Mafiascum.net

In post 684, farside22 wrote:I was going to say something till I saw your list. Did you check GC's meta that was referenced?

I thought reading GC that he was getting mad about his push and it was reading like he was offended that he even had to explain himself. But after researching his meta and rereading his points on BM I'm feeling differently about GC. He recent games are town so far (I didn't check older games) and he is more laid back and not this bitchy typically. Or this full of himself so I'm now leaning more towards a scum read. Plus I feel like he is being a bit over the top on his read and reaction to BM.

Does he typically have to take a leading role in dragging town with him?

In post 694, stungun0404 wrote:Instance attempt at a distancing vote? Note the wording: I "know" that you are really an "assassin droid".

How can you "know" that he is an "assassin droid" unless you are, in fact, scum with him?

Hi theres this great website called google.com that says thats literally what the type of droid is and weve already covered that votato is clearly a fan of star wars and the game thats being referenced.

Didnt we literally spend 10 pages covering how that isnt scummy

In post 696, stungun0404 wrote:Also note all three of Votato, BM and GC have weakly sheep-voted people, using players as shields.

You do realize scum arent likely to do the exact same thing and hide themselves in the exact same styles?

In post 702, stungun0404 wrote:Lie. No follow through (which in this case is anti-town).

tell him my stance on this tia, you should remember my stance on active anti-townity from our last game.

In post 703, stungun0404 wrote:They have all three lied. Lynch all liars. Lying about simple and clear intentions with no follow-through and lying to implicate me is what can be considered scummy here. Simple as that.

OTOH, Dunn has

not

made one single blatant lie in this game. You can ISO everything he has said to confirm that there is no blatant lie. That's the difference between town and scum I think in this particular game.

Not that the "lynch all liars" approach always works, but in this case I think it leads us to the correct solve.

Im not lynching people based off preflip associatives and them "lying" about when they plan to finish catching up because this is a GAME and people have REAL LIVES to focus on.

In post 714, HK 50 wrote:wait I have to be funny

DAMN STRAIGHT YOU DO

In post 717, stungun0404 wrote:@Farside, @Dr. Pepper, @NS, since I trust you are all three town, would you guys be willing to potentially move over and lynch Clidd this day phase provided that I promise you that we lynch either Dunn or Votato next day phase?

Fuck ass no

In post 725, farside22 wrote:I feel the bold to be pretty spot on. I think if dunn was town he would have been an easy lynch. His vote on nm is lazy as that is how nm is and he avoids discussing anything relevant.

IMO only way scums comfy rn is if one of them is leading the apathy wagons.

In post 727, bob3141 wrote:It does feel sort of suspect looking back. Bm makes a scummy vote on vota. The vota wagon gets quickly abandoned and when he is benign suspect he makes a weak push on dun being town. All the while never really trying to explain how he managed to come to the opposite conclusion using one of your points. Until just before he repped out.

I abandoned it due to cold feet re my own thoughts on votato not related to the wagon and I daresay Im the reason that wagon fell apart, and why are we doing preflip associatives like this.

Robot 728 is town.

In post 731, HK 50 wrote:-Im sure there are points that help sort conscience, malakitten, and GC.

Im town my darling little curling iron

In post 735, stungun0404 wrote:Is it not scummy to add an extra day to the clock only to use more than double that amount of time up without even saying so much as a word like "I am having trouble catching up" or something? I can understand busyness, but at the same time it only takes about 15-30 seconds to come in and say something like that, and it also helps us.

Do you think for a second that might be scum that has no defense for what I called them out about on Friday?

Votato has also not answered. It has been >36 hours since I asked those questions, and HK only responded after I asked him a second time. Do you think there is a reason these players are dodging those questions?

1) Cases on availability on players not regarded as lurkers of a typical alignment are trash

2) Don't you think scum that had a defense for it would have posted it super quick instead of, as you say, avoiding it?

3) Why do they even need to answer a case that literally boils down to their interactions with someone else that they might not necessarily be on a team with? "YOU HAVE TO BE SCUM FOR DOING THIS WITH THAT SCUM" doesnt really work. Besides, you aren't going to convince those players they are scum. They either know they are or know they arent you cant convince someone of that shit cases are purely to try to convince the rest of the game to follow you.

4) Why do I have to explain these base concepts that you are using to force an apathy lynch?

In post 741, HK 50 wrote:Read mine and stunguns when you get a chance and tell me what you think and why.

Yes my beloved flashlight.

I think its just really misguided town. I fully agree with the points you are bringing up, but we don’t really have a solid other option presently.

In post 751, Green Crayons wrote:There is a metric ton of associative theory going on without a flip.

THANK YOU

In post 756, votato wrote:honestly im a bit suspicious of stun for how hard he's spamming the thread pushing inactives, but i think he just got caught up in the excitement of seeing several events happening and unconsciously tying them together. i think it would be a terrible play for the scumteam to ask for more time and then all go afk at the same time.

Yes its the same thing that made me suspect dolly originally and given the gamestate it does kind of make sense. Im back and forth on him because it did feel like he was TvT with GC earlier. But idk.

I feel like hes trying to inject life into a town similar to how I was last game so its whats holding me off atm, but there has to be a scum thats trying to pull strings.

In post 759, Green Crayons wrote:Phone posting so, long and short of BM/Clidd is that BM’s wonky posts that NM called out

I dont really feel like NM has done much calling out and moreso that hes just been tunneling regardless of BMs alignment

It is not alignment indicative that votato knows about HK's character. Stop bringing it up and play the actual game TIA.

MALACURTAINS

I dont like this gamestate and I am calling on you to help me change it.

As notsci will tell you, most anti town behavior comes from town

i dont think dunn is the scummiest, but i feel like dunn is a good lynch for info who also has plenty of scum equity

I had a rough day, there’s no way I’m posting until Wed.

Hope it gets better.

Wow I’ve never had this much power before it’s exhilarating

Votato I want to Lynch scum who should we Lynch

In post 775, notscience wrote:

In post 684, farside22 wrote:I was going to say something till I saw your list. Did you check GC's meta that was referenced?

I thought reading GC that he was getting mad about his push and it was reading like he was offended that he even had to explain himself. But after researching his meta and rereading his points on BM I'm feeling differently about GC. He recent games are town so far (I didn't check older games) and he is more laid back and not this bitchy typically. Or this full of himself so I'm now leaning more towards a scum read. Plus I feel like he is being a bit over the top on his read and reaction to BM.

Does he typically have to take a leading role in dragging town with him?

In post 694, stungun0404 wrote:Instance attempt at a distancing vote? Note the wording: I "know" that you are really an "assassin droid".

How can you "know" that he is an "assassin droid" unless you are, in fact, scum with him?

Hi theres this great website called google.com that says thats literally what the type of droid is and weve already covered that votato is clearly a fan of star wars and the game thats being referenced.

Didnt we literally spend 10 pages covering how that isnt scummy

In post 696, stungun0404 wrote:Also note all three of Votato, BM and GC have weakly sheep-voted people, using players as shields.

You do realize scum arent likely to do the exact same thing and hide themselves in the exact same styles?

In post 702, stungun0404 wrote:Lie. No follow through (which in this case is anti-town).

votato

tell him my stance on this tia, you should remember my stance on active anti-townity from our last game.

In post 703, stungun0404 wrote:They have all three lied. Lynch all liars. Lying about simple and clear intentions with no follow-through and lying to implicate me is what can be considered scummy here. Simple as that.

OTOH, Dunn has

not

made one single blatant lie in this game. You can ISO everything he has said to confirm that there is no blatant lie. That's the difference between town and scum I think in this particular game.

Not that the "lynch all liars" approach always works, but in this case I think it leads us to the correct solve.

Im not lynching people based off preflip associatives and them "lying" about when they plan to finish catching up because this is a GAME and people have REAL LIVES to focus on.

In post 714, HK 50 wrote:wait I have to be funny

DAMN STRAIGHT YOU DO

In post 717, stungun0404 wrote:@Farside, @Dr. Pepper, @NS, since I trust you are all three town, would you guys be willing to potentially move over and lynch Clidd this day phase provided that I promise you that we lynch either Dunn or Votato next day phase?

Fuck ass no

In post 725, farside22 wrote:I feel the bold to be pretty spot on. I think if dunn was town he would have been an easy lynch. His vote on nm is lazy as that is how nm is and he avoids discussing anything relevant.

IMO only way scums comfy rn is if one of them is leading the apathy wagons.

In post 727, bob3141 wrote:It does feel sort of suspect looking back. Bm makes a scummy vote on vota. The vota wagon gets quickly abandoned and when he is benign suspect he makes a weak push on dun being town. All the while never really trying to explain how he managed to come to the opposite conclusion using one of your points. Until just before he repped out.

I abandoned it due to cold feet re my own thoughts on votato not related to the wagon and I daresay Im the reason that wagon fell apart, and why are we doing preflip associatives like this.

Robot 728 is town.

In post 731, HK 50 wrote:-Im sure there are points that help sort conscience, malakitten, and GC.

Im town my darling little curling iron

In post 735, stungun0404 wrote:Is it not scummy to add an extra day to the clock only to use more than double that amount of time up without even saying so much as a word like "I am having trouble catching up" or something? I can understand busyness, but at the same time it only takes about 15-30 seconds to come in and say something like that, and it also helps us.

Do you think for a second that might be scum that has no defense for what I called them out about on Friday?

Votato has also not answered. It has been >36 hours since I asked those questions, and HK only responded after I asked him a second time. Do you think there is a reason these players are dodging those questions?

1) Cases on availability on players not regarded as lurkers of a typical alignment are trash

2) Don't you think scum that had a defense for it would have posted it super quick instead of, as you say, avoiding it?

3) Why do they even need to answer a case that literally boils down to their interactions with someone else that they might not necessarily be on a team with? "YOU HAVE TO BE SCUM FOR DOING THIS WITH THAT SCUM" doesnt really work. Besides, you aren't going to convince those players they are scum. They either know they are or know they arent you cant convince someone of that shit cases are purely to try to convince the rest of the game to follow you.

4) Why do I have to explain these base concepts that you are using to force an apathy lynch?

In post 741, HK 50 wrote:Read mine and stunguns when you get a chance and tell me what you think and why.

Yes my beloved flashlight.

I think its just really misguided town. I fully agree with the points you are bringing up, but we don’t really have a solid other option presently.

In post 751, Green Crayons wrote:There is a metric ton of associative theory going on without a flip.

THANK YOU

In post 756, votato wrote:honestly im a bit suspicious of stun for how hard he's spamming the thread pushing inactives, but i think he just got caught up in the excitement of seeing several events happening and unconsciously tying them together. i think it would be a terrible play for the scumteam to ask for more time and then all go afk at the same time.

Yes its the same thing that made me suspect dolly originally and given the gamestate it does kind of make sense. Im back and forth on him because it did feel like he was TvT with GC earlier. But idk.

I feel like hes trying to inject life into a town similar to how I was last game so its whats holding me off atm, but there has to be a scum thats trying to pull strings.

In post 759, Green Crayons wrote:Phone posting so, long and short of BM/Clidd is that BM’s wonky posts that NM called out

I dont really feel like NM has done much calling out and moreso that hes just been tunneling regardless of BMs alignment

GC games he asked more questions in this game
replaced in here putting out reads but thoughts but I don't see either game were he gets pissy or bitchy to anyone.
Games after those are 2018 or older and I know players can change from a few years break but the more recent games is why I don't see his over the top anything like he typically has been recently.

I mean I get it bc we’ve had some real dumb stuff in here this game

@farside: oddly enough, earlier when I was doing a meta on GC, that is exactly what stood out to me. The fact that he was not asking many questions, but I wanted to keep that information to my self in case it is a scumtell for him.

That is really what originally led me to want to really look at him. Because if he asks a lot of questions in more than one game of his meta as town, then when you see the opposite, is he scum?

@NS, I did not know about the drone thing. I really did not carefully read the conversations that were not particularly game relevant in this thread. I hope you can see how I might interpret that as scummy if I did not know/get the reference.

Farside quote: "Please don't make a molehill into a mountain. Chill and let the player catch up. People get busy and frankly I find your attitude a bit rude in this department."
Response: yeah, that's on me. sorry i got impatient there. i think i went a little too far trying to justify someone i had a scum ping on.

In post 760, Green Crayons wrote: Ghost Ganster stungun0404 - town Like, annoyingly super town and I say annoyingly because he can get a thought in his head and it might be wrong by gd he runs it down.

yeah, i have very much of a tunnel tendency when I think I have caught scum. like sometimes I literally will block out everything but who I suspect, which I can try to work on, especially if it's only from D1 evidence/before flips.

In post 782, notscience wrote:Votato I want to Lynch scum who should we Lynch

As for this, I think regardless of who he might say, we should wait to lynch until we can get a claim. Even if that means someone has to replace Clidd and instantly come into the thread and claim. That helps us more than simply lynching the slot, because we'll have more information to make an informed decision off of.

my reads, based off a combination of feel and reasoning.

titanium-strong town reads: bob, dr. pepper
solid town reads, but not beyond doubt: farside, notscience, malakittens
likely town: nm
nulltown: Dunnstral (this is notably my weakest town indication though)

minus associations and all the other stuff i have been pondering, here is how i would rate the others based strictly off the assumption that anyone could be partnered with anyone:

null: votato, gc

scumleans: geraintm, hk50

strongest scumread: clidd/bm

In post 783, farside22 wrote:GC games he asked more questions in this game
replaced in here putting out reads but thoughts but I don't see either game were he gets pissy or bitchy to anyone.
Games after those are 2018 or older and I know pl

Ah yes the “pissy or bitchy” metric, which is definitely a thing that people can objectively measure.

Has HK said who they suspect other than stun?

I don't intend to hammer Clidd, if the wagon is going to shift to me I'll defend myself.

In post 792, Dunnstral wrote:I don't intend to hammer Clidd, if the wagon is going to shift to me I'll defend myself.

I like this post from Dunnstral right here. It will look good especially if there is a scumflip of clidd. if Clidd's town, then it holds less weight, because technically that could mean a scum Dunnstral is not wanting to lynch town here.

I observed that he took up on an opportunity in his meta as scum after replacing into a game to hammer a townplayer immediately after someone asked him to do so. He didn't even debate it, he just did it.

Now granted, that person had a power role which we might to note that scum may have known, but given that he hasn't followed anyone asking about a hammer so far, this does look good to me if Clidd flips scum. NM has asked him, which he could have taken up on that opportunity, but has not and is currently resisting the opposing wagon to himself.

In post 791, Green Crayons wrote:Has HK said who they suspect other than stun?

Just Dunnstral. And ISO'ing him I have not gotten a real sense why he suspects Dunnstral scum. It feels like he is just following everyone else.

Can somebody else look into HK's ISO and just tell me if it looks like he is scumhunting? Because that is what concerns me about his entire ISO, even if you just look at it from a surface perspective.

In post 789, stungun0404 wrote:my reads, based off a combination of feel and reasoning.

titanium-strong town reads: bob, dr. pepper
solid town reads, but not beyond doubt: farside, notscience, malakittens
likely town: nm
nulltown: Dunnstral (this is notably my weakest town indication though)

minus associations and all the other stuff i have been pondering, here is how i would rate the others based strictly off the assumption that anyone could be partnered with anyone:

null: votato, gc

scumleans: geraintm, hk50

strongest scumread: clidd/bm

this is a really bad list and i want to lynch you for it.

In post 795, votato wrote:

In post 789, stungun0404 wrote:my reads, based off a combination of feel and reasoning.

titanium-strong town reads: bob, dr. pepper
solid town reads, but not beyond doubt: farside, notscience, malakittens
likely town: nm
nulltown: Dunnstral (this is notably my weakest town indication though)

minus associations and all the other stuff i have been pondering, here is how i would rate the others based strictly off the assumption that anyone could be partnered with anyone:

null: votato, gc

scumleans: geraintm, hk50

strongest scumread: clidd/bm

this is a really bad list and i want to lynch you for it.

por que?

what is bad about it?

some strange townreads, and some townreads in the wrong order. like why is dr p so high up as an inactive? do you really not have enough info to have reads on myself or GC at this point?

In post 797, votato wrote:some strange townreads, and some townreads in the wrong order. like why is dr p so high up as an inactive? do you really not have enough info to have reads on myself or GC at this point?

yes, i too want to hear more from Dr. P, but his content has a very distinct town feel to it for me thus far. I have also observed some things he has done that would make things more difficult on himself if he were in fact scum, and I don't think scum ever wants to make their jobs harder than it needs to be.

As I have been suspecting this day phase, I think one of GC/BM or Clidd is scum based on their pushes of each other. GC has done some things I have found scummy, but not as scummy as BM. There are limited town pings for me on him, thus I have him in the middle right now.

As for you, I have observed on your Wiki page that you are 4-0 and scum, so I am being very cautious in resorting to any sort of townread for you, and I really can't say that anything you individually have done is too overly scummy, so that is why I am null on you.

What are your reads?

I can make sure to meta Dr. P later when I get the chance just to make sure that he does not do the things I have spotted as scum, but from a strict feeling perspective I feel good about Dr. P.