Ladies Night 2: No Cover -- (Game Over)

[Telo]

/confirm

[Telo]

Ok, I already know this is going to be a stupid question but I'm confused. Up top it says 12 women and 3 scum but I count 18 names. The set up has 18 roles unless I'm misunderstanding something important. It looks like 4 red plus 14 blue. Do 3 people not know who they are?
That can't be it. I'm missing something here.

[Telo]

I knew it was something simple.

[Telo]

VOTE: RachMarie
For being late to the party

[Telo]

I hate changing my vote once I've placed it on someone but I also can't justify leaving it on Rach since she hasn't said or done anything.
Ok, I went to the member list to see if she'd been on and the members go from Raamawen to radwulf.
Did RachMarie delete?

[Telo]

Nevermind. The list wasn't sorted in alphabetical order. Disgregard previous post.

[Telo]

@ Eidolon, thanks I guess :/
I'm not really 'out of the loop' as much as I'm hoping to get to a computer. Following along from my nook is good but participating is less so. It's difficult to type or format so I leave off unless I'm getting left behind or if I really need to make a point.

@Tammy, in rvs I go with my intuition. I like to make a guess at the start of every game and see if I'm right. Rather than keep moving my vote with the wind I leave it on the first person until I make my final decision. That can often take a while.
As far as my opinions on the game so far:
The piggy wagon raised a blip on my radar. In hunting I typically look for slips of the 'tounge' (fingers and mind when playing in a forum) lies, and misdirection. Jokes by their nature are funny because of those three things. But- joking is also sometimes just a part of a personality. It's a big part of mine so when I see a person who's a joker I make note to pay attention to what kind of joker they are. A social joker, a nervous joker, a person that makes jokes to misdirect.

I'd like to say more about Sucrose, Hunter and possibly more but I can't open multiple windows from my device so I either have to make a string of painstakingly pecked out posts or I can hold off till I get to a computer. Maybe today but if not some point this weekend.

[Telo]

And Telo is scum.

A definitive statement like that should be backed by action or it rings hollow.

[Telo]

All of DGB's reads have been in that style. It doesn't thrill me that Telo only noticed on "And Telo is scum."

As I explained before. I have to be a bit selective in my posts when I'm on my nook. So it's not that that's the only thing I noticed. It's that it was the only thing I wanted to bother commenting on since commenting can sometimes be difficult. I'm on a computer now so my comments can be more complete.

If action is a vote - if you think that more than one person are scum - DGB can't have votes on all of them.
If action is an explanation - the post is consistent with her previous posting style.

Camn is sketch. Well more than sketch. Maybe even scum.

Saying a player is maybe scum I wouldn't expect a vote because we have to scrutinize everyone but an out an out -this player is scum- doesn't really mean anything without reason to back it up. If not a reason then at least a -money where your mouth is- vote.

What kind of blip on your radar did it have? What type of joker did you come to the conclusion that piggygirl was?

Unfortunately when you go to assess what type of joker another person is the mirror you hold them up against is usually your own. Since I really didn't get the duck part of the joke and I can't read the small writing (is there a way to magnify it?) I don't really know. It looks like it says psyduck but that makes no sense to me. She says it's a pokeman reference so it went over my head as I'm not familiar with pokeman I can't tell if the joke makes sense or if it's a misdirection.

It only served to confuse me and make me squint. In the next post she admits to sarcasm. Now that I get. I can't tell if the previous post was in fact sarcastic but I do know sarcasm is a defense mechanism. That's when I got my blip. After that she makes no more jokes so I can't give any more of a read than that.

[Telo]

On

Huntress

: Only one real vote but when a player gives their reason and backs it up with a vote they go up a notch in my esteem. Of course I reserve the right to amend this but I think Huntress is town who thinks she got off a good shot.
On

Tammy

: Getting lots of info out there and promoting activity. The fact that your vote is on Huntress who I'm reading as town doesn't make me think you're scum. It just means that one of us is wrong about her.
On

Camn

: That sort of introduction always makes me leery. When people claim to know more than they should it makes me suspicious. She says she will prove it once her wheels get spinning so I'm watching for that.
On

flinter

: Said almost exactly what I was thinking and placed a vote on camn. I'll be following to see if our thinking stays in tuned.
On

Brandi

still doing the extra reading assigned in post #89

[Telo]

EBWOP
On Huntress I meant to say "Only one real

post

"

[Telo]

@ Tammy: I never said the joke means nothing. The fact that she made the joke tells me -something- What I said was it went over my head. I don't know what psyduck (if that's what it says) means.
I also never said alignment relevant. That's not a term that I've ever used so you might be confusing me with someone else.
I didn't comment on piggy in 145 because I'd already commented on her and with so many players in the game I'm not going to get bogged down by just one. I also didn't comment on a bunch of other people. I have a lot more to scrutinize.

But yes, I do find sarcasm to be a defense mechanism which puts a blip on my radar however I'm not prepared to call piggy scummy until I'm ready to place a vote on her. I haven't seen nearly enough to determine that yet.

[Telo]

As soon as I have a strong scum read I'll be placing my vote there and it will very likely stay there until the end of the day.
So far who I'm leaning towards and why.

Piggy

for reasons I've already stated and don't need to repeat.

Spring

- post 90 just seems pushy and mean. I know pushing is part of the game but that post seems strategic.

DGB

because I really hate the term Hos. Usually people use that type of term to make themselves look better by putting others down.

Bunnylover

for hanging back the most

MathGirl

because I hate it when people put tiny font in their post. I can see that it's there but I can't see what it says and it makes me feel like they're doing it on purpose to hide something but then be able to claim that they weren't hiding it.

My strongest town read is

Tammy

but I've already said that.
After that in no real order

RachMarie

-yes yes, I know my vote is on her but I already explained that was rvs. I'll move it when I decide where to place it.

Fujiko

- mainly because she says things that I'm thinking to the point that I don't feel that I need to say them too or it'll look like I'm sheeping. I'm not. I just find her townish

Amrun

- willing to ask a question, get an answer and then move on. So far doesn't seem to get hung up on stuff.

[Telo]

I appreciate this, especially since I haven't figured out how to say 'yes, I agree' yet without it being called sheeping.
However, some of what I posted wasn't that flattering to you, so I find it odd.

I don't like post 130 isn't unflattering. It's honest and honesty reads town.

THIS

Telo - Reads as an endless series of self justifying posts with no content so to speak.

Only redeeming feature is she doesn't read as if she is all there

.

was unflattering. But it was funny as hell.
ok for some content since people are on me for a read on piggy.
In the begininng she says her self vote was sarcasm and that it was just a joke. I was willing to take her at her word for it but in her most recent post she says she did it to get reactions to her self-voting to keep an eye on certain groups.

If it was calculated I can see why she'd need to play it off as a joke at first or her ruse wouldn't work. But why reveal the reason so soon? If there was information to be gained from it it would have been better to reveal it after the information had been gathered not warn them off.

[Telo]

Telo votes are good.

Based on Post 213 I know I won't lose any tears over a Piggy mislynch. I have no words.

Yes, I know and I agree. If anyone else had posted what I did I'd be prompting them for a vote as well so
VOTE: piggy

[Telo]

Drip,
Do you have a response to 236? Do you know something we do not?

[Telo]

Drip,
Do you have a response to 236? Do you know something we do not?

this game.

wow, that was very clever.

[Telo]

instead of asking what was going on,

I asked and didn't really get an answer.

[Telo]

Katty. I don't know what you mean by defending Piggy so I don't really know how to answer that. Can you please point out what you think of as my defense of her? Not only is she one of my scum reads, but I'm voting her so I don't know what you mean by defending her.

I know you said the piggy vote was wagon-y but honestly I didn't get the dayvig joke that cleared her in everyone else's eyes. I'd be really appreciative if you could explain it.

[Telo]

Here. If you think she is scum, what's wrong with the wagon?

Yeah, no. I'm still not seeing any defense of piggy. I'm also not seeing anywhere that I say there's anything wrong with the wagon. What I said was that it raised a blip on my radar.

Not sure how you fabricated a defense out of that or how you stretch that out to mean that I find anything wrong with the wagon.
Blip =/= wrong

I'll let you finish reading. Hopefully by the time you finish your second question will be rhetorical.

[Telo]

I keep seeing Telo browsing this forum but I guess she has nothing to comment on here?

Just eating my popcorn and enjoying the show. You're hanging yourself so you decide to deflect attention to me. That's a good strategy. Any other deflection techniques?

[Telo]

I'm glad too. I was getting bored and I'm finished with my popcorn so I don't mind touching my keyboard now.

[Telo]

Would you care to pick a fight with me now? I have a few minutes before I need to go pick up the kids and I enjoy reading you. You are very spirited.
p-edit.... if you think popcorn is gross you're not doing it right.

[Telo]

*They LOVE me. They really really LOVE me!* In my best Sally Fields voice. Skimmed very quickly. Weekend prod dodge post. What's the count? I saw lots of questions for me so I'll read again from my nook when possible and then be back no later than Tuesday to answer.

[Telo]

@ Sucrose post 405, I explained early in the game that I'm from my nook. It's nice to have as I can catch up on the game from it when I have time -which is not thos weekend or tomorrow- but it's terribly inconvienient to post from. Mainly because I can't open multiple windows to address things from previous pages. But also because I can't qoute which question I'm answering or easily format my responses.

Church and family obligations today and slammed tomorrow. Earliest time to address my fan club is Tuesday.

[Telo]

@ Sucrose post 405, I explained early in the game that I'm from my nook. It's nice to have as I can catch up on the game from it when I have time -which is not thos weekend or tomorrow- but it's terribly inconvienient to post from. Mainly because I can't open multiple windows to address things from previous pages. But also because I can't qoute which question I'm answering or easily format my responses.

Church and family obligations today and slammed tomorrow. Earliest time to address my fan club is Tuesday.

Do you mean you're on your nook for the time being, or that you don't have a regular desktop or laptop?

I mean that I am currently on my nook as I was this am before church. Yes, I have a computer. I also have a husband and four kids. I will not get the computer tonight and I'm busy tomorrow until late. Hence my post to explain that I'll be back Tues.

To the person who pointed out my posts with formatting in them... those are from the computer.
-ahha, caught you in a lie. You quoted in THIS post.
-I -can- qoute from my nook. There might even be a way to format if I figure it out. But, once I start typing I can't move off this page. To go back and read questions or cite examples. If I'm not dead I'll do that Tuesday. If I am dead I won't
Cuz I'll be dead.

[Telo]

ok, I have a minute now.

There is a lot of REALLY GOOD data to be gleaned here... and here is the deal.
There is a real, solid towntell out there...though I will admit it is losing its usefulness SOON. But that day is not today.

The tell? Its the "honestly didn't know there was day-talk" towntell... also known as the "daytalk/discussing scumcoaching towntell"

I have seen it before, and in THIS game I was intentionally trying to elicit some discussion on the topic.
When, in post 153, I mentioned Piggy was coaching--- I was being disingenuous. If you are prone to lynch all liars.. then I am a good target for you, because that was a lie. I didnt think she was coaching.. because I knew there was daytalk.
What I WAS doing, was trying to elicit discussion on the topic of coaching.... the idea being that- anyone who bought the 'coaching' argument probably didn't notice there was daytalk.. and thus almost certainly

WAS NOT SCUM

. Scum, on the other hand, would ignore that... and concentrate on crapcasing me

Now that the truth is out- lets look at the results (ill try to be comprehensive. Correct me if I miss anything):

Tammy

in 158:

I doubt very seriously that piggy would be coaching her scum partners as if anything shed be the one in need of coaching.

Springlullaby

in 177

I really dislike camn's last series of posts, reason to suspect Piggy are reaching. Piggy reads as a total derp to me, pinning mastermind scum 'coaching' on her is just terrible.

Fujiko

in 183

Why would less experienced scum coach more experienced scum?

^^these are TOWNPOSTS, imo... except maybe Fujiko.. I kind of see a playing-along kind of vibe there? maybe not.

THIS,

Sucrose

in 222.. is maybe either/or. I cant tell.. but this could be him saying there IS daytalk, duh.. like.. its obvious. JUST HOW SCUM WOULD THINK.

Well, if Piggy's scum there's no daytalk.

And that is it for my coaching bait.

THEN there is the actual daytalk revelation-reactions... which I take with a grain of salt, as they could be more easily faked, I think.

First.. the reveal.

Huntress

in 313

Why would scum need to coach in thread when they have daytalk?

Brandi

in 349... quite a delayed response?

Do scum have daytalk or something?

Huntress again (352):

I think you know they do.

Brandi

.. I think an honest reaction:

wait, really?
wtf

Um, pretty sure they don't.
I just checked the first page and CTRL+F "daytalk"
and no where does it say scum have daytalk.

.

Additional add-ons.. unknown significance:

Springlullaby

in 365.

Wait what. Wtf daytalk but what the fuck it has to do with you vote on Telo. Afraid of calling me scum?

DGB

in 374. Gotta go null here. She is certainly good enough to lie

Where is it "known" that the scum have daytalk?

aaaaaand.. Thats it. Those are my conclusions.
Understand.. I have used this in a couple games before.. so if anyone has seen it before.. their reactions become null. But I can't be bothered to meta right now.

To sum up:

TOWN:

Tammy
Springlullaby
Fujiko
Brandi

PLus my townreads for other reasons :

PiggyGal
Eidolon
Sucrose

Hmm.

UNVOTE
Vote: Telo.

wagon ho.

Allow me to explain camn. Yes, I can quote and reply but let's say I wanted to quote and reply to one point made in this particular post. Let's say I wanted to respond to paragrah 4 sentence 3.

I'd have to quote this whole big wall of text just to answer one line. And then let's say my response would ideally include a post from page 4. Well I can't go to page four. Once I start typing on page 8 (or whatever) I can't move to another page to support my arguments. It's also very difficult to truncate quoted posts and only respond to the things that are pertinent. Too many times have I tried and effed up one character of code that messes up the formatting and then I have to start ALL over. So if there was only one thing I wanted to say about this post I'd need to post the entire thing then make another post for my supporting arguments and if there were multiple supporting arguments I'd need to make another post for each one.

Yeah, no. I will not be doing that. That much work would suck all the fun out of playing this game. What I am willing to do is let you know when I'll be able to properly respond and let you know why you may be seeing me reading the thread even though I'm not fully participating at this time. To the person who suggested I go V/LA; thank you but I didn't want that banner across my avatar in other games so I didn't think that was a good solution.

[Telo]

Before I get down to the older stuff I wanted to comment on what happened yesterday -- flinter's post where she's quoting from my other ongoing game and posting it here.

We're not allowed to discuss ongoing games and we're certainly not allowed to QUOTE ongoing games into other ongoing games. Piggy does a good job of playing it off like she's confused about what it is and DGB quickly offers support that this is town.

That is not town. I'd vote flint but since piggy was right there backing her up I'll leave my vote where it is.

Ok now going back to the other day when I left off back in a few.

[Telo]

Ok I'm going back far, like 10 pages back so that it can't be said that I didn't answer any and all questions.
Taking it back to the dayvig thing which I never really did get. CityElectric calls out DGB for lying about being a dayvig and votes her. Yeah I don't get why lying about being a vig isn't scum. Appearantly it was a trick but anyone who questions it rather than automatically voting it is suspect.

Also, you asked instead of just voting DG.

I don't buy that. I'm going to attempt to clarify first. The bullet proof role says: the ability to survive one shot. It doesn't say when the shot is fired.

@DGB what exactly were you trying for with the fake dayvig stuffs?

I wanted an answer to that too the conversation had moved on by the time I got back.

Oops this was back on page 9 but I wanted to address it as well.

I know I won't lose any tears over a Piggy mislynch.

I caught a vote from Brandi over voting piggy after Tammy called her a mislynch. The odds are she might be. I dunno maybe she is a mislynch but she's the scummiest to me so I'm leaving my vote.

THIS

I told you I was on my period and that's why I told you you were dumb. Don't like that excuse? :shrug: oh well, your personal problem.

Is my absolute favorite line of the entire game and I may end up sigging it. LOL!

Moving on
There were some questions posed to me about Brandi. Yeah I did think she was scum at first but her confusion about there being daytalk seemed genuine. I know I sometimes don't read the other roles players roles as well as I should. Sometimes I'm confused enough about my own.
I've been trying to create a scale of who I think is most town down to who's scummiest. Tammy and Brandi are actually at the top of the town list. Rachmarie is in the middle and flint and piggy are at the bottom. I'm doing my best to place everyone else accordingly.
OK I'm posting now and then I'll comment on the next four or five pages.

[Telo]

VOTE: Telo
Hopefully this will bring you back earlier.

Sorry, coming back sooner than today wasn't an option or I would have. Trust me I need and enjoy the diversion.
post 409 I missed the half in the spoiler the first time I read it. Yes, I did get prompted for content but I also let you all know when I'd be able to provide it.

You'll be dead by then.

Don't bother with responses to anything.

oh geez now you tell me. LOL!

A claim might be nice... I won't believe it, but still, I'm interested in what you might come up with.

I don't claim. IRL play claiming gives out tells. I can never get away with it so I don't do it -ever-.

I was specifically going for a reaction from Telo, but it's not a particularly good one and effectively useless if others commented first.

If I had been here the only reaction I would have given you is - I'll get back to you tomorrow when I have more time.

I went back and deleted flinter's seemingly accidental VC addition.

ok just so everyone knows that they were there and there was a little bit more than VC. There was also some comment from the mod and the comment was about me.
I'm not really sure how posting that was considered an accident since the posts came from two different games and it requires several steps to post from one game to another. I'm going to have to believe that posting from two seperate games was intentional but I'm glad they're erased.
She really didn't need to try that hard to find a reason to vote me as I'm the largest wagon and all she had to do was say 'good point' and follow someone else's vote. I think she was going way over board looking for a reason not to seem scummy but it ended up backfiring.

It's late in the day so I won't change my vote from where it is as I'm comfortable where it is but I did want to point that out once more since it's been deleted.
OK- I'm done. Good luck ladies.

[Telo]

I don't claim. IRL play claiming gives out tells. I can never get away with it so I don't do it -ever-.

What? No claiming because claiming gives out tells in RL? You can't GET AWAY with it so you don't do it?

GET AWAY WITH IT

Wait

What????

LAUNCH LYNCH SEQUENCE

don't be silly.
What would I do? Only claim when I was town and if I was mafia choose not to claim. How would that ever work?
If I'm going to -not- claim I have to always -not- claim or not claiming won't ever work.
Everyone who plays me knows I never claim.

[Telo]

It's like poker. You always make the other player pay to see your cards. You don't ever show your cards for free.
And yes there are tells IRL and OL.

[Telo]

I don't think you really believe that Brandi.

Even if I told you who I am I'd still get voted. We both know it. If you're at L-1 on D1 claiming doesn't do anything.
If it wasn't D1 I might allude to my night powers if I had performed any but if I hadn't all I could ever safely claim is VT. _{which is kinda LAME}
If I wasn't a -no claim- girl I'd be an -always claim VT- girl but

that's

anti-town if I do have a PR so no, not gonna do that.

p-edit. What is auto lynch and how is it different from the regular lynch that I would get if I showed you my card?

[Telo]

Aren't you going to reply to the all the other stuff people have been waiting to hear from you on? I asked you a question back in post 224 that I wouldn't mind an answer to, and there's plenty more for you to comment on.

Sure I'll respond to anything I missed. What exactly is the question? Just keep in mind I game myself a few hours to play today but it's getting on towards dinner so if I don't get auto lynched (whatever that is) I might not get back to you until later tonight after the kids have finished their homework.

[Telo]

I'm not missing the point. The point of the game is that everyone has hidden cards. If we show our cards to other players where's the FUN in that?

[Telo]

I don't get what people are so upset about. It's not like you don't get to see my card in the flip. I would get the outrage if you couldn't find out until the end of the game -

that'd

- be something to get huffy about- but my card flips at the close of the day. What's the big deal?

I do have one comment though... I think though that when a mod edits a post that it would be more clear if they use their mod color directly in the post that it's been edited rather than do it later in the thread. I think it makes it more clear for anyone reading to know what is being discussed when they're reading the thread in order.

[Telo]

gg, I can't wait to get my new siggy