Gears of War Mafia - ( Game Over! )

[Piratecat]

I see mollie around, but shes lurking in this thread! Clearly she and mala rolled scum. Which is ok, I expect them to implode if they did ^ ^.

Yes you got us we rolled scum. ;o!

vote: col guile

Guille - how did let UN talk into allowing your name to be spelt wrong? You iz total weakling

Yes, ANG, AP is

really

scary when he's on a roll. Stay clear because you may get bird dropping on you.

[Piratecat]

No.. It's Mala.

[Piratecat]

Hmm. Not really seeing that Bork. Seems like something that could be done by any alignment in my opinion.

[Piratecat]

Okay, that's cool. Usually guts tend to know more than actual logic. I can't argue with that.

[Piratecat]

Uh at Mastin's claim. I want to believe it. >.>

Chances are you aren't lying.

@Neo/Angel - the game started. What was the purpose of your self vote?
You say wake me up when the trolling stops, but what are you doing to stop the trolling? Nothing.

[Piratecat]

@Jiffy, but it's not the weekend. >.>

Ugh, can't tell if this is AA or Nero at this moment. The whole 'rage' aspect makes me think it's AA, but doesn't sound like her type of written posts so it's probably Nero. I haven't played with Nero so I don't really know how he plays.

On the topic of meta - Meta is good to use for beginning reads, but later as the game progresses it shouldn't be used. As meta can easily be used to fool a player.

[Piratecat]

hi guys!

mollie here

ahahahaha

pidgeywidgey thinking mala was me earlier. I am probably going to be a terrible influence on mala.

also pidgeywidgey, it looks like you are going after low hanging fruit in ang what's up with that. also looks like you are cosying up to fitz. AND we were really on the same page in the posh game and I am so not there with you in this one. like, I am wondering who is this person. e are out of sync <--- not good,

agree with borky, majiffy looks off. I have what I think might be a loose relative scumtell for majiffy but it stems from tr. not sure of how reliable it is here but he is definitely pinging my scumdar.

also borky, I had an early town read on you in the posh game but I lost it on d2 or d3 but kept forgetting about you cos of uber goober's spam posting and cos I really wanted him lynched but no one would help me and then I got paranoid about majiffy.

re: people banging on about meta. I can read some players that I am really really familiar with in like 2 posts, sometimes even 1. I no longer give my reasons for meta or do meta analysis cos players will update their meta off of it. but yeah it possible to read a player early but it takes skillful use of meta and pattern matching certainly isn't all of it.

thinking mastin's claim is legit, outing anti-town roles first thing is protown but he will probably have to be removed from the game at some point, good vig kill choice but not until n3.

teh kernal is being kind of quiet except for giving a town read on pidgeywidgey which is....weird.

also uber goober is my new best friend. he never tells me anything about himself so I don't have to pretend to be interested in the boring details of his life and mostly just blather on about my own. works out great. \o/

so to the cgkernal hydra...why so quiet? and why do you have pidgeywidgey as town? I don't. he is unsure for me.

[Piratecat]

erm... Why is AP scum, for whoever has a scum read on him. he reads town to me

ANG is iffy, I can see AP's point on him though

um, I don't agree with a Jiffy lynch

KoC contributed as much as I have in terms of content and scum hunting and I only have to post so...

marangala I was going to beat up on mr knighty guy for being mean to you but honestly this post sounds odd. I will still beat up on him anyway but no really this post was odd.

[Piratecat]

oh hai cryo is playing where did they go

eta: crap between majiffy/angelnero smells a bit like scum theatre
eta2: marangala I will not defend against you for being scum cos I am sus of you but I will make sure no one is unnecessarily mean to you cos I feel somewhat responsible for inviting you to this game. game needed more estrogen, I was thoroughly marinating in testosterone in the posh game. and you thought the same thing of nacho in inheritance.

[Piratecat]

VOTE: goat

[Piratecat]

Pedit:why is Jiffy scum?

he is sus for me for similar reasons that borky is sus of him. I don't think he is a good d1 lynch cos regardless of what nero says he

can

deliver when he is town.

[Piratecat]

@Goat: why do an RVS vote when clearly we are out of RVS stage?

Jal - His Miller claim is likely truth. I'll be able to explain soon enough. I hope.

[Piratecat]

Why not the Goat? Complains about content, uses a RVS to cast a random vote and has no comments on anything. That to me is scummy even though I wasn't the head that cast the vote. I would totally have though if I caught it in time.

[Piratecat]

No offense to how this next comment will appear.

I'm not sure I'm feeling a KoC scum. One of my first games he was an annoying assbag due to language. He was also aggressive and this game he feels different.

[Piratecat]

@Mollie: Are you ... sober? Yes, Im def going for low hanging fruit because that totally my MO as scum .

Also I love the "I believe mastin... but he needs to be vig'd anyways" sentiment. Totally protown. In fact 209 as a whole is awfully waffly. ANG/KoC/Molliekittens/Messiah looking scummy so far.

you are such scum aren't you

town waffles while scum fencesit or "hedge"

mastin knows what is up. he will be more accountable for his reads then most if he is a miller. so he will have to work twice as hard in order to dance 3 times as fast. vig killing a miller is always protwon in order to remove end of game wifom unless mastin produces a solid protown game. don't even pretend that this is not true.

[Piratecat]

and this is why putting Mollie and Majiffy in a game together is a bad idea, they'll defend each other regardless of alignment. See Mollie voting for Goat despite Ma Jiffy doing the same thing. And despite calling Majiffy scummy she still finds a way to not vote him. + I don't remember Bork expressing suspicion of him so...what the hell?


Jals believe that fast wagons=//=town lynch is somewhat wrong. MOST fast wagons are town lynchs.

I don't think either of us are defending majiffy.

I think he looks scummy

but sweet attempt at trying to discredit my (mollie's) read. /:

eta: pidgeywidgey am I?

[Piratecat]

Ok, lets say someone dies N1 and flips 'Town Cop'. Is vigging Mastin still the right move before end game? His negative utility means absolutely nothing at that point. Hes effectively a VT claim, but you still think he should be PL'd regardless before lylo?

Actually, no. Lets stop. I don't argue mafia theory as town. Its never worth it and it doesn't mean anything.

But you are probably scum for trying to hedge me into your suspects list with awkward sideways suspicions for reasons. What about Nero/Majiffy looks scum/scum and why are you not voting one of them then?

I am not "hedging you" I am directly fosing you.

[Piratecat]

then that should probably tell you something

[Piratecat]

You know - Fitz's vote was a joke imo. I ignored it because I didn't think it meant anything. You are only 'liking' it because he's voting someone who you have a scum read on and you are casually tryin to test the water to buddy him.

Truth is - Mala side of the hydra has a really weak town read on AP.

^ yes this is Mala speaking.

[Piratecat]

'Cause I make her bubbly. Kbai. Brb ill get her to answer your question in a 'jiffy, Majiffy

[Piratecat]

I have made my own thought. No, I didn't like the vote, but I have a bunch of really weak town reads running about an trying to organize it and talk to Mollie especially if we have a conflicting read on a player.

[Piratecat]

Moar fail. I mean; I didn't like his vote. Posts 221,223&229 were all by me.

[Piratecat]

it's true, I am loving this hydra

jal, what about mine and pidgeywidgey's exchanges gives you a headache?

[Piratecat]

it's true, I am loving this hydra

jal, what about mine and pidgeywidgey's exchanges gives you a headache?

this was answering majiffy

[Piratecat]

Oh, I already have a headache. It's just making it worse. Very cat like. Miaw~

Okay, you don't like the vote. What now?

*consults with other hydra head*

[Piratecat]

jal we agree you are town

[Piratecat]

Okay.

Hi again.

@Piratecat: I almost always drop a random vote on D1 (RVS = Random Vote Strategy?), because there's not usually a whole lot to analyze. I also mess around with people, just to see how they react.

Regarding the saber rattling in the first few pages, Mac looks the dirtiest to me. Post #47 seemed contrived. If ANG is scum, Mac almost certainly is as well.

Recently, the KoC/Angelous Nero/Majiffy kerfluffle struck me as interesting. Starting here:

Didn't majiffy do this exact same bullshit in overly posh mafia? And flip town? Just saying, I don't get why people are up in arms about lynching him, unless its pure policy..in which case, wagon-ho!

I would it is totally PL, Majiffy is not helpful, arragont and totally suck at scum hunting. Each wagon he pushes they all end up being town.
He is horrible at this game. I don't know why he even play

What I found most amusing is that a couple posts later, NERO called MAJIFFY a dick. This has nothing to do with whether either is scummy. It just made me laugh.

Now...I may be swayed by Majiffy's line of thought being similar to my own (read as: Not much happening D1), but it looks like KoC was trying to build a case against him out of thin air with post 201, to the point where I'm going to do this to see what happens:

Vote: KoC

who are you replacing again

and why are you dropping the classic scumtell that dates back to like what the 50s or something

loving how you are ignoring marangala

as in

it makes you look like scum

she is looking scummy to the core. I bet you are like me and are shy about bussing newb scum teammates

[Piratecat]

there was a list passed around a few years ago of 20something scumtells. most of them are outdated. like the food tell. voting from random.org was another one. goat boy knows perfectly well that his rvs vote is misplaced cos...we are out of rvs. have been for a while.

I get town wanting to stir things up

but the timing is wrong. the game is moving at a fast paced so....why the rvs vote? it is an entrance into a game when you are a sub when you are for whatever reason feeling unconfident. whether it is cos he doesn't know a lot of people or cos he is not confident in his team is what I would like to determine.

[Piratecat]

when someone does a fluff post about what they ate. it can't be used anymore cos town drops it all of the time (borealis on tr and rach marie on this site). occasionally it still works as far as picking out scum.

I don't know if that is what goat boy is doing or not so can you plz stop interfering!

eta: goat boy, what makes you think I don't like your playstyle? I actually quite like it. especially if you turn out to be scum.

don't turn this into a personal issue when what I am clearly quite saying is that you dropped a legit scumtell that dates way back.

eta2: xposts

[Piratecat]

Jal - I personally don't see what's so scummy about it.

[Piratecat]

but it does not mean I don't like your playstyle it means I don't like your vote

there IS a difference

[Piratecat]

That was Mala talking about Mollie's post. Again, what's scummy about it? I frankly don't see anything that shouts 'scummy' to me.

[Piratecat]

Well, not sure about Mollie, but I wanted to wait until we decided on a target we both felt was scum rather than casting out a vote that one of us might not have agreed with. She was talking to me right before my class started and a bit during it.

So unless it was a huge gut trigger - I would not have voted without talking to Mollie first. Judging by our skype conversation we had going on we both were in sync with our thoughts on Goat.

[Piratecat]

but it does not mean I don't like your playstyle it means I don't like your vote

there IS a difference

Okay. I tend to draw a correlation between the two.

why

eta: sorry mala, I should have spoken with you first

[Piratecat]

Hmm interesting. That comment right there might be the only thing that makes me lean slightly town on you Goats. Scum normally care what they look like to avoid early suspicion and town can normally careless what they look like and use a number of certain ways to show it.

[Piratecat]

Trust me I'm very well aware of JMT. I have used it multiple of times on another site and once accused Mollie if it in another open setup. All though it wasn't used in that way, but a Slighty different way.

[Piratecat]

No, we never made a decision together, but after the vote happened I had the same feel that Goat was likely scum due to his odd placed RVS vote with no content.

[Piratecat]

Jedi Mind Trick.

[Piratecat]

No, we were talking before my class started which was only a 15 min time period.My class was at 5:30 til 7 and I ran to get food and Goats posted during the time span I was driving. We barely had contact during the hour and a half of class or even during the break.

Our first read difference happens to be AP. she has a scum read on him, but I have a weak town read.
Without communication our first similar read was a scum read on Goats. As stated before, but I'm seeing him more as town as his interactions with players progresses.
Our second similar read happens to be you Jal. Basically you came in being aggressive and haven't backed down. That along with a huge gut feel I am pinning you as likely town.

[Piratecat]

mastin I am feeling left out here

[Piratecat]

Mollie getting worked up about a random vote outside of RVS is very likely to be town motivated

Uhhhhh

Ok, Im about 2 pages behind. Be back in a bit. I don't like Malak defending Mollie's scumwall.

pidgeywidgey I swear it is like you are pretending you have never played with me before what is up with that

that was not a scumwall

I am waiting to consult with mala before I give a list of our reads.

[Piratecat]

mastin I am feeling left out here

Sorry, Mollie/MalaK. You two might be decent or even good scumhunters, but I really haven't seen enough of your town-play to make that call. What little I've observed of your town-plays puts you both in that range to be approximately at my level, mediocre-good. The people I listed are the people in this game who I consider to be better scumhunters than me.

I do know that the Mollie half of ya has experience reading Majiffy, so that'd be appreciated, and you're free to join in and do what I asked of those people despite yourselves not being among 'em, but simply put,

I currently don't really feel like you're as important to coordinate with

.

we are not important y'all

[Piratecat]

I think you're important, Mollie!

Despite her bonding with Majiffy, I personally think Mollie is a very good town player.

I think you have super good instincts arc.

[Piratecat]

I have not played on this site in years. I popped on a month ago, and received a prod from 2008. And I'm (obviously) not too concerned about the common perception of when the random stage should stop. It's D1. I enjoy random voting and having fun. Tis what I'm gonna do.

I seem to remember you playing a game or two after 2008. Significantly after.

Do these ring any bells?

The question is, why would you lie about getting a prod from 2008?

I don't want this post to get buried

[Piratecat]

@ nero

I have led a mislynch on majiffy before on d1

changed my mind at the last minute when I saw town flail but he was lynched anyways (KISS micro game)

I have led a lynch on him when he was scum.

I want him in the game cos he is a good player. if he delivers.

you making a "thing" of this feels false but I lean town on you but I will have to consult with mala so that we can consolidate our reads.

my votes are never sticky. and I vote for players for different reasons and not always cos I think they are scum. sometimes it is to see how they react. sometimes it is to see how others react. sometimes it is just to stir shit up in a dying game. the reasons vary and depend upon circumstance

deal with it

eta: jesus fucking christ xposts. catching up

[Piratecat]

She's scum

[Piratecat]

Mollie is a glorified VI, we should like ignore her

. I would also like AP's response to my post telling him that I don't think Mac is taking a "hard stance".

oh hai nero is this some of the discrediting that I supposedly do not know about?

[Piratecat]

I want him in the game cos he is a good player. if he delivers.

Ohgodperformanceanxiety.

lol

[Piratecat]

so we agree that jal and qwints are town

waiting to hear about mastin. I have him as town but I want mala's input on this.

[Piratecat]

No Jal. Mastin's likely town.

[Piratecat]

Also AAhydra - I don't see how Mollie is a VI. She's not because she's a strong player.

Ugh back to work for Mala. More when I'm home later

[Piratecat]

who are your circle of 3 I forget

[Piratecat]

AP - How in the world does PV look town for that post? I don't even remotely see that. In fact I don't see how that post is an indication of either alignment.

[Piratecat]

who are your circle of 3 I forget

Did you only read half of my post?

In short, my

#2 suspect (Mac)

finds my

#3 suspect (Madrigal)

to be suspicious for the identical reason I voted for my

#1 suspect (KoC)

.

who is madrigal

also how long are you planning on staying away from cryo

[Piratecat]

AP - mind linking to me the games you read PV in correctly?

[Piratecat]

Mollie makes people crazy, but I try and keep them sane.

[Piratecat]

2) I will stay away from Cryo until I am of the opinion that he is not town. Then I will vote for him.

How are you planning on making this determination?

[Piratecat]

Okay. Why don't you interact with him to force a slip or a scummy comment instead of hanging back allowing the time to come?

[Piratecat]

PirateHydra...whichever head I'm speaking to at the moment:

You had a bad read on me. It's okay to think that. However...I'm going to apologize in advance for excessive sarcasm if you continue to chase minutia.

are you being serious you can't tell mala and I apart

she capitalises and punctuates and stuff

also she is the sane one

no one can accuse me of being these things ever

[Piratecat]

Also for what it's worth, it looks to me PirateCat is shaking the trees to see what comes falling out. Is that the typical MO for her as town?

for me?

yes

mala is the brainier of the 2 of us

[Piratecat]

MollieK, I really want to talk. I'm one of the few people not town-reading you this game and I can't tell if its because I'm paranoid (definitely possible) or we really aren't working towards the same win con. So what is your read on me right now? I'd appreciate a stream of thoughts from one of yo about why your opinion of me is what it is. Why is mastin such a liability that he should be vig'd? Mastin is more valuable than you think. I really don't get why you would think he is town but insist that he must go for his claim.

Why was Ms Marangal scummy circa post 270?

If you had to give me your combined top 5 townreads and top 2 scumreads, who would they be?

Okay we can talk. Probably because you are being paranoid or it's because having two players who share an account is really hard to read. Trust me - why I hate hydra's due to never being able to correctly read them. If you are town, which I have a weak town read on you, then we are going towards the same win con. Mala-head has a town read on you. Why? One. Gut Two. You are being aggressive and trying to make people come to an agreement. You keep allowing everyone to know what you are thinking and not holding back. Now when I told Mollie I thought you were town based on aggressiveness she told me scum could also be aggressive, but I told her I don't think he's scum being aggressive. Now - I'm not the one who made the post regarding Mastin and being vig'd. I rather not have him vigged or even lynched at this point because I believe he's town. When someone is town I don't want them killed and I will defend them if the read I have on them is strong enough. I don't believe Mastin is gambiting nor do I think he's lying. He is valuable - I agree. I'm currently trying to talk to Mollie regarding Mastin and we have been coming to a conclusion he's town. I have also gotten her to warm up to the idea that AP you are town also.

The whole Ms Marangal thing will be something Mollie has to explain.

I need to talk to Mollie about the combined top town reads, but so far:

Jal, Mastin, Qwints & Goats.
I have a town read on AP, but Mollie does not.
Mollie has a slight town read on PV, but I do not. Although I think I'm confusing him with another player and have to go reread the Marketplace Game.
I also have a slight town read on KoC, but that's due to him being different from the first game we played together.


Cyro is a scum read.


~

Bitmap is a bit quiet for my liking and I need to discuss that with Mollie.
I have to also talk to her about Jiffy and Col Guile.

~

Unvote:

~

Oh for Goatz wif luv <3

[Piratecat]

Cool stuff. We are going to possibly become part of the town block?

-___-

Bitmap normally would have gotten into the game though. So him not posting before going V/LA is alarming to me.

Yeah, Fitz, is someone that I'm bad at reading. Though his activity is low, but question is the activity low for all his games?

[Piratecat]

and then never sign up for a game again?

I like cryo

a lot

[Piratecat]

AP so you are back on the Piratecat hydra is scum again crusade only because other people are starting to see it. Doesn't give a good feel about you. I still think you are town, but this seriously might put a hurt on that read. Sounds a lot like opportunism to me, to be frank.

[Piratecat]

Also I don't like Slandaar's nitpicking of my words to try and turn it into me being scum due to that. Scum will twist a meaning on purpose when it's not intended to be that purpose just to get eyes on that player and possibly a lynch drawn onto them.

[Piratecat]

I would like to talk it over with Mollie before I vote. Considering it would be 'bad' for me to vote someone that I still think is weak town regardless of what is coming out of his mouth.

[Piratecat]

Can you stop calling us Mollie when it's a hydra? The last posts haven't even been by Mollie. We're not scum.

Slandaar - it did put a hurt on the read, but I'm still clinging onto AP's town because I just have a gut-feel he's town rather then scum. Then we have my strong town read on Mastin and I am actually believing in what he's saying. So let's hope that doesn't come to bite me.

[Piratecat]

Gotta love how we're not included at all in the list, Mastin.

[Piratecat]

okay.

mollie here

@slaandar
do you remember how in the titanium game you thought I made a "slip" and then you trolleytacked on me like a mofo until I was lynched on d1? nearly ragequit the site after that, I have never seen such town stupidity from a lot of players but then my newbie game started and I met majiffy and maestro. do you also remember how I was right about hiraki and the NJAC slot? maybe you should go think about that. you are simply not as good as you think you are and you push horrible cases but I am chalking that up to the hubristic driven arrogance of youth which you need to get in check tbh.

@marangala

oh yeah I noticed that mastin is wanting to work with anyone without a vagina, lol. I find it pretty funny. I think we should spam the thread by snorting chocolate and talk about tampons.

@ everyone

cryo looks off and they are still not feeling right but I am wondering if it is exactly as they said it was and their head is simply not in the game. the post they made about going 1 on 1 with messiah and lynching messiah the next day points to a town POV though. it is hard to see scum doing that but I dunno.

uber invited me to this game and I invited guille. so I find it weird that the hydra is avoiding mala and I like the fucking plague. they are not doing shit and you guys better not let them skate if they are scum to a win or I will hunt you all down and dropkick you in the kneecap.

I have nero/arc as town cos of arc. nero is an annoying twit who sucks up to anything he thinks is bigger than him and belittles anything he perceives as lesser than him. so far I am very unimpressed and I think he can sometimes be a bottom feeder so I wonder where all this sense of entitlement comes from probably desperate insecurity but that is a personality thing and I am sure he has his *stellar* mafia moments.

marangala is off. I am giving her some time cos I know she is newish to the site and I invited her to this game. in the inheritance game she seemed lost with mine, nacho's and robo's dynamics. we were all doing this crazy ass dance and I know it looks weird when you are not sure what is going on. she made a pretty convincing case against guille and hey, flawless town victory and all. I think she is a strong player but the dynamics might be throwing her off. other than that I am not sure if I buy her claim, the timing was weird and the circumstances did not justify it IMO. so I have her as unsure. it also smelled a bit like scum theatre between her and goat boy.

not sure about goat boy. he is the kind of player that attracts me like a moth to a flame, I just want to get all up in his grill, which means he is probably town.

leaning town now on AP cos his aTe looks like he is sputtering. AP, plz don't replace out. but you are posting waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay different than in the posh game which you keep referencing to. there is a big time difference and I am not understanding it.

leaning defo town on majiffy.

liking jal.

liking mastin.

not all of scum can be in the people whom you cannot even remember, there has to be at least one noisy one in the bunch unless they are going to sit back and let town eat its own and then gain control once they remove some key players.

[Piratecat]

Its so cute when you try to stand up for yourself, Mollie. If anyone is being an ass this game its you. I mean you just took shots at me and Sladaar for no reason.

erm...weren't you calling me a glorified VI like 5 minutes ago? didn't you then change it to there is no way I am strong player that I was a weak one? and this is based off of what...1 completed game? in which you were the d1 lynch and I tried to help you but there is no arguing with majiffy when he decides to get stubborn and a whole of people were screaming for your blood? I bet you didn't even keep up with the game once you were out of it.

so no yours was certainly not undeserved I was pointing out where some of what you say wrt might possibly be coming. looks like I struck a nerve.

Anways, I don't see how you get "they[cryo] are coming from a town POV" I think what they proposed is pretty stupid and I think I could see that coming from either alignment.

okay, walk me through the scum motivation with what cryo proposed.

[Piratecat]

oh yeah I noticed that mastin is wanting to work with anyone without a vagina, lol. I find it pretty funny. I think we should spam the thread by snorting chocolate and talk about tampons.

(((mollie)))

[Piratecat]

I am sorry you felt this way; I felt you were scum so I wanted to lynch you. I have had a look as I couldn't remember my case and it was absolutely fine.
My ISO
I see nothing wrong with my ISO at all. I felt you were scum I wanted to lynch you; this happens all the time in mafia it does not mean the town was stupid.

first off, the case was on town so it wasn't fine. second, you neglected to look for other motivations other than to insist that you were right and you started a chain of confirmation bias based arguments where no matter what I said you would try to paint it as scummy, in which your whole axis of the game swung on and you failed to leave a good trail for town to follow when you were nked. no, the case was not fine; it gave scum plenty of cover to hide.

lynches happen but they certainly do not need to. I am never okay with lynching town but will do it if I have to. I am highly competitive and have high standards and generally always aim for a perfect game (as in no town lynches).

On a side note; Guess how old I am; I am intrigued.

you come across as 18 but since you are asking I am guessing you must be a little older.

PS; one game is not a sample size;
Day 1 Reads
Dead
Endgame
Now you have a sample size of two.

touche

Back on topic; why did you post this?

cos I see you making the same mistake in this game as you made in that one and I don't want you to. it was very frustrating especially since you were my strongest town read and I was wanting to work with you. when you do this and do not even attempt to look at something from a different perspective it not only interferes with your scum hunting but mine too; I am getting a little bit of a town read on you so plz don't do that.

ps - I accept your apology. and I offer my own if my bluntness offends you.

[Piratecat]

@ slaandar

yeah, I already figured out in titanium that we have very very different approaches. I saw early signs of trolleytracking and I did not want to go there again.

@pidgeywidgey

it was something slaandar said in the dead qt that made me put him at a young age. it was pretty arrogant and I found it very funny even though he was being serious.

sidebar for nero: I am tired of you discrediting me in every game we are in together, it shits up the game. we can shelve this til postgame. I don't particularly like you, but it is not going to impact how I play if we are on the same team. I am not "biased" towards my friends. nacho is one of my best mafia friends ask guille and marangala what I did to him. but we can save this all for postgame but we need to get to some place of objective game focus if we are going to continue to play games together. truce.

also you have yet to explain what the scum motivation would be for cryo to propose what he did. what he proposed would set up a situ where he could implicate his scummates and that would be a terrible thing to do to them. I personally do not think it is a bad idea. and would not mind seeing a competing bw between cryo and messiah if that is what we have to work with. his suggestion stems from a vt POV which supports his claim.

town role pm>>>town motivation>>>town motivated posts.

mala has koc as leaning townish. I am not seeing it. this hydra disagrees on our reads on koc at this time.

[Piratecat]

AP's reads like he is unsure about our alignment but has a gut read on us as town. He wants to pursue other avenues and actually lynch someone he has scum reads on, but will ultimately vote us as compromise.

AN's reads like they are very sure about AP being scum, but ultimately know nobody is going down that road today so in order to end the day, they are willing to kill Cryo instead of someone they think is scum. No need to further pursue the case on AP since lynching us is just as good of a mislynch as mislynching AP.

AP's post still includes questions that lead to better reads and making people post and not tunnel. AN's is simply 'let's get today over with so we are willing to join someone we think is scum in lynching Cryo'.

Lastly, and it's minor we know, look at the words used to talk about our death. AP says "lynch" and AN says "kill". It's highly a psychological argument and alone doesn't mean much, but combined with the other thoughts, we think it's more telling than not of each of their mindset's.

Again, maybe personal bias, but to us, these 2 similar post seem to be coming from 2 different motivations. Only provable once we flip town, but please lynch AN tomorrow after our flip.

hhhmmm......

I agree with your analysis but the kill tell is dropped like nuts on this site. I thought it was an accepted site meta thing cos it was so widely accepted. the people from here who have played at tr stand out like bright neon lights when they are scum/vig/SK cos they drop them like crazy and most of tr has learned not to but they still slip up sometimes.

I think it would be interesting to see a competing bw between you and messiah. what do you think.

re: slaandar

not sure. he trolleytracked on me in my first game but I dunno. I get a slight town vibe from him because of it.

@ nero

okay yeah scum

could

do it, but would they? you would have to be super confident in your team.

[Piratecat]

*should correct this to psychological piece of the analysis

[Piratecat]

*stepping back and consulting with the lovely mala*

[Piratecat]

Stupid, but not really very scummy. Makes sense for someone who is suffering from a severe case of the bias.

where is the bias

[Piratecat]

IMollie:Is Bork the same here as Posh?

he has done a fade

[Piratecat]

^ so kind of

[Piratecat]

because questioning my voting patterns is scummy. I don't like scummy questions

erm...no

[Piratecat]

If you're not trying to lynch Cryo, why is your vote on them, and why have you spent a good majority of your posts saying how scummy Cryo is?

I clearly am talking about PirateCat.

OMGUS means a lot when you suddenly call someone scum out of the blue because they called you out, yeah.

OMGUS is just a way to attempt to discredit someone who thinks someone who called them scum is scum.

huh?

I am pretty sure you have been talking about cryo and the 1v1 situ. or at least I thought. when did you transition to talking about us? other than our one on one chat? and how does that relate to the links you provided? you were defending your cryo vote or did you forget that.

majiffy plz bus all of your teammates it will make this game so much easier

you dropped a mega scum tell

goat boy you best believe I will be all up in your grille and it is for

you

to decide if it is good or bad.

like

what made you think slaandar was talking about us when he posted those links and was making a case against cryo

how did you come up with that. what am I missing

still liking AN, pidgeywidgey and cryo for town

it seems like somebody else asked us something.

[Piratecat]

what made you think slaandar was talking about us when he posted those links and was making a case against cryo

how did you come up with that. what am I missing

I didn't. I thought that Slandaar was making his case against CN, and then turned around and stated that he wasn't trying to get them (CN) lynched. Slandaar is the one who then stated he was talking about you.

That bit a couple pages back where Slandaar and Majiffy got into it is a little hard to follow.

that should tell you something

at least one of them is scum but I would not be surprised if it was both

that was us

eta: not telling, cryo I no longer out relative tells.

it may or may not be a scum tell for him but I am leaning that it is

[Piratecat]

and I am leaning that you are being an arrogant ass hth, no need to thank me in advance

sheeping your read on slaander for now

VOTE: slaander

[Piratecat]

borky

why are you talking to scummy looking pidgeywidgey. I am not sure if he is scum but I disagree with his whole line of thinking in this game and in posh we were on the same page nearly all of the time even when we were both being retardedly wrong, lol.

I think cryo is town. I think there is little motivation to push a 1v1 on d1 even if you are under fire. his vt claim supports why he would suggest it in the first place; to maximise info for town. scum are unlikely to do this cos it forces their scummates to either bus, defend or avoid altogether and depending on

how

they did it, it would be something that probably would put their team in the spotlight. cryo is not stupid. I do not think they would do this as scum. let's not even talk about the trail of voting analysis it would leave.

so that is why I am leaning town on him.

slaandar looks awful. not the clear headed logical minded slaandar that I got to know in our previous game together.

I really think he is the best lynch for today. pidgeywidgey needs to be looked at tomorrow. along with the kernel. and goat boy. I agree with most of your town reads.

[Piratecat]

that did not look like a panicky OMGUS vote at all.

PC are quite clearly talking out of both sides of their mouth ^. I was a light-moderate townread for BOTH sides of the hydra recently yet Mollie suddenly goes from "AP is prob town" to asking why Bork is interacting with 'scummy pidgeywidgey' and encouraging people to look at me tomorrow. Shes scum and can't remember that she thinks Im town. Piratecat is a quality vote.

did you not earlier state that your vote hopping and read switching was a town tell for you but you are using it as a scumtell for us? this is rich.

see, you left out a key part of my post and that is telling. you cherry picked "scummy looking pidgeywidgey" but did not post the post in its entirety in which I followed it up with "I am not sure if he is scum though".

you look scummy for calling borky's reads "forced" when there was nothing "forced" about them.

[Piratecat]

that did not look like a panicky OMGUS vote at all.

PC are quite clearly talking out of both sides of their mouth ^. I was a light-moderate townread for BOTH sides of the hydra recently yet Mollie suddenly goes from "AP is prob town" to asking why Bork is interacting with 'scummy pidgeywidgey' and encouraging people to look at me tomorrow. Shes scum and can't remember that she thinks Im town. Piratecat is a quality vote.

did you not earlier state that your vote hopping and read switching was a town tell for you but you are using it as a scumtell for us? this is rich.

see, you left out a key part of my post and that is telling.

you cherry picked "scummy looking pidgeywidgey" but did not post the post in its entirety in which I followed it up with "I am not sure if he is scum though".

you look scummy for calling borky's reads "forced" when there was nothing "forced" about them.

Time to totally 180 cause I super don't like both bolded parts.

1) He's not calling vote hopping a scumtell.

He's showing where you just flip flopped with no explanations.

2) Nothing in there demonstrates what caused you to say "scummy looking" in the first place. Was it my post?

jesus fucking christ

1) which is what he has done. that is why it is rich. the proper words for this would be either projection or hypocrisy and that would be based on his alignment.
2) it was based on you 2s interactions. I said your post of your reads did not look "forced". that he is pushing this looks sus, so what I said actually does demonstrate as to why I think he was "scummy looking".

are you following this so far

[Piratecat]

Ugh, I keep saying Im leaving, and then seeing something I feel like I need to comment on.

@Mollie You are simultaneously accusing me of OMGUSing you (ergo you think Im scum) and saying that I cherrypicked your post (apparently you don't think Im scum). So which is it?

Im saying that you and Malak have been listing me as one of your townreads (Malak has been for awhile and you have been for a lesser amount of time). Suddenly you are talking to bork about me and how I'm scummy and might be scum? And you fucking said I need to be looked into tomorrow, so no taking back THAT. You clearly were saying I am scummy in that post yet in your VERY LAST POST you mentioned me as one of 3 townreads worth mentioning. No idea where you stand on Bork at all because Im not looking atm, but IIRC you never mentioned him that much - but now you are talking to him about me being scummy when I was a townread of yours?

@qwints: I also took back my scumread on KoC in my first post of today.

this head has been sus of you all game. you cherry picked, plain and simple, in order to justify an OMGUS vote. but this head has steadfastly maintained that you are very different in this game and this head is trying to freaking sort it out.

if you are town, BACK OFF

[Piratecat]

saying that I cherrypicked your post

you left out a key part of my post and that is telling. you cherry picked "scummy looking pidgeywidgey" but did not post the post in its entirety in which I followed it up with "I am not sure if he is scum though".

First of all, 'I'm not sure he is scum' sounds like you think Im a null or null-scum read.
Second, you are implying that YOU had a townfeel on me in this post and that that was obvious and that I decided to ignore it. How am I omgusing you if, as you claim, it should have been obvious to me that you had a townread on me and I cherrypicked that away?

Can't have your cake and eat it too Mollie.

I waffle on you. plain in simple.

I waffle on majiffy

I waffle on nero/arc. where did they run off to

and you are still cherry picking

if waffling is a scumtell then why are you waffling too on some of your reads?

are you scum?

I am unsure about you but the other half of this head has had you as town. we have been in disagreement for awhile. I moved you to town cos you were showing some town tells

but I cannot ignore the difference in your game here and the posh game.

like a big difference. it keeps pinging my scumdar.

eta:

but ONE POST BEFORE, you said I was a townread and you in NO WAY mentioned Bork's nteractions with me as a reason for suspecting me. The bolded was all you offered.

at the time I had given you a town read you had not interacted with borky. then you did. and I thought you looked scummy with how you interacted with him. so I moved you back to my scum pile.

what part of this are you not understanding.

and no, I am not lying. your interactions with borky point to why we are so out of sync. the "we have not been in line with thinking this whole game" is a true statement cos we haven't been.

my moving you to my town pile was independent of you being in line with my thinking. cos we haven't been. it has to do with independent town tells that I thought you might have been dropping and what the other head says. but I dunno. it is weird to be on the end of this level of dissonance with someone else who claims to be town. I am not able to follow you at all.

[Piratecat]

borky

why are you talking to scummy looking pidgeywidgey. I am not sure if he is scum but I disagree with his whole line of thinking in this game and in posh we were on the same page nearly all of the time even when we were both being retardedly wrong, lol.

I think cryo is town. I think there is little motivation to push a 1v1 on d1 even if you are under fire. his vt claim supports why he would suggest it in the first place; to maximise info for town. scum are unlikely to do this cos it forces their scummates to either bus, defend or avoid altogether and depending on

how

they did it, it would be something that probably would put their team in the spotlight. cryo is not stupid. I do not think they would do this as scum. let's not even talk about the trail of voting analysis it would leave.

so that is why I am leaning town on him.

slaandar looks awful. not the clear headed logical minded slaandar that I got to know in our previous game together.

I really think he is the best lynch for today. pidgeywidgey needs to be looked at tomorrow. along with the kernel. and goat boy. I agree with most of your town reads.

Side note: this post reads really really weird.

Mollie is talking to Bork in a really familiar way despite mostly

ignoring him (except like one or 2 instances where she off handedly agreed with something he said)

If this game is multi-ball, then Mollie/Bork are probably scum together.

(Otherwise, maybe not, but it still reads really weird for someone who hasn't been interacting with Bork at all)

it takes like 2 seconds to see that

this

is a lie.

I mentioned borky early.

mentioned him again later.

mentioned him when nero asked me.

he went awol and then reappeared. he looks town to me.

wrt the bold: hedging

eta: xposts, pidgeywidgy, you are fucking flailing like a duck in quicksand

[Piratecat]

1025 is a giant misrep

the only thing that can be construed as a misrep in that post is me saying he was accusing me of vote hopping.

that is the only thing

.

his reads have been all over the place bit every as much as mine/ours have. and no matter which way you look at it that is either hypocritical or projection, the motivation would be dependent on his alignment.

what the fuck is wrong with you.

[Piratecat]

Found it:

I like KoC's last post. Guessing he actually is town.

OK, this is town-AP.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Piratecat

AP switched a read so he's town?

Really?

scratch that I'm taking that out of context ignore

oh like what pidgeywidgey did with us? but you are okay that he cherry picked and built a case around it that slaandar bit into?

[Piratecat]

yeah I'll go ahead and address that maybe when you can be a little more civil cause I'm really not in the mood.

well I did a post edit of deleting the JESUSMOTHERFUCKINGCHIST and I don't think I have insulted you, not once.

I

am

trying to be civil. I am truly not seeing where you are coming from and I am struggling to see how you think that pidgeywidgey's OMGUS vote is in anyway legit.

it should be pretty obvious that interact with people who are in the game in real time. if I want to talk to someone I am usually "where the fuck are you?". like I have been trying to put steady pressure on the kernel cos they are not interacting with us!!!! how people have them in their town pile is a mystery all I can think of is that they are walking around with faerie dust in their pockets and blowing it in people's faces and suddenly people are like, "oh, they are so town". cos they aren't! if they are we are not seeing it.

[Piratecat]

#1062 is actually quite a good point by Slan: molliekittens can you explain please?

it isn't really. you can think a player is logical and makes sense with their reasoning but still think they have too high of an opinion of themselves. I think slaandar is both.

in the titanium game his entrance into the titanium dead qt was: "smashboard was not the town leader he was only the pretender. I was the true town leader and that is why I was nked".

^^^ which is why I thought he was 18. what grown man would say that?

slaandar didn't have a single correct read the entire time.

[Piratecat]

I currently have 5 scum voting me

Its actually hilarious.

lol. just saw this.

it kind of proves my point doncha think?

but at the same time the consistency with his overblown sense of his own self-importance gives us pause and makes us wonder if maybe he is town.

[Piratecat]

We'd like to tell you all a quick story:

Once upon a time there was a scumlord playing his scumlordy games:

----Slandaar: 'ZOMG, CRYO IS SCUM', 'Did I mention cryo was scum?', 'guys, cryo is scum', 'more votes cryo', 'vote cryo to lynch scum'.....

The good people of Cryotown (who were all nudists...AND super good looking) had recognized this scumlord from before and called him on his scumlordy play:

----Cryo: 'Slandaar, your tunneling reminds us of a game where you did the same thing and flipped scum....looking like a scum tell for you at this point...'

The scumlord thought he was sly and changed it up immediately:

----Slandaar: 'uh.......crap.....uh.......' 'oooh, I know!...AP is scum', 'KoC is scum', 'PC is scum', 'MaJiffy is scum'....Hope everyone sees I'm not tunneling now....

The good people of Cryotown saw through it and convinced the surrounding towns to kill the scum. The end.

I LOVE YOU CRYO!!!!!

[Piratecat]

Those are seriously the worst "cases" I've ever seen, Slandaar. Is there a reason your main method of casting suspicion on other players has been twisting their motivations to portray them in the way that suits your narrative the best in the face of the obvious?

--

I actually see the point AP is trying to make w/r/t bork's reads wall and I kind of agree with it. I find it hard to believe that everyone getting in his face about it has such a hard time with the concept.

Speaking of AP, he seems really genuinely frustrated/upset and out of his mind at this game

. He's very likely town.

he started the game like that. he is literally jumping on anybody who questions him. it is one of the reasons why this half of the hydra has been so sus of him.

[Piratecat]

@ slaandar

me switching my opinion on a player or holding the tension between 2 views on a player that might seemingly contradict one another, is a playstyle thing. you do realise that don't you?

so there is a distinct dissonance with your defense against majiffy's case on you and the one you are trying to push on us. unless you want to outright justify hypocrisy.

still loling that you think scum are so terrified of you that they all would risk voting as a bloc in order to get you removed. like that shit is seriously funny.

thinking scum will be distancing from what is going on. *looks at goat boy*

@ cryo

I want to talk to you when you have a minute!!!

[Piratecat]

in the titanium game his entrance into the titanium dead qt was: "smashboard was not the town leader he was only the pretender. I was the true town leader and that is why I was nked".

You misquoted me. I said something like that but the wording is completely off.

slaandar didn't have a single correct read the entire time.

NJAC

Oh.

And the townreads I was right on... Nice attempt at discrediting me.

I remember you saying that you thought njac was scum in the dead qt but I don't remember you pushing him as a scum read in the game thread

at all

. you were too busy with your hard on that I was scum, which I wasn't.

and I quoted from memory, pretty sure the wording can't be too far off. it was that funny and stuck out that much.

[Piratecat]

he started the game like that. he is literally jumping on anybody who questions him. it is one of the reasons why this half of the hydra has been so sus of him.

That's kind of why it seems so genuine to me though, I see a natural progression into the insanity starting right from the beginning. He started out slowly becoming more upset that mastin wasn't townreading him, and I know they're buddies and they hydra and mod together and whatever, and then it escalated from there after Majiffy and Nero(?) started to attack him when he jumped on Cryo's wagon.

It all just seems really genuinely emotional rather than a scummy panic thing.

okay. I think that might have been what mala saw.

what other reads you got

[Piratecat]

also @ messiah

what do you think about the exchanges between marangala and goat boy.

let me explain what I was seeing:

to me it looked like goat boy was a deer caught in headlights by a scummate whom he thought was being dumb. he was all ready to go after her but then she soft claimed and then he was like wtf. and he has been playing the "I don't know what is going on can you teach me how to iso posts again?" ever since. it has been the scummiest exchange the entire game IMO. (mollie's)

what do you think about that. am I being reading too much into it or is there something there.

[Piratecat]

Ok...read/skimmed 25 pages and ~caught up. Painful. I liked Slandaar's post 1042. I'll stay on PirateCat for now.

lol

[Piratecat]

also @ messiah

what do you think about the exchanges between marangala and goat boy.

let me explain what I was seeing:

to me it looked like goat boy was a deer caught in headlights by a scummate whom he thought was being dumb. he was all ready to go after her but then she soft claimed and then he was like wtf. and he has been playing the "I don't know what is going on can you teach me how to iso posts again?" ever since. it has been the scummiest exchange the entire game IMO. (mollie's)

what do you think about that. am I being reading too much into it or is there something there.

^^^ that was me

venmar I will not be offended if you delete my alt slips if I repost what I was originally posting. and sorry I keep alt slipping I know it confuses things a bit.

hello, can I input my opinion?

I find Ms M's soft claim a bit bullshit, her post says "of course you want me gone" as though she expects Goat to know her role and he's actively pushing to get her lynch.

I'm not sure what to make of it.

thank you!

I don't like her claim either and have said so.

one of the things that I am still learning on this site is navigating the thread narrative from a premise that scum do not have day chat. it is not something I am used to and it puts the in-thread interactions in a totally different light. that whole exchange looked awkward as fuck.

it smelled like 2 scum staging an interaction to me. it looked incredibly forced.

[Piratecat]

also @ messiah

what do you think about the exchanges between marangala and goat boy.

let me explain what I was seeing:

to me it looked like goat boy was a deer caught in headlights by a scummate whom he thought was being dumb. he was all ready to go after her but then she soft claimed and then he was like wtf. and he has been playing the "I don't know what is going on can you teach me how to iso posts again?" ever since. it has been the scummiest exchange the entire game IMO. (mollie's)

what do you think about that. am I being reading too much into it or is there something there.

hello, can I input my opinion?

I find Ms M's soft claim a bit bullshit, her post says "of course you want me gone" as though she expects Goat to know her role and he's actively pushing to get her lynch.

I'm not sure what to make of it.

thank you!

I don't like her claim either and have said so.

one of the things that I am still learning on this site is navigating the thread narrative from a premise that scum do not have day chat. it is not something I am used to and it puts the in-thread interactions in a totally different light. that whole exchange looked awkward as fuck.

it smelled like 2 scum staging an interaction to me. it looked incredibly forced.

eta: shit. fixed

^^^ that was me (above the eta)

venmar I will not be offended if you delete my alt slips if I repost what I was originally posting. and sorry I keep alt slipping I know it confuses things a bit.

[Piratecat]

@ slaandar
me switching my opinion on a player or holding the tension between 2 views on a player that might seemingly contradict one another, is a playstyle thing. you do realise that don't you?

No its not.

Rest of the post is obviously nonsense because this is clearly wrong.

Playstyle: I scumhunt using x; I post a certain way; I use certain language in my posts; I post a certain frequency

Playstyle is not: I contradict myself

lol

erm no

I scum hunt and my reasoning may seemingly appear contradictory this is the same dumb bullshit you went after me in the titanium game.

[Piratecat]

(AND super good looking)

Damn straight I am.

@Cryo though: Tunneling is, ironically, something Slandaar does as town and I'm pretty sure he is actually mostly immitating that in his scum games. For instance, this game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=22466
He was so convinced that pidgey, a cop cleared VT claim, was actually a godfather that we ended up lynching pidgey in phase before lylo. (Not blaming Slandaar or anything, but seriously I'm just trying to show you what hes capable of when he is convinced hes right). Tunneling as scum is something he does to mimic his town play.

I currently have 5 scum voting me

I really don't want to lynch this. Slandaar could be playing me, but this is really the exact same attitude I've had more often than not as town. Biased and frustrated, but aggressive and loud.

I LOVE YOU CRYO!!!!!

ITT:
Mollie: Slandaar looks town. He was a stubborn ass and tunneled me to death as town in my first game.
Cryo: Slandaar is scum! Hes playing to his tunneling scum meta of one game!
Mollie: Yes, yes, yes!

still loling that you think scum are so terrified of you that they all would risk voting as a bloc

This is a fallacy. Who said they are 'afraid' of him? They could vote for other reasons (easy lynch, wifom of congregating, etc). Slandaar never said anyone was afraid of him.

natural progression into the insanity

haha. Trust me, I know Im a few cards short of a full deck.

slaandar actually makes sense when he trolleytracks. right now he isn't.

also when have you ever seen scum cluster vote on d1? I am not going to say it does not happen, I had a heated argument with my mentor one time cos he did not believe it was possible. then I showed him 3 games from ratz where

scum did exactly that

but it was cos they thought they could get away with impunity. and they did!

@ borky

I asked mala last night to deal with you cos you are way frustrating for me right now. so any interaction you want to have plz address to mala tia

[Piratecat]

also pidgeywidgey, #1099 is a bit of a misrep I sheeped majiffy not cryo

[Piratecat]

I don't see why scum would fakeclaim cop enabler or something like that this early as they basically just outed themselves when there is no cop.

hhhmmm....

did you leave out some words here?

and I thought it was commuter/bulletproof/enabler or something

[Piratecat]

I scum hunt and my reasoning may seemingly appear contradictory this is the same dumb bullshit you went after me in the titanium game.

You are lying

I might show everyone later

I want you to show everyone now

put up or stfu

you accused me of being contradictory in the titanium game and that was why "I needed to be lynched". <---- paraphrased.

you are town and did not learn a thing and therefore have no desire to improve or you are scum pushing what you think is an easy lynch and oh hai! there are people who have the ability to be stupid in this game who will follow you.

[Piratecat]

Still, Cryo made a really fluffy post that boiled down to:
Slandaar is scum because he is tunneling like he did in one other game.

And you loudly agreed with the post

. But you think Slandaar tunneling is a meta towntell from earlier. I just don't get why you are so excited about that post then since you clearly disagree with it or at least know its not totally accurate since YOU have meta of slandaar doing that as town.

then you will have no problem finding the post where I did this.

Wait, Im missing context here. What is this about?

marangala's soft claim?

Mollie, why did you encourage Bork to stop talking to me despite it helping you read me?

that isn't what I did. I asked borky why he was talking to scummy looking

you

AND FUCKING SAID

that I was not sure if you were scum. you are assigning motives in that exchange and have been pushing them. I wanted to see what borky would say. and it confused me cos it seemed like he backed off at time when I he should have been his scum read on you. but then you got spastic and well :/

Why is it weird that I am suspicious of you for that, calling me scummy (for no explicitly stated reason) despite saying Im town one post before? Do you really not get my reaction?
Why would I actively try to OMGUS you?

cos you looked scummy. looking scummy does not always equate to being scum.

go fucking read my post without the blinders on

and I have no idea what you are doing. you are seriously acting crazy and I have not been able to follow you not once in this game. and that worries me.

[Piratecat]

question mollie: why did you refer to Slandaar as "not as good as you think you are" and then "clear-headed, logical minded Slandaar" ?

I will answer this but I already answered this earlier?

I think both are true. slaandar made sense in the titanium game. he was my strongest town and that is why I kept trying work with him even though he was steadily pushing for my lynch.

I think we can all agree that slaandar's trolleytracking is a null tell for him. the difference that I am seeing is that he is not making sense in this game. I have been able to follow not one of his trains of thoughts. he looks desperate and edgy. so does pidgeywidgey. and I am wondering why. it is out of character (given my limited experience with the both of them).

seriously, why is this so hard to understand.

[Piratecat]

The post.

Spoiler:

We'd like to tell you all a quick story:

Once upon a time there was a scumlord playing his scumlordy games:

----Slandaar: 'ZOMG, CRYO IS SCUM', 'Did I mention cryo was scum?', 'guys, cryo is scum', 'more votes cryo', 'vote cryo to lynch scum'.....

The good people of Cryotown (who were all nudists...AND super good looking) had recognized this scumlord from before and called him on his scumlordy play:

----Cryo: 'Slandaar, your tunneling reminds us of a game where you did the same thing and flipped scum....looking like a scum tell for you at this point...'

The scumlord thought he was sly and changed it up immediately:

----Slandaar: 'uh.......crap.....uh.......' 'oooh, I know!...AP is scum', 'KoC is scum', 'PC is scum', 'MaJiffy is scum'....Hope everyone sees I'm not tunneling now....

The good people of Cryotown saw through it and convinced the surrounding towns to kill the scum. The end.

I LOVE YOU CRYO!!!!!

that isn't what I did. I asked borky why he was talking to scummy looking you

Mollie...don't give me this. You asked it in a way that implied he shouldn't be. Otherwise, why ask him so pointedly? What is POSSIBLY wrong with Bork talking to me? It reads like coaching. The whole post just feels misplaced.

omg

wrt the spoiler

I found the post funny

but I had sheeped majiffy before that post.

so why are you not going after me for majiffy and instead are focusing on my laughing at cryo's post as if that was the original reason as to why I voted slaandar? cos slaandar was positing that cryo and I are scum buddies and that simply is not true. slaandar seems to think that I was sheeping cryo. and you are supporting that.

when that is not true.

[Piratecat]

also welcome buldey!

@ pidgeywidgey

I wanted to try to see where he was coming from and what he would say. it was not about you.

[Piratecat]

What I don't get by Bork is he said that being 'hurt' over not being included was a semi-town-tell yet posts later he decides to jump on the PC BW.

Yeah, AP, you keep freaking shifting with your read on us and it's getting old. Oh they can be town for now, oh wait they are scum, they are back to town because player x and y think they are and now that more people are leaning scum on us you're back to calling us scum.

Last time I gave my perspective on something that had to do with my other head - I got told it wasn't necessary or even helpful about what I thought the post looked like.

Either way it looks like a TvsT between us. I think you're town, but you are seriously bothering me.

As for Fitz run in and run out that actually did bother me. Seems like he's okay with his vote being on us, but even then so he was 'okay' with moving his vote onto another high wagon. Reeks of opportunism to me.

Con Guile - There IS two heads. Where's Guile? Even then so you might be busy, but you are also free enough to post elsewhere. You know you are acting very similar to how I think one of the heads would act when they are scum.

Bitmap still hasn't caught up. >.>

[Piratecat]

buldey <3

we have a bw on us (are you surprised?) started by slaandar (again, are you surprised?) for really stupid reasons (let's go for the gold! are you surprised?) and then some people (probably scum) jumped on it. <------ I bet this shocks you, lol.

I think slaandar is scummy not because he is trolleytracking but his reasoning behind it. at least in titanium he made sense sort of. oh in his world of pet theories somehow cryo and I are scum buddies.

I now think cryo is town btw. liking mac for town cos seems to be really trying to work things out and leaning town on majiffy.

meanwhile, pidgeywidgey is running around like an epileptic chicken jumping on anyone who has the slightest suspicion of him and I can't follow his thought processes at all which is waaaaaaaay different than the posh game where we were on the same page practically the whole game.

I have no idea what the hell is going on with borky. mala should be on later tonight.

oh and slaandar and cryo are going 1v1 and I think I want to be cryo's publicity manager if he will let me cos I think it will probably be the only fun I will have all game. you know how I feel about stupidity. don't mind getting lynched for good reasons but I do mind getting lynched for bad ones and the ones right now are pretty terrible.

also I am so glad you are here.

[Piratecat]

xpost with the other head!

I will step back and let lovely brainier of the 2 of us take over for a while.

[Piratecat]

Can you stop calling the posts by Mollie or Mala, but actually call it by the hydra. 1173 WAS done by Mala and not Mollie. I didn't know how annoying it was until well now. I feel bad for doing it to Tracey and Mit.

[Piratecat]

Thanks Bork.

Lol 'Jiffy. Apparently people are still having trouble.

[Piratecat]

I'm still reading him as town, but I don't like his flip flopping around. Then again when people always flip flop around reads it bothers me because it can easily be done by scum since they can hop around if they please. I learned a really good lesson about tunneling off my other site, but not sure it can apply here since it requires me to ask a player to walk me through their line of thinking and then decide if its town or scum tunneling.

So unless Slandaar wants to walk me step by step regarding his tunneling; I won't bother.

Meh, KoC, is so much different than our first game. Not sure if he tamed. :p I love how he hasn't responded to anything that we have said (meaning our hydra posts)

[Piratecat]

Bork: he was scum. Large theme Kingdom Hearts.

[Piratecat]

PM: What do you think of Slandaar in light of his quick acceptance to the 1v1? We read it as town due to the circumstances he was in when accepting. His reads may be shit (at least his read of us is), but recent activity doesn't add up to him being scum like we thought. Thoughts?

tbh I don't know. it was never a trolleytracking thing for me but it was his reasons behind it that didn't make sense. and probably has a lot to do with his speaking in absolutes and his inflexibility. I think his reads are shit cos I know our alignment. I have you as town but then why on earth are you going around and gladiator-ing everyone? this is the second player you have done this with and it is almost as if you

want

to be lynched.

can you talk to us about that

[Piratecat]

I understand what you think you're seeing in it, but it feels like extreme overthinking to get to that point to me. I think Goat was just completely baffled by Ms Marangal's assertion at first(which is totally fair, what an idiotic bit of suspicion that was), and then later he got upset about it and shouted at her(post 666).

It's really post 666 that sells his genuineness to me, because that's exactly how I feel when I'm town and get complete bullshit pushes on me. As scum you would want to be careful to not overreact and draw attention to yourself by attacking the person that was attacking you, and if they were buddies you wouldn't think he'd freak out when bussing was going on./b] But yeah, that's 100% exactly how I think I'd want to respond in that situation as town. Marangal looks super shitty for that whole debacle, though, and if she's town then that was just really terrible all the way around.

thanks messiah. I will keep that in mind.

I remember one time a long time ago I was scum with this one player in an untimed game and he went after me hardcore with really stupid reasons. it was after I said, "checking in" and he decided that it was scummy and aggressively (and rather hostilely too) attacked me. at first I was startled and then I was furious and I MEAN FURIOUS cos you never want to spotlight a teammate like that. I behaved exactly as goat boy did and I think my scummate even soft claimed when people jumped on him. so the whole situ gave me a strange sense of deja vu. it looked forced and awkward.

what is also significant about that exchange was that player used to play on this site.

it is a twinge but I have learned to listen to those twinges over the years. I will take your input on board though.

I really don't think you should be lynched. that was one of the sanest posts in this game. I ironically have been thinking about this a lot cos yeah I do tend to over think things.

so what are your reads so far?

@ borky

I have somewhat calmed down a bit but really until you grasp that when I said AP was scummy

looking

but I

didn't know

if that made him scum is an "unsure" read then this head cannot talk to you. you seem to respond less hostilely to the other head so it is probably for the best.

@ slaandar

are those the same questions that I already answered but are going to pretend that I never answered them in the first place? are you just going to reframe the same questions I already answered?

repost them again and if they are different ones then we will answer. not sure what the point of it is though since you are already convinced that we are scum and you will analysing the answers from a state of confirmation bias if you are town or trying to figure out a way to make the answers look scummy. I am only reconsidering you as possible town cos cryo has a point about your willingness to go 1v1 with him. I have my reservations but we will see.

[Piratecat]

I have somewhat calmed down a bit but really until you grasp that when I said AP was scummy looking but I didn't know if that made him scum is an "unsure" read then this head cannot talk to you. you seem to respond less hostilely to the other head so it is probably for the best.

If voting you for thinking you're scummy is "hostile" then I'm not really sure what to tell you.

but what you have called "scummy", some of those things I never actually did :/

[Piratecat]

eta: not to mention that some of those things are not actual "scumtells"

[Piratecat]

here is a thought

how about we lynch the kernel

[Piratecat]

You're sidelining your vote, Mala. Qwints isn't happening today. Put your vote on a viable wagon.

How am

i

sidelining my vote? We are voting Slandaar and

not

Qwints.

[Piratecat]

Thanks Bork. I am aware, but I actually wanted him to answer rather have someone else answer it.

[Piratecat]

I am only reconsidering you as possible town cos cryo has a point about your willingness to go 1v1 with him. I have my reservations but we will see.

An aside, but this is actually a pretty good summation of why I don't like cryo('s playstyle?) -- his play consists of doing questionable WIFOM producing moves and then making snap judgments about the responses to those (when by their nature, scum needs to just try to figure out which side of the WIFOM they need to come out on)

well I addressed cryo's whole gladiator approach and said it even looked like he was

trying

to get lynched. I hate to use the "j" but I can't tell you how many declarations of love I have received from jesters.

[Piratecat]

Hey Jal. Why are we on the same wavelength regarding the hydra?(con guile)

Anyways, Jal is most likely town. Her being aggressive and defensive is more of her town trait. It's scary, but she's like me in a way.

[Piratecat]

I guess snarky sounds

similar

to scummy. I must fit the bill. You can also join the legion of idiots who don't understand what being "defensive" is or how to apply it properly as a scum tell or as an anything tell.

I will never be lynched this game. I will have to be night killed. Boo hoo.

I noticed Guille was on V/LA which is the only thing making me not want to jump further on that ass. Uber can kind of get away with not posting for awhile. He's done that crap as town before. Need to see more content from Guille, though.

the uber half gets a pass for now but guille should really be stepping up, he has been around.

[Piratecat]

If there's a jester in the game then all that's gonna do is make me not sign up for another Venmar game. I don't operate normally on the condition that a jester might be in the game and you shouldn't either.

I already announced no bastard roles in sign-ups, cult and jester included.

sorry about that, you guys treat jesters differently than what I am used to. jesters don't usually end the game when they get lynched since it is an independent win condition of town/scum.

[Piratecat]

I wonder if that's like how you never post in our hydra anymore, Mollie...

lol, maybe if you would talk to me during a game about the game maybe I would! you are as bad as mantis. in our hydra qt all we talked about was how yoguart was good for the skin and how potatoes can reduce the puffiness around your eyes. then we talked about wine. I don't think we had one game related post in like 30.

but this is a mala/mollie hydra called Piratecat so address us accordingly!

[Piratecat]

okay

@ borky then I still think cryo is likely town. I just finished a game where he was scum and he was a lot more controlled and pretty much had me fooled right up until we mass claimed and in the night round I did a reread and realised his claim did not make sense. but then I was nked. :/

this is nothing so far of what I have experienced of his scum game.

[Piratecat]

okay

@ borky then I still think cryo is likely town. I just finished a game where he was scum and he was a lot more controlled and pretty much had me fooled right up until we mass claimed and in the night round I did a reread and realised his claim did not make sense. but then I was nked. :/

this is nothing so far of what I have experienced of his scum game.

well that's entirely different than what your other head said so okie

When did

I

ever speak about Cyro?

Won't lie my reaction when I saw this post was "What the fuck"

[Piratecat]

The fact is Bork. The only thing that I said about Cyro was way early and I'm trusting in Mollie's read because that's how hydra's work. We need to try and harmonize rather than be dis-harmonized because then our reads will be all over the place. When we have conflicting reads we try and work through it and get to some level where both of us are seeing eye to eye.

We were wondering if you were trying to confuse us on purpose, but now I know that you seem to be confused while trying to tell the difference.

For those who are having trouble reading us you can refer to our sig. That should help clear up confusion, but please don't call us in thread by one person unless you want something that one of us said cleared up. Thanks.

[Piratecat]

There is a distinct lack of her doing what she usually does as town.

I need to see more MollieUnderPressure though.

Well if you ISO her and count the scum reads versus the town reads it's quite obvious that she's delaying doing any town reads. Usually she bursts out with a bunch of town reads right away based on very few posts. And it's not a matter of her wanting to talk to mala first, because she is happily sharing scum reads and fos'ing.

You have to keep in mind this

is

also a hydra and we are talking about our reads before blurting them out in the thread. We do have very similar town reads though which I already stated in some earlier posts. You aren't taking everything into consideration.

[Piratecat]

Okay, I'll be the guy to ask. Why doesn't Mollie use caps and punctuation? She's quite erudite, from what I've seen.

I use it as a litmus test of sorts, in order to weed out those who prefer style over substance and to assess skill level. Players who prefer style over substance have a tendency to be shallow players and are frequently wrong with their reads and can be somewhat detrimental to a town win condition. For example, an argument can be presented using formal/informal logic but this is alignment neutral, since scum can do this just as easily as town and town is perfectly capable of being highly illogical and irrational with their responses. Players who have experience and skill can determine the motivations

behind

the posts, which is much more important IMHO.

This lays the groundwork for a town win.

win condition>>>scumhunting>>>figuring out who is actually

on

your team is part of that process----> end result = lynching scum

But I am sure you know that.

Mafia is a game of psychology, at least that is how I see it. For me at least, there is a great deal of intuition involved as in I make leaps of reasoning that I cannot always easily explain (pattern spotting). Other players do too and I think it has to do with spotting a syntax structure of a particular post that points to a win condition different from their own, but unable to articulate why (gut readers). Or, in the instance of having an additional responsibility in the game i.e. a power role, holding more information than the rest of vanilla town players (their team) have.

tl;dr: I prefer those who prefer substance over style, they tend to be winners. and not just in mafia.

fake eta: this is about as nerdy as I will get but certainly not as nerdy as I

can

get but I will spare you the rest.

fake eta2:

[Piratecat]

back to the regular scheduled programming ------>

[Piratecat]

There is a distinct lack of her doing what she usually does as town.

I need to see more MollieUnderPressure though.

Well if you ISO her and count the scum reads versus the town reads it's quite obvious that she's delaying doing any town reads. Usually she bursts out with a bunch of town reads right away based on very few posts. And it's not a matter of her wanting to talk to mala first, because she is happily sharing scum reads and fos'ing.

erm...we have thrown a shit ton of town reads lol

but nice try!

[Piratecat]

I love you too, marangala.

you guys haven't seen mala unleashed yet. she is her own force of nature.

eta: qwints was pinging my scumdar too but I need to get into a more in-depth analysis with mala about it

[Piratecat]

Ms in general. The mafiascum server

[Piratecat]

cryo, plz don't be scum...

it will mean all of those "I love yous" were....

*chokes back sob*

*struggles to get out words*

LIES!!!!

*runs away sobbing*

[Piratecat]

S'ok. I just wanted to see if you would post.

I don't think pushing Mrs M is that unpopular. No one has been giving crap to others about it, except for Mac himself. He sort of goes in-between respecting and acknowledging her claim, telling GIF why he shouldn't vote her (her claim), then calling her claim shit.

What?

You know, I can call her claim shit all I want because of the way she soft claimed it and my personal stance on it: that doesn't mean I'm going to risk voting/lynching a PR. And I don't think anyone should be voting her yet, hence I told GIF to unvote her. Plus I think he just skipped by it without realising.

I think you also asked for my scumreads too. Here:

Ms. M I'm obviously a bit suspect about. PC made a good point about the exchange between her and The Goat looking forced too, and reading back, I kinda agree with her too. So The Goat too.

I found GIF suspicious too for his flavor questioning early on, but I can't say Buldemar has continued this because I haven't really seen anything he's posted.

Uber/guile hydra is quiet. Too quiet. And Viomi has replaced in and posted absolutely zero content in her posts so far.

so marangala is not your scummate

that is good news

[Piratecat]

erm...I didn't?

saying someone is

not

your scummate is not the same as saying that you thought they were scummates in the first place.

it is 2 different things

[Piratecat]

How does Messiah look like scum? I'm not seeing it, at all even after I looked at his Iso. yeah, he's been gone for a while but, like Mac most, if not all his post has content, and alot of it.

^^^ this.

and you just moved up in my town pile. scum would much prefer to have slaandar in the game than out of it if this what he keeps presenting.

[Piratecat]

and you just moved up in my town pile. scum would much prefer to have slaandar in the game than out of it if this what he keeps presenting.

What if Slandaar is maf though?

I think he is. but we are up against mastin's "slaandar is for sure town!! ARGGHHHHHH!!!!!!" and gives us doubts.

I would rather lynch havingfits personally and he is tweaking the other head's scumdar too. what pinged for majiffy pinged for me too. havingfitz does not care who is lynched and that should be screamingly obvious to everyone.

I like messiah I think he is one of the most level-headed people in the game. I am not understanding why people are lynching him

at all

.

[Piratecat]

Fitz seems town.

name one "town" thing that fitz has done

[Piratecat]

Bullshit. Town can make contradictions.

Yeah, please tell me what Fitz has done to make him seem town to you? Or you just going to buddy Fitz like you did to Absta that mini game?

[Piratecat]

Pirate: I think you are town because you voted to lynch my scumread
Pirate Explanation: You are town NOT because I think you are voting scum its because I think scum would more likely keep Slandaar in the game than Messiah. By voting Slandaar you are trying to lynch the person scum would want to keep around so you are not scum.

That isn't town.

Clearly.

It is assuming Messiah and I are both town; which makes no sense from her perspective.

I think you are scum, slaandar. your cases are BAD. you flailed around in your back and forth with majiffy. you have a town read on fitz for...what reason exactly ?

however we do take in consideration other players reads. mastin seems protown so far and we respect his reads. that is the only reason why the waffling on you.

hey if you trolleytrack on town a lot, maybe you should think about...I dunno, not doing it? improving one's game is a great but underrated thing.

did you want to repeat the questions you think we did not answer or is it true that it does not matter what the response is and you will only find some ridiculous type of scum motivation behind it because you a) are going in with a confirmation bias or b) scum?

[Piratecat]

Fitzscum cares about how he appears much more.

so at some point you will have no problem pulling up a meta case on him in order to support this and to justify the reasoning behind it.

Town are more likely to have confirmation Bias then Scum will Mollie. I'm pretty positive that Slandaar is town, he's town reading Fitz based off Meta which, I think is weak, but Viable coming from a town perspective.

hhhmmm....

here is the thing. when town does it, it is confirmation bias (trolleytracking). when scum do it, it is a form of what I have come to coin "scum tunneling". the motivations behind the 2 are very different

trolleytracking is when a player is so transfixed on their target that they get literally blindsighted by scum and get hurt in the process. it is a hockey term and it means you get knocked to the ground cos you didn't see your opponent (scum) coming and you lose teeth and get bruised. scum tunneling provides a smokescreen for scum to focus on one town player and not be accountable for the rest of their reads or their play. slaandar is trying to paint what are actually not scumtells into scumtells. that is scummy but he did this to me (mollie) in the titanium game and he was town. he claims a meta read on one player but ignores the meta of another player whom he has played with before whom he misread. it makes us go hhhmmm...

[Piratecat]

I think you are scum, slaandar. your cases are BAD. you flailed around in your back and forth with majiffy. you have a town read on fitz for...what reason exactly ?

I explained it.

hey if you trolleytrack on town a lot, maybe you should think about...I dunno, not doing it? improving one's game is a great but underrated thing.

I don't know where you get the impression I do it on town a lot.

did you want to repeat the questions you think we did not answer or is it true that it does not matter what the response is and you will only find some ridiculous type of scum motivation behind it because you a) are going in with a confirmation bias or b) scum?

Now you wish to answer them?

Too late.

Be worried my case on you will be huge and yes it will include the fact you couldn't answer simple questions then try to turn it round on me like I didn't want the answers.

1. addressed that in the above post
2. ohhhhhh reeeeeaaaally? so far we have seen examples of you doing it regardless of alignment. correct us if we are wrong, but is that not what your whole defense to cryo's case is based on? oh my, have we spotted an inconsistency here?
3. we asked you about the questions earlier did you miss that post or what. your case will be full of shit (null tell for you, apparently) and you will lose credibility and will have to acknowledge that you cannot read us and are prone to going after what you think is low hanging fruit, again, apparently a null tell for you.

also we answered your questions (as stated earlier) but if you posted some new ones that we missed, then we will answer (as stated earlier) <------ who is ignoring who now

yeah, you need to fix your game.

[Piratecat]

Jump onto Fitz so we can get into night phase, and not lose any potential active town players?

????????

scum love to shoot active players and leave lurky anti-town players alive.

but Fitz ain't a bad kill at all.

interesting...

[Piratecat]

Fitzscum cares about how he appears much more.

so at some point you will have no problem pulling up a meta case on him in order to support this and to justify the reasoning behind it.

lol

I probably won't be doing that.

he claims a meta read on one player but ignores the meta of another player whom he has played with before whom he misread. it makes us go hhhmmm...

I misread you before so I wouldn't do it again?

Logical fallacy.

ignores the meta of another player

I never had this contradiction issue with Mollie when she was town.

Hey look! Sland did use meta on Pirate!

so far we have seen examples of you doing it regardless of alignment. correct us if we are wrong, but is that not what your whole defense to cryo's case is based on?

This is about right.

Calling Cryo's 'case' a case is laughable though.

oh my, have we spotted an inconsistency here?

Have you?

I tunnel as town a lot = I tunnel on town a lot

Nope you havn't. Its relative; I tunnel on scum a high % compared to the base numbers; perhaps if you use flat how many times have you tunnel town its a lot; but that clearly isn't what was being said as seen;

yeah, you need to fix your game.

And if people don't get that; in flat numbers I could tunnel 50 town and 5000 scum; so yes 50 times is a lot; but I clearly wouldn't need to 'fix my game'.

we asked you about the questions earlier did you miss that post or what.

I no longer care for the answers.

you will lose credibility

Well not when you flip scum I won't.

and are prone to going after what you think is low hanging fruit, again, apparently a null tell for you.

This clearly doesn't enter my mind. Low hanging fruit or not why does it matter if I think they are scum?

I would rather lynch havingfits personally and he is tweaking the other head's scumdar too.

Oh wait; you are going after low hanging fruit???

Fitzscum cares about how he appears much more.

so at some point you will have no problem pulling up a meta case on him in order to support this and to justify the reasoning behind it.

lol

I probably won't be doing that.

he claims a meta read on one player but ignores the meta of another player whom he has played with before whom he misread. it makes us go hhhmmm...

I misread you before so I wouldn't do it again?

Logical fallacy.

ignores the meta of another player

I never had this contradiction issue with Mollie when she was town.

Hey look! Sland did use meta on Pirate!

so far we have seen examples of you doing it regardless of alignment. correct us if we are wrong, but is that not what your whole defense to cryo's case is based on?

This is about right.

Calling Cryo's 'case' a case is laughable though.

oh my, have we spotted an inconsistency here?

Have you?

I tunnel as town a lot = I tunnel on town a lot

Nope you havn't. Its relative; I tunnel on scum a high % compared to the base numbers; perhaps if you use flat how many times have you tunnel town its a lot; but that clearly isn't what was being said as seen;

yeah, you need to fix your game.

And if people don't get that; in flat numbers I could tunnel 50 town and 5000 scum; so yes 50 times is a lot; but I clearly wouldn't need to 'fix my game'.

we asked you about the questions earlier did you miss that post or what.

I no longer care for the answers.

you will lose credibility

Well not when you flip scum I won't.

and are prone to going after what you think is low hanging fruit, again, apparently a null tell for you.

This clearly doesn't enter my mind. Low hanging fruit or not why does it matter if I think they are scum?

I would rather lynch havingfits personally and he is tweaking the other head's scumdar too.

Oh wait; you are going after low hanging fruit???

I am just going to number our responses to make it easier for you and everyone else.

1. how surprising.

2. spot the fallacy and name it. then go back and cite your own. then you will have earned a bit of cred.

3. what is interesting is that later in this post you self-cite meta. but it was brought up in that game and you soft supported with follow-up responses. this is why I don't iso; things are taken out of context and can be painted however way you like. the key to the game is the timing of posts. and oh, I will come back to this.

4. I don't think it is laughable. however, there

is

a difference between your town trolleytracking and your scum tunneling I think, no matter how you choose to dance around that.

5. okay.

6. of course you don't care about the questions it seems you did not care about the answers in the first place. as far as I know, we have answered the questions.

repeat: if you have asked us questions that you feel we have not answered in the first place then remind us of what questions you do feel that you need answers to

.

^ earnest request btw.

7. we are not going to flip scum. are you going to dismiss our reads cos...that is what you do?

8. cos that is what scum does. and retarded town. where do you fit in with this.

9. so you think havingfitz is low hanging fruit?

tell me moar about the meta town read on him that you have no interest in supplying...

you have a crap case on us and I cannot determine if it is pride, confirmation bias or if you are scum.

look at what else is going on around you. think about what you are seeing here. <---- only applies if you are town.

if you are scum plz don't bother

[Piratecat]

xpost: lol. I don't have the patience to deal with you and it is directly related to what I said earlier about some player's prediliction for style over substance.

[Piratecat]

*predilection

[Piratecat]

Hate to say this, but I'm getting flashbacks with Slandaar. I remember not wanting to even go near the whole Slandaar vs. D3x, but Slandaar vs. Mollie is just unbearable.

No, Slandaar, I have zero knowledge of GoW.

Anyways, I want to talk to Jal and Mastin since they are both my strongest town reads. Mainly this is regarding those who are seriously not posting. I think there's scum in those who aren't posting. What do you guys think of Fitz, Bitmap, Viomi, Qwints and Col Guile?

I'm giving a day to allow some content up from the hydra. Mainly one is v/la and the other is in a lot of games, but I have never seen UN this quiet.

Viomi has been posting elsewhere and hasn't given one inch of attention here.

Also, Buld, if you think we are scum, why isn't your vote on us?

[Piratecat]

He's not voting anyone. He's only commented regarding us and didn't even follow up with it. So, yeah, I'm calling him out.

[Piratecat]

I'm not encouraging him to NL. I'm trying to encourage him to actually post thoughts or content or even a vote to make sure he's actually playing and paying attention.

[Piratecat]

our reads:

Town:

majiffy
mastin
ap
koc
jal

Unsure/Leaning Town:

cryo
borky - thinking the hydra is throwing him off
messiah
goat boy

Unsure

qwints
viomi
bitmap
perv
mac

Unsure Maybe Scummy

marangala
an

Leaning Scummy

kernel guiile
havingfitz
slaandar
buldey

[Piratecat]

lol wut

What has buldermar done that's so scummy?

using meta that he doesn't have

has only gone against me (mollie) as scum once. you were on my team. I was lynched before he even checked in I think.

also that reaction is hhhhmmmm.....

[Piratecat]

Leaning Scummy

kernel guiile
havingfitz
slaandar
buldey

So I call you out on something and suddently you're "leaning scummy" on me? Or do you have some sort of magical read that you'd like to elaborate on? You're OMGUS'ing me so hard and you wont even admit it.

lol, since you seem to be such an

expert

on my scum game despite never having really seen it, I do not usually OMGUS as scum. I do it on occasion.

and the magical read on you is something that I will never tell. but thanks for confirming our scum read on you!

[Piratecat]

lol wut

What has buldermar done that's so scummy?

Oh hey someone else noticed - great. Town cred to Majiffy I suppose.

nah. he lost points with that post. he should be calling you out cos you are essentially doing the same thing that he did to me in the recent tr game.

[Piratecat]

Jesus Christ Slandaar, you're just completely misrepping Molliecat, Mollie specifically. that wall post explaining why Mollie is scum is nothing but fabrication on your part, and taking things way out of context. you seriously need to rethink your case.

Why would town Slaandar feel the need to fabricate you think?

both town-Slaandar and scum-Slaandar would prefer not getting lynched.

Hello.

When I ask question such as this, it's not for my own benefit for wanting to know why oh why would a town Slaandar do that oh goody goody gosh.

I've been in enough games with Slaandar where I've seen him as town make up some bullshit and attempt to follow through even after everyone calls him out on it. Slaandar trying to save his ass by fabricating things? No. If Slaandar is town, he wholly believes these things, otherwise why would he be playing around with a vote on piratecat when things may turn for the worse against him? No. A town Slaandar believes in the goods he sells when town. This is not the point I'm driving at though. If you believe he is mindfully fabricating as town, then I suggest turning around and rethinking dat thar read.

I was asking the question to Ms M, not you, not AP, not Majiffio, or Piratecat, or Uber the Supreme Pooper. I'm asking Ms M, the one person who thinks Slaandar is fabricating things and yet is not hopping on the Slaandard wagon like most others and why they think so. Thanks though, for not letting her speak for herself and (potentially) giving an out.

Champ.

I like you.

[Piratecat]

that vote right there makes either slaandar scum or slaandar and messiah are both town

that was me and I corrected it

[Piratecat]

lol wut

What has buldermar done that's so scummy?

Oh hey someone else noticed - great. Town cred to Majiffy I suppose.

nah. he lost points with that post. he should be calling you out cos you are essentially doing the same thing that he did to me in the recent tr game.

What? How is this even remotedly similar to what happened in that game?

I believe majiffy tried to claim a meta read on me or something before trying to fake cc me (like you have done in this game)

regardless, you are like confirmed scum. you don't have my scum meta

[Piratecat]

and no I do not mean you have cc me this game but you

have

claimed a meta read on me

[Piratecat]

if I can get mala to agree I think I can actually go for AN lynch. I had them as town earlier cos of angel but nero is starting to look scummy as fuck.

AN we have not derped about a single thing.

[Piratecat]

@Buld:

See this is where you are wrong. We both gave out town reads and some scum reads. She might not have tossed them out randomly because I wanted to talk to her about them first, but they are there.

Why are you being so rock hard and stubborn?

[Piratecat]

@Piratecat

: Do you believe in the hydra dissonance tell?

this half of the head doesn't cos I have a hydra with majiffy and we disagree on almost everything. mala may something else...

this is our first game as a hydra. we are still working out our groove.

@ buldey you have to say why you think we are scummy. you said it was a meta read.

I have a scum read on Piratecat - mostly due to meta with the mollie part of the hydra.

but you are not

a) taking in consideration that this is a hydra
b) saying what it is we are doing that you find is scummy. most of your posts to this hydra has been to mala, and I was going to let her answer.

I see that majiffy either ignored our post about how I was not saying that buldey was cc I was saying that majiffy tried to pull the meta thing too.

http://talkrational.org/showthread.php? ... ost2071546

and when majiffy cc me I don't think he even had a vote on him at the time so he was not going down.

going to talk to mala before I blurt out any reads but ooooooh my.

[Piratecat]

Yes, but you have a scum read on 1/2 players in

the

hydra. You are disregarding the other head's posts entirely.

Easy Buld. I'm trying to figure out your motive of which you are posting.

[Piratecat]

not to mention the posts you found scummy after your "meta" read on me are from mala lol

[Piratecat]

I'd much rather not lynch Slandaar.

then when you will move to AN?

[Piratecat]

gut scumread on cryo

I haven't read anything and am not really planning on it

if you haven't read anything then how do you have a gut scum read on cryo

oh wait you are doing your thing aren't you

[Piratecat]

Jal, I find your entire sequence of play here confusing. Why would you unvote without putting your vote on someone else?

^this

[Piratecat]

lol wut

What has buldermar done that's so scummy?

using meta that he doesn't have

has only gone against me (mollie) as scum once. you were on my team. I was lynched before he even checked in I think.

also that reaction is hhhhmmmm.....

I'm not using meta

, I'm stating that you've made a shitton of scum reads in the beginning of this game and not a single town read, and that's more often than not indicative of scum waiting it out and not getting locked into certain reads early on.

My read that is based on a shitton of scum reads made by piratecat in the beginning of the game is not meta-related. I don't see how this is supposed to be me claiming not to have a meta-read on mollie?

you said that we were scummy based on your meta read on me. you haven't really played against me as scum. it was the same thing that thing majiffy just tried to pull on tr, I quoted the post. the posts that you have addressed that you seem to have a problem with were mala's (none of them were from the beginning of the game in fact I doubt you have read it. you should probably go do that.)

this is the scummiest backpedal I have ever seen.

fucking lynch this shit

and if majiffy doesn't go after buldey for this then lynch him too!

[Piratecat]

Bleh the one thing about Messiah was that they came into the thread briefly and they didn't seem to even care about their wagon or notice it

. I'd think they would if scum. I really don't like either wagon and the whole thing coming to "pick between two" early was stupid.

VOTE: Messiah

Bleh bleh. Hate me for it. I don't have an anything read on Messiah whereas I think Slaandar may be town.

Think it's L-1.

so while you are running around and calling everybody stupid and question everyone's reading comprehension you make you somehow manage to miss this?:

Does anyone even know why they want to lynch me? That's an honest question, because if they do you can color me surprised. AP made a big deal about how I have shown a "subconscious need to rationalize [my] vote [on ANG]" earlier in the game, and mastin is of the opinion that every single thing I've ever posted was chock full of obvious scum tells that he doesn't seem to feel obligated to explain to anyone.

What about everyone else? Mac's vote was incredibly shit, with his only previous mentions of me in his iso being how he thought I could be Cryo's scumbuddy but Cryo was more likely to be scum. Coincidentally, this is pretty much exactly what qwints has done as well. These two scumfucks are also trying to paint my V/LA as being scummy somehow, even if it requires them to fabricate the timelime of my posts and when I went V/LA (in qwints' case). Buldermar is voting for me because PirateCat is on the Slandaar wagon(??). And who the fuck knows why PV and Bacde are on me, they sure didn't say so.


If anyone has any doubt in their mind that I'm not a scum-driven Slandaar counter wagon then they're probably dumb as fuck. I would be willing to vote Mac or qwints if I need to, but it's patently god damned obvious that Slandaar is scum at this point.

pedit: Actually, Jal is voting for me. She was kind enough to leave the reason up to our imaginations, though.

you need to be lynched too. you and buldey are not even fucking paying attention to the game. you have no fucking idea of what is going on yet you clearly trying to steer a town lynch.

[Piratecat]

so while you are running around and calling everybody stupid and question everyone's reading comprehension you make you somehow manage to miss this?:

Hello.

Thanks for joining the club to be bitched at. If you read my conversation with Ms M, you would have noticed I spoke about that very post you highlighted with her. We had a brief conversation about the potential scumminess about it. So you can't very well say, "lol, u missed this GOTCHA."

I was referring to this post, champ:

Hey, I'm sorta here. I don't know that I'll be able to read much of the last ten pages but I'll be available for deadline stuff.

Tell me this scum case on me. You have piqued my interest, because whatever you just pulled was a horrible attempt to do .. whatever you were trying to do. By your logic, should we be lynching you for not being able to follow along, and then are you on board for Mac and Qwints for the same reasoning?

I only regret bitching out Buldy. I like buldy and he doesn't talk back. Sorry Buldermar.

hi

what they post doesn't look as scummy as what you post so I think you should be lynched over them. read this sentence twice and see if you can manage to understand this very basic concept.

wrt the bold:

good so you will not have any problem with quoting the conversation that apparently is in this thread but no one else can see it?

[Piratecat]

Pirate is scum yes everyone knows it.

She had(has) a meta read on me and only played once before which is hilarious when you consider this conversation.

slaandar

I never want to play with you again. I think you are pretty terrible. the main reason I found you suspicious is because I did not think that you were

this

this horrible with your reasoning or be this bad. I really thought you were a good player cos in titanium you made sense. I didn't agree with you, but I understood the reasoning and still thought you were pretty good. <------ I deeply apologise for thinking that. obviously I was wrong. apparently this is...

normal

for you.

also my suspicions on you were not based on meta which is a sophisticated form of pattern matching although obviously that is not all there is to it. my read on you was based on an erroneous assessment of your skill level cos I had you much higher than you actually are. <----- again I deeply apologise for that.

[Piratecat]

hi

what they post doesn't look as scummy as what you post so I think you should be lynched over them. read this sentence twice and see if you can manage to understand this very basic concept.

wrt the bold:

good so you will not have any problem with quoting the conversation that apparently is in this thread but no one else can see it?

SOMEONE IS OBVIOIUSLY VERY VERY MAD. POOR PIRATEKITTY. I go after Buldy: I like you! Go after Mac and Qwints; grumble grumble i try hard 2 make u stoopid. Sorry for striking a nerve regarding these two. Secret side lover?

Hi, it's one page over. Look. Read. Enjoy life. I mean, I fucking specifically said "their last post" for jesus fucking christ.

Looking for some coherency any moment from you. I knew Mac was thinking of the wrong post (and I was mostly talking to Qwints, even though I quoted Mac) and I was waiting for him to actually get off his duff and search, but you are rather convicted on this one. Miaw.

so in other words the conversation never took place. that is what I thought. you were just making shit up.

I am not mad I am actually having fun sparring with you cos you aren't going to wilt under my aggression.

I do like you! I love feisty women.

[Piratecat]

I am done with the bitchiness. Let's just stop.

whoops spoke too soon

[Piratecat]

Well this is why we should have lynched Pirate

Lt. Minh Young Kim; 1 shot masonizer. I am conftown tomorrow.

no. this is why you should have done some legitimate scum hunting instead of the lazy pig-headed half-assed crap that you have pulled.

if I lose another game cos of your retarded trolleytracking I am going to never want to play with you again for a very long long time unless until you grow up.

jal and buldey for sure, maybe majiffy and probably the kernel as well cos they have both been off of v/la and have NOT DONE SHIT

[Piratecat]

where do you see this:

Hey, I'm sorta here. I don't know that I'll be able to read much of the last ten pages but I'll be available for deadline stuff.

in this:

Does anyone even know why they want to lynch me? That's an honest question, because if they do you can color me surprised. AP made a big deal about how I have shown a "subconscious need to rationalize [my] vote [on ANG]" earlier in the game, and mastin is of the opinion that every single thing I've ever posted was chock full of obvious scum tells that he doesn't seem to feel obligated to explain to anyone.

What about everyone else? Mac's vote was incredibly shit, with his only previous mentions of me in his iso being how he thought I could be Cryo's scumbuddy but Cryo was more likely to be scum. Coincidentally, this is pretty much exactly what qwints has done as well. These two scumfucks are also trying to paint my V/LA as being scummy somehow, even if it requires them to fabricate the timelime of my posts and when I went V/LA (in qwints' case). Buldermar is voting for me because PirateCat is on the Slandaar wagon(??). And who the fuck knows why PV and Bacde are on me, they sure didn't say so.


If anyone has any doubt in their mind that I'm not a scum-driven Slandaar counter wagon then they're probably dumb as fuck. I would be willing to vote Mac or qwints if I need to, but it's patently god damned obvious that Slandaar is scum at this point.

pedit: Actually, Jal is voting for me. She was kind enough to leave the reason up to our imaginations, though.

I mean, what you are saying is that you were referencing the post that I quoted in your "conversation" with marangala and can't because it does not exist. and now you are trying to say that you referenced the 2nd post I have on here but quoted the first post which is very clearly not in the second post.

so why are you lying?

[Piratecat]

no. this is why you should have done some legitimate scum hunting instead of the lazy pig-headed half-assed crap that you have pulled.

if I lose another game cos of your retarded trolleytracking I am going to never want to play with you again for a very long long time unless until you grow up.

jal and buldey for sure, maybe majiffy and probably the kernel as well cos they have both been off of v/la and have NOT DONE SHIT

Hey are you going to pull this crap on me as well when/if I out/get mislynched and you realize that you were silly to think I'm scum?

oh god you are such scum

[Piratecat]

I was going to use it on Mastin but yes I can use it on Pirate also.

If town we mason if not town I get a negative result.

I will be expecting your apology on the mason board

if there are any protective roles will you plz protect slaandar so that we can have 2 confirmed town to start the day off

[Piratecat]

slaandar, we will figure something out on the mason board to help give you some leverage in the event that I am killed. no matter how I feel about a player I always set those feelings aside when it comes to working with them as a team. I hope you are the same way. we figure something out just plz show up.

that is of course if you are town.

UNVOTE: slaandar

I would rather have a no lynch then to lynch 2 outed specials and I don't give a shit what other people think about it. I am pretty sure messiah is telling the truth and slaandar has a way to prove himself.

eta: xpost with messiah, I would love a buldey lynch

[Piratecat]

messiah I love you

[Piratecat]

VOTE: buldey

hey jal weren't you bragging that you could make flash lynches happen? here is your chance! help us bus your scumbuddy?

[Piratecat]

Is it that hard to follow a conversation, really? You are trying so hard to twist things I say. You are talking to the person who has been night killed because scum knew I could argue my way out of their bullshit.

Let's see.

Mollie claims that this post indicates that I don't pay attention to the thread:

Bleh the one thing about Messiah was that they came into the thread briefly and they didn't seem to even care about their wagon or notice it

. I'd think they would if scum. I really don't like either wagon and the whole thing coming to "pick between two" early was stupid.

and somehow proves that I didn't read this:

Does anyone even know why they want to lynch me? That's an honest question, because if they do you can color me surprised. AP made a big deal about how I have shown a "subconscious need to rationalize [my] vote [on ANG]" earlier in the game, and mastin is of the opinion that every single thing I've ever posted was chock full of obvious scum tells that he doesn't seem to feel obligated to explain to anyone.

What about everyone else? Mac's vote was incredibly shit, with his only previous mentions of me in his iso being how he thought I could be Cryo's scumbuddy but Cryo was more likely to be scum. Coincidentally, this is pretty much exactly what qwints has done as well. These two scumfucks are also trying to paint my V/LA as being scummy somehow, even if it requires them to fabricate the timelime of my posts and when I went V/LA (in qwints' case). Buldermar is voting for me because PirateCat is on the Slandaar wagon(??). And who the fuck knows why PV and Bacde are on me, they sure didn't say so.


If anyone has any doubt in their mind that I'm not a scum-driven Slandaar counter wagon then they're probably dumb as fuck. I would be willing to vote Mac or qwints if I need to, but it's patently god damned obvious that Slandaar is scum at this point.

pedit: Actually, Jal is voting for me. She was kind enough to leave the reason up to our imaginations, though.

But I obviously did read it, based on my conversation with Mrs M regarding how I thought Messiah's last post was scummy because they weren't around and did not claim in the last post (when they did come):

Messiah said they would be here for deadline stuff and isn't. Also, they didn't claim. If they knew they wouldn't be here, why not claim then? Ms M, where's the pro town in that?

Their last post sucked

.

But ho, reader! This doesn't make sense, as I already said, my post which she points out refers to this much earlier post of Messiah's:

Hey, I'm sorta here. I don't know that I'll be able to read much of the last ten pages but I'll be available for deadline stuff.

It doesn't make sense at all to take my conversation previously and call it scummy and think I am referring to the same thing later on by giving a reason by I think Messiah may be town. In the first post I used "last." By saying earlier in my last quoted post, I am obviously not refering to Messaih's "last post."

But all of this boils down to Priatecat's main argument: I am scum before I don't pay attention. She never questioned may bitching at Mac and Qwints, so one can assume she doesn't protest my claim against them. They should be scum too by that logic. By the fact she couldn't keep up herself, she is also undeniably scum now in her own light.

1. the part that I bolded is referencing the post that I said you had missed. that post did not "suck", there was not a sucky thing about it.
2. the part that I italicized was where you referenced his last post is a ginormous misrep of messiah's post that I quoted and said you had not read. cos he did care and he did comment on the wagon. you said

his last post

. so it is not clear

at all

that you were referencing the post that you quoted

cos it was not his last post

. so I am not the one talking bullshit here, you are, and all you are managing to do is dig yourself deeper and deeper.

[Piratecat]

I'm not disagreeable to a Bulder lynch, but I still think Slandaar's claim is far too easy to fake, and it hasn't changed my opinion of him.
Disagree with Mollie, a lynch - even a mislynch - gives us information which is something we are desperately in need of due to the number of inactives in this game.
Will be around all day for any last-minute shenanigans.

not if slaandar agrees to mason us and guess what - he did! we can try to work something out on the masonboard. we will have 3 heads on that board I am sure we can figure something out in order to clear him in the event that I am nked.

I rarely go for the mislynch for the same reasons you posted above but in this case I think it is worth it. we still votes to analyze on the 2 major wagons on town and that is something to work with as far as voting analysis and motivation. what we are doing here is bottlenecking scum's options and this will have a greater impact on the game I think. it really is worth the risk.

[Piratecat]

no. this is why you should have done some legitimate scum hunting instead of the lazy pig-headed half-assed crap that you have pulled.

if I lose another game cos of your retarded trolleytracking I am going to never want to play with you again for a very long long time unless until you grow up.

jal and buldey for sure, maybe majiffy and probably the kernel as well cos they have both been off of v/la and have NOT DONE SHIT

Hey are you going to pull this crap on me as well when/if I out/get mislynched and you realize that you were silly to think I'm scum?

oh god you are such scum

Mollie, you've never seen a scum tell from me (at least not what I know of)

.

I made a whole bunch of notes on my spreadsheet from the game that I gmed where you were...scum.

I've only ever lost a single game as scum, and you weren't a participant in that game. Every other game in which I've been scum, I've won. On the contrary, you have mislynched me as town before, thinking you have picked up on some scumslip. I don't make scumslip as scum, but I may make something that could look as scumslips as town because I don't particularly care about looking town as town (but perhaps I should). In summary, you're probably better off lynching me when you can't find a single reason to do so than when you think you have actually found one.

I have never mislynched you as town. you were town flailing in the KISS game so I was going for metal. it was jake that wouldn't budge.

and my reasons for wanting you lynched are very good. we are town and you are not.

[Piratecat]

Jal, what do I have to do to convince you to vote Piratecat with me?

so we have a way to

[/i]clear

[/i] us but you are still wanting to lynch us anyways?

why not just announce that you are scum and be done with it already

[Piratecat]

Oh jesus christ that is some horrible back tracking there, Piratecat. You don't even know what argument you are making and I won't be responding to that mess anymore.

Buldy, it depends. If we assume Slandaar town we should let him try to mason. What are your thoughts on Messiah's claim?

I didn't backtrack on a single thing. you tried through obfuscation and it failed. miserably.

messiah is town

[Piratecat]

@ KoC

let's flash lynch buldey gogogog

help me drum up some business

[Piratecat]

HEY EVERYONE LET"S LYNCH BULDEY!!!!

give me a B:

B

give me a U:

U

give me an L:

L

give me a D:

D

give me an E:

E

give me a Y:

Y

vooooooote buldey!

[Piratecat]

I don't like Messiah's claim, especially with there possibly being a cop.

Slandaar, so why are you off Messiah?

P-edit: No.

have the cop investigate messiah

problem solved

they should however investigate you though cos you are scummy to the core

[Piratecat]

To use AP town logic:

~Buldermar is probably going against popular opinion and making himself appear awful while doing so, Scum probably wouldn't do that and willfully gain negative attention on himself. There, he is probably town.~

I am moving my vote to Messiah. Everyone who wants to NL can just go ahead and do that.

VOTE: Messiah

I think it is sweet the way that you are trying to save buldey whom you supposedly only have a 50/50 read on

[Piratecat]

Also Mac, I see you checking out these forus over the night and not saying crap all.

so mac is probably town then

who the fuck needs specials when we have you to clear town left and right and help get us organised so well!

[Piratecat]

There will be no Buldermar lynch. Not today.

P-edit: Huk Yuk. Piece it together. It may take awhile.

that he is your scummate? I already did!

but just for shits and giggles riddle me this:

we already solved the messiah problem so why are you voting him?

[Piratecat]

slaandar plz work with me here, scum are on the ropes

let's go for a lynch scum everyday and vote buldey

[Piratecat]

Jal, what do I have to do to convince you to vote Piratecat with me?

You aren't voting PC so wtf are you talking about.

It's not too late to get a PC lynch. Anyone not inclined to vote one of the claimed players should move to PC now.

I wasn't supporting a Slandaar wagon to begin with and I believe Messiah's claim so he's out. I have no idea what the push on Buldermar is based on.

PC and Viomi are only two I'd support. I'm around all morning. I think we have less than 2 or 3 hours left.

^^^ third scum spotted

town has an effective way of dealing with me that does not include a lynch

it will clear me

but good try

[Piratecat]

Oh and also, why the fuck would you want the cop to investigate someone you think is town?

if you think messiah is scum, and I am assuming you do hence your vote and shitty fos, why would you

not

want them to investigate messiah?

xpost: VENMAR STOP BEING A TEASE!!!