The Wire, Season 1 - Final Credits!

[TheGreatestAmericanHero]

Unless you're going to make an argument that SafteyDance necessarily has a similar meta to Jason, I don't see how 304 should affect my read on Jason at all. (Jason has a pretty distinctive town playstyle consisting of things I would find scummy out of almost any other player.)

What do you want me to say about his scumread on Dayne? I don't agree with it.

This is the issue I am starting to take with you, and why I think that if Jason flips scum that you are a buddy. You –still- are not discussing the issue. You have gone into this LALALA CAN’T HEAR YOU mode that Jason is town because Jason. How well do you think Jason is aware of his own meta? His play in Dresden Mafia I feel is completely different than here. Yes he gambits, but unlike here where his thoughts are a stick in the mud, I saw a progression of reads and thoughts as the Day went along.

TGAH -- according to 125 / 141, both your heads have (had?) a town-read on Dayne. How and why did you come to this read?

I mean, obviously I agree that Dayne's RP is a terrible reason to suspect him. But, as I think I've said already, it doesn't follow at all that Dayne is town, so I wonder if either of you had some other reason to think this?

From the same posts: rofl had a town-read on Jason, while Konowa had a scum-read. Presumably, since you're now voting Jason, rofl was persuaded out of his town-read. Can (either of) you say why?

I had Dayne as Town due to the Jason push (if Jason was scum, Dayne was most certainly not). rofl’s reason was “he is”.

I showed rofl the light in regards to Jason. rofl and I had opposite reactions to Jason’s gambit, this was due to his lack of flavor knowledge, while I am from Maryland and not watching The Wire is a sin punishable by death. I eventually convinced him that Jason’s gambit was a crock of shit. After that, I eventually got him to agree that Jason was the best vote

TGAH's vote on Jason is pretty poor; to be honest I'm completely unconvinced as to why anyone would consider Jason a good vote today. Sotty and Zach have vouched for his towniness, which is NOT a reason to count him out completely but is a great reason to go after other people on Day 1. Indeed, in the situation TGAH seems to suspect, I'd want to vote Sottyrulez instead of Jason. Wouldn't their flip tell you more about a partnership between them than Jason's would?

What? Since when has anyone –ever- been given a pass just because someone else says they are Town? This is horrible play. As far as the associative tell situation, Jason has been a major point of discussion for most of this Day. I think a Jason scumflip and Sotty’s meta defense would be more indicative of Sotty also being scum.

your [SAD] whole case is bad gambit = scum...

That’s not the whole case at all. Why are you not addressing other people’s issues with you? Your “content” is a bunch of noise, examples have been posted several times, and that your push on both Dayne and Vifam are for things that are not indicative alignment. I do find it slightly amusing that you haven’t attempted to analyze the Vifam slot since BT replaced in. This makes the push on Vifam even more scummy.

Am I stuck in a tunnel? I feel like I’m stuck in a tunnel.

I need to change skins or something.

~Post on Konowa account deleted

[The Baltimore Sun]

Day 1, Votecount 23

Shadoweh (1) - Baby Spice
JasonT1981 (4) - Ser Arthur Dayne, Cerulean, BT, TheGreatestAmericanHero
SafetyDance (4) - ChannelDelibird, petapan, McStab, sottyrulez
petapan (3) - Benmage, The Mini-Librarian, SafetyDance
McStab (4) - Plessiezarus, camn, Nostredeus, Deasvail
The Mini-Librarian (1) - Shadoweh
camn (1) - absta101

Not voting (1):

JasonT1981

• With 19 alive it takes 10 to lynch.
  
• Deadline is on 6th of February at 5:30pm GMT
  
• Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2013-02-06 13:30:28)
  
• Baby Spice is V/la.

Baby Spice is still V/la; will give her a while before prodding her.

[Nostredeus]

So TML has had 0 heat all game which makes me sad, I suppose that can wait until Day 2; I might look at this once TML has more content to consider.

Things that are bad right now:

Chat about this gambit.
Chat about this RP stuff.
Chat about why players talking to other Heads is or isn't scummy.

What does that leave:

Chat about Jason's wall posts having little content; this really doesn't seem to be true, largely because a lot of the wall is responding to this gambit crap so perfectly understandable, the bits that are gambit response do have content such as Jason's defence of his SD scumread which whilst wrong imo is still decent content.

SD's #543 and #544; the latter of which is a pretty good point imo, the former of which is both true and screams town, I'm not sure #548 is a legit response to #543 since SD is under fire, in my experience town go out of their way to defend themselves when under fire, had #543 just come out of no where then maybe.

McStab's #531 is terrible and I'm pretty happy with my vote there, this OMGUS chat also doesn't track imo.

[sottyrulez]

Unvote: Vote: TheGreatestAmericanHero

No way rolfcopter is the passive head in a hydra as town. I just did a search on him and he's also active in site. The alarm bells are ringing.

[BT]

He seemed legitimately ticked off by the RP & the wagon on him.

how does this relate to his alignment in this game

That's... a good question. <_< I got the impression his "gonna criticize my wagon" response was genuine, though, and that IS related to his alignment.

Librarian #390 gets a mention for commenting on the big wagons while still sticking to a vote that no one is interested in.

Could you please explain why this post of mine is scummy?

I just did?

I'm not -that- bad at reading you BT, for example it looks scummy when your posts are nothing but a bunch of quote strips.. oh wait. BT, after the rant about camn being scum and commenting that she jumped onto McStab right after Plessie, don't you think its hypocritical that your very next post is checking out the McStab wagon?

You're pretty bad at reading me if you think the occasional quote strips aren't part of my meta nowadays! And yeah, it's not hypocritical. Consider that she was on a wagon with one other slot, and then she went on to spar with that slot without seeming to take note of that fact once. Unlikely to come from town.

Do you think SOtty is more likely White Knighting or defending a scum buddy? It seems odd that scum would go out of their way to call as you said a census read, town.

I'm still not sure about it. If they're town then it's hard to argue with their recent reply, and then you have Jason saying they'd have bussed him as scumbuddies if the case were scum-scum. And I'm not reading the hydra as town or anything so who knows. Their recent post isn't so hot overall (overreactionary at times & there's the whole "cmon lets get tgah and sd" comment near the end) and there's also the fact they think Cerulean might be scum.

Nah, I'm still going to give this the benefit of the doubt for now.

UNVOTE: Jason
VOTE: McStab

I actually want to give camn a pass despite what I said earleir too. She's been tonally town in her recent posts and her continuous talk about theory would be pretty awkward. So misguided town is gonna outshine scum for now. (I'm pretty sure you STILL haven't talked about other suspects like I wanted you to)

... Reading Cerulean's post almost made me go straight back to the Jason vote. What's your answer to the question Benmage asked me? Do you think both Jason and Sottyhydra are scum?

Aaaaah fuck it I'm not switching votes. TGAH's point about the flip being helpful is tempting.

Or really I could go both ways right now.

[BT]

Uh, I had a reply to McStab's post written up but I guess I lost that somewhere while making that post.

[BT]

Found it:

Alright time to plow through the shit arguments out there. Can someone, perhaps

BT (I find his posts to be the most eloquent of my detractors)

please outline, in bullet point form, the points against me?


Jason is town. Absta is town (I know his townmeta pretty well and this is townabsta). SAD is town.

BT is town

. Peta is town.

Shadoweh is town

.


I think Nostredeus is most likely scum, SafetyDance and Plezzie are next behind him.

Guarantee 100% scum are on my wagon.

BT isn't one of them

, and I doubt that both DV and Camn are (although I wouldn't be surprised if one is - they both are giving me a weird vibe, but I think that partially stems just from an all around difficulty of mine to read them).

Also funny how many people are setting themselves up to switch votes onto me and thinking they're ohhhhh so clever at how reasonable they're looking *glares at Shadoweh, BT*

I'm still trying to comprehend how that last line came from the same post.

As for your request, I don't know about others's reasons, but my current reasons now are here and, uh, this post.

[Benmage]

Weak as Budwieser reads that do nothing to help with anything. List reads (or whatever you call them) are not proper reads or effective scumhunting.

So it's not something you're going to see me throw out there.

I disagree here, rough reads list like that can give basic standpoints, which is helpful imo. Plus if you see something that doesn't make sense, like Benmage listed under scum, you can question that person further for why they have that read.

Nearly 100% McStab would flip town after reading him in ISO like I said in one of my recent posts. My vote may well go on Safety Dance as it stands.

More when I get back on.

Okay, why and why? On the off chance you happen to be town,

how the hell is mcstab nearly 100% town

, and why are you ready to jump on the easy wagon? Show me your thought process.

^This.

Benmage, what's your explanation for SD not unvoting? I am not making any assumptions, just considering possibilities.

No, but you only propose negative possibilities. Confirmation Bias much? He answers you here:

Stubborness? Busy defending myself? I don't think you're quite grasping the fact I was only defending an early post, nor time as a factor.

But plenty of times I'll leave an early vote floating and outdated if I simply don't have a strong scumsuspect, and or am behind in the game.

SD's #543 and #544; the latter of which is a pretty good point imo

What makes #544 good?

McStab's #531 is terrible and I'm pretty happy with my vote there, this OMGUS chat also doesn't track imo.

I concur here, the FoS the world is pathetic.


UNVOTE: VOTE: MCSTAB My god take a gander at his iso:
-First post I didn't even realize the scumminess, check out the 'cutesy' behavior I spoke previously about:Post 17
Stash house nonsense?? post 53
-Votes Nost, for his backing off the nameclaim. (Why couldn't Shadoweh's statement that Faraday gives varying safeclaims be sufficient enough to have swayed Nost??)
-- Connects CBD to Nost because CBD defends him. post 165

@Everyone: I think alot of people are thinking that what Benmage said is what happened (that a bunch of people shot down the name idea, that's why he backed off). Go back and check the posts. He suggests it, ONE small post comes up (that really doesn't have alot of merit), written by the person he was voting for as scum (which would normally bring into question the motives of the person saying it) and he backs off.

Okay yes, Nost rescinds his stance after Shadoweh's one point. As said before, I don't see why that can't be the case. And then yes, several of us echo similar Faraday points. But because I had a misnomer in recalling when Nost exactly rescinded his point, I'm suddenly lumped into the scum team.

Also for the sake of posterity in case my tinfoil hat theory starts looking plausible a

Benmage-CDB-Nost scumteam

works really well; I don't wanna get into setup spec too much so it's possible there's more scum/different factions/SK.

NEWSFLASH, whose going to be morelikely to check when exactly Nost took back his position? Scum or town?

Answer this please**.

This "cute" behavior, from a little pressure reads forced: post 416 / post 422

This is the creme de la creme post 531 I said previously, he opens aggressive... for what? Because he instantly asks BT todo his legwork, scummy scummy scummy.
-The FoS at the end for those attacking him, as I said before is ridiculous.

If you read his iso, it's altogether rather flat. I get a strong early scum attempt at trying to be active enough to avoid being calling a lurker, but attempting to stay off radar.

ANYWAYS, down for petapan or Mcstab. Not really Jay anymore. Don't think SDance either tho I do (zomg) still need to iso there. But I'd rather take my next energy attempt to look at DV.
***** I think we're getting to that point where we need to start narrowing these wagons down. ( I know it'll take another 8+pages todo so )
-- A lot of people have voiced acceptance with a Mcstab wagon.
*** Whose currently against a Mcstab lynch?

[The Mini-Librarian]

I just noticed I missed a question from nost. (not sure why he didn't mention it again though...)

1. ("Contrived Reasoning". Heh, I see what you did there.) Anyway, it was the way he called for it. It was mentioned already and shot down. In his post he showed that he was reading at least some of thread so his call for name massclaim felt very weird to me. And as Benmage correctly noted Omar could easily want specific people dead.

I've actually already answered that question about bringing it back up; is there a reason you are unsatisfied with my answer or are you hoping people wouldn't notice?

Am I correct that your reasoning for bringing it up again was to clear players that claimed Avon and Stringer, per post 107? You should be able to realize that doesn't really alleviate my concern that you're a 3rd party with a hit list.

--

@BT:

Let me rephrase, why is that particular action of mine scummy in your eyes. I don't see how in a vacuum that particular action can be seen as scummy, nor can I see how in this particular situation that can be seen as scummy.

--

As for trying to narrow down the wagons, peta is still my number one choice. Not particularly interested in Safetydance today (SD is not scum buddies with peta) Jason is a good compromise with my only concern being sottyrulez insistence that they're town (tiny town read on them, they seem to be playing similarly to a game I just finished with them). I'm not sure what to make of mcstab right now. He's incredibly null to me.

[BT]

Let me rephrase, why is that particular action of mine scummy in your eyes. I don't see how in a vacuum that particular action can be seen as scummy, nor can I see how in this particular situation that can be seen as scummy.

Because you were clearly showing interest in the big wagons but your vote didn't reflect that -- it was wasted on Absta instead. Why didn't you commit to one of the wagons at #390?

[DeasVail]

SD: Sorry about misunderstanding the first part of your post. So was it being stubborn, or being busy defending yourself?

[The Baltimore Sun]

Sending Baby Spice a reminder to post

[Baby Spice]

Sending Baby Spice a reminder to post

Pfffffttttt!

Going to start reading soon.

[McStab]

I know this is going to sound like a pressure replacing out, but it's not, I assure you. Some fairly serious, unanticipated real life things have come up for me (don't worry, not sick or anything, but nonetheless I'll be unable to devote the time to this game and site as a whole that it deserves - I may not be back for a few months).

Sorry to all the other players, my replacement for leaving him in this spot (although my replacement should definitely look at my post 53), and Faraday for his great modding; I have no doubt this will be a fun game.

- Mod, replacing out.

[DeasVail]

Good luck with the RL stuff!

[The Baltimore Sun]

Zdenek replaces McStab

[Cerulean]

Unvote: Vote: TheGreatestAmericanHero

No way rolfcopter is the passive head in a hydra as town. I just did a search on him and he's also active in site. The alarm bells are ringing.

What do you think of Konowa's cotent irrespective of rofl's activity?

[Cerulean]

Arthur - What's your read on Pless/Zar?

[Cerulean]

Safety - when you come back around, mind giving your top two scum reads.

*was going to try to do more, but I'm in a bad mood, I'll deal with this tomorrow*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Arthur - What's your read on Pless/Zar?

Prob null leaning scum.

[Cerulean]

Arthur - What's your read on Pless/Zar?

Prob null leaning scum.

Have you been very accurate in reading them (either head) in the past? What is leaning you null/scum?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Arthur - What's your read on Pless/Zar?

Prob null leaning scum.

Have you been very accurate in reading them (either head) in the past? What is leaning you null/scum?

Not particularly? (I mean I don't remember the last time Zar played a westerosi game, and I don't remember ever seeing Pless as scum on westeros, so meh - I don't remember ever really getting a strong read on them in ADWD either).

And I find their lack of engagement/interaction and seemingly interest to be appalling. Both of them look like they're forcing themselves to post, esp from Zar who looks like he's being dragged to come and post. I actually find Pless' annoyance at Zar not really posting or conversing with him privately rather genuine - but I can very clearly see it as Pless being annoyed at Zar in a scum slot.

[petapan]

@petapan

Could you bullet the reasoning behind your two top 2 scum reads (Sdance, jason? if thats still them)
-And bullet top 2 town reads with a reason or two please.

i think safetydance is scum because he was super bitchy and indignant about how SAD was acting but used words like "antitown" to describe it, then shifted his focus solely to defending himself and complaining and acting like he's a victim. it's bullshit, he's fake, his words ring hollow

i don't particularly have a reason on jason, i was more or less following other people there but i lost confidence in that vote

if i had townreads i was confident in, i would state them. i don't. i don't believe anyone here is someone i can easily read as town.

[Cerulean]

Arthur - What's your read on Pless/Zar?

Prob null leaning scum.

Have you been very accurate in reading them (either head) in the past? What is leaning you null/scum?

Not particularly? (I mean I don't remember the last time Zar played a westerosi game, and I don't remember ever seeing Pless as scum on westeros, so meh - I don't remember ever really getting a strong read on them in ADWD either).

And I find their lack of engagement/interaction and seemingly interest to be appalling. Both of them look like they're forcing themselves to post, esp from Zar who looks like he's being dragged to come and post. I actually find Pless' annoyance at Zar not really posting or conversing with him privately rather genuine - but I can very clearly see it as Pless being annoyed at Zar in a scum slot.

Er the last time zar played a westeros game was the marvel game (which incidentally pless rpd a good portion of the game >_>)

My problem with them is the lack of engagement, I said before that I thought that zar was less active due to his modding a game that was running before this game and passed him on that, but he's still not being active, and his new immediate pet project doesn't excuse him from being active here. The only only thing I have towards him being town, is that he hates being town and he hates being unrolled, so if he's decided to check out and leave his partner hanging he might be town.

And I might really believe that just pless isn't engaging in the game at the level I would expect innocent him to be, so it makes me paranoid on them both. None of this makes me think they're town, and them looking like they're forcing to post does ring off. I might expect that from zar, who probs has his own thing that's more interesting, but I wouldn't expect it from pless.

I was just really hoping you'd have some insight as the pless/zar read is something we've been having a hard time with.

[DeasVail]

If Zar likes being scum though (and hasn't been scum/played in a while) wouldn't he be more eager about things?

My thoughts on Pless are pretty limited right now. It's basically that Pless is possibly trying too hard to be chatty. Sometimes his posts take on a kind of conversational(?) style that I think could be fake. Other than that... I nothing much either way, but I don't find them particularly scummy for now.