Heroes of Comedy Game Over - He who laughs last!

[Korlash]

Naw, fate is scum for sure.

His "korlash is scum for saying 'lol I get to kill fate too!' " when he knows the nature of our relationship means I would make that joke regardless of my alignment; plus his "using our history makes MoI 100% town" post pretty much suggests scum fate.

Speculatin on a tow. MoI would be futile since its impossible he is town who started to set up this specific gambit the twenty odd pages when he first dropped the vengeful hints.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Read the above and lynch him tomorrow please! Or Benmage. Both are scum.

[Korlash]

Yeah keep it up MoI, this fake 'obv distancing' as you die isn't very attractive an it won't work to paint me as your scum partner.

Does a good job of givin me not so warm and fuzzy feelings from Ben though...

[MagnaofIllusion]

Yeah keep it up MoI, this fake 'obv distancing' as you die isn't very attractive an it won't work to paint me as your scum partner.

Does a good job of givin me not so warm and fuzzy feelings from Ben though...

And when I flip Town as I will they can hang your ass from the nearest tree!

[jasonT1981]

Zeek has requested replacement (a few days ago) I have been flat out with work so not had a chance to do anything. VC coming soon.

[jasonT1981]

Day 1 Vote Count 7

Rat 2 - Mini-Librarian, Pizza,
MOI 6 - Benmage, Yates,pappums rat,MattP,Korlash,Shotgun,
Mini-Librarian 1 - Zeek
Yates 1 - vijay2vansandani,
MattP 1 - PereV
Korlash 2 - Fate,MOI,

Not Voting

It is now Day 1, with 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

(expired on 2012-05-15 10:21:52)

till Day 1 Deadline

[Korlash]

Pshhh MoI, hanging my ass wouldn't accomplish anything... They would need to use my neck, gosh.

MOD: you have me and fate switched in that VC.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Oh look ... not too late to lynch scum Benmage or Korlash ...

If this is still open tomorrow I'll dissect all the crap Korlash has laid out while LA.

And Benmage's last responses are typical of Benmage scum. Don't address the things pointed out and just call people names.

[drmyshotgun]

I doubt you didn't know your own lynch wasn't yet complete.

[jasonT1981]

MOD: you have me and fate switched in that VC.

BAH! The effects of a long weekend, lack of sleep... lots of work and a quick VC.

[Benmage]

Does a good job of givin me not so warm and fuzzy feelings from Ben though...

Yeah MoI and I are partners.. this whole games been a preplanned attack eachothers throats....rightttttt

Here I thought gunny had hammered. How disappointing.

[pappums rat]

PV and V2V you guys need to put your vote somewhere that would count considering there is less than two days left. Your 1-man wagons aren't going anywhere and you know it.

[vijay2vasandani]

Well I'll hammer in 12 hours.

[pappums rat]

That's the fifth time you've mentioned hammering someone at a later time. Here's the other posts for reference:

If MoI claims bomb or something I don't mind hammering.. I'm waaayyy out of my league here. Although idk if he's actually going to do that now.

@MoI: regarding that post where you said I was posting as if you were town, you deliberately misinterpretted it. I posted that with the mindset of you being a better player, thus causing the mistakes you made to be deliberate and scummy instead of just newbie-ness.

^ agree. And Pappum's Rat, I already have my vote on him. It's just that if we're afraid he's a bomb or something i don't mind hammering instead of say Benmage.

^ goon is the most common scum drink, not role.

Also dude, we're comedians. There is no RB. This I know. If anybody is at L-1 I will hammer.

Why in the world did I listen to vijay when it comes to hammers?!?

Still don't like Korlash's vote though.

Lol ikr? Hahaha God it's something about you TML. I can't seem to count. If nobody has claimed a hammer, I'll do it in 24 hours. (that's assuming I can count to 24 X.X)

Scared to hammer for some reason?

Folks, take a quick look through vijay's ISO. There's a lot of words that dont really say much. If there are two kills tonight I wouldnt be terribly surprised if vijay isnt a SK. I dont really see much of a town mindset behind V2V's posts.

[vijay2vasandani]

^ this guy. How am I scared to hammer? I'm just giving a heads up. Is it my fault the wagon disappears when I decide to hammer?

[Korlash]

Oh look ... not too late to lynch scum Benmage or Korlash ...

Considering I'm not scum I would say it's plenty late... Consider your lynch isn't going to stop, I'd say lynching Ben is out of the question as well. Sorry. *looks genuinely sorry*

If this is still open tomorrow I'll dissect all the crap Korlash has laid out while LA.

Cool, start with how I'm scum for voting you due to fakeclaiming, when you, you know, actually fakeclaimed... Or how your 'town gambit' had zero chance to work due to the approaching deadline and the size of your wagon. Or how you knew you would even be in this situation 20 pages ago when you started this 'gambit'...

Once you can explain all that away, then feel free to dig through my crap... >.>

Folks, take a quick look through vijay's ISO. There's a lot of words that dont really say much. If there are two kills tonight I wouldnt be terribly surprised if vijay isnt a SK. I dont really see much of a town mindset behind V2V's posts.

Not to put V2V down, but did he say a lot back in Redwall?

Even if he is a SK, he has to kill who we want him too since he's claimed, so the scum would want him 'taken care of' in some capacity, either through kill or RB. If he is an Sk, let him absorb the scum's attention for now.

[pappums rat]

^ this guy. How am I scared to hammer? I'm just giving a heads up. Is it my fault the wagon disappears when I decide to hammer?

Why do you feel the need to announce your intention of hammering instead of just hammering in the first place? If you feel good about hammering someone why dont you act on it and throw down a hammer instead of just talking about it?

[vijay2vasandani]

So people can talk about it. Just a habit from newbie games I guess. Waiting for claims etc etc. Obviously not in this situation but yeah. And after my last game with TML, I've been even more cautious with hammers.

[Fate]

lolyeah die Korlash.

I have way too much pride to even BEGIN to call MoI town as scum. I'd push for hsi mislynch even if he did venge me. its just become too apparent that he's town that I can't ignore my wincon.

And you'd use our realtionship to justify getting me killed JUST LIKE YOU DID LAST TIME AS SCUM, just to tunnel on me. I'm not going "WHY WOULD HE TWO GAMES IN A ROW WITH ME" fuck that WIFOM youre scum just like then

[MagnaofIllusion]

He used our history and hate between eachother to try and draw out EAGER scum. That's 100% town

Unvote:
Vote: Korlash

This is 100% exactly what happened. Once I flip Town keep this in mind.

--

My hesitation is, unbelievably, something along the lines of what Pizza said [God help me]. It's impossible to determine the motivation for your gambit until after a flip but this one does feel like a survivalist play. The whole "I'm going to shoot Fate - scratch that I'm going to shoot Korlash" thing played weird yet somehow created this Korlash counter-wagon when you have once again reached L-1. While I'm sure scum can get out of L-1 without a problem [simple matter of a bussing scum buddy hopping off], I don't know how Town can wriggle out of L-1 twice in one day so easily. This would make me consider an MoI/Fate scum buddy team if MoI were to be lynched and flip scum [especially after that "I retract my PR claim" business].

Keep this whole line of thinking in mind after I flip Town. I gambitted out Korlash and Benmage is obv-scum. Both need rope ASAP.

--

* that should read "I would expect Korlash to be scum and Fate to be town."

Keep this in mind after I flip. Do not forget it.

--

So let’s start at Post 553 where Korlash drops into his “get that mislynch” mode ..

Wait wait wait...

Do I have this right? If we lynch MoI we either hit scum or Fate dies... So... It's a win/win for me? >.> <.<

I'm going to do this vote analysis right now first but combine this with my uneasy feeling about the wagons and MoI's recent gamble of posting his PM to the mod in thread (or prematurely, I don't know how the fuck vengeful are suppose to operate) I see a very strong possibility of me swapping wagons...

Although it does pain me to vote with Fate... Hmmm... I guess I'll just cover his name up and pretend I'm joining Ben... Ahhh... Blissful ignorance...

More to come...

This entire post is staging. First he throws down the “Oh, we either lynch MoI scum or I get Fate killed” stance. Given that Fate is not actually referenced as scum in this exchange (just that Korlash can be rid of him if I’m not scum) it’s trying to mask the hope that he has indeed gotten his double Town death via my Fate ‘hate’. He further shows this in his “I hate to vote with Fate, I’ll just pretend I’m voting with Benmage” which implicitly shows he doesn’t believe I or Fate are scum. If so why even bother to say it? Because you should clearly not hate voting scum regardless of who is on the wagon, or care if a partner is bussing said scum.

This post is the first part of his ‘overjustification’. If he thougth I was scum he’s simply vote me, say “Deadline is close, Pappums isn’t getting lynched, we need a flip” pretty straightforwardly.

Now on to Post 554 …

So MoI gets to L-1, wagon stalls as it does and fallout more or less leads to the Pizza wagon forming. Rat unvotes MoI and revotes Pizza swapping out MoI for Pizza in terms of lead wagon. Immediately following this MoI creates the Rat wagon (knowing I would follow him) which creates an alternative possibility for competing wagon to the Pizza wagon that isn't his own. Pizza wagon falls through, as they do, and oddly enough MoI is returned to the competing wagon thanks to Rat's revote...

I can't make any conclusions on vote analysis without flips so I can only say that from a scum perspective of MoI, this would fit fairly well. Given who he is, the competing wagon he creates would have to be on a partner to both give him better credit (after being at L-1) and to make sure that wagon sticks (a wagon on scum is easier to build since, you know, it's on f'in scum). So it is a viable conclusion to say both MoI and Rat are likely and possibly scum. Clearly not enough on it's own to make me switch my vote, but certainly doesn't let me sleep easy knowing MoI is getting off if I don't.

This is what you call empty posting. He throws us a complete paragraph that is a rehash of the wagon movement of the day, which is pretty easy to find just by looking at the Mod Vote-counts.

Then we have the following – “I can’t conclude anything since we don’t have a flip, but knowing MoI-scum it makes perfect sense for his counter-wagon to be on a partner”. So he’s absolutely first distancing himself from the conclusion he makes (haven’t seen a flip) but tries to tie “MoI scum” to the stance he’s had most of the day “Pappums scum”.

This is further reason why I’m fairly happy to call him scum. His ‘VC Analysis’ first isn’t an actual analysis but just a justification of his play through the day. He’s aiming to use my play in IGMEOY Mafia (where I power-bussed both partners) to say “It makes sense that Pappums and MoI are Partners”. What he isn’t telling you is that game I power-bussed because the Mod fucked the game up beyond recognition (he ‘on the fly’ added a second Sane Town cop due to a Role PM screw-up he mande and then later confirmed that the Cops were Town in the thread itself) and the long-show was out only shot to beat PoE. But Korlash, who has never played with me as scum for a full game, is trying to tie that single scum game to my play here in a manner to suggest his reads are still justified. Scummy.

Now we come to the new information. MoI's vengeful claim has just been solidified as a real claim (I was being honest when I said I didn't remember it the first time so I never took it as a 'real' claim) and that claim is bullshit in the setup. No 'good' comedian takes someone down with them when they die. Bad comedians do that. "I sucked, therefore your show is going to be terrible too." So from a setup perspective his claim is not only unlikely to be town, but actually more likely to be scum.

Lastly, My own selfish desire to see Fate die in as creative a way as possible intrigues me... >.> (No in all seriousness his idea of having two flips isn't terrible. MoI's death alone gives us his early game wagon along with how Pizza's and Rat's sprang up and grew from whatever alignment's perspective. Having a flipped Fate(anyone else) would just be icing on the cake that is scum's imminent demise.)

1. The first paragraph is an example of “Outguessing the Mod”. He’s experienced enough to know that it’s not good Town play at all to do so. For example look at JasonT’s last Mini Theme Sci-Fi Mafia which had Sarah Connor of Terminator lore as a ‘Watcher” and Luke Skywalker as a “Hider”. In that game DavidXanatos scum tried to make the same “This doesn’t make sense” Mod outguessing argument against Woodruff’s Luke Skywalker claim. He was scum.
2. The second paragraph does not make any sense with the first. In the first he’s saying my role was invalid and in the second he’s talking about how lynching me as said role makes sense from a “get an additional flip” standpoint. It makes no sense to include the second paragraph if he honestly believed the first. None at all. Because if he really believed I was scum fake-claiming he wouldn’t cover his tracks and say “I’d love to see Fate flip in an creative way”. Nope. The second paragraph highlights that he didn’t at this stage believe I was fake-claiming Vengeful . Otherwise he wouldn’t discuss the Pro-Town benefits of lynching me (agreeing with Fate) at all.

For what it's worth dude, I don't hate you. I actually enjoy playing with you and you being on the player list above me was a reason I joined. But... This whole shtick screams gambit at this point, and uh... I can't have that. Just a word of advice, if you had said you would have killed Rat... Might have worked better for you. But that's a big slip up on your part.

This is the kicker – why is he apologizing for voting me if he thinks I’m scum? No reason to. The only reason to do this is he knows I’m not and wants to keep things smooth and have me not change my target if I am indeed a Vengeful (which he ostensibly doesn’t believe if you read his post above).

An of course I disagree … my Vengeful long-gambit worked well. It gave us tons of meaningful interactions early (who refused to vote my wagon early) and highlighted you as scum being coaxed onto the wagon.

On an unrelated note, A non-vengeful Scum flip from MoI would make my two top suspects Rat and Fate in that order. (yes yes, blah blah blah at me Fate but if this is a gamble on his part one of you [if not both] is likely his partner)

Read this carefully … how is my flipping non-Vengeful scum (which is the only type of scum flip I could have) unrelated to this post? The heart of his reasoning is that I fake-claimed Vengeful as scum. Here all he is doing is looking to justify his suspicions going forward (note that Fate is now scum despite him never mentioning him as such before).

Go for it mate. Vote analysis, set-up speculation, and recent events all say you should be lynched. You can't scare me off...

Keep in mind that he just in the previous post said that the Vote Analysis wasn’t valid without flips. Also keep in mind that I’ve already shown his set-up speculation is scummy.

Actually, no. This is a lie. You just said point blank your 'kill fate' was some sort of ploy, thus 'recent events' is true by your own admission. You haven't posed an alternative to my setup speculation, so you have no grounds to argue it. And to say any sort of 'speculation' is wrong is just a stupid thing to say. It's not wrong or right, it's speculation.

Nice response right here.

1. Yes it was a ploy. A ploy that caught scum Korlash. You haven’t indicated or made an argument as to how Town don’t gambit / use ploys. You just keep trying to dismiss it by saying "Gambit better". So no, I’m clearly not agreeing with you.
2. I haven’t shown alternatives to your set-up speculation? I don’t have to. Outguessing the Mod is useless as already outlined. But your distancing “it isn’t right or wrong, it’s speculation” shows that you don’t actually believe what you are floating.

And I made my feelings on the wagon being fishy before you posted you would 'kill fate' and before he even voted. Are you suggesting I was psychic and had planned this all along? Regardless of if you think I am scum or not, my 'timing' began before your ploy. The only one who is wrong here is you mate.

Um, whut? You had feelings that my wagon was fishy before that? The only reason my wagon should be fishy is if I am Town. So derp … you’re just proving my point for me.

And of course you are dodging the issue – you bit hook, line and sinker to the gambit. You saw MoI who has claimed Vengeful apparently biting on his bad history with Fate and saying “Jump on my wagon, I’ll still kill Town-Fate for spite” which you have no reason to doubt. So you see this post, spend 30 minutes making the post where you justify voting me for all sorts of reasons, and slide on the wagon.

You got caught with your hand in the cookie jar Scumlash. Too late to reverse course on that now!

You do realize that anyone who had voted you would have gotten this treatment from you, right? Which makes it all the more stupid as a ploy. With deadline approaching and you the lead wagon someone was going to vote you. Just some advice from one gambiter to another. Even when you're faking it, you need to sound legit. You have a lot to learn.

Oh the one-two despereation punch –

1. Trying to suggest that my gambit is invalid because “anyone would have gotten the same treatment”. Yup anyone who jumped on with the justification and timing that you gave would. Because they would be scum. You notice that Mini Librarian also properly noted you vote was scummy. Is he scum also?
2. Trying to insult and dismiss (you have a lot to learn about gambitting). It burns to get caught doesn’t it?

No, you stay off the wagon V2V.

If the scum want you dead they'll have to do it at night. Don't take the risk MoI has a scum equivalent of the role he claimed.

Korlash posted this at Post 566. Note that he is implicitly showing that he believes me claim is still valid (I had not yet retracted it) in his buddying to V2V. If he thought I was scum who would not be killing someone on my wagon (which is his premise). Which doesn’t make sense. Why would I be worried about who jumped on as I have shown in calling Korlash scum? I could just kill whoever I wanted. Yet the main thrust of Korlash’s post is that I’m not Vengeful. It’s Cognitive Dissoance.

Lynching MoI (from your perspective) would kill me (Who you just said voted 'scummy' so... I'm guessing you have some notion as to my alignment.)

Add in MoI's recent actions and from any town's perspective lynching MoI gives a potential two chances to take out scum. Him, or if we're wrong, me.

Lynching anyone else only gives us one. It's a no brainier really.

Keep this in mind post my flip – Korlash in the bolded is actively acknowledging that him being a Vengekill is a chance to flip scum. No Town player ever thinks this. If he was Town he’s be making more of a point for me to be shooting his ‘scum’ suspects Pappums and Fate. But nope … he’s not even thinking about that. He’s not approaching the situation from a Town perspective.

For what it's worth, my whole "Lynch MoI for double the chance" isn't some bullshit shtick I'm tossing out willy nilly. Lynch MoI, and even in the event you 'guessed' wrong, I still die. Lynch me, and if you're wrong you have to waste a second day making up for it.

And at Post 584 Korlash is still pretending that he thinks my claim is valid in pushing Yates to vote me. Doesn’t connect with his “I was voting you for fake-claiming” that he trotted out after I claimed VT.

Hard to say how to take this atm... You're trying to set up some argument for tomorrow, but I can see it going either way... You wouldn't want to just do me a solid and tell me which one of these guys is your partner would you? Promise I'll pay you back the first time you manage to catch me as scum.

I’ve already caught you but in your defense your strong defense of obv-scum Benmage has already told me you are partners

[MagnaofIllusion]

So I've gotten my final words in.

Someone can hammer.

Keep this in mind - every Night when Benmage and Korlash who are "Town" somehow miraculously are not targetted over other players is another reason why they are scum. Neither of them as Town should survive long-term.

So when Fate dies but they don't don't let them weasel their way out of it.

Both are scum for being alive past Night 2. Same argument Benmage has floated at me before - turn-about is a bitch, huh Scummage?

[vijay2vasandani]

I don't know if it's been 12 hours yet but okay.

VOTE: MoI

Yayyyy night time.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Remember - Benmage and Korlash are both scum who need rope / bullets!

[Yates]

Remember - Benmage and Korlash are both scum who need rope / bullets!

*If* you flip Town, I will reevaluate how your gambit played out and how your wagon formed as promised.

I see your case on Korlash above.

You never answered this re: Benmage, though:

Is this your case?
"So this is my ‘Respond to Benmage’ post."

[jasonT1981]

Day 1 Vote Count 8

MOI 7 - Benmage, Yates,pappums rat,MattP,Korlash,Shotgun,vijay2vansandani,
Rat 2 - Mini-Librarian, Pizza,
Mini-Librarian 1 - Zeek
MattP 1 - PereV
Korlash 2 - Fate,MOI,

Not Voting

It is now Day 1, with 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

(expired on 2012-05-15 10:21:52)

till Day 1 Deadline