[Game Over] Open 743 - The Crown of Misery

[Malakitty]

DarkLightA (L-2)

: NotNova, Lamees, bristep123, Persivul,
Auro

rb (L-4)

: Leodanny, Something_Smart, DarkLightA

Malakitty (L-6)

: Dunnstral

Dunnstral (L-6)

: rb

Leodanny (L-6)

: Thor665

Egix96, Malakitty

Okay i'm at the end of 22.
I didn't realize it's almost 23:00 and I gotta be at my volly dept at 00:00.
Sometimes I wonder why i do this to myself.

[Auro]

I didn't really much understand the DVa votes beyond "she was loud and garnering a lot of attention." I think it makes even less sense to vote that slot now that it's been replaced. (Looking at you Auro)

So her scumclaiming, self-voting and asking me to hammer her, this doesn't concern you at all? You think *this* play comes from town? I've seen DVa riled up before and was feeling that was towny till the self-vote -- that's bothering me a lot.

I'm liking DLA and it seems like we have a few similar thoughts - yeah, the Persivul townslip I mentioned was the daychat one. But just because what I think is a scumslot replaced out and I like the new one, I don't think I should discard my old read on it.


@DLA: Yay that you noticed the RB cop slip too. While it did feel TMI, I don't think it's *as* damning because in Newbie 1900, I was saying that one usually trolly slot was better dealt with investigatives, that led to a TMI push on me. I think RB's play progression seems a lot less agenda driven and more towny (the trolling around and then frustration at DVa's posts).

[Malakitty]

Mala, do you not think my interactions with Lamees and treatment of her slot could be informed by prior games? In my most recent completed game with her, Newbie 1900, I treated her pretty much the same -- I said she makes scummy plays as town, and is a bad lynch -- she pushed a pretty bad wagon on me, and yet I didn't vote her a single time D1 IIRC. And I was town that game.

yeah I get it meta reads. but she only has one completed scum game.

Also you are really good at implementing your town meta in your scum games.

IDK. She is right now forced into the town pile b/c of her claim.

[Auro]

I think DVa might be zombie

No way a Zombie would try to get lynched with an Angel in play

[Malakitty]

plus i just found out there's a missing persons for one of my class mates, we spent almost a year in a hell class for our aemt-cc in ny and for less than 4 months later of passing that and becoming Cc's.. hes now missing.

I just can't

[Something_Smart]

So her scumclaiming, self-voting and asking me to hammer her, this doesn't concern you at all? You think *this* play comes from town?

It doesn't make sense from town or from scum. Those posts alone could have been faked emotion, but since she replaced out it proves it was real emotion-- which could come from either alignment.

[Dunnstral]

You should also go back to another game where everyone scum read me for inactivity and my clusterlack of votes and what did i do? Yep. flip town.

Hope you're not talking about witches dance because that is decidedly not what happened

[Dunnstral]

UNVOTE: Malakittens

since you're saying you didn't see the claim until now

Auro is weirding me out with his push on DVa here

[Auro]

It doesn't make sense from town or from scum. Those posts alone could have been faked emotion, but since she replaced out it proves it was real emotion-- which could come from either alignment.

I don't think replacing out necessarily implies true emotion, I think tactical replacements are against rules but then scumclaiming and asking to get lynched as town is gamethrowing, too. *Shrug*

I think there were some benefits as scum, baiting a hammer to end the day early if she thought she was going to be the lynch anyway. NK Lamees and make us lose the copping mechanism, maybe. If rb is town, makes all the more sense there.

[Auro]

yeah I get it meta reads. but she only has one completed scum game.

Also you are really good at implementing your town meta in your scum games.

A meta non-read. A bunch of towngames where she gets wrongly scumread means a higher propensity to get pushed just for her style.

You said I was white-knighting her and I pointed out that I've treat her this way as town; you then said I'm good at implementing town meta. I'm feeling a tinge of dishonesty here

[Auro]

Hmm she did do all that after requesting replacement though, not the other way around..

Meh
UNVOTE:

[rb]

i'm sheeping mala

[Lamees]

Here's the thing. I replaced in. I didn't even get a chance to start posting and solving when I was hammered. I don't think you can even compare here and then. I'm definitely can be an aggressive person on forum mafia especially with pushes. I'm not where where I really sheeped anyone that other game.

Really, ok now I have to quote from that game.

mala come vote lcpl with me

lamees come vote lcpl with me

fl come vote lcpl with me

VOTE: lcpl

for now 'cuz RC

Also all of your town reads AND scum reads were RCB's reads. Because he claimed cop I guess?

Having players mindlessly tunnelling me while not being serious is just gonna waste day 1 time on a town PR, so I claimed in order to not get to final day with L-1, as that is more likely to look like a scum gambit and also that's a lot of time wasted.

Um isn't that exactly what you are doing to rb, or am i wrong??....

You're wrong because I already explained multiple times that there is no town motivation for doing what rb was doing (it was way beyond RVS so I don't buy that excuse, claimed to be not serious but was pushing the wagon seriously hard). I have had it done to me before and it was a scum player doing so. Therefore my counter case against him wasn't "what he was doing" it was "because of what he was doing"

[rb]

can you read words or nah

[Lamees]

We have to lynch DLA though, because I don't see how that is playing to town's wincon (the way DVa went out) so has to be scum. Makes sense if they are scum because wanting to end the day early and not have anyone gather more info on who their partners are sort of plays more scum sided, actually wanting to end the day right there was really bad for town.

Only chance DLA is town is if they are angel. Which is super low, I'm already angel and chances of rolling angel arent high.

So if DLA does not claim angel, we have to lynch imo. I mean, scum literally claimed, the rules state there are certain situations where if you feel your claim can benefit scum then I guess you can do so. Not claiming their role also only benefits scum etc.

[Auro]

DVa did that stuff after asking to be replaced out though, do you think she was necessarily playing to any win-con?
Like I'm trying to understand why scum!DVa would strategically scum-claim and ask to be lynched *after* actually asking to replace out.

[Dunnstral]

You're having trouble understanding because she wasn't playing strategical after requesting replacement

[Egix96]

You're having trouble understanding because she wasn't playing strategical after requesting replacement

Yes. The thing is, once you've requested to sub out, you are meant to STOP POSTING. DVa not doing that is just breaking the rules.
I agree with Lamees that we should lynch the DVa slot toDay. IMO there's simply too much risk in NOT doing so.

[Egix96]

NGL I will be super disappointed if DLA flips town
Because that would mean her predecessor went full-on doo-lally-twp.

[bristep123]

The post replacement request behaviour could be read so many ways. If you felt she was scum before that then that's where the gut should go. Much like trying to lynch off mechanics lynching off rule breaking is suspect to me.

Also DLA has pinged for me by congratulating Something Smart on good play, as I've not seen that at all especially as they were totally on board for lynching a claimed angel.

[Dunnstral]

Yes. The thing is, once you've requested to sub out, you are meant to STOP POSTING. DVa not doing that is just breaking the rules.

ok? That's not my problem, why should we vote her for that? I don't understand what the 'risk' is - I think the slot was town

[DarkLightA]

NGL I will be super disappointed if DLA flips town
Because that would mean her predecessor went full-on doo-lally-twp.

I'm a he

Also DLA has pinged for me by congratulating Something Smart on good play, as I've not seen that at all especially as they were totally on board for lynching a claimed angel.

This is fair. I'm not yet fully into the game so my views aren't that rigorous yet. I had a look over the situation you mention, and in general I don't necessarily think lynching Lamees is that far-fetched, and I can see where Something's coming from. I don't think it's optimal play though, especially cause (as mentioned by someone I don't remember) it's an unlikely claim by scum. However, the following post I

really

don't like as it's phrased assuming Lamees is town.

Okay I think the right play is to hang Lamees and have her shoot rb.

Although actually, given the chance of GF, it might be better to just hang rb.

This feels a bit slippy.

We have to lynch DLA though, because I don't see how that is playing to town's wincon (the way DVa went out) so has to be scum. Makes sense if they are scum because wanting to end the day early and not have anyone gather more info on who their partners are sort of plays more scum sided, actually wanting to end the day right there was really bad for town.

Only chance DLA is town is if they are angel. Which is super low, I'm already angel and chances of rolling angel arent high.

So if DLA does not claim angel, we have to lynch imo. I mean, scum literally claimed, the rules state there are certain situations where if you feel your claim can benefit scum then I guess you can do so. Not claiming their role also only benefits scum etc.

This post really rubs me the wrong way. It should be fairly obvious DVa's play isn't optimal at the end of her game (or at least there's a high chance), but Lamees is analyzing it as if it should be. Which is odd and seemslike intentional misrepping. PEDIT: This has been hammered a bit already.

@DLA: Yay that you noticed the RB cop slip too. While it did feel TMI, I don't think it's *as* damning because in Newbie 1900, I was saying that one usually trolly slot was better dealt with investigatives, that led to a TMI push on me. I think RB's play progression seems a lot less agenda driven and more towny (the trolling around and then frustration at DVa's posts).

I hear what you're saying, but I still think it's really ugly.

[DarkLightA]

To be clear 495 is the post I'm referring to in commentary of 719.

I have to look over SS a bit more after that slip

[Egix96]

The post replacement request behaviour could be read so many ways. If you felt she was scum before that then that's where the gut should go. Much like trying to lynch off mechanics lynching off rule breaking is suspect to me.

Also DLA has pinged for me by congratulating Something Smart on good play, as I've not seen that at all especially as they were totally on board for lynching a claimed angel.

@First sentence: So you think it's NAI then? Technically it's not OGI though because it's still in the game thread.
If you think I'm angleshooting though, just say so and I'll stop.

[Egix96]

Yes. The thing is, once you've requested to sub out, you are meant to STOP POSTING. DVa not doing that is just breaking the rules.

ok? That's not my problem, why should we vote her for that? I don't understand what the 'risk' is - I think the slot was town

It's risky not to lynch a slot that came very close to outright claiming to be scum.
Then again, the Game of Mafia is kind of all about taking risks, so... you do you.