Newbie 1289 - Game Over!

[Natural_river]

okay guys, I just joined this game... I just made a quick scroll through the pages, and I guess I underestimated the amount of information that could be placed in just a few pages.
So give me some time to read it all, and It'll be like nothings ever changed.
Nothing... nothing changed.

yes.

[Natural_river]

Okay, I have taken some hours to read these posts, now this is a LOT of information and fingerpointing.
The names that pop in my head after reading all these posts, (some of them so long my mind busts, with words that the devil himself couldn't understand)
are buldermar, tierce and vendetta21.

I've tried to get a clear image in my head of who is who, but to me it seems like a bunch of bickering that started somewhere with correcting each other about gameplay.
I'm afraid the real mafia is lurking in the shadows.

For some reason ovyo seems most suspicious to me.
Ever since the focus has been directed at buldermar, ovyo stayed perfectly silent and is conveniently "bogged down with coursework".
Now I am not saying that buldermar is not mafia or so, but I'm only seeing two names, whilst the rest kind of silently follows every now and then joining and agreeing/disagreeing
with what those two have to say.

Maybe the real mafia lurks in the dark crevasse, and is waiting to pop out unexpectedly like diarrhea in an old lady's bowels who has had constipation problems for weeks and had just ingested large amounts of laxative.

Sorry for the disturbing image, but I found such an image appropriate for mafia scum.

to contribute I will UNVOTE: (if BT has voted at least)
and put my vote to VOTE: ovyo until I have been convinced that my vote has been placed incorrectly.

[Natural_river]

Would I be correct in interpreting this as a policy vote or am I missing something?

I don't know what a "policy vote" is, please explain.

[Natural_river]

It is a vote based on a policy. For instance, a policy could be "vote the lurkers/inactive players" and a policy vote would thus be a vote placed on a lurker/inactive player solely due to this. I'm basically asking if you're voting him exclusively due to his lack of activity and/or timing of activity.

[/quote]

Then no, it is not a policy vote.

[Natural_river]

Yes, I could elaborate.

I'd say vendetta, he makes not of PaperShift's newbie status, uses that as both a reason for and against voting for him, then backs off. I'm suspicious of anyone that picks an easy target. Plus his wordiness gives me a strange vibe too.
Then again DeltaBacon wanted to kick all of our arses, not a town friendly stance. Most likely a joke. But suspicious none the less.

this post.
After voting randomly on BT, while he/she popped in later in the game and could have at least made some decision based on some reason.

I'm really not sure, but DeltaBacon and Vendetta

sound a little off to me

this doesn't sound like a good reason to suspect anyone either.

I don't have a scumread on anyone yet. My BT vote was completely random and my suspicions aren't really valid either. Bacon, I suspect you because of your first post but I guess you could've been joking...

I doubt scum would be so obvious

. Vendetta, I can't put my finger on it, but

something is just off to me.

True, but I'm a novice and more of an observer.

I'm not too sure

of myself right now so I think it's best I sit back until I get a better grasp of things.

UNVOTE: BT

Maybe he/she is not mafia, but to me it seems like ovyo is using the "im new and innocent" act to get off the suspicion list.
It might be that ovyo is a beginner, but he/she just doesn't make any clear reasons why to vote someone...maybe because there is no reason.
Because he/she is mafia.

What do you guys think about this?

[Natural_river]

I'd say vendetta, he makes not of PaperShift's newbie status, uses that as both a reason for and against voting for him, then backs off. I'm suspicious of anyone that picks an easy target.

Plus his wordiness gives me a strange vibe too.

Then again DeltaBacon wanted to kick all of our arses, not a town friendly stance.

Most likely a joke. But suspicious none the less.

I forgot to underline these sentences.
strange vibe? so unclear.
And then ovyo tries to push suspicion to deltabacon because of this post..

Well hey there and hello, everyone.

I'm busy at the moment reading up on how to kick all your arses at Mafia

, but whilst I'm here I'll put a vote down on BT for having the same name as a woeful Internet Provider.

When he obviously meant kicking arses of the mafia.
Pretty sad reason to point FOS.

[Natural_river]

Yes, I know ovyo didn't FOS, but implied it.

[Natural_river]

Are we all going to wait till the game unfolds itself?
Mafia will win that way, this is wasting time....
Anyone have any thoughts on my vote on ovyo?
What do you guys think?
Have any other suspicions? why?
please post...

[Natural_river]

Well, I wasn't really referring to you buldermar, you're actually the most active in this game, hahaha.
But I was referring to others who are posting less.

Besides, I don't know if anybody noticed, but Paperspirit requested to be replaced... this kinda sucks cause we've been missing a player since saturday.

[Natural_river]

For some reason ovyo seems most suspicious to me.

I'm really not sure, but DeltaBacon and Vendetta sound a little off to me

In post 161, you say "This doesn't sound like a good reason to suspect anyone either." So what is the difference between this reasoning and your own reasoning against ovyo?

Airick, why didn't you post the complete message?
I said
"For some reason ovyo seems most suspicious to me.
Ever since the focus has been directed at buldermar, ovyo stayed perfectly silent and is conveniently "bogged down with coursework".
Now I am not saying that buldermar is not mafia or so, but I'm only seeing two names, whilst the rest kind of silently follows every now and then joining and agreeing/disagreeing
with what those two have to say."

Yes I said " for some reason" but then I explain why I suspect ovyo.
I don't know if you're just trying to sound clever, or if you're trying to mislead.
But you're not making a great impression.

[Natural_river]

This game needs so much more activity. If no-one contributes, then scum can safely hide amongst the lurkers, which sucks because then we're scuppered.

Basically guys, start posting.

"People need to post!

*crickets*

Really, people need to post!"

Compare to buldermar and Natural_river, who are actually trying to generate content even as they cajole others to post. This is grandstanding scum trying to look like he's doing something to improve the activity, when in truth he did nothing with that post.

VOTE: Deltabacon

Hi scum.

okay, I have read your posts, and I do believe you have a point, I even read back on Deltabacon's posts, and I can see some mafia in his posts.
He hasn't contributed to town yet, at least, I can't find one post that actually is progressive for town, all I see is that he keeps trying to get the reasons on why you think someone is "obvtown" or who is mafia.
To be honest, I can't blame him for wanting to find out, because I think everyone is pretty curious... just because you mention it's in the best interest for the town if you don't explain why, is not going to get people to trust your thought on this.

But what I don't like about his profile so far, is that he hasn't showed any effort to find the mafia.
Or at least, I can't notice much effort.
It also seems to me he doesn't like you so much, by the request to prod you, this can be seen as an effort to continue discussion, but can also be seen as a test to see if you were not a potential threat anymore.

The only thing stopping me from changing my vote to Deltabacon, is that ovyo in my opinion is just as suspicious.
That, and the fact that you have the tendency not to explain hardly any of your actions, I can see that you are a more experienced player, maybe you know more about the
game than I do, but this alone is not going to convince me fully that you are indeed town, you might as easily be an experienced mafia.

[Natural_river]

Quick post, Tierce, although you didn't explain why you thought paperspirit was obvtown, I do agree with your read.
I'm not going to vote for fish-riding-a-bike-2000 either.
Now, @fish, I agree with your vote, and I too will vote Deltabacon, but I don't like it when people pull that post " going to kick all your arses at mafia" up, because it's pretty obvious what he meant.
But I'm voting for the reasons mentioned before.

UNVOTE: ovyo

VOTE: Deltabacon

[Natural_river]

By the way, ovyo is STILL not posting... can we get a replacement on that one?
More activity would be great.

[Natural_river]

Buldermar, this huge wall of text has got to stop man, when you wish to quote somebody, cut off all the other text you don't need.
So, only keep the sentences you're replying to.
This is something I noticed a lot when checking out other games, I notice that mafia members often post HUGE quote walls man, it's to distract the reader,
and it'll make you miss vital information.

Pro-town is to make sure information is easily read.
Please stop making this game harder than it already is.

[Natural_river]

It's spelled " ovyo" btw.
But I've been getting my doubts about ovyo...
I looked more into ovyo's posts, it seems to me like ovyo really had no clue what was going on.
ovyo jumped in a game that happened to have Tierce and buldermar in it. Both very fierce players, lots of text, lots of BOOM BAM BAM!
Honestly, I think that's why we don't see ovyo in this game anymore.

Also that and the fact that ovyo has also cancelled her ( she's a girl, yes ) second game as well due to "homework."
I don't think a beginner would think that far ahead to cover her tracks if she was mafia.
I don't know if it's homework stopping her, but I don't think she's mafia, I think she just has no idea what's going on really.
And now has put the forum aside because of other interests.
If she was mafia, I believe her actions would be different, who wouldn't want to be mafia as a beginner?
Sounds so cool, you get to lynch at night and all.
This "defending" ovyo is not really a defence, it's just me stating a possibility.

Ovyo obviously isn't here to defend herself...
If only she would talk I could get a clearer read on her... maybe she'll get replaced soon.

[Natural_river]

Hey,Natural_river--quick post.

Please don't mention other ongoing games.

This is a forum rule and you can be hewed out for it--and rightfully so, as while some references can be harmless enough, drawing a line as to what can influence other games is a very subjective matter.

Oopsee, didn't think this would be against the rules...
But will not do anymore

And Buldermar... for F's sake.
We're not trying to build the great wall of China.

[Natural_river]

Buldermar, I wish for you to take an example of tierce's latest post.
Very handy to read, she cut out the pieces she was replying to.
I think quotes are very handy, use quotes, but is it so hard to cut out pieces?
I don't know what you're replying to if you have a huge wall,
I don't even want to know cause it's way too much work to read on entire conversation of 6 posts, just to see what you're saying next.
Just a simple request.

Redrabbit, I understand your view on ovyo, and am not going to go against it, cause in the end, I don't know for sure if my view on her was correct.

And I do agree with tierce that if you believe some sort of information might be harmful for town, it should not be revealed, but I don't think tierce did a great job concealing it.
Tierce, you mentioning that you had information about town that might be harmful for town is something I wouldn't recommend doing again, it only causes confusion.
I seriously can't understand how any information might be harmful for town.
I also can't understand your "obvtown" read, what else can make you so certain someone is town, other than going against the rules of the game?

But then again, these are just questions about your read on paperspirit, which you won't answer anyway, so me saying this seems like a waste of time.

Oh, and I see that mrjameswason is in the game.
Welcome, and a good tip would be umm...
1.)Think before you type.
And 2.) have fun.

[Natural_river]

No.
UNVOTE: Deltabacon

Tierce, you give me the heebiddygeebies.

And I'm starting to get my doubts about Deltabacon,
I don't know how you managed to get everyone to face Deltabacon, but you did.

It seems you feel the right to vote and call obvtown without further explanation calling it necessary for town that we don't know.
All you have caused is chaos, I guess in a way it starts discussion, but I don't think you're getting the right guy.
Buldermar hasn't contributed much either, not much reasons why he thinks who is who, just lots of theory talk...
I'm going to read over things today.
Gonna try to get me clear reads.
I'll post tonight.

[Natural_river]

These are two strange accusations to make at this point.

Tierce has not been contributing to the ongoing of the discussion after initially stating that she wasn't going to reveal the read. In fact, she's several times made it clear that she'd prefer it stopped. You, on the other hand,

did

contribute to its ongoing:

I believe tierce made up the town read to get a discussion started.
I think she wanted to lure out the mafia, but it don't think it worked.
Mafia is still hiding.

Tierce, you mentioning that you had information about town that might be harmful for town is something I wouldn't recommend doing again, it only causes confusion.
I seriously can't understand how any information might be harmful for town.
I also can't understand your "obvtown" read, what else can make you so certain someone is town, other than going against the rules of the game?

What does this accomplish?

Well, can't you see I'm explaining why I think her "obvtown" read is BS ?

It seems you feel the right to vote and call obvtown without further explanation calling it necessary for town that we don't know.

What about this?

I clearly stated

several times

that I have a scumread on vendetta. I've informed that I am fine with lynching Tierce on the premise that she does not reveal her read once she's at L1 and in danger of being lynched. I have a townread on Airick, despite his most recent read on me being misguided. He has not been opportunistic the way some others in this thread has, and he has thoroughly explained each of his votes.

I didn't have much of a read on your slot, but recently you've been acting in a suspicious way. You've tried to blame Tierce for your own vote on Delta:

I knew it...
oh, I have this feeling about you buldermar... and it keeps growing.
You can't handle any pressure, at all.
Whenever any attention is focused your way, you get freaked.
I purposely talked about your quoting style, for one, it IS annoying, even the new guy noticed this first thing he joined.
And for second, I needed something to link to you being mafia.
To see how you would react.
Your reaction to a potential threat is attack.
You haven't fully attacked me yet, but you're building it up.
You want to vote people you don't like, not people you suspect.

No.
UNVOTE: Deltabacon

Tierce, you give me the heebiddygeebies.

And I'm starting to get my doubts about Deltabacon,
I don't know how you managed to get everyone to face Deltabacon, but you did.

And you've been preoccupied with seemingly unimportant things, such as my way of quoting (this in isolation might be a null, but in conjunction with the other things it becomes suspicious to me).

It's becoming clearer to me, vendetta21 was right for voting you.
Tierce was too, but I think she's distracted.
Buldermar, you're my number one suspect.

VOTE: Buldermar

[Natural_river]

Hey buldermar--you should be voting Deltabacon. We can get his buddy tomorrow. I'm a huge not-a-fan of how Natural_river jumped off Deltabacon to make a larger wagon on you just now, and how he's trying to paint a personality quirk/posting style as something bad, so cooperate with me now and we can get two birds with

one stone

two nooses.

And yes, I've said that if the danger of not outing the reason for my townread on the fish-riding-a-bike-2000 outweighs the benefits of

not

revealing it (i.e. getting a townie in danger of being lynched--me or him), I will obviously explain it. No, it's not a made-up read, I have no reasons to lie as town and I don't do silly gambits like that to spark discussion just to smother it afterwards by saying I wouldn't want it discussed.

You are very energetic, very quick paced and aggressive in playing style.
I like the aggression, it's good to catch people off guard.
But it seems to me you're someone you can be on the "good side" of, or the "bad side".
On the good side, you seem to overlook things.

It's not a personality quirk/posting style.
Going against any suspicion on yourself with an attack is suspicious.
If you feel you have to get Deltabacon, I'm forced to try to stop you, since I do have a town read on him.
It has changed suddenly, since I read over his posts again, but then not only in ISO.
I realized that actually, we are all just as confused over your obvtown reads, and your mafia reads.
None of them explained, it's only logic to question, it's not lingering on purpose.

I think you think you know what you're doing... but you don't.
You have experience in mafia forum, and you believe that that gives you some power that makes your hunches correct, well it
doesn't.
You are joining with the mafia.
Vote who you will, I am so certain, the outcome of the game will give you the answer, but that's too far to wait.
Buldermar is a mafia, who whispers in the ears of innocent townies, giving them false trails.

Oh, and I can see now that James agrees... well, I guess that the outcome of our votes could prove if sylvant/ovyo/mrjameswatson are townies or not.

[Natural_river]

(applause for the dramatics please)

[Natural_river]

Well, Tierce, I amjust going to say this.
I do not find your reasons on voting someone sufficient, you voted Ovyo becasue sylvant voted paperspirit who was obvtown to you,but cannot be proven it is so.
So in other words, to me you had a gut feeling and went with it. Not going to suffice.

You voted Buldermar, and I believe you explained pretty well why,and I agreed.
Now you unvoted buldermar,and I don't see the reason in doing that, it was right after he asked you to be replaced.
Yes it's normal for someone to ask for replacement for someone who has been inactive for a while, but that just matched too perfectly with you being suspicious
of him.
To me that screams " oh, I hope she get's replaced".
And you unvote him for that.
I don't get it.

Now this latest post of buldermar tells me 100% that he is mafia.
Asking me to check his other games to see his gaming style, knowing I won't.
Voting Deltabacon along with you, he loves the safety you are giving him.

And no, we aren't the same people.
I don't know why he so agrees with me, probably to get me on his good side.
Understandable since his slot has eyes on him.