Mini 1353 - Dr. Who Mafia - The End of Time (Game Over)

[triangle123]

Starbuck, Tierce's interaction with me was based off a misunderstanding regarding rule violations. She thought I might have been referencing an on-going game, and I clarified.

I would much rather take the gamble of lynching Jason over lynching Tierce. If they're both town, he's the one I'd rather lose because he's barely contributing to the game, and I do not want to lynch a claimed power role.

[jasonT1981]

Starbuck, Tierce's interaction with me was based off a misunderstanding regarding rule violations. She thought I might have been referencing an on-going game, and I clarified.

I would much rather take the gamble of lynching Jason over lynching Tierce. If they're both town, he's the one I'd rather lose because he's barely contributing to the game, and I do not want to lynch a claimed power role.

He claimed River song, he didnt claim a town power role....

[Tierce]

For the (n+2)th time, I'm female.

And yes, I've already clarified that this is a PR claim and that no, I won't be any clearer toDay. Nice skimming you have going on there.

[Korlash]

What are you talking about? On the same day, I posted 3 hours after you called me scum and 1 hour after your last post. How is that waiting to respond until you are V/LA?

I was trying to make a point, not accuse you of something. Apparently, that wasn't clear... >.> My bad I suppose...

How is it self preservation? You're not even voting me. I just hate it when terrible cases are made against me. And how does deadline even matter?

Self preservation is that you care more about 'finding out' why I think you are scum than you do about hunting for scum. Whenever a majority of your posts seem to be revolving around defense instead of scum hunting, you thusly appear to be in a self preservation mode.

I never made a case nor implied I had any intent of making one yet you jump to this conclusion? you aren't feeling guilty are you?

Deadline matters because you are spending your time waiting for someone to tell you their case while you focus on defense instead of working on making your own case. The whole "i'll be here before deadline, so don't worry' excuse only works when you spend that time MAKING A CASE so your decision is as accurate as possible.

How could that be the case when he voted her the page before that even happened?

So you admit his vote/reasons make no sense... and you vote with him? Sweet...

How am I just sitting here?

Your posts include "someone tell me the case of the person I should be voting" and "/defend myself against non attacks". You have done virtually nothing to find scum or make your own case/decision. That is just sitting there two weeks from deadline, two days from it is unacceptable. If you didn't want to vote, fine. But you still need to show that you're TRYING to figure out who to vote and you had and still have barely done anything of the sort.

1. Why would I want a full claim when she's not at L-1? I think it's scummy that she is saying that she will refuse to claim when at L-1.
2. Her interaction with triangle is the FoS thing.
3. As you just stated in the same sentence but somehow ignore now, I also think that him refusing to claim is scummy.

1. Well seeing as how you're voting her and want her lynched, I don't see why L-x would make any difference. Do you not want her lynched? If you do, why the fuck wouldn't you want her to claim asap to give us the most time before deadline to check into it?
2. Did you ever continue to follow through with the FoS thing after the 2nd post of yours?
3. So the answer is no... You spent more posts asking for a case on Teirce than you did trying to make your own. Got it.

And he hates M:tG walls, he's obvtown.

NO NO NO NO NO! That makes him fucking scum. Walls are awesome! <3 defender + mill wins everything!

[Starbuck]

Wait, I missed it. Who hates M:tG?

[Korlash]

I also am of the belief that if you are going to claim then you claim everything about your role or you don't claim at all. Now, I'm not all the way caught up on Doctor Who, but I know who River is. I think she could easily be a cover and I'm not believing her one bit.

I would caution you on this. In theme games, remember you are given more to claim than in normal bland games. There is always possible reason to claim one and not the other so make sure to think it through in each situation you come across.

Anyway, River could easily be a safeclaim. I honestly can't tell if the 'constant' crumbing of it makes it more likely a safeclaim or less. I'm honestly leaning more towards it making it more likely a safeclaim but I have no frame of reference.

Have you considered the fact she claimed early without any real provocation? Has that factored into your results at all?

This is terrible reasoning. Please explain to me how that can be proven.

Just saw this in Teirce's post. What the fuck is your problem? Explain to me how you can prove her actions don't have town motivation? You can't PROVE either, it's fucking impossible because hypothetical can be made to suggest both.

What the fuck is this, your vote is so shit...

[Starbuck]

Have you considered the fact she claimed early without any real provocation? Has that factored into your results at all?

Of course it has, she was at what L-4? She had no need to claim and to reveal her character and then insist that she is a PR seems like a desperate scum move.

[Starbuck]

I'll be going over the longer posts when I get home as I'm with the group for my team term paper.

[Korlash]

Wait, I missed it. Who hates M:tG?

Acosmit... *shakes head* It's sad to see such uncalled for hatred...

No, it's not scummy. I'm refusing to fullclaim because at this stage I would really, really rather not fullclaim. It brings no benefit for the town if I out my role now, and a lot of benefit to scum. My role name can be confirmed via any name/flavor cop, so there is interest in doing a partial claim and say I have a PR because it would be really stupid to get lynched over a scummy, survivalistic, claimed VT on D1, if I say so myself.

Answer me this darling, Does it bring less benefit to town to lynch you today than it would for you to claim? If you were threatened with the lynch RIGHT NOW, would it not be more beneficial for you to claim?

So... what exactly is there for me to address here?

Considering it was directed at me... >.>

[Korlash]

Of course it has, she was at what L-4? She had no need to claim and to reveal her character and then insist that she is a PR seems like a desperate scum move.

Do you know when the first time was that she insinuated she was a PR? Was it after claiming to be River, the same time, or before it? I somehow missed it on my read through and only learned of it when someone else said she had done it...

I can also tell you I've seen her claim prematurely before... Not sure what that means but...

[Starbuck]

Wait, I missed it. Who hates M:tG?

Acosmit... *shakes head* It's sad to see such uncalled for hatred...

*gasp*

Acosmist, I thought we could be friends! Apparently, not!

[Tierce]

Next you're going to tell me you also like blue decks. Why you break my heart so, Korlash.

Answer me this darling, Does it bring less benefit to town to lynch you today than it would for you to claim? If you were threatened with the lynch RIGHT NOW, would it not be more beneficial for you to claim?

Fallacy. Would be a lot more beneficial for town for me NOT to claim and jason to be lynched. Forcing me to claim renders my role all but worthless and I really wish GreyICE was here because I'm pretty sure he'd guess what I'm talking about. (Please go check MLP, Grey.)

[Starbuck]

Of course it has, she was at what L-4? She had no need to claim and to reveal her character and then insist that she is a PR seems like a desperate scum move.

Do you know when the first time was that she insinuated she was a PR? Was it after claiming to be River, the same time, or before it? I somehow missed it on my read through and only learned of it when someone else said she had done it...

I can also tell you I've seen her claim prematurely before... Not sure what that means but...

It was after.

She claims in #487 blatantly stating that it's just a "nameclaim" and lists her crumbs.

Grey follows calling her out for nameclaiming.

She then follows it with this:

EXTERMINATE

Not even close, Grey. Stop tunneling, you idiot.

Go through my ISO. My role is pretty damn evident, but no, I'm not going to fullclaim.

[Starbuck]

For the record, I like blue decks.

[Tierce]

I claimed PR a post after I nameclaimed, Korlash.

PEdit: That.

Starbuck, we cannot be friends. I really hope you are scum because this travesty will not stand. Pistols at dawn.

[Starbuck]

My preferred deck is Artifact, but it will usually have a bit of blue.

[Korlash]

Next you're going to tell me you also like blue decks. Why you break my heart so, Korlash.

Well I am called Korlash... So you know I like me some black... My main is a B/U/W deck centered around Glimpse and Mind Funeral. I <3s it so much....

Fallacy. Would be a lot more beneficial for town for me NOT to claim and jason to be lynched. Forcing me to claim renders my role all but worthless and I really wish GreyICE was here because I'm pretty sure he'd guess what I'm talking about. (Please go check MLP, Grey.)

*shakes head* It is not a Fallacy. I gave you a perfectly possible situation in which Jason's lynch was not a choice. I am not asking you to claim, just to tell me yes or no. Is it more beneficial to lynch you than it is for you to claim? What is MLP's full name?

It was after.

I don't understand how that is a PR claim...

@ Teirce, by "My role is evident" did you mean that you were River or that you had a PR?

[Korlash]

My preferred deck is Artifact, but it will usually have a bit of blue.

MEMNARCH!!!!!! My first ever deck ever... ;_; How I misses you....

Starbuck gets to be town forever now!

[Starbuck]

That's why I don't believe it and think it to be a safeclaim.

[Tierce]

@ Teirce, by "My role is evident" did you mean that you were River or that you had a PR?

The PR in question.

MLP was MLP - Friendship is Awesome.


Starbuck, when I say that the breadcrumbs should make my role evident, it doesn't necessarily mean that you should be able to decode everything

now

. There are hints, yes, but I'm not going to make things easier for scum by making it as glaringly obvious as the nameclaim. When they become useful, my crumbs will be there and they'll be evident.

[Zang]

I am extremely tired. I'm going to sleep now. I'm not sure If I'll be back before deadline but I'll try.

The hell? You say my posts have no town motivation, I say they have, and you're asking me to prove how I'm town? You do realize I can't do that without posting my role PM/claiming masons with someone, right? No, YOU have terrible reasoning; you say my posts have no town motivation, then show where you think they are lacking it, don't ask me to prove otherwise.

That is exactly my point, you can't prove it. Which is why you can't use "I know I'm town so my posts have town motivation" as a defence.

Pushing her when we're close to deadline, while not shifting from a wagon that I believe will hit scum. FoSes are minor signs of suspicion.

I know what an FoS is. But it is usually use to indicate to other players that you find this person suspicious. I don't understand how it can be used to push her.

No, it's not scummy. I'm refusing to fullclaim because at this stage I would really, really rather not fullclaim. It brings no benefit for the town if I out my role now, and a lot of benefit to scum. My role name can be confirmed via any name/flavor cop, so there is interest in doing a partial claim and say I have a PR because it would be really stupid to get lynched over a scummy, survivalistic, claimed VT on D1, if I say so myself.

Like I said, I agree that you shouldn't claim now. But if you get to L-1, claiming reveals the same information as lynching you and it should benefit the town much more.

Or you could drop the wagon, let me do my job, do your own and everyone will be one big happy town family. Lynching jason would be a good start.

Except I think that jason is town and you could still be scum trying to avoid being lynched.

So... what exactly is there for me to address here?

Nothing? It was to Korlash, not you.

Self preservation is that you care more about 'finding out' why I think you are scum than you do about hunting for scum. Whenever a majority of your posts seem to be revolving around defense instead of scum hunting, you thusly appear to be in a self preservation mode.

Ok, that may be true then. Althugh I consider something it to be self preservation when I put my own interests above that of the town which I don't think I'm doing.

I never made a case nor implied I had any intent of making one yet you jump to this conclusion? you aren't feeling guilty are you?

We may have two different definitions for "case". I mean your reasoning for why you think I'm scum.

Deadline matters because you are spending your time waiting for someone to tell you their case while you focus on defense instead of working on making your own case. The whole "i'll be here before deadline, so don't worry' excuse only works when you spend that time MAKING A CASE so your decision is as accurate as possible.

I think I alread made a case against Tierce.

So you admit his vote/reasons make no sense... and you vote with him? Sweet...

NO. Where do you get this? the whole reason why I was asking was because there are reasons but I just don't know what they are. I never once claimed that there was no reasons.

Your posts include "someone tell me the case of the person I should be voting" and "/defend myself against non attacks". You have done virtually nothing to find scum or make your own case/decision. That is just sitting there two weeks from deadline, two days from it is unacceptable. If you didn't want to vote, fine. But you still need to show that you're TRYING to figure out who to vote and you had and still have barely done anything of the sort.

No. The only thing that I've done that can be misconstrued to that is asking what the case on him is and the reasons for why I did this, I have repeated but you still ignore.

1. Well seeing as how you're voting her and want her lynched, I don't see why L-x would make any difference. Do you not want her lynched? If you do, why the fuck wouldn't you want her to claim asap to give us the most time before deadline to check into it?
2. Did you ever continue to follow through with the FoS thing after the 2nd post of yours?
3. So the answer is no... You spent more posts asking for a case on Teirce than you did trying to make your own. Got it.

1. That is a good point but no matter how much I think he is scum, there is always the possibility that he is town. In which case, what he is saying could be true and could be devestating for the town. I only want him to claim if the only other possibility is his death. If he doesn't get to l-1 and he's town then tommorow or whenever he is at L-1 or claims, it won't be as devestating for the town and if he is scum then he'll still be lynched. it would be better if he was lynched today but at least he would be lynched,
2. Yes I did. it's the second quote in this post.

Just saw this in Teirce's post. What the fuck is your problem? Explain to me how you can prove her actions don't have town motivation? You can't PROVE either, it's fucking impossible because hypothetical can be made to suggest both.

What the fuck is this, your vote is so shit...

Obviously, I can't prove it. It is my opinion that her posts don't have any town motivation. She's using that as her defense.

[Korlash]

Damn tigers! I was hoping to get to look at that game... Oh well...

When they become useful, my crumbs will be there and they'll be evident.

When they become useful? You do know how much that makes it all sound fake right?

[Tierce]

Damn tigers! I was hoping to get to look at that game... Oh well...

When they become useful, my crumbs will be there and they'll be evident.

When they become useful? You do know how much that makes it all sound fake right?

The game is available, but you have to download it. http://www.mafiascum.net/cache/MLP.rar

So you've never seen crumbs that are only useful after some event?
I can't continue dancing around this--I've said all I care about the subject. Figure it out.

[Korlash]

Except I think that jason is town and you could still be scum trying to avoid being lynched.

This seems like you are implying the Jason wagon is being used to help her avoid the lynch... But the Jason wagon was started long before her wagon came about so that's impossible.

I think I alread made a case against Tierce.

Before you voted her? My comments here are about your actions when this discussion first started, so they predate your vote on Teirce.

NO. Where do you get this? the whole reason why I was asking was because there are reasons but I just don't know what they are. I never once claimed that there was no reasons.

How do you know there are reason? And your comments about that post of his suggested to me you saw it the same way I did, not making sense.

No. The only thing that I've done that can be misconstrued to that is asking what the case on him is and the reasons for why I did this, I have repeated but you still ignore.

Considering I'm trying to remember what your reasons for it are and I keep coming up blank, if you truly have told me then it seems I have ignored them. You wanted to find out ICe's reasoning for his vote? Right? So in other words, in your opinion he has no reasons... Yet you just said you know he has some (but not sure what they are) and you're voting WITH him... Even though he has not told you his reasons.

Obviously, I can't prove it. It is my opinion that her posts don't have any town motivation. She's using that as her defense.

Okay, for the first time I'll give you a chance to prove yourself to me. Where did she use this as a defense 'BEFORE YOU ATTACKED HER FOR IT'. Are you saying she physically used "My posts are town motivated" as a defense somewhere in the thread to another attack?

To save time, if you are saying "she used this as a defense once I attacked her" then that's shit...

[Korlash]

So you've never seen crumbs that are only useful after some event?
I can't continue dancing around this--I've said all I care about the subject. Figure it out.

Crumbs are only useful to back up a claim. End of story. They have no use outside of that, they have no 'time frame' that dictates their usefulness, they do not 'become' useful in any way shape or form.

They are a static device used to serve one purpose, back up your claim. The only crumbs that 'become useful' are those added by scum early on to back up potential future claims. Fake doc/cop/etc crumbs sown in by scum so that if they ever need to fakeclaim they can back it up. Those BECOME useful because they are made without a claim to back up and thus BECOME useful once a fakeclaim is invented FOR THEM to back up.