"Still Alive?" Mini 45

[Dirge]

I think that we ought to consider this issue from all angles, even DP: normal cop. It's late and I am sure that I will miss something. I rest assusred knowing that someone will fill in the blanks or point out what an idiot I am.

-If DP is a normal cop: Quagmire is innocent. This means that Quagmire is trying with lots of effort to get a powerful town role lynched and he is also encouraging the mafia to kill a powerful pro-town role during the night phase.
I am not sure but is it not also possible that a normal cop would get an innocent type result on a godfather? Or does that usually show "no result"?

-If DP is a naive cop: Quagmire is actually guilty. This means that Quag is trying to persuade everyone that DP is scum to take attention off himself and get rid of a townie during the day to free up a scum kill at night. At the same time encouraging other killing partys to off DP at night if a day lynch is unsuccesfull.

-If DP is mafia pretending to be cop: Quag knows that DP is wrong because he himself is scum e.g. SK.
Quag might know if he himself was a cop. But, if he didn't investigate DP it would be too risky to go on the assumption that there is only one investigator.

It seems pretty clear to me that the town has the most to gain by lynching Quagmire at this point.

• He is town
  trying to get the cop lynched!
  Or...
  He is scum trying to get the cop killed. Or...
  He is scum trying to get scum.

And if DP is scum it makes sense to me that he would be mafia and that Quag is the serial killer. Therefore, if Quag is a SK lynching him will reduce the number of night kills, whereas killing DP, if he is mafia doesn't reduce the number of night kills.
Plus, DP is probably a cop. Right now it would be nice to get a killer our numbers are getting smaller.

I am open to input here. I could be missing something but so far it looks pretty good to me.

Vote: Quagmire

[Dourgrim]

Ahhh, well said, Dirge. That's pretty much precisely what I was going to doublecheck with my abovementioned readthrough. It bears noting, however, that if DP is

naive

, he'd get everyone as innocent. Now if DP is

insane

, we have a winner. Personally I believe that DP is telling the truth (as well as he knows it, of course) and that someone was wise enough to protect him last night... or, alternatively, the scum didn't bother trying to kill him last night because they figured someone would try to protect him, etc etc...

Vote stands... at least for the moment.

[Dragon Phoenix]

Yes, I could be naive, or even insane (in which case I was bloody lucky choosing two mafia). I could also be normal.

With respect to detecting Godfather: usually the cop gets 'innocent', not 'no result'. So one of the two I checked could be a Godfather, yes.

I don't quite understand Quagmires motives either. Still, it goes against my feelings to vote for someone I found innocent at this stage of the game.

[rite]

Polotet is being replaced by Darkblade. Everyone welcome him in!

[Quagmire]

The reason I wanted DP lynched is because I couldn't think of a way that he couldn't be scum. Well, I did think about it, and my tiny little mind thought of why DP could be the cop. Here, I'll show you, which is pretty much talking to myself:

DP claims to be cop, but is suspicious to all people around. We then lynched massive. The mafia (or SK) realize that DP is suspicious, so they kill off someone else and DP looks suspicious this day. This is now what I think happened, so I'm going to

unvote DP

.

No vote yet, because I haven't read over most of the posts in this day, but welcome Darkblade! I'm your waffle mafia mod!

[Darkblade]

Cofirming Im' here, I'm analysizing the thread and I'll get back to you with my views.

[Darkblade]

After reading the thread, I'm highly suspicious of Quagmire for reasons stated and unstated by others. But one thing is bothering me about voting Quagmire. If this game has townies, what is the chance that a 12 person mafia game would have cops with varing levels of sanity? Has there ever been a mingame where there have been townies and naive cops?

[Quagmire]

Well Darkblade, in the Waffle Mafia game I'm hosting, I gave everyone a special role. One person that is still alive is a Paranoid Inspector, whom gets evil every time. If there is a naive cop (he gets good every time, right?), that would suggest that probably all the players have a special role. It's not all that uncommon.

No vote at the moment yet, because I guess that Ihat I'm the only suspicious one. And I don't want to vote for myself, because I know that I'm innocent.

[CurtainDog]

if Quag is a SK lynching him will reduce the number of night kills

Dirge, I think you overlooked the fact that the maf and the sk will probably be trying to get to each other. I think having an sk alive at this stage would probably be

better

for the town (at least until we see whether or not massive and/or ningal are scum (I don't include myself in this list because presumably I was targeted by the maf last night)).

As it stands we need four to lynch. I'm going to assume that the maf controls three votes unless told otherwise. Killing the sk today practically ensures scum victory.

My take on dirge's scenarios:

-If DP is a normal cop: Quagmire is innocent

Then we shouldn't be lynching either. (Oh yeah, lets lynch a townie because he's trying to get another townie killed.. )

-If DP is a naive cop: Quagmire is actually guilty

This scenario is pretty unlikely especially considering the fact that the maf targetted me last night. But it's possible...

-If DP is mafia pretending to be cop: Quag knows that DP is wrong because he himself is scum

Then we definately should be going after DP.

If I had to guess I would say DP, Dirge + Dourgrim are scum, with DP waiting to cast the lynching (and possibly winning) vote once someone decides to go Quag.

[Electra]

CurtainDog, Ningal- what were your roles? Have you claimed already, only I missed it?

I don't terribly suspect Quagmire. The way I see it is that there has to be a real cop in the game. Until we have any evidence that there's another cop [meaning one of them could be naive/insane/paranoid/lying], the only way for Quag to be Mafia would be for him to be a Godfather, and that would be kind of coincidental.

I'm suspicious of Dirge and Dourgrim, for pushing the massive bandwagon. It would be quite helpful if we knew if he were lying or not, but I don't think he was. I didn't really like the Dourgrim's logic of 'well, he's a useless role anyway'- it sounds like something the Mafia would say to push a lynch.

No vote yet, if there are indeed three Mafia left, we really can't make a wrong move.

FOS: Dourgrim and Quagmire, for voting so early

[Dirge]

Dirge, I think you overlooked the fact that the maf and the sk will probably be trying to get to each other.

Yeah, I can see where you could have thought that.

He is scum trying to get scum.

Nothing bugs me more than people who don't completely read posts and just latch on to one idea without looking at the entire thing.

-If DP is a normal cop: Quagmire is innocent

Then we shouldn't be lynching either. (Oh yeah, lets lynch a townie because he's trying to get another townie killed.. )

This is a total misrepresentation of what I stated.

-If DP is a normal cop: Quagmire is innocent. This means that Quagmire is trying with lots of effort to get a powerful town role lynched and he is also encouraging the mafia to kill a powerful pro-town role during the night phase.
I am not sure but is it not also possible that a normal cop would get an innocent type result on a godfather? Or does that usually show "no result"?

My whole point is that if Quag is a townie he was trying to kill a COP! Not just "another townie."

All together I was just saying that any way you look at it we are better off without him. In every senario he has negative points. Put them all together and you have the most suspicious person in this game.

I don't understand your scummy reasoning curtain dog. Is it possible that you are part of a scum group still aiming for a group win?

...DP waiting to cast the lynching (and possibly winning) vote once someone decides to go Quag.

Besides the player called someone is not even playing in this game how is he even involved?

[Darkblade]

All right.

Vote: Quagmire

I've seen enough

Reasons

• In the begining of the game, he votes DP because he is experianced. This is total crap logic, and Quagmire knows this, How do I know? Well in his own Waffle Mafia, he watched the SK get away with lynching a player because she was smart, and saw the susquent arguements for that player's lynch on Day Two. Thus, he was using logic he
  knew
  to be crap
  
• His assult on DP after he claims cop on the sole basis that he wasn't killed the previous night. I'm sorry, but the mafia would be happy to let investigator who isn't sure of his sanity live. They could eigther hope the screwed up investigator causes an innocent to be lynched or they could try to lynch the investigator for not dying. Heck, if I was mafia, I would definatly not kill DP.
  
• (see above)Quagmire was the first to assult DP, then when it was clear the town wasn't buying it, he said he "just got an idea" on how DP migth be innocent. His "new idea" was only one of the first arguements mades against his position.
  
• CurtainDog is defending him passionatly with crap logic. Which reminds me
  Big Fat FOS:CurtainDog
  He utterly butchers what Dirge says and completely misses the opint behind the conditionals. Dirge's arguemetn tried to look at all the possibilities and see overall which person would be most likly to be scum. CurtainDog takes his conditionals as separate facts and reduces them to "If A is innocent and B is scum, then KILL B! Duh!". This is the straw-man's fallacy, and I doubt it was an accident.
  
• Quagmire's post once I came in reminded me of Antrax-as-scum's kissing up in Mafia 9
  
• (fake inside joke reason) Quagmire is just plain Unsanitary! Plus, if you look at him upside down, you can see the mark of the beast!

[CurtainDog]

Apologies for being wordy -> I'm overcompensating for my inability to vote...

If quag is innocent how is the town better off without him?
If quag is an sk trying to get maf how is the town better off without him?
We don't even know what quag is...

Dirge, you present three scenarios - only in the most unlikely one is the town actually served by lynching Quagmire. And when I said you 'overlooked' the maf and sk going after eachother I was giving you the benefit of the doubt - sorry if that bugs you

I'll try to act a little deader from now on - give others a chance to speak an' all that.

Electra - sorry, it would not be good for me to claim at this moment. All my finger pointing is based purely on conjecture and hearsay. Thanks for asking though

[Dragon Phoenix]

Posts of the last days have gone missing - I propose not to psot until it is sure that these cannot be retrieved.

[mneme]

ayeee. Yeah, I guess they have.

Also, I'm not getting email updates from the site, at all; has this facility gone south?

[massive]

Just wanted to throw this out because I saw it and it stuck in my craw ... the players of this game did not all have special roles. I was just a townie. Quagmire pushed for the "all special roles" Mafia a few posts up. I don't know if that has any bearing on his scumminess level.

[Quagmire]

So will this mean that I get a second chance at living, or am I still dead?

[Dirge]

We ought to wait to see what the mod says.

[Dragon Phoenix]

Last time I checked (before the mini-crash), Quagmire had enough votes for the lynch. I still can't believe you people lynched someone cleared by a cop - even if the nature of the cop is not clear and even if Quagmire could be a GF.

[rite]

Alright guys-- I've decided that we'll just continue on with the game as it was. Quagmire has received four votes: Dourgrim, Dirge, Darkblade and Electra.
---------------------------
As the crowd slowly circles around Quagmire, they demand explanation for exactly what he does in the town. He squeals and pulls out a physicians certificate, identifying him as yet another doctor. A voice cries out from the crowd, "It's a fake!" and, fake or not, within an hour, Quag is six feet under. His spirit, however...

Quagmire is dead. He may no longer vote or use any night abilities

Night Three has begun (again). Deadline for choices-- Noon Wednesday EST.

[rite]

Just realized that I said the wrong DEADline-- had the dates screwed up in my head. I like to give at least two days for a deadline, so I'm going to change it to THURSDAY Noon EST. Sorry for any confusion!

Rite

[rite]

(Of course, right when I extend the DEADline, I end up with the night choices I need).

Midnight-- A shadowy figure creeps into Mneme's house without a sound, and exits after making only one sound. A gunshot. As he drives away, a thin mist rises over the house. Mist... or ghost?

Mneme is dead

1:00 AM-- A black car rolls up to Mneme's house, and a large man exits the back seat with a humongous black machine with quite a large barrel. "So long, sucker," he whispers, as he switches it on. A horrible howl is heard wakes most of the town up as Mneme is vanished into the machines depths.

Mneme (Townie) is destroyed. He may no longer post

Day Three has begun. Three to lynch, no DEADline set.

[Dragon Phoenix]

Bad news and good news.
Bad news is that mneme is dead. The good news is that Quagmire was a townie. So I'm not insane. You know what? I'm also not naive. I found me a real fat mafia member this night:

vote Dourgrim

[Darkblade]

HOw do you know what Quagmire is? It wasn't revealed yet. He could have been the GF (And it seemed sure like it as he was acting very guilty). But, I'll go along with the Dourgrim vote

Vote: Dourgrim

[Quagmire]

That's funny. Why would someone be destroyed? I mean, I was a Serial Destroyer, IE: Same role as CRiX, but then again rite must have had 3 of a destroyer-type role in the game.

And I'm good? I thought I'd be evil. Just a thought...