Mafiascum.net

In post 770, BoroPhil wrote:basically two dreadful votes.

here is a question. if your day one gambit was so obviously town, why are you still alive?

Fake content, bad way to pass off suspicion to BB MOlla

The purpose of investigating a non-obvious target was to maximize the results. The non-existence of a second cop does not harm the results, but if there had been a second cop, the results would have been more beneficial to us instead of having us both investigate the same person OR both investigate a dead person. (Both the idea of a second cop as well as the possibility that DBK might die went into my decision, as I explained).

So for instance, if there was a second cop, DBK was a very likely target. By targeting Zebe instead, I left room for the possibility of 4 clears (essentially): me and Zebe, DBK, and the other cop. With wake/tammy, that's 5 town you can reasonably assume to be clear, and look in the other 6 people, significantly reducing the lynch pool of possible suspects.

In post 833, aptil wrote:

In post 825, aptil wrote:I do not understand post #802 . Please can you explain it again .
@ DP : who are you adrressing in post #812 ? I don't get that either .

This never got answered .

Because I haven't read the thread?
I reffered to Kalimar, I agree it was confusing the way I worded it but I basically measnt "Why vote Kalimar"

Oh and Zebe, to answer your questions
I thought of you as scum individually regardless of what the other said about you, its not really that hard to distance imo. Why was the Cheery case misguided? Well for starters ETL took to Cheery's sarcasm as a scum tell with his assessment of Lucky. Plus I didn't feel cheery was scum and a lot of things they were trying to pin on him weren't scummy,. at least not to me.

Oh yeah I like Fusion for town. Good posting.

Seriously with posts like 828, 829, 846, 847 I'll ask "Why the fuck aren't we looking at BoroPhil more?".

After Kalimar, youre next.

DP this is totally your scum posting. ....

Hmm might have been a hit hasty with changing that vote. DRP you will find I already explained why you and not Kalimar

Yeah Boro and Im telling you that your reason makes no sense.

Sure ETL, believe that if you want to. I dont see the difference between how I post as either alignment but maybe you'd liek to walk us through if you do

I have already explained why I found Lucky scummy, both yesterday and today. Agreed to a lesser extent. Phil while I understand you feel there is a case against me you quote the simple fact that two people have called me scum you change your vote. Fair enough.

Lucky yes it's a lazy post why should I repeat myself?

Totally dandy with Kalimar or DP, both are fine.

Borophil, can you discuss what about Kalimar's 417 you liked? I had the opposite impression from that post mainly due to the lack of new content and it seemed to me like he was merely re-stating generally accepted positions. For instance, you tell Tammy in your 795 that Kalimar came to a similar conclusion to you on Aptil. Yet, in 254, Mr.Blonde states pretty much the same thing saying "" Kalimar's later point seems to merely be a rehash of this. And it wasn't a great argument either, it is one of hypocrisy. I can see town being hypocritical just as much as scum. There was very little I found in Kailmar's posts that I felt would be difficult for scum to fake. I am not as confident in anybody else and I am paranoid that some of the good players in this game are scum but I haven't yet nailed down who it could be. Kalimar is the one that I feel is the easy catch, and to a lesser extent maybe Smudger. Investigative results and probably associative tells should help figure out which others are scum.

I looked through your reasons for voting DoctorPepper again and it seems to be based mostly on wagon analysis. You make a good point that scum would be happy to sit on a wagon as opposed to hop around providing new reasoning each time. However, the flip side is that scum don't really care which townie is lynched while town do. DoctorPepper resolutely sitting on DBK while arguing against ETL's case on Cheery looks very genuine because ETL is a persuasive player and a town leader and it would have been easy to switch around based on her case since it was on a townie anyways. But Pepper's analysis of scum motivations and defense of Cheery felt very town. As you mentioned yourself, if Zebe/ETL are town, it would prove your case wrong.

Smudger, what of my reads do you agree and disagree with? Is your scumread on Lucky based primarily on Lucky's 540 and 541 as you say in post 580? Can you explain what of those posts is scummy? I find them equally likely to come from town as scum. As for ETL's points, why do you feel Lucky is more likely to do a reaction test as scum than town?

ETL, can you share a bit about your thoughts on how DoctorPepper plays as town and scum and why he is playing to his scum meta here? Also, I really feel that your disagreement with Lucky is more of a playstyle clash than actual scum motivated actions. You are widely townread by most players in the game and a formidable opponent for a 1v1. I feel it extremely unlikely that you are going to be lynched. As such, I doubt scum would want to push at you so recklessly.

In post 850, DoctorPepper wrote:

In post 770, BoroPhil wrote:basically two dreadful votes.

here is a question. if your day one gambit was so obviously town, why are you still alive?

Fake content, bad way to pass off suspicion to BB MOlla

I think you'll find I already passed off suspicion on him based on the gambit itself. what do you think about that? also fake?

In post 856, DoctorPepper wrote:Yeah Boro and Im telling you that your reason makes no sense.

Sure ETL, believe that if you want to. I dont see the difference between how I post as either alignment but maybe you'd liek to walk us through if you do

it would make sense if you were town

In post 859, Fusion wrote:Borophil, can you discuss what about Kalimar's 417 you liked? I had the opposite impression from that post mainly due to the lack of new content and it seemed to me like he was merely re-stating generally accepted positions. For instance, you tell Tammy in your 795 that Kalimar came to a similar conclusion to you on Aptil. Yet, in 254, Mr.Blonde states pretty much the same thing saying "

Aptil's response to it I didn't like much considering he was attacking Lucky for not voting someone based on the previous content when he hadn't as well.

" Kalimar's later point seems to merely be a rehash of this. And it wasn't a great argument either, it is one of hypocrisy. I can see town being hypocritical just as much as scum. There was very little I found in Kailmar's posts that I felt would be difficult for scum to fake. I am not as confident in anybody else and I am paranoid that some of the good players in this game are scum but I haven't yet nailed down who it could be. Kalimar is the one that I feel is the easy catch, and to a lesser extent maybe Smudger. Investigative results and probably associative tells should help figure out which others are scum.

I looked through your reasons for voting DoctorPepper again and it seems to be based mostly on wagon analysis. You make a good point that scum would be happy to sit on a wagon as opposed to hop around providing new reasoning each time. However, the flip side is that scum don't really care which townie is lynched while town do. DoctorPepper resolutely sitting on DBK while arguing against ETL's case on Cheery looks very genuine because ETL is a persuasive player and a town leader and it would have been easy to switch around based on her case since it was on a townie anyways. But Pepper's analysis of scum motivations and defense of Cheery felt very town. As you mentioned yourself, if Zebe/ETL are town, it would prove your case wrong.

I didn't like Aptil's 121 so it was mainly based on that. He also noticed Blonde's 254, which I had when I did my own catchup. So basically, me, Kalimar and Blonde seemed to be on the same wavelength which is a good sign (for me anyway).

You make good points about Pepper, but I'll throw something else him, he didn't post at all yesterday, yet today when he has pressure on him we suddenly get a barrage of them?

"throw something else in"

Lol Boro, you could find that I didnt post at all for a few days in all my games and had to have my back up mod lock and unlock the thread for night and youre calling me out for the beetlejuice?

sorry?

Going to be partially VLA today and tomorrow RL. I see the question Fusion and will answer it ASAP but right now time is short for me today.

In post 848, DoctorPepper wrote:

In post 800, Kalimar wrote:@lucky: not a defence of you, more an attempt to gauge ETL's thought process on the matter. content is subjective but to me refers to the assertion and discussion of posts and opinions that advances the gamestate. i have not asserted or discussed a large amount of posts and opinions in this game, and neither has DP. this wasn't my main problem with DP's vote of me: rather I found it hypocritical (and therefore scummy) that someone who has done next to nothing votes me primarily for doing next to nothing.

i'm decently satisfied with ETL's reasoning on her lucky scumread and cop choice. although i think making the second choice cop contingent on another n1 cop existing was a bit odd i'm not sure it's scummy odd just odd.

1. Is hypocrisy a scum tell in itself?
2. I dont see why you thinking ETL would see a second cop possibility and that first cop may have made the first choice to investigate anyway?

Hypocrisy is more likely to come from scum for the reason that it shows a shallow level of thinking. If Person A accuses Person B of being scummy for Action X, but is also doing Action X themself, on the face of it why is it scummy for one person but not the other?

That doesn't necessarily mean the action isn't scummy for that particular person. A certain level of context-dependence takes place when evaluating the potency of any scum read.

In your case, I didn't feel as though the context-dependence was there.

Please rephrase the other question as I didn't quite understand it as currently posed.

prod dodge .

feel free to add some content aptil.

Kalimar needs more votes.

I'd like to hear where ETL, Lucky, Smudger, Zebe and Aptil stand.

In post 859, Fusion wrote:Smudger, what of my reads do you agree and disagree with? Is your scumread on Lucky based primarily on Lucky's 540 and 541 as you say in post 580? Can you explain what of those posts is scummy? I find them equally likely to come from town as scum. As for ETL's points, why do you feel Lucky is more likely to do a reaction test as scum than town?

Let m deal with Lucky question first. At the time Lucky was inactive and I say as much in my post 580. The only interaction from Lucky at that time were the 2 posts as highlighted. While I agree in isolation they could come from town just as much from scum, in context I found them scummy. To have not said anything of note and then come in with those two posts, it seemed to me to be treading water somewhat when you look at what was being discussed in the thread at that time. Also 529 in retrospect is also in keeping with the feel I got and maintained, why I missed mentioning that though I don't know. It could be argued that Lucky is more active now, but I keep going back to D1.

With regard to your reads:

I have to agree with your reads on Tammy and ETL. Tammy at first I was not so sure on, I had a town read on Wake but with doubts. However Tammy’s content and motivation are in my mind now firmly set in Town concrete. ETL also, ETL was a strong town read for me D1 and continues to be so.

I will admit that Zebe was a scum read for me all D1, thus the reason for my vote. Of course ETL has now stated that she has a innocent on him and, based on my read, I find it highly unlikely that ETL is bluffing, as sated she has done her job she is, in her words, it can be proved if there is doubt, which I doubt there is, not in my mind ATM.

DP, he has been pushing most of the main scum reads all game, I do ask him why he defends Lucky in D1 but his response is good, you in fact highlight that in your read on him. I agree with you that the DP wagon is off.


Aptils' input to begin with was limited and slow , It also seemed staged IMO, but it has picked up hIs imposts are probing and town motivated. Although I remain sceptical I think that Aptil is leaning Town for me right now.


Phil is leaning town IMO, his posts and interaction since he replaced in have been town motivated and his questioning I agree with. I get good vibes when reading the majority of his posts.

BB is null now, I was taken that he was probably Town due to his gambit, but that does not mean I fully believed it. I know that you have mentioned that in your reads but then since then I cant work him out, thus why I have asked him questions to clarify some of his statements.

I like your read on Kalimar TBH. I had to go back and read the ISO and well, yes.

P EDIT

I had meant to mention that Tammy was mod Killed but omitted to include it, but as you did ask me to comment on your reads, I thought i should include her

Smudger, how are BoroPhil's posts full of town motivation when half the stuff he posts are fluff?

Because he is questioning people, why do you not see that he is asking questions?