A Gentleman's Game of Guile, Subterfuge, and Intrigue (Fin)

[ToastyToast]

Hello, my friends! If the above post was indeed not a lynch, then

Unvote

whoever i am voting for.

[ToastyToast]

So I had a catchup post, but, when I pressed submit, the thread was locked and I lost it all. Instead, I'm going to give a list.

Buttered Toast

Feysal: He brings up a lot of good points, its that simple. Its unfortunate his stance on TS was ignored.

imaginality:Sure, he went after me. But his willingness to try other cases and search other venues gave me many plus points. He comes off as a very interrogation-oriented player, and I like it. 1 negative: his similar "this wearies me" thing he did when choosing to vote TS

Toast

Reya Cookiebringer

Apokalyptika

--lolwho?

DemonHybrid

GMan

--not much to say here. maybe i have to relook at the slot, but I have nothing

kpaca*--I liked him, but he hasn't said nearly enough. Leaning town.

vezokpiraka*--Nothing wrong with his slot at the moment, but nothing good enough has been said to put him on town-reads, either.

Burnt Toast

Sir Hoppster--I am pretty much shocked by his stance on TS. I cannot mention any games in particular, but I can mention the fact that you hydra together. I recognize TS as being a very whimsy player, one who comes of as scummy because of his apparent love for WIFOM. Also, your declaration that he ABSOLUTELY CAN'T BE SCUM. Does TS ordinarily make cases? nope. I have played a game with just Hoppster as well, and got strong town vibes when compared to this game.

inHimshallibe*--very wishy-washy. He likes Hoppster and he likes TS, but at the end of the day seems so sure of himself when he tells TS "Its time for you to leave." He spent significant time on the discussion, and yet his votes come from posts that seem...detached--manufactured, if you will

lord_hur

Caboose

**--My vote for the lurker-scum of the group. He only voiced suspicions, he didn't push anything. All his posts came off as "well, I had to say something!" Tunneled Apokalyptica, placed TS as a null read.

Vote:

Sir

Hoppster

He strikes me as the type to lead a scum team, and the way he danced everyone around and into a TS lynch makes me sure of this.

[ToastyToast]

As for the NK speculation, I highly doubt the two kills came from the same faction. Same kill flavor for all kills is a possibility, which means we may have a third party, second scum team, or a vig. Vigs can still murder--in fact, they do.

@Hoppster: see this alleged misrep came off as an honest mistake for me, something that could easily have been missed. As such, I think there were better people to go after. I also remember the few contradictions TS made in speaking, but feel he was only singled out for making them because a majority of the players were focussing purely on the Hoppster-TS discussion.

Lord_Hur's post about Hoppster rubs me a little the wrong way, but Hoppsters reasons for voting him are equally as weak. Could be some buss action goin' on.

I feel like I'm missing something about the Hoppster-TS discussion, so I'm going to have to look back at the whole misrep issue.

[ToastyToast]

Lord_Hur's post about Hoppster rubs me a little the wrong way, but Hoppsters reasons for voting him are equally as weak.

My mustache slighty quivers in fury as I read this. If you think my efforts are so laughable, how about you place a ballot that is not blatant unbacked up OMGUS like your predecessor, then?

If this is a taunt, you aren't going to get anywhere with it. I'm voting Hoppster because my read is stronger on him. Why should I vote you if I think your scum with him? Not sure what the point of this post is.

[ToastyToast]

You can read into it if you want, But I would have voted kr0b yesterday (apologize for the bit of WIFOM). Over TS, at the least. When my list was completed, someone had to be among the top 3. It just happened that you were both in it, for challenging not only this slot but exploring other possible lynches as well. Much wiser than tunneling twistedspoon.

[ToastyToast]

vote: Sir V. Piraka

So let me get this. An unknown (as in role) person voted me , but then switched to TS.
The only way I can explain what you are saying is by thinking that hoppster is scum.
Wouldn't it make more sense to vote for hoppster?

its because inHim-Hoppster-lord_hur is the scum team

[ToastyToast]

@AV: I find it interesting that you find my list less scummy than lord_hur's case, and yet I am still on your scum list. Not to mention the fact that both inhimshallibe and lord_hur are on my scum list, the only difference being that I find Hoppster to be among them. Do you doubt that my suspicions are genuine?

[ToastyToast]

^^WIFOM

[ToastyToast]

I'd be very interested. Can you direct me to the minutes? I will comment right after.

Tis found here.

You were right. As you asked for what I would derive from the fact that I was wrong about it :
- from your point of view, I may have been lying to cover Sir V. Piraka (but that would be very stupid, since anyone could verify it at any time) ;
- from both yours and mine, Sir inHimshallibe could be guilty of putting too much trust in my affirmation, which can be viewed as alignment knowledge.

Maybe WIFOM isn't the right term for it, I apologize for not explaining. I don't like the whole "Well, if I were you" approach. Also, the part in parentheses, with your assumption that its easily verifiable and that such a claim is stupid.

So some things I've noticed about lord_hur. I find him to be aggresive in his defense, and not in a positive way. COmes off as frustrated, which I don't think town would be in his situation. Also, the information of lord_hur about inHimshallibe is odd. Are you voicing a suspision? Perhaps some light distancing by someone whose facing a lynch? Same could be said for vezok, but I actually agree with that now.

Unvote:Vote:lord_hur

. Hoppster has put an effort in making his D1 actions understandable from a town perspective, lord_hur has not given much thought to caboose. In other words, the two are on my scum-list still, but Hoppster has gone farther up. In order its now lord_hur-Hoppster-inHimshallibe

[ToastyToast]

In this post, I think you are guilty of appeal to emotion and bullshit logic. A reread of your predecessor is in order.

its stuff like this that isn't helping at all. Incredibly antagonistic and attempting to undermine arguments with this. Vezok brings up the point that only you and AV are reading the walls. Its true, I'm only skimming, and stuff like this stick out. I don't see AV's arguments as emotional. I'm not voting you for answering a question, I'm voting you because of your defensive attitude and my earlier suspicions of caboose.

[ToastyToast]

Very strange. You're voting me, and yet you're pointing out mistakes to help me? This is not consistant at all...

No, I'm pointing out a big part of my vote--you aren't being helpful, just standoffish.

1. I find Caboose's intervention very logical and on point (even about Hoppster, town vs town fight was my first reaction). Please tell me an example or two of his sayings that you find worthy of a vote.
2. Explain "defensive attitude", please. Especially with regards to the wall of death I have been subjected to.

1)Caboose didn't do anything worthy of a town read. Starts with a vote on Hoppster (note that I think u guys are scum together. Ever since AV came in your case/thoughts on Hoppster have completely disappeared. So has hoppster)
odd stance on vezok: he's useless but I don't understand the votes on him
called TS null-town, avoiding the issue because he knew that TS was, in fact, town.

2. 432, 472, 479(the deeply insulting part), 490(BS logic),499

Does this sufficiently answer your questions?

something else I noticed when finding exaples: buddying with inHim, my other scum read. 453

[ToastyToast]

@Hoppster: You and lord_hur are scummy independent of each other, I would have to relook at inHim. But of course I would have to look at things again, in all situations, as they are all contrasting with my belief that all 3 of you are scum. This is a rare thing to happen indeed, but you are my lynch pool. When I look between the 3 of you, I see light buddying, but its possible that I only see it because its what I believe.

[ToastyToast]

Can I vote Lord_hur? Since right now, my suspicion is increasing by the moment. As long as no one hammmers, we should be fine. I'm all for lynching him at the moment tho. What do you guys think?

Do what you think you should do. Asking for what other people think makes you sound incredibly unconfident.

[ToastyToast]

Yes, I had a bad gut feeling, and I'm going with that. I'm only listing people, I think are definitely town. Now for a few questions to everyone: What makes a good Mafia player?, If you had to lynch 3 people, who would they be?, and also Who do you feel like is the most helpful or least scummy person?

1) someone who plays consistently enough to be unreadable based on meta (im assuming you mean what makes a good scum)
2)lord_hur, inhim, Hoppster
3)Feysal,AV

[ToastyToast]

In my question, I meant a scum and a townie. Could you describe why you think Hoppster and inhim are suspicious? Why does Feysal seem helpful and scummy? (Is there such a thing as asking too many questions?)
And, um, what's a meta?

This should answer your questions.

Meta is what a player is know for (playing style). There are certainly more factors to good scumplay, but I've only been scum once, so I'm not really one to ask. I suggest u read up on mafiascum wiki for the questions like "what makes a good scum player."

[ToastyToast]

lord_hur, I believe u are at L-1. Willing to claim?

[ToastyToast]

haha Vigs are vigilantes. VI's are "village idiots"

[ToastyToast]

lord_hur, who do you think should be lynched tomorrow if you indeed flip town today?

[ToastyToast]

Sorry for tripleposting! Actually I can't find anyone at the moment to do a case on, since right now I don't feel like anyone's scum. If your not too busy, could someone examples of valid scumtells or valid reasons I could vote someone from this game? Please?!?

Have you read the game? Examine the twistedspoon wagon/ reasons for people voting him.

[ToastyToast]

Ok...I'll reread that. Also, I notice how under my name it says Goon, and under alotta pplz it says Mafia Scum, what does that mean and how do you change it?

It changes based on amount of posts. Other people have names granted by people on the website.

[ToastyToast]

@lord_hur: although I completely agree that vezokpiraka is an infamous player, its important to remember that he has the exact same probability as anyone else at being scum. What do you think is the main difference between his VI play and his scum play?

[ToastyToast]

lord_hur, who do you think should be lynched tomorrow if you indeed flip town today?

You never answered this. I'm asking for motivation speculation. Who on your wagon comes off as the most opportunistic? I had another question but I totally forgot

@inhim: could you explain your vote on Reya in more depth? Is this entirely based on lurking?

@AV: Who do you think lord_hur is scum with? You were tunneling a bit.

@jillynne: Has your opinion of lord_hur changed from scum to town or from scum to null?

Other notes: I am noticing a large decrease in activity from AV and Hoppster (post length, general content)

[ToastyToast]

1) I have no knowledge of meta and feel that it is an inadequate argument to lie on it solely. Scum who knows their town meta are going to try to make it identical. I similarly have a habit of getting into a "survival" mentality when town, but its not enough to base a town read on me.

2) I feel you ARE being more active, and I like that, but your vote on imaginality came at a weird time, especially if you have strong suspicions on AV. Your scumhunting isn't strong enough,and if the part of your defense sayin "hey, im town because AV sucks at scumhuntin" was a bad move. I also see a few attempts at buddying. For example, as nice as helping jilynne is, we can ultimately agree that she needs to play through a game to get a true picture of improvement. In other words, the whole teaching thing easily manipulated her into changing her vote.

I guess the bottomline is that despite your meta (which I am unaware if its indeed true), your predecessors activity, the overdefensiveness, light buddying, and case formation all outweigh your pro-town activites (being active)

3) I felt that the game was stagnating, so a claim might provide a time to look for reactions. Also, I always claim at L-1 in case some idiot decides to hammer.

[ToastyToast]

@lord_hur: I'll respond to the other stuff later. I meant no offense. I mean, I helped her a bit too. I'm just saying that teaching someone during a game is basically what got her to change her read.

[ToastyToast]

@Hoppster: this game started b4 the end. You have very good reason to vote TS if he knows your play well (but his reasons were bad). I'm not going to use meta from that game to accuse you, though. I did not find your TS vote scummy in Candy Zoo, but I do here.

Just out of curiosity, why don't we lynch vezok? He seems to not help much even if he is town, and if he's scum, yay!

Policy lynches (that is what your suggesting) are helpful sometimes, but we should focus on lynching scum first (since we had a mislynch D1)

[ToastyToast]

1) I have no knowledge of meta and feel that it is an inadequate argument to lie on it solely. Scum who knows their town meta are going to try to make it identical. I similarly have a habit of getting into a "survival" mentality when town, but its not enough to base a town read on me.

You left out the most important question : what would be my scummy intent?

You don't want to die, lol. Its not a valid defense.

- My scumhunting isn't strong enough? God, I feel like I'm doing the only scumhunting that is not completely focused on me! No one but me even tries to find an alternate wagon!

what's your case on imaginality? 509 (you find his hopping sketch but say its no reason to vote him), 524 (I interpret this as a null read; also, the day went on for sufficient time), 540(1 scum game is not meta)

I'm FUCKING furious to see my efforts at helping newbies called out at attempts to get any advantage. This would be utterly dishonorable. Newbies have to learn, and if your frame of mind was mainstream, no one would help them at all. Shame on you for doing this. That reminds me of that one time when I contemplated farside22 gaining extra info from normal use of her limited mod powers. I immediately and deeply apologized to her, even before she confronted me about it. I suggest you do the same. Insulting someone in this manner is very grave to me.

I already apologized, I didn't mean it as an attack. But an IC can be scum, and I think its important that jilynne's reads are not based off of someone teaching them. In other words, it should be done elsewhere.

I didn't hide my suspicion of both, and imaginality is up there as well, and slightly ahead. Can't see what's strange about this. I never said I'm town because he's bad at scumhunting. More importantly, trying to look good is a scummy frame of mind, so why would you vote me for not doing it? This is the second time you do this, and I'm beginning to think that you might be yourself in this frame of mind. You know, attempting to look good.

This is what it looks like when reading your slot today. "Hoppster is scum. Wait, ppl don't like me, I'm gonna be nice and gentlemanly when responding to inHim, but AV's giant post attack deserves RAGE. DEFEND. DEFEND. USUK. Oh, btw, I don't like imaginality."

3) I felt that the game was stagnating, so a claim might provide a time to look for reactions. Also, I always claim at L-1 in case some idiot decides to hammer.

Can you tell me in which games you did this?

Many games that I've been L-1 are not completed, but there is Cowboy Bebop

So wait, are policy lynches just lynching people that you don't need or aren't helpful?

Yes

[ToastyToast]

TT, you need to answer this.

Who do you guys think are the top 3 candidates for being scum?

There are too many people who haven't been posting recently to answer this imo.

Right. You answered it yourself. I like activity, and the two of you were the most active (aside from myself and lord_hur).For you, its more like I

expect

you to be active, whereas I've never played with AV (but he's V/LA?)

[ToastyToast]

Understood.

If for some reason or other we were unable to lynch lord_hur today, who would you want lynched?

Lynch preference: 1)lord_hur, 2)inHim(i haven't made a case really, but nothings changed on my read here), 3)Hoppster

[ToastyToast]

just so I fully understand, what were your main problems with kr0b. His lurking was bad, but I think his posts were decent when he "tried"

[ToastyToast]

I assure you that if you flip town I will take a second look at AV. But at this moment I don't think that you will flip town. Hence, my vote on you. Scum often try to disguise motivation in fancy, long posting, but I find AV's posts and argument to be more convincing than your defense.

Your best bet (in my opinion) would be to make full cases on imaginality and AV

[ToastyToast]

This game seems to be going in cicles now...If no1 is willing to hammer lord_hur, then I guess switching to Reya would be a good compromise. Still, I have a feeling this argument is just going to continue tomorrow if we do that...

[ToastyToast]

Only 4 days, really? Damn...
Well, I'd lynch Reya Cookiebringer of course, if the alternative is me. But why him?

Reya has absolutely no presence in this game, which is both troubling and a detriment to town. Don't get me wrong, there are people I would rather lynch, but I don't see this game moving anywhere.

[ToastyToast]

Gosh.

Don't vote Reya. Vote the Lord_hur scum.

If the lord flips scum then TT is going down for that post when he is defending him and trying to switch the town to reya.

Clear misrep. I'm not defending him at all. No one seems willing to vote lord_hur atm, we're running out of time, and reya is a ghost. There's a reason my vote is still on lord_hur, and thats because I think he's scum. I will switch to Reya if no one is willing to vote him at deadline.

[ToastyToast]

This sudden unanimity in willing to turn to Reya Cookiebringer makes me think that he's town, since I really can't imagine that there is no scum on my wagon.
Yes, I know I'm shooting myself in the foot, but that's what I'm thinking.

This kinda makes me feel like you are trying to butter me up so I don't vote you, but then again it's 1:30 in the morning after alot of work today. I'll make my decision tomorrow.

Hmm. You do know you are the counter-wagon, correct? You need to either defend yourself or tell us why lord_hur is a better lynch. Your lack of presence in this game has sort of made you lose your credibility. Do you think lord_hur is scum?

Also, lord_hur and reya should probably claim, as it seems these are our only two options 2day (running out of time)

[ToastyToast]

Also, lord_hur and reya should probably claim, as it seems these are our only two options 2day (running out of time)

Why both, when only one will be sent to the gallows? I do not like this, sir.

I assumed a 1v1 situation, the claims might help make the final decision. But I see your point

[ToastyToast]

What a twist!

Unvote

Actually agree with lord_hur's logic on Reya
Other possibilities: Hoppster, inhim, vezok

And inhim, I didn't for a new team of suspects because I still suspect Hoppster

[ToastyToast]

TastyToast, do you believe lord_hur's claim, or do you still suspect him to be scum but are unvoting as a precaution in case you are wrong?

Still suspect him, but I'm not about to vote a claimed cop.

Vote:Reya Cookiebringer

[ToastyToast]

jilynne, I think he's L-2

[ToastyToast]

guys, we have to make a decision...

[ToastyToast]

I think we have a vig, not an SK.

@AV: I was still waiting for lord_hur to make a case on imaginality, he focussed more on you b4 the end of the day. However, I will be reviewing his slot, given that most of the positives I saw in him have disappeared.

[ToastyToast]

Why is vezok cleared again? I believe the claim. Looks like inHim is my #1 suspect.

[ToastyToast]

Cleared by innocent investigation from a confirmed cop.

Potentially, you could have forwarded said information to scum, correct?

[ToastyToast]

vote: ToastyToast - scumclaim in asking why vezok was cleared again. He probably bussed Hoppster on his list, and I just don't see AVox being scum.

rofl, the fact that you change clarification of a statement into a scumclaim is quite a stretch. Whether or not I saw said information is completely null. Did I go after Vezok? No. I highly doubt that anyone here read the full extent of every single one of lord_hur's posts, so it should not be that much of a stretch to figure out that its an honest mistake. I suggest you remove your vote now, sire inHimshallibe. All it would take is three scum to hop on my wagon. Of course, I am much more of the opinion that you are taking this small opportunity to ensure someone who has considered you to be scum from the moment he arrived here is lynched.

[ToastyToast]

Sir Hoppster
ToastyToast kr0b**
Feysal
jilynne1991 DemonHybrid* GMan
inHimshallibe*

At least 3/5 of these people are scum. tell me, which one is the scummiest? Which one has always been that "well, he could be scum, but I'd rather lynch....?"

In my opinion today's lynch should be either myself, inHim, or Hoppster. inHim's fail-vote just now makes me about 95% sure that he is scum, and as such I would even be willing to get into 1v1 mode if he so wishes.

[ToastyToast]

@AV, you are supposed to be on the list, must've copy-pasted incorrectly.

[ToastyToast]

This is the way I see it, but first:
@Hoppster:Neither scum nor town would ordinarily put themselves up as a lynch candidate, I am only doing so because I realize that I am at the bottom of most people's lists anyways. So is inHim. And we are not scumbuddies. You and inHim could be, however.

Also, if you are of the opinion that inHim and I are scumbuddies, why suspect me over him?

1)ToastyToast or inHIM: Neither of us are exactly obvtown, and solely based on percentages, at least one of use is probably scum. I know what I am, but I cannot simply say "hey guys, I'm town." In a game of mafia, its up to the other players to see who is lying and who isn't. I'm putting myself out there because I'm confident that town will make the correct decision.

inHim:

2)Jillynee or Hoppster: Hoppster is still villainous, all but disappearing as suspicion rose against lord_hur. His play has drastically changed since D1, perhaps due to shame of his role in the TS lynch, or worry that he would be lynched for it.
Jilynne is an interesting one. She pretty much has a universal town-read on her. Most of her games aren't finished, but, from what I see, she plays...differently--she's more solid on her opinions. There's still no way I see myself voting her over Hoppster, however.

3) AV or Feysal: Every scum team needs a leader, and leaders like to talk. From an organizational standpoint, 1 talkative scum+1null scum+1 lynch-bait scum is common. Let's look at their suspects...

AV, in order: Imaginality (town)-inHim(probscum)-TT-Jily-Feysal-Hoppster-Vezok
AV, why do you have such a high opinion of Hoppster? The revelation of imaginality being town actually puts Jilynne in his scum category.
Based on associations, AV-inHim-Hoppster would be the scumteam (place the most suspicious in the bottom, place an under-the-radar player on the town list, and put two mislynches down in the bottom as well.

Their reasons for killing lord_hur are quite obvious. He was a claimed cop, and that cop found all 3 of them suspicious.

Feysal (list can be considered outdated), in order: Hoppster (says he needs to change it), AV, jilynne, inHim, vezok (town), TT, imaginality(town)

@Feysal: can we get an updated version of your suspicions? Is your like of Hoppster purely based on D1?

His list looks more like town who's trying to figure out who scum is. Scum have the luxury of being able to manufacture their lists based on the information we already have
Scum team would be: Hoppster OR jilynee (his town read), inHim(his null), TT(his scummy). Of course, have only two scumspects makes this more difficulat to figure out. Because I'm pretty sure my rolePM said I was a townie, I am much more of the opinion that The first scum-team is the correct one.
The one thing that can throw a wedge into my argument is the presence of an SK, which would explain why its hard to analyze Feysal.

So, the scum-team is (from order of highest likelihood of scum): inHim, Hoppster, AV.

@Jil:no, that would be bastard

[ToastyToast]

If imaginality is town, then jill is in your bottom 3

[ToastyToast]

^^I second the motion

[ToastyToast]

AV's list has you as null, but with imaginality being 100% town, that would bring you down into the bottom 3.
His list was made b4 your claim.

[ToastyToast]

Vote:inHimshallibe

because I realized it takes 5 to lynch, not 4

Jilynne, tell me how to soothe your troubled soul. Recommendation: Be with the lynchings on Toasty.

Something only scum would say.

[ToastyToast]

Hmm, I think the vig can remain unclaimed for at least one more day, unless they make it to L-1.

[ToastyToast]

Quick change of opinion from 796, ToastyToast?

Yes.

[ToastyToast]

In terms of perfect scum-team chemistry, a group consister of (TT/inHim, jilynne/Hoppster,AV/Feysal) is pretty good. Scum working together well is one of the reasons why I think we are doing so badly. 3/6 of those players are scum, and those pairs make it easier for me to figure out. I am not saying "if inHim is scum, I'm town" or "If AV is scum, Feysal is town." I am suggesting the pattern we should use to lynch teh scums.

Because you put yourself forward for a lynch.

...but its null....you think scum have more of a chance of putting themselves forward for a lynch even though they are this close to winning? Neither side, town or scum, does this often. I'm doing this because it is the most practical lynch pool for town. We are the two highly suspected gentlemen remaining in the game.

[ToastyToast]

The case on Toast is a matter of process of elimination. Given the role evidence present, I will risk the game on Sirs V. Piraka, Imaginality, and Jilynne. Using basic assumptions about making rulesets, I feel it is HIGHLY likely there are three Villains still present in this establishment. As such, I can further eliminate myself. What remains is the confidence in my townreads of A. Vox and Hoppster. Aurorus Vox, PhD continues to provide content and analysis, while my read of Sir Hoppster was based on a Day 1 town v. town read between himself and Twistedspoon, Esq.

Lolbadcase
I can pretty much say: just cross out my name and put in your own.
Your opinions help me maintain the fact that I think yo and Hoppster are scum together, with AV being the other possibility, but not one I am sure about.

Your Feysal case consists of 5 one-liners and a bunch of assumptions. lolfailagain.

[quote="inHim]I've been guessing for a long while, and I'm damned certain by this point in my playing career.[/quote]
If your guesses are that great, why are no scum dead? also guessing + damned certain? DOES NOT COMPUTE

[ToastyToast]

Meh, that wasn't the complete Feysal case. Also, since they're one-liners, I figure they'll be easy to respond to.

But, tell me... why are you tearing down my Feysal case? Uh oh.

One line saying "your case on Feysal isn't good" is hardly tearing it down. I'm not buying it and as such, you'll need more than that.

[ToastyToast]

you, hoppster, and AV. I'm guessing your follow-up question will be: make a case on AV, which I will not do because I'm not confident on that third scum-read. He more or less just fits the kills and seems like a "scum-leader" type

Also, I'm pretty sure I was a neutral read for a lot of people yesterday because 1)I'm never obvtown and 2)my predecessor wasn't exactly a paragon of obvtown

[ToastyToast]

Hoppster lynch, then?

Is this you asking for a case?
Not really in the mood, but 1)His D1 play was still bad 2)He changed his gameplay drastically after D1 3)You buddy him way too much

[ToastyToast]

inHimshallibe, stop accusing everyone and please, focus on one person, you're starting to appear scummy, after all those days in believing in you.

Well, he WAS asked to give cases

[ToastyToast]

No, I understand that, but have you tried reading his posts in iso?

Yeah, it was my first major reason for suspecting him

[ToastyToast]

Hm? I suspect you more based on wagon speculation

[ToastyToast]

umm...look at my first catch-up post. reasons for callling you scum: wishy-washy. You approved of TS, then voted him.

[ToastyToast]

Point is that Feysal makes long, descriptive posts. He also doesn't skim. Is he in the background? Yes, and its very troubling. I just was so sure he was town when I first joined the game.

this is why I just want to lynch inHim. He's so much more likely to be scum than anyone else in this game.

Also, another problem I just found with inHim's case on Feysal is that its reliant on me flipping scum. This is poor because 1)Using associations b/w a scum-team when not a single scum member has flipped is often very inaccurate. 2)We're in MYLO, we need to be thinking about "who's the scummiest," not "who has an interesting posting relationship with people who could be scum"

inHim:LOL TT HAS TO BE SCUM SO THAT MEANS FEYSAL'S SCUM TOO
TT:inHim is scum. I have other scum reads but will not go after them until inHim flips.

I think we have to move on with the game. It's stagnating.

vote inHim and make the world a better place.
I have full confidence in my read on him.

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You guys really have to be careful, I don't think we're in a very good position at the moment.

You yourself said you think inHim is scum.

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@Hoppser: That was supposed to be directed to you O.o. I've said plenty about inHim

@inHim: My read on Feysal isn't strong enough to vote him yet. Not to mention the fact that I said I was leaning more towards AV as scum. AV asked me about Feysal, so I responded with some of the reasons why I'm not confident yet.

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Unvote:inHim

pseudovote:Hoppster

I can't be wrong about all of them. The lack of a hammer on inHim seemed very telling, but I could see scum not wanting to hammer inHim in fear that there was a vig in play. In this situation scum-team would be people who were not present at the time of the claim to quickly get inHim lynched. This means AV and imaginality are not likely scum.

OR vezok is scum godfather with an investigation immune quality.

Hoppster comes in and is liek "lolnvm its TT."
Jily could be scum but Hoppster is scummier. He's defending his votes

inHim was probably RB when he tried to kill me, which honestly sucks for town because now a lynch will be wasted on me and we'll lose the game :/. RB means inHim won't be able to shoot at night and town loses. I'm at a loss of words as to how to defend myself right now.

What if we no lynch? 4:3 is actually a better position to be in, is it not? That said they'll probably just kill imaginality....

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@AV: regarding jilynne, one of two things are occurring for her to be Villainous. 1) She and Imaginality planned this from the start OR 2) the scum have daytalk. I don't see new blood like her playing it this way as scum. I will review her case files yet again.

I don't think scum-jilynne=scum imaginality.

That was a smooth entrance, and I definitely don't want to punt anything away, but my gut tells me if there were a roleblocker, Gentlemanly especially, they would have claimed by now. Even a Villainous Roleblocker would find the lack of second kill too tempting to pass up a mislynch, methinks.

Wait, why would a roleblocker have claimed? That would get them lynched.

Since I'm out in the open, should we all reveal our occupations?

Given that I'm pretty much responsible for getting scum a cop and a vig, I'd rather not risk anyone else. I myself am willing to claim, however.

[ToastyToast]

I am a Most Proper but Unspectacular Man of Class (aka: VT)

Popcorn to...Hoppster

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looks like the whole game needs to "dodge a prod"

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we could always attempt to talk like proper gentlemen.
What say you, AV? Would you like some Earl Grey with that English muffin?

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You misread. He's saying either my lynch will end in a loss because I am a town target who was at the end of a vig-kill that got roleblocked, or i'm a scum godfather with immunity.

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Feysal's bad logic + TT latching onto it makes me confident in TT's scumflip.

lowut? I wasn't denying the fact that there could be a roleblocker OR that I could be on a team with a roleblocker. I was pointing out that any other options is just asking for WIFOM.

Declaring that I could be on a scum team with a roleblocker who blocked a vig from killing me? I can just as easily say that vezok is secretly scum who was only half-confirmed town, and imaginality and jilynne wanted to ensure that either myself or inHim would be the lynch. You see my point?

There is absolutely nothing I can do at this point to prove that I am town. Its a shame, I really thought I had something on inHim.

No reason for vezok to claim.

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I'm town...sorry guys

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That's just not true. You've tried to make it look like there's a greater chance that you'll flip town than there actually is. InHim being blocked by a RB'er in NO way clears you, which was what Feysal suggested and what you were quick to support.

knowing the truth makes me a little biased.

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O.o thought that was the lynch
@Jil: there have only been a max of 2 kills, and we know one comes from inHim, who claimed vig
@AV:Lack of quickhammering in a game that has to go to night phase if town has a killing role isn't a stretch. Scum wouldn't want to risk being killed by vig/SK, regardless of claims.

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A vig, regardless of having a roleblocker, can be emotionally off-putting to a scum team. Knowing that someone can kill them in a night phase is just enough to let them avoid quick-hammering. Not to mention all the positive WIFOM it gives the team for not hammering their target. Its also possible that the scum team was on me already (b4 L-1)

I don't like how vezok keeps saying "IM CONFIRMED! IM CONFIRMED!"
Feysal is quiet...too quiet
Still don't like Hoppster
AV is becoming more town.

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@Hoppster: Its just enough information to cause a scum team to hesitate. Just because scum don't actually HAVE anything to worry about doesn't mean they won't worry. A powerful town role will cause paranoia among a scum team. You are missing my point entirely, this is a psychological evaluation on what the reasons for not hammering would be. It consists of 1) just enough paranoia (there are plenty of roles that can block a roleblock/town may be hiding something. Vezok also hasn't claimed yet--and shouldn't) 2)being unsure if the whole scumteam is present and 3) WIFOM

Hoppster, I am aware that there has to be a roleblocker (unless inHim is lying, which is highly unlikely). I also know what I am. As such, from my point of view, I can assess what the scum motivation would be for NOT hammering me. All your other conclusions are based on a "TT scum bias". This is poor scumhunting because I haven't flipped. One-shot vig speculation is also useless, because 1) inHim would have said so if he was town and 2) You said it yourself. Scum only need a mislynch to win. I think Hoppster has a good chance of being a roleblocker, given his adamant references to the issue.

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couldn't all three scum be on my wagon? that was my other theory...

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love how absolutely no one thinks I'm town. lol. well, I am. I wasn't faking, i really thought i was hammered. I also thought vezok was really scummy for it. He's used his "confirmed" status to his advantage, yet lord_hur never outright said "HETOWNGUSY"

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Wraith said we could post once the hammer happened. I'm scum with inHim.

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yayyy gj guys. Really happy with my "TT or inHim," "Jil or Hoppster," "Feysal or AV" post, even if I came to the wrong conclusion.

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Any thoughts on how I could've gotten out of that lynch? After inHim's claim, I knew I was fucked. I actually think my lynch turned out well in terms of what happened afterwards. Jilynne and Feysal both being wishy-washy singled them out a bit.