Mini 1516: Mafia in Space (Game Over)

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Day 1, Votecount 19

Street Hassle [1]

Kid A

Kid A [0]

TvK [0]

My Milked Eek [5]

Herself, Squirrel Girl, Garmr, ICEninja, The Silver Bard

LolWagons [0]

Regfan [0]

ICEninja [0]

Garmr [1]

My Milked Eek

Squirrel Girl [0]

The Silver Bard [1]

TvK

Wake88 [0]

Herself [1]

havingfitz

havingfitz [3]

Street Hassle, LolWagons, Regfan

Not Voting [1]

- Wake88

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is on November 23rd at 7:30 AM PST or in (expired on 2013-11-23 07:30:00)

[Squirrel Girl]

Do me a favour, re-read the entire Fitz vs Herself argument and tell me if you think that Fitz’s motivation behind it is 1) To push on Herself due to his scum read 2) To get a better read on Herself or 3) Solely to attempt to appeal to them that they’re wrong about him while discrediting them and the case. I see a lot more scum motivation than town motivation there.

That feels like a very large amount of effort for little gain. I think we both agree that his reactions are laced with frustration. I think we can both agree he is downplaying and attacking Herself. I think the split comes in that you see this as all he is doing, and that makes it scummy. I see it as what he's doing, and think it means he's an argumentative and grumpy face player. What I've seen of fitz's play elsewhere seems in line with this.

So, I guess my question is; how are you separating this fitz as being scum fitz, as opposed to fitz getting in a wall war with someone he thinks is playing badly and then deciding that it equates to them being scum. I will admit I'm not sure how to tell the two apart, and thus doubt I'd get anything from reading it again.

I also find your Garmr/Fitz interaction read kind of weird. Fitz asked Garmr for a read and Garmr ducked doing so (twice) and you decide that is a good thing from Garmr? I feel I need that expanded on.

[Regfan]

The only thing giving me any pause on a Milked lynch is that his Post 629 is how I’d react in that sort of situation as town.

That said I agree with ICE that the whole “You can go ahead and lynch me” in Post 633 reads as gambitty especially with what I remember from doing his meta reading before but going over and doing a mass quick re-read is something I'll make sure to do either tonight or tomorrow morning*. The explanation behind not seeing or knowing the cases on Fitz and Orestes is really really bad though, it’s not just looking in “Their ISO’s” it’s a discussion that occurred between everyone throughout large portions of the thread so you not knowing = you not reading the game to look for information and tells but rather just to seem “here”. Didn’t like the admittance that his reads list was “Awful” and “Superficial” too without actually amending them with legitimate updated thoughts until questioned and then the only real amendment was TvK. The defence of Fitz Post 634 fits as scum partners too (Especially with both being leading wagons at the moment, the entire sacrificial gambit attempt might be because 1) Fitz is a more important role or 2) Because he thinks he can get town read from it and potentially swing the lynch somewhere else like Garmr).

So yeah, I'll do the meta reading on Milked tonight or tomorrow but consider my vote there in spirit (If people want to move to Fitz though in the meantime there's Mango Tea and Cookies here). Oh and Fferyt, can you get Empire to focus on this game for the next 2 days please?

That feels like a very large amount of effort for little gain. I think we both agree that his reactions are laced with frustration. I think we can both agree he is downplaying and attacking Herself. I think the split comes in that you see this as all he is doing, and that makes it scummy. I see it as what he's doing, and think it means he's an argumentative and grumpy face player. What I've seen of fitz's play elsewhere seems in line with this. So, I guess my question is; how are you separating this fitz as being scum fitz, as opposed to fitz getting in a wall war with someone he thinks is playing badly and then deciding that it equates to them being scum. I will admit I'm not sure how to tell the two apart, and thus doubt I'd get anything from reading it again.

Effort is a good thing though! And him getting into an argument with someone is generally typical Fitz (He's kind of like Thor in that right) but what I'm reading as scummy is exactly what you're pointing out his focus has pretty much solely been on Herself and his votes elsewhere (Oretes for example) come across as opportunistic and not a legitimate scum read, another thing is something that Garmr pointed out, Fitz had Garmr as town in Post 187 then shifted him to scum in Post 566 after Garmr had him as scum. The change of read mirrors how he's dealt with Herself, ie. De-crediting pushing back on attackers (He even said the "Feel bad about Regfan voting me" too). And again I think

the entire tone of his back and forth with Herself comes across as him convincing them they're wrong about him (In a manner that he knows they're town) while accusing them of being scum.

I also find your Garmr/Fitz interaction read kind of weird. Fitz asked Garmr for a read and Garmr ducked doing so (twice) and you decide that is a good thing from Garmr? I feel I need that expanded on.

The attitude from Garmr towards Fitz in Post 620 is something I highly highly highly doubt comes from scum with daytalk. I don't think scum get frustrated enough to go

"I fucking told you why I suspect you"

and the whole

"Also your questioning me allot why aren't you voting me."

reads as town / non-partners too. I don't think scum attempt to push to have someone vote them (at all) especially if that person is their partner.

[Regfan]

Actually fuck me, shows how little my brain works after my exam and cramming for days. Ignore the entire bottom section of the Milked paragraph, on reading Bards ISO that post (Post 634) is actually his. That said Milked pretending not to know or agree with the Fitz case might mean the same thing.

[Regfan]

On that note, reading this ISO (Bards) in detail is probably pointless now, half of it will go through my head without me assessing it probably. Think my brain needs a few hour break minimum, then I'll get around to doing it* and the Milked meta*.

[Street Hassle]

Yo, sorry not having been around the last few days, had some really rough shit going on IRL. I've spent the last like 5 hours trying to catch up in this game and discussing things with ffery. The long and short of it is that ffery and I are worried that we're wrong somewhere on at least one of our townreads just due to the sheer quantity of them and the concern that the game might not be this easy (I think a big part of the reason is that we both have a townread on Wake, a slot that before looked very likely PoE scum). I just got through Milked's posts on the last page and was hoping to get ffery's opinion but looks like she fell asleep.

One question for him though:

Good to see some content from Eek. Do the peple on the Eek wagon have reasoning beyond lurking (and no...I haven't checked)?

You'd be a fool not to find that post scummy, if not, you should find it between bad and lazy. Are you preparing for my flip to tell everyone where they went wrong?

You and fitz are competing wagons. The fact that scum is probably scattered about voting useless votes to run us up to deadline suggests that one or both wagons are town fueled. If you flip town I'm going to take a hard look at fitz, as I find it unlikely that both wagons are on town (especially since most of the players I'm suspicious of have dutifully avoided both wagons). If you're scum then you've got a buddy or two pushing fitz. Even if you flip town, we're finding scum based on your corpse. If you're scum we'll probably find another anyways. Lynching you is the right move.

Sure, sounds nice in theory, but I'm not convinced that when I flip town, fitz will be scum. Sorry. I'm not convinced of his wagon.
I find your thoughts about wagon population to be rather simplistic and, as we say in Dutch, short through the corner.

@Eek:

The first quote here implies you think he's scum but the second suggests something else entirely. What's your current / updated read on fitz? Did anything change between those two posts and, if so, what was it?


Regfan, I was about to ask you where you got the impression that Milked would try the martyrdom gambit as scum here, but then found Open 213 (where he self voted as a scum lover). I have a bit more to say about the possibility of a Milked / fitz partnership but I want him to answer my question first.

Short notes: Liking TvK a lot more for town after #563 and #571 as well as Wake for his general approach (one of the more notable things I liked was his persistence in getting people to answer his questions). Both of us still don't get the townreads on Kid A at all (worth a trip down meta lane).

Note to self: read Mini 937 when I'm more awake.

[Regfan]

Good to see you're back and glad you agree with TvK and Wake town reads. I'll explain Kid A later but it's my weakest town-read at the moment and with your "There's scum in the strong town reads" ect. attitude I can't see who at all, I'm fairly confident in most of them (There's 3-4 I'd bet the entire game on being correct Herself, SG, ICE and You).That self-voting scum game of Milkeds was the one that I had a slight memory of reading and yeah, that's why I can see the "Fine lynch me" being a gambit. Think we're dealing with Milked+Fitz+MaybeBard(?) or if not that maybe Lol or Kid A.

Anyway my times up at the internet cafe in 2-3 minutes here so I'll have to read the rest of your thoughts later.

[Street Hassle]

Uh, Kid A's only scum game is a rather old newbie but he's way more active / aggressive / pushy / etc in his town games than he's been here and he tends to explicitly look a lot at potential partner interactions which is noticeably absent here (examples include: Mini 1463, Mini 1476, Mini 1486). Gotta read over them one more time when awake in more detail.

[Garmr]

So you milk your online mind posting your case against me now???

[My Milked Eek]

So you milk your online mind posting your case against me now???

I'm just reading before I head off to work. I don't have the time right now. But your sad attempt at making me look like I'm lurking has been noted.

[Garmr]

I'm asking you for your case because i'm eager to see it but now that you mention it. You sure had time to defend yourself in post 646

[Garmr]

In post 611, LolWagons wrote:
And this is just utter bull. I haven't even been in the game long enough to be inconsistent. And I'm not lining up anything. I'm straight up voting you.

I wasn't talking about you...I was referring to Garmr.

Just noticed this and would like to point out what he said in his original comment.

LolWagons for T S O's play and questonable replace out and their parroting Herself's case on me.  Same for Garmr.  I view their play as inconsistent today and they are lining themself up for a vote on me tomorrow or later today. 

He is indeed talking about lolwagons this makes it conflicting with his earlier post.

[Garmr]

Actually scratch the above post I just realized them self refers to a singular.

[My Milked Eek]

Street isn't scum hunting you how I'd expect him to. If you're town I doubt it means anything but if you're scum then I may have to take the paranoia up a notch.

So, let me get this straight. Street according to you is some mafiascum prodigy (if you can spin my words, I can spin yours), yet you don't think he can easily bus a scumpartner? He (or they) have posted a few suspicions of me before, they could have easily continued down that path. If anything, that's a townie behavior. I still don't get what you were trying to achieve by noting that.

I'm pretty sure this was a scum slip. And now I'm going to be INCREDIBLY paranoid of Street.

There's just no end to your spinning or forced interpretations. I don't know if you're overeager or if you just can't read or understand what I was saying. As a side note, I also love how you cherrypick content out of my post.

That said I agree with ICE that the whole “You can go ahead and lynch me” in Post 633 reads as gambitty especially with what I remember from doing his meta reading before but going over and doing a mass quick re-read is something I'll make sure to do either tonight or tomorrow morning*. The explanation behind not seeing or knowing the cases on Fitz and Orestes is really really bad though, it’s not just looking in “Their ISO’s” it’s a discussion that occurred between everyone throughout large portions of the thread so you not knowing = you not reading the game to look for information and tells but rather just to seem “here”. Didn’t like the admittance that his reads list was “Awful” and “Superficial” too without actually amending them with legitimate updated thoughts until questioned and then the only real amendment was TvK. The defence of Fitz Post 634 fits as scum partners too (Especially with both being leading wagons at the moment, the entire sacrificial gambit attempt might be because 1) Fitz is a more important role or 2) Because he thinks he can get town read from it and potentially swing the lynch somewhere else like Garmr).

Meta things: I've done this twice before, once as scum (the game Street linked) and once as town (I don't remember which game anymore, it's been some time). Going from hazy memory: The scum game was a lost cause (I believe I replaced into a very bad situation?) and the town game was a disaster (iirc, not sure).

I also elaborated on Kid A and I'm going to post that garm post soonish (next few hours).

Your little fitz-eek scum scenario makes no sense whatsoever. Could you honestly see us "buddy up" our concurrent wagons to avoid either one of us getting lynched if we were scum together? (ICEninja disclaimer: hypothetical situation). This makes no sense in any scenario of us being scum together. And the reason I'd like everyone to swing to garm is because I find him a lot more scummy than fitz. It just so happens that your opinion of a productive/town lynch candidate is the wagonee accusing or jumping on a concurrent wagon regardless of how he feels about that bandwagon apparently. I just happen to find garm scummy. Deal with it.

One question for him though:

Good to see some content from Eek. Do the peple on the Eek wagon have reasoning beyond lurking (and no...I haven't checked)?

You'd be a fool not to find that post scummy, if not, you should find it between bad and lazy. Are you preparing for my flip to tell everyone where they went wrong?

You and fitz are competing wagons. The fact that scum is probably scattered about voting useless votes to run us up to deadline suggests that one or both wagons are town fueled. If you flip town I'm going to take a hard look at fitz, as I find it unlikely that both wagons are on town (especially since most of the players I'm suspicious of have dutifully avoided both wagons). If you're scum then you've got a buddy or two pushing fitz. Even if you flip town, we're finding scum based on your corpse. If you're scum we'll probably find another anyways. Lynching you is the right move.

Sure, sounds nice in theory, but I'm not convinced that when I flip town, fitz will be scum. Sorry. I'm not convinced of his wagon.
I find your thoughts about wagon population to be rather simplistic and, as we say in Dutch, short through the corner.

@Eek:

The first quote here implies you think he's scum but the second suggests something else entirely. What's your current / updated read on fitz? Did anything change between those two posts and, if so, what was it?

I'm leaning towards town on fitz. I just didn't know that if you had a town-ish read on someone you can't point out odd behavior that conflicts with the reality and context of the thread. My list-post was scummy, I'm not denying that and no one would, but fitz did. And regardless of my read on fitz, that's unusual.

Regfan, I was about to ask you where you got the impression that Milked would try the martyrdom gambit as scum here, but then found Open 213 (where he self voted as a scum lover). I have a bit more to say about the possibility of a Milked / fitz partnership but I want him to answer my question first.

What's your impression on that game aside from a lost case? I also have a game where I did this as town. -I just skimmed my posted topics and I didn't see it on a first glance, but it's in there somewhere. I remember a chinchi?

Note to self: read Mini 937 when I'm more awake.

That was a pretty good scumgame! I really enjoyed that game.

[TvK]

Caught up again. I still don't like Garmr, but I also don't think we can avoid an Eek lynch. Will post more detailed stuff later.

[Garmr]

In post 547, Garmr wrote:
Sigh I am going to sleep. If you haven't noticed town can't agree on anything the most a wagon has got is 3 votes. Also your a pretty common scum read between most of us. I thought we might have our first real wagon. But there's so much bickering.

I was going to quote a few garmr's posts, but let me post "

Why garmr is scum" in my next post, it'll make this post more readable. And less wall-y.

Ok-----Post636-----4 posts no mention of it-----thenthis post Bit defensive there but ok asks him why he didn't do it earlier when he had time then-------------------663 ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME -GRABS HAT THEN THROWS IT DOWN-

Now here's a quick case eek which is using the last page alone.

Hold off on voting me for now. You can vote me all you want in a few hours, but let me get my next post in before you do (just saw SB vote in the preview edit).
And no, it's not a post to discourage my bandwagon, just a few thoughts and such and then you can continue on your merry way.

It would just be a shame if I was typing it out and you'd go ahead and lynch me before I'd be able to post it. You can lynch me afterwards if you see fit.

^
This post to me shows he is more intreasted in surviving than scum hunting

In post 566, havingfitz wrote:
Good to see some content from Eek.  Do the peple on the Eek wagon have reasoning beyond lurking (and no...I haven't checked)?

You'd be a fool not to find that post scummy, if not, you should find it between bad and lazy. Are you preparing for my flip to tell everyone where they went wrong?

Potential partnership there as fitz could be his scum buddy and doesn't want this linked to him when fitz flips Also if i'm his number 1 scum read then why does he point out fitz as being scummy as fitz pushing on me more than anyone else here including eek who's the only vote on me. You'd think if he thought i was scum he would push more.

I'd bump TvK a bit to the town side of my in betweeners. A bit because he also sees garmscum. I don't like that he hasn't posted anything about my #530. Sure he posted his readlist with me as leaning scum, but that feels really cautious, you know. I should be right up there, next to you on his list. Look, the way I see it is that I'm as good as lynched so I might as well offer some POV opinion for you guys. He's being really safe with his opinion on me. I'd like to get more on this from TvK.

I reread orestes and I really get a townie vibe from him. I haven't read all your posts during the past 100 posts as it was a quotefest with SG and I didn't feel it was needed for my "quick-before-I-get-voted-on" post. So, nothing has changed aside from a more solid read on orestes. I'll reread the last 100 posts (or more) to see if that read can be pulled through onto you or not.

Garmr is actually scum. I'd rather see him lynched than... well me. I'll get on that garmscum post.

Wake/robot thing, I still ignored what that robot did. I agree with SG when she says that he uses a lot of words, but doesn't say anything. Like regfan, he didn't really comment on me as well. Not that I'm egocentric, but if I'm going to be the lynch today, I'd rather have everyone comment on me. Especially when his content has been too little and his noise too much.

The rest hasn't changed.

This more about surviving and less about reads. He is basically saying "garmrs scum go vote him I will make a case latter through to actually prove it just don't lynch me." Also his reads haven't changed and admits his reads are bad Ice points this out then eek ignores this and post this fluff as a way of defence

Post646 Finally answers ice question about it after trying to dodge it unsuccefully

You aren't sure that I claimed VT?


Want to hear what happened day 1?
You entered a mindset of "there's a scum in the lurkers group" quite early in the day. You pushed this idea quite a few times (instead of letting the mod handle it). I posted (paraphrased) what I pm'd to the mod after he instructed me to post it here to you guys. And people overanalyzed it (it was a shit post, tbh). I don't think it mattered whatever I would have posted sunday (? was it sunday?): "I would have taken pointers from my scumbuddies via daychat" - Pretty sure it was you who said this before -just looked and yep, it was you.

A rushed defense that tries to appeal to our emotional sides.

nothing else worth talking about or that I have found yet that others haven't already said. Haven't read 663 fully but I know it isn't the case against me you promised.

[My Milked Eek]

Give me time, you're quite impatient, it's quite a big post. I'm at work and I am typing your post. Not being a native speaker, I like to go over my posts and look for spelling errors quite a few times or correct the flow of sentences as I sometimes Dutchify English, so this slows down my typing/reply.

Why are you so nervous about my upcoming, 5-star review post about you? I'm not going to be rushed and put out a half assed post so that you can "easily" "debunk" it. If you can't wait a few hours, then it's going to suck to wait for it. Talk to your scumbuddies while waiting.

To annoy you even more, I'll make this post a separate one from my case.


"This post to me shows he is more intreasted in surviving than scum hunting"
This guy! Cracks me up. I am going to be lynched today. Pretty sure of it, like 90%. I just didn't want it to be rushed and I wanted to throw out my opinion as I really want the town to know you're scum.

[Garmr]

Give me time, you're quite impatient, it's quite a big post. I'm at work and I am typing your post. Not being a native speaker, I like to go over my posts and look for spelling errors quite a few times or correct the flow of sentences as I sometimes Dutchify English, so this slows down my typing/reply.

Why are you so nervous about my upcoming, 5-star review post about you? I'm not going to be rushed and put out a half assed post so that you can "easily" "debunk" it. If you can't wait a few hours, then it's going to suck to wait for it. Talk to your scumbuddies while waiting.

To annoy you even more, I'll make this post a separate one from my case.


"This post to me shows he is more intreasted in surviving than scum hunting"
This guy! Cracks me up. I am going to be lynched today. Pretty sure of it, like 90%. I just didn't want it to be rushed and I wanted to throw out my opinion as I really want the town to know you're scum.

Lol your quite funny. Also you have only being putting out half assed posts on me so what difference would it make. Lol and if i was scum I shouldn't be able to debunk anything just showing me more and more that you are scum. Plus i'm not nervous I am bored and have to much time on my hands. Also what I think your doing is stalling for time I understand you don't speak English but it's been 13 hours since your promised it and post 636 makes you sound like you haven't even given a thought about it.

I want everyone to look back on your post when I flip town and realize how stupid post 666 was and i'm going to save it and every game you play with me I will post it so you remember this game.

[My Milked Eek]

Lol your quite funny. Also you have only being putting out half assed posts on me so what difference would it make. Lol and if i was scum I shouldn't be able to debunk anything just showing me more and more that you are scum.

That's why I put "" around debunk. I'd love to see you try and talk your way out of this. spoilers:

you won't

Plus i'm not nervous I am bored and have to much time on my hands. Also what I think your doing is stalling for time I understand you don't speak English but it's been 13 hours since your promised it and post 636 makes you sound like you haven't even given a thought about it.

You think 13 hours with a night's sleep and a few hours of work is stalling? Get real. You're nervous.

I want everyone to look back on your post when I flip town and realize how stupid post 666 was and i'm going to save it and every game you play with me I will post it so you remember this game.

Won't happen as you'll flip scum. How could you flip town? Honestly. I'll post it

[Garmr]

You finished great please do and I kinda forgot about the time difference.

[My Milked Eek]

I'll put it in a bullet list. Everyone likes those and then we can use the bullets to lynch garm! win-win. A-hem.

Why to lynch garm

• very defensive play over stupid reasons
  
  #49 "
  I could see your post as an attempt to subtly diffuse a early wagon which we could get allot of information out of or a slight chainsaw defense as I feel like your post was insinuating I was acting scummy with out directly saying so to make me unvote Nutsy McSexytail thus making it a humming chainsaw.
  " spoilers:
  it wasn't in the slightest insinuating anything.
  
  
  
  
• afraid to be the first to lay out a case against anyone/sheeping (if only we had a wiki page on this)
  
  #135 "I don't find anyone scummy, did I mention that I find orestes scummy for a post that was 100 posts ago? surely nothing else happened in between" I might've paraphrased that a bit . But it's still ridiculous that he holds on to his lame orestes reason. The street hassle name dropping feels pretty fake. Street didn't reply to an old post? Big deal. Things to note here: 1) Street was one of the people you mentioned in the early stage, but "you'd see". 2) You don't even give your opinion on Street. Literally asking the town on what to do: "
  What do you guys think of this.
  " == "
  Tell me guys, is there a platform for voting Street?
  " I remembered Kid A's sudden vote on Street as I typed this, but that's 300 posts later (in Kid A terms: 3 posts).
  #234 Avoids giving any insight on herself vs. street,
  SUDDENLY
  , after herself posts her case and dare I speculate, after he sees a platform for voting someone else besides orestes, an opinion! "
  finally where to place my vote at the moment I'm pretty flexible between the fitz and orts wagon.
  " == "
  But yeah, you know, it's not as if I'll vote for fitz, I totes would, it's just, I got more important things to consider, like orestes' post from 1996
  ".
  #373 He sees an Eek wagon might be feasible and he makes sure we haven't forgotten he has orestes as a scumread.
  370 posts in and all he has is orestes and early wagons that he might hop on "

  at the end of the day

  ".
  Bolded for emphasis. His reads in that post are pathetic. He even avoids mention his TSO opinion using his old "let's talk about a previous game but then counter what my conclusions were from mentioning it and hope no one sees this"-method or garmscum for short.
  #379 Votes me in a very "if I have to" way. No real mention of suspicion before this, a quick mention that he might join the Eek wagon later on.
  #573 "It's a good case, but that subjective" Really? What is he trying to do here? Point out the obvious (all cases are subjective until a flip/game over) or prepare a backtrack? Either way "Herself made the case, not me".
  
  
  
• afraid to push

  early

  opinions
  
  #49 "
  banksys was scum last game, but we'll see ... street is power house, but we'll see ... ice is paranoid, but we'll see
  " (paraphrased) I get the point that it's an early stage of the game, but why bring all this fluff up if not for appearing to post some kind of opinion on anyone? Coincidence or not; the three people he mentions in his post are all town or leaning town imo (ICEninja disclaimer: imo)
  #162 "Remember that time that I mentioned banksys before? Well, I'm still watching her/him" (paraphrased) Seriously, can you not once deliver an opinion
  on someone besides these 4 players
  ?
  #183 Why is he still being on the fence about everyone? 200 posts in and all I know is that he doesn't like orestes's one post that one time.
  #248 He makes sure the new player in the banksys slot knows he's on his tail and requires mind reading powers from regfan to justify bringing up a meta that would have been useless. Again, "interaction" with one of his 4. And then he follows it up with "Yeah, I had nothing on banksys." (paraphrased)
  #541 Non-committal about orestes.
  WHAT?
  After a small 500 posts of making sure that we know that he suspects orestes, he just drops it because he might flake? As I said before, a flake is not indicative of alignment. If anything, if I were garm and I found orestes to be scum, I'd keep the pressure on. To which he replies with this bullshit.
  #560 After 560 posts, we get this gem. A few things wrong with his read: He would like "fitz gone for obvious reasons". From reading his posts, this obvious reason is that he can only vote for people who are being wagonned. And orestes. He says I'm trying to push suspicion elsewhere. What else would he expect me to do? Keep it on me? (yes, I know I did actually keep it on me, lol)
  
  
  
• Nervousness
  
  626 "Lynch the milk guys come on."
  658 "So you milk your online mind posting your case against me now???"
  660 "I'm asking you for your case because i'm eager to see it but now that you mention it. You sure had time to defend yourself in post 646"
  665 Read it, it's too big. But he's flailing so hard. Rehashing points other people made. Tries to smear an appeal to emotion on my request to wait and on my recap of day 1.
  
  
  
• This is becoming a mess, so a new section:

  Let's mention that we suspect orestes, but not do anything about it
  
  #620 I don't see how (or why) Bard should defend an "defense" of SG made by orestes. What did garm expect him to say?
  I would have added more (copied from the above and below), but meh, you get the point.
  
  
  
• Talks about being scum
  
  #448 "
  So to my point.When I am scum I take great pride in my ability to distance myself from others and the ability to survive.
  " This is exactly what is happening this game. He's non-committal about everyone until someone else (or multiple people) voiced their opinions or voted them. He even undermines his own question from before.
  #584 "
  My scum game N is for normal I played allot more passive when people called me scum.
  " But he is being passive, by sheeping, by not putting out his own opinion, by not sticking to his scumcandidates, by possibly changing to a wagon late in the day.
  
  
  
• Coaches Kid A scum
  
  #454 Sure, this requires you to think that Kid A scum, which _I_ do by the way. I might even link this to that one post garm made about street. I mentioned this higher up.
  
  
  
• buddying to squirrel
  
  
• fluff posting about nuts, stretching arms, koalas, math skills
  
  
• theoryposts

Well that turned out to be a very messy list.
I'll put a

tl;dr

for the lazy people:

- waits for others to make points and then rehashes them. I had some rapid interaction with him a few times without anyone else posting anything relevant in between and hhe doesn't bring anything new to the table. He just doesn't.
- as a consequence, he hasn't got a single scumread quite a few posts in the game (200-400 (don't actually remember))
- everything is obvious.
- he gives his opinion on his previous scum plays AND HE IS PLAYING THE SAME STYLE IN THIS GAME. He's not even hiding it. People aren't reading this thread. How funny is this, coming from me?
- incredibly nervous
- has he told you yet that he suspects orestes?

[My Milked Eek]

You finished great please do and I kinda forgot about the time difference.

That's why I put my location in my profile. It also makes me not post about koala's or having to mention that I'm from Australia every game. Oh wait, that's your fluff, not mine.

[My Milked Eek]

Stop stalling garm, it's been 15 minutes. I see you're online.

[My Milked Eek]

Stop stalling garm, it's been 30

15

minutes. I see you're online.

[My Milked Eek]

Stop stalling garm, it's been 45

30

15

minutes. I see you're online.

Just measuring how long he's been online.