Mafiascum.net

HezLucky replaces shotgun thank you

Hi everyone.

Will read game soon. Excited.

Anything I need to know?

Read commencing now, posting with gusto by tomorrow

↑ Korlash wrote:

Rat wrote:Your main shit reason is that you are saying V2V's actions are more likely to come from scum than town without actually backing up this presumption and then using contrived, WIFOMy reasons for it. I will admit that when you look into a person's reasons for doing something WIFOM is likely to come up, but it becomes shit when WIFOM is entirely what the "case" is built on. You are using your percieved reasons for why scumV2V would fakeclaim vig and using only these without anything else scummy that he has done and no other reasons. You initially said you were not pushing his lynch and that you were trying to get answers for why he would fakeclaim vig. Is this still the case or will you now admit that you are pushing his lynch and want him dead? Also LOL @ "the mislynch MoI handed you on a platter" if anyone is the easy mislynch today it is V2V.

You've just blown your whole arguement. You cannot argue I am both "Saying his arguments are more likely to come from scum without backing them up" AND say I'm "Using contrived WIFOMy reasons for it". If I'm using reasons, regardless of how contrived, I'm backing up my accusation. if I'm not backing up my accusation, then I cannot be using any reasons at all, regardless of how WIFOMy they are.

Pick an attack you want to use and run with it. Stop trying to accuse me of anything you can think of because it all comes out as stupidly pointless.

To counter your argument, you are using the same contrived WIFOMy reasons to call him town. The only real evidence there is is that he lied and outright fakeclaimed, which more than justifies a 'wagon' on him while we get answers. Your shit lashing out at it is not of a sound town mind. Either you're town with a vendetta against me and just 'assume' V2V is town because I've attaacked him, which is stupid for you to do regardless of your feelings on him since an admitted lie SHOULD be delved into as hard as possible. OR, you're scum who knows V2V is town. I won't venture to guess which is more likely until I do my analysis.

To answer your question, Aye, it is still the case. Although it shouldn't be for long since I have enough... i just have to get around to compiling the information. >.>

Alright, I will agree with you that both of our arguments on V2V's fakeclaim are WIFOMy. I have my own WIFOMy reasons for believing he is town and you have your's for believing he is scum. I saw you attacking him as pushing an easy mislynch (considering I think what he did was a towntell and that you were probably scum from the MoI trap from yesterday) and I attacked you for doing so. That's where things stand atm for me. I will give some more thought into the matter and take into consideration that I probably have a good deal of confirmation bias atm and then go from there.

Yay new people, you can distract everyone from me not holding up my promises! >.>

Honestly, working on it... Just uh... Well... Minecraft is a hell of a drug... >.>

My work schedule should be rather light the next couple of days so... stuff will happen, promise! *wink*

Looking forward to see what the replacements can bring. See you all after the weekend.

Yeah - I'll be V/LA until Tuesday evening, probably. Enjoy.

↑ Korlash wrote:Bullshit... I've been 'on site' for Five years, do you actually think I'm going to kill the one guy leading the charge against me? When it's Fate? Having him alive would have made it less likely I was lynched. This is a very lazy excuse for your vote so I'm hoping the rest is better.

↑ Korlash wrote:Yeah... you've never met me then. My style of Scum play is to literally no kill all game... I will always choose the less violent path, so killing my biggest threat is almost always out of the question. (Not here though, as I said, proper play would dictate the Fate kill regardless.) In a three person team I would just hand the kill choice off to the others to decide...

While it's very considerate of you to provide us with a view into your scum meta, I have the feeling you're revealing more than you intended to. These two blurbs are contradictory, and I think you're trying to have your cake and eat it too. If you were scum, then you would've left Fate alive except you wouldn't have because proper play would dictate the Fate kill regardless.

Korlash flipping scum would clear Yates, pappums, and Tammy in my mind.

VOTE: Korlash

Split wrote:While it's very considerate of you to provide us with a view into your scum meta, I have the feeling you're revealing more than you intended to. These two blurbs are contradictory, and I think you're trying to have your cake and eat it too. If you were scum, then you would've left Fate alive except you wouldn't have because proper play would dictate the Fate kill regardless.

They aren't in any way contradictory but I'll give you a chance to defend that argument.

Proper play would dictate the Fate kill, that is a fact. However, this applies to anyone and everyone equally.

People have suggested I killed fate because he was a threat to me, my scum meta suggests I wouldn't do this, thus that statement is false.

Arguing I killed Fate is pointless because it both 'applies to everyone' and 'goes against my scum meta'.

How is this in any way contradictory?

Split wrote:Korlash flipping scum would clear Yates, pappums, and Tammy in my mind.

You like my lynch because it has the added benefit of suggesting other's 'townyness' if I flip scum... You realize how dumb that is right? Saying there is possible partner links as an addition to lynching a person has some merit in hypothetical-land. SOME... Saying a person's flip (of scum) suggests others as town is just stupid and worthless.

I wont assume to say this was an actual reason for your vote, but as your only stated one so far is obviously false I have to say your vote looks a little... backless. Do you have anything of merit to actually add to the case against me or some actual evidence to support your vote? (Even if those were a contradiction, it's hardly enough unless you were to go into it more. As in, if there were contradictory you have me lying on scum meta... Which is a big thing. Since, A, town shouldn't ever lie about that, and B, scum in hot water lying about that makes perfect sense. But of course, you would first have to prove they are contradictory, which you can't because they aren't.)

On a side note: Had to go to a movie and dinner today, so couldn't do any analysis. Luckily, everyone V/LA anyway so no one should miss me too much! Cheers!

Hmm...not a fan of Split's "contribution." That's the only thing there is to comment on the game? A contradiction? No thoughts on anything else?

Is the whole reason you're voting Korlash is because of the contradiction?

I'd like to know how Korlash flipping scum would clear PapRat, Yates or me. Do we look good independently or is this just a future thing in case we're voting for scum? You don't think it's at least a little bit suspicious that I voted for Korlash and then got into a lengthy discussion in which I said that I wasn't even sure if I wanted to lynch him?

↑ HezLucky wrote:Hi everyone.

Will read game soon. Excited.

Anything I need to know?

You probably got a scum PM and you need to bus Korlash to save yourself.

↑ PeregrineV wrote:

↑ HezLucky wrote:Hi everyone.

Will read game soon. Excited.

Anything I need to know?

You probably got a scum PM and you need to bus Korlash to save yourself.

Why do you think Korlash is scum?

@Tammy- Korlash no-hammered MoI when the early wagon formed. An early day hammer and town flip would put more scrutiny on scum-Korlash then he would want. Don't recall if he actually argued MoI was town at that point, but it could be in there.
Also, the self-vote for no reason.
Then, spending most of the day on the Papum's Rat wagon WITH MoI, but suddenly finding him scum at the end of the day. Managed to get on the middle of the wagon, but his buddy had to hammer instead.

All very suspicious.

Also involved in weekend things, will read up Monday.

So then you think that V2V and Korlash are partners?

I have to admit that I'm less convinced of Korlash as scum than I was when I replaced in. Part of that could be because I've actually enjoyed debating points with him because I find that fun and crap like that wins me over. But V2V...I can't get behind the out of his depth stuff and think that Yates raises some good points.

I, however, have not had a chance to do the ISO's that I need to do to get a better picture of some of the people in this game.

^^^Really need to pedit sometimes...addressed to Pere.

↑ Tammy wrote:So then you think that V2V and Korlash are partners?

I have to admit that I'm less convinced of Korlash as scum than I was when I replaced in. Part of that could be because I've actually enjoyed debating points with him because I find that fun and crap like that wins me over. But V2V...I can't get behind the out of his depth stuff and think that Yates raises some good points.

I, however, have not had a chance to do the ISO's that I need to do to get a better picture of some of the people in this game.

No, I think V2V is probably town. Scott summed it up here.

↑ Scott Brosius wrote:
Again, you are acting like he actually claimed. v2v said something like im gonna shoot you tonight. Why would anyone take that seriously? If his claim was so convincing that it warranted protection, why did the ACTUAL VIG kill him? That's how weak that feeble attempt at a claim was.

I repeat, it's a dumb move, but it really reeks of town, not master manipulator scum.

And Korlash is good at the talking part of the game, which does make it fun.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... &start=400

But, read 400-507 of this completed game, starring scum-Korlash. He almost talked his way out of a guilty result. (this game also included a self-vote)

Because he's such a hard read for me to decipher, I'd rather look elsewhere. Since I am getting town-vibes from most players, I looked at one of the ones I didn't (drmyshotgun now HeezLucky).

↑ Tammy wrote:So then you think that V2V and Korlash are partners?

I have to admit that I'm less convinced of Korlash as scum than I was when I replaced in. Part of that could be because I've actually enjoyed debating points with him because I find that fun and crap like that wins me over. But V2V...I can't get behind the out of his depth stuff and think that Yates raises some good points.

I, however, have not had a chance to do the ISO's that I need to do to get a better picture of some of the people in this game.

No, I think V2V is probably town. Scott summed it up here.

↑ Scott Brosius wrote:
Again, you are acting like he actually claimed. v2v said something like im gonna shoot you tonight. Why would anyone take that seriously? If his claim was so convincing that it warranted protection, why did the ACTUAL VIG kill him? That's how weak that feeble attempt at a claim was.

I repeat, it's a dumb move, but it really reeks of town, not master manipulator scum.

And Korlash is good at the talking part of the game, which does make it fun.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... &start=400

But, read 400-507 of this completed game, starring scum-Korlash. He almost talked his way out of a guilty result. (this game also included a self-vote)

Because he's such a hard read for me to decipher, I'd rather look elsewhere. Since I am getting town-vibes from most players, I looked at one of the ones I didn't (drmyshotgun now HeezLucky).

Busier weekend than expected. Will get back to the site Tuesday at the latest.

Damn it, sorry guys, I forgot I had to do something for this game. Will do that tonight.

Korlash 4 - pappums rat, The Mini-Librarian,Tammy, splitfarvle
vijay2vansandani 3 - Korlash,HezLucky, Yates
HezLucky 2 - PereV,Scott Brosius,
Yates 1 - vijay2vansandani,


With 10 alive it takes 6 to lynch

(expired on 2012-06-08 15:16:47)

till Day 2 Deadline

Pere wrote:@Tammy- Korlash no-hammered MoI when the early wagon formed. An early day hammer and town flip would put more scrutiny on scum-Korlash then he would want. Don't recall if he actually argued MoI was town at that point, but it could be in there.
Also, the self-vote for no reason.
Then, spending most of the day on the Papum's Rat wagon WITH MoI, but suddenly finding him scum at the end of the day. Managed to get on the middle of the wagon, but his buddy had to hammer instead.

All very suspicious.

A lot of people no hammered MoI. You need to be more specific mate. And you don't know if I was calling him town at this point... How would me calling him town and NOT hammering him be scummy? (I am taking your 'it could be in there' comment to imply if it is, I look more like scum because of it) An early day hammer would put more suspicion on me (if scum)... sure... I suppose that at least makes sense, but it's not even close to actual evidence that actually I am scum.

Self vote for no reason? It was RVS... Explain to me why I needed a reason to make a RVS vote... I'll wait...

Spending time on the Rat wagon with MoI... Yes. Switching onto him at the end of the day... Yes... Were my reasons not only valid but outright proven correct? Yes. You need to explain how my switch to MoI came from scum, not just said I did it. I said he was fakeclaiming, and he was. Case closed. My 'switch' is more than adequately acceptable. His fakeclaim came after the Rat wagon, so me being on that means nothing when it comes to my MoI read.

The only thing about this that even MIGHT be suspicious is the MoI vote, but you have to say WHY...

Pere wrote:No, I think V2V is probably town. Scott summed it up here.

What did you mean by this then:

Pere wrote:Managed to get on the middle of the wagon, but his buddy had to hammer instead.

Pere wrote:But, read 400-507 of this completed game, starring scum-Korlash. He almost talked his way out of a guilty result. (this game also included a self-vote)

Aye, I'm fairly good at talking my way out of losing situations. Next time someone has a guilty on me I'm sure it will be harder to fool you.

As for the self vote... Check these out: 1106 ; 1095 ; 1056 ; 125

I think that's 3 town games and 1 scum game all with self-votes during the RVS. It's how I start every game off, short of those that I replace into.

The thing with Redwall is I self voted OUTSIDE of RVS. Thus, I self-voted as a ploy and not as a random vote. You cannot compare that vote to the one I did in this game... totally different situations mate. =D

Looks like I'm not the only one enjoying the weekend... <.< Makes me feel less guilty about shirking my duties at least... >.> *eats hot dog*

I hate this game sometimes. Pere, even though I do try to stay away from meta, I read what you linked me to. Good reading. Also, go Korlash for almost pulling that off. Hats off.

Here's part of my problem. I don't have a read on you Pere...at all. So, either you're a townie who's trying to help me read Korlash better and see that he can, in fact, talk himself out of almost anything...or you're scum trying to nudge the doubts I already had about Korlash upon coming into the thread.

I know a good part is my fault. I've been horrible and haven't ISO'd because I got caught up in conversations and haven't had the time to do it, and deadline's not for another 11 days so I guess I'm being a bit lazy about it too.

What do you think about Scott Brosius and Splitfarvle's contribution so far?

@Tammy- to be honest, since they were both other people I haven't dug back through them now+who they were. I think I looked over Knox from before, and found them pretty town, but nothing has stuck out lately.
I do like Scott joining the drmyshotgun/Hezlucky wagon, but I haven't dissected his posts otherwise.

Starting from the beginning with knowledge of the flips ahead of time [as I don't want to reread just for that]

FLIPS
MOI - Town
Benmage - Scum
Fate - Town

LOL MOI IS PARANOID TOWN. LOL LOL LOL BAD MOI.
[To MoI: boy am I happy you are dead. Your playstyle stinks. Seriously, it really does. And based on Germany mafia you aren't even a bad scumhunter but the way you treat people as town is basically asking them to vote for you.]

PeregrineV wrote:Vote: the Jester

Seems like a ringer in a game like this.

MoI, you are correct. Here is the link to the scum Q

-ignores any of the first 17 posts goign on in this game [there is more than enough to comment] in favour of trying to be useful to MoI by providing him a link.

Smells like fencesitting "ZOMGIWANTTOLOOKTOWN" scum to me.


Yates actually realized that in Post #19. He's thinking exactly like I am. Yates = town.

Something is off about Vijay #43.

Korlash wrote:I have to weigh in on this, even though I feel Yates said it perfectly. Comedians are comedians, regardless of how funny you feel they are. if they 'weren't funny' they couldn't be comedians, it's impossible. Your theory on the setup is solid enough, but since this is a game of comedians from around the world for all we know nationality plays into who is scum, not their lack of talent. We can't know until someone actually flips scum.

And.... Korlash is mafia. Let me tell you why. There was NO need to weigh in on this. He basically took what Vijay said and expanded it ("I have to weigh in on this" give me a break you are posting game theory filler and doing nothing but setup speculation. How about you actually hunt scum? I HAVE TO WEIGH IN ON THIS ARE YOU SERIOUS?)

Interesting that Benmage #50 has a scumtell where he gets hung up in meta. :notes it down for future games:

Korlash's #50-54 interactions with Benmage also look crafted. [hell the whole page looks crafted and I am not putting shit like that past Benmage - sorry Ben your buddy has let you down]

knox #64 isn't great. Basically shows up, throws out a general comment about the setup, and half-asses his way onto the MoI wagon without actually voting for it.

vijay #65 looks town. gah. Maybe this is playstyle.

knox #66 - choosing easy targets, much? "be easy on me" "i'm giong to vote the biggest lurker in the game"

iStark #70 is bad town. #73 is LULLULULULULULULULBADTOWN. I love you.

Oh hey MoI #72 votes Knox. I'm telling you guys MoI is a decent scumhunter but has a batshit TERRIBLE playstyle [he also plays differently as scum -- he's EXTREMELY uncomfortable and awkward, which he isn't showing here]. I feel better about voting for Knox right now. [Of course MoI does massively massively tunnel as town and its terrible, see: Post #80 -_-]

Pizzadudes7 - boy you are AWFULLY meek in this post

pizzadudes7 wrote:Fate, did you admit to being scum in 74?

Scared you are going to upset the mighty Fate?

Yates #81 - dammit Yates I had you as town up to here. REALLY? You don't find Knox SCUMMY? And you are trying to "gradually" change your read on MoI? ugh. bad. You're wrong and playing poorly, or scum. [YES I AM AWARE I HAVE HINDSIGHT BIAS]

MoI claims you are bad town in #94. I will accept it. [ALTHOUGH THE FATE-TUNNELING IS BLINDING MOI. YES I WILL TAKE SHOTS AT YOU EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE DEAD DEAL WITH IT I HATE YOUR PLAYSTYLE AS MUCH AS YOU HATE MINE]

Vijay #124 town. "Way out of my league" - dude, you LOOK way out of your league.

Its post #127 and pappums is still posting fluff
[funny thing? Post #129 is a half-decent post. Calling Korlash out for his garbage.

knox #132 - thats some nice MoI buddying of dead town.

I'm worried I'm tunneling. But PeregrineV #188, where he asks MoI to rehash all of his reads [even though I can personally name just about all of them off the top of my head as I'm reading right now] looks like an attempt to get towncred. PeregrineV hasn't previously expressed any sort of respect for MoI's scumhunting ability, so it just doesn't add up. On the other hand, its possible he wants us to see him as "that guy who asked a good, useful question that can certainly help town".

Korlash #207 - OH GOD CAN THIS GUY BE MORE SCUM? I actually looked at MoI's so called "slip" that Yates pointed out and my EYES FUCKING WIDENED. Liek HOLY SHIT I WOULD HAVE HAMMERED HIM THERE AND THEN. You are trying to discredit someone for pointing out a LEGIMTIMATE SLIP [that happened to be wrong, but of course, given that we know Korlash is scum Korlash himself is more than happy to point out that Yates is wrong before the D1 lynch flip]

Korlash/Yates argument is scum v. town

Korlash wrote:
Fate is scum because Fate is always scum even when the mod mistakenly gives him a town role pm.

Korlash is scum becaues he's being cheeky as fuck. Die diediediediediediediediediediediediedie.

Korlash's attack on Ben in #225 is also garbage. Ben flipped scum. Nice faux-bus.




------------AT THIS POINT I HAVE READ UP TO POST #230. I HAVE TWO REALLY STRONG SCUMREADS THAT ARE ALIVE, AND SEVERAL TOWNREADS. THIS IS MORE THAN WORTH POSTING. ENGAGE TUNNELMODE--------------

SCUM -
[with any association tells]

Korlash scumscumscumscum [unlikely to be scum with Vijay]
knox scumscumscum
PeregrineV scum
Pizzadudes7 scum?
Jester BE USEFUL
pappumsrat post less fluff please. [town?]
Yates town
Vijay town
iStark town


So Fate-town is dead and most of the remaining town are useless [everyone except Yates] or not good enough to win us this game [Yates]. Yay.