Open 728: Sharing is Caring (GAME OVER)

[Zoronos]

Okay, so, you're town reading or at least not advocating the lynch of what I've got left in my scum pool (besides the_worst, who you're voting for, so asking about him seems a tad redundant), that means I'm upside down on my scum slate and have got scum in my town reads. If I move S_S from 'no AI content' down to 'okay scum??' that still leaves me with one wrong read, minimum, and two wrong reads if S_S is given that benefit.

Where am I going wrong? Who is scum with the worst here? I've got one guess that I alluded to above, but I'd feel better if I had more to go off of than that gut read.

[the worst]

find one scum first tbh

[the worst]

the wagon on me isn't important, they'll settle down before EOD

[davesaz]

Two followups:
Do you feel she has fully answered your question to your satisfaction, or did she give you the runaround?
Based on her answer, how do you read those slots now?

I didn't have a

strong

read on either slot.
I'm not really sure if I liked the answer or not. I had time to see it, but didn't really have time to process it fully.

Hey, Daveasz, what's the current state of your MathDino read? He has, to my eyes, become more engaged with the game in the time since you wrote your case on him. Has MathDino's recent posting changed your mind or reinforced original suspicion?

Somewhat tempered toward null but also with the recognition that an adaption to his play in the game could be an attempt to improve his standing and not truly natural.

I should perhaps fill you in that my reads are rarely strong before the first scumflip.

[pinturicchio]

Sorry guys, my friend's father's dead has affected me more that I thought and even if I have the time to look and read some posts, I really have no motivation at this moment to do something about it. Some quick thoughts: I'm not scumreading ofrhz (I think she asked me if I was scumreading her?), I saw the duckling's case on her and, if ofrhz WAS scum, his case on her seemed like bussing. That doesn't mean I think ofrhz is scum. I had a solid townread on ruru for how she started the day, but that has changed a little, I see some coincidental things between this game and our scumgame together, but I wouldn't go for that today, need some more time. One of my tinfoil hats is that NSG and Mathdino are scum together, since Dino is partially avoiding to make a read on NSG and vice versa. One of jjh reactions pinged me as scummy, and this time scummy could equal scum (different from my first perception about him at the begining of the game). Solid townread ond Zoronos, would bet a kidney for that. Blackstar is under my radar and oh boy that almost always means something but oh boy I never do something about it. I don't like HitAlt's playstyle and the same thing happened in another game where the other player was scum, but it would be a falacy to push him because of only one case. Something_Smart is somewhat smart.

Check out this entire ISO starting from here for "things that work great one game but that you can never do again".

I almost relate to pintu -- I get the vibe that he doesn't actually much enjoy playing scum and he seems to get slightly more indignant when he has to play it.

I love playing scum, makes me concentrate better on the game. In Tit for Tat I was indignant 'cause it was my first scumgame and I was getting lynched on D1 so I was frustrated, but in Newbie 1859 I had a lot of fun and I think it was one of my best games here, and have no more completed scumgames. I think the most important factors for me to enjoy the game are 1. the playerlist and 2. how much time and dedication I can provide.

[Mathdino]

i think i'm on record elsewhere for saying that if i were scum with NSG i would just bus her so i wouldn't get BoP'd for misreading her later on

granted i'm literally on record saying that so wifom wifom wifom

pintu do you have scumreads?

cuz it seems like this game is really lacking scumreads

town is still {ruru, Zor, HitAlt} i agree

[pinturicchio]

i think i'm on record elsewhere for saying that if i were scum with NSG i would just bus her so i wouldn't get BoP'd for misreading her later on

granted i'm literally on record saying that so wifom wifom wifom

pintu do you have scumreads?

cuz it seems like this game is really lacking scumreads

town is still {ruru, Zor, HitAlt} i agree

Yeah but you're still on time to bus her since you're avoiding a read on her, and I said that 'cause I've seen you said that before (I gave some time about that to see where you were going with your read on her and the last thing you said is that there could be scum in {SS, NSG}

No scumreads, sorry. Lack of motivation has me with too many nullreads; at this point I should have more townreads to start my conspiracy theories, but I'm confident in Zoronos and maybe ruru and ofrhz.

[Mathdino]

very true

tbh i've been avoiding a read on most people

i stopped doing ISO reads lists a few months back when i realised that was a scumtell for me
and started getting into ISOs with serious metadives
i haven't had much time for metadives these past few weeks so i guess i'm afraid of being wrong after ISOing?

the point is that i'm still kind of getting my bearings and i have skipped an unusual number of posts this game

checking NSG now

[Mathdino]

okay so keeping in mind that everyone has a 3/4 chance of being town and i already have 3 solid townreads

i'd put NSG at 85-90% town

so if i get dayvigged that's where i'm at

[HitAlt]

I don't like HitAlt's playstyle and the same thing happened in another game where the other player was scum, but it would be a falacy to push him because of only one case.

You're too nice yourself, so obviously you dislike my style.

[Zoronos]

The world (okay, mafia games) is a better place that I've never drawn dayvig.

[HitAlt]

I see that MathDino isn't cleared yet either. (although I still enjoy their posting very much)
Good for us in the end I think.
Scum will have to show some of their hand when they kill if we refuse to lock anyone as town.

Tell me when you guys agree that the worst can be lynched today, and I'll be around to unvote at L-1. (???)

[HitAlt]

The world (okay, mafia games) is a better place that I've never drawn dayvig.

The worst would've been shot at something like page 5 if I were to have drawn that!

[Mathdino]

i mean the best gamestate is where all the bad townies are also obvtown
so the good townies have to get NK'd or wagoned

i think jjh is stalling -- he says he doesn't obvtown conventionally, fine, that's cool
i also don't hardtownread people conventionally

i do townread his previous towngames in a way that i do not townread him here
he doesn't seem that interested in solving this game
he's active and all but there's a fire missing

i'm good outsourcing my vote to NSG today if it means we get a flip
VOTE: jjh927

[Mathdino]

it's actually pretty hilarious how many people have, over the past few months, decided to fake a scumlean on me just to prevent me from getting nightkilled

so while i'm a little bit indignant at doing all sorts of logic that i don't think scum-me could fake

i guess you're right that this is the best place to be

[Zoronos]

Two followups:
Do you feel she has fully answered your question to your satisfaction, or did she give you the runaround?
Based on her answer, how do you read those slots now?

I didn't have a

strong

read on either slot.
I'm not really sure if I liked the answer or not. I had time to see it, but didn't really have time to process it fully.

Hey, Daveasz, what's the current state of your MathDino read? He has, to my eyes, become more engaged with the game in the time since you wrote your case on him. Has MathDino's recent posting changed your mind or reinforced original suspicion?

Somewhat tempered toward null but also with the recognition that an adaption to his play in the game could be an attempt to improve his standing and not truly natural.

I should perhaps fill you in that my reads are rarely strong before the first scumflip.

That math read was mightly hedged, and still rested on a bad meta core.
I feel bad yelling 'answers now!' so I guess I won't, but I'd really like the answer to my first question which you obviously did not give. Take your time, but come back and answer.

[Zoronos]

So, I was pondering JJH's reply to my question about Math and Davesaz. My highlight VC list probably spoiled the intent of the question, since I was obviously looking for him to give reads on potential partners in the PoE.
But if JJH is saying legit things, I'm upside down on a read, and I've been staring at my little notepad, and I think the read I'm most likely upside down on is HWS.
His postcount is lower than I thought it was, he's been largely gliding by, and he's a potential the_worst partner.

So if we lynch JJH and he flips green and I die in the night ~mysteriously~ I'd recommend having a think about HWS. I'm not at 'tunnel until dead' levels of surety or 'murder with vig' levels of surety, but I'd recommend giving that slot increased scrutiny if I perish.

I'm not sure yet what's up. Maybe I shouldn't ramble late at night and instead go to sleep. Or maybe I shouldn't ponder pre-flip associatives. Or both.

[HitAlt]

it's actually pretty hilarious how many people have, over the past few months, decided to fake a scumlean on me just to prevent me from getting nightkilled

So I wasn't the first one then..?
Wonder who the previous one to do it was..

[Mathdino]

So if we lynch JJH and he flips green and I die in the night ~mysteriously~ I'd recommend having a think about HWS. I'm not at 'tunnel until dead' levels of surety or 'murder with vig' levels of surety, but I'd recommend giving that slot increased scrutiny if I perish.

You got it.

I'll sign off on that too.

[Zoronos]

i mean the best gamestate is where all the bad townies are also obvtown
so the good townies have to get NK'd or wagoned

i think jjh is stalling -- he says he doesn't obvtown conventionally, fine, that's cool
i also don't hardtownread people conventionally

i do townread his previous towngames in a way that i do not townread him here
he doesn't seem that interested in solving this game
he's active and all but there's a fire missing

i'm good outsourcing my vote to NSG today if it means we get a flip
VOTE: jjh927

What do you think of JJH's answers to my questions? (to wit, his reads on you and Daveasz).
Also, active? I feel like I haven't seen a lot of content from him since the first day or two when he got heat for attacking someone for voting me. Curious how you're getting a perception that he's active.

(I realize the answer to his read on you is likely redundant, so feel free to elide if necessary for the sake of brevity)

[Mathdino]

I read his ISO and he doesn't seem to have trouble posting and keeping up with the thread.

It seems like whenever I call someone low-content they accuse me of accusing them of lurking when that's not the case. He IS posting, but he's not doing much with what activity he has.

So I'll revise that to "active enough". I don't really care whether or not he's active, I'm not policying him for lurking lol.

On Math:
We don't have to ignore the meta take right off the bat. It's lazy. It's not the only time in this game he's taken an approach to this game that is lazy. I would like him to not be lazy, but it doesn't mean he's scum. That said, while I haven't played with him before, I can see he's been doing the whole townread PoE thing- even if I don't think his reads are necessarily accurate here. Probably town, and should be easier to place as the game goes on.

On Davesaz:
Either result is possible.

But no seriously he's probably town because he's got this air of semi-competent cluelessness going and IDK if he can replicate that as scum because I haven't seen him play scum but my natural assumption is that it's very difficult to fake this kind of authentic tendency to bark up the wrong tree. I'd anticipate that he might actually make sense as scum? Not 100% sure but unless someone with more of a grasp on his meta tells me otherwise, I will be assuming he is town.

Good people to ask about btw

This is a nothingpost that ends with unnecessary slight buddying tbh.

- I don't think his read on me is as nuanced as it might seem on the surface. It's mostly just commentary on my play. IIoA.

- I have no idea what the fuck he's trying to say about davesaz although I roughly agree with this read.

[Zoronos]

I understand what he's trying to say with the dave read, I just am not sure I agree with it.
He's saying the following things:
1) Dave is clearly lost in the woods, a scum would have more trouble hiding their TMI than dave is exhibiting.
2) It is hard to authentically fake confusion.
3) Dave's reads (I am guessing he means ruru) are non-political; that is they are so against thread consensus they are invariably bound to draw attention.
4) Dave's reads don't make a lot of sense. JJH believes that scum-dave would likely put more effort into portraying an appearance of continuity of thought.

(3) and (4) are obviously leveling arguments and I'm not sure I buy them in this particular case.

Also, I'd suggest clicking that handy Activity Overview button and sorting it by post count.

[Mathdino]

So in that case, jjh spent a paragraph detailing a read that I already had, which is "dave's reads/reasoning are so out of left-field that he's prob outside his scumrange".

Like I said, I agree with this read, but it's still not that interesting.

I don't know what I'm looking at re: Activity Overview. With the exception of me not being the 2nd highest poster, it seems pretty normal for everyone in this game.

[Zoronos]

Maybe due to the banding effect in the 38-44 posters, but my initial reaction was the JJH was not super high on the post count, so classifying him as 'active' struck me as inaccurate. Especially given the bulk of his posts were near the very start of the game.
But w/e, lurking isn't strongly AI and is heavily playstyle dependent, so not a road worth continuing down.

[jjh927]

Fwiw I am not considering myself active here