Mafiascum.net

WC wrote:I need to quote this whole post because Ythill is just taking pieces of it as he chooses to make me look scummy. This board is incredibly difficult to get a foothold in. You show up and people automatically assume that since you're new you suck and target you as an easy lynch. I dealt with this exact same thing in my first game as well.

Get off your cross. No one went after you "because you were new" they went after you because you did anti-town/scummy things. Maybe you did those things because you were new, but how the hell were they (I) supposed to know that? If I see scummy behavior, I'm going to attack it. "I'm new" is NOT a defense.

Also, the rest of your post doesn't make you look any better. He took those specific sentences because those specific sentences SHOW YOUR SCUM MINDSET.

Nexus (6) – Locke Lamora, Ythill, farside22, A Gaggle of Geese, Saint, AGar

LL made a good case on Nexus, while I am in agreement that the OGML lynch should not be rushed, it was the way Nexus announced it was a bit suspicious. However, I don't see it suspicious enough to trigger the size of the wagon that followed. Ythill, Farside, Gaggle, and Agar all just wagon for wagon's sake. Saint provides some content to as why Nexus' post was scummy, but my opinion is that the Nexus post that triggered this landslide was not scummy enough to validate the size of wagon that followed. When I vote for someone, whether it's a wagon or not, I provide the reasons why I want that person lynched. I do not like to just jump on a wagon for the sake of a wagon. I don't know if this is a meta difference, but I don't like it. I think we need to look at the wagonsake wagoners a bit more.

I also have lost confidence in my read on Agar and would like to elect Saint in his place. He has shown he is willing to put some effort into scumhunting, I agree with most of his reads and having played with him in Cyclic experiment I feel confident in his ability.

LynchMePls wrote:

WC wrote:I need to quote this whole post because Ythill is just taking pieces of it as he chooses to make me look scummy. This board is incredibly difficult to get a foothold in. You show up and people automatically assume that since you're new you suck and target you as an easy lynch. I dealt with this exact same thing in my first game as well.

Get off your cross. No one went after you "because you were new" they went after you because you did anti-town/scummy things. Maybe you did those things because you were new, but how the hell were they (I) supposed to know that? If I see scummy behavior, I'm going to attack it. "I'm new" is NOT a defense.

Also, the rest of your post doesn't make you look any better. He took those specific sentences because those specific sentences SHOW YOUR SCUM MINDSET.

The sentance he is attacking me for is out of context. The very next sentance I explain what he later accused me of contridicting myself when I said the OGML flip would tells more than just about SGR.

I am completely down for a LMP-back wagon. Would rather see him back there then Sea, GG and farside hands down, and have him around the same level as Ythill/Apoc. Since no one aparently is happy with a Apoc vote



@Sea - Can you explain your suspicions? You are calling just about all the top wagons scum at this point. What is your order here?
@Agar - Same question.

LlamaFluff wrote:I am completely down for a LMP-back wagon. Would rather see him back there then Sea, GG and farside hands down, and have him around the same level as Ythill/Apoc. Since no one aparently is happy with a Apoc vote

unelect Apoc
Elect LMP

@Sea - Can you explain your suspicions? You are calling just about all the top wagons scum at this point. What is your order here?
@Agar - Same question.

OGML
Ghost/Nexus
WC
Ani

You're right, I'm wagon-hopping with a bit of reckless abandon. But I'm not going to sit here and re-hash the points on players when cases have already been made. I've already given scumhunting on OGML. I'm not going to give full lists with reads on every player, I'm not going to give a 13 point analysis on why X is scum or Y is scum. I've found my choices, and I'm willing to work with everyone here in order to maximize our D1 potential. If I wasn't, my vote would still be parked on OGML.

OK, I've been completely unable to understand wtf is going on.

Wow, everyone who gets heat wants to replace out. This sucks. It's Day 1 and there have been, what, 2 replacements already and another 2 requested.

AGar wrote:

LlamaFluff wrote:I am completely down for a LMP-back wagon. Would rather see him back there then Sea, GG and farside hands down, and have him around the same level as Ythill/Apoc. Since no one aparently is happy with a Apoc vote

unelect Apoc
Elect LMP

@Sea - Can you explain your suspicions? You are calling just about all the top wagons scum at this point. What is your order here?
@Agar - Same question.

OGML
Ghost/Nexus
WC
Ani

You're right, I'm wagon-hopping with a bit of reckless abandon. But I'm not going to sit here and re-hash the points on players when cases have already been made. I've already given scumhunting on OGML. I'm not going to give full lists with reads on every player, I'm not going to give a 13 point analysis on why X is scum or Y is scum. I've found my choices, and I'm willing to work with everyone here in order to maximize our D1 potential. If I wasn't, my vote would still be parked on OGML.

Agarese Translation: I'm not going to put any effort into this game, deal with it.

Well, we can't just blindly wagon him.

I'm not unvoting any more, this is who I want lynched.
I don't know why I didn't vote at the end of #537, novice mistake.

WC, thanks for the support, but you can praise me if OGML/Nexus flips scum
I am completely willing to lynch either of them, or Animorpher (was willing because he is policy), although since he replaced out, I'd like to see who we get.

EBWOP: AGar not putting effort is his town meta, believe it or not

I agree that LMP is a good choice for the Backstage …



--

Saint wrote: Who am I appealing to? I generally feel AtA has to be TO someone.

No, it doesn’t. You are appealing to the “experienced scummers” in your argument. It’s not a valid argument to do so because said unnamed scummers are certainly capable of being wrong.

--

Vezok wrote:OGML: Why am I a town read? Sorry but having me in your town pile really makes me feel you are trying to go along with some other people.

Do you not think your play has warranted being a Town read?

Vezok wrote:I actually agree with AGar here.

Although you can add him to the list of people I would like to lynch.

Um, whut? You agree with AGar but want him lynched? Or did you get a little loose with your Pro-nouns and mean to refer to someone else?

--

Wrath wrote:The main reason I have not elect Ythill is because he seems to be so influential. I can't get a read on him and his ability to lead wagons is either really good if he is town or really bad if he is scum.

This seems like needless undermining. Putting Ythill back-stage isn’t going to do much harm from the standpoint of causing wagons as it is a Night only activity.

If anything it puts his thought processes under scrutiny and if he is scum holds him possibly accountable if anything said Backstage is used against Town going forward.

--

Ythill wrote:Oh look, Ghost is one of those scumbags who replaces out under pressure. Wonderful.

Did you actually look to see if this was in all of his games?

Ythill wrote:Saint brought my attention to this count and I do find it interesting that, without Sea's self vote and two late-wagon votes from scummy mofos, he would not be going backstage. I've been wondering if scum were going to prioritize avoiding the neighborhood or planting a spy in it and, though I'm not going to give this one too much weight without cardflips, it does look a little like the latter.

Interesting theory – I went to the latest raise counts and looked at each raise wagon in comparision to your latest stated scum reads –

Ythill ISO 57 wrote:Ghostlin remains at the top of my suspect list by a decent margin. Ani and Nexus are the runners up. A lynch on any of them would be good. By the numbers, OGML, Apok, and Wrath have been sufficiently scummy that I wouldn't mind seeing them hang.

This is your latest rundown of scum reads that I could find in a quick search.

The List – Ghost, Animorph, Nexus, OGML, Apok and Wrath.

I bolded those players in the latest Top 4 Raised list

Mod wrote:A Gaggle of Geese (9) – Vezokpiraka,

WrathChild

,

Ghostlin,

/Apokalyptika

, AGar, Locke Lamora,

OhGodMyLife

,

Nexus

, Ythill
Farside22 (9) –

animorpherv1

, farside22, Seacore, SGRaaize, Ythill,

Apokalyptika

, Locke Lamora, MagnaofIllusion, LynchMePls
Ythill (9) – Llamafluff, Seacore,

animorpherv1

, Agar, SGRaaize, Vezokpiraka,

Apokalyptika

,

Nexus

, LynchMePls
Seacore (6) – Seacore, Vezokpiraka, A Gaggle of Geese, SGRaaize,

WrathChild

,

Nexus

Looking at the raw numbers we have the following –

Gaggle – 5 suspects supporting
Ythill – 3 suspects supporting
Farside – 2 suspects supporting
Seacore – 2 suspects supporting

On a percentage basis we have

Gaggle – 55.5%
Ythill – 33.3Z%
Farside – 22.2%
Seacore – 33.3%

I would think Gaggle, being less of a Town read for you than Seacore (ISO 58) along with a high raw number of Suspect supporting and higher percentage of Suspect supporting would be the obvious scum trying to get Backstage.

Thoughts?

--

GG wrote:I, FARADAY, think MOI is scum.

Then bring your reasons. Chesskid I’m happy to ignore on his personal dislike of me when he just calls me scum on a regular basis. You on the other hand I don’t expect to be flippant like that.

The only time I will be unvoting will be in weeks, if I have to, or if it gets near a hammer.


EBWOP: I was just referencing someone not even in the game, MoI.

Evidently, vezok doesn't see fit to talk to me. I feel quite unloved. That being said, . vezok's clearly a waste of my vote today, and of the three leading wagons, OGML is the one I'm most comfortable with by far.

Also, I think LMP is a viable backstage candidate, and I think it would be entirely healthy to have some actual debate about backstage elects instead of being so complacent.

People I feel are scummy at the moment: vezok, Saint, OGML

People I feel are towny at the moment: Ythill, farside, LMP, MoI

AGar wrote:537 is a great pointer to why OGML needs to be lynched.

For prolific wagoning. Really? Hypocrite.

Yeah, I quoted the slip where you show very clearly that you are mafia and didn't mention the unrelated sentence that you are using to try and bullshit your way out of trouble. Pretty scummy, huh? I'm noting here that you are continuing to sully the point rather than explain the discrepancy.

Magna wrote:Did you actually look to see if this was in all of his games?

Nope. And I wasn't saying that he was scummy for requesting replacement. Just that he is scum, and under pressure, and requested replacement. It's frustrating.

Magna wrote:Thoughts?

Um... I'm not as thorough as you are? One of my solid townreads expressed strong dissatisfaction with one of my elect. I followed up. Sorry if my play isn't up to your standards. Also...

In the same post where I looked at the electorate, I removed OGML from my lynch list and, though it wasn't entirely explicit, moved Wrath into a top four category that didn't include Apok (who is scummy but not nearly as bad as the others). I also mentioned self-voting and suspects' late voting as qualifiers. So, ignoring the "late voting" aspect as harder to denote, your analysis should look something like this:

Mod wrote:A Gaggle of Geese (9) – Vezokpiraka,

WrathChild

,

Ghostlin

, Apokalyptika, AGar, Locke Lamora, OhGodMyLife,

Nexus

, Ythill
Farside22 (9) –

animorpherv1

,

farside22

, Seacore, SGRaaize, Ythill, Apokalyptika, Locke Lamora, MagnaofIllusion, LynchMePls
Ythill (9) – Llamafluff, Seacore,

animorpherv1

, Agar, SGRaaize, Vezokpiraka, Apokalyptika,

Nexus

, LynchMePls
Seacore (6) –

Seacore

, Vezokpiraka, A Gaggle of Geese, SGRaaize,

WrathChild

,

Nexus

If you remove the bolded votes GG, farside, and myself would still be going BS but Seacore would be replaced by Llama, which was the point. Mind you, this is all in retrospect because I didn't bother to look this deep into things when I originally posted on the subject.

OGML is not the play today. Wrath-scum was chaining suspicion on him flipping town. Wise up. In fact...

UNVOTE: Ghost
VOTE: WrathChild

Ythill wrote:

AGar wrote:537 is a great pointer to why OGML needs to be lynched.

For prolific wagoning. Really? Hypocrite.

@Wrath:

Yeah, I quoted the slip where you show very clearly that you are mafia and didn't mention the unrelated sentence that you are using to try and bullshit your way out of trouble. Pretty scummy, huh? I'm noting here that you are continuing to sully the point rather than explain the discrepancy.

I wasn't trying to BS out of anything. I followed up one statement with another. In the same post in the same two sentances.

AGar wrote:You're right, I'm wagon-hopping with a bit of reckless abandon. But I'm not going to sit here and re-hash the points on players when cases have already been made. I've already given scumhunting on OGML. I'm not going to give full lists with reads on every player, I'm not going to give a 13 point analysis on why X is scum or Y is scum. I've found my choices, and I'm willing to work with everyone here in order to maximize our D1 potential. If I wasn't, my vote would still be parked on OGML.

Reckless wagon isnt anything to be ashamed of, and contrary to popular belief is not scummy. You are being very vauge about anything past your call that OMGL is scum though, just lobbing names up without doing much to distinguish between any of them, just that you think they are decent lynches which is not going to fly.

At this point im going to wagon up the person who I really think can get lynched over townish read OGML and meh-Nexus. Just to note the OMGL wagon should be shot up by a vig tonight for sure, not sure anyone who has been on that wagon recently is holding more then a neutral read.



Ghost is still a lynch I could back, but this is just building up steam as the better lynch, and I think the more feasable one.

I've fallen a bit behind with things the last couple of days so I'll be doing my best to catch up over this weekend.

Same as above

Hey everyone. I going to start reading. It may take me a day or two to catch up, so if anyone wants to bring me up to speed with important events (claims, dramatic happenings) then I'll be appreciative.

Deadline is 7 days away, yes? So we need to start getting on the same page with things.

Then bring your reasons. Chesskid I’m happy to ignore on his personal dislike of me when he just calls me scum on a regular basis. You on the other hand I don’t expect to be flippant like that.

I'm uh, quite flippant. Anyway it's a gut read of course which obviously makes it completely invalid. Hopefully everyone else gets the same gut twinge and we can eventually lynch you.

Actually need to check something, in your other games you've replaced in to too. Might do that if I feel better later.

Hey K.K.