Micro 134 (F11) (Game Over!)

[jasonT1981]

vote: Sixty

yup, L-1 quick-lynch FTW... whoever quick-hammers is town foreva

[jasonT1981]

1) Didn't realize Sixty was hydra... even with knowing that it wouldn't change my vote.

2) I will reveal my reasons,not right now though.... I want everyone to weigh in on the issue first

[jasonT1981]

vote: Josh

yup, that was the reaction to my post I was looking.

Someone comes in auto wanting the lynch without question or hesitation, and has since said 0 about it when it died down.

[jasonT1981]

I am thinking Nacho, Josh scum team too btw.

[jasonT1981]

wow thought I had posted Yesterday. FourTrouble... your reaction was that of what I would expect of scum in a OMGUS and seemingly paranoia jumping onto the person who votes you

[jasonT1981]

Yea, ignore that... I was responding to him, in another game..... blagh ffs. I am in two games with him atm and I had two windows open

Mod Note: Duplicate post deleted.

[jasonT1981]

Normal weekend V/LA

[jasonT1981]

So, after a re-read... I am still not sure wtf is going on. Josh and Nacho for scum though. Both mostly gut, but Josh jump on me was scummy as fuck.

[jasonT1981]

2)

Josh Lyman

, it was implied that you like to quickhammer people at L-1. Is this true?

Nope. I'm a lurky-type of player who doesn't really meet anyone else's expectations.

unvote

Will re-read later today and place a vote.

this is why I am sure Josh be scum.... Along with his jump on me.

Nothing since and this was wednesday except for one extra empty post.

[jasonT1981]

jason has trouble faking reasoning as scum

Actually, I do think you are wrong, I don't like to self meta, but my arguements are more solid when scum.

[jasonT1981]

back - post soon

[jasonT1981]

Can we just cut though the crap and get your scum reads and reasons for why? That would be most excellent.

this, too much talk of past games and meta is really putting me off!

[jasonT1981]

2)

Josh Lyman

, it was implied that you like to quickhammer people at L-1. Is this true?

Nope. I'm a lurky-type of player who doesn't really meet anyone else's expectations.

unvote

Will re-read later today and place a vote.

despite this, he never did put down a vote, did he?

Urgh,

unvote

until his replacement comes in.

[jasonT1981]

I shall try... I am failing in all my games right now. :/ all my fuckin' pre-ins came up at once lately. I try catching up in one, I fall behind in another. URGH

[jasonT1981]

I'm finding Sotty fairly town for her Tierce exchange.

pretty much agree with you on this, scum sotty would be all over me for lack of activity and pushing it to high hell, but town Sotty will go on actual cases against you etc.

[jasonT1981]

Very tempted to vote Whiskers right now, josh was meh, whiskers done little to convince me that kitty is a soft kitty....

[jasonT1981]

You didn't respond to this, but I might as well come out with why this bugged the hell out of me: Sotty has been pretty much attacking you all game solely because you haven't been active. Didn't you just say that was her scum meta? Why are you suddenly clearing her for it?

very wrong, Sotty had not been calling me scum all d1 because of it. If she had, that would be more her scum meta. But it was gradual.

[jasonT1981]

Sotty's town read of Jason muddies the waters quite a bit w.r.t what the scum team is (Syryana's last post isn't bad either), but it only makes this vote easier:

Vote: Nacho

how so, do you not have your own opinions, or are you relying on Sotty to provide the scum team for you on a plate?

[jasonT1981]

There is one flaw with the hammer on cop so can't be scum argument,

there was no cop claim until after the hammer had been laid down.......

As scum CES would not have known he was hammering the cop.. he would have just known he was hammering town who was seen as scummy and could have been hammering to earn town cred.

[jasonT1981]

Also, did it occur to you that

other

people might not want to lynch him depending on his claim?

This is an actual serious question, not just rhetorical whining.

jason, your turn: what do you think of CES? (You

sort

of ninja'd me, but I'd like more of a concrete answer. Do you suspect CES, and

why

?) What do you think we should do with CES? Policy lynch him?

Also, I'll look for quotes when I have more time, but I'm pretty sure the first negative thing Sotty said about you was that you were lurking.

At best, very opertunistic - no claim, and a fast L-1,Hammer situation. The hammer came right in the very next game post after Four Trouble put him at L-1. (There was a mod VC between) If anything. Fourtrouble had a good bit of interaction/comments on Josh, but 0 on Whiskers...

At worst it is scum hammering, thinking they are hammering an unclaimed town who many found scummy and got shit luck when the cop flip came.

Also, he says Sotty/Jason scum team makes sense to him, but his vote is on someone totally different.. Nacho, the very person he was lining up for a lynch with his hammer.

I am only holding off a vote, because it will put him at L-1 less than 24 hours after game begun. I see no town reasoning in CES actions both yesterday leading up to the hammer, and today with calling a possible Sotty/Jason team, yet have his vote on Nacho.

[jasonT1981]

I also am considering a push at fourtrouble for his L-1 vote.

[jasonT1981]

this is more my own thoughts, but given the flip, we can deduce the following setups are the only ones in play now.

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Sane Doctor, 5 Townies
2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies

[jasonT1981]

CES Can you explain what makes sense about Jason/Sotty scum team, given Sotty's only real thoughts of me being scum was due to activity being low.. and not the way you are blowing it out. Most of the time she commented on my actual game play.. she saw town in it... her only thoughts of jason-scum was on lack of activity.

Also, can you explain why if the scum team makes sense, your vote is elsewhere?

[jasonT1981]

CES Can you explain what makes sense about Jason/Sotty scum team, given Sotty's only real thoughts of me being scum was due to activity being low.. and not the way you are blowing it out. Most of the time she commented on my actual game play.. she saw town in it... her only thoughts of jason-scum was on lack of activity.

You're not bothered by Sotty calling you scum in her last post Yesterday and calling you 90% town Today? The interaction between you and Sotty has been a bit weird and I'm definitely missing something if the two of you are town (and I don't really think you have different alignments).

I've played with Sotty too many times to care. I am used to Sotty finding it hard to get an accurate read on me and in a lot of games changes from scum to town and vice versa on me. I don't find it troubling. Her scum read on me was just for activity levels being low.

[jasonT1981]

prod received, its 3.40am. Thought I had posted yesterday, obv not. Post tomorrow when its not 3.40am

[jasonT1981]

Argh, Zach... You know I'm V/LA at weekends.

Been trying to sort my own game out as of late.. back soon

[jasonT1981]

Also, he says Sotty/Jason scum team makes sense to him, but his vote is on someone totally different.. Nacho, the very person he was lining up for a lynch with his hammer.

Sotty/you is worth exploring, certainly; that doesn't mean I should vote for either of you. Do you think I was trying to line up lynch while quickhammering as scum?

More like making an empty statement with little to back it up with.

CES Can you explain what makes sense about Jason/Sotty scum team, given Sotty's only real thoughts of me being scum was due to activity being low.. and not the way you are blowing it out. Most of the time she commented on my actual game play.. she saw town in it... her only thoughts of jason-scum was on lack of activity.

You're not bothered by Sotty calling you scum in her last post Yesterday and calling you 90% town Today? The interaction between you and Sotty has been a bit weird and I'm definitely missing something if the two of you are town (and I don't really think you have different alignments).

not really, reads change all the time.

The thought process in Syryana's 383 is superficial, too.

can you expand on this please?

Me and Jason because I attach myself to my scum buddies like this? No really, what's the rationale behind this?

exactly, its a load of tosh.. you bus and bus hard as scum.

Why do you think CES and FT are scum outside of the hammer and L-1? Do you think they are scum together?

I think there is a good chance, fourT put Whiskers in the position for a Quick hammer.. there is also this from D1

wow thought I had posted Yesterday. FourTrouble... your reaction was that of what I would expect of scum in a OMGUS and seemingly paranoia jumping onto the person who votes you

tosses unneeded support onto the wagon, does nothing else

I suggest you read, Josh was already a scumread of mine before whiskers came in

probing for support of an easy target
no followthrough when no one takes up his offer

Its not an easy target, and I am still interested in a FT wagon.

[jasonT1981]

So he suspects a Sotty-Jason scumteam but votes Nacho? I don't see this making any kind of sense. He tries to say later that he wants to explore the Sotty-Jason idea but doesn't necessarily want to vote for them. I think he's trying to be inconspicuous. He quickhammers yesterday, thinking that nobody will suspect a quickhammer from CESscum; he's too wily for such an obvious tactic. It backfires; Whiskers was the cop. Today, therefore, he attempts to appease me by saying my post attacking him "isn't bad" and slinks off to the person he targeted all day yesterday: Nacho. He makes some token posts about Sotty-Jason, then sits back and waits for everyone to get distracted by something else. Like Jason, for example.

very much my toughts on the situation. Refusing to commit really to it. Because he knows he will have to work for it and not have a position where it can be run up easy like yesterday.. IE the way the last two votes fell.

I think Sotty-Jason is plausible; I think Nachoscum is plausible. Now why are you parroting Jason's silly talking point?

again, you say this but you do little else to back anything up

- Do you really see Sotty7scum turning her back on an easy mislynch in a close game like this? Get me mislynched, mislynch Jason - it's an easy win.

remind us again how easy that hammer was for you, please?

FT, what did/do you think of my hammer?

It didn't come as any surprise. I probably would have done the same if you had voted for Whiskers before me. Why did you say Syryana's 383 wasn't bad?

off course it didn't you were the one who made it possible with your L-1 vote.

Newbies convinced of my scummitude is sadly not that uncommon a phenomenon. I care more about his lack of insight into the nightkill motivation.

what do you think the NK motivation was?

Jason, when you do finally post can you give me some links of your last 3 or 4 scum games.

Thanks.

alrighty...

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=25233 Medical Mafia -

I will have to go hunting later for the rest, I have lost my records so will have to manual hunt through the site.

[jasonT1981]

So he suspects a Sotty-Jason scumteam but votes Nacho? I don't see this making any kind of sense. He tries to say later that he wants to explore the Sotty-Jason idea but doesn't necessarily want to vote for them. I think he's trying to be inconspicuous. He quickhammers yesterday, thinking that nobody will suspect a quickhammer from CESscum; he's too wily for such an obvious tactic. It backfires; Whiskers was the cop. Today, therefore, he attempts to appease me by saying my post attacking him "isn't bad" and slinks off to the person he targeted all day yesterday: Nacho. He makes some token posts about Sotty-Jason, then sits back and waits for everyone to get distracted by something else. Like Jason, for example.

very much my toughts on the situation. Refusing to commit really to it. Because he knows he will have to work for it and not have a position where it can be run up easy like yesterday.. IE the way the last two votes fell.

I think Sotty-Jason is plausible; I think Nachoscum is plausible. Now why are you parroting Jason's silly talking point?

again, you say this but you do little else to back anything up

- Do you really see Sotty7scum turning her back on an easy mislynch in a close game like this? Get me mislynched, mislynch Jason - it's an easy win.

remind us again how easy that hammer was for you, please?

FT, what did/do you think of my hammer?

It didn't come as any surprise. I probably would have done the same if you had voted for Whiskers before me. Why did you say Syryana's 383 wasn't bad?

off course it didn't you were the one who made it possible with your L-1 vote.

Newbies convinced of my scummitude is sadly not that uncommon a phenomenon. I care more about his lack of insight into the nightkill motivation.

what do you think the NK motivation was?

Jason, when you do finally post can you give me some links of your last 3 or 4 scum games.

Thanks.

alrighty...

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=25233 Medical Mafia -

I will have to go hunting later for the rest, I have lost my records so will have to manual hunt through the site.

[jasonT1981]

Sixty and Dazzled and Charmed both seemed like obvious enough kills. I don't think speculating on the nightkill is particularly fruitful when there are no strong reasons to favour one or the other; the reason could easily be something silly or idiosynchratic.

So why did you ask in the first place? I mean if there is no point specualting?

[jasonT1981]

Moe convinced on a CES flip scum than Nacho atm.

vote:CES

On the fence about Nacho. More sure CES will flip scum

[jasonT1981]

Yea, it did, sorry.. still getting games mixed up (im in 2 with him) but still very unsettled by his L-1 vote.

[jasonT1981]

Also, I'm confused by why you felt the need to announce that you'd be willing to "push" on FT, but then you decided to tell us that you were choosing CES over Nacho. Why was this a decision between CES and Nacho for you?

Nacho is lower on my scum - read, I don't even think I have come out and said he is scum. why is that hard to understand? right now CES/FT are my two picks for scum not Nacho.

[jasonT1981]

Why did you mention Nacho then when you decided to vote for me?

gee, why would I mention the leading wagon at the time of the vote? and then give a reason as to why I was going elsewhere other than the leading wagon.

Maybe because as I said, I am more on the fence about Nacho, and am more sure about CES/FT

I don't understand what you're even getting at... can't I mention someone else when making a vote?

your making an issue out of a non-issue here.

[jasonT1981]

leading wagon that was not myself, even.

[jasonT1981]

Jason, just give me the names of your last few scum games, I can link look myself. I need to check something.

Had to hunt, not had many games as scum recently. Mostly town. Last 4 I can find as scum

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=25233 Micro 112 (most recent)
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=19193 that 70s show UPick
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=21919 - Team Mafia

I had a few others, but replaced out very early in them (like 1-2 posts) Don't even remember what they are now.

[jasonT1981]

OK, so its either FT or CES.

CES & Syryana. Why the quick jump out of the blocks for a FT vote right away? Are you trying to push through a quicklynch?

[jasonT1981]

Quick ISO on CES showed he never really expressed thoughts of FT being scu before the above vote

[jasonT1981]

vote CES

Came off with no suspicion of FT all game by the looks of things in his ISO.. a few buddy buddy comments to him here and there. Comes out quick D3 with a vote without reason. Seems like he is trying to engineer a fast lynch.

My two choices for remaining scum are FT and CES.... I have a feeling CES is more likely and is trying to play on some of the towns suspicions on FT by getting the lynch on FT.

[jasonT1981]

I'm getting drunk, so back at some point!!

[jasonT1981]

meh very drunk

unvote

sottyyyy hoew comes

[jasonT1981]

prod recieved. post soon.

[jasonT1981]

I am on the fence about Syryana 'decoy' I don't think it really makes sense. It surely would make more sense to go after your scum read instead of decoy and wait for a hammer opertunity to change.

[jasonT1981]

Jason, wanna detail your CES scum read for me?

Alright, well first off the hammer... obv
the very vague yet unable to back up his scum team read ala Jason/Sotty.
the fact he tried to make something of Sottys read change as if it was scummy
Asks others about speculation of nightkill but when asked himself about it said it wasn't important or worth discussing
Never had expressed interest in FT day 1..but shoots out of the blocks voting d2 without explination
Seems very trigger happy... the above mentioned vote and the hammer D1.. he seems to be doing everything possible to get things finished quick so there is little discussion.

[jasonT1981]

Let's lynch FT?

Why? you are yet to give NY reasons apart from 'it makes sense'

in fact this is all you have said today about it

Vote: FT

FT makes most sense as Nachobuddy. I've certainly implied as much; not much reason to outright state without a Nachoflip.

.

Same question for you as I asked FT.

So you want to lynch FT... but not much reason to without a Nacho flip?

yea, no....

Why does FT make 'sense'
Why do we lynch FT today


You seem to be going back on yourself alot.

First me/Sotty made 'sense' but no reasons
now FT makes 'sense' but no reasons.



K Thanks.

[jasonT1981]

ANY not NY

[jasonT1981]

Anyone alive?

[jasonT1981]

Jason, unvote CES at least while you spend the weekend in a drunk stupor. Pretty convinced he is town at this point.

Just out of interest, what made you change your mind on CES being scum?

[jasonT1981]

prod dodge/

[jasonT1981]

Nacho's RB flip. What do you think about that?

It honestly surprised me, I had him lower on the scum reads. If he flipped scum, I expected goon. So it was a great blow to scum to get their RB taken out.

@Dazed, am I understanding your concern correctly? You're worried that Jason is scum because of Nacho bussing him for two days and the informed posts?

Yes. It's not like Nacho pushed really hard for a Jason lynch either.

Jason, you ever play with CES before?

A few times I believe. And yes, Nacho was pushing a lot for my lynch.

[jasonT1981]

I think Zach needs to reduce the prod timer to like 12 hours or something. This is ridiculous.

Its the weekend, weekends are usually less active

[jasonT1981]

I would kind of love anyone to dump some knowledge at this point. I'm seriously hating how dead this game is.

Have you any knowledge of your own to dump?

[jasonT1981]

Unless I'm misunderstanding this setup, the mafia didn't know there were PRs of any kind until Whiskers flipped. I just don't see CES bussing his roleblocker from the get-go in that kind of situation.

I was just about to post the same

Before the flip scum only knew it was a possibility.

Day 2... would scum bus a RBer though with a confirmed cop/doc/RB/Goon setup in their opinion. I think that is what Sotty is asking

[jasonT1981]

Is that something you explicitly thought about? Whether people made sense as RB or Goon?

Eh, not overly... The setups show more chances of a goon flip than a RB flip though.

[jasonT1981]

Stating intention to vote FT. Gonna give it some more time though so we don't get a fast hammer like D1

[jasonT1981]

I don't and I have not changed my mind. but since my other read is FT... well, you do the math.

My vote would be wasted on CES, since it does not seem a viable wagon today. So switching to my other scum read is what I shall do.

[jasonT1981]

I can sure as hell try.

[jasonT1981]

Alright, since conversation is at a standstill.

vote: FourTrouble

[jasonT1981]

Jason has yet to detail why FT is his alternate scumread and put FT at L-1 with zero justification other than "I'm bored". I'm going to wait until Jason explains himself before making a decision.

read the game, I already have....

[jasonT1981]

Alright

FT

quite a few of his votes have been without reason and seems happy to lynch most people at times
his L-1 vote opening up for the Quickhammer without much reasoning
seems to be mostly agreeing with others instead of doing his own work

[jasonT1981]

Your bussing theory is interesting and has a little weight. I would like Jason to respond to that.

gonna have a think and get back to you.

[jasonT1981]

wooooooooooooo

And sorry, I totally sucked this game. I was right about FT though

I think now with this game done, I have only one other game and then I am taking a bit of a break from mafia, I am burnt out and it is showing, and effecting the game.

[jasonT1981]

I will, Sotty.. I will

my problem was EVERY ONE of my pre-in's all came at once. That killed me lol.

[jasonT1981]

If you are scum, you would push my lynch to the ends of the earth... as town you look for reason to my behaviour in game.