour me whole]
So please, talk about why you think Gamma is apparently scummy. Or like, literally anything reads-wise.
Or replace out. Either would be appreciated.

I don't fuck around with false confidence bullshit like tons of people will with every read they push

Okay.
Tell me what is potentially different between here and with elusive in DoA then? How absolutely confident are you that UT isn't just being a shitter as town?

[singersigner]

UT's been hanging out with the Commune all weekend. I don't know how, why, or if that's affected his posting, but he leaves tonight so I'm expecting something in the next 36ish hours or I'm washing my hands clean of him and his fate.

DV replacing out is but his reads list could be way more thorough if he really wanted to give us something other than "seemed town" or "seemed scum". I literally have no idea where his head's at because he didn't explain ANYTHING.

Mina thinks Bulb's VCA is gross and thinks he was mildly appealing to us with his "oh well VCA says you can live another day" even though it was shallow at best. The only thing I've liked from him so far was his approach to the Bane mechanic D2 because it seemed thought out and coming from a town-motivated mindset.

I really liked Shadoweh's 5054 about FF and feeling like he shouldn't still be working with nothing this game. His last two posts were complaining that no one was engaging him or helping him out, when he should've had a slew of resources at his fingertips.

Speaking as another replacement

, it seems really under-the-radar. Even with a townread on Marquis, I can't really reconcile not being able to contribute at this point. Titus making excuses for him and deconstructing the pressure on him as "I'm not going to call taking care of family scummy" when that is not what the pressure is about at ALL, or even what people are remotely calling scummy, is terribad. Of note, this also isn't the first time she's turned a push on something/someone into something it wasn't to make it look worse!

[Titus]

@Singer, It's ok for UT not to post because UT is hanging out with you, but it's not ok for FF not to contribute because he's got a sick fiance and is a replacement? While I'm sure he could relay Marquis's reads, they are not his reads. I like the fact FF is open and honest and saying he's confused.

You've also committed a logical falllacy here. You've supposed that two issues that can ideally be handled separately by two players means one player can handle both.

You've supposed UT has got real life issues, yet he can post (and it's somehow temporarily excusable although I doubt he's been at the commune all game). You're a replacement, yet you can post. Therefore, having both shouldn't stop FF. The logical fallacy can be displayed in math terms.

An Average person can hold 5 bricks. (Personal reasons not to post)
An Average person can hold 5 stones. (Being a replacement)
Therefore, a person can hold both 5 bricks and 5 stones. (Being a replacement and dealing with personal issues)
Yet it can be true that the maximum any one person can hold is 7 objects. (Either being a replacement or dealing with personal issues).

FF, not posting for ever will not be tolerated, but it seems like you're coming up with smokescreen reasons for UT.


UT is not explaining his gamma read. Your big reason for not liking DV, he didn't explain his reads. DV's explained more in his current post than UT has explained all game.
UT is not posting content. Your big reason for not liking FF is... not posting content. UT is actually just spamming.

I do love the touch of "class" at the end where you attempt to paint my opinion as wrong or scummy just because you disagree with it and it doesn't fit into your narrative.

All the reasons you push for voting other people also apply to UT. Yet, you won't vote him.

[Titus]

You also said Bulba's VCA is shallow. Far from it. The methodical process is clear.

He starts with the assumption that all four wagons were on town, and then analyzes them looking for the scum. Yet, none of Bulba's names for scum fit into your narrative, so you dismiss it as "shallow". While I don't think it's

wise

to pursue VCA without a confirmed scumflip, you're just dismissing anything that doesn't agree with your worldview is downright scummy. There's a difference between disagreeing and just assuming all disagreement is scummy. The former is scumhunting. The latter is just attempting to push easy mislynches.

[Gammagooey]

I don't fuck around with false confidence bullshit like tons of people will with every read they push

Okay.
Tell me what is potentially different between here and with elusive in DoA then? How absolutely confident are you that UT isn't just being a shitter as town?

I've played with UT a pretty decent amount before.

Also, using elusive is fair in this context because I was about as confident as I am now about UT but elusive WAS really really reactive and manipulative in how she reponded to people >.>
I do want to point out that throughout all my pushing on singer and CDB here which I've done a TON of I'm pretty sure I never called them obvscum or said that I was absolutely sure that they were scum. Go through UT's iso and take a look at all the mentions of me. He isn't trying to read me.

[Oversoul]

Hey UT.
Can you start taking the game seriously so I can actually get a read on you?
Because like, jesus I'm feeling really tempted to sheep this wagon on you because of how garbage you're being at engaging literally anything in this game and if it weren't for the odds being so high that there are tryhard-as-fuck scum directing the game right now, I would be getting on board as well. [and I mean the fact that I don't want to be on another wagon without actually agreeing with it from here on out because holy fuck the VCAheads are probably just licking their chops at the idea of a UT townflip as an excuse to devour me whole]
So please, talk about why you think Gamma is apparently scummy. Or like, literally anything reads-wise.
Or replace out. Either would be appreciated.

I don't fuck around with false confidence bullshit like tons of people will with every read they push

Okay.
Tell me what is potentially different between here and with elusive in DoA then? How absolutely confident are you that UT isn't just being a shitter as town?

JUST VOTE HIM

You and Singer are trying to do everything you can not to vote UT

[Untrod Tripod]

You and Singer are trying to do everything you can not to vote UT

proooooooooooobably because it's really obvious I'm just lynchbait!

[Untrod Tripod]

also, I'm Alquin

suck it

let's actually vote for some scums now

[Untrod Tripod]

I would suggest Oversoul because he's really hitting the sweet spot of wrong and obnoxious, but that's probably just the residual anger of having to read the steaming dungpile that is his ISO

[Oversoul]

also, I'm Alquin

suck it

let's actually vote for some scums now

In order to do that

You would probably have to

umm

vote?

[Untrod Tripod]

hey

Oversoul

shut up

[Untrod Tripod]

do you have any suggestions you'd like to go with that aren't me, or are you going to continue being wrong and obnoxious

[Untrod Tripod]

we have two lynches today

I think we have a really great shot of hitting at least one scum because there's some REALLY opportunistic fuckery in the people clamoring for my lynch

CDB for example!