Mafiascum.net

In post 7022, LlamaFluff wrote:I still think it breaks because you get a negative you know you are a cop.

Or any one of the roles who get a default Failure because they weren't targeted.

If you get positive you have a guilty or are doctor.

That's a good point, will have to look at that. It only works if everyone targets the same person, though, because you get a positive if you're targeted. Maybe give one (or more) of the scum a fruit-vending ability that doesn't dispense fruit? So they can provide false positives?

Under your plan, and assuming the targeted person is town and not one of the PRs in this group: Both the vig and the scum target that person. Bodyguard takes the first hit, doctor protects the target from the second, bodyguard gone. Hider confirms target as town. Next night scum kills that person, or town keeps protecting that person, and for all they know, they're protecting a VT.

So doctor doesn't protect all? If a player is targeted by a doc, vig,and BG... how are you resolving that?

Doctor protects its target, but does not protect the bodyguard. First kill hits the BG; doctor does nothing. Second kill hits the target, doc protects him. If no BG, two kills hit the target, doc protects from one of them, but the target still dies.

Either way you have three roles that are self-confirming through result. The vig (basically self confirming). Neighborizer (self confirming).

Neighborizing is basically self-confirming, yes. Vig can be depending on what the protective roles and scum do. But I'll look at them when I look at the cop/doctor positive results.

Thanks, Llama, this is the kind of stuff I was looking for.

Saulres, it looks to be that default is a success/failure if visited on target, not on self-visit.

Not quite following. Does this clarify?

For the roles which do not have specific success/failure results: If PlayerA has such a role, and is targeted by anyone, PlayerA will receive a Failure result. Otherwise PlayerA will receive a Success result.

Anyone who self-targets will get a "No Result" result.

Note to self: When reviewing, check if scum should receive success/failures if they're visited, to prevent them having to guess if questioned.

I probably won't get to review this until after the holiday weekend.

In post 7024, LlamaFluff wrote:In the interest of trying to get some new open setups for 11-15 players I am going to try and revive:

In post 6925, LlamaFluff wrote:

Making Friends and Enemies

3x Goons
2x Masons
8v Vanilla Town

Masons have the ability to recruit a new member on N1. If they attempt to recruit scum, the recruit fails. If they attempt to recruit town, the player is added to the masonry as "Recruited Mason".

Basically F&E with the masons being a one shot cop joint instead who confirm themselves to an innocent.

In post 6940, Toomai wrote:

Death and Taxes

v1.0

Vanilla Townie x7

Town Tax Collector x2

Town Homeless x1

Mafia Goon x3

• Tax Collectors target three players. They are informed of how many of their three targets pay taxes, but not exactly who.
• Mafia members and Homeless players do not pay taxes.

I have no idea how well balanced this is, but I like the general idea (

Mastermind

-style investigative roles).

If people have comments on these two let me know.

For Toomai's setup I think Tax Collector and Homeless need to be variable numbers (TC 1-2, Homeless 1-3 with remainder VTs for example) to stop the game from being claim damaged. Otherwise you are looking at something that with an early scum lynch (or just lucky N1 action) can be broken for town. Maybe make it a goon-goon-GF or TC for scum as well.

Its a good miller variant. Could just eliminate the odd flavor and rename TC a cop and Homeless miller to make it less alien.

in toomai's setup, the miller claims right away

the tax collectors are three times as swingy and powerful as normal cops

the mason setup is alright but nothing special

Heaven and Hell

10 Vanilla Town
5 Mafia Goon

Instead of day and nights, phases alternate between heaven and hell. Scum have permanent talk (call it daytalk i guess).
During heaven phase, the town votes for one player to send to heaven. During hell phase, the town votes for one player to send to hell.
Alignement is revealed upon being sent to heaven or hell.
Players in hell can't post and can't vote (they are basically dead). Players in heaven can post but their vote doesn't count, unless to break ties.
In case of a tie among votes from living players, votes from heaven players decide the result.
In case of a tie among votes from living players and from heaven players, scum chooses.
Town wins if 3 scums are sent to hell, Scum wins if 3 scums are sent to heaven.

Very strong scum voting block, but that should also make voting dynamics more interesting to analyse.

Has it been run before, and if not, would you be interested to play in such a game?

I like the idea. There's way too many scum though. It's almost impossible to send a scum to hell and after a few days of only town sendings, scum almost get a majority of votes.

10-3 and only 2 scum up/down? Still scumsided, I think.

Yeah after rereading it seems that the best scum strategy is just to make sure only townies are sent to hell or heaven. I need to think of a way to make sure scum need to send their members to heaven in the first iterations.

That's kinda like saying in 4:8 Nightless scum just have to make sure only townies get lynched. I suspect it's probably fine as is.

That setup is great and balanced and /pre-in.

In post 7031, Elscouta wrote:Yeah after rereading it seems that the best scum strategy is just to make sure only townies are sent to hell or heaven. I need to think of a way to make sure scum need to send their members to heaven in the first iterations.

"When at least 50% of the living are scum, a Judgment Day occurs. All living players lose the ability to vote. The townies sent to heaven get back their votes and send a living player to hell*. If the player is town, the Mafia win. If not, the game moves on to the heaven cycle."? Besides being a fair solution, this gives the townies in heaven more incentive to keep up with the game.

Also, I wouldn't give scum in heaven the ability to talk. The only thing they can do is disrupt the game's flow with WIFOM attempts.

*assuming plurality lynches, heaven-daystart and me thinking straight, this never breaks the cycle.

Alright, idea; tell me what you think about it.

Prison mafia

Scum:

4 Racist murderers(goons)

Town:

5 Protected inmates(1-shot BP)
2 Prison guards(Both are both Vig and 1-shot BP)

Plurality lynching
Day start
Scum wincon is if nothing at all can prevent winning - 4v4 isnt enough, 1v1 vs a BP vig is a town win.

That's rhe same as double day with two vigs and too much scum

Well, not exactly, but there will be a lot of boring nights

Scum wincon is if nothing can prevent winning? So ambiguity in the wincon prevents them winning?

well, no, as long as there are vigs, tie isn't enough for a win, and if there aren't any vigs but there are still BPs, then plurality CAN get a scum lynch in a tie and a kill blocked, etc. that's the idea.

And I don't think there will be too many boring nights; scum getting vigged is definitely not boring, vigs & scum shoot same person, etc...all in all there are only 7 shots to be blocked, and these can be removed via lynching. etc.

Do you think this is balanced? the 'too much scum' gets kinda balanced with the BP & Vigs combo, I think.

also consider townies trying to soak scum NKs, etc.

if is too strong 1 of the scums can be of flavor: godfather/arch-murderer and be BP as weel

Uh.

That actually looks broken.

Both vigs shoot scummy looking people N1 and you either have 4 conf town D2 or dead scum at night.

How many vig shots are there on the prison guards?

infinite vig shots, I think.
that is not breakable because scum can fakeclaim vig whenever. if scum sacrifice, say, 2 of their team to claim vigs, it'll be chaotic, and they will still have enough men for a game of mafia.

i would make it prison guards get vig only.

d1 massrole call is nearly borken by all the BP claiming and then the vigs claim (w/ BP) then either mafia CC and 1v1 or claim BP and then becomes POE. this would at least discourage them from outing right away.

also i would have at least one mafia (maybe 2) be BP so its not as easy to POE the entire game (tgis would make BP+vig better overall then)

Try this
3 goons
1 mob doc

1 complusive vig
1 deputy vig (but does not know it), thinks vt
1 town doctor
4 inmates, each w one manual vest (pick a night immune to all kills)

↑ ika wrote:i would make it prison guards get vig only.

d1 massrole call is nearly borken by all the BP claiming and then the vigs claim (w/ BP) then either mafia CC and 1v1 or claim BP and then becomes POE. this would at least discourage them from outing right away.

also i would have at least one mafia (maybe 2) be BP so its not as easy to POE the entire game (tgis would make BP+vig better overall then)

hmm.
there's lots of small changes to balance that can happen; for example, if earlier I had 2 BP vigs then I can make only one of them BP or both, or have one scum BP etc...

generally I want to keep the number of players as it is, and just play with the BP-numbers in each team and/or add roleblocker for sucm until this gets balanced.

↑ Titus wrote:Try this
3 goons
1 mob doc

1 complusive vig
1 deputy vig (but does not know it), thinks vt
1 town doctor
4 inmates, each w one manual vest (pick a night immune to all kills)

nah, that's already a different setup. my idea was the general concept of lots of mafia vs powerful town.

You're right, the setup isn't superscumsided like I thought it was. It would probably be more fun if the vigs weren't 1-shot bp, though.

I think Jungle Anarchy sucks as a large open. In fact, I think the large opens suck in general. "Picking Simplicity" seems to be the only large open that looks like an actual large game.

Lost In The Jungle...




3 "Mafia"
3 "Scavengers"
1 Doctor
1 JOAT (Cop/Vigilante/Jailkeeper)
12 Townies

The Scavengers are the interesting mechanic here. They have the ability to day kill one player per game day EACH that had not posted for at least 72 hours, and was not on announced V/LA. Basically once a person gets prodded it means they might also get eaten. The scavengers also have daytalk. The "scavengers" then pm the mod to eat a lurker that has fallen behind. If the person posts before the mod sees it then the kill doesn't go through. Also a doctor will have a chance once per day/night to protect someone. The day protect is useful only once per daykill. So the protect is more likely to go through since it's obvious someone is lurking and about to get scavenged, but the doc has to ask themselves : is this person going to lurk again and get killed later". However if the doctor uses their protect during the day then they can't use their protect during the night.

4 factions is way too many.

↑ BBmolla wrote:4 factions is way too many.

OK.

Classic Rivals Multiball

15 Players

1 Mafia Ninja
1 Mafia Godfather
1 Mafia Doctor

1 Werewolf Ninja
1 Alpha Werewolf
1 Werewolf Doctor

1 Town Cop
1 Town Seer
1 Town Tracker
1 Town Vig
5 VTs

• Daystart
  
• 1:1:1 situations automatically no lynch.

Win conditions might need to be clarified more. And town might be too weak. May be most beneficial to add a power role and turn the cop and seer into a single bloodhound?