Mini 448: Judgement Day Mafia-Game Over!


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Post Post #600 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:41 am

Post by remussaidow »

Spambot, as a catholic, I'm ver tempted to smack you right now. Moses is entirely a "big guy" for Christian worship, though I don't yet know why he's being mentioned. It is now the first time I've been sober since friday afternoon, so I'm about to read back through what went on, and then do the kabenon analysis I promised.
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Post Post #601 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:37 am

Post by WhoMe? »

there isn't even a wiki entry for reverse hider. Am having a hard time buying it.
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As Town: 3/8
As Scum: 3/4

Survived/Lynched/Nked/Other:

3/7/2/0
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Post Post #602 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:22 am

Post by JDodge »

Quite frankly I believe that Blue Zebra and xyzzy are both scum.

I think reverse hider was used once, in Bastard Mod Mafia.
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Post Post #603 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:02 am

Post by remussaidow »

The "doc" claims: BZs using the same target's as whome? did is odd and improbable, but not impossible.
xyyzy, though... the only bit about his claim that makes any sense is his name. I find myself really disbelieving this claim.
vote: xyzzy
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Post Post #604 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:07 am

Post by xyzzy »

Spambot wrote:
xyzzy wrote:
Spambot wrote:
xyzzy wrote:
Spambot wrote:
xyzzy wrote:Oh, sorry, I was skimming.

Shadyforce and Remus.
Reasons?
I target quiet people, as a rule.

They tend to be hardest to get information from, so our only clues come from night results.
I don't really see how your ability gives us information, though.

So, do you think that Blue Zebra is lying about his role or do you think the town has two doctors (one with a drawback)?
It has a few other effects; if the person I protect doesn't die, and the doc didn't protect them, then the person is practically proven town.
...What? That doesn't make any kind of sense and is more WIFOM than what Blue Zebra said.

Dude, here is why you are lying.

1) You admit in this post that there is a doc. Now, if I had your role, I would probably think I might be the only protection role. There being two docs, even one with a drawback, is a HUGE advantage for the town. Think about it like this, if you are both telling the truth, you can just protect each other every night and we almost can't lose. I don't know if Battle Mage is a good designer, but that is unbalanced.

2) Your role name is supposedly Moses. This is high profile, but unlikely to be countered. However, it doesn't fit the flavor so far. Most of the roles have been either priests, nuns, or the big guys, Jesus, God, Satan. Moses has been dead for infy years, but he doesn't really fit into either of those categories.

3) You have acted in an extremely scummy manner all game, and I don't think this claim saves you.
1. There was just a doc claim. And I wouldn't really call myself a doc; depending on my luck, I can cause more harm than a regular doc.

2. Eh? How is Moses not big? He pretty much single-handedly founded Israel.

3. Yes, I've acted scummy. But that was partially intentional, since any smart scum wlll target the people who are clearly town, but not clear enough to be protected. If scum attacks me, I have a high chance of taking a townie down with me.
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Post Post #605 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:07 am

Post by JDodge »

Mod
: Vote count, please.
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Post Post #606 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:20 am

Post by remussaidow »

kabenon007 wrote:Alright, there seems to be enough suspicion floating around now that a random vote seems unnecessary, so
unvote.

I don't like how aggressively ~N9V~ is pushing for a quick lynch. At this point, a quick lynch is probably not necessary. The longer we draw out a lynch of somebody who has acted pretty scummy, (looking at you, xyzzy,) then maybe there will be the possibility that in the ensuing bouts of defense and accuse, another scum will get too eager to defend, or too eager to put down the hammer in an effort to appear town, thereby landing another scummy person to accuse. So, my thoughts are to wait on a lynch, but keep pressure where pressure is needed to bring out conversation and hopefully scum.
the rest of these are quotes too, but I always botch the quote tags so I'm not going to even bother to try:

I went back a little, because ~N9V~ has been making my scumdar go off. I find that he ignores the fact that if we lynch xyzzy and he is town, then the mafia gets another free kill without having one of their own die. He seems to think that if we lynch xyzzy, even if he is town, then all of our problems will be solved, we will be able to tell from who was and wasn't defending him exactly who the mafia is. It just doesn't make sense to push that hard for a lynch that is in question.
vote ~N9V~


Of course all lynches are in question. I'm not debating that, because that could get into some serious WIFOM. I'm just saying that I don't like the way that N9V is pushing hard his argument that a lynch is better than a -1. By going to a -1, we could get someone to role-claim, snitch on a partner, or let a scum slip up. And if nothing happens when someone is at -1, then it is a simple vote to get the lynch that N9V thinks is better than a -1. But a -1 is reversible, a lynch is not. If we made a mistake with a lynch, it is unrectafiable. Bringing someone to -1 and then discovering they are not scum is worth the wait.

Yeah, Albert, I thought your whole theory and basis for not voting for Fonz was due to the fact that you claim he wants votes, but then you vote for him, when you had your vote comfortably on N9V? I don't like how N9V is playing, but this is too obvious. Let's see what comes out of this.
FOS: Albert and Fonz Defend yourself, Albert. Why'd you change your vote, after trying to convince us we shouldn't?

Oops, sorry Fonz. Um UnFOS Fonz. Not quite sure about him yet... That was mostly directed toward Albert. Fonz seems to have been drawn into this whole arguement, but Albert is the one who switched his vote. Still, Fonz could still be in on it...

Oof, simulposting, I hate it. Okay, Albert. How can someone be too scummy to be scum? Isn't a scum inherently... scummy? How can someone possess so much scumminess that it negates their scummy nature? If a girl possessed too much hotness, does it make her ugly? No, it just makes her all the more hot. And the fact is, if someone is acting too scummy for scum, then they are probably scum. I'm not Fonz is scum, I'm just trying to disprove Albert's logic.

Wow, Albert. Now you're being lead around blindly, trying to do whatever people want of you in order to shift suspicion elsewhere. I was content on N9V, but this is too much to just let slip by. unvote, vote Albert. Damn.

end quotes.

Those were all of the relevant, not entirely common sense posts of Kabenon007. he beelined onto two people, n9v up until he couldn't handle leaving albert alive anymore. It seems to me that that is the way that the game went in general before I got here though, so that means that there is no true read on how he played. Also, this many posts over the course of a dozen or so pages, is no impressive at all.
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Post Post #607 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 9:38 am

Post by Battle Mage »

Vote Count


Xyzzy 4 (Whome, Blue Zebra, Spambot, Remus)
Blue Zebra 1 (Jdodge)

Not Voting: Xyzzy, NowaRanger, QMan

With 8 alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.
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Survived to the end and won - 11
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Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
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Post Post #608 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:06 pm

Post by Spambot »

remussaidow wrote:Spambot, as a catholic, I'm ver tempted to smack you right now. Moses is entirely a "big guy" for Christian worship, though I don't yet know why he's being mentioned. It is now the first time I've been sober since friday afternoon, so I'm about to read back through what went on, and then do the kabenon analysis I promised.
I didn't mean he wasn't a big deal, but I didn't think he was on the same level as Jesus and God.

As an agnostic, I don't really care. Let's just say it's not the sort of thing I'd think was in the game. It's possible I'm wrong.
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Post Post #609 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:07 pm

Post by Spambot »

Ranger and Qman aren't even playing anymore.
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Post Post #610 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:44 pm

Post by JDodge »

Spambot wrote:Ranger and Qman aren't even playing anymore.
Eh? Yes they are.
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Post Post #611 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:28 pm

Post by Qman »

Yes I am. I'm not by nature very vocal. Should I post every 20 posts or so to say "Hi I'm here" and make you happy that I'm at the least keeping up? That just seems silly. Or should i post when i have something to add to the discussion. Sometimes it's easier to see whats going on it your not in the middle of it. I read every post made, and when something that I think warrants my input comes along I'll make it.

Lurking? Maybe, but I don't like to make frivoulous posts as I've found it can just confuse the issues already out there. The current discussion really don't involve me directly. (I mean it does since I'm in the game, but thats not what I mean.) If someone brings me into it with a question or an accusation, I'll be more involved. Right now my main interest is in watching WhoMe, xyzzy, and BlueZebra squirm/claim. Everyone else seems to be doing a fine job asking the things I'd ask, so I'm sitting back and watching.
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Post Post #612 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:20 pm

Post by Spambot »

Qman wrote:Yes I am. I'm not by nature very vocal. Should I post every 20 posts or so to say "Hi I'm here" and make you happy that I'm at the least keeping up? That just seems silly. Or should i post when i have something to add to the discussion. Sometimes it's easier to see whats going on it your not in the middle of it. I read every post made, and when something that I think warrants my input comes along I'll make it.

Lurking? Maybe, but I don't like to make frivoulous posts as I've found it can just confuse the issues already out there. The current discussion really don't involve me directly. (I mean it does since I'm in the game, but thats not what I mean.) If someone brings me into it with a question or an accusation, I'll be more involved. Right now my main interest is in watching WhoMe, xyzzy, and BlueZebra squirm/claim. Everyone else seems to be doing a fine job asking the things I'd ask, so I'm sitting back and watching.
I asked you what you thought of Shadyforce's play, and you never answered.

Who do you think we should lynch today?

Do you believe xyzzy/blue zebra/whome and their claims?

Do you think it's likely that we have two protection roles?

Do you think WhoMe? could be naive? Why?

Why shouldn't we lynch you?

There are all kinds of things to comment on, and just saying that somebody else already said what you think is a load of crap and a complete cop out. Since you've replaced in, what have you done to help the town win this game?

You don't seem to realize that other people might think you are scum. By lurking and not putting your opinions out there, if you are town, you are distracting us from looking at people who are acting scummy. For all I know, you are scum skating by while we fight amongst ourselves, and saying that you don't have anything worth adding does nothing to dissuade me from that line of thought.
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Post Post #613 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:21 pm

Post by Spambot »

JDodge wrote:
Spambot wrote:Ranger and Qman aren't even playing anymore.
Eh? Yes they are.
Ranger hasn't posted much in the past couple days, and Qman hasn't up until just now. I'm hoping that they might actually contribute something if I call them out on it.
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Post Post #614 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:31 pm

Post by xyzzy »

Spambot wrote:
JDodge wrote:
Spambot wrote:Ranger and Qman aren't even playing anymore.
Eh? Yes they are.
Ranger hasn't posted much in the past couple days, and Qman hasn't up until just now. I'm hoping that they might actually contribute something if I call them out on it.
Telling them to post isn't the way to do it. Asking them questions is.

Are you trying to produce a victim for the lynch tomorrow? "Well, they're not talking when I told them to, so they must be scum."
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Post Post #615 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:36 pm

Post by Spambot »

xyzzy wrote:
Spambot wrote:
JDodge wrote:
Spambot wrote:Ranger and Qman aren't even playing anymore.
Eh? Yes they are.
Ranger hasn't posted much in the past couple days, and Qman hasn't up until just now. I'm hoping that they might actually contribute something if I call them out on it.
Telling them to post isn't the way to do it. Asking them questions is.

Are you trying to produce a victim for the lynch tomorrow? "Well, they're not talking when I told them to, so they must be scum."
God, why aren't you dead yet?

I just asked Qman a bunch of questions, we will see how that goes. For the record, everything I asked Qman is directed at Ranger too.

Do you mean am I trying to get an idea of who I think we should lynch tomorrow? Uh, yeah? Do you really disagree that not talking abotu what is going on at all is scummy?
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Post Post #616 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:41 pm

Post by Qman »

Spambot wrote:
1.) I asked you what you thought of Shadyforce's play, and you never answered.

2.) Who do you think we should lynch today?

3.) Do you believe xyzzy/blue zebra/whome and their claims?

4.) Do you think it's likely that we have two protection roles?

5.) Do you think WhoMe? could be naive? Why?

6.) Why shouldn't we lynch you?
I added the numbers for my own use. And I don't mind the call out at all.
Answers:

1.) What play? Thats not even meant to be sarcastic. A random vote and two oops posts? I didn't even notice the questions when you first posted it. Theres your answer.

2.) It's a cop out, and I know it, but I don't know who we should lynch today. Ergo, I'm not voting. I will say I'm not comfortable being the hammer on xyzzy, which is why i haven't voted. If *I* had to pick I'd pick Bluezebra, because his investigations while possible, are a little fishy as they duplicate WhoMe?'s

3.) I'm pretty confident in WhoMes claim, and xyzzy fits what I'd picture the role name as in this setting. Blue Zebra, eehh.. I'm really unsure of his because all he did was state he investigated the exact same people after whome posted his. I'm not saying it couldn't legitimately happen... but it's at the least, noteable as an oddity.

4&5.) I'm pretty sure we don't have two cops, unless one is naive/paranoid. And neither seems to be paranoid as no one has been posted as coming up scum. Though I have zero problem believing that god is a naive cop. The problem here is that both say the came up with the same results on the same people. I'm leaning towards only 1 Cop role. I know it looks like I'm waffling here, but i doubt I can avoid it. I'm unsure, and don't want to come down to hard on one side of this only to regret it later, as mistakes can haunt you in this game. For now, I'd buy one Legit Cop, with a nod to the possibility that God would be a naive cop. Jesus told his father God, "Forgive them father, for they know not what they do" If god is the forgiving figure that is generally believed in by Christians, he'd forgive any transgression, and only see the good in people.

6.) Because I'm not scum. I know, classic scum tell, but it's the truth. I doubt you'd be happy with the results.


Keep asking questions please, I really enjoy the process of answering them
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Post Post #617 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:41 pm

Post by xyzzy »

Many roles have good reason to mostly lurk; power roles need to avoid being the targets of lynches.

Oh, and I'm not the one who roleclaimed God. :P
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Post Post #618 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:44 pm

Post by xyzzy »

I doubt you'd be happy with the results.
Pick one: (Power role, scum trying to look like a power role, moran who wants to be lynched)
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Post Post #619 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:46 pm

Post by Qman »

xyzzy wrote:Oh, and I'm not the one who roleclaimed God. :P
Not sure if this was directed at me but as it stands

Claims

xyzzy = Moses (reverse protect?)
WhoMe? = God (cop)
Bluezebra = Jesus (doc)

Wait a minute, what is this two cop crap people are talking about, i just now looked back and BZ says hes a doctor not a cop. What am I missing?
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Post Post #620 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:49 pm

Post by Qman »

xyzzy wrote:
I doubt you'd be happy with the results.
Pick one: (Power role, scum trying to look like a power role, moran who wants to be lynched)

Yeah that just about covers all the possibilities.
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Post Post #621 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:50 pm

Post by Blue Zebra »

It's not two cop roles, it's two protection roles, which both xyzzy and I claim to be.
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Post Post #622 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:51 pm

Post by xyzzy »

You didn't choose one.

Not quite worthy of a FoS but still slightly scummy: Qman
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Post Post #623 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:58 pm

Post by Qman »

Blue Zebra wrote:It's not two cop roles, it's two protection roles, which both xyzzy and I claim to be.
Odd. Why was I thinking(reading) cop.

Weird


Two protection roles:

Fully possible, moreso given the role names.

Jesus was a healer (doc), and Moses saved his people by sheeperding them in the desert so they count find a new home. (Read, protects them.)

I'd buy two protection roles, with one having a penalty such as the one Xyzzy claims. Does make me wonder what other roles are out there though to offset that.
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Post Post #624 (ISO) » Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:59 pm

Post by xyzzy »

Why are you ignoring my question? I was completely serious; you're hinting at something, which could do a lot of harm.
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