Animal Rescue: petsPick (Game Over!)

[Amrun]

Oh and for the record I forgot about the census taker in DDD's game, too. lol

[Llamarble]

VP does have the 'my role conflicts with Lew's let's lynch' towntell and the bit about whether we should have Roxi claim felt a smidgeon town though.

I also don't like the fact that you voted Lew more or less entirely for role-disagreement, and that he flipped town after that.
If scum think they see a hole in a townie's claim that's like BLOOOOODD IN WATER LYNCHLYNCHLYNCHLYNCH.

well that opinion conveniently shifted....

This D1 read of VPB happened because his towntells are surface-tells whereas his scumtells are slightly closer to the hardware.

you've yet to actually outline anything close to scumtells or scum motivation. you said I "string sentences together" (which doesn't even make any kind of logical sense, I am equally verbose as either alignment) and that I used the word "honestly," which is a typical word in my lexicon.

Usually somebody who votes for somebody else because of role conflicts is town and the votee is scum.
But sometimes scum find a hole or dubious-point in a town claim and ground their vote on that.
Lew flipping town, the degree to which you focused on the claim conflict itself as opposed to the rest of Lew's posting, and the fact that his claim did have very scum-exploitable sketchy parts (the 'multiple animals' thing and the 'noncatdog' thing) make me think the latter was going on.

I don't care much about the word honestly, though it and its ilk do crop up a lot when scum think town really has done something weird.
The point is you saw something that really seemed baseless to you and decided to attack irrespective of that thing being actually scummy.
Your pursuit of Q over his townread on S felt like exactly the kind of thing scum would dig into in exactly the manner scum would dig into it.
Overall VP is poking at logic-holy-things instead of at scummy-things.

And chaining discrete terse sentences is scummy because scum typically compose most of their posts like "this is a good thing to say"... "and so is this" and so on whereas town can pretty much dump raw thought unless a post is specifically being built as a persuasive-essay-thing.

unvote, vote:DDD

Your vote switch really just seems to come at Vi's behest. Since when are you so easily flapped?

Also, Llamarble is so fucking scum it's not even funny. Most of his D1 iso is a hard fence sit on the lew wagon while employing "cheese stands alone" voting tactics. Then when lew's lynch is inevitable he suddenly finds him so town and complains of the hammer, as if it's the rest of the town's fault he didn't start participating until the 11th hour. Then he starts today with the 'poor me' act. Give me a break.

His reads aren't even consistent. For example, Vi goes from "towntown" in post 214 because he shares her reads throughout the early game, to not even making his deep reads before the end of the day. Today, Vi is "shades of grey," which I find funny and inexplicable given his other stances.

Then he proceeds to use 'grammar tells' to suss out my alignment while simultaneously using my reasons for calling lew scum yesterday as both a town and a scum tell.

Does not compute.

First off what is your vote doing on DDD if I'm "so fucking scum it's not even funny?"
I fence-sat on Lewarcher because he had tells in both directions and I wanted THE TRUTH.
I started writing that post-hammer post well before the hammer actually dropped, as you might infer from its length and the fact that it followed the hammer by 10 minutes.
I simply didn't get to Vi during twilight (I was going alphabetically so I didn't miss any ISOs and got cut off by threadlock).
When I was reading him later he moved from towntown land to grey-land.

[VP Baltar]

why did Vi move in your reads?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Why do I need to explain my fake governing? It's in essence just a reverse fake daykill. It probably would've worked better if lew had been active, but on the whole I think it was useful.

Useful for what? What info did you gleam from it?

A bunch of people responded well (glowball, UT, you, Amrun). I don't like that 'marble completely ignored it. Jason arguing it was fake based on mechanics after I had given up trying to convince people it was real seems less likely coming from daytalking scum.

[Llamarble]

Iffy:
CES - he has a couple of decent early posts, but mostly is just watching. I could see faking governor from either angle.

I thought it was pretty obviously fake, so I only found it important for reading you, and it didn't make reading you as town or as scum fail to make sense.

I'll go look at Vi again and see if I can dredge up what I was thinking about, but I remember agreeing with some of the things Vi said early but finding the overall amount of smashing things up and looking for scum to be lower than I expected.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

How was it obvious? Governing lew made sense given what I had said in thread and I even said zorzor would confirm it.

[Llamarble]

I dunno, I just never really even considered the possibility you were telling the truth.

Reasons I thought Vi was town were his initial push on Lew and townread on Sotty, but as the day goes on Vi didn't talk a whole lot about people / scums other than Lew, So although I liked some individual things I was a bit concerned about the overall pattern. I still lean town, but I wouldn't be shocked by a scumflip.

[Amrun]

What is your read on CES? What was it then?

[Sotty7]

Overall VP is poking at logic-holy-things instead of at scummy-things.

This pretty much sums up my feelings on VP.

[VP Baltar]

Overall VP is poking at logic-holy-things instead of at scummy-things.

This pretty much sums up my feelings on VP.

You said this about me in DDD's game too where I was legitimately scumhunting (and successfully I might add). I think it's a pretty bunk accusation.

[xvart]

Prod received. Post coming tonight.

[Sotty7]

Overall VP is poking at logic-holy-things instead of at scummy-things.

This pretty much sums up my feelings on VP.

You said this about me in DDD's game too where I was legitimately scumhunting (and successfully I might add). I think it's a pretty bunk accusation.

umm, you were scum in that game.

[Sotty7]

I also disagree you were scum hunting when you killed Sottyrulez in that game. But I'm not going to bicker with you about that here, it's more of a pet peeve of mine when scum or in your case the SK, are peeved they were caught out even though they were scum after all.

[Vi]

I'll go look at Vi again and see if I can dredge up what I was thinking about, but I remember agreeing with some of the things Vi said early

but finding the overall amount of smashing things up and looking for scum to be lower than I expected.

Yes, and...?
I'm particularly interested in what you expected.

p-edit 2: Can't you shift your attention to DDD yourself? I've said all I feel like saying about DDD at the moment. He's playing a bit milquetoast.

I've done quite a bit of that recently; thanks but no thanks.

Also VPB, Sotty7 is more than likely Town here.

[VP Baltar]

@sotty - I remember my role, but I was legitimately scumhunting there. That's my point, I don't think you can deny that considering our hydra was instrumental in the death of two scums there.

@Vi - I share your sentiment. I am just saying it's a flimsy and inaccurate argument. She may be town, but she's fueling a bad case mad by a scum. I'm gonna call her out on that.

[Sotty7]

VP I don't care how many scum you caught, the fact is you were scum which means you were playing differently to when you are town. Trying to discount my point because you caught some scum doesn't work. It still fits

your

scum meta which was my point.

I don't think it is a bad case, but it's not a super strong one. Magic mafia and Pie mark two (maybe the later of SA III, but not as much) are all examples of VPscum latching onto things that aren't scummy and NOTEVERLETTINGGO. It's like you need to find something to attack so it looks like you are doing something. As scum you tend to blow things out of proportion, like you did here with Quilford's early town read of me.

[VP Baltar]

I think I've talked less about Quilford's town read of you than you have...just a thought.

Also, I was SK in that game, meaning I was scumhunting no differently than I would as town...which was my point.

[jasonT1981]

God damn it! I had a post made, and my browser crashed losing it. Anyway, short of it.

Going to look more in depth tomorrow and Cog and Ghostlin by ISOing them.

Unsure on the VP thing. D1 he was a non entity to the point I forgot he was in this game and I was focusing elsewhere.

The census taker is slightly different from what I have seen before. In the past, It was used to determine how many scum was on a lynch wagon. I still see Quilford as town. Scum has no reason really to out themselves that much. Unless Quilford is scum, and fucking with us. But I read him as town so I doubt it.

Sotty/VP what game are you talking about, and how relevant is it to this game, meta wise?

Amrun, did the census taker work like this in DDD's game you talk about?

@ Amrun again, how does my push not seem genuine?

more tomorrow evening after college and Car getting its MOT test.

[Amrun]

You're confusing census taker with sensor, Jason.

They're also talking about DDD's game. Tbh I don't really remember the census taker in that game. They died before revealing so it didn't much come into play.


Your push doesn't seem genuine because it feels ... constructed. A) It's based on associative tells with no flips. B) The way you're building it seems feels like a push for a mislynch rather than a genuine probing of intent.

[xvart]

I lost my post but I have to say that there is something fishy going on with Jason, LLamarble, and glowball. Whenever I read their love triangle I feel like at least one person, if not tow, are operating on more information than a town member should have at this point. The whole Jason pushing glowball while voting Llamarble looks to me like he is more convinced that the person he isn't voting is scum which doesn't work with where his vote actually is. Also, spilling over from my suspicions yesterday:

VOTE: Jason

I also think VPB is town.

[Llamarble]

^scum.
Like, wow.
So we've got 2/4 now. Guessing the rest are somewhere in DDDP / UT / Ghostlin / CES
Which makes my townlist:
Amrun
Vi
me
KK
Glowball
Quilford
Sotty

Yeah, those people may all be town.
Cool.

[Vi]

I'm glad* to see I'm back on your Town list...?

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

You seem to be of the opinion that I really and truly thought KK was 100% scum and thus my vote switch was somehow a big revelation, what in my posts gave you that impression?

Well, it's not really that, I just expect you to be serious about your votes and it seemed to me like you moved rather easily for no reason other than a poke in the ribs. Listen, I'm going to be straight with you, I really want you to prove your towniness to me so we can just wreck some fools like in WWF. Unlike Vi or Sotty, I feel like you and I are able to lock in on each other's townieness without a doubt. That's something I want to be able to do and let the scum kill us off if they like. I can't have this middling read of you for the rest of the game.

The vote was serious in that I was trying to use it productively to feel out a player I didn't have much of a read on. I moved my vote because after my trial balloon went up their were decent reminders of why KK wasn't as likely to be scum. And that poke in the ribs was a catalyst for me to make the logical leap from bothersome argument to scumtell.

They're also talking about DDD's game. Tbh I don't really remember the census taker in that game. They died before revealing so it didn't much come into play.

It was a one-shot ability for the JOAT and the information was handed off to another player (Vi) and the information mostly got lost in her post restriction.

[Untrod Tripod]

/picks up prod

More later, but DDDP's notion that my play being "normal" makes it scummy is, uh...

Well I guess, what exactly do you mean by normal?

[VP Baltar]

I have a big interview today guys. I probably won't have much time for this game, so fair warning.

That being said,

unvote, vote: Llama

I'm gonna try this a different way, help me lynch this scumbag DDD...then I'll know you're town.

@Jason - I was an SK in DDD's game. In that game, Sotty claimed I was poking at logic holes and arguing semantics rather than scumhunting. She claims I am doing the same thing here. I told her, the problem with her logic is that as a third party in that game I was legitimately scumhunting. That is optimal SK play--hunt scum for real during the day, kill townies at night. I was a part of two scum deaths in that game. That's why I told her that her argument is bad. I was legit scumhunting there and I'm legit scumhunting here, whether she agrees with my approach or not is not an alignment tell.