Mafiascum.net

hiplop and I were both sick last weekend and couldn't do a joint-catchup and whatnot. He's been sick with the flu [IIRC] for some-odd days now so its just been me. Anywho.
hiplop agrees with most of my reads, and has something for the QT when he gets back.

SlySly wrote:MOI, this is the part that bothered me. Since it appears to have worked so well in the first game, I seriously doubt the mod would run a sequel that would be so easily broken by the same methodology.

In an ideal perfect world, we'd all be Commies.

SlySly's post against the poison thing's format makes no sense to me. There's alot of time put into that [?] for little return.

wazzatron wrote:... why? this is the whole paragraph and there is nothing that is pointed at me in the rest of the post can you please clarify them scumpoints.

Sinestro wrote:Pushing easy case on silly player is scummy[?]

This. I don't remember exactly what happened but crypto throwing himself out there like that is definitely not scum_behavior.

warriormode wrote:warriormode (6) Magister Ludi, springlullaby, Drunken Piper, projectmatt, Workdawg, Toogeloo

This is where I have a problem. Definitely one scum here in my wagon.

1) Name a quarter of the playerlist.
2) Call at least one of them scum.
3) ???
4) Profit

Magna wrote:This is bad. Both Junpei and myself have clearly explained that Fourseen is a Shotty style VI. There’s not “significant meta” that says he is scum. Junpei is just basically shouting “LYNCH THE IDIOT”. This vote screams of 'just browsing' and not actually reading the game content.

1) Never played with the man, can only go on other's opinions. Don't have time to read extra games for one man's meta when I have SJC for extra reading.
2) Ok well that's that.
3) That's what I said.
4) We're reading. When we read. When I play as a hydra its sort of turned into me sharing the slot instead of coop, as IDEALLY I only have to post half as often, thus I can put less time and constant effort into the game. (Read: Nintendo Mafia. I always lurked in the shadows offering opinions to the hydra buddy but never actually did alot of work publically until LyLo when OWNED.)

MoI's point on workdawg is valid.

Magna wrote:It’s to forge links for late game, in the case that a pass results in a death, and to put scum stupid enough to lie about their passing in a 1v1 with Town who can say “No, you didn’t pass that to me”.

Makes sense.

SlySly wrote:@SlySLy – I really want to know who you think is scum. I await your post.

Did you miss his case on why Junpei is scum?
And then the not voting Junpei immediately after it?

Goddammit crypto.

Furco not voting is bad. "well if i would vote i'd vote ABC but im not so"

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...46452#p3546452]post 311[/url], Toogeloo wrote:

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...46374#p3546374]post 306[/url], MagnaofIllusion wrote:You are not a unique and special Snowflake.

Nope... I am a beautiful butterfly though.

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...47148#p3547148]post 325[/url], Magister Ludi wrote:Drunken Piper is the most amusing poster I have encountered on this site.

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...47407#p3547407]post 330[/url], SlySly wrote:

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...45754#p3545754]post 284[/url], Sinestro wrote:
SlySly calling Junpei out for a "slip" is fine and all but not followed up by a vote is scummy.

He responded, I voted. In my very next post.

ISO #1, post 158

Oh.
My bad.

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...50625#p3550625]post 360[/url], Furcolow wrote:I am a warrior sent to here from another land in order to maintain everything just in this scenario
I will not be deterred in my mission.
I am the Keanu Reeves character.

ITP he claims 3rd party?
wut

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...51219#p3551219]post 374[/url], Junpei wrote:six scum? Why six?

Reminds me of me in BDM when I argued the number of groupscum with Nikanor [?] and Toast for days.
+1scumpoint

Magna wrote:WE5874016 - Sinestro [Online.] – Why Town? Much lower activity than should be expected from hydra of hiplop and Andy. Horrible justification for Fourseen vote. Given the mechanics of this game hiplop’s ‘I’m bored because I’m VT’ regular excuse doesn’t hold water.

Well yes but you can still stay Vanilla for a loooong time.

Magna wrote:Please elaborate on why the phrase ‘word maracroni salad’ appears in that sentence.

lolwutareyoudoing?

DGB wrote:I didn't know this is a hydra, but I never played with either hiplop or Andy. I liked his one big post. Seems rather uninhibited, so town.

DGB wrote:I never played with either hiplop or Andy

DGB wrote:I never played with ... Andy

DGB wrote:I never played with ... Andy

DGB wrote:I never played with ... Andy

DGB
I...
we...
us...

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...81980#p2781980]post 0[/url], Eddard Stark wrote:
Andrius -

Osney Kettleblack - Lannister Aligned Brother

killed night 4
DrippingGoofball -

Osmund Kettleblack Lannister Aligned Brother

was killed night 5

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...98526#p2898526]post 2800[/url], zoraster wrote:

DrippingGoofball the Immortal God of Rewards

Andrius the Vigilante!

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...54801#p3554801]post 451[/url], diddin wrote:

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...54308#p3554308]post 446[/url], MagnaofIllusion wrote:

MORE STRINGER VOTES PLEASE!!!

Have I ever mentioned how fucking annoying this is? Because it is.

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...54841#p3554841]post 452[/url], Junpei wrote:
Diddin, I strongly believe that fourseen is scum, so should I do what MoI does and go

MORE FOURSEEN VOTES PLEASEEE

every post?

Okay, I will.

Just let it go.
Its Magna's new style. I don't remember seeing it before this game and [ONGOING], but. :/

Sweet Magna sees springlullaby_scum too. Awesome.

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...55521#p3555521]post 476[/url], DrippingGoofball wrote:

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...55490#p3555490]post 474[/url], Ghostlin wrote:

In [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p...55469#p3555469]post 473[/url], DrippingGoofball wrote:I changed my mind. Junpei is town.

Why?

He's aggressively poking hornets. NEVER a good idea when you're scum.

See my problem is he's like this one guy in [ONGOING].
Basically he's getting tons of pressure and is going into PARANOIA stage, like I did in Outwitted. (Read: Outwitted Mafia. After claiming everyone who wasn't a pre-claim townread was a scumread of mine out of sheer paranoia and pushing me to various degrees and whatnot. Not believing a Doc claim was scummy, thinking that my play was town BEFORE the claim and then the claim made me scum was scummy. Unvoting me and still calling me scum was scummy. All flipped town. :/)

Then again he could just be scum grasping at each and every straw trying to keep himself in the game. JUST ONE MORE DAY cries the scumbag. (Read: Powerful Wizard Mafia (Andy), Cyclic x.01 (DGB).)

nopoint leave DGB's wordchoices alone. It'd be like trying to burn down my bakeries on the grand opening day.

nopoint wrote:Panda made you sick?

Panda Express, not Toog.

Ludi wrote:I actually find bunnylover's ultra simplistic and circular reasoning town. And it shows an attempt at independent thought. (Re: leaving the forseen wagon, and looking for a better target) It looks town.

This. Bunnylover is always a townread for me because he's so non-complex of a thinker and is easy to follow. I don't think I've ever seen him as scum either when I call him town. B)

Magna wrote:I assume this is hiphop posting. I just want to be clear – both you and Andrius have run afoul of sickness at the same time and are having trouble keeping up with the game for that and other reasons?

Aaaaand goodbye diddin.

Sorry about the funeral, warriormode.
Condolences.

Bunnylover is town.
whispersilk is null leaning scum.
Catchup hasn't happened at all IIRC.
SlySly is leaning town as he cleared up the fail-to-vote-junpei post.
Junpei is questionable as per I said to DGB but leaning scum.

Ghostlin I didn't realize was PLAYING the game to be honest.
Leaning town for reaction to Magna and responding with WELL THIS HERE CASE.
DGB is town as per crypto and her own play, though +sadpoints for not remembering who Andy is. (If she were Plum she'd be lynched by now, but.)

This man prefers a Junpei lynch over the other two.
Shoot before deadline please, Kdub.
Ugh. Though the "LETS TALK ABOUT IT AND VOTE ON WHO DIES" reminds me of OUTSOURCING which is major scumtell.

Ok obv don't shoot StringerBell.


Or shoot him and save the lynch, but.

On my end I'm working on a variant of Magna's plan for claimings and whatnot. It probably won't be better as he played and tested it in the original but I also had a hand with the original so I'm going to look at it too. /BAKER

hiplop agrees that Bunnylover is town, though we're in disagreement on springlullaby.

DGB & Ludi: What do you think of springlullaby?

chkflip: What do you think of StringerBell and FourseenCircumstance? Are you catching up?

Peregrine: Hi! What do you think of Toog and RC?

Is there a case out there in Ludi for 101 courselevelthought or should I reread after I reread II?

We think that Fourseen should be shot, but I prefer Junpei and I think that overall Kdub needs to make the decision and accept the responsibility for the shot regardless of what happens.

whispersilk is also lurkyscum
I'm down to two games at the moment as ANDY so I should be picking up activity here, and hiplop's coming out of sickness so we'll be more active. I was waiting on him last night to compare reads and I went to bed earlier than I ususally do so I apologize for the delay in posting.

-Andrius, who DGB doesn't remember T_T

↑ MagnaofIllusion wrote:
Do you think there would be any potential gain for him as scum to be 'deceptive' about the number of Mafia members in a game he played as a member of the Mafia and is easily publicly accessable? What possibly could that gain be?

First question, I can easily see scum saying something untrue hoping for a lazy town that won't go dig up the truth.

Question 2, I don't know. That's why I brought it up.

When I spot what could be a lie, I inquire. The response helps me determine if it is a lie. If a lie is determined, then I move into motive. Lying is not pro-town.

Rather than try to pick apart MoI's wall, the more revelant points (in my defense):

1) The Junpei muitiple suspicion factor is a scumtell to me like he has a scumtell for...oh, using the phrase 'town v. town' (which I encourage everyone to start using as town) as a scumtell.
2) About half of the suspicions Junpei had I disagreed with. 3 out 7. For sake of argument, 40%. If someone's handing out a 40% bum read accuracy on scum tells, something maybe might be wrong.
3) The scum reasoning for having muitiple tells on many active players is that it permits scum to ignore buddies that may be lurking and a fluidity in wagons. (You can vote anyone if you suspect almost everyone). Thing is, I'm still not sure why I'm explaining this to a player like MoI who's been around more than once, and I thought it was obvious.

About Furcolow: Too dumb for scum isn't an excuse. It had gotten so bad I chose not to ignore it anymore. I find it ironic that we've got maybe technically four days left to deadline, and MoIs jumped on a short wagon (mine) after posting how obviously scummy Stringer is the entire day. A lot of Furc's posts make no sense or are useless like reposting MoI's wall. So I get attacked for four days left in the day, MoI jumps on with four days left, counting the reset...and the reset renders his voice useless.

Kdub, if you want to shoot someone today that's posting but not contributing, I'd recommend Furc.

EBWOP: Oh, what the hell. I'd like to express that



is quality today.

So Sinestro, I am scummy because of your meta and some other guys' meta? And I'm leaning scum but I need to be shot/lynched? Wait a second... you don't have any scum reads stronger than leaning? Wait. I'm your only scum read other than null-scum whisper who has like two posts.

You can do that better than that, surely.

>"though we're in disagreement on springlullaby."

Is hydra dissonance going to be a theme here? I hate hydras...

Wow Ghostlin.. I didn't realize you thought so highly of me... being 40% wrong is indicative that I'm not scumhunting up to my standards? I'm... honored, to say the least. Although, it's more like 40% of my scum reads are your town reads, unless you know that they're town, I don't see how this translates to me intentionally pushing suspicion onto town, and I don't see how suspecting town is scummy inherently unless you consider me as great as you seem to. Finally, the fact that I'm bellowing to kill Fourseen shows that I'm not ignoring lurkers.

I agree, too dumb for scum is not an excuse, I'm assuming then that you support "Lynch Fourseen: 20-11+(4) to lynch"? Or alternatively, for those with less income, "Disregard those saying don't shoot Fourseen, acquire town points".

Andy is Andrius????

Wooot!

Furcolow has three votes!

↑ Junpei wrote:Wow Ghostlin.. I didn't realize you thought so highly of me... being 40% wrong is indicative that I'm not scumhunting up to my standards? I'm... honored, to say the least. Although, it's more like 40% of my scum reads are your town reads, unless you know that they're town, I don't see how this translates to me intentionally pushing suspicion onto town, and I don't see how suspecting town is scummy inherently unless you consider me as great as you seem to. Finally, the fact that I'm bellowing to kill Fourseen shows that I'm not ignoring lurkers.

I agree, too dumb for scum is not an excuse, I'm assuming then that you support "Lynch Fourseen: 20-11+(4) to lynch"? Or alternatively, for those with less income, "Disregard those saying don't shoot Fourseen, acquire town points".

I never said I didn't support the Fourseen lynch. Or shot. In fact if kdub was to flip a coin, both of those would be excellent choice.

Thanks for taking a stance, Ludi, even if it's a reversal of course. I will take it under consideration.

Andy's lack of comment on nopoint in his catchup post is notable, given the nature of the discussion at the moment.

Ah but you haven't clearly articulated your desire to have Fourseen shot today, but now you have. In fact you have explicitly mentioned Fourseen being scummy since your second post (first content post), and you implied him being reasonably scummy in this post.

↑ Junpei wrote:Wow Ghostlin.. I didn't realize you thought so highly of me... being 40% wrong is indicative that I'm not scumhunting up to my standards? I'm... honored, to say the least.

Although, it's more like 40% of my scum reads are your town reads, unless you know that they're town, I don't see how this translates to me intentionally pushing suspicion onto town, and I don't see how suspecting town is scummy inherently unless you consider me as great as you seem to.

Finally, the fact that I'm bellowing to kill Fourseen shows that I'm not ignoring lurkers.

I agree, too dumb for scum is not an excuse, I'm assuming then that you support "Lynch Fourseen: 20-11+(4) to lynch"? Or alternatively, for those with less income, "Disregard those saying don't shoot Fourseen, acquire town points".

This is a WIFOMsque tangle. Let's just say you and I disagree fundamentally on those three reads being accurate to the game state. Although, if you're going to use that logic, MoI really has three points: he disagrees with my read on you as some kind of scum reasoning, he didn't like my focus on you versus Fourseen or my vote hopping to Furc (the last is a pot/kettle moment) and he has a mystical Zang tell that says I'm scum (and a tell from the Workdawg days).

↑ Junpei wrote:Ah but you haven't clearly articulated your desire to have Fourseen shot today, but now you have. In fact you have explicitly mentioned Fourseen being scummy since your second post (first content post), and you implied him being reasonably scummy in this post.

The Fourseen wagon almost died and he vanished after it did. There's not much more I could add to Four's wagon that I haven't already said.

I’ll respond to what little there is to Ghostlin’s ‘defense’ in the morning. Suffice it to say his 'he has three points' summary is misrepresentation and scummy as hell.

--

DGB wrote: Andy is Andrius????

I can’t believe I’m about to do this …



--

Sinestro wrote:4) We're reading. When we read. When I play as a hydra its sort of turned into me sharing the slot instead of coop, as IDEALLY I only have to post half as often,

thus I can put less time and constant effort into the game.

(Read: Nintendo Mafia. I always lurked in the shadows offering opinions to the hydra buddy but never actually did alot of work publically until LyLo when OWNED.)

The bolded is crap. Both of you are wanting to put in less time and effort and what do we get? Crap / non-existent play. Hydras are more time intensive because you not only have to read and stay active but you have to come to a meeting of the minds before actually posting. How this ‘I can hydra when I don’t have the time’ site fairy tale came about I don’t know but I’m going to snuff it out if it kills me.

Sinestro wrote:Well yes but you can still stay Vanilla for a loooong time.

Probably not. You are going to get lynched / killed long before that giving the effort you are. Plus “I’m bored I’m Vanilla WAAAAAHHHAA” is crap. Stop playing Mafia if being Vanilla bores you.

Sinestro wrote:Sweet Magna sees springlullaby_scum too. Awesome.

1. Where do you see that?
2. I’m allergic to buddying. Check

Sinestro wrote:On my end I'm working on a variant of Magna's plan for claimings and whatnot. It probably won't be better as he played and tested it in the original but I also had a hand with the original so I'm going to look at it too. /BAKER

Don’t bother looking to revise the plan. Nothing to be brought to the table and a waste of time / active lurking fodder.

--

Kdub wrote: All this waffling close to the deadline is interesting, but not productive. Of the people who were OK with killing nopoint, a few of jumped off the wagon but haven't given much indication that they have changed their mind about him. Ludi, you're saying you think he is town now, but I've stated that I'm going to shoot him and you are not actively doing anything to dissuade me. It's not a good mindset - "I know this guy is going to die, I suddenly have a town read on him, but I'll go attack someone else without doing anything to prevent his death". If nobody is going to give me a good reason otherwise, I'm still killing nopoint. I'll give people ~6 hours or so from this post. If something warrants it, I can hold off until closer to the deadline, but then people might panic and quicklynch if I take it too close, so I don't want to wait until the absolute last minute.

This is exactly why all the ‘Let’s make it a Double Lynch’ talk was foolish in the first place.

Shoot who you want and deal with fallout, even if it means you need rope. Continuing to run claims up the flag-pole isn’t productive for Town in the least.

--

Magister wrote:Yeah, I don't think you should shoot him. This could be a giant egg on my face if i'm found out to be wrong later in the game, but I strongly discourage you from shooting him. I think how people act when they are close to death reveals more than all sorts of talking beforehand ever could.

I'm sort of scrambling here to find someone who I think is scum, which is pretty unlike myself so late in the game. Magna seems townier now than ever, warrior has flaked until wed and heat has gone off there, nopoint I think is town, and I'm not as sure on slysly anymore (considering he might legitimately be busy)

What I'm trying to do now is speed read this thread to gather myself again. I think I was taken down a route of thinking people who were being confrontational with my own slot were scum, when in reality most scum aren't confrontational at all. So thats where I'm at right now.

This absolutely reeks. “I have no more scum reads and I was fooled because I think everyone who suspects me is Scum because I’m that bad a player.” That’s what you are saying and I don’t buy it in the least.

--

Furc wrote:MoI that could be balanced with a recruiting mechanic

It could be balanced by a lot of things. That said your ‘cult / recruiter’ speculation is more far-fetched than two scum teams or any number of other options.

And why whine about set-up talk when you are doing it yourself. Also hint – scum already have a knowledge advantage of the setup since they know their faction.



--

Junpei wrote:MoI: What is the Zang tell? Is committing the Zang tell enough to lynch Ghostin to you?

It’s fully explained in my case on Ghostlin. Why don’t you read that? Is it enough on it’s own? No, but with Ghostlin it was the straw that tipped him from suspect to full scum read.

Junpei wrote:Here's question for you: If every post I make is pure utter nonsense, and shows a clear lack of complex thought or logic, does that make me town? I believe in innocent until proven guilty, that is golden; but mafia is different, in mafia sometimes you have to lynch the person who shows no signs of guilt, but no signs of innocence. That said, Fourseen has shown some guilt, but you keep ignoring that fact.

No, it doesn’t make you Town it makes you a Moron.

I’ll say this for the last time Junpei – you need to be able to develop a means to read VI players. Just saying ‘He’s terrible, lynch him’ is made of fail.

Junpei wrote:Hider is not as strong as you're implying, are we thinking of the same role? It doesn't confirm town well, and it doesn't confirm scum because we have to specifically direct it, which is dangerous.

See, this is the point where I get frustrated as all fucking hell.

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. It shows and your continued need to argue when you have no understanding drives me up the wall.

In this set-up a Hider like any other investigative role is EVEN STRONGER THAN NORMAL.

1. Any result can be outed THE NEXT DAY for any investigational role. Cops / Trackers / Hiders / Whatever are free to come out and say “Hey, I passed a Cop last night and Player X is Scum / Town”. Without worrying about repercussions since they can’t be killed to stop the Cop skill.
2. The Hider as Stringer described it is the standard one – IT CAN’T BE ROLE-BLOCKED. The only way the holder of the Hide ability doesn’t survive is either being moronic and not submitting or hiding behind scum. Otherwise they are assured to give their “Player X is not scum’ report.
3. But what if they are lying scum you say? Doesn’t matter. The report itself is only relied upon when said player flips or is proven to be Town via other means. Thus the Hider report clearing Player X on Night 1 becomes an absolute clear when the player who gave it flips.
4. The Hider also is almost assured of living to pass the power on. That’s important given that kills resolve before passing.
5. A proven scum Hider claim still bring benefits in the person they pass to being cleared of being in their faction / sacrificed to the ‘Poison’ mechanic.

I could go on but your ‘Hider is weak’ statement show you really haven’t thought about what makes the set-up tick at all.

--

Furc claimed third party. We kill him.

Sinestro/Andy is now gloriously town.

↑ DrippingGoofball wrote:Furc claimed third party. We kill him.

Point out where, that's a novel concept!

↑ MagnaofIllusion wrote:I%u2019ll respond to what little there is to Ghostlin%u2019s %u2018defense%u2019 in the morning. Suffice it to say his 'he has three points' summary is misrepresentation and scummy as hell.

That rhetoric and a buck fifty will buy you a (bad) cup of coffee. For someone who continually goes 'WHERES THE SCUM MOTIVATION, OMG?!', the fact you have an entire tell based on the phrase on someone says really proves you love to talk the talk, but you don't really walk the walk.

Particually when the phrase has been used in the past as a townie going 'look guys, you're both wasting your time savaging yourselves here.'

I'm not downplaying motivation based scumhunting, but I've explained for the third or fourth time motivationally why scum might do some of the things I've accused various players of, and you have a scum tell based on the exact usage of a phrase. That's cognitive dissonance, MoI.

Alright, give me links to show me the difference between scum who act similar to fourseen, and town that do.

As for hider, now that you've explained it I see your point. I did read your Ghostlin case, and I determined that I did not know what the Zang tell was. I'm not going to say "Oh, town v town, ah yes scum!", because I'm not a sheep like the idiots you are claiming to be town, explain to me the SCUM MOTIVATION behind going "X conversation is town v town to me".

One my wagon was based off one of two things: A) My meta game From Toy Story and TV Mafia, maybe even some of my newbie games I'm not sure, or B) becasue of my backpedaling on the the Crypto vote/unvote.

Both Reasons are more policy than any stretch of scum tell. If you look back at what I did in Toy Story mafia, It was almost an incredible gambit of faking watcher landing on the scum which I thought was an amazing guess on my part, and then having the scum down a member. However; the real watcher had to counter claim which wasn't part of my plan and that ruined a lot of things....

In TV Mafia I replaced in like 30 pages or some big number that I can't remember and I should've asked to replaced out immediately.

This is how i play the game, you guys scream policy lynch right away, and that is only going put the town down a person. That said, I do think backpeddling was bad on my part and lurking hasn't been very Good either, but sinnce I am now into the full course load at college things have been a bit busy around here lately. however; I am currently reading the first Cycle game to see how the mechanics and the gameplay worked in that game to get a better feel for how this game will play.

There are people lurking through this game way harder than I am by the way, whispersilk, peregineV, workdawg, and SlySly, So don't go bashing me for being such a horrible lurker when a quarter of the game is lurking.

I think Whispersilk is A good vig target, as well as Furclow for his suspicious 6 person scum team comment, his random claim, and the fact that his claim is a bit too mysterious to be 100% truthful.

Honestly, what happened to the entire game plan of not claiming abilities and what not, passing them on, and then claiming later on passes/abilities? It was one of the things discussed.

↑ DrippingGoofball wrote:Andy is Andrius????

Yes.

Ghostlin wrote:1) The Junpei muitiple suspicion factor is a scumtell to me like he has a scumtell for...oh, using the phrase 'town v. town' (which I encourage everyone to start using as town) as a scumtell.

Dismiss instead of respond. Noted. Facts –

You yourself have practically as many ‘scum’ reads as Junpei. I pointed this out. Yet again – Cognitive Dissonace in full effect. You claim that Junpei having multiple scum reads is scum behavior but you are doing the exact same thing yourself.

Ghostlin wrote:2) About half of the suspicions Junpei had I disagreed with. 3 out 7. For sake of argument, 40%. If someone's handing out a 40% bum read accuracy on scum tells, something maybe might be wrong.

Look, let’s use numbers in a non-meaningful way!

You disagreeing with 40% of Junpei’s reads doesn’t make them ’bum reads’. Sorry to break that to you.

I don’t agree with a large number of your scum reads. This should tell me maybe something might be wrong, correct? Thus my read on you must be accurate. Not really any answer you can give to that statement is there when you are on the other side of the coin. That's why that stance isn't valid.

Have you ever done a survey of Town player’s reads in a Large Theme game to determine whether being 60% accurate (which you are basically saying Junpei is since you don’t disagree on that percentage) is above average or below average? Not that your use of accuracy really means anything at this stage given we have no flips. But suffice it to say you’ve just grabbed the number and ran with it hoping it was big enough to make your stance look good.

Ghostlin wrote:3) The scum reasoning for having muitiple tells on many active players is that it permits scum to ignore buddies that may be lurking and a fluidity in wagons. (You can vote anyone if you suspect almost everyone). Thing is, I'm still not sure why I'm explaining this to a player like MoI who's been around more than once, and I thought it was obvious.

Let’s see …

1. It assumes only Town players are active. Bzzzt … wrong answer there.
2. It assumes that all of Junpei’s reads are active players. Kind of hard to say that your stance is valid without actually showing who of his reads are active versus not. Let’s do that – here is the list of players we agreed were his seven suspicions earlier:

DGB, Toog, Stringer, ML, diddin, Sinestro, Fourseen.

Of those the only players you can say are active players are ML and maybe DGB. And that’s stretching it. So once again – how is Junpei using reads on all the active players?

Yes, that’s the sound of your ‘scum tell’ exploding in the face of actual facts.

Oh … I also notice you don’t even try to address the inherent scumminess of using Fate’s meta against Junpei and the extra scumminess of doing it in such a clearly self-serving way. I’ll just assume you know I’m right and just hope it dropped into the abyss.

Ghostlin wrote:I find it ironic that we've got maybe technically four days left to deadline, and MoIs jumped on a short wagon (mine) after posting how obviously scummy Stringer is the entire day.

Yes, ignore the developments in thread (such as Stringer’s claim that we absolutely should not lynch / kill based on the role) and try to say that I’m abandoning my read to just attack you out of the blue. Ignore I’ve been questioning you and calling your behavior suspect since you replaced it.

Ghostlin wrote:MoI really has three points: he disagrees with my read on you as some kind of scum reasoning, he didn't like my focus on you versus Fourseen or my vote hopping to Furc (the last is a pot/kettle moment) and he has a mystical Zang tell that says I'm scum (and a tell from the Workdawg days).

Not even close and scummy of you to try and represent that case as such.

The case on you is made up of many elements -

Cognitive Dissonance from workdawg's Crypto and ML reads.
Cognitive Dissonance from you regarding 'having too many scum reads'.
Failure to authentically scumhunt. You've coasted and not pushed a single one of your scum-reads.
Outsized reaction to a single vote.
Surivivalistic play in not wanting to push a perceived 'hard target' in Magister.
Use of meta from a single Fate game as 'evidence' against Junpei.
Inability to justify why Junpei is scummy for having his reads - when questioned the goalposts and your 'reasoning' move each time.

Ghostlin wrote:That rhetoric and a buck fifty will buy you a (bad) cup of coffee. For someone who continually goes 'WHERES THE SCUM MOTIVATION, OMG?!', the fact you have an entire tell based on the phrase on someone says really proves you love to talk the talk, but you don't really walk the walk.

Strawman away!!!! My case showing your scummy behavior isn’t based only on the Zang tell.

Ghostlin wrote:I'm not downplaying motivation based scumhunting, but I've explained for the third or fourth time motivationally why scum might do some of the things I've accused various players of, and you have a scum tell based on the exact usage of a phrase. That's cognitive dissonance, MoI.

Do you understand what Cognitive Dissoance is? I ask because your use in the last sentence shows you don’t. I have a Tell based on scum buddying up to players / seeking Town cred by calling Town versus Town conflicts just that. My view of that hardly qualifies as CD.

Please continue to whine about how ‘It’s based on a exact usage of a phrase’. I enjoy the flailing.

↑ Junpei wrote:Also, how did you know about kdub's claim by page 8?

Is this some retarded "scum slip" you're trying to catch me in? Clearly I've been trying to keep up with current pages, I'm just the type that prefers to go back and go over everything I've missed. This seems like a silly ass post, sir. ~

Sinestro wrote:chkflip: What do you think of StringerBell and FourseenCircumstance? Are you catching up?

Jesus, did all of two people read my last post? I give opinion, clearly, on both of them as of P10 in my reading. Working on a post up to P20 now, but I'm Skype'ing with a lady and cba to do both at once so it'll come in late tonight or tomorrow afternoon during class.

, I'm sorry? You haven't done anything I saw as substantially noteworthy as of P10. I'll keep my eye on you if you'd like, though? This too reads like such an off thing to say.

YOU'RE ALL CRAZY. [/sarcasm]

↑ chkflip wrote:

↑ Junpei wrote:Also, how did you know about kdub's claim by page 8?

Is this some retarded "scum slip" you're trying to catch me in? Clearly I've been trying to keep up with current pages, I'm just the type that prefers to go back and go over everything I've missed. This seems like a silly ass post, sir.

IGMEOY

~

Uhm, what? Yes, I can see it now, allow me to replay the conversation that may have occured with your premonition:

Junpei >How did you know about kdub's claim by page 8?
chkflip >I have been keeping up with recent pages
Junpei >Ah.. ahah! I knew it, you are scum!

Okay, I couldn't come up with anything for the third line. Honestly the way you are getting over-defensive about a harmless question is a bit ridiculous. Yes I could infer that you were keeping up with recent pages, but then why bother making a point of going "OKAY, NOW I'M ON PAGE 5 AND HERE IS WHAT I SEE..." if you have already seen page 20? I don't like your catchup method anyway, I'd rather you just read the thread and post a cumulative post with reads and analysis than that.