scum is not gonna loudly tunnel a different person every day phase that is a horrible strategy.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:54 am
by Tchill13
so basically if you explain yourself your town. FL and Skitter get to be town just because.
well i guess its a good thing you reminded me of yourself vork. now ik a "bad town" read could be in play for you.
Either way, Vork/FL dont need to be in lylo at this rate. Not sure if I can see a lot of town motivation in what vork has done anyway.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:54 am
by Vorkuta
In post 572, Tchill13 wrote:Lines up with you just blindly following the "better" or "famous" players in a game
The push on you was independent of papa cowbells- I legit thought you were pulling a fast one with "i'm miller" "nvm im ascetic" and wanted to have both options open
In post 572, Tchill13 wrote:its terrible. I'd advise you to make mistakes confidently and learn rather than be content to play like that any more.
idk I've made too many as town recently so I'm on a backseat I suppose
also I'm noticing that in quite a few games it's completely plausible for townies to just win on the coattails of other players so there's that as well
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:55 am
by Vorkuta
In post 575, Tchill13 wrote:scum is not gonna loudly tunnel a different person every day phase that is a horrible strategy.
You say "horrible", some people see "100% viable and optimal"
In post 576, Tchill13 wrote:so basically if you explain yourself your town. FL and Skitter get to be town just because.
no.....?
are you putting words in my mouth, or is there a misunderstanding?
I'm not going to be able to read them on this day phase and that's it. Nothing more, nothing less.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:58 am
by Tchill13
A. So i was lynched for an honest mistake in getting miller/ascetic confused. Sounds about right.
B. Why even sign up if you're gonna ride coattails. It's completely plausible for town to lose b4 the game even begins if FL roles scum and theres enough players like you in the same game. Which is SUPER fun for townies that actually are confident in their ability but aren't on your fame list.
In post 575, Tchill13 wrote:scum is not gonna loudly tunnel a different person every day phase that is a horrible strategy.
You say "horrible", some people see "100% viable and optimal"
In post 576, Tchill13 wrote:so basically if you explain yourself your town. FL and Skitter get to be town just because.
no.....?
are you putting words in my mouth, or is there a misunderstanding?
I'm not going to be able to read them on this day phase and that's it. Nothing more, nothing less.
ok dont say "some"
YOU tell me the pros/cons of tunneling a seperate towny as scum every day phase. Tell me why some may view that as the way to play scum.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:05 am
by Flubbernugget
Do you specifically want vork to answer? Cuz I've got two off the top of my head that seem obvious
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:07 am
by Vorkuta
In post 579, Tchill13 wrote:B. Why even sign up if you're gonna ride coattails
You uhh... realize that you've inspired me to become more confident/independent and now I'm pushing you right?
Also depends on the game- with some games or players I feel like I can accomplish things.
In post 580, Tchill13 wrote:YOU tell me the pros/cons of tunneling a seperate towny as scum every day phase. Tell me why some may view that as the way to play scum.
Isn't this..... like.... self-evident....?
This is quite a small game (8:3 I'm guessing? => D1: mislynch, N1: NK, D2: mislynch: N2: NK, D3: 4:3 LyLo) so it only has to be done twice.
You get absolved of all your responsibility, don't have to waste energy/braincells to come up with reads for other players as they're outside your tunnel, and have more bases covered. It's more optimal than the traditional "pretend to scumhunt, but not too badly" approach of blending in with town. And at the end of the day, you get your mislynch.
pedit
you tell em flubber
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:08 am
by Tchill13
i mean why would claiming miller then claiming ascetic be a viable scum strat? its gonna cause attention.
THINK of the indirect consequences
of an action before you label it town or scum.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:09 am
by Tchill13
so youre telling me in lylo that slot thats been tunneling will probably survive said lylo?
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:09 am
by Flubbernugget
You uhhh already hit the nail on the head
It makes townie noises w/o much effort, but also robb's stake in meta probs means he feels like he has to play like that as scum too
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:11 am
by Tchill13
and idc what you do as long as you do it confidently. You're in the middle of a mistake rn. Mistakes are good. Learn from it post game.
why am i scum exactly Vork?
townie noises? how is tunneling townie?
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:12 am
by Vorkuta
Ok tchill, yes you're an amazingly good player, you have immense knowledge of theory and a ton of experience,
I'm sorry I haven't had the fortune of playing with you more often enough to get completely intimidated by you and add you to my list of greats.
Can we get back to this game at hand and discuss mafia theory a bit later?
I'm quite content with my """"surface level reads"""" as I've outlined in my readlist before and I'm not capable of dedicating more braincells to consider more levels of depth and ripples
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:13 am
by Tchill13
can anyone pushing robb determine what his scum tunneling looks like opposed to his town tunneling? because if you cant. his tunneling is NAI.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:14 am
by Vorkuta
In post 584, Tchill13 wrote:so youre telling me in lylo that slot thats been tunneling will probably survive said lylo?
Considering lylo is tomorrow (9:2 are only newbie setups right...?) and NK'ing him is just dumb considering what amazing hypothetical lynchbait he is....
and there isn't/wasn't support for a wagon on him esp. given how no-one except for yours truly raised ANY objections to his D1 play....
It's easy to fatigue people into reading the tunnel participants as null/town
At least that's what happens to me
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:18 am
by Flubbernugget
In post 588, Tchill13 wrote:can anyone pushing robb determine what his scum tunneling looks like opposed to his town tunneling? because if you cant. his tunneling is NAI.
I will flat out admit I have no clue how to read Robb
In post 579, Tchill13 wrote:B. Why even sign up if you're gonna ride coattails
You uhh... realize that you've inspired me to become more confident/independent and now I'm pushing you right?
Also depends on the game- with some games or players I feel like I can accomplish things.
In post 580, Tchill13 wrote:YOU tell me the pros/cons of tunneling a seperate towny as scum every day phase. Tell me why some may view that as the way to play scum.
Isn't this..... like.... self-evident....?
This is quite a small game (8:3 I'm guessing? => D1: mislynch, N1: NK, D2: mislynch: N2: NK, D3: 4:3 LyLo) so it only has to be done twice.
You get absolved of all your responsibility, don't have to waste energy/braincells to come up with reads for other players as they're outside your tunnel, and have more bases covered. It's more optimal than the traditional "pretend to scumhunt, but not too badly" approach of blending in with town. And at the end of the day, you get your mislynch.
pedit
you tell em flubber
is it standard that 11p games have 3 scum? or are you just assuming scum have more than 2 ppl when its still a possibility.
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:19 am
by Flubbernugget
Really doesn't matter
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:21 am
by Tchill13
i mean thats another day phase of tunneling to incriminate robb . which makes them look worse in lylo.
which means they probably dont survive lylo. Of course i didnt know ppl just threw out TR's to tunnelers.
"doesn't vote in first few posts. He has to be scum"
That's you turning nothing into something because you think you can read tonally.
garbage attempt to shade = reasons to mislynch
In post 167, Tchill13 wrote:Nomnomnom is scum. That weak push on havo and now it looks like they're trying to get ahead of this lynch and say "I told you so" when azure flips green.
In post 309, Tchill13 wrote:luca, absolutely nothing personal, but you really have no idea what scum me does in any given situation. So if you'd like to push me make a general case.
Not one based on me and my tendencies specifically.
In post 273, Luca Blight wrote:I do agree that the Vort hammer felt kind of townie - after the self-vote I just assumed Azure was scum already, so I can understand quick-hammering there. Scum obviously would know she was flipping green and might have hesitated.
scum most likely hammer, chalk the wagon up to a stupid self voter and move along...
Scum want a flip to be green lol. Why would that cause hesitation????
So based on my exchange(s) with you, you clearly have an idea of what's "optimal play" for both sides, and anything that isn't optimal for one is automatically the other. This lack of nuance maybe why I dislike your posts and points so much
In post 487, Flavor Leaf wrote:Ugh, I haven’t read completely, and the slowdown of the site messed with me.
I’m VT. I think I’m L-2, right?
Pushing me as “needs to get in here” is a bad reason because I’m an incredibly active scum player, and Havo has seen me as scum.
self meta is BS. anyone can try something new.
counter: "why fix what isn't broken"
In post 519, Tchill13 wrote:as of right now vork is more dead weight than any player in this game who's inactive because he keeps talking about how bad he is as town and he even mentioned skitter/leaf being "Gods" of some sort. talked as if he couldnt even touch them.
not happy with vork or flavor at all.
i love you too
Also for robb who complained that my "tchill's ISO is bad" post was too vague or whatever
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:24 am
by Tchill13
how should i defend robb here if im town and i think hes town?
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:24 am
by Tchill13
"holier than though" i TR'd azure obv and was getting mad she was punishing other townies out of pure ego and rage.
Hence my 40% policy "insistence" as he is probably a bigger Lylo liability than all of us put together.
In post 593, Tchill13 wrote:is it standard that 11p games have 3 scum? or are you just assuming scum have more than 2 ppl when its still a possibility.
I don't have many 11 player games under my belt so I'm just spit-balling- The 8:3 setup helps my point (scum only has to deathtunnel twice) and I'm assuming that the numbers are balanced by townPR power
english wtf
In post 595, Tchill13 wrote:Of course i didnt know ppl just threw out TR's to tunnelers.
based on my read and re-read of the beginning of D2.... yeah robb's kind of getting a free pass