The Wire, Season 1 - Final Credits!

[The Mini-Librarian]

eh

VOTE: mcstab

[The Mini-Librarian]

Sottyrulez eh? I take it Zach/Sotty hydra as opposed to just Sotty which is listed?

Over compensating already... oh dear.

VOTE: Ser Arthur Dayne

Why didn't you comment on SAD's post in your first post?

[The Mini-Librarian]

His is 22...

[The Mini-Librarian]

Gah.

I mean why didn't you mention it in post 23.

My bad.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Heh, I was just about to say 79 is scum.

VOTE: Shadoweh

--

Also don't like Great american Hero.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Work Post.
-
3rd party vibes from Nost's 103 (His suggestion for massclaim came of a bit desperate. Sounds like a lyncher or a SK that needs to kill specific people.
-
Safety Dance's 113 is either bad at mafia or scum. Not sure whichh yet.
-
@American Hero: Can you explain what you mean in 115?
-

I had to do a double take and re-read 79 could you explain how it is scum, please?

Basically, I find the whole post to be highly contrived. It just plain doesn't sound genuine to me.
-
Not liking peta (not engaged in the game, coasting through)
-
@Absta: why no vote for Safety Dance in 134
-
@Benmage: Reason for voting Plessie?
-

@The Mini-L: Why don't you like Great American hero?

66 felt like a lame question designed only stir up dissension and not find actual scum. They've played slightly better lately though.
-
Townread on mccstab for 160
-
camn's obsession with SAD is annoying and scummy.
-
might change my vote later. will expound on any of this if questioned after work.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Not liking peta (not engaged in the game, coasting through)

i just have no idea what i'm doing

[Reminder to self to meta peta soon]

--

For contrieved reasoning like 'calling for mass nameclaim must mean a third party' and avoiding commenting on current vote (never commenting on it really. 'it felt funny'.) along with asking why absta isn't voting for someone Mini himself isn't convinced is scum? Mostly I don't like your face double spacing that makes it look like your post is alot bigger then it is, when you only express one solid read in the entire thing. Sounds like lurking.

1. ("Contrived Reasoning". Heh, I see what you did there.) Anyway, it was the way he called for it. It was mentioned already and shot down. In his post he showed that he was reading at least some of thread so his call for name massclaim felt very weird to me. And as Benmage correctly noted Omar could easily want specific people dead.

2. Did you read the absta post? It doesn't make much sense (to me at least) to spend the majority of your post casting suspicion on someone and just unvoting. I believe people should make use of their vote and he isn't. I was wondering why.

3. You don't like the double spacing or the fact that it's shallow? The double spacing is for readability. I hate single spacing if each line is talking about something different. Seems cluttered. The (lack of) depth was mainly due to the fact it was a WORK POST. If you have a question about my post ask.

[The Mini-Librarian]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: absta

Seriously don't like any of his posts.

--

@Shadoweh

:

Scum Reads:
Absta (doesn't seem to be interested in finding scum. useless questions)
Safetydance (essentially the same thing)
You (reasons give already)
peta (wtf active lurking)
camn (obsession with is SAD's rp-ing is scummy. attack on Pless isn't particularly good either)
Nost (like I've said, his massclaim post set off a 3rd party ping on my radar. Obviously very weak, cause 3rd party)

Town:
Cerulean (established at 94)
DV (he seems to be honest with his feeling of not having many reads, doesn't read fake)
Benmage (light town read for content. not strong because, well, benmage)

--

@Safetydance

: Are you seriously bringing up

that

game as proof you're not terrible?

The reason why your vote was bad was that it didn't try and find scum (especially with 100+ posts before yours). Reasons like that are a perfect cover for scum, because they can just say "HE WAS BEING ANTI-TOWN" and move on with life.

[The Mini-Librarian]

For people on the Safetydance wagon: Why him over Absta? I really feel that Absta is display many of the same signs that Safety is except on a much worse level.

I like 351. Makes a lot of sense to me. Move Jason to a slight scum read. Probably not voting him today though. (Also Jason's latest wall-post-things are terrible. ugh.)

Don't like plessie's 364. That is not trying to get your scum read lynched, or even put pressure on the slot.

[The Mini-Librarian]

I am not convinced on Jasonscum. It certainly could be that he is fooling me, but I generally feel confident on my gut reads of Jason.
In re: my so-called "obsession"..... if that's gonna keep getting mentioned, I would like someone to point out where it actually happened. I am officially telling you that it was just a question, and one I would want answered any time someone displays a weird post-style. But to spin it as "obsession "...... It does occur to me to wonder why anyone would spin it that way So cite, please. Or retract.

Yeah, maybe "obsession" was hyperbolic, but when you ask the same question twice (147 and 182) AFTER he essentially answered your question (82 and 123) it's not going to sit with me well.

--

Remember when I said I was going to meta peta? Well I did. He's scum.

VOTE: peta

town peta

scum peta

Town peta is much more focused early in the day in terms of scumhunting. Scum peta takes a few pages to find something he wants to bite on.

This is something that is fairly consistent throughout his meta.

So in conclusion, more peta votes please.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Librarian #390 gets a mention for commenting on the big wagons while still sticking to a vote that no one is interested in.

Could you please explain why this post of mine is scummy?

--

[Re: peta]How many (and which) games did you check?

town
scum
town
town
town
scum
scum

[The Mini-Librarian]

I just noticed I missed a question from nost. (not sure why he didn't mention it again though...)

1. ("Contrived Reasoning". Heh, I see what you did there.) Anyway, it was the way he called for it. It was mentioned already and shot down. In his post he showed that he was reading at least some of thread so his call for name massclaim felt very weird to me. And as Benmage correctly noted Omar could easily want specific people dead.

I've actually already answered that question about bringing it back up; is there a reason you are unsatisfied with my answer or are you hoping people wouldn't notice?

Am I correct that your reasoning for bringing it up again was to clear players that claimed Avon and Stringer, per post 107? You should be able to realize that doesn't really alleviate my concern that you're a 3rd party with a hit list.

--

@BT:

Let me rephrase, why is that particular action of mine scummy in your eyes. I don't see how in a vacuum that particular action can be seen as scummy, nor can I see how in this particular situation that can be seen as scummy.

--

As for trying to narrow down the wagons, peta is still my number one choice. Not particularly interested in Safetydance today (SD is not scum buddies with peta) Jason is a good compromise with my only concern being sottyrulez insistence that they're town (tiny town read on them, they seem to be playing similarly to a game I just finished with them). I'm not sure what to make of mcstab right now. He's incredibly null to me.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Let me rephrase, why is that particular action of mine scummy in your eyes. I don't see how in a vacuum that particular action can be seen as scummy, nor can I see how in this particular situation that can be seen as scummy.

Because you were clearly showing interest in the big wagons but your vote didn't reflect that -- it was wasted on Absta instead. Why didn't you commit to one of the wagons at #390?

Cause I thought (and still do btw) absta was a better vote than both Safetydance and Jason. I'm not really sure why your confused about this. A few of my goals in that post were to 1) try to convince people to take a good hard look at Absta again, 2) failing that, try to have people explain to me why Safety is scummier than Absta, since I saw Safety essentially as a Absta-lite at the time, and 3) announce that I had a newfound slight scum read on Jason.

--

@petapan

Could you bullet the reasoning behind your two top 2 scum reads (Sdance, jason? if thats still them)
-And bullet top 2 town reads with a reason or two please.

i think safetydance is scum because he was super bitchy and indignant about how SAD was acting but used words like "antitown" to describe it, then shifted his focus solely to defending himself and complaining and acting like he's a victim. it's bullshit, he's fake, his words ring hollow

i don't particularly have a reason on jason, i was more or less following other people there but i lost confidence in that vote

if i had townreads i was confident in, i would state them. i don't. i don't believe anyone here is someone i can easily read as town.

Heh, one read. Yeah this guy isn't town.

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@Mini-L - Are you voting peta for meta reasons only? (post #439.)
Also, did you read more than two games of his?

Only? No. Mainly? Yes. (I also don't like his unwillingness to try to read anyone) (I am going to assume you got to my list of games cited eventually)

--

Unvote
Vote: Plessiezarus

Explanation later.

If possible, explain this.

--

I almost had a heart attack when I saw the red.

"Hey look guys! I got a town pm! I swear!"

--

-TML hasn't really had any negative contribution. His posting albeit low, is pretty good (I don't think he's ever very prolific?).

Yeah, yeah. I tend to get drowned out first day. I don't like spam posting and frankly don't have the time to do so.

--

I'm gonna be honest here. I still haven't read those Plessiezarus case walls. My eye just kinda glaze over when I see them. Will read soon though.

[The Mini-Librarian]

I'm gonna be honest here. I still haven't read those Plessiezarus case walls. My eye just kinda glaze over when I see them. Will read soon though.

They are actually worth reading. I think Plez might be town.

Already have a slight town read on them cause 614. This is main reason I asked that question to SAD, since he voted them shortly after that post. (most useful case was the one on mcstab still not confident in any sort of read on that slot though. Will iso again tonight.)

--

Vote: Camn
Votes me for null reasons and doesn't comment when I point that out.

1) Your pointing that out wasn't particularly convincing. (hint: there's a difference between acting nonchalant about a vote yet explaining why the person is wrong and just acting nonchalant about the vote) 2) even if you're right, why does this make camn scum?

--

This game is pissing me off. Jason is scum, but most people are so fixated on his "gambit" that they can't see past their nose.

-That's not why he is scum.-

Jason is scum due to 1) saying Dayne is scum because he's trying hard to look Barksdale (wtf?) 2) Push on Vifam because "one-liners" but hey! hasn't touched BT since he replaced in 3) if people haven't looked at the Dresden Mafia link, do it he's not the same 4) Here's the kicker: If Jason was so worried about scum "fitting in" why does he have no comment on CDB's early posting about absta?

Honest question: why didn't you post something like this much, much closer to your vote on Jason? You've had a scum read on Jason for most of the game now, but haven't really reduced your suspicions into an easy-to-follow format until just now.

--

@Nost: post 582

-TML hasn't really had any negative contribution. His posting albeit low, is pretty good (I don't think he's ever very prolific?). Looks like genuine reading/questioning, and he does give reads which is something you need to be more wary of if someone's coasting(That is coasting and not giving reads). Think you're jumping the gun a little early with the lack of questioning on his spot. Tis D1.

I agree; I said basically exactly the same myself, I think I'd like to hear more from TML, I think TML hasn't done anything terrible, and I think players who go through D1 without heat worry me. There's no accusations here yet, maybe in time depending on how TML comes across to me, I haven't even got the gun out never mind tried to jump it.

New question: why sling non-suspicion onto my particular slot for not being attacked when there's other slots that fufill your criteria? (baby spice, sottyrulez)

[The Mini-Librarian]

[re: camn]She's voting McStab for doing something that she's done twice. The other one is her Ooooh, Big Man post, where she doesn't explain anything. It's scummy, first of all, because using bs cases to try push a lynch is scummy, and secondly, because of the cognitive dissonance involved in voting someone for something that you do yourself. Now, okay, people have different takes on things, and that's fine, but she doesn't even comment when I point out that she's done exactly the thing that she's voting me for, which is something that I don't see coming from town who's trying to get me lynched.

:/

Yeah, none of those are legitimate reasons to think someone's scum.

--

ML -- can you explain your town-read on McStab? (From 197). What about 160 made you think McStab was town? And (since you don't list him as a town-read in your next-but-one post, 307) why did he stop being a town-read?

Also, did you find BT's implict suggestion that your 390 was scummy to be suspicious, or just strange? What are your current thoughts on that slot? (I don't think you ever mentioned Vifam, did you?)

Re: Mcstab - I think I had a town read on 160 because of the case on nost (felt like he was at least trying). I tend to be overly cautious giving out town reads on lists like 307 so he came off. That one post wasn't enough to put him the list.

Re: BT - I tend to work off people's suspicion on my slot, so I found his suggestion to be strange possibly suspicious. After the fact, I find his suspicion to be bad but not something to vote for. (so basically the slightest of scum leans on this slot.

[The Mini-Librarian]

VOTE: zdenek

[The Mini-Librarian]

Deadline compromise lynch.

(If you want to know why specifically I find you to be scummy, it's because I don't like your reactions to people voting you.)

[The Mini-Librarian]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: actiondan

Zdenek should just choose someone who he thinks will live till tomorrow. If ZD is lying he'll get lynched. If the person that recieves it lies, then he'll get lynched d3 after ZD.

(@zd: I know it's too late, but I thought your responses to camn's and jason's suspicions on you were not logical and forced. Especially the Jason one.)

[The Mini-Librarian]

Friendly Neighbour != Neighbourizer

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?tit ... _Neighbour

It's a necessarily town-aligned role.

its not a town role, but its also not a scum role...It can be used as scum or town and has no real indication as to the allignment of the person at all.

eh? how so?

[The Mini-Librarian]

no.

you claim now if you want me to believe you.

[The Mini-Librarian]

One thing we definitely don't like about TGAH is rofl's absence, but think that Konowa's posting has been all right and more like his town self. Empire has a stronger townish feel there than I do but I've mentioned that before. I'd really like to know why TGAH hasn't given a read on deasvail though. In the game we all just finished playing, rofl read dv correctly as scum really early and Konowa was the main reason why we lynched dv at the end. He also said that he felt like he had a grasp of dv's meta now. So why haven't they given a read on him here? If you have a good grasp of someone's meta, and you just correctly read them, isn't that the type of person you give a read for? And I've never known rofl not to be open about a scum or town read when he has them.

What posts of TGAH read town to you lately? Cause I was actually leaning the other way. 819 reads like Konawa is reading along but isn't engaging himself except to comment on his pet read.

--

@actiondan: Do you know the name of your qt? (Essentially do you know if your qt name is Orlando's or not?)

[The Mini-Librarian]

Willing to let Dan live a night.

VOTE: TGAH

[The Mini-Librarian]

One sentence reasons?

[The Mini-Librarian]

(intenttohammermyass)

lolololol

(why hasn't TGAH claimed yet?)

[The Mini-Librarian]

Why didn't Actiondan claim his night action immediately? >.>

Looking at day one a bit, to see if anything pops out.

@camn:

Could you explain the town read on benmage based on associative tells? I see the others, that one is eluding me.

[The Mini-Librarian]

VOTE: SAD

Interested in this Jason vote by Sotty. Not sure what to make of it.

I need to think about Action Dan a bit. As of right now I don't think I'm going to move over there.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Dudes I DO NOT want to lynch: Camn, Plessiezarus, Jason, Nostredeus, SafetyDance, Benmage, Librarian, Zdenek, DV (uneasy about this one though)

I believe it is worth it to note that my list is exactly the same. (except replace myself with Cerulean obvs.)

[The Mini-Librarian]

Yeah, but zd isn't scum unless he's scum with benmage.

(basically read the thread first)

[The Mini-Librarian]

I'm alive. Weekend was more time consuming than I anticipated.

@Jason

Do you think Kuribo has a better chance of being scum than SAD? Your post seemed to indicate otherwise (after all why mention him at all in your post?)

[The Mini-Librarian]

judging the flips we've had since day 1, i'd reckon scum SAD would have to be A+ fucking stupid to say this:

Nah the east-side people are not that important in s1. I can see 3 cops + like Bubbles as a traitor to the cops + Omar as an SK.

just saying, I'm not feeling him as scum, like, at all

This is a very, very good point.

UNVOTE:

[The Mini-Librarian]

VOTE: CDB

--

If you think we're scum with TGAH after the way day 1 played out, I really don't know what to tell you.

Um...Traitor? (jus sayin)

--

Now I'm feeling stupid. Why is this a good point? What makes you both think that SAD wouldn't say this as scum?

~ Pless

Pretty much exactly what kuribo said. It's definitely enough for me to at least not worry about him for a while.

[The Mini-Librarian]

@sotty

: K, that makes sense.

Do you guys still have a town read on CDB?

[The Mini-Librarian]

Guys I really want Jason's flip now.

Did you forget about this?

This game is pissing me off. Jason is scum, but most people are so fixated on his "gambit" that they can't see past their nose.

-That's not why he is scum.-

Jason is scum due to 1) saying Dayne is scum because he's trying hard to look Barksdale (wtf?) 2) Push on Vifam because "one-liners" but hey! hasn't touched BT since he replaced in 3) if people haven't looked at the Dresden Mafia link, do it he's not the same 4) Here's the kicker: If Jason was so worried about scum "fitting in" why does he have no comment on CDB's early posting about absta?

Don't make question my read on you again...

[The Mini-Librarian]

@Kuribo: is there a reason for this camn 3rd party push?

[The Mini-Librarian]

people I don't want to lynch updated

Cerulean
Plessiezarus
Benmage
sottyrulez
JasonT1981
camn
Ser Arthur Dayne
Safetydance
Zdenek
Deasvail
kuribo
Nostredeus

That leaves these three:

BT
ChannelDeliBird
Kise

Kise is null as all get out. scum reads on the other two.

[The Mini-Librarian]

if I was pushing her, I'd be voting her, come on man, you know this


i'm suspicious of her as a serial killer, and I'm questioning her. big difference

rephrase. Why are you suspicious that she's a sk?

[The Mini-Librarian]

TML, you're both saying that SAD is town because scum knew there was a traitor and that Sotty could be scum because scum didn't know there was a traitor.

Thank you for concisely showing that I'm an idiot. Knock SAD back into OK with lynching territory.

--

By the way I see some really bad PoE on TML's part ("uhh automatic scumreads are a go"). These are the instances where you want to reconsider some of those reads / question if you gave out townclears too easily and I don't see you doing that. (Not scummy, just a complaint.)

Am more than willing to consider any town read at any time if someone points out why they might be scum. (see above.) But this post isn't helpful.

--

@sottyrulez:

Do you find TGAH's push on Nost day one to be distancing rather than pushing a mislynch?

--

Why aren't people voting? This is day 2 people. You're supposed to have some reads.

[The Mini-Librarian]

guys. As amusing as this is, can we not do this?

Can't you guys go take a smoke break or something? Just step away from your keyboard a bit.

[The Mini-Librarian]

and TML, you're doing it wrong, I don't see a vote for me or ben in that post

But I have town reads of varying degrees on both of you. So nope no vote.

(cue swearing and insults )

[The Mini-Librarian]

Kuribo:

I'm voting scum here. Look at CDB's interactions with Absta and get back to me.

[The Mini-Librarian]

SAD

: Why kuribo over CDB?

[The Mini-Librarian]

I'd like to direct everyone's attention to the play of Nostradeus and Kise. When you get a free moment from your focus on the major bandwagons, feel free to take a look at their play.

I feel horrible for stalling on you guys.

Why don't I have any votes on me?

Unvote: Vote: Kise

I was meant to actually get back to Babyspice way back when but that went on the backburner for some reason, but she never bothered to give me anything to back up her meta read of Vifam scum with anything other than her word. (If there was an actual meta read, how does she not have even so much as a single game to rattle off for reference to go look and verify what she got?)

::goodposting::

If this CDB wagon wasn't so awesome I'd jump over here.

--

@TML: Where the hell are you?

girlfriend's place/modding for the first time/genuinely uninterested in what people are talking about (really it's mainly the last one)

[The Mini-Librarian]

Really I just want this day to end with a CDB lynch and I'm very content pushing that forward for the time being. All of the discussion points I really wanted to talk about have already been mentioned so I just kinda want this day to be brought towards an end.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Any response to the mountain of posts I've been making, TML? Or are you just tuning them out?

Let's see - The assertions you make Re: your connections to absta aren't convincing at all and I still don't get the feeling you're genuinely trying to find scum. That pretty much sums up my opinion of you today.

--

TML, you're not really "pushing it forward" though, you're just kinda running on idle while I yell at people

bleh. You're right. :I My natural state is passivity I guess.

[The Mini-Librarian]

The Mini-Librarian - Said literally nothing about me other than his initial vote and a general "I just want CDB to hang/this wagon's so great" until I explicitly called him on ignoring me. I had him down as assumed town but have forgotten why and his play suits someone looking to ride my wagon and offer the bare minimum to add to my desperate defence when questioned on it. Guilty.

mmm-hmmm. How is my play regarding your slot scum motivated? Or any of the people you say are "coasting" on your wagon for that matter.

[The Mini-Librarian]

People like you, BT, et cetera have said little and less but stoked the fire of a wagon that was first running quickly up and now is in a position where it looks like it's dragging towards a "yeah, sure, that'll do" lynch. The scum motivation is to let that happen without having to justify it too much at the time because they know it's going to flip town.

OK, if this is the case you should take vote position into account. I also know you know that being vocal does not equal town.

Did you look at other people you suspect and their interactions between absta and TGAH, or just BT? If so what did you find?

[The Mini-Librarian]

OK. Just one last question for now. I may have missed it, but why was BT more pressing than the others?

[The Mini-Librarian]

I hate to agree with Scotty here but the last few pages feel town:

Unvote

@TML: CDB asked a reasonable question, could you answer it (at the very least so I see what I'm apparently missing there):

Sure. Why should your position on the wagon change my suspicion of you, as you imply?

Also if your main complaint with CDB is that he isn't looking for scum to what degree do you agree/disagree that CDB has been forced to defend himself instead and couldn't?

Eh, it wasn't really to change his suspisicion on my slot or anything. I genuinely want him to attempt to scumhunt. I'm more interested about trying to figure out if CDB is scum or not. It'll be easier to read him (at least for me) if he takes everything into account when analyzing his wagon.

And no, the main reason I don't like him is the day 1 interactions.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Reminder to self to iso BT and sottyrulez when I get off work today so I can put that interaction into context a bit. Gut says it doesn't look good for BT, but would like to make sure.

@Kuribo

: is there any other reason you have for thinking SAD is town than the traitor thing?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: kise

[The Mini-Librarian]

Reminder to self to iso BT and sottyrulez when I get off work today so I can put that interaction into context a bit. Gut says it doesn't look good for BT, but would like to make sure.

Finally got around to this. It actually got me to give a slight town read on BT believe it or not. (at least not want to lynch him today.) His push on Sotty seems very natural to me. It may not be the best push in the world, but it looks town.

more later.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Yo, Kise. Stop taking playing tips from Katsuki and get in here. You are lurking like a mofo and I don't like this.

This setup spec shit is shit and needs to stop. We need to focus on the wagons that are actually doable. Also, why are there stillllll people not voting. :I

[The Mini-Librarian]

TML, what's your reason for shying away from the kuribo wagon?

Mild town read from Kuribo's play, especially that town read on SAD. Doesn't seem like a scum thing to do imo.

I see what you're saying about this lynch being mostly useless for information, but frankly with the flips we already have I really don't care about info flipping right now. I just wanna kill scum.

[The Mini-Librarian]

Part of me wants to lynch Kise regardless of his claim, on the other hand Kuribo does have a point about the no counterclaims. I need to think on this a while.

UNVOTE:

for now

[The Mini-Librarian]

Ah, shit the thread exploded...

Kinda read the thread right there (I'm sick also, so concentration no the best thing in the world right now) Gonna have to go with the SAD wagon over the options right now.

VOTE: SAD

(and I'll try to tap into your posting prowress kuribo, thanks for bequeathing it to me )

[The Mini-Librarian]

hrrg. You know what, I do kind of get what you guys are saying about the absta thing, especially since I do tend to bus early. My day 2 play was just really natural to me though, especially considering how many town read/not mafia reads I had. It just made sense to work from those down.

I'm leaning towards kise right now. Need to actually spend some time parsing through this shit but yeah,

[The Mini-Librarian]

People who have town reads on Nost could you please explain why.