Newbie 1735 - Banana Split (Game Over!)

[goodmorning]

ffs, even jiffy's ego isn't this huge

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Given that it's unlikely they're both Scum, Dragon seems the more likely of the two to be Town (albeit very silly Town) than copper does.

But that's not a reason, you just flipped the question I asked; I wanted an explanation, a why.

[goodmorning]

It's totally different: they're equally likely to be Scum, probably both aren't, but Dragon is more likely to be Town.
When I put myself in his shoes, I can see where a townie could have posted some of that silliness. I can't say the same for copper.

[ironstove]

VOTE: DDD

[ironstove]

I'd like to see DDD lynched before we lynch copper. Lynch DDD plox.

I also fos GL but not as much as DDD.

[ironstove]

The jon slot might be scum. People town reading that slot don't make sense.

I think trying to figure out alignments this early in the game is dumb, but I'll go out on a limb and say if DDD is scum, his partner is jon.

[goodmorning]

We're nearly at 1000 posts. This is not early in the game.

[copper223]

I am back to {(Accountant,GM), Dragon}.

Could be GM not wanting to join the Dragon wagon while seeming to support it was a soft buss and not real conviction in her copper read as I first interpreted it.

DDD's logic in 894 makes sense from his perspective as town so I'm moving him up, GM agreeing with him that it's likely only 1 between Dragon and I though is not as obvious, in fact I would expect the "Jon" proposition of the two of us being teammates to be the more likely genuine read.

VOTE: Dragon

[goodmorning]

vca is

so great

, you guys

SO GREAT

[goodmorning]

ALSO TWO SCUM DON'T USUALLY COME IN AND DO THE EXACT SAME THINGS

[copper223]

Why are you getting so fussed and bothered about what the closest thing to confirmed scum, according to you, has to say?

SHADY.

[ironstove]

We're nearly at 1000 posts. This is not early in the game.

By early in the game, I mean it's D1 and we have no flips, how can you figure out an alignment if you don't even know flips? Just try to find the first scum, then go back and read interactions to figure out potential partners... IMO it's a waste of time otherwise.

[ironstove]

Copper, where did this dragon vote come from? You're voting for him out of the blue. I don't see you applying pressure or casing him.

What exactly is a compromise lynch? Who are you compromising with?

[copper223]

Copper, where did this dragon vote come from? You're voting for him out of the blue. I don't see you applying pressure or casing him.

What exactly is a compromise lynch? Who are you compromising with?

I'm compromising with Jae who thinks Accountant and DDD are not scum.

I already said why Dragon could be scum, his interpretation of Accountant vs me as a pure TvT is strange, everyone else active at the time picked a camp and he hasn't been able to show me why he considered Accountant town, the best I saw was him saying that my points against Accountant were NAI because as an experienced scum player Accountant would not make those mistakes, that does not explain why he was town-reading Accountant and why he was town-reading me despite me pushing NAI points according to him.

I also think Dragon vs DDD is a TvS for a number of reasons and DDD has been looking more town in his latest posts.

The logic he is using to PoE one scum inside the people pushing him and one staying on the sidelines is the same I've been harping on about wrt. to the three stooges and someone outside of the trio for most of the day and I don't think it's a conscious mimic, so it's likely a town process.

[GuyInFreezer]

VC 1.15

Accountant (1):

GuiltyLion

copper223 (3):

goodmorning, jon_h61, Accountant

Debonair Danny DiPietro (2):

ironstove, DragonFire

DragonFire (3):

Debonair Danny DiPietro, JaeReed, copper223

Not Voting:

None

With

9

votes,

5

votes to lynch.

The deadline is in (expired on 2016-09-10 16:07:31).

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

It's totally different: they're equally likely to be Scum, probably both aren't, but Dragon is more likely to be Town.
When I put myself in his shoes, I can see where a townie could have posted some of that silliness. I can't say the same for copper.

Only in mafia does this sort of argument make any sense (and it does). What sort of silliness?

[jon_h61]

I have never been lynched as town, I have never reached lylo as town (other than as a tree-stump) and in a newbie I have never survived past D2 as town, this is how bad some of you are, read the flip and weep at your ineptitude.

I have, I have, and I have. It's all in my meta.
If your Town, I will. Then move on.

[jon_h61]

The jon slot might be scum. People town reading that slot don't make sense.

I think trying to figure out alignments this early in the game is dumb, but I'll go out on a limb and say if DDD is scum, his partner is jon.

Your compass still didn't give you what you want. If you're Town. Why DDD?

I'll get to your other questions soonish.

[jon_h61]

Jon, what are your reads of myself and guiltylion? Are we null or...?

Your biggest scum read is copper, but why did you say you're sheeping Accountant? Why do you have to say it's sheeping if you're voting for your biggest scum read?

Accountant is your strongest town read? Is that right?

Tbh I've kind of ignored you. I've carried out crusades on trolls just to find them Town almost every time.

You can say I'm sheeping gm now. I've finished her and Ddds ISOs and for now, they are my Town reads ATM.

I gotta look better at Jae, but that's it.

I don't know what I going to do tomorrow. I'll worry a out it then. Im learning respect for accountant's game, he looks like he can be pretty deceitful. Still thinking Town. GL Town.

[copper223]

I have never been lynched as town, I have never reached lylo as town (other than as a tree-stump) and in a newbie I have never survived past D2 as town, this is how bad some of you are, read the flip and weep at your ineptitude.

I have, I have, and I have. It's all in my meta.
If your Town, I will. Then move on.

Why would you say this to your scum-read?

The only reason I see is to convince me (and more importantly everyone else) that you're likely to make this mistake as town, but if I am scum, as you claim, I wouldn't care less and if you're preemptively excusing yourself for my flip to the rest of the crew that is super fishy.

[jon_h61]

I said it to a human being.

Is sorry I killed you, Hope we play
Again soon better?

[copper223]

Bah, this is mafia, if you're sorry for fucking up tell me post game, if you say it in the middle of the thread as a hypothetical when you presumably don't know if it applies you're going to screw with people's reads.

I do not hope to play with you anytime soon unless you flip scum and for the record I still don't think that's the case.

[Dragonfire]

@Jon
Make your case, I don't see why scum decides to solo push me after my wagon dissolved so close to the deadline and I was town-reading the player you replaced so the sooner the better.

VOTE: copper
I feel DDD when he says copper keeps playing the fake gotcha game

VOTE: jon_h61

Jon, what are your reads of myself and guiltylion? Are we null or...?

Your biggest scum read is copper, but why did you say you're sheeping Accountant? Why do you have to say it's sheeping if you're voting for your biggest scum read?

Accountant is your strongest town read? Is that right?

I've reached the end of my patience with this player-list, and I think my flip may actually be beneficial at this point, for sure it will please me to be out of this game.

Reads (I'll do my best but given the people I'm playing with I don't have the same confidence as I usually do):

Jae: I think they are town, although those DDD defense posts combined with the long inactive period weirded me out. Don't scum-read them for not voting anyone for a long time as that is a bad tendency they have but not scum indicative in their case. If Accountant and/or DDD flip scum and you've also lynched or cleared what I believe are their likely buddies come back here, maybe possibly there was an early buss from GL going on but that's really a marginal case and I'd discount it unless a lot happens after this read-list.

GL: In a normal game I wouldn't hazard a town-read here because he has a tendency to just post in bursts and only at interesting times, given the circumstances though I also believe he is town, review this if DDD flips scum or if someone disconnected from my main reads like Iron or Jon does.

Jon: I hate it when town comes in and half-asses it and I think this is what happened here (proof is in all the "I started doing a) but then found b)" stuff, seems more like a scatterbrain than scum to me), I think your reads are absolute garbage though so throw them away. He could be a buddy for the 3 stooges or Dragon though and just felt he could get rid of me (in which case that's good scum play, my bad, but I don't know how I could catch you here if that's what you're doing), review it if one of the those flips scum.

Iron: his posting has gotten progressively scummier (what happens if DDD flips town tomorrow as well, then if you're town you are going to get hammered at lylo and you lost the game based on a day 1 read, how stupid can you be playing? This made me think, this guy has to be scum but after re-reading I just think your false confidence is just boundless this game). Review this if Dragon flips scum (and you haven't won the game yet because Dragon should always be lynched after Accountant).

GM: I think the fact she stayed on me when everyone else ignored the wagon, the AtE about trying her best with newbies and her complaint that she was looking like a likely compromise lynch tomorrow mean she is more likely town than scum, if that's the case I strongly urge you to go back to your sabbatical and stay there, some people are just not made to play this game. If you're scum I have no words for the level to which you are willing to sink. Review this (and I mean throw it out of the window) if she is alive at lylo without a good reason.

Dragon: If Accountant flips scum look here for his buddy.

DDD: preferred lynch if Accountant flips town, mass claim before it happens and hopefully the PR allocation will help you if it did not before.

Accountant: Lynch tomorrow.

I have never been lynched as town, I have never reached lylo as town (other than as a tree-stump) and in a newbie I have never survived past D2 as town, this is how bad some of you are, read the flip and weep at your ineptitude.

My initial read of DDD is Town. I still don't get the copper/Dragon tag team. Just seems "too scummy to be scum." I'm almost sure one of them is scum. The argument is just so convoluted. It doesn't feel natural (to me).

I'll disagree with Accountant and agree the too scummy to be scum is a thing and while I wouldn't say copper/Dragon have achieved that, the way they've been operating as a tag team feels very strange. Personally I'm more inclined towards one of (copper/Dragon) with a teammate sitting a bit off to the side in (Jae/GL) but there is a possibility that Dragon replaced in and felt the need to help his buddy make his point and then figuring they'd already linked each other they just embraced it hoping to draw the exact argument that scum wouldn't link that closely together. There's even a little bit of suggestive evidence for the latter theory with copper's weird little jaunt into suspecting Dragon for like five seconds until Dragon posted the exact same arguments we'd seen before.

A. Dragon's at, like, L-2. Also, I'm B. not in any hurry and C. still hoping that a copper wagon somehow happens.

Explain to me the big preference for copper over Dragon?

I know he's capable of participating, so maybe, if I do the same thing over and over again, eventually I'll get a different result.

I mean I know you were invoking it yourself but that's the "definition" of insanity.

I have never been lynched as town, I have never reached lylo as town (other than as a tree-stump) and in a newbie I have never survived past D2 as town, this is how bad some of you are, read the flip and weep at your ineptitude.

l o l
I've said it before:
If one place you go smells of shit it's probably a poorly-cleaned public convenience. If every place you go smells of shit you may want to check your shoes.

I think copper is town guaranteed after that post

ugh, seriously???

A. Dragon's at, like, L-2. Also, I'm B. not in any hurry and C. still hoping that a copper wagon somehow happens.

Explain to me the big preference for copper over Dragon?

Given that it's unlikely they're both Scum, Dragon seems the more likely of the two to be Town (albeit very silly Town) than copper does.

I know he's capable of participating, so maybe, if I do the same thing over and over again, eventually I'll get a different result.

I mean I know you were invoking it yourself but that's the "definition" of insanity.

Well, you slightly modify it, prodding with kindness or insults or questions or comments, appealing to ego or fear or whatever. Eventually it probably happens. I mean, he's already asked jon some questions.

I am back to {(Accountant,GM), Dragon}.

Could be GM not wanting to join the Dragon wagon while seeming to support it was a soft buss and not real conviction in her copper read as I first interpreted it.

DDD's logic in 894 makes sense from his perspective as town so I'm moving him up, GM agreeing with him that it's likely only 1 between Dragon and I though is not as obvious, in fact I would expect the "Jon" proposition of the two of us being teammates to be the more likely genuine read.

VOTE: Dragon

Copper, where did this dragon vote come from? You're voting for him out of the blue. I don't see you applying pressure or casing him.

What exactly is a compromise lynch? Who are you compromising with?

I'm compromising with Jae who thinks Accountant and DDD are not scum.

I already said why Dragon could be scum, his interpretation of Accountant vs me as a pure TvT is strange, everyone else active at the time picked a camp and he hasn't been able to show me why he considered Accountant town, the best I saw was him saying that my points against Accountant were NAI because as an experienced scum player Accountant would not make those mistakes, that does not explain why he was town-reading Accountant and why he was town-reading me despite me pushing NAI points according to him.

I also think Dragon vs DDD is a TvS for a number of reasons and DDD has been looking more town in his latest posts.

The logic he is using to PoE one scum inside the people pushing him and one staying on the sidelines is the same I've been harping on about wrt. to the three stooges and someone outside of the trio for most of the day and I don't think it's a conscious mimic, so it's likely a town process.

I'm guessing I'm at L-1 now. Should I claim / post final reads lists or what?

[Dragonfire]

Wow, sorry, I absolutely messed that up. Didn't mean to post all those quotes!

[jon_h61]

#

@copper appeal to intimidation? Sorry you take the game so seriously. If you feel its best we don't play again, fine.