Mafiascum.net

VP Baltar wrote:

AV wrote:You might think Furc = town was "obvious," but I didn't see you logically proving it to convince others to unvote him.

He claimed a fucking ward and a mod error with that ward AND that he didn't hear noise even though he didn't know the rules had changed regarding ward. Does it really take someone spelling it out before people can get that? I don't think there is anything that could be more obvious than Furc's investigator status and I'm suspicious of the people that were trying their damndest to shovel shit on him because they know they can rile him up and potentially get him mislynched.

Re: posts/pages
My point is that it shouldn't have taken actual town 20 pages to figure out Furc is town. You appear to have explained it before SpyreX, which is fine, but that only makes it slightly better imo. I feel that your first post was definitely meant to test the waters of calling him scummy. Why else would you "offer reasons" for him to be all three alignments without taking a solid stance on his alignment? All of the same evidence has been there from the beginning.

RC wrote:

LB wrote: going, "LOL, Lost Butterfly is scum because it's schizo and contradicts itself" is shallow analysis when two people will obviously never have the same opinions 100% of the time.

So you think you can just say this, and then suddenly you'll be able to backtrack as much as you want without suspicion?

Cool story bro.

Basically. Excuse making at its finest. "Just because we flop positions to fit the changing of the tides doesn't make us scummy because we're a hydra." ffff

Also,

Unvote, Vote: Lost Butterfly

This is a fight I definitely want to get into and a place people should be paying more attention. I know I'm not going to out word Mina, but I'd like to highlight some important quotes later today or tomorrow so people can see what I'm talking about. In the meantime, wagon ho!

xvart wrote:Furc 795 - I applaud your effort in posting multiple thoughts in one post. I also enjoyed your misrep about me saying I was too good to answer MoI's question. The biggest thing I'll note is that my plan, however flawed it might be in your eyes, would absolutely guarantee you to not have insanities if you don't. You don't even suggest that it is okay with you for my plan, even though it would completely clear you of what I am accusing you of. Even a Cult Member would say, "go ahead and Book me" if he/she did not have an insanity.

VasudeVa wrote:

MagnaofIllusion wrote:You think I’m not playing aggressively when any number of people have attacked me for being too aggressive regarding Furc? Cool story bro.

It doesn't matter what other people think. What matters is I'm seeing some indications that your Furc-agressiveness may have been faked, and now that Furc's near-unanimously believed to be Town, you're looking for something to do. So you follow on Spy to vote on AV. However, the problem is that lacks the usual MoI Town-aggression I've seen before~. It reeks of buddy distancing, I tellz ya.

Wouldn't the appropriate place for you vote be on the person he is distancing from (AV), since your case hinges on AV being scum?

Lost Butterfly, 799 wrote:Honestly, would people be interested in giant cases from me tomorrow night (I'd saved what I'd written on kunkstar and xvart last night, and there's stuff I'd like to call attention to from other players), or is everyone just overwhelmed by all the wall posting? If it weren't against every fibre of my nature, I'd almost say we should move on with a lynch as quickly as possible just to get a flip and keep the game from stagnating. (If we decide on that route, then I'd direct my attention to players who are being wagoned instead.

I actually thought what you posted was your case; but I would certainly be interested in any more details you might have for the case on me, provided Faraday isn't going to come in on Tuesday and say the opposite.

Lost Butterfly, 799 wrote:

@ xvart and MoI - What do you think of Lost Butterfly? Do their conflicting posts bother you?

You know, I'm debating how much I should defend against this, because I think I'd be more interested in hearing how xvart and MagnaofIllusion answer when they reread.

1

I will say that the questions you should be asking should be:

2

-Does Faraday's 180 on Furcolow OR my consistent defence of Furcolow before and after Faraday's vote have a scum or town motivation? And is either scummy enough to negate the other head's behaviour?

3

-Is it a significant scumtell that Faraday voted before discussing it with me in the QT or waiting for me to wake up?

4

-Is it scummy that Faraday didn't think of how it would look for an account to vote for a player it had just defended before (even if new information had come about)?

5

-Is it scummy that I contradicted him in the thread in order to enforce my own beliefs and/or do damage control?

6

-What scum agenda would be furthered by our switching back and forth like that within a day?

7

-Do you think I've secretly been pretending to be Faraday the whole time so as to fool people?

And maybe Faraday should be the one explaining his own thought patterns and motivations.

But just going, "LOL, Lost Butterfly is scum because it's schizo and contradicts itself" is shallow analysis when two people will obviously never have the same opinions 100% of the time.

1

I actually already gave my initial impressions, here.

2

Guided questions are not your friend in this case.

3

If one individual playing under one account were to say "XXX is scum" and "XXX is town" for different reasons it would be called fence sitting; especially during the time that the Fuculow opinions were being thrown out. Just because there are two people on one account is not a free pass and does not excuse having contradictory reads.

4

Is it a significant scumtell? So you agree that it is a scumtell, just not a big one? Also, from everyone else's eyes, this is unprovable (although possibly likely since you two have drastically different timezones); but still, this isn't a solid defense.

5

He should have thought about it, since we had this exact conversation at the end of post game discussion in the game he modded.

6

Yes. The admittance to doing "damage control" is especially scummy. What damage were you controlling and why did it need your immediate attention without consulting with Faraday first.

7

Like I said, fence sitting; which has more scum motivation than town motivation.

As I said in my previous post, I don't think you (Mina) would maliciously game a hydra that way; but with this recent post I'm starting to believe that it was an unexpected byproduct of being a scum hydra in different time zones.

Lost Butterfly, 805 wrote:Except that's not really what happened, is it?

That is exactly what happened: your account flip flopped reads on a lightning rod at the time. I don't think you intended it to occur that way but your defense and guided questions for our consumption and direction is inherently scummy. It's like you got busted for something you don't think you should have been busted for.

VOTE: Lost Butterfly

Feysal wrote:

totallynotmafia #774 wrote:I'm not sure I understand you, but are you basically saying the grave robber will rob two graves each night and thus have no room for other night actions? (not sure how you're so certain there will be more than one death each night) My understanding of the rules is that you can only rob one grave each night, and the free action from robbing a grave is for any other action

It is not necessary to have two graves to rob every night. Every other night is enough, since Stalk and Murder have to happen on consecutive nights. Also it is in the rules, under Questions and Answers, that Rob Grave can be used multiple times per night.

Triglav #789 wrote:

Furpants_Tom #766 wrote:Re: Feysal's post - are you talking about #504 or #539? I'm not sure I can see the logical inconsistency you're talking about. His position on Furcolow is that the mistake is such an unlikely cult gambit that it virtually confirms his townieness, even if it is logically possible he's scum, right? Where's the red flag?

#539 - look again, makes comment to Seacore saying "Furc is sooooo obv. town, amirite?" immediate next quote responses are agreements with MoI on his points against furc. Reads as defense while straddling lines for later possible shift. Not a fan of it.

Actually, Furpants_Tom has it right. I was defending Furcolow at the time, and that meant responding to the points brought against him by MoI. I read the first point as Furcolow making other posts while avoiding to answer who he warded, and I had to check to see this wasn't the case. I'd misunderstood what MoI was saying, and so I found the point inconclusive. The second point where Furcolow defended himself with timing was just silly, and of course I agreed when MoI called it comedy gold, but I still did not think it meant anything. For the record, I firmly believe Furcolow to be an Investigator, and though there exists a possibility of him having murderous plans, I find it remote.

ReaperCharlie #792 wrote:I do have a question for you, though: What would you think if you rezzed Fate tonight, but Benmage was dead by morning?

Benmage won't be dead by morning. He heard no noise, and thus cannot be killed. If he died, he'd have lied about the noise.

Furcolow #795 wrote:

SCUMSLIP

"you are town play is good Baltar"? Fatescum.
Maybe benmage was right and we should just lynch him(fate!)

You haven't made much sense before, but seriously, suspecting someone because of an obvious grammar mistake? Really.

As for xvart, I'll have to do an ISO on him to see if there's any basis for these suspicions I've seen on him.

Lost Butterfly #799 wrote:Feysal, I agree with your last paragraph that the best idea is for Benmage just not to kill (but SSBF to resurrect Fate just in case Ben decides to be an idiot), but what was the point of writing yet

another

giant wall post with no suspects, but lots more "protown" looking theory?

My best strength is in game mechanics, and so I took a moment to analyze the whole Benmage/Fate situation and posted about it. That was all there was to it. As for actual scum hunting, I admit I've been lacking there. I've only had time for one read-through, and while I did get some reads from it, I really need to do an ISO on a few people to sort out my thoughts regarding them. You can expect to hear my thoughts on Seacore, Baby Spice and xvart in a few hours, once I read through their posts again.

Plum wrote:

El Goosuki wrote:I'd like to line up lynches from whoever has the highest word count in this game, to whoever has the least.

Unfortunately that puts our basically confirmed Investigator Furcolow right at the top of the list

Fur wrote:where were you at when i tried to wagon them for two days?
if you want to lynch LB, there are many lynches that indicate their alignment which are less hurtful on the town if LB is an investigator (baby spice, seacore, fate) in my opinion

im still fairly happy with a lynch on LB, i've been pushing that nearly all day.

El Goosuki wrote:Yellow reads does irritate me.

VOTE: AurorusVox

AV wrote:VP, do you want Wicked's particular version of the Benmage plan, or will any do? I think mine is a pretty fine version, because it accounts for Fate and Ben being town/town, town/scum, and scum/town.

xvart wrote:I also want to note that I don't like SSBF's vote on Bowser with the context of his previous observation on Trigalov. I am of the opinion that Trigalov is also guilty of minimal posting and providing content in the flurry and smoke screen of posting and fighting. SSBF notes that Trigalov is coasting and CSL has dropped in activity to melt suspicion (essentially the same outcome for both player slots) but his suspicions of Trigalov has more meat behind it in this post. I do recognize that SSBF has posted suspicion of Bowser earlier, but there is something in his recent post that just doesn't sit right with me and the way it was presented.

Triglav wrote:Everyone needs to stop posting till we catch up.

ReaperCharlie wrote:I do have a question for you, though: What would you think if you rezzed Fate tonight, but Benmage was dead by morning?

I mean, the whole plan would be kinda busted, and Fate wouldn't even be confirmed town.

Perfect cult way to ruin all our plans, right?

VasudeVa wrote:Nah, that Furc vote was all I needed. I've skimmed it, but I didn't understand. I think that anyone who dared attempt to vote for Furcolow SHOULD be put under some scrutiny because they're either: Scum or Stupid. When people started nitpicking Furc's "EL GOOSUKI BUT I TARGETED DRIPPERETH", I imagined scum partying in their Cult QT doing virgin sacrifices and having orgies thanking Cthulhu for an easy mislynch. (Note: I have no real knowledge of Lovecraftian stuff, just some shitty stock knowledge.)

Lost Butterfly wrote:Honestly, would people be interested in giant cases from me tomorrow night (I'd saved what I'd written on kunkstar and xvart last night, and there's stuff I'd like to call attention to from other players), or is everyone just overwhelmed by all the wall posting?

rewq455 wrote:It would prove that BenMage is town if he murders Fate. Any confirmed non-cult helps town, and by doing so hurts the cult. Do you not want to do something to help town?

El Goosuki wrote:I'd like to line up lynches from whoever has the highest word count in this game, to whoever has the least.

Triglav wrote:This presumption is based on a concept that all the heads read and post indepednantly in order to generate more posts then a regular account.
We tend to get together in a QT to share thoughts in order to avoid too many "lol different head different opinion lol" posts.

Furcolow wrote:WHAT THE HELL IS THIS? AS SOON AS I UNVOTE MY BANDWAGON PEOPLE STEAL IT?

VP Baltar, 822 wrote:I can see where they are going with it. It's a null-point.

Furcolow, 825 wrote:3) triglav's vote is with who? oh, yeah, lost butterfly. and the "confirmed" townie he is trying to use to cast suspicion on xvart... me. I guess I just misread xvart as being too helpful to be town, but i guess that's just how he is. he must work in an office or something

Furcolow, 827 wrote:im pretty happy where we're at, but xvart needs to learn to not just cast votes on people who vote him
he does that every game

xvart, 807 wrote:The biggest thing I'll note is that my plan, however flawed it might be in your eyes, would absolutely guarantee you to not have insanities if you don't. You don't even suggest that it is okay with you for my plan, even though it would completely clear you of what I am accusing you of. Even a Cult Member would say, "go ahead and Book me" if he/she did not have an insanity.

xvart wrote:I can see where they are going, too; but I want them to spell out why they are asking; it might not be null.

Furcolow wrote:

xvart wrote:

AurorusVox wrote:And I've already pointed out two flaws in xvart's plan, so no, it's not a good idea.

But the flaws are flaws in determining if he is Cult; not determining if he is lying investigator going Murderer. The general consensus is that he is fairly cleared of being Cult, so that is almost a moot point. My point in my last post was that the plan was better when it could catch Cult and Murderer (if in the off chance the town's nonCult read of Furcolow is wrong). I still think it's a good plan because he is lying and most likely already has an insanity. Fate does not have an insanity. Commune will show if Fucolow is an Investigator going Murderer.

xvart.

too bad this is WIFOM because there is an insanity which delays a day

ReaperCharlie wrote:

Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:Getting a feeling that Triglav is trying to coast through this game. His latest posts sounds like a bit of mimicking off other people instead of actually providing his own thoughts in the game. When examining what they post, it feels more artifical then those of the other hydra, as if they are trying too hard to agree on everything instead of taking risks and posting their individual thoughts on the game. This is probably gut, but it's not giving me good feelings.

This paragraph in #779 is beautiful. And overall I get the awesometown feel from most if not all of #779.

ReaperCharlie wrote:

Lost Butterfly wrote:going, "LOL, Lost Butterfly is scum because it's schizo and contradicts itself" is shallow analysis when two people will obviously never have the same opinions 100% of the time.

So you think you can just say this, and then suddenly you'll be able to backtrack as much as you want without suspicion?

Cool story bro.

xvart [emphasis ours] wrote:[Triglav's] initial vote on me had terrible justifications. Like I said, the list was going to be made, there is no doubt about that, so you voted for something that was not a scumtell. It's not a towntell, either;

but the fact that you don't assert with any sort of backup that I was going crazy to be the first person to post the list

in an attempt to look town by being helpful or that I needed crazy town points because of evidence A, B, and C does not help your case.

xvart wrote:I find it strange that you did not include me on your "oddest furc commentors" since you have a vote on me and I have been one of the biggest "lynch Furcolow" commentors even after everyone else had moved on.

xvart wrote:Maybe it is because you have only posted three times, but are alluding that you might make contradictory reads in the future? I don't understand the basis for this comment, considering both player slots in totality of content presented.

Super Smash Bros. Fan wrote:

Triglav wrote:Everyone needs to stop posting till we catch up.

How about finding a way to catch up faster? We don't need to wait on one person to catch up just to play the game.

VP Baltar wrote:Ok, so the murder goes through before the ritual, meaning that Fate can state if he was attempted murdered. What if cult kill him on top of that just to make Ben look bad? I assume the rez would stop the murder first and then it would look like he was cult killed. Though I guess SSBF then claims if he rezzed or not....though the greater ritual would negate that too. I'm also still not sure on the significance of SSBF doing the rezzing, or does that not matter.

Triglav wrote:Also, Triglav

should manage to stay sexy

for rest of game.

Triglav wrote:We are

Adel, Albert B. Rampage, Zorblag, and Ythan

(twice).

AurorusVox wrote:=_=" I forgot about the triple threat of fetishes. AND I guess a fellow cultist could pass him a fetish of himself. Right, well #2 is off the table then.

Luckily, I've discovered a way to make #1 work that is still ethical.

We instruct Ben to launder N4 and investigate him for blood that night too, to see if he picked Mutilation. The results should be Bloody N3 and Not Bloody N4. Is there a way around that?

xvart #331 wrote:...

Baby Spice

- No Noises (308),

Warded

(308)
...

xvart

-

Heard Noises

(52),

Warded

(52)

xvart #347 wrote:I only posted the wards for the people who claimed them. Baby Spice also did not claim her ward target. At the time (and even now) I didn't know if claiming the ward target is in the town's best interest. I have no problem claiming my ward target. I do think we should come to a consensus about warding targets, but I'll defer to the setup freaks in the room on this one.

xvart #603 wrote:

I warded MoI

because of his play and smarts in aCoK large theme, and his thought/thinking in that game, which would be beneficial in this game due to the complexities.

...

I didn't immediately claim because I knew that Ward interfered with Craft Fetish and Pass Fetish and the negative I was thinking of about claiming was if we claimed who we Warded then the cult would know not to Pass Fetish to that person in the night, but now I realize that that couldn't happen because they would have failed on the crafting to begin with.

xvart #648 wrote:I do not know what he did last night, but I do not believe he Warded last night. I would never presume to understand why Furcolow does what he does and why he says what he says. A lot of players I can attribute motivations or postulate why they might do something; but Furcolow is so far off the reservation it is fruitless.

...

So seven cult members can craft a fetish of every single player in the game by roughly the conclusion of N2 (considering there were four wards N0) without gaining an insanity? Hmmmm...

xvart #649 wrote:

Andrius

- No Noises (272), Did Not Ward (272)
...

ReaperCharlie #543 wrote:Benmage on the other hand is decidedly anti-town, regardless of his alignment.

Furcolow wrote:

AurorusVox wrote:We instruct Ben to launder N4 and investigate him for blood that night too, to see if he picked Mutilation. The results should be Bloody N3 and Not Bloody N4. Is there a way around that?

cult can have res kits
res kits can cause blood
WIFOM on #1 too