Newbie 1345: Mafia in a Bind (Game Over)

[Xegarus]

Yo. The other SE here. Our job is a lot more relaxed than the ICs. We are just players that have some experiance on this site to keep the game moving. Just think of us as any other player.
VOTE: VooDoo
Wagon away.

[Xegarus]

During day 1? Well generally, someone getting overly flustered or defensive.


Might as well place a random lynch for now though

VOTE: Xiao Long

So you vote for a reason before and then unvote to randomly vote.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Didi

[Xegarus]

Hm i see a vote because somebody is missing an avatar still as a random vote.
"to vote for a reason" means for me suspicion of scum

Only the first vote is every truly part of RVS. Everything else is a reaction to it in a sense.
And he did give a reason. Regardless of how legitimate it can be, it is a reason. Heck, once the reason had been dissolved he unvoted.
Also, don't think that voting is only used for trying to get a lynch.

[Xegarus]

Since activity is kinda low, i will also ask.

Why so afraid of one random vote Mutley?

Did you feel pressured by it?

[Xegarus]

Hi, everyone
This is my first game ever, so
Let us all have fun!

VOTE: KingPin96

Because avatar.
Counter Strike is the only
Worthwhile source game, bro.

;D

Confirmed scum for telling BOLDFACE LIES

Actually, it depends.
Which one does he mean?
1.6?
Source?
Go?

[Xegarus]

Confirmed scum for telling BOLDFACE LIES

<3

Actually, it depends.
Which one does he mean?
1.6?
Source?
Go?

I mean Source because
1.6 was before Source (engine)
If I recall right.

Then you are 100% wrong and confirmed scum.
Nothing can match 1.6.

[Xegarus]

Then you are 100% wrong and confirmed scum.
Nothing can match 1.6.

My original
comment was CS was
the best Source game, man.
1.6 is not
a Source game, therefore it is
not the best Source game.

huehuehue

DAMMIT I SCUM SLIPPED
YOU WILL GET FAR CHILD.

So IC, you think you could get some relevant RQS questions?
The ones i keep thinking up suck.

[Xegarus]

Hm i see a vote because somebody is missing an avatar still as a random vote.
"to vote for a reason" means for me suspicion of scum, other than that it is rv, especially Page 1. At least in my eyes it is.

For me it was more interesting that Mutley was so eager to get the vote off him.
Why so afraid of one random vote Mutley?

ahhhh man, you caught me, I'm mafia. Redhanded how did you guess.

Oh look, a snarky answer to a serious question.
Think you could actually answer the question next time?

[Xegarus]

in my experience.

And how much experience do you have?
Everybody jokes around. Especially this early on. Its not a tell in itself of any alignment.


Yes, thats what RVS & RQS means.

[Xegarus]

Duly noted though that you came to his defense.

There something wrong with me 'coming to someones defence'? I saw your reason for being suspicious as a null tell and so i pointed it out. Would you rather i keep my mouth shut when i see something i dont agree with?

[Xegarus]

Duly noted though that you came to his defense.

There something wrong with me 'coming to someones defence'? I saw your reason for being suspicious as a null tell and so i pointed it out. Would you rather i keep my mouth shut when i see something i dont agree with?

Not in particular, though of course people who know eachother's allegiance to be the same are more likely to stick up for eachother, and right now that's only the mafia.
But I'm not prohibiting you from talking, on the contrary, a silent town is a doomed town, so please, keep talking.

I am sticking a vote on you for now though because you're reacting overly defensive (in my eyes) to just a tiny bit of pressure.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Xegarus



FSnake, whose side are you on?

I would feel pressure over me 'coming to somones defence' about a null tell?
I don't quite understand where you are going with this.

Because i was so confused about that RVS stuff i read anothter more detailed guide about it.
I thought we shouldn't build random wagons until someone seems suspicious. Now i'm more inclined to build wagons to create reactions and content.
Right now it's a slow game and i think part of it is that we have 5 people with one vote and nobody has more.
Please correct me if this is a total stupid idea (looking at you IC and SEs)
In that sense
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Xiao Long

I feel the stupid part is you telling people about it. When you are pressuring somone, its only effective when they don't realise it. When you just out it, it looses its strength.

There's nothing wrong with joking around in a game of mafia! But you've been asked a couple of questions and have been making funny comments in lieu of answering them, which isn't very helpful. To reiterate: a) were you threatened by Didi's vote on you, and b) what did you mean by the comment about him "being easily swayed"?

This so much.

Worry not! I feel a storm brewing between Fsnake, Xega, and Xaio. Not sure what's going on, but it should cook something up to get us out of RVS/RQS

Huh?
Whats that supposed to mean?

Maybe you didn't see it because it was at the bottom of my post, but I'll ask it again:

FSnake, whose side are you on?

Or maybe he doesn't understand what you mean. Cause i don't.
What do you mean 'whose side'?

[Xegarus]

However, his reaction seemed to me like overly defensive for the situation.

You for some odd reason mentioned that you were noting something. This is not town behaviour. You don't show your hand this early. You were just trying to bait the newbs to sheep you. Its far better for someone to keep this kinda thing to themselves and then to use it as evidence when needed. That is how I would expect someone with experiance to play.
Also, I'm not being 'overly defensive'. This is how I play. Meta me. If I see something that I dislike, regardless of who it is directed towards, I will speak up to it.

[Xegarus]

Forgot to mention
V/LA for 2 days. Will post if I get the oppurtunity.

[Xegarus]

I think I made it quite clear already that the noting was just a comment to apply pressure.

No, thats just what you said. What you say and what it actually means are two very separate things.
I saw no town motivation to randomly apple pressure to anyone. But seeing as how i had already voted you, there may be some scum motivation to make the voter look bad.

However, at the moment we know nothing yet so isn't it all townies' job exactly to pry and pressure and try and get as much reactions and thus information as possible?

Not quite. You see, if you solely apply pressure to everything, all you are doing is putting people on the spot and thats where they may say anything. Put a gun to my head and i will sing. If you don't take it off, i will even start cursing the very things that are precious to me. Towns job is to find contradictions. With or without pressure. Pressure can lead to information, but pressure does not guarantee information.

I don't totally buy your meta me comment yet, since I just get an odd feeling when talking to you, all your posts seem to hide something /instinct.

Remaining ignorant to something is your problem. To make it easier for you, i have only ever been scum once so you can tell the huge contrast between my meta for town and scum.

So for now, my vote stays on you. But relax, if you're truly innocent I'm sure I'll come around and even if not, it's just 1 vote.

One vote is all it needs for scum to jump aboard and try to sheep others. But only if the reason is sound.

and maybe try and pressure some other people.

Don't say this. Pressure looses all its meaing when the receiver knows its pressure.

I'm town. But wouldn't scumMe say the same thing?

Scum you would also say that, and guess what, so would town you.

but i read a few weeks ago a game where xer was participating and i remembered him to say what he thinks, maybe this influences me there.

Mind if i ask which game this was?

Then how about actually explaining what was scummy in my posts AT THE TIME YOU VOTED. The only thing you explained that was scummy (at the time you voted) was that I was excited and then bullshit'd it by saying someone entirely different, in an entirely different game was also excited and ended up being scum.

Asking the person that finds you scummy, why they think you are scummy, is not that great an idea. It can make it look as if you are only trying to argue against the points made and not the actual motivation around them. Also, since they think you are scum, why would they answer you?

I started to answer these pointless questions but decided I wouldnt waste my breath with pointless questions that have been answered. What was the point in you asking me?

Oh they've been answered?
Let me just iso you and check.
*17 hours later*
Nope, you haven't answered them.
And those questions are not pointless in themselves. The fact that you are not answering them kinda makes it all the more important that they were asked.
Any reason you find them to be pointless?

VOTE: Mutley


Sorry for the long post, this is what happens when i have to play 'catch up'. And this was a short catch up too......

[Xegarus]

Asking the person that finds you scummy, why they think you are scummy, is not that great an idea. It can make it look as if you are only trying to argue against the points made and not the actual motivation around them. Also, since they think you are scum, why would they answer you?

I disagree. I think it's a good idea. If someone doesn't tell you why they vote for you/think you're scummy, then you can't really defend yourself. Seeing as the whole point of this game is trying to sway people to vote for who you think is scum, then you need to have solid reasons for voting for said person and you need to voice them - both so others can agree with you, and so the people you're accusing can defend themselves.

I don't see why they wouldn't answer me, unless they just want the game to be really inactive.

When you start to defend your self, you are not scum hunting. If they give you reasons as to why they have voted you as such, ten by all means tear them a new one. But if they haven't, fuck them. Scum's only goal is to stay alive. So they try to appeal to everone more. Town though, towns only goal is to lynch scum. A town getting lynched is not a bad thing. It tells us its alignment, those that pushed the lynch etc. This means that town is less afraid to be lynched than scum. And thus means that trying to defend your self against points rather than scum hunting can look really scummy.

And aboutthe ignoreing thing, its a play style. I have seen it enough to say that it isn't alignment based. Heck, its usually one of the rare cases where its "that is so anti town, scum wouldnt do it". But thats only usually. Dont take it as a reason not to attack someone for it. Just dont get too angry.

How are those questions not pointless? I obviously wasn't threatened as shown by my 'dry' answers answer that. Just because you want a straight up answer isn't my fault also shown by just common sense why would I be threatened by a first vote? Secondly I called him easily swayed because he did as I said even if it was because he said he would. Hence pointless they could have been answered by anyone or by using your own common sense.

It was not your question. How pointless something is, is subjective. You are not the oneto decide how important it actually is. The question was directed towards you. It's your choice whether or not you answer but it can give people a personal opinion about you, and thats when shit gets bad.

[Xegarus]

Lol shit gets bad if someone has an opinion? Wow. Damn. Plus I am the one to decide for the sole reason because I said so. Pointless questions are pointless.

An opinion on someones play and one on the person are very different. Don't take what i said out of context. No, you saying something is pointless is, well pointless. You are the last person anyone will trust on how valid a question aimed towards you is if you dont give a reason. And yes pointless questions are pointless, but that is not the issue here. The issue was that a question was asked and you brushed it off as a "pointless question".
What i'm trying to say is, try not to be a dick.

[Xegarus]

Wait, is this addressed at me?

Yes.
Let me clear any confusion there may be.
For you its people "ignoring" you when you asked them reasnos for being scummy.

For Mutley, its about just not answering questions in general.

One has a rather narrow area in which it applies, the other does not.

I'll post my reads when i feel the need to. Id rather not call someone town or scum at this point cause then their actions will be changed around those. It's also too early for me to form any solid reads.
Is that acceptable?

[Xegarus]

If you ask me, i dont think MP5 even believes his own reasoning. I think he is just trying to get something to happen so that the game can really pick up. Thats just how i see it.

[Xegarus]

Also: worth pointing out that Mutley is at L-1 and that no one should vote for him until someone expresses intent to hammer. Regardless of Mutley's alignment, ending D1 less than a week into the game isn't going to give the town the info we need going into the next day.

Fuck that shit.
Time to hammer this scum out.

VOTE: Mutley
Bye now, you're dead scum.

[Xegarus]

I'm sure ill be killed tonight.

Why do you think that?
No offence but you aren't exactly a strong town.

[Xegarus]

You seem very eager for it so I'd happily say you were mafia now.

Fail to see this.
I haven't pushed your lynch at all.

[Xegarus]

You didnt stary but you sure as hell thought you ended it. With your lets end this shit or whatever it was.

lol what?
You don't understand do you?
Since you don't, i think i will leave you in the dark for a bit.

[Xegarus]

You thought you had ended it, you didn't realise your vote was already on me. You thought you had taken a power role out first day mr mafia.

Xeg: You actually did push his lynch because you thought you were hammering him.

I guess you don't understand either. I was wondering why you ruined my plan by telling people that my 'hammer' didnt count.

It was an INTENTIONAL fake hammer.
A reaction test. Do you honestly think i would not notice? And could you not tell the total change in personality?
And i must say, i don't like Mutley's reaction to it at all. His confidence that he has contributed by making a vague point and then the arrogance to go and say that he will likely be NK'd.
Mut, i do think you are scum.
I want a claim from you.

[Xegarus]

Surely someone who came donw so happily with the hammer (even though it wasn't the hammer) is seen as more scummy? So you can say I haven't helped the town, but in a way I have because I've drawn people out who thought they were getting a nice easy day 1 lynch but fucked it up and is now saying that they weren't pushing for me (having to defend their actions a bit now?)

Didnt fuck up, infact it worked really well.
I haven't pushed your lynch prior to reaction test.

why do you want a claim from me?

Cause i think you are scum.
Cause you are on L-1.

[Xegarus]

Why would I claim something though? I would only be helping the mafia by possibly getting town roles out in the open on day 1, how would that help?

Cause i see no reason to keep you alive.
If you don't claim and you are lynched, you may flip town. This means we waste one lynch. If you claim and we believe you, we can lynch somone else and we may lynch scum.

[Xegarus]

We can say you didn't fuck up if thats what you are into.

Oh newbies. So much fun.
Listen, there are many ways to play but there are some things that wont ever make sense. You find these out through the motivation behind them. Now then, what motivation would i have had by hammering you in such a bold fashion? Heck it would go against my own philosophy (see sig). Find my motivation before. Dont just brush what i say off the side with out backing it up.

But I'm not going to claim a role if I am not one, that's just stupid.

I want you to claim what you are.
Are you a VT, cop, doc, JK or a scum?

[Xegarus]

Even if not I've implied it a lot.

No, you haven't.
If anythng you implied you were a power role.

[Xegarus]

You thought you had ended it, you didn't realise your vote was already on me. You thought you had taken a power role out first day mr mafia.

You brought up the PR part yourself. No one said anything about lynching a PR. And even if my fake hammer was real, i made no comment as to whethr or not you were a PR.
The fact that you even brough it up looks like a PR slip of somekind.
I think you may be scum role blocker.

[Xegarus]

So you ignore my last post after you said that I hadn't implied VT. Even though I had porved that I had implied it? My point about the PR was more that I put a fake something out there hoping it would be picked up on. Therefore if I survived a day 1 lynch the mafia would have to kill me if they saw it. That way they would only get a VT kill and not a PR.

I'm not ignoreing it. It was a post made after the slip so obviously you would try to deflect it.
Heres how i see it. You mentioned something.
Were called out for it and so you denied it. I believe you scum slipped when you even brought up the PR talk.
I think you denied it cause you realised that you shouldn't have. I believe you have the words POWER ROLE ingraved into your head that you might have mispoke.
If you did claim a PR, i would have believed it easily since it sounded plausible. But now that you claimed VT, i think you are a scum pr.

[Xegarus]

Surely I had already claimed by saying I am not a power role (whether or not you think I am covering up) as by saying I am not a power role leaves only VT.

No. Mafia isn't VT or a standard PR. Therefore it doesnt only leave to VT.

And yeh we'll see. But why are you 'accepting' your lynch already?
Why not move onto something else. If you change the subject, i wont mind. If you are town, by all means look for scum.

[Xegarus]

well I call any mafia a power role.

Cool. I dont.

Ive said why I am accepting it. I don't care for being the first one lynched because you guys can hopefully get some info from the last few hours exchange. plus someone has to go its only a game.

UNVOTE:
I like you.

I am looking for scum by carrying on these exchanges and seeing people reactions.

These exchanges are against you and everyone else as a collective mind.
Not too good for checking reactions.

Theres not exactly a whole lot of other ways to look on day 1 is there?

What makes you think day 2 will be any better?
Discussion from day 1 carries over to day 2.
An inactive day 1 leads to a really shitty day 2.

[Xegarus]

Reads, Mut is confirmed town in my book. I love his responses. So arrogant and stubborn. Scum is NEVER like this. Not in my experience. Scum is fickle and trying to look good. ALWAYS. Mut isn't scum. He's not afraid to say no. This makes him look so shit to everyone but soo town to me.

[Xegarus]

Doesnt town not want to look good too? So a myslynch is less likely to happen?

Also its been said before, people act in different ways. Town-mutley could just have been bored and clueless and felt like fannying around, scum-mutley could have maybe felt clueless too, or maybe just didnt like being scum so he has less motivation and just gives up from the start.

In my opinion, it all comes down to opinions and not facts in terms of peoples play.

Let me link you to CF, he said it best.

" Later eventually comes, so it didn't bother me that he didn't answer right away. That was a towntell, imo. It shows he isn't afraid to tell people "no." Scum are appeasing because they want to be on everyone's good side

[Xegarus]

Reads, Mut is confirmed town in my book. I love his responses. So arrogant and stubborn. Scum is NEVER like this. Not in my experience. Scum is fickle and trying to look good. ALWAYS. Mut isn't scum. He's not afraid to say no. This makes him look so shit to everyone but soo town to me.

So why'd you vote for Mutley in the first place? It's not like there's been a radical change in his behavior.

To pressure him.

i played with two really stubborn and arrogant people that were scum

Think you can link me to this game?

My gut atm says Kingpin and Slimer are the mafia team.

I dont like kingpin too much but not too sure about slimer.

@Slimer
Played as an IC before?
Ifso, care to link me to some games.

hello everybody. i realised today that i’m just not suited for this kind of game. i like strategy and intelectual games but i have a hard time to be aggresive or to be investigative because i feel always like insulting someone. i appreciate that i had the possibility to try mafiascum in the newbie section and don’t want to angry someone by quiting midgame. but i think my playing along after i lost the motivation i had last week would be worse to the other new players that really like to play the game. everything said, i enjoy reading games and see games develop from an outsider view. i will follow this game to the end and others in the future. you won’t see me, but i will be watching =)
perhaps some day i will decide to try it again but not in the foreseeable future. again thank you everyone and sorry.

greetz FSNake

asking for replacement

Thats a shame. It would be better to replace out now than later but its a shame you don't feel this game is for you just yet.
I hope you reconsider and try again someday.
Do you have any last reads you can give be fore you go?
Good luck out there (outside this site). Itrs dangerous to go alone,take this *hugs*.

[Xegarus]

I agree with Xeg, a mafia probably wouldn't be so brazen, this feels like town responses.

UNVOTE:

Or perhaps he would be because he knows no one would ever vote for him if he acted like that.

Thats a pretty ballsy move if thats his plan.

[Xegarus]

scummy behavior as just being his playstyle

Mind telling me exactly what scummy behaviour is?

@Mod, do you think you can contact slimer to see when his V/LA will end?

[Xegarus]

Sorry mod. I'm a little busy atm. V/LA till Tuesday.

Fixed tags. (Equinox)

[Xegarus]

VOTE: Sorry mod. I'm a little busy atm. V/LA till Tuesday.

.......I was supposed to bold that, now vote.
Mod, could you fix that?

[Xegarus]

Hey look. The game ended. About time.
Good Job Mac. I had a solid town read on you from the start.
Poor slimer. You did well as IC.