Mafiascum.net

In post 5449, Solstice wrote:[Toog is a weird case cause i almost feel like they never flip scum but it's a bit difficult to explain.]

[I think Toog is scummy, but they have posts that just surprise me I think. The case on Polarbears is obviously not good, and it's totally possible they just do all this "Vig shoot me" and "I'll eat the supersaint" stuff knowing fully well neither of those will ever happen. But even then..]

In post 4873, Toogeloo wrote:

In post 4871, Double the Trouble wrote:What do you think of DEB v Dunn?

I think the plan to lynch Deb is fine. I think I can hammer, and if DEB is legit, the vig can shoot Dunn. If scum have a SuperSaint and it's DEB, it's better I be the one that hammers.

In post 4876, Toogeloo wrote:I'd probably say DEB is more likely town than Dunn. I can't imagine a game where one scum counter claims another scum and then suicides either another scum buddy or himself the next day with a real or fake scan.

[This is completely wild to me -- although i dont know in which direction. Toog, why'd you want to eliminate DEB first? Or more specifically, what was going through your mind when you made these? Ircher pointed out these two posts and you never responded, so im curious]

In post 5448, Solstice wrote:[it's not Polarbears or Ydrasse]

[right now, I think it's Dr Easy + Spiffeh + Mastina/Ircher/Toog]

~Morning

Pick one please

In post 5446, MURDERCAT wrote:Everyone list the 3 people you think are scum please

{DEB, Toogeloo} (lockscum) and {Spiffeh} (poe as most likely third scum).

Speaking of which:
VOTE: Toogaloo.
We're eliminating DEB today, but since I'm going to wait for the masons' permission before voting DEB, no harm in placing my vote here until they permit me to.

The fact that neither I or DEB was eliminated lat night probably signifies the vig only had one shot I'm guessing.

I'd almost rather be eliminated ahead of DEB so that you guys have more time to figure out the other two scum. DEB is a lock, and if for some reason the vig can still shoot but opted not to, then he can still be shot tonight.

But I am kind of sick of everyone saying I'm scum, and no one willing to consider deep wolf options, and the sooner I'm eliminated, the faster that happens.

mastina putting me as lockscum needs to explain why it's a lock and not just a read, because she's very, very wrong.

It's also kind of important everyone convey right now their pick for scum in the event I flip town. I'm the current easy target for the scum team to get a miselim on, but someone else is right above me that the scum are eyeballing to take out as well. Be on your toes.

In post 5451, Solstice wrote:Toog, why'd you want to eliminate DEB first?

Because, if I'm not mistaken, there was discussion of lynching DEB ahead of Dunn and I was weighing my opinion on that. That's what I thought Double Trouble was asking.

I'd also like to point out that if I were scum, there's no chance in hell I elim DT ahead of another Mason when DT is quite literally the only player to express that they think I'm town.

Toogeloo wrote:It's also kind of important everyone convey right now their pick for scum in the event I flip town. I'm the current easy target for the scum team to get a miselim on, but someone else is right above me that the scum are eyeballing to take out as well. Be on your toes.

[Who scum, Toog?]

~Morning

In post 5456, Toogeloo wrote:I'd also like to point out that if I were scum, there's no chance in hell I elim DT ahead of another Mason when DT is quite literally the only player to express that they think I'm town.

[DT was always the mason scum was gonna kill first, i don't think it matters if they townread you and you're scum. That'd actually look bad on them to leave DT alive for that, really]

~Morning

In post 4853, Double the Trouble wrote:tbh if we are doing deb I would probably want dunn to hammer that

This was the post my response was to.

---

My scum reads are two of mastina/PBE/Ydrasse.

Spiffeh feels like their slot might be right behind me in the pecking order, which worries me a bit. I like Spiffeh from Day 1 and 2, but he's been less of a read after the mass claim.

Ircher is still mostly null.

Solstice is town.

What do you hate about my two posts, Solstice?

I was advocating that DEB lynch was fine first, despite my town read on DEB due to counter claims and suicides. Wouldn't it make more sense for me to endorse the Dunn lynch as scum?

In post 5454, Toogeloo wrote:mastina putting me as lockscum needs to explain why it's a lock and not just a read, because she's very, very wrong.

Because I've thought your play has been scum for almost the entire game and I've gone into explaining why I felt that way, why I felt you were picked as scum, why this is your scumplay, and literally all of the defense of your slot is "but this one thing Toog did looks like it doesn't fit my mental picture of what scum would do even though it's something scum could very easily do".

I still intend on voting at L-2 on DEB, unvoting, and then hammering.

I am hoping that he's SS because I literally need to die today as the best thing I can offer town.


PEdit:. That's a read, none of that makes me lockscum.

In post 5460, Toogeloo wrote:What do you hate about my two posts, Solstice?

I was advocating that DEB lynch was fine first, despite my town read on DEB due to counter claims and suicides. Wouldn't it make more sense for me to endorse the Dunn lynch as scum?

[Hm? I did figure out why it looked like you were contradicting yourself but i asked the question anyway cause idk. I see in the context that you thinking DEB is more town but also being alright with DEB being eliminated first is not contradictory.]

[And i don't know, is that better for you to do as scum? Personally i dont really think your opinion would be a huge deciding factor in either wagon, so you would be free to say whichever one you think looks better.]

~Morning

[I did actually like Spiffeh's read on Creature though, hrmm]

[That was pretty well done if faked. I also like the locktown on Polarbears]

[pedit: In a little while, don't worry. i might even sub Spiffeh out. who knows where i'm going with this! ..i didn't review during the night]

[What it feels like to me so far is that the solve is not Spiffeh/Toog.]

[My town!Toog feelings are starting to dwindle actually. I have been looking long and hard at these two's ISOs. I felt like i had less for Spiffeh earlier, but actually, think that's probably wrong]

In post 3601, Toogeloo wrote:

In post 3560, mastina wrote:

In post 3250, Bell wrote:K, I'm detective.
N1 I investigated Toog who killed no one.
Good job everyone.
Good job.

This is, at the very least: a plausible claim with a plausible target.

What, am I a rookie? Is Bell a Rookie?

You telling me that I would literally take any action at all on N1 as scum after claiming VT? Watchers and Trackers would keep me from ever taking an action after a post 1 VT claim let alone worrying about someone specifically checking I did the kill. Even more so with the fact that we know that scum can multitask.

In post 3610, Toogeloo wrote:UNVOTE:
VOTE: mastina

I'm kind of working on this mastina, polar bear scum team at the moment.

[This is sorta over-the-top. and no, they never really get a mastina-polarbear thingy going.]

In post 3851, Toogeloo wrote:UNVOTE:
VOTE: Creature

I'd rather this than Bell.

[I am actually stupid, Spiffeh's approach to the Bell v. Creature wagons is more organic looking to be honest]

In post 3877, Spiffeh wrote:I do think DEB's counterclaim (even though it's not really a counter claim) is super town though? There's no reason to put yourself out there as scum, especially since it seems like Bell was already going down for anyway?

In post 3922, Toogeloo wrote:The only scenario where Bell makes the claim as scum that I see here is if scum actually do know the town PRs and was attempting to get the real Detective claim out. If scum know all of town's PRs though, that's kind of fucked up.

[It's kind of a little detail, but Toog thought Bell was more likely town, and the only way he isn't town is if scum knew there was a real town detective and wanted to get them. So they're implying that in a Bell!scum world, then Dr Easy would be town, but isn't outright going there just yet. Whereas Spiffeh came to the outright conclusion that Dr Easy was just town from the claim, which i guess looks a lot better to me. Toog's options for reading Dr Easy in the future are a lot less in stone whereas Spiffeh is making a hard call that his buddy is town there]

In post 4275, Toogeloo wrote:The conundrum here is that Bell wim while DEB only countered and took off.

From my PoV, there are two clashing ideas.

1. Both are Detective. If it's a weak role, then it might be possible to have two in a power-lite town. With a roaming doc and two Cats that I know of, that is power-lite so far. But again it depends on the power of the Detective scan. Can it find a killer days afterwards, or just that night only? I'd like both Bell and DEB to clarify this.

2. Scum know town's PRs, which I think would be heinous. People seem to think that Leaf helped design town's power somehow, but no one seems to elaborate on where they know this from, and all I've seen is scum pick roles they want and mods balance town around that. In this case, scum want the Detective out, so Bell is either scum and was hoping to get DEB to claim, or DEB was planning to take claim Detective to eventually out the other Detective. Bell would be more likely scum than DEB in this scenario.

[Toog is never going to have to take a stance against both their partners as long as they use this logic]


[mmmmmmmmm I want to believe this very badly]


[This is stuff that sounds good at face value but Toog hasn't really shown to be true]

[Span of posts where Toog is confused about Vigilante/supersaint/vengeful stuff is sort of good-looking but really is not as good as Spiffeh's confusion towards the Tracker/Detective claims. like misunderstanding what Dr Easy and Bell were doing, I feel, would be tricky to fake. Definitely harder than feigning confusion over what a supersaint enabler does and what happened on N1 (which scum wouldn't know by default, i suppose. Their team would tell them it was a vig, but still).]

[obviously i shouldn't give towncred for begging to be vigged and taking the supersaint and so on, *especially* considering scum!Toog probably knows neither of those will happen. I bet FL knew the vig didn't have any shots left by looking at his team's power.]

[I want to hear more about Toog's Polarbears/mastina reads consider they're their strongest ones. I don't think they've mentioned mastina in a while so is that not a thing anymore ?]

[if I can get this soulread on Spiffeh correct I think I'm probably getting a lot closer to the solve, cause Ircher placed Toog in a spot in his reads that is very believable for that team.]



[---------- JUST READ BELOW , IT'S THE ONLY THING I REALLY NEED FEEDBACK ON --------]

In post 4974, Toogeloo wrote:I'm out of time, so I'll try to do more later. Noraa has been my #1 scum pick for a while, and I am going to attempt to paint the picture as to why.

In post 5009, Toogeloo wrote:Well, if no one's going to read it, it'll save me from finishing it.

I'll just opt for always being a hammer vote for SSfear.

[, you never got to the part where you showed us why you feel Noraa is scum, though. You more or less started with the conclusion they are scum and combed their ISO from there -- this is evident by how you say "scum theater?" and stuff like that a bunch while going through. You clearly already started with having her in a bad light]

[You don't gotta go thru their ISO bit by bit, i guarantee most of that will be useless. I just want to know why this has been your most consistent SR. You admitted it didn't have much substance early on, but it stayed your favourite on D2, probably bolstered by Murderkitty's case. But why do *you* think they're scum? i need help getting there, cause I do not think they are scum]

~Morning

[oh, by the way, what's your opinion on rule of threes, Toog?]

~Morning

I think FOURS is more consistent in finding scum. THREES wasn't the rule I was aware of. It's always been FOURS.

I struggle with actually making cases on people, as evident by my attempt to show ISO analysis from PBE. I try to show what I see, and why I don't like it, but my solves always revolve around player motivations and gut.

PBE's posting is a lot of fluff and noise, buddying, and very light on engaging in a way that might turn the majority against them. In many of the big areas where they are pushing reads, they are usually doing it in tandem with another player.

Seems too safe too me.

---

I struggle to articulate my mastina read, and it's almost entirely born out of OMGUS, but the biggest reason I dislike the slot is the very large tonal shift in playstyle from very aggressive Day 1 to more reserved every day afterwards. She was more savage and unrelenting on BM, but felt like she was trying to assuage her reads into a conformed manner since Pichu was currently dominating Day 2. Very much like she was observing how the day was going down and trying to fit that narrative more.

---

Again, I struggle with conveying my thoughts, and a lot of times I post very unfiltered brain spew into my posts. What I'm thinking, when I'm thinking it.

In post 5104, mastina wrote:

In post 4850, Solstice wrote:[If you wanted to sacrifice him this is probably how you'd do it.
~Morning

I mean.
DEB-scum sacrificing himself to take out someone who was probably going down today or tomorrow anyway?
Not impossible, although obviously by necessity what happened if Dunn flips town here.

More likely is either DEB town with a genuine guilty or DEB scum faking a guilty on a scumbuddy. Either way, Dunnstral's a pretty sure bet at being scum.

[I think mastina going back on calling Bell and Dr Easy SvS temporarily as a response to Dr Easy's guilty yesterday is more likely town.. insistence on Creature scum also more likely town, still like her D1, and Misty believes mastina is town too. im gonna keep thinking mastina is not a deepwolf here]

In post 4552, mastina wrote:I quite liked the Kindred and Vayne stories in particular. (I liked the flirting with Vayne which caused her to go all Tsundere.)

[WOAH those were my only two S+'s]

~Morning

In post 5466, Toogeloo wrote:I think FOURS is more consistent in finding scum. THREES wasn't the rule I was aware of. It's always been FOURS.

I struggle with actually making cases on people, as evident by my attempt to show ISO analysis from PBE. I try to show what I see, and why I don't like it, but my solves always revolve around player motivations and gut.

PBE's posting is a lot of fluff and noise, buddying, and very light on engaging in a way that might turn the majority against them. In many of the big areas where they are pushing reads, they are usually doing it in tandem with another player.

Seems too safe too me.

---

I struggle to articulate my mastina read, and it's almost entirely born out of OMGUS, but the biggest reason I dislike the slot is the very large tonal shift in playstyle from very aggressive Day 1 to more reserved every day afterwards. She was more savage and unrelenting on BM, but felt like she was trying to assuage her reads into a conformed manner since Pichu was currently dominating Day 2. Very much like she was observing how the day was going down and trying to fit that narrative more.

---

Again, I struggle with conveying my thoughts, and a lot of times I post very unfiltered brain spew into my posts. What I'm thinking, when I'm thinking it.

[Ohh that explains the rule of fours you mentioned in the Noraa analysis, then.]

[Crazy fluff and noise from Polarbears is just not a scum-indicative thing for them, Noraa especially. You devoted so much time to pointing that out -- and it's just not scummy for them. I could show you sections of Noraa's other games if you like.]

[Tbh i would say blatant buddying is also more or less what I expect from them, but I would definitely look at it if you pointed out major examples of where Polarbears seem to do that.]

[Mastina has been decently aggressive towards Creature, and now you, wouldn't you say? I am interested in what the big distinction you're noticing between her attitude towards BM and you two is. and I guess why you think that shift is inherently scummy. I would take it down a notch after hard tunneling a townie on the first day -- and i don't really see the big shift you're seeing, I suppose.]

[Like she had BM as lockscum, then Creature as lockscum, and then you. those three reads are very unmoving. She had DEB!scum a little bit before it was cool, too. Your characterization makes it sound like her D1 is savage aggressiveness, whereas later on she was more trying to conform to what everyone else says and be lurkish. And granted, she came around to Bell being scum after a little bit of hesitation, but that certainly wasn't unique to mastina and it didnt automatically make her into a sheep from there on either. its possible I'm just bad at finding what it is you're seeing though]

~Morning

Hey, you win some, you lose some. I must have been fucked with last night, redirected without my knowledge.
Well barring any misdirection, last night I swear to you I targeted the Electric Toogeloo, and got a guilty.
It’s time once again for you to pick up your swords and fight alongside me!
VOTE: The Electric Toogeloo

Merry Christmas!!!!

Gloria and I don't really agree on much besides DEB!scum.
We've agreed that she'll be the one providing reads for now and I'll just be on the lookout and voice my opinions to her. By request, this thread can also get them.

-nornor

In post 5472, Noraa wrote:Merry Christmas!!!!

Gloria and I don't really agree on much besides DEB!scum.
We've agreed that she'll be the one providing reads for now and I'll just be on the lookout and voice my opinions to her. By request, this thread can also get them.

-nornor

ahhhhhh shittttt

Oh oh wait my gif.