Mini 760 - Bleach Mafia: Karakura Town - Game Over!

[PhilyEc]

Vote:Glados

for sending messages to the commies in the eighties!

[PhilyEc]

Everyone gives a good random vote some kind of clever justification. As for auto-suspicion, if I said it wasn't I'd have been lying. No, rather, call it a bit of uneasiness about having him in the game to begin with. Perhaps not suspicion, but certainly a tingle of fear that he might not be as lucky as he was last game.

I didnt give a clever justification ._. I was rushing to get to the restroom :3

[PhilyEc]

It sounds like his gifted with the Holy Sledgehammer of Babylon, perhaps we should confide entirely in it in hopes of winning

Unvote

Vote Zeenon

for doubting LOLCAT logic.

[PhilyEc]

Corniness was intended.

FoS

on non speaky people. I dont wanna be dragging lurkers from the shadows when this game is big on players. Could result in them not being noticed.
And yes Guiseppe I stole this theory from you from ze other game~

[PhilyEc]

From the looks of it everyone was very eager to sign up, now some people aint talking so quickly as they signed up. I know they could be busy but then again they could be keeping quiet for now, just telling town to be aware of this.

[PhilyEc]

I'm pretty deadset on Stark to be honest, laziness over pwnage any day. FYI favourite before I found out he was Primera.

Right... becuase anyone lurking in the first two pages of a game is obvious scum! At least give the game a bit of time to start before you start trying to focus on the less active people...

You're right, I'd prefer pointing at them so they actually post though. No harm in it right? Its been Monday + St Pats day is tomorrow so it aint too serious about people not posting yet, just something to throw into the mix.

Since random phase seens to have ended I'll remove my random vote

Unvote

[PhilyEc]

Look out! That finger could be poison, Korlash!

Anyway...Phily, why are you so eager to hunt lurkers on Page...2? I'd be more worried later in the game when activity is important.

Well where else is there to go for now, its something to work off going into the game and I feel quite sure enough of how I behave further on to make this action. FoS is just so people consider it, to bring it to their attention, read post above for elaboration.

[PhilyEc]

@Seraphim
Omg I just looked at KoC's game, he WAS third-party O_O Can't wait till 19th to say it <.<

[PhilyEc]

I think I know why you're voting for Green Crayons, Glados. And IF its for the same reason(s) as to why I'm suspicious of him then you're pretty quick to notice. The fact that you dont want to reveal your reasons yet further makes me think we're on the same line of thinking here.

Posting this now because town needs to check out his behaviour after Guiseppe made his vote before it fades out of memories.

FoS Green Crayons

[PhilyEc]

Phily: Care to point out what specifically we should be paying attention to regarding my behavior towards Giuseppe?

Not yet, I will if I vote though, otherwise I'd be behaving unfairly. Seems it would only lead the town if I explained why the FoS, its their duty to pick up on what you've done till things get more serious. Tis too early to build up a case ;]

[PhilyEc]

I think its a better idea to let people look into Green's behaviour rather than telling them what to think, if it was a vote then you'd be right in saying

You would help the town by not distracting us with worthless baseless

votes

and playing this stupid mindgame of Maybe I do/maybe I don't.

(that sounds more correct to me)

Call it shadowy if you must but its me pointing out hes done something to earn him scum points. Rather than state what I think and get launched into some sort of redundant and stagnating debate over the event Im asking town to check out what happened and think up whatever they think is appropriate. Thus we can carry on and have that event noted.

Its nothing worth a vote, its worth paying attention to. At the moment I'm writing up about the game itself, drafting out what each posts means, is it townie, is it scummy and I'm thinking his behaviour stood out the most so far, nothing more.

[PhilyEc]

Its nothing worth a vote, its worth paying attention to.

You mis-rep my point, try upgrading data analysis~
Its an FoS so people dont look past it like I almost did.

[PhilyEc]

Your post encourages others to list various reasons to suspect or vote Green Crayons. This allows you to later choose any of them and say "Yes, this is what I was thinking.

Thats far more appropriate. In that case I'll just post what I've written about him so far (two A4 sheet summary of game made earlier). I guess I dont have to fear scum eating this up as me trying to mislead the town either since I now have to explain.

Page 1 of Game

1) Guiseppe

votes LHNM

for out of game behaviour. (Adds Scum Points)
2) Glados challenge Guiseppe,

votes Guiseppe

3) Green Crayon challenge Guiseppe,

votes Guiseppe

(Possible buddying?)
4) Guiseppe tries to press in-game behaviour (justification) claimed auto suspicion (sounds like intuition)

unvote

seems to be a diplomatic one. (Pro town points for not tunneling).
5) Glados raises question over if post was random.
6) Guiseppe (Post 22) claims it was a 'good' random vote. The auto-suspicion was intended to mean unease over LHNM due to out of game behaviour.
7) Ghostwriter claims the vote has more real qualities rather than random.

Conclusion: Feel it was harmless enough a vote, he needed a reason as did everyone and chose out of game experience. Not as common for randoms but generally people do it to past players is they were scum in other games.
Keep an eye on Glados & Green.

Page 2 of Game

(Has vote count scribbled in then moves on)
1) Green Crayon challenge Guiseppe, asks if theres any plan to bring up said meta info later on.
2) Giuseppe, "I'd be taking discussion forward" Agrees RandomVotes stink.
3) Green Crayon behaves unsatisfied , asks same question with clarity.
Nitpicks over information I found innocent enough from Giuseppe about the random vote.
FoS's Korlash for his joke vote on himself (Add Scum Points for reaching)
4) Zwets, "Didnt he (Giuseppe) unvote?"
5) Green Crayon, goes at Giu's random vote moreover, questions the true randomness behind the vote (Note: Meta info was his unease)
Asks me questions, answers would be good scum food, doesnt notice that I dont answer (Empty questions to look town?)
6) Korlash, pro town points noticing that those inactive doesnt entail suspicion this early into game. Seraphim does the same in different manor but Zwet strangely 3rds the notion even though the questions already there. (Might need more attention)
7) Glados,

unvotes

&

votes Green Crayon

seems to have picked up on what I have. Good analyser, possibly most town so far.
8) Seraphim: "Why change to GC?"
9) Glados, keeps reason to herself. (Could be retaining this information till theres more info to back it up with to appear more sure/Could be a pressure vote after seeing scummy traits).

Page 3 of Game

(Has vote count scribbled in then moves on)
1) Korlash, accuses Glados of having no reason (most likely knows there is one but wants to apply pressure)
Wraps up questions towards be about my blanket FoS.
2) Green Crayon, accuses Korlash of putting words in Glados' mouth. Seems obvious what Korlash is trying to do thus (Add Scum Points)
Brings talk up with Korlash/Phily to further question after it looked wrapped up.

Thought Memo: Defending one voting for him is the best way to be unvoted. Looks town while still turning suspicion on possible town.
(Note: I'm leaving out who I think is scum and who I think is town as its not regarding the FoS I made)

3) Korlash makes it clear what he intended (pressuring Glados)
4) Green Crayons, challenges my FoS.
Takes Korlash very literally to press his arguement towards Korlash, seems to be reaching (Add Scum Points)

---

Thats what I got so far, *clicks to preview* *Adds italics to thought note*

To note, an FoS shouldn't get such a reaction, thus I'm reaching for another sheet *squints*

[PhilyEc]

@Korlash,
Due to amount of interest (wheter good or ill willed) I've provided my notes so far. I'll try being open since people want me to share my ideas more often instead of just one person demanding I explain. Anyways, he got the most scum points so far so I encourage people study him. Perhaps now they'll bother to cross check my notes with what they've seen.

[PhilyEc]

I do agree that there's some interesting discrepancies in GC's posting...but Phily, your entire "mystery shadow-in-the-dark" type thing does not help the town. Explain what you mean or stop talking altogether.

Elaborate please, I dont know what question you're speaking of. Same goes to Zwet.

[PhilyEc]

Urgh, wrote an answer, I swear but when I clicked submit the blasted thing asked me to sign in.

Post gone.

Will post about the following;

Guiseppes future post thing.
Korlash's questionable self vote.
Zwet's strange behaviour.

But too annoyed to have to try and remember everything I already typed, gonna lurk around and read some other peoples games until I recover from the shame x-x

[PhilyEc]

Initially, Giuseppe said that he was going to "...Launch future discussion from how people criticize/critique my move." That was his "Action X:" his future discussion about how people reacted to his actions. He later shifted through a misunderstanding (?) of what specifically I was referencing into "taking discussion forward based on discussion of how I did it."

Originally, I was referencing his decision to base his future discussion on how people reacted to his actions. In his response to me post-clarification, he said that his future discussion was going to be able what he did (not people's reactions). At no point was I ever really thinking about Giuseppe's future discussion centering around LHNM's meta (not sure where Phily is pulling that from). This source of confusion, however, is a non-issue to me - I just want to clear up the situation in the here and now.

My point remains the same, regardless of what his "future discussion" is supposed to be about: I have seen plenty of times mafia say that they will talk about whatever but never actually talk about the subject - though they are quite verbose about promises of discussion, which masks their actual lack of contribution. It's basically a way of appearing to be active but maintaining no actual constructive behavior in the thread. Because my point is universal, it did not require me at the time to specify what specifically I was expecting him to talk about in the future - just, merely if he continued to ramble on about talking about something without actually discussing it I was going to slam him hard for it.

Okay that makes way more sense then what I figured you meant by 'Item X', you wanted to call him out on his 'promise' to bring up how people critiqued his move in the future so that it doesnt just fade away and look like he already brought it up when infact all he did was assure people he'll do it at some point.
Reasonable enough way of saying it.

---

Self-voting is 1. dumb 2. counter-productive if you're town and 3. a great way to "be active" without having to worry about where your first vote will go if scum. The RVS is highly overrated and self-voting only prolongs it at best, distorts future rereads at worst.

1. Self voting well into a game is dumb, random voting yourself is dumb but so are all random votes, you seem to agree with this outlook on random voting stages.
2. Counter productive well into a game, not at the beginning, all random votes lead to little productive result, those results than do get produced usually come from over-eager players who generally tend to reach.
3. I dont think anyone worries past if they are wagoning someone theyve picked randomly from mod's list. You single him out for voting different to everyone yet I think the vote itself was a mock/joke vote for obvious reason.

Conclusion: Korlash voted himself during random voting stage, lawl~.

---

I considered -- and still consider -- his vote to have been appropriately random, whilst being informative.

This is not to say I am satisfied with Giuseppe's recent attempts at explanation, because I am not.

You've given me the words I couldnt find myself, this is exactly how I was the random vote. I think Green's intentions are questionable, on one side he could just be looking into it too much and confusing himself over wheter this vote was a scumtell or not, on the other hand, he could be playing a poor game as scum with his use of logic being weak. Other behaviour (my notes adding scum points) makes me think his intentions were scummy to be honest, doesnt make him scum, could be a mistake by a townie.

---

@Korlash
Would you agree with me in thinking that what you had said to Glados for not providing reasons for her vote was an attempt to apply pressure rather than making it easy for her by asking for reasons?

---

What do you think about Green Crayons?

: Scum, but I want Phily to answer first.

Conclusion: Finds me answering an unclearly stated question more important than identifying if GC is scum (quick write off then turns focus on PhilyEc). If he thinks GC is scum then why does he have his vote on Seraphim still?

---

I'm with Erg0 Green.

Vote: Giuseppe

*Adds scum points*

---

End

[PhilyEc]

Erg0 definitely came out the victor out of that exchange in my opinion. This explains the vote, and why I now suspect you Giuseppe.

Who be this Erg0 you speak of~ And why do you vote with victors within exchanges, what happens if both are town? Your jump into the 'exchange' throwing in a vote seems to be an attempt to fuel some serious suspicion on Giuseppe rather than provide an evaluation of said person while considering wheter this is enough reason to vote this person for being scum in your mind. Letting town do the work for you?

I dont like this kind of behaviour and its a good scumtell in itself.

[PhilyEc]

Albert, firstly, you need to unvote before you can vote again. (eager jump on Giuseppe?)

I'm highly suspicious of you now. You're posting a tiny amount and leeching off of GC's accusations.

...So you lied to be less suspicious? I mean, I understand everything else you're saying, for the most part. But, really? I can't see any other way to read this ^.

I mean, I understand that you're saying that the RVS stage isn't purely random and so when you said "random" you meant in the semi-random aspect that encompasses the RVS... but. It just feels wrong. You had to excuse your vote after the fact by labeling it as random. And so that you wouldn't look suspicious.

Though, I hate that line of thought. Anyone who wants to get down to brass tax on D1, Page 1 I'm right there with them. In fact, I was happy you were talking about meta on Page 1 - it was a welcomed sight rather than "Tee hee I <3 Player X so I'm voting them gigglebarf" or whatever crap that has a tendency to occur in the early parts of the game. I originally voted you just because I thought it was a poor meta to hate on, but when you went back to somehow excuse your semi-legitimate means by explaining it was "random," it just struck me in an odd way. And now, to know that you did it specifically to look less suspicious... I mean. Wow. People lying about their motives to look more innocent are usually scum.

Lying over a random vote is the reason you think hes scum? This lie being what exactly Albert? Give some content, the lack of it is making you look reluctant to give opinions.

[PhilyEc]

Erg0 Green destroyed your (G) arguments

BS. Post 80 is speculation unless you can prove Giuseppe has lied. (Add Scum Points) false & negative feedback.

and provided ample evidence to your guilt, particularly in post 80 where your scummy actions are revealed.

Ample evidence? State said evidence. I dont want a quote, I want you to list them to me.

[PhilyEc]

@Rules Quote

I believe hes talking about one being allowed to:
i) Unvote: Name
or
ii) Simply use 'unvote'.

[PhilyEc]

PhilyEc, your most recent squander, coupled your suspicious behavior outlined in the quote below, have shown us how little you understand the game. I will now ignore you entirely until you post something of value.

Asks me questions, answers would be good scum food, doesnt notice that I dont answer (Empty questions to look town?)

Phily's furthered and continued retreat from his original lurker prodding led me to believe he didn't really have anyone in mind. His lack of an answer had me chalk up in my little notebook an attempt to look pro-town by calling out lurkers, but it backfired by pulling on that line a bit too early.

My oh my, someone doesnt want the spotlight put under him alright. Its okay Albert, your avoidance will be accepted instead of a respectable post. (you're still due at least one)

Vote Albert

If you're town, ignoring someone questioning you will never vice well, if you're scum, thank you.

[PhilyEc]

Now you abandon you 'claim' on Giuseppe and go for a cliché OMGUS? You're making this far too easy.

Has Giuseppe stopped being scum? (votes are for scum) Has the sudden realisation that all my posts have actually been useless and empty now sunk in and during this euphoric that you've realised I'm the real scum?

Perhaps its a last stab at survival by swinging at the one whos only added a slice of pressure on your self. Notice how reactive your reply to me is, big scumtell.

[PhilyEc]

What I like about Giuseppe's last post is how he's shown that he doesn't pretend like he knows what he's doing, different to PhilyEc, who knows very little about what he's doing, but likes to show off a whole lot.

BS. You decided to turn on me after reading my comment, before that you voiced no suspicion of me, merely leeched off another one of GC's posts.

I know exactly whats going on in this game and have made sure to note everything down I find I must remember, the sheets lying about a meter away from me now.

[PhilyEc]

Please dont waste posts on useless stuff thats expressing how abstinent you are the second you are put under the scope. Had you been town you'd have a much strong case before voting. The lightest context your behaviour can be put in is poor townie play. Defensive and useless so far.

Lets keep posting on the respectable level for now, okay?

I will now ignore you entirely until you post something of value.

Is just the opposite of that.

[PhilyEc]

You don't see the whole accusation, so let expound (though I feel as if I have said this before): Giuseppe lied over the genesis behind a "random" vote after the fact that he's given separate, semi-legitimate reasons all so he doesn't look suspicious. Saying you're voting for Player X because of meta, then come back after that to say that your vote is actually random (when the very definition of random decidedly makes such a vote not random) just to make yourself look less suspicious is a pretty big deal. I mean, I didn't think my initial suspicion had much merit, but I wanted to see how Giuseppe would react under pressure. Letting slip that he didn't want to look suspicious and so fudged the genesis of his vote is pretty much cracking under some pretty light pressure and begs closer scrutiny.

Basically, you asked why his reason switched from meta behaviour to it only being a random vote. Later admiting he was trying to avoid suspicions then cracks. Aye?
I noted this and he received scum points for it. Unfortunately, later I concluded;

His unease for LHNM's style was what created the auto-suspicion.

It was never really random though, that point has sunk in now. Thus I agree that its strange that he seemed to crack, his excuse is that hes not good at defending himself.

---

Noted, they have been acting rather useless hence why theyre not in my notes as to having contributed. Seraphim bounces around questions alot then watches events unfold. No opinions only questions.

Zwets I'm not so sure about, need to analyse further.

---

1. Yup.
2. No. It's counter productive at any point of the game. The RVS is shit. It's a manufactured concept that doesn't deserve any more time and attention than a half-thought. Self voting does not help in any way whatsoever from helping the town move away from the RVS. It's counter productive.
3. Have you ever been scum? I have. Plenty of times. From before my very first post I'm thinking about how my play will be interpreted if I or any of my mates die. Self voting absolves the scum of worrying that their very first vote might be interpreted in an incriminating fashion.

1. Kay~
2. Its easy enough to look past thus its not stopping anyone, I dont think it effected the town, did it?
3. I have never been scum, though if I was I'd do what everyone else was doing during RVS and vote for someone randomly as a townie would.

---

Memo: One problem, I've found Seraphim scummy in every game I've played with him, I dont like it >_> Maybe its a natural vibe from him, maybe he should simply work on his gameplay, but I'd feel pretty shitty to be honest if this turns into a habit. Apologies Sera, it really isnt personal.

[PhilyEc]

Ghostwriters last post: Mar 16, 1am. (GMT)
LHNM's last post: Mar 16, 11:40pm. (GMT)
ZEEnon's last post: Mar 16, 3am. (GMT)

[strokes imaginery beard]

[PhilyEc]

After stalking Ghostwriter my investigation results:
Posting actively after the 16th in both Cheat Mafia and South Park Mafia.

After stalking LHNM my investigation results:
Posting actively until 16th in Robot Chicken Mafia.

After stalking Zeenon my investigation results:
Latest post was here.



Ghostwriter, are you feeling reluctant to post here or is it necessary that you continue to lurk?

[PhilyEc]

122 & 123 were made mostly out of boredom due to the fact that;

Ah man... It's one of these games... where everyone talks... *rolls eyes*

You're very correct sir. People need to start posting and not reading & waiting (better term for this?) Best thing that one can do is hope Glados & Crayons express some interest in the latest developments.

Till something happens I'll continue to zzz.

[PhilyEc]

Why is the best thing I/anyone else can do is hope that I express some interest in the "latest developments?" And what specific "latest developments" are you wanting me to comment upon which I have not already?

Albert's childish outburst to be exact. Its very emotional and has little content. Not only that he performed an OMGUS, his second weakly backed vote.

Nobody seems to care o-o

[PhilyEc]

Its pretty easy to misrep a post where all you give the direct question is a one word answer though (being 'scum'). I thought you earlier accused Giuseppe of misreping your post by this;

I hadn't actually seen this when I was reading the topic before, but upon seeing the quote in Phil's post, sirens went off in my mind. Zwet doesn't normally wait to hear other people's opinions... This is massively out of character. This seems to me like scum who want to hear a Townie's PoV before latching on and repeating the same argument, thus clearing themselves.

Of course, then again, after seeing Zwet's post, I thought of ABR's most recent post, and saw how they were quite similar. Both in the severity of their condemnations of their respective targets, and also the seeming lack of their own arguments to bring to the table.

FoS: Zwet and ABR

Is this what you're thinking of and typo'd the wrong name?

[PhilyEc]

I hadn't actually seen this when I was reading the topic before, but upon seeing the quote in Phil's post, sirens went off in my mind. Zwet doesn't normally wait to hear other people's opinions... This is massively out of character. This seems to me like scum who want to hear a Townie's PoV before latching on and repeating the same argument, thus clearing themselves.

Also, does anyone else find wasser's post 73 exceptionally odd? As in, he thinks he has found scum on page three and then, instead of explaining his conviction, he wants someone else to respond to something I can't readily identify first?

The only thing that can be considered 'the exact same thing' is the FoS.

[PhilyEc]

So you want me to say something more about something I've already commented upon while I'm awaiting a reply because that's the only thing people can rely upon to see activity in this game? ... Wow.

Well how can you explain Albert's reaction? Its 'Wow' itself and I think it deserves more attention.
---
Rest of your post I agree with, I think I've mentioned some of what you've said earlier regarding your opinion of Zwet's behaviour but its a good summary of what hes

really

said.

[PhilyEc]

[Reads new Bleach manga]

Oh lordy~

[PhilyEc]

... Processing ...

Zwetschenwasser: A Play in Three Parts

Act #1: Zwetschenwasser, what do you think about Green Crayons?

Scum, but I want Phily to answer first.

Act #2: Zwetschenwasser, why did you not vote Green Crayons? There were no questions for Phily at the time!

I think Phily could be scum. That's why I was holding off on GC until Phily gave me something to work with. How is this hard to understand?

Act #3: Zwetschenwasser, didn't Phily already give you something to work with?

Exactly. Which is why I didn't ask for something to work with. I had just gotten it.

Zwetschenwasser exuant. Fin.

I find no way to read these three statements without there being a contradiction. If he had already gotten what he wanted from PhilyEc, he had no reason to hold off voting for Green Crayons. This looks like a classic case of muddying the water.

~~~

Thanks, that clears up and pretty much explains why I couldnt make sense of Zwet's intentions, perhaps hes trying to look like someone contributing rather than simply flinging around contradicting claims of intention.

I'm still happy with my vote at the moment as Zwet hasnt had the chance to explain yet.

---

@Albert
You some sort of representative now? You decide when the questions come? Thats a very arrogant think to say wouldn't you agree? Also...is water wet?

[PhilyEc]

EBWOP: Thing* to say (staying up far too late..)

[PhilyEc]

I apologize. Expect content later today.

That was yesterday, please post something sustantial soon, as you can see we're in need.

[PhilyEc]

Wow strange night, two people returned

@Zeenon

LOLCAT logic vote on you was a joke vote, thought that would be obvious =P

I acknowledge that later in the game you explain yourself, but I find this post really suspicious.

Later explain myself? I prove I have reason to doubt Green Crayons by providing what are obviously written up notes on him after people make it obvious I should just spit it out, after I 'explained myself' scrutiny over the post you mention vanished and for good reason.

PhilyEC, why would you not state your reasons for voting instead of getting other people to try and determine them?

I believe the second Albert came under scrutiny he curled up into a defensive little ball and began firing out craplogic claims to seem more like a poor player rather than have to answer questions. Perhaps hes not good at defending himself or perhaps he doesnt want to allow too much attention to come his way this early. I'll post some of the quotes that make me feel like this;

PhilyEc, your most recent squander, coupled your suspicious behavior outlined in the quote below, have shown us how little you understand the game.

I will now ignore you entirely until you post something of value.

My oh my, someone doesnt want the spotlight put under him alright. Its okay Albert, your avoidance will be accepted instead of a respectable post. (you're still due at least one)

Vote Albert

If you're town, ignoring someone questioning you will never vice well, if you're scum, thank you.

Unvote, vote PhilyEc

What I like about Giuseppe's last post is how he's shown that he doesn't pretend like he knows what he's doing, different to PhilyEc, who knows very little about what he's doing, but likes to show off a whole lot.

What's that? Did you guys hear something? Maybe just the wind

Unvote

I've decided to get back into the game. I will take no questions for the moment.

Last quote makes me wonder, what happened to make him unvote? He seemed pretty serious about that OMGUS, could it have been an emotionally driven vote instead of a reasonable one?

I'm happy with where my vote lies ZEEnon.

[PhilyEc]

@Zwet
Nice, you made a post consisting of paragraphs (first from you that I've seen). One question. Are you observing the rest of the town as well or only me?

[PhilyEc]

Thanks Gorrad, oh and Zwets, considering you're playing so many games, is this the reason you've decided to observe only one person? If so, what exactly did I do that caught your eye?

@Giuseppe
Any idea of who here seems most scummy? I'd really like to know what you're thinking right now (understands you're V/LA but I think you'll see this question later).

@LHNM
Seems like an opinion of Giuseppe rather than a scummy move, could be seen as a pre-emptive strike to start a wagon effect but I dont see that happening anytime soon. That would be taking a leap to assume though. A vote seems inappropriate, even scummy in its own sense.

@Gorrad
Following the lynch all liars principle? "completely incorrect, and hypocritical" to him admiting lying is scummy and never good? Seems very correct to say such a thing in his case, though hes basically agreeing with people that what he did deserves a vote. What you've left out is his defense that hes not good with defending himself in the first place.

I think claiming to be poor at your defending yourself is okay, but lying to do it? Either he paniced or else its another lie. This would seem more appropriate to vote towards.

[PhilyEc]

EBWOP: @LHNM:
Seems like an opinion of

Gorrad's

(Apologies, I was referencing as I typed the post, never read it back)

[PhilyEc]

It was a poke up backsides to get people talking, I was mimicing what Giuseppe did in our other game because I liked the idea. Must admit, it didnt seem to be effective, if I'd waited a while till those 3 werent posting then maybe it would've been more appropriate but couldnt see that coming, anyways, it wasnt a protown effort. I hate people who dodge D1. Theres a fair amount of it going on here in my opinion.

[PhilyEc]

You seem too eager to prove to us that you're town.

Thats your point. (I seem to want to prove im town early)

it wasnt a protown effort. I hate people who dodge D1. Theres a fair amount of it going on here in my opinion.

Thats my intention basically. To elaborate, those who dont post make the game less interesting.

That's not the point. I've been observing you because of my discomfort with this early post.

Thats your point. (You're discomforted by the fact that I look like I'm trying to prove I'm town)

---


So how is my explanation of my intent 'not the point'? Thats like casting it off as irrelevant when it directly answers your suspicions.

[PhilyEc]

@Gorrad
I thought LAL = LAWL = LOL o.o Anyways you answered my question to you anyway, you're not in favour of lynching all liars like I assumed as scum eat up his coming out about lying. Hmmm

Does this mean you think Green Crayons is scummier than Giuseppe?

[PhilyEc]

And in the case of fakeclaim cop, lie, claim vanilla. I believe that player should be lynched simply becuase of that lie. Do you disagree with it?

If the guy is still alive the next day then I'd find it very suspicious. Usually scum would have to pick someone down to intuition but if someone was acting like cop and managed to claim in a way that they were believable then scum would target them. If scum didnt its because the person is trying to be confirmed town when they arent, falling back on a vanilla role would look scummy. Existing cop would probably push the lynch on them and make it very easy to identify real Cop for scum.

(This happened this evening on EpicMafia but it was a Bodyguard instead of a Cop.)

[PhilyEc]

Xtoxm,you're in this game? O_o Damn you need to post more xD

Albert, whats up with you and the lazy posts? Zwet wagon doesnt appear until he at least defends himself. Obviously hes explained his actions but theres plenty of room to elaborate.

[PhilyEc]

That boy needs to grow up.

If it looks like scum, smells like scum and plays like scum, its

probably

scum.

Boy? You are terribly rude, grow some sort of conscience before you bother posting another sloppy-joe of tripe.

Since you dont bother stating HOW someone is ANYTHING is there any point in even listening to you? I'm sick of this jackassery on your part. Shape up or else ask for a replacement because you're failing to meet the expected output of the average scummer.

(As you can tell I'm very bothered by this persons disgraceful behaviour.)

---

Apologies Xtoxm, I had not noticed someone was replaced, welcome.
Might be a bit of a stretch for the time being but any opinions you have of players in this game so far? (Concerning scummy behaviour)

---

so are we lynching zwet or what

(Adds Scum Points)

[PhilyEc]

I was talking about Hitsugaya but that works too

Ahk, sorry Albert, I didnt realise we had posted almost simultaneously thus thats why it looked like you were replying to me. Still. Try contributing more beforing accusing people, its like you're living off the towns progress and as you can tell its annoying me.

[PhilyEc]

@Albert
Right. Okay you're completely in the right and havent been acting like a baby. Its all my fault and I made you take it to an emotional level, I apologise. Lets get on with this game. (Forgets all the useless stuff) Bing!

@Green Crayons
"it's mafia theory masturbatory conversation." Worthy of a Wiki page. The rest of your post seems reasonable enough, you certainly went more quiet over the weekend but its easy to assume you were off enjoying yourself. Looking forward to your more substansive post.

@Zwet
Thank you, I like being told I'm town, makes me feel like I'm doing something good for the game. I agree with Korlash, you need to ask more questions. I notice you did this more in the other games we're playing together but not here, is it just more difficult to find something to question or are you behaving differently on purpose? (Sorry for bringing up meta info, I just notice you tend to be more forward rather than reserved and watchful in games, thus its really bothering me).

@Xtoxm
"No, but I don't find him scummy, and i'm not liking the manner in which he's being attacked."

Hes making votes and accusing people of being scum without explanation or elaboration, his watching seems to not have helped him much since he'll stilll think I could be scum during the game as would any player until I or anyone else is confirmed. Can you explain why you think its an attack rather than interogation of suspicious behaviour (that being as how I've seen it).

[PhilyEc]

This feels to me like Zwet manipulating Phil onto his side, and the 'pro-town' flattery in Zwet's posts after their little scuffle on page 7, on top of Zwet's odd tie to Phil *IE waiting for his opinion, and the pro-town remarks so soon after he (Zwet) finished suspecting him (Phil)*

Yes, I noticed this. He concentrated on me 'confirming' that he believes I'm town but never does he explain why he thinks GC is scum. Confirming scum > Confirming town.

I still think Albert's craplogic (i.e.

instinct

upon myself) shows scummy tendancies, his reluctance to vote for me now due to the fact that Zwet has more votes is also not very town play. If he could highlight why each seems scummy perhaps that would give insight into why hes between voting for Zwet or Phily. Instead he seems to be waiting for a good moment to step into events without grandstanding. Perhaps hes after a mislynch, this is just speculation.

---

Gorrad, you probably knew this was coming. Why do you think I'm the best place to pop your vote down on until you find someone scummier? Gut feeling can go both ways (mine seems to betray me alot of the time) , has your gut feeling proven accurate in the past?

[PhilyEc]

I dont like the Temple of Worship Albert seems to be building up around Green Crayons already. Its as if hes decided Green is confirmed town already, other than that I havent got much else to posts about since my last one.

[PhilyEc]

He did say 'for now', he probably has nothing strong enough to go on and I dont blame him. I'd like to hear from those less active here though, particularly Zeenon, he seems reluctant to play.

[PhilyEc]

We'll most likely have to push forth the deadline through request..I'm seeing promises of posts and no results though, me no likey!

@Albert
Without referencing to others beliefs can you please clearly explain your suspicions. Quoting scummy lines are fine but parroting GC endlessly isnt.

@Glados
Why are you admiting you're trying to make Seraphim look worse than the event seemed? Its like admiting you've made a scum move to justify yourself as not scum (beating them to the punch).

[PhilyEc]

ABR is something I can relate with but Zwet is 'scum' in everygame, fyi, I dont like it. His actions are extremely suspicious in this game to be fair in the way that hes behaving (being very reserved at the moment). I'm sure at least half of you here are aware of how outspoken he can be about any post rather than observing.

Any reason why you decided to do this Zwet? Hoping to see some flaw you could exploit in my posts or was your hunch just very strong?

[PhilyEc]

People look at the vote count. Look at the reasons. Theyre weak and yet hes earned himself many voters. I'm not convinced hes scum at all and I dont see the game going downhill just because hes here (aimed at you, Gorrad). I also see my prime suspect (Albert) voting for the same person as well as 4 others?

We have at least one scum in the group there obviously. My votes staying

right where it is

.

To any townies reading this, I think it would be wise to compare Albert's gaming to Zwet's. Both seem scummy but I think the jumping on of Zwet is an indication that if this lynch goes through, itll be a mislynch. Albert

being

on the wagon just makes me think more so that he is infact Mafia (Hollow).

[PhilyEc]

You definately pulled the classic "Look, I'm mafia trying to look like a town!" or the less classic "Look, I'm doc trying to not be subtle about me being the doc!" Either way, players don't congratulate the doctor anymore. It puts a big fat target on their head (by the town if they're scum; by scum if they're the doctor). So, congrats, you just exposed yourself for one or the other.

Extreme WIFOMing, closing other options. Take into account that ZEEnon's been inactive for the first day and was then eager to make up for that. Hes most likely town in my opinion, just tried to look it too much in the beginning unfortunately.

I fully support this, and for this reason I:
Vote: ZEEnon
FoS: Seraphim

I wonderful example of leeching, its scummy but not vote worthy. I'm currently considering a Korlash/Gorrad buddiness at the moment if anyones curious. Its worth consideration at least though at the moment its just a hunch. I'll be rereading to see if this is the case.

[PhilyEc]

First of all, I'm not blindly following OR leeching. I've seen scum do this first-hand, Random Mafia 3, where I led the attack on UROE D1. A case that started as him commenting on night kills.

I see this as trying to link 'blindly following' (poor town play) to MY accusation of 'leeching' (scummy). Where are you going with the meta though? You saw what I accused you of being done by scum?

---

Albert, starting to feel town vibes off you strangely enough...I dont think you deserve those votes either. Zeenon, Glados, do your positions on Albert still stand? Anyone else you're seeing as scummy? I could very well be missing out on something here.

[PhilyEc]

FoS: PhilyEc

. Something about using the phrase "leeching" directly after I myself use the phrase to describe ABR is rubbing me the wrong way. It feels like you have been ingratiating towards me for much of the game, and now I think I'm catching instances of imitation.

Check "Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:19 am Post subject: 18" when looking at all my posts. I was first to bring leeching into play to describe ABR. I noticed you doing exactly what you've accused me of yet I hadnt brought it up BECAUSE its a word anyone can utilise. Its best for people to keep using the same phrase to describe a players actions and then summarise it into a single line when recalling why said person is scummy a few pages on.

For example,

Replacement: "Hey whats the deal on ABR, why have you all voted him?"
PhilyEC: "Poor play is he is town, leeching off others reasoning, dont like his lack of enthusiasm."

Am I right about that being the case against him by the way?

[PhilyEc]

ick, sorry for double post. I'll reply to other posts later so I dont spam up the page.

Mod: Anyway you can delete the useless second one? T'wud be most appreciated~

Duplicate post deleted. -OGML

[PhilyEc]

But this makes me wonder. I'm not sure I believe that. There is a definite lack of immediacy between your use of the word leeching on Day One and my use of leeching on Day Two. I really only noticed your usage of it today because the word seemed to be suddenly popping up in multiple posts.

To the best of my recollection I've brought it up twice. I'm not that sure to be honest but this is what I believed when I typed why I felt you were the one using my phrase =P

Resulting to a personal insult when attacked like that when there was no need makes me pretty bloody set in my vote. You didn't have to post.You could have just waited and made a full response when it was later in the day. But you didn't; you went out of your way to insult Korlash without making any sort of response to his points.

Huge overstatement of what ZEEnon has done in context to the conversation they were having. If we go by your logic me, Albert, Korlash and Zeenon would be lynched just for cussing at someone. Thats leaving out any little insults anyone else has made.

---

@Albert
Seraphim has been acting pretty scummy on page 12...

@Korlash
You seem to be against Gorrad who adamantly agrues against those who think he doesnt deserve a vote. Seraphim seems to easily convinced. You're out of my suspect list for now.

Vote Gorrad

Hes just going in the wrong direction and behaves far too assuredly to be in a position where he doesnt actualy know Zee's role.

---

Do you guys feel like doing a scumlist soon? I'd like to see where the towns thoughts are at the moment.

[PhilyEc]

[reading Gorrads lastest post now]

[PhilyEc]

Did I say the insult was the basis for my suspicion? No. It's the final nail. And considering UROE in the quoted game, I'm perfectly fine lynching ZEE based on that one post.

Weak case. Simple as Gorrad. No ones biting and for good reason. I'd really like to see a Gorrad lynch today but that can change if you start acting more pro-town and patient for today.

[PhilyEc]

I'm willing to bet a Kor or Gor scum. I don't think they're together, so it would be an either/or situation. Would need to do an individual reread of each to determine which I think would be scummier.

But didnt Kor only start to contradict Gorrad when I mentioned how I thought the two were buddies earlier? I think it was just a poorly timed turn on a buddy since they were getting along fine till things fell on Gorrad (to the best of my recollection)

I still don't know why people aren't voting the self-admitted scumster. If Seraphim has an explanation for his poor play, I'm all ears. I think a votecount is nigh, so maybe an impending lynch will get him to attempt to explain himself.

Doubt he admited hes scum. Your words are strongly suggestive when Seraphim could be a poor townie right now.

[PhilyEc]

That was very kind of you to sum up, helps alot and I see where you're coming from here. I'd like to see Seraphims response to your recollection of events to be fair though. For now I agree that Seraphim does look like potential scum.

How has he interacted with Zwet in Day One? This may help [looking back on it later tonight]

[PhilyEc]

Welcome Mastin,

1: We have a night-kill immune player, who was shot, and the mafia wasted their shot because of that.
2: We have a roleblocker, who roleblocked the scum who sent in the kill.

Did the thought cross anyone else's mind?

Some sort of bulletproof crossed my mind, perhaps a jailer did the awesome deed.

They're just a spectator's wild speculation, and it might help scum in a nameclaim and hurt town in any future name claim as well, so I'd like to hear other opinions on the matter as well.

You're right to think that stating these opinions on whos got what role (concerning town players) is indeed a bad idea, but if you have any idea of who is mafia at the moment I'd like to hear your opinion. Obviously it wont be ripped apart since you just joined so nows your chance =/

---

Agree with GC about post 327.

In reply to Korlash,
Yeah, you seem pretty grumpy there. I've not even FoS'd you have I so why the sudden jump towards defense? I merely felt your attentions on Gorrad shifted into a negative manor as a connection between you and him began to come into view. Its made me suspicious, okay? Nothing worthy of a vote obviously though it does make you eligible for a reread. If I have the same problem with your actions then I'll be sure to make a more informative post as to why I've gone from theory to sureness.

At the moment I feel a Seraphim lynch would be more practical.

Unvote

Vote Seraphim

(L-2)

Might need to hear a claim sooner rather than later.

Anyone reading this, hammering aint cool until we get some discussion and a claim. I know you've all read this big bold text so, hammering then claiming you didnt know about the lynch being so close aint gonna happen or be accepted.

(This happens in more games than it should) ¬¬

[PhilyEc]

<3 Mastin

You're going to counterbalance PhilyEc perfectly. For every question PhilyEc asks, Mastin will provide five answers! No, six!!

Now I

know

this game is going to be fun.

Hes doing it to me somewhere else

[PhilyEc]

Haha, now now, I'm getting a chance to read his posts one by one so I think I'll survive this time. Hes probably not so destructive as I think (knock on wood).

Back to Topic,

Albert, what do you think of Gorrad & Korlash? I dont know which is scum but I think either are paired with Seraphim. Its a massive hunch to be perfectly honest but these little things building between them, their similar votes and suspicions make me wonder. I'm going to reread the game to get to a proper answer myself towards the Q Im asking you.
---

[PhilyEc]

A death scene would help determine that, but as we have no death scene to go off of, my speculation:

1: Arrancar. They're the only hollows who are actually in a team. Really, flavor-wise, can you think of any three hollows that work together, besides Arrancar? As to what they're called, no clue. I know, it's many arcs early (Arrancar are in the Arrancar arc, and in the Anime, that's not 'til ~110; this is in the first arc, apparently), but it makes sense.
2: Sosuke Aizen, Ichimaru Gin, and the third traitor captain. They're the big bad guys, after all, in Bleach.

3: CRAZY WILD THEORY: Ichigo Kurosaki and Uryu Ishida. I would be down-right shocked if this were the case, but it is a possibility

Sorry I meant, which players, not characters, my bad.

I think theyre going to be some of the beginning hollows though. One could very well be a disguiser though, the one that killed 'Kaien'. Remember? Black haired dude? This is speculation but since Zwet was such a minor hollow I'd go on to assume this hollow slaying competition contains all the first hollow characters =P Using their traits as reps for their powers. (ie. Zwet was a scum SK but also his character was previously a Japanese Serial Killer, his soul turned hollow.

Me too, and that's how I noticed him doing it to you too. Ahhh newbie games. I just hope he doesn't scare anyone off the site!! LOL

Bah. Me, scare someone off the site? Nah. They just night kill me instead.

Unless you be scum o.o

[PhilyEc]

Phil claims that the mafia are Hollows, where we can’t know that for sure.

I'm positive everyone against the town is hollow since.
a) Zwet was a typical hollow.
b) Intro states that "

the hollow bait

is proving more effective than anyone could have imagined and things are starting to spin out of control. Now everyone must do their part to save the residents of Karakura Town before they all end up as

hollow food

.

I dont see him dragging Arrancar into this, nor Espada. They'd not belong in a Hollow Slaying Competition to begin with.
Anyways it doesnt really matter what their roles are, theyre still mafia ands needs lynches.

I'd say its Seraphim, Korlash & ????. 3 scum might be too easy in this game thus I'd agree with those considering theres 4 (incl Zwet).

---

I could actually follow that long post Mastins, you're improving XD

[PhilyEc]

Warg. Not feeling good and up to the mental agility it's going to take to defend myself right now. First thing tomorrow...I had a jazz festival to go to yesterday and I didn't get home until midnightish...got five hours of sleep...so, not at the top of my game.

Drink some soda and watch some Afro Samurai, always fixes me up

To the others, I'm waiting for Seraphims long due response on our submissions. I think the game needs it at this point.

Mastins, hows your reread gone? Anyone you think is definately scum? (I'd like to look into some other people while I'm waiting).

My possi's are (in order of likelihood)
Seraphim
Korlash
Gorrad

Gorrad strikes me as the observer in this game, some of his actions have been questionable but hes overall ties with Korlash are making me wonder just how strong they were pre-game wise.

[PhilyEc]

*facepalm*

So many Okay that does help the both of you if either turns up scum during the game =\

Who do you think is acting more scummy at the moment between Zeenon and Seraphim?
(I think we have our scum with Seraphim but obviously votes on him right after hes promised to respond to people would be poor sportsmanship.)

[PhilyEc]

I've been catching up from when I last posted around the 4th. I think Seraphims roleclaim is true.

1) Kon is a very desirable character to have in this theme and I can see him being chosen by Mod.
2) The role seems quite reasonable.
3) No one else is giving out shit for Seraphim claiming their own role (due to 1 I think it does exist in this game).

Unvote

[PhilyEc]

In order to be a

true theme game

the mod should give the scum a few

believable roles to fakeclaim

. Kon definitly fits the description of a believeable role while also being minor enough to not be a main part of the set-up.

Theres a little bit of logic there but tons of speculation. I've not played at scum much but I've never seen a pm (after all roles revealed) stating possible roles scum can claim that others dont have. Rather this gives away roles that are in the game (narrowing down character list) thus I dont agree.

So just to be clear: you do not know the difference between ABR as town and ABR as scum? You just know how ABR “usually posts,” without knowing the context of those posts in an actual game?

You seem to be switching your direction from your last question, its misleading and makes Zeenon look like hes dodging after he answered your question over how he found all of Gorrad's current games. Either nitpicking due to lack of content (I see far better stuff to go on) or else scum trying to turn attention back on Zeenon, note, I dont think hes done anything too scummy.

Care to explain whats going on? It has been a few days since I read how this all began afterall.

[Moving onto page 18]

[PhilyEc]

Ok Sera's latest post makes far more sense. Tracker is most likely the only person effected as mod mentioned this action but not investigating or protecting.

Seraphim is confirmed in my books.

[PhilyEc]

How many theme games have you been in based off something like a show or a movie or something with a main pool of characters?

Rather than asking the noob, can you give me at least one example of this happening in another game?
To answer your question, none. I know nothing for sure but I can speculate that its a bad idea for mod to help scum in the sense that players dont know the roles either. No reveal games through stick to that sense for both sides no?

[PhilyEc]

I gave like 4 examples already...

I've not seen a single link to something real. Thats kinda what Im getting at when I say evidence...

And giving a safeclaim is not "helping scum" it is keeping the game fair. In a theme game like this there is a "town pool" of players. Ichigo, Kon, Chad, etc... And it's limited.

There is not 150 possible roles to claim.

Becuase of this should the town massclaim the scum would be screwed. They would have to pick some inane character and hope that it's not only not in the game already, but believeable enough to be a real role.

A viable option but due to Seraphim's specific description I choose to buy it. Why are you so sure hes lying?

This is Bleach mafia, there is a greater then average chance of safeclaims having been given to the scum. To say otherwise is just ignorant bliss.

Last time I checked there are dozens of characters, captains, hollows, rogues, Menos Grande even >_> Third parties may be in effect too, like the Boundo. Seraphim being Kon is believable, one of the other players seems convinced of this due to their role. His latest posts make the role clear yet you choose to believe hes using a safety net claim. Risk removed, easy for scum to fake.

IF we're to narrow down possible characters, Id say theyre residents of our village. Urahara, the kids, Ichigo and Uruyu are obv, Orihime, Chad, Rukia even. Kon is just another one of these people. That would narrow down scum to 3 funnily enough. (Though this is speculation)

[PhilyEc]

I only link if it's important to a case of mine. This is no more then me backing up what's happened in the past so I'm not respincible for telling you where to look. Either try the search button or disbelieve me I really don't care. In the long run it doesn't really matter if you do or don't believe safeclaims exist. If and when we get into a massclaim either I'll be proven wrong or you will.

You cant even name the specific games? =____= How people react to a claim can be scumtells too so I REALLY dont mind indulging in this topic for a while. Something tells me theres lurking afoot though..

In any case I'll have a look around finished games and hope to gawd you're right (for the sake of lazy man Phily actually looking for them) but I find the claim and role very believable.

The mechanics seems off, it doesn't fit flavor(Which doesnt disprove it, just doesnt sit in his favor either), his original claim of it left a lot out which he then used another two or so posts to fill out the holes, and I'm still trying to figure out if my role makes what he claimed less or more likely.

Well lets look at his two claims then, they should help when beside one another (retrieving thems)

I am Kon and have the ability to "hide" with another player rendering me untargetable for kills that night. However, if the player I am hiding behind is targeted for a kill, I also die.

I targeted Gorrad on N1.

I am Kon. Due to my compact body, I can hide with one person every night in their packs, shielding me from NKs. However, anyone tracking me via "spirit threads" will get confused and find the person I hid behind instead.

I targeted Gorrad on N1.

Only part I find weird in those claims is the 'behind' part when Kon hides through use of being a pill. Aye?

The difference is I'm being cautious in this uncertainty, and you're letting him walk away clean.

Assuming your question above this quote was rhetorical I'll carry on, yes you're being cautious and what I'm being cautious of is my suspect trying to ensue doubt upon the claim so earnestly. It does worry me Korlash, theres three reasons for this.
1) You're Kon
2) You're poor scum (since it seems town wont lynch Sera this round)
3) You're town sticking to your points since you really do believe them.

I'd like to go with three but I honestly cant yet.

I don't know what the Boundo is so that shouldn't be in either.

The tanned grey haired dude who goes around Soul Society topless trying to destory it, yeno... FILLER BOSS MAN.(Vampires)

I doubt Urahara is in it simply because he took a more sideline approach in this battle.

My role puts him in as a shoe-in dude. Thus I disagree. As for ze Kon thing again, I completely disagree (big suprise there~) as Kon's pill (being him) lets him go inside people in Bleach. Seraphim said behind, that worries me and perhaps why you aint believing him.

*Joins on walk to wagon*

[PhilyEc]

I strongly oppose a Zee or Sera lynch.

I'd like to see Korlash or Gorrad go as I've earlier made clear. I think everyone should post like this see we get a view on the majority of towns beliefs.
If we are wrong its poor town play and not scum driven. (Due to townies being far more of a majority atm)

Anyone that doesnt agree, tell me why, I dont want any one liners.

[PhilyEc]

Nice job town, I tried investigating Gorrad on my second night but got killed obviously. Wish I knew why =P