Mafiascum.net

Even if it was an AI thing we need people who like scum more than town.

(I prefer scum but enjoy town a lot too.)

In post 793, Lukewarm wrote:

In post 788, Datisi wrote:

In post 784, Lukewarm wrote:I am considering moving my vote to meg, which, I

know

.

I was the one saying Chaos>Meg, and now people are moving my way, but yeah.

x.x

what's your opinion on the newer stuff that meg's posted?

Their read list in 509 578 felt made up.

The exact single line on each and every player I think is part of what makes it seem manufactured, because I feel like the average player actually has lots and lots of thoughts on some slots, but then not very many thoughts on others. So, the single line on each feels more like someone trying to manufacture a read list.

And even following that, it has taken questions for Meg to expound on things. And the way they have expounded, feels more like a conversation in abstraction then how they feel about each player they are talking about. Like, why each action could be read the way they read them in the read lists, as opposed to what they think about each player.

In post 610, MegAzumarill wrote:I'm fine to be today's mislim but I would like to discuss my analysis more in depth, especially when more people are online.

Try to curb your trigger happy hammering and not cut the day short, I have more to say but the discussion will take some time.

This line did nothing for me, and looks like just trying to buy time, and does not give me town feels

I like this post a lot, town points for Luke for efforting in his reads. The particular reasons Luke is pointing out to suspect Meg don't seem to me like like the kind of reasons scum would use to manufacture a scumread.

In post 798, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 791, MathBlade wrote:

In post 785, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 660, MathBlade wrote:last few posts are pretty bad. Gamma's played with me enough to know that I'm top tier scum so if Gamma genuinely thought I was scum I think he'd go back and make a genuine case. I'm going to stick with town for now, but that read is degrading fast.

I’m not quite certain you’re scum, I just think your theory crafting is off base in a way that indicates you have low expectations for the quality of tris’ modding, and imo there’s no reason for you to feel that way

1) Poking a setup of which I believe to still be within the normal rules is not an attack on the quality of Tris’s modding. The entire point was I thought this was going to be similar to extra communication mafia and subvert expectations.

2) I literally just got done with a game where the mods gave town way too much power. The literal name of the game with the past few games I have been in is subvert expectations. It was in Calculasia and Boonskiies to name a few.

3) I have never been in a tris game before and not giving scum a PT imho is a brilliant setup design plan. I do not consider it “not mafia” as the mod said.

I think this post is disgusting as fuck here. Like you seriously make up crap about me not having scumread Chaos and now you’re poking at a bear long since dead? Are you trying to piss me off here? It’s working.

Tbh I don’t have an issue with the theory about no Mafia PT, though I don’t think that would pass either. My problem was with you thinking using Discord as a substitute in order to subvert expectations would be something any normal reviewer would pass. Expectations can be subverted in normals but telling what is in essence a mod lie is not what I’d consider fair game.
And like, I kinda don’t care that you think my post is “disgusting” when IMO your own actions have felt pretty terrible.

Maybe the discord idea was bad.
I was more thinking in the moment.

That idea still doesn’t attack Tris as a person/mod.

I do not think subverting expectation setups is a bad thing for a mod to do when done well.
I hypothesize setups all the time. Some are good some are bad.

Why are you so hung up on my actions being terrible?
Taking mod information and figuring out what it means is our job.

I will not ever apologize for trying to brainstorm possibilities.
I don’t see how I could have offended anyone here but if I did I will apologize to them post game.

Now if you scumread me let’s talk about something we can actually talk about here. If you think I am scum point out what is scummy. If you think I am a gigantic asshole be better than me.

Because right now it feels like at best you’re policying me or scumreading me because I suggested weird shit versus actually scumreading me for play reasons.

In post 800, Vulture wrote:Even if it was an AI thing we need people who like scum more than town.

(I prefer scum but enjoy town a lot too.)

*cough* I enjoy scum more than town *cough*

I’m not pushing you or voting you, I’m just saying I don’t like the fact you thought something that borders on bastard modding would be allowed in a normal
Maybe I should save it for postgame I guess, but I kinda felt incensed because IMO you should definitely know better. What I guess I’m looking for rn is an admittance that the discord thing would not fly because of how it would be a mod lie in a normal game
Which I guess your last post might have kinda, but it doesn’t feel like you actually grasp WHY the discord idea was bad
Let’s say I modded a normal game where I said there were no Cops, but included a role that well and truly was a substitute for a Cop. That seems like a bit of a bad modding choice right? Now take a second to realize Discord isn’t a part of the site, and does it now seem clearer why using that to upend speculation would be such a no-go?

In post 804, Gamma Emerald wrote:I’m not pushing you or voting you, I’m just saying I don’t like the fact you thought something that borders on bastard modding would be allowed in a normal
Maybe I should save it for postgame I guess, but I kinda felt incensed because IMO you should definitely know better. What I guess I’m looking for rn is an admittance that the discord thing would not fly because of how it would be a mod lie in a normal game
Which I guess your last post might have kinda, but it doesn’t feel like you actually grasp WHY the discord idea was bad
Let’s say I modded a normal game where I said there were no Cops, but included a role that well and truly was a substitute for a Cop. That seems like a bit of a bad modding choice right? Now take a second to realize Discord isn’t a part of the site, and does it now seem clearer why using that to upend speculation would be such a no-go?

I don’t think the first is a bit of a bastard modding choice. Setups (even normals) do this all the time. If told the setup included no cops but included a PT cop or gunsmith or investigative that seems fine to me even though they are usually functionally the same. Rules are meant to be taken literally and this is the same issue I have with Warehouse 13. The moment you expect players to understand what you’re saying versus just saying it it’s a bad idea.

The discord part would be a bit more bastard though because a discord isn’t in the normal list.

I get extremely paranoid of how people take things and the drop a misleading setup spec idea is a common trick of my scum play so I am hyper vigilant for it.

I apologize if I seem like I was accusing Tris of bastard modding and I mean nothing of the sort.

Fwiw I am regularly surprised at how ill-informed players are about the boundaries of Normal games, and I don't think the Discord theory is much more egregious than other examples of that even though it's obviously wrong

Gamma, it seems like Math has already conceded the point that such a setup is unlikely-to-impossible, why (within the context of the game) do you need any more from him than that?

You know that this setup possesses both a role that can determine whether a player is aligned with the Council of Calculasia and a role that can determine other players' effective role. These roles may be possessed by a single player or by multiple players, and they may or may not be modified.

This is what I was informed of In Calculasia word.
Given our roles this is essentially two cops since our effective roles were guilties.

So practical example from a recent game

In post 806, Umlaut wrote:Gamma, it seems like Math has already conceded the point that such a setup is unlikely-to-impossible, why (within the context of the game) do you need any more from him than that?

I don’t want to have a potential repeat scenario in the future

Look there may be issues where I get too paranoid
Where something is wrong and I accept that because I am an odd ball player

When I was a loyal motion detector with Grendel I got a result that seemed to confirm Grendel scum
But we talked it out and realized it wasn’t and went back and elimmed Titus and she flipped scum

In Undertale Mafia I found the only goddamn scum in a game of 20+ because of this paranoia. It fell apart afterward because I spent all my emotional energy getting the elim and I trusted practically no one because of how hard I had to fuckin beg.

Yeah I may be weird and sometimes my theories are wrong but I will never ever apologize for doing so when if I am wrong I can be corrected and there is literally no harm done.

So I always do theorize about what the actual minimum we know is and work from truth because it’s what we know.

Yeah I am the fuckin weirdo but I am your safety net. My experience with all sorts of setups makes me alert for things other players miss.

I may have Charisma as my freakin dump stat but I am working on it.

Now, do you scumread me? Bring it back to something content related.

In post 723, Prism wrote:

In post 694, Datisi wrote:i can see my tone seeming like that, but that is just How I Talk and if this game turns into me having to dig ten billion meta examples of me Talking Like That i am gonna scream. though i'm not sure how you remembering

a more paranoid datisi makes you ease up on that read?

and sorry, what question was i avoiding there?

The more paranoid/offset Datisi was my original "This post to MathBlade is weird?"

The paranoid/offset Datisi kicks in the opposite direction when he is more concerned about my alignment/SvS wagons than afraid of me.

The more I think about this, the better I feel about it. I think a scum Datisi does not have a very good time upon seeing me replace-in, and that pressure would weigh a lot more heavily than it did on him here.

Does anyone disagree with Datisi-town here?

I also really don't think Aristeia goes this far out of their way against me Day 1 as scum. There's SvS shenanigans with burning a tell+wanting me out but there's really no point; just let me lead on town Day 1 then go on me Day 2. Perhaps I'm wrong and them being this serious is a scumtell. I'm also bothered by the linkage between me/Meg given how tenuous Meg being scum is to begin with, but oversold confidence is part of the schtick.

This one is more likely to burn me than Datisi but again I feel good about it. If anyone has a more solid read on the slot let me know.

I don't know how to feel about Lukewarm without the whole game. I thought he was threaddodging but it is unfair to expect him to revisit this game before posting in the others. I just expected an instant response+a followup later.

In post 810, Prism wrote:

In post 723, Prism wrote:

In post 694, Datisi wrote:i can see my tone seeming like that, but that is just How I Talk and if this game turns into me having to dig ten billion meta examples of me Talking Like That i am gonna scream. though i'm not sure how you remembering

a more paranoid datisi makes you ease up on that read?

and sorry, what question was i avoiding there?

The more paranoid/offset Datisi was my original "This post to MathBlade is weird?"

The paranoid/offset Datisi kicks in the opposite direction when he is more concerned about my alignment/SvS wagons than afraid of me.

The more I think about this, the better I feel about it. I think a scum Datisi does not have a very good time upon seeing me replace-in, and that pressure would weigh a lot more heavily than it did on him here.

Does anyone disagree with Datisi-town here?

I am good with Datisi Town going to have to catch up with his responses after work. I think his logic/reads/tells are flawed but I don’t think he’s scum for it.

Really hoping for more from Chaos soon, but I'm actually really pleased with how this general approach to the game has worked so far. At least before I get the pie in my face.

In post 812, MathBlade wrote:I am good with Datisi Town going to have to catch up with his responses after work. I think his logic/reads/tells are flawed but I don’t think he’s scum for it.

I really appreciate you answering this; I know I've ignored your slot so far+will surely do so again at times but I promise I will do my best to get to your broader view of the game sooner rather than later. I'm glad you're still willing to dialogue with me post-Warehouse regardless of alignment.

I am curious as to why Datisi is town over null for you.

There’s a lot of reasons why but there’s certain things I find mid level scum don’t do because it would be harder of themselves. If Titus made post 512 it’s NAI but I haven’t seen Datisi do a Titus level scum game.

There’s also Star Wars reasons but you’ll see it on read. That’s all I should say there.

In post 791, MathBlade wrote:

In post 785, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 660, MathBlade wrote:last few posts are pretty bad. Gamma's played with me enough to know that I'm top tier scum so if Gamma genuinely thought I was scum I think he'd go back and make a genuine case. I'm going to stick with town for now, but that read is degrading fast.

I’m not quite certain you’re scum, I just think your theory crafting is off base in a way that indicates you have low expectations for the quality of tris’ modding, and imo there’s no reason for you to feel that way

1) Poking a setup of which I believe to still be within the normal rules is not an attack on the quality of Tris’s modding. The entire point was I thought this was going to be similar to extra communication mafia and subvert expectations.

2) I literally just got done with a game where the mods gave town way too much power. The literal name of the game with the past few games I have been in is subvert expectations. It was in Calculasia and Boonskiies to name a few.

3) I have never been in a tris game before and not giving scum a PT imho is a brilliant setup design plan. I do not consider it “not mafia” as the mod said.

I think this post is disgusting as fuck here. Like you seriously make up crap about me not having scumread Chaos and now you’re poking at a bear long since dead? Are you trying to piss me off here? It’s working.

It's not disgusting as fuck to call out someone's theory you find ridiculous.

@Gamma, Math tends to be more like this as town.

In post 795, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 752, Titus wrote:Of course, I am supposing a competent scumteam and an incompetent or disabled town when I say that.

wat

I'm jaded I know.

In post 816, Titus wrote:

In post 791, MathBlade wrote:

In post 785, Gamma Emerald wrote:

In post 660, MathBlade wrote:last few posts are pretty bad. Gamma's played with me enough to know that I'm top tier scum so if Gamma genuinely thought I was scum I think he'd go back and make a genuine case. I'm going to stick with town for now, but that read is degrading fast.

I’m not quite certain you’re scum, I just think your theory crafting is off base in a way that indicates you have low expectations for the quality of tris’ modding, and imo there’s no reason for you to feel that way

1) Poking a setup of which I believe to still be within the normal rules is not an attack on the quality of Tris’s modding. The entire point was I thought this was going to be similar to extra communication mafia and subvert expectations.

2) I literally just got done with a game where the mods gave town way too much power. The literal name of the game with the past few games I have been in is subvert expectations. It was in Calculasia and Boonskiies to name a few.

3) I have never been in a tris game before and not giving scum a PT imho is a brilliant setup design plan. I do not consider it “not mafia” as the mod said.

I think this post is disgusting as fuck here. Like you seriously make up crap about me not having scumread Chaos and now you’re poking at a bear long since dead? Are you trying to piss me off here? It’s working.

It's not disgusting as fuck to call out someone's theory you find ridiculous.

@Gamma, Math tends to be more like this as town.

It’s not that he’s calling out the theory it’s that he is implying I am attacking the mod that’s disgusting.

In post 818, MathBlade wrote:It’s not that he’s calling out the theory it’s that he is implying I am attacking the mod that’s disgusting.

Yes, take a moment to see his perspective. You're posting something so bizarre and ridiculous that no competent mod would pass as normal. By suggesting it, you're suggesting that tris is not a competent mod. I think there's a few gaps in reasoning but it's not disgusting.

In post 819, Titus wrote:

In post 818, MathBlade wrote:It’s not that he’s calling out the theory it’s that he is implying I am attacking the mod that’s disgusting.

Yes, take a moment to see his perspective. You're posting something so bizarre and ridiculous that no competent mod would pass as normal. By suggesting it, you're suggesting that tris is not a competent mod. I think there's a few gaps in reasoning but it's not disgusting.

Ugh I just really need to stop posting.

Can you go steal me some scum? Right now you are kinda scattershot and it’s hard to focus when you are.

In post 820, MathBlade wrote:

In post 819, Titus wrote:

In post 818, MathBlade wrote:It’s not that he’s calling out the theory it’s that he is implying I am attacking the mod that’s disgusting.

Yes, take a moment to see his perspective. You're posting something so bizarre and ridiculous that no competent mod would pass as normal. By suggesting it, you're suggesting that tris is not a competent mod. I think there's a few gaps in reasoning but it's not disgusting.

Ugh I just really need to stop posting.

Can you go steal me some scum? Right now you are kinda scattershot and it’s hard to focus when you are.

I'm assembling the team. I can determine the mark if I must but that's not really my thing.

In post 821, Titus wrote:

In post 820, MathBlade wrote:

In post 819, Titus wrote:

In post 818, MathBlade wrote:It’s not that he’s calling out the theory it’s that he is implying I am attacking the mod that’s disgusting.

Yes, take a moment to see his perspective. You're posting something so bizarre and ridiculous that no competent mod would pass as normal. By suggesting it, you're suggesting that tris is not a competent mod. I think there's a few gaps in reasoning but it's not disgusting.

Ugh I just really need to stop posting.

Can you go steal me some scum? Right now you are kinda scattershot and it’s hard to focus when you are.

I'm assembling the team. I can determine the mark if I must but that's not really my thing.

Not asking for you to find the right recipe just clean up the damn kitchen of all the noise so I can Sophie easier. You asked me to do something that’s almost impossible while not misleading Town. Don’t make it harder for me.

If you don’t understand ignore this and I will move on.

In post 822, MathBlade wrote:Not asking for you to find the right recipe just clean up the damn kitchen of all the noise so I can Sophie easier.

Working on stopping TvTs. Work with my TRs. Push your scumread that matches their pools. That'll help. You're near obvious town and your frustration is obviously townie. You don't need to be right. You just need to be full of hugs and rainbows. Being right helps.

Alright that’s a hell of a lot easier than what I thought you were asking of me.