Mafiascum.net

That redefines things.

The worst part is that now IAI looks town.

Bah, it's stupid early in the morning and I'm currently sleep deprived. I'm going to crash out, watch the FL/FL State game tomorrow, and then see if I can re-evaluate my reads. My immediate reaction to Elmo's posting is one of town response, and frankly I still stand by furc being obv. town, and I'll add I don't see scum bothering with a hammer on a scumbuddy while calling it sheeping because there reads are wrong this game. Passing the buck happens on scum hammering town, not the other way around.

lulz, it has to be Empking at this point. Just look at how he and his predecessors manoeuvred.

Cannot wait for the Benmage reaction post.

Also, Thor's signature is now 100% funnier and needs to be updated with the role reveal.

Yeah. I'm 70% sure it's Empking as well. I'd thought BS wouldn't have been bold enough to distance like that, but their unwillingness to push each other afterward looked bad. I was actually getting cold feet on Empking because he didn't attack Baby Spice that hard in his catch-up post, and was writing, "Hmm, unless you're Baby Spice's scumbuddy, you aren't making the optimal scum move as the second leading wagon (just the optimal one by attacking Percy)."

Elmo and Furc's reactions look pretty genuine (not that my gut has a fantastic track record), and although it irks me that Kscope never commented on the Baby Spice Lrdwhyt wagons, he should have voted for Empking instead of Percy had he decided not to bus.

It's just...that is way too easy. My mind rebels at it ever being the obvious answer. It has to all be a convoluted scheme by Locke, dammit!

By the way, Percy never answered my question about why he was waiting for my Elmo post, but since it doesn't matter anymore,...fine, I'll admit it, Elmo. I did find your defence townish, you lurky bastard. But I STILL am meaning to respond to you--tomorrow, assuming the game doesn't end with Empking's lynch.

I don't know if Sotty still wants examples of where I got the idea that Baby Spice was a VI, since after her flip, it would only be an attempt to belatedly cover my ass. The only thing I have to say in my defence (since my earlier votes on mongoose/BS could be distancing) is that had I really wanted to save Baby Spice, I would have aggressively pushed Lrdwhyt harder (I can write a nasty frame case when I set my mind to it), rather than completely dropping my pressure of him and making a dead-end attack on Elmo while the Baby Spice wagon gathered more steam.

Thor665 wrote:As in you think it's a scum tell? Or is creepy=interesting=hinky?
While you're at it, please refer to jason's post and tell me that didn't deserve a joke to be made immediately after it. Ben and I are softclaiming?

To be honest, I skimmed over jason's post. I thought you were joking about my getting creeped out by your alignment comment. And that set off my paranoia, as if you were going, "Ha ha, who me? Evil? Of course I'm not evil. Or ?" But fair enough, it was kind of a fluffy, "You're giving me baaaaaad vibes" comment.

Unfortunately, I'll have zero time over the weekend. Unless someone comes out with a fantastic reason for why, say, jason could still be in the suspect pool, I get the feeling it really doesn't matter who we lynch in what order (we have at least four mislynches left, right?). But maybe for completion's sake, I'll reread the early Baby Spice/mongoose-Dry-Fit-Imkingdavid/Lrdwhyt interaction to see if it fits as a scumteam in a few days.

Anyway, I'll post what I was working on before, since it's still relevant:

======================================================
Kaleidoscope:

1) Why do you suspect Percy? Give us reasons. You mentioned that you hated his post about the Kingmaker. But on D1, was there anything else?
2) Why were you willing to explain to Percy before why you suspected Red Coyote, but not willing to explain to me why you suspected Percy?
3) I don't think you've answered this:

Percy wrote: Why did you change your vote to RC at this point? I don't understand. You had said before that you were voting me only because of the size of the wagon. Moving your vote at this point made RC the bigger wagon by one vote because you moved from me. So, plz2explain?

Vote count before you switched from Percy to Red: 5 Percy vs. 4 Red
Vote count after you switched from Percy to Red: 5 Red vs. 4 Percy

You see why "I voted for the biggest bandwagon" doesn't fly?

4) What were your thoughts on Baby Spice vs. Lrdwhyt/Empking? Why didn't you ever weigh in on the leading wagons? Who would you have voted for had you chosen between the two wagons before the deadline? Be honest.

=========================================
Empking:

Empking wrote:Town:
Benmage
I Am Innocent
KaleiÐoscøpe

Why do you think Kaleidoscope is town?

The Scum Side of Null:
Baby Spice

Mongoose

JasonT1981
Thor665

Nikanor

Interesting that jason made it here. Why do you think jason is scummy? Do you disagree with the reasons people such as Sotty have used to clear him?

Also, interesting that Baby Spice made your scummy list. interesting. See the following...

Leaning Scum:
Elmo - Reading his posts give me a town tell until I think about it and then it seems obvious that he's not really deserving of it. My reason for thinking about him as scum though is his votes during D1P1 that seemed immediately to defend DF before jumping on the DF wagon once it became inevitable. (VC: 8, 12)
Furcolow - Again its the votes. His first vote on DF when there wasn't a DF wagon and when one started to build he jumped off. His later vote looked oppertunistic bussing also. (VC: 7, 9, 11)
Percy - The fact that he has yet to be lynched looks like he's being protected by scum. The players and ways he's been voting also don't look good.

I can just imagine Percy's reaction when he sees this.

Which players do you think are protecting him if he's scum? Also, can you elaborate on which votes/suspects in particular you disagree with from Percy?

Because who has Percy spent the most energy attacking today? Baby Spice and Furcolow. Two players .

Start backpedalling now and find an explanation for why you disagree with his votes and suspects even though . Who in particular did you mean?

Oh, and by the way, Benmage? Are you still up for that avatar bet?

I'm going to sleep now. Eh, I can't think of a good reason to do this.

VOTE: Empking

EBWOP: I just realized it probably wasn't fair to say Percy spent the energy attacking those two players. It'll still be hilarious to see Empking try to justify himself, though.

I'll stop spamming the thread soon, but just for a lark, I ISO'd mongoose, and this stood out to me:

mongoose wrote:looking at furcolows last 4 posts he says he thinks we should hurry up and lynch someone, but doesn't say anything contributive as for WHO to lynch. then he gives a vote without information. I don't like that at all.

nothing else really jumped out at me

unvote, vote furcolow

mongoose wrote:I dont see anything wrong with dryfit to be honest. I think everything he has said can be justified.

n00b scum are adorable and unsubtle. But anyway, based on the contrast between his DF and Furc interaction, I doubt mongoose would have distanced that hard from Furcolow. So okay, I'd rule Furcolow as an unlikely mongoose partner.

Baby Spice is slightly craftier; at least she puts DF among her suspects, and her first scum list consists of Benmage, jason, Nikanor, Furc, and DF. It's WIFOM as to whether she'd include more than one of her buddies in that list. Oh, dear God. Her first posts basically just call every sentence in the game scummy for silly reasons. (I always get that cringeworthy feeling when I reread a flipped scum player of, "Ick, why didn't I notice the signs?" Maybe I should be entirely honest and admit my eyes sort of glazed over some of her earlier posts. In my defence, I find her thought process just so confusing and hard to follow that it masks her contradictions and distortions and lack of follow-through.) Never mentions IKD/LW or Kaleidoscope (or me). Just one comment--she openly listed Elmo as one of her three town reads. And then she says this:

Baby Spice wrote:Also Elmo is so obv town that he should be in the dictionary for it.

This is WIFOM, but I'd actually say that makes Elmo likely to be her buddy.

AAAH, I'm half-asleep right now. I'm going to skim a bit, since a lot of this is WIFOM. Suffice it to say that Benmage is super-extra-confirmed town now.

At first, her LW vote looks like an opportunistic hop on a townie (which makes sense since Percy, the player she'd declared very loudly was town, was in the lead with four votes, and LW was tied with her at two). This is what makes me most nervous. Given how badly she played, would she have risked voting Lrdwhyt instead of a player she'd claimed to suspect? But I guess the fact that she mentioned "bussing" in the first place in her vote might be an example of protesting too much.

But yeah, then she REEEAAALLY goes on and on about how Sotty/Lrdwhyt is the most likely scum pairing, Sotty is bussing, etc. In retrospect, I agree with all those who said she might be trying to link them together as a scumteam, particularly since her only other link-based cases were (i) a minor point saying Percy be scum if Benmage was, and (ii) this:

Baby Spice wrote:One of jason or Nik is scum. Bet on it. Unlikely both.

In retrospect, it looks like she's setting up two mislynches in a row--if one of them flips scum, hey, it doesn't cost her anything! It'd be a bit risky to rule a townie you're trying to scum up out as being scum. It makes jason and Thor yet unlikely to be scum--jason in particular, since she was pushing him first. (Maybe I'm attributing too much logic to her, though.)

Also just noticed that jason was the swing vote from Percy to Baby Spice. Yet more town points for him. Good thing, or else I'd be wary of him for his "let's policy lynch Percy if Baby flips scum!" routine.

Aaah, I started looking at the vote counts, but some of them are from VP Baltar and some from Zachrulez, and oh my God, ? It's hard to follow if the timing of her votes make more sense for bussing or for trying to push a mislynch. Unfortunately, my Elmo wagon muddies the waters a bit. But anyway, she jumps off LW and votes Sotty after I vote Elmo. Hmm. Considering both Sotty and LW's wagons were less viable at that point and she claimed to suspect Sotty more, it's kind of null. LW voting Elmo, the only other wagon other than Percy to compete with LW, on the other hand, is very far from null.

That said, I noticed that as of this count, she isn't on LW, even though it would save her skin:

Baby Spice - 4 (Percy, Sotty7, Thor665, JasonT1981)
Lrdwhyt - 4 (Locke Lamora, Benmage, Elmo, Furcolow)
Elmo - 2 (Mina, Lrdwhyt)
Percy - 2 (I Am Innocent, KaleiÐoscøpe)
Sotty7 - 1 (Baby Spice)

She only votes LW when IAI threatens to put her at L-1. Nothing to rule them out as buddies.

============================================================

I'm not really sure why I stayed up until past 4 AM doing this when I have work tomorrow morning and Empking's lynch is an inevitability. Probably because I'm obsessive-compulsive, and because I want to say I was right about this game. I'll save rereading IKD/LW and seeing if DF and BS fit as partners for another day. So far, I don't see anything that makes someone else fit better as her partner. Um...she has zero interaction with Kaleidoscope, and she be distancing with Nikanor early on, I guess. And she and Elmo fit as buddies only if they're doing a very postmodern "openly defending and kissing up to each other is the new distancing" routine. I once got away with that off-site, but I doubt it would fly on mafiascum.

EBWOP: LW voting Elmo, the only other wagon other than Percy to compete with LW , on the other hand, is very far from null.

Mina wrote:

Baby Spice wrote:Also Elmo is so obv town that he should be in the dictionary for it.

This is WIFOM, but I'd actually say that makes Elmo

less

likely to be her buddy.

I'm actually starting to think this is a scumtell.

:<

A scumtell from me or from you, Elmo? If it's the latter...um, thanks for confessing?

(oh my god WHY AM I STILL UP)

And EBWOP:

By this wrote:In retrospect, it looks like she's setting up two mislynches in a row--if one of them flips scum, hey, it doesn't cost her anything! It'd be a bit risky to rule a townie you're trying to scum up out as being scum.

I meant this wrote:In retrospect, it looks like she's setting up two mislynches in a row--if one of them flips town, hey, it doesn't invalidate any of her theories. Because she told you one BUT NOT both would be scum. So let's lynch the other one! It'd be a bit risky to rule out a townie you're trying to scum up as being scum.

- Same point as yesterday plus the "lucked out" comment looks like bitter scum.

Mina: Percy went exclusively for the VIs. That's the point where I disagreed with his choice of suspects. I thought it was pretty obvious that he was being protected by Thor, since that's out of the window Percy is probably town.

Every post Kscope makes look like town scum hunting and sticking to his guns. (plus with the BS wagon the fact that he continued to vote Percy rather than voting me to protect or voting BS to distance makers me almost certain that he's town.)

With regards to Jason, I'm going to reread Sotty to make sure I didn't miss anything but its it what I think you're talking about then "no" it doesn't mean much.

Thor665 wrote:The worst part is that now IAI looks town.

Any you too.

Any = And

OK Baby flips scum after attacking Sotty quite a bit, confirming my thoughts Sotty is town...now the super excellent town read she has on percy is very interesting

I really needed someone to high five with after that flip. Damn.

Yeah, it's probably Emp.

Wowwww lol. I hate noobs. Impossible for me to read.... I don't get it Baby Spice could've saved herself by simply voting Percy. Sacrifice?

We should lynch furc or Percy next. Maybe Kscope. Or even Mina.

That unvoting shenanigans .... come on.

I'd probably wanna hang someone else off the dryfit wagon.....whoever this 3rd scum is, I feel very bad for you.

never attacked dryfit or baby spice. Elmo case. Lrd case.

AtE to me to get off the Baby Spice wagon.

Benmage wrote:Wowwww lol. I hate noobs. Impossible for me to read.... I don't get it Baby Spice could've saved herself by simply voting Percy. Sacrifice?

We should lynch furc or Percy next. Maybe Kscope. Or even Mina.

That unvoting shenanigans .... come on.

lynch me when i hammered scum?

Furcolow wrote:

Benmage wrote:Wowwww lol. I hate noobs. Impossible for me to read.... I don't get it Baby Spice could've saved herself by simply voting Percy. Sacrifice?

We should lynch furc or Percy next. Maybe Kscope. Or even Mina.

That unvoting shenanigans .... come on.

lynch me when i hammered scum?

vote: benmage

Are you joking? Think this through.

why is he even mentioning my name after ive been on both fucking wagons of scum

Furcolow wrote:

Benmage wrote:Wowwww lol. I hate noobs. Impossible for me to read.... I don't get it Baby Spice could've saved herself by simply voting Percy. Sacrifice?

We should lynch furc or Percy next. Maybe Kscope. Or even Mina.

That unvoting shenanigans .... come on.

lynch me when i hammered scum?

vote: benmage

But of course. It took you forever to join that wagon. Hammering a fellow scum is a classic scum move. It by no means confirms you, in the slightest.

. Because OH MY FUCKING GOD U SUCK.

actually i voted you

Furcolow wrote:why is he even mentioning my name after ive been on both fucking wagons of scum

good way to distance yourself from them I guess if you are scum