Zachtown in the mountains (Game over TOWN WINS!)

[Baby Spice]

NP Zachrulez.

Unvote

Will now go away and read.

[Baby Spice]

Ok, done my skim and buit my votals chart. So now I think I'll wander through the 14 pages (only 14 pages yay) and post my thoughts.

That said...D1 should only have 1 lynch. Not 100% on the mechanics of this double lynch, but I guess we can no lynch for one of the lynches and than perform a standard lynch.

I'm thinking we no lynch off the bat..and than progress the day as if it were normal.

and lo we have scum.

Anyone who wants to take the town from a situatuion where the scum can (effectively) only NK and night talk every other night back to every night must be scum. Throw away our biggest advantage, hah.

and #13 backtracks.

ITT: Scum explain how happy they are that they're not scum.

?? More like scum complain about how they wish they were scum.

#37 #57 I am Innocent(5) : Oso, Sotty, Jason, Benmage, Elmo.

That's a hell of a wagon for RVS, and everyone following such a stupid reason to vote. (Ok, a reasonable RVS reason but not to 5 votes) (6 if you count Furcolow) Definately something hinky here and I dare say, There's scum on that there wagon!

lol, #41 Benmage calls IaI scum for showing why Ben's scummy idea was wrong, although Ben doesn't say it directly. Way to go Benscum. That's the second time you quote Dry-fit btw.

Was the information I provided helpful to the town? Was it hurtful to the mafia?

It was null. It was filler. Therefore it was scummy and not helpful for the town.

The correct answer was yes showing a scummy plan is scummy is helpful to town and yes it was hurtful to the mafia.

Don't understand Percy's #52 and RedCoyote's #55 sotty votes. Sotty asked a reasonable question. Nice to see Oso and Locke agree

(Keep in mind that I may establish rules pertaining to the scum's ability to night talk privately with the scum team. The town will not be informed as to these requirements.)

Apparently Zach is taking away mafia's night talk to make up for that.

What made you come to that conclusion based on that quoted statement? I would think scum have day talk.

?? Open setup, mod only refers to night talk. Why would you think that the scum have daytalk?

Nikanor's comment is hinky but so is yours.
Though since it's mentioned, requirements makes it sound like the scum team have to do somerthing re night talk.

Elmo #69 comes to Ben's defense for some reason, and votes the most obvtown person to this point
Hinky Elmo.

Bottom page 3. Benscum, hinky posts, and lurkers galore.

Page 4. Elmo == town and IaI == Vi as it's only drunks and VI's who tend to vote for themselves (ignoring the rare quick hammerer)

Hmm, Jason's #98. Blatant buddy on Sotty and a vote on town that includes buddying as a reason.

Reasonless votes on Nikanor are bad. The reason should have been stated.

Post 94 mon, obv misrep /scum can you find it? Will show later and deal with innocent who after this game really needs to ho back to the newbie section. I am not opposed to his lynch/being replaced out.

Ben, this is your third post

whilst

you are supposedly V/LA. I don't consider this a good sign.

*Headdesk*

Furcolow. 'nuff said'

As of post #70, you can REALLY BELIEVE SOMEONE IS A TOWNIE?
I'm not fucking buying this

*headdesk*

#114 three posts and Furc is scum. Showing why a scummy idea is scummy is not filler Furc, but voting the biggest wagon for bad reasons is.

#125 Oso adds himself to the townie list.

flat out lie. He is not a day cop.. If he was, he would know my proper role and not that I am mafia.

The day cop thing was an obvious joke in a pr-less game, so why did you take it so seriously and respond like this? Hell, it's almost like you're trying to soft claim a pr or panic claim that you're not mafia.
Furc yeah, he has history of not reading rules/set-ups so I can understand him buying it.
I don't know whether Nik is just dumb for making such a joke at that point, scum trying to avoid posting content, or flaming brilliant/lucky with an amazing/lucky stunt.


#149 doesn't look good for you Jason. How would a cop know what your role is? Cop would only know your alignment. Yet you go on and on about now realising that it's a mountainous game. Are you trying to cover up your aparent soft claim of a role in a previous post?

I gues like me they didnt take into account the vanilla setup

Maybe they recognised it for the stupidly timed joke that it was.

I was saying IF we were going to only lynch once in a day, there would be no possible advantage in no lynching the first day, because all that does is make it so we can't change our minds later.

Benmage's scummy idea makes a reappearance. Slightly re-imaged to try and make it more town friendly but still scummy.
Dry-Fit makes the scum list.

IAI is one of the players I suspect the most,

lol, IAI shows why a scummy idea is scummy, you know the one you mention earlier in the post, so of course you suspect him.
Then Dry-Fit backtracks his Oso case.

Middle page 8, and I'm going to post this.

Town

Oso.
Elmo.
Percy.

Scum

Benmage
JasonT
Nikanor
Furcolow.
Dry-Fit.

Quick scummary
Benmage, scummy suggestion, scummy follow ups
JasonT bad reaction to joke claim "Role" as opposed to "alignment"
Nikanor. Badly timed joke cop claim. One of jason or Nik is scum. Bet on it. Unlikely both.
Furcolow. Scummy ideas are still scummy, wagon hopping is scummy, hell, just scums it up.
Dry-Fit. Someone who shows why scummy idea is scummy is generally not scummy themselvs, but calling them scummy is.

[Baby Spice]

Ben, this is your third post

whilst

you are supposedly V/LA. I don't consider this a good sign.

That's because you are a noob. Activity is a town-tell.

The first two posts I can understand, claim the absence then spend a bit of time catching up whatever. But that third post just smacks of you monitoring the thread and deciding to make comment.
Faking a V/LA is a scum tell, as it's a form of active lurking, and that sounds like what you were doing.
Trying to mis-rep a scum tell as a town tell, along with the insult, just makes it worse by a long way.

Still have sixish pages to catch up on, but Ben's response here makes me certain.

Vote benmage

[Baby Spice]

Typical scummy defense there Ben. No defending your scummy actions, just throwing insults.
About what I expect from you.

[Baby Spice]

Really? Votes for lying and Fake claiming are bad... noted.

So now that I challanged you on not giving a reason you decide top give one.

Very long Absence. Yeah I kinda know what that means. I, and just about every other person I've seen, also make a specific not when it's just an access thing. So yeah, you were Active Lurking.

Oh Jason btw. Benscum has not explained away the case against him. Benscum made a suggestion that can only benifit scum. "I took it back" does not explain it away. Hammering (figuratively) the person who prooved that the suggestion is scummy with "I took it back" is not explaining it away. Voting the person who prooved it scummy is not explaining it away.



Love the way that 2 of my top scum picks are ignoring my case on one of them though. "Play the man" is only a defense in football.

[Baby Spice]

Sorry for the absence, ran out of time in my life.

Post 343"]That's a hell of a wagon for RVS, and everyone following such a stupid reason to vote. (Ok, a reasonable RVS reason but not to 5 votes) (6 if you count Furcolow) Definately something hinky here and I dare say, There's scum on that there wagon

What would have been a reasonable number for this wagon in RVS then?
[/quote]
Not over halfway to a quicklynch

Think I said hinky not scummy btw.

[Baby Spice]

Alright, now that DF has flipped goon, I will expain what made me change my vote to hammer and also lessen suspicion on Fur, don't get me wrong I still think Fur has been scummy and is worth looking at however that last post by DF looked like a diliberate attmpt of distancing and/or buddying to make Fur look bad.

Does that mean that you weren't going to explain it if he flipped town?


Back to the Daycop thing.
The reaction to his joke is what is scummy. Reguardless of it being true or not, some people jumped like he was right.

Also Elmo is so obv town that he should be in the dictionary for it.

[Baby Spice]

You hammered. It's not like you haad to convince anyone else to follow your vote, or had to worry about a counter wagon or anything.
I can see no town reason for withholding your supposed reasons, nor can I see any town reasons for you saying "Now that he has flipped scum ..." and giving them.

Pure and simple you bussed and hammered a scum mate with a poor reason and tried to hide it.

lol Benmage. Leader says obv town is not todays lynch. Would that be coaching since you had no night chat to use? (Since we've had no night)

Vote Benmage

Benmage and Jason are the lynch. Not Percy, not obv town. Just those two scum.

[Baby Spice]

Sorry about being absent. Struggling to keep up with the Stars Aligned monster

Will hopefully catch up later today.

[Baby Spice]

IaI

#437. I started with my most likely scumdidate.

BabySpice.. you are hellbent on pushing a scumslip on me... how do you respond to accusations of a scumslip from yourself?

When people are that obvtown, why not call them town? and Jason, not pushing a scumslip. Pushing a really weird reaction.
Kind of weird though that you have claimed lack of interaction with a read as a scumtell for both myself and Percy. I'll give you a hint. I question/pressure scum (That's you), not town. That's why I haven't been questioning/pressuring Percy.

Also loving how Benmage calls himself confirmed town, and Hannity by the looks, but you don't seem to question them.

what is your case on [Benmage]

Scummy idea that can only help scum is scummy. beating on the player who prooved it scummy is scummy. Ergo ...

Wishy washy language is wishy washy.

(That means I find it scummy btw)

Wishy washy language comment is just so much ffttt! if it's scummy I call it scummy. If it's hinky I call it hinky. Hinky =/= scummy. (But it may be)
I wonder how you can make that wishy washy language comment if you have been reading what I've been saying.

You should probably know I am married to the mod,

boo hiss, unfair advantage

and her present lurking through Phase 2,

It's keeping up with your bloody game that's killing my time Percy!

Did you notice that I was on V/LA for a week

Actually, no I don't think I did.

Jason #492. Have a look at that game. have a look at me complaining about lack of time in that monster 85+page post fest. SERIOUSLY, HAVE A LOOK.

[Baby Spice]

Ben, what exactly makes you "confirmed" town. Someone saying you were obv town I'd accept after all people are allowed to be wrong, but confirmed?

[Baby Spice]

Benmage is still arrogant scum, nothing changed there. Seriously 'confirmed' in this game means you're dead and flipped. Claiming otherwise is scum trying to make themselves into a white knight and lead the town to a loss.

Sotty, Mina. You both seem to be having a go at each other, but are both voting the same player. It makes me think that one of you is faking the discussion/arguement, which is scummy, whilst buddying up to them, which is also scummy. Or that one of you is bussing hard and trying to use the other as cover.

Vote Lrdwhyt

[Baby Spice]

Your reasoning is bizarre and what makes it even worse is that you join the wagon myself and Mina are on. WTF?

To see if either you or Mina decided to jump off of LrdWhyt and vote for me.

Basically, I think that little Mina/Sotty thing sounded fake, but couldn't pick which one of them sounded off to me.
I thought if I'm wrong on benmage, and I'll happily admit I could be unlikely as it is, then perhaps one of Sotty or Mina was voting a scum buddy. If that was the case then they might panic and jump on me if I added a vote. having the wagon get to L-1 (Zach forgot my vote in the votecount so it was off Locke) would indicate that I might have been wrong on Benmage and that Sotty was trying to bus LrdWhyt.

Still think that Ben is far too arrogant though.

To follow on. If Sotty thought that Lrd was scum, she'd stay there and suspect me of bussing. If Sotty was scum driving a mis-lynch she'd stay there and ride it down, especially with the vote count being off. Accidental hammer and all being easy to excuse in that case and it would screw up wagon analysis.

[Baby Spice]

Hey Sotty. try reading the rest of my post that you quoted from where I answer your question.

Then answer this question. Why did you jump off of a wagon you started when it hit L-1?

[Baby Spice]

Mod, #616. You missed a vote I believe

[Baby Spice]

Personally Mina, I was happy leaving my vote on Lrdwhyt while I re-read and things, rather than throw my vote around willy nilly or wagon shop.

Ben, you do realise that when Percy was at L-1, you're the one who unvoted?

So we have both Benmage and Sotty starting wagons, on different people, and then jumping off when they reached L-1. I have no idea what to make of that, though it is hinky to then see Ben asking why the Percy wagon stalled.

Unvote

Vote Sotty

Sotty/Lrdwhyt are my top pairing for scum, with Ben as a possible. If ben is scum then I'd have to think I was wrong on Percy despite the supertowntell and general early townieness. (Though supertowntell looses strength if Ben is scum)

[Baby Spice]

Do you even read before you post? Percy never even got to L-1, he was L-2 with the next largest wagon at L-4(Red's)...but he managed to wiggle himself out. When Red's increased to L-2, and Percy's decreased I unvoted.

You're part right and yes I made a slight mistake.

Percy was at L-2 when you unvoted, but you were the one to start the run from Percy.
Doesn't change my question though.

Sotty, what questions? I believe the only one was did I find your vote scummy, and I think me calling you my top scumspect kind of answered that. But le me make this clear.

Sotty7's unvote of Lrdwhyt and vote of me was scummy, scummy, scummy! It reaked of sotty panic jumping off of a bus she had started.
Nothing here that I've said is new, except for repeating scummy a few times, so when Sotty asked her question I had already answered it. Again.

Actually, my posts have already adressed Mina's questions as well Sotty.

When Percy was run up the pole, and there was more than one, each time he didn't vote for the biggest alternate wagon. He voted for the player he thought was scum. This is mega town, (assuming that Benmage isn't scum with Percy). I had a town read on Percy from D1P1, but this one action just cements him as town.

(If Benmage is scum with Percy then the wagon looses much of the pressure on Percy due to the way Ben was/is driving it and he could then afford to risk faking this major tell)

[Baby Spice]

Sotty, I do believe I've said in a different game that you are in that I hate meta arguements because I don't know people here. One game doesn't make a meta btw. Ten maybe.

Also, normal game bussing partner into the noose =/= mountainous game bussing partner to leave yourself at 12/1. (Not that Gonzo was that normal from the brief look I had)

Jason, Benmage willing to vote a town read on a deadline is a null to me. That the deadline is artificially imposed by him, that he is the one who suggested n0-lynching, and is (I think) the only player to actually vote no-lynch but is now willing to deadline lynch is what raises the red flag.

[Baby Spice]

IaI what the hell are you on about?
Someone had a go at Benmage for being willing to vote a town read just because of a deadline (that is artificial).
Percy is even more obv town because he wouldn't vote a town read alternate wagon when he was leading the vote count.
I am not going to vote a town read, even if it is the lead alternate wagon*, especially if someone threatens me like you just did.
(*Actually, my personal votal chart is a few votes behind, I don't think Percy is the lead alternate wagon.)

Vote Lrdwhyt

Voting Sotty isn't going to go anywhere. So onto a secondry scumspect.

[Baby Spice]

LL. I didn't pick it up at first with Benmage, but with Sotty it stood out.

Basically, I keep seeing what appear to be faked arguements between people, mostly what appear to be faked on one side, and to me a faked arguement means scum. Ergo, if I see a faked arguement then it means that one of the two participating is quite possibly scum.

Spotting two of them like that at the same time made me wonder if I was judging things properly. I really didn't know what it meant because I was seeing too many of those wagon starters jumping things. Of course, being wrong on when Ben's little spat happened changed that.

[Baby Spice]

If I understand this right people are voting me because (In no particular order);
A: They think I'm town and want to use my flip to implicate Percy.
B: They think I'm Percy's scum buddy and want to use my flip to implicate Percy.
C: I wont vote Percy who they think is scum.
D: Voting Mongoose.

For gods sake take a step back people and look at yourselves. Reguardless of what you think of me, the confirmational bias that is on almost every vote on me is staggering.
The only person who does not seem to be suffering from that is Percy, who unvoted when you guys laid all that crap on me.


Sotty. Your original vote on Lrdwhyt stank of fake along with that arguement with mina, which is what made your unvote terribad. Bens vote on Percy has never seemed fake. It only looked hinky when (mistakenly) combined with yours. Percys vote also has never looked fake, and quite franky as I said above the wagon on me stinks of bad reasoning/linking. You Sotty be the apples, Ben and Percy be the oranges.

[Baby Spice]

Lrdwhyt has requested replacement.

Unvote

Replacements should be given a chance to speak for themselves.

[Baby Spice]

This is actually nowhere near true; whilst the first three reasons seem to be the reasons Benmage is voting for Baby Spice,

Nowhere near true huh.

A:

At any point Percy would appear to be a viable lynch I'd be voting/hammering him no questions asked. I think BS is a town village idiot and therefore a mislynch. However as our lynch one deadline draws near I have no problem switching my vote to ensure the lynch especially since I think it will further implicate Percy.

That said if I recall (since I'm on my phone) BS was also someone I named undesirable to have around lylo. So its all wins in my book.

B:
Ok, B might have been stretching Mina's and Jason's points a little. But they both have expressed it.

C:

Baby Spice, last chance for self preservation. If you do not vote Percy in your next post, I vote for you to move you to L-1.

D:
[quote="Thor #641]I never even had a town read on Mongoose for her to destroy

[/quote][/quote][/quote]

Only ever says I'm scum, usually with reference to Mongoose. No actual reason or anything.

Yeah, nowhere near true.

Sotty, L-3 with at least two players I can think of saying that Lrdwhyt is one of their top two suspects who aren't voting him. Yep, he's in danger.


Furcolow: How about we lynch someone who votes at the drop of a hat, who votes as a knee jerk reaction to anyone who questions him, who's logic is bad and who is totally unpredictable.

E: Vote made by Furcolow.

I'd rather vote someone who is actually scummy, not because of stupid reasons (a: c: e:) Even d: isn't a brilliant reason.

[Baby Spice]

damn, quote failure.

Zach pretty pls ...

[Baby Spice]

btw Sotty.
I replaced into newbie 1012 at L-1 about 7 hours before deadline for D1 in a game with deadline lynching rules.

Nameloc did it then and it seemed like a good idea to me, and yes Lrdwhy was in some danger I believe.

[Baby Spice]

Percy, two of those responses were direct, unambiguous quotes from the people involved.

I don't see how I can treat Benmage, IaI, or even Jason's votes as anything else. Thor has never actuallys stated a reason, just Mongoose is scummy and baby Spice didn't change that.

Ben stated catagorically, and I quoted, he's voting town to implicate you by my flip, IaI stated he would vote me ifI didn't vote you and he did. Furc voted me to stop IaI getting the L-1 spot for gods sake.
Sotty appears to be voting me because I called her scum.

The only one who appears to be saying anything actually about me is yourself, and that is simply that you don't understand why I voted Lrdwhyt. Your question to me that you are harping on, why did I vote lrdwhyt, I answered pages ago, so I don't understand why the hell you are asking it again.

But just for you:
I strongly believe that her arguement with Mina, that led to her vote on Lrd was faked. So I followed her vote to see what she would do.
I strongly believe that Sotty's actions in voteing and then later unvoting for Lrd was bussing.
Since a wagon on Sotty wouldn't fly I voted for the other side of the bus, Lrd.


After looking for that Newbie 1012 I decided to check my reads from that game.
My strongest town read in newb 1012 turned out to be scum, way I'm going it will probably be the same here.

[Baby Spice]

Defends Dry-fit? I voted #1 scumspect not #2 while there was something like two weeks left, how is that scummy?
Thor, check other games. Sotty and I had that hinky=/=scummy in more than one game.
Scummy ideas are scummy ideas and should be pressured, even if the idea is made in error, and Ben's was scummy.
When have I claimed a play-style. Claiming to play to a play-style is faking a meta and faking a meta is scummy. I've voted for that in other games too.

Sotty/Mina is gut pure and simple. I can't point to what seemed fake about it, but it seemed fake.

[Baby Spice]

Have I used the word "interesting".

Hinky: "Something as yet undefinable is wrong, out of place; not quite right." (From a web dictionary.)
: "I've got a bad feeling about this" from a different web dictionary. (Yay, Han Solo moment)

[Baby Spice]

Can you feel the love


Nikanor, glad to see it was the size and not my abruptness in the QT that put you out.

Zach

I'm happy for the QT to be posted.

I think the scum team just got off to a horrid start with Dry-fit and Mongoose, and Thor did a brilliant job recovering.
Note to self, never offer to replace into a game and ask for the scummiest position lol

A lot of my actions this game were about getting Nikanor/Thor as squeaky clean as possible and sow as much doubt as possible. More doubt equals more options for mis-lynches. I did hope to survive one more phase though.


Oh, the tell. (From the dead chat). Thor's quote in his siggi.

[Baby Spice]

Must say though that the phrase "Love Mina" did appear more than once in the scum QT, from both Thor and myself.

Siggi thing was more that it was the only real link between us. Perhaps I saw it for more than it was because I knew more.

[Baby Spice]

That I agree with. Also I think the starting scum team didn't think it through and chose poorly right at the start to have the chat D1P2 not D1P1.

I also think Mina's idea to trim down the town was actually a good one.