Mini Normal 2012: Tropical Mafia [Endgame]

[Gustavo]

I'm waiting to be "owned." Guess that's not going to happen? All bark, no bite, lol...

You’ll be owned when you are lynched and flip scum which I’ll make sure happens.

[JarJarDrinks]

535

[Mumble]

I actually like Mumble's reads on Tex and BBT. They're probably wrong, but they make sense given his internal logic.

He defended BBT earlier.

wut? When?

[Mumble]

How is that a defense when I said I could see scumBBT?

[Shoshin]

Gustavo, you said earlier that "you have to look at the intent behind it." What did you mean by that if no that mistakes can be alignment indicative depending on the underlying intent?

Meaning if somebody makes a mistake and gets called on it, it they don’t admit their mistake and back off, their intent is scummy. It actually means it wasn’t a mistake after all.

Sort of like your “mistake”

Then why isn't the ultimate scum strategy to just always admit a mistake? "Oh, you suspect me? It's because I made a mistake, I'm sorry about that, I retract what I said earlier as that was just based on a mistake." Flawless defense every time, huh?

[Gustavo]

This isn’t a game of absolutes.

That's my point... You seem to be saying mistakes can't be alignment indicative (i.e. an absolute) and I'm saying that in some circumstances they can be (i.e. looking at specific circumstances on their own terms). So I want a straight answer:

can

they be alignment indicative or not? The non-absolute answer is yes, the absolute answer is no.

Ever heard of Occam’s razor? You are going against the most likely scenario.

[Gustavo]

Gustavo, if I'm town, who would you say is scum?

I don’t think I can answer that rn.

[Shoshin]

I'm inclined to vote Gustavo at this point but I can't tell if he's having a bad game or if he's scum, so I'll let others weigh in on that.

[Shoshin]

This isn’t a game of absolutes.

That's my point... You seem to be saying mistakes can't be alignment indicative (i.e. an absolute) and I'm saying that in some circumstances they can be (i.e. looking at specific circumstances on their own terms). So I want a straight answer:

can

they be alignment indicative or not? The non-absolute answer is yes, the absolute answer is no.

Ever heard of Occam’s razor? You are going against the most likely scenario.

You didn't answer my question...

[Gustavo]

Gustavo, you said earlier that "you have to look at the intent behind it." What did you mean by that if no that mistakes can be alignment indicative depending on the underlying intent?

Meaning if somebody makes a mistake and gets called on it, it they don’t admit their mistake and back off, their intent is scummy. It actually means it wasn’t a mistake after all.

Sort of like your “mistake”

Then why isn't the ultimate scum strategy to just always admit a mistake? "Oh, you suspect me? It's because I made a mistake, I'm sorry about that, I retract what I said earlier as that was just based on a mistake." Flawless defense every time, huh?

Who says that isn’t the ultimate scum strategy? Smart scum do this.

[Gustavo]

I'm inclined to vote Gustavo at this point but I can't tell if he's having a bad game or if he's scum, so I'll let others weigh in on that.

Where is option c? I’m not having a bad game and I’m not scum.

If you are town you are having a TERRIBLE game.

[Gustavo]

This isn’t a game of absolutes.

That's my point... You seem to be saying mistakes can't be alignment indicative (i.e. an absolute) and I'm saying that in some circumstances they can be (i.e. looking at specific circumstances on their own terms). So I want a straight answer:

can

they be alignment indicative or not? The non-absolute answer is yes, the absolute answer is no.

Ever heard of Occam’s razor? You are going against the most likely scenario.

You didn't answer my question...

Which one?

[Gustavo]

I don’t really think mistakes are AI. There are obviously exceptions to everything but for the most part no they aren’t. I definitely don’t feel mumbles mistake was AI.

[Shoshin]

Gustavo, what's your read on Invisibility?

Town

Why?

[Gustavo]

There was a game where a player wrote a post with links to the scum topic and not the game topic. That was clearly AI. I’ve seen scum post in the game thread thinking he was talking in the scum thread. That was AI (also a good argument to bring back QTs)

Mistakes like what mumble did aren’t really AI. Now if you compiled a body of work in addition to that mistake, I’d be inclined to listen but I haven’t really seen much else. You say you have but I don’t remember seeing it nor is it what you are pushing. So your push looks like scum looking for an easy target and digging in when people aren’t listening.

[Gustavo]

Gustavo, what's your read on Invisibility?

Town

Why?

Cause my top scum read scum reads him.

[Invisibility]

lynch shoshin

[Gustavo]

VC 2.03

votes

Shosin

(3): Mumble, Invisibility, Gustavo

Mumble

(1): Shoshin

Invisibility

(1): BlueBloodedToffee

Not Voting

(6): Havo, Jodaxq, texcat, JarJarDrinks, bacy, havingfitz

With 11 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

The day 2 deadline is in

: (expired on 2018-06-09 19:20:59)

Mod Notes

:
If I have your vote in the wrong place, please let me know.

mod. Is it still 7 to lynch with 11 people?

[Shoshin]

You say you have but I don’t remember seeing it nor is it what you are pushing. So your push looks like scum looking for an easy target and digging in when people aren’t listening.

Maybe you should read the game, then.

[Shoshin]

Gustavo, what's your read on Invisibility?

Town

Why?

Cause my top scum read scum reads him.

VOTE: Gustavo

There's no way a townie is so confident I'll flip scum that Gustavo bases an entire read on a major wagon (Invisibility) on a surface-level observation that I've scumread the guy, while ignoring Invisibility's actual behaviors. I'd lynch Gustavo on this basis alone.

I think we're looking at a Gustavo/Invisibility/Mumble team, with Gustavo most likely to flip scum.

[Shoshin]

Like, I've got doubts about my scum reads - enough doubt that I'd never base a read on a major wagon on a weak association with a scum read. And someone as "experienced" as Gustavo should know better. If I'm too biased about this, it'd be nice to have my townreads weigh in.

[Havo]

Skimming through. Some of my early reads are developing and some are changing. That’s good.

I’m taking off work tomorrow so I’ll get caught up and get involved.

[Gustavo]

Gustavo, what's your read on Invisibility?

Town

Why?

Cause my top scum read scum reads him.

VOTE: Gustavo

There's no way a townie is so confident I'll flip scum that Gustavo bases an entire read on a major wagon (Invisibility) on a surface-level observation that I've scumread the guy, while ignoring Invisibility's actual behaviors. I'd lynch Gustavo on this basis alone.

I think we're looking at a Gustavo/Invisibility/Mumble team, with Gustavo most likely to flip scum.

Jesus dude lighten up. It was a joke.

I don’t scum read him cause I haven’t seen anything scummy he’s posted. I haven’t seen a case that sells me on him being scum. But yes, I’m able to piece together enough to know if somebody I’m scum reading is pushing somebody, odds are that person is probably town. That’s how you poe the scum team. That’s basic mafia. If you don’t know that you are definitely in over your head.

[northsidegal]

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[northsidegal]

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