Micro 152 - BSG Mafia (Galactica Survives?)

[Syryana]

Damnit how'd you know I was scum

Interesting.
VOTE: fferyllt
For not posting "Interesting".

[Syryana]

My apologies for my silence, I've been somewhat busier than expected this week.
UNVOTE: VOTE: Pitoli

I agree with orcinus and Sotty that Pitoli's #36 was terrible, fluffy, and irrelevant. There's plenty to comment on and she ignored all of it.

Well no FF did it last game when she was obvtown and I think it's townie that she's willing to uphold that belief despite whatever flak she might get for it.

I disagree with this being a towntell. Upholding one's beliefs is all well and good but I'm not inclined to give her a townread for it. I don't see any particular reason why she wouldn't refuse to give meta as scum, particularly since she's historically refused as town (according to you).

If this was a bigger game I would love to policy lynch Nero.

Very much this. My brief review of his last newbie game revealed him to be a terrible troll.

I was looking for a game where the two of you played. Reading the recent newibie game I see what you mean about unsubstantial. I'd say obfuscatory though trolly works, too. he was town in that game.

No. He was a Mafia Goon, if we're reading the same game. Newbie 1342.

Main (abbreviated) thoughts atm: Pitoli is lurky and fluffy, Nero is troll-y. Will be looking into fferyllt more also, some of her actions just seem off to me.

Pedit:

also let me tell everyone right now that i don't intend to write a colossal amount explaining why i'm town and why the person i'm voting is mafia. just trust me, i'm usually right.

You were scum in that game and I'm thinking you're scum in this one too.

[Syryana]

I just realized that there's a lot of noise about Pitoli's fluff post, but buldermar got no flack at all for posting a "checking in" during the midst of all this noise.

I should think the reasoning for that would be obvious. Buldermar made a single post saying essentially "I'm here." It's neither town nor scummy IMO; I'm treating it as null until we get more from him.

Pitoli's post on the other hand is neither a first post nor null; she comes in after placing an RVS vote with her inane question: "Why can't wagons be random?" It's terrible, fluffy and completely ignores the interactions between fferryllt and orcinus. The difference: Buldermar's post doesn't read like he's trying to post filler, Pitoli's does. If Buldermar continues to lurk, then we can revisit.

Checking in.

I want to PL you so much right now.

[Syryana]

Syryana: why don't you?

A few reasons. First, like Sotty said, this is a 9P game. We don't have a lot of room for mislynches. Second, I like Pitoli better for a lynch at the moment. Third, I have a gut feeling fferyl might be scum also thanks to some inconsistencies (need to investigate) earlier, so I'm not going for a PL on Nero when we might catch some actual scum.

If Pitoli comes back and gives me reason to not vote her anymore and my investigations on fferyl come to naught, then I'll consider a PL on Nero.

[Syryana]

People are being intriguingly free with their townreads this game.

[Syryana]

My, this game exploded since yesterday. First off:
UNVOTE:

I like Pitoli's responses because they seem genuine.

Investigation on FF: (I hate abbreviating to FF but I can't remember how to spell the damn thing every time)
I first got an off feeling on FF on Page 2. She got an incredibly fast town read on orcinus (in #21) then followed that up by sheeping orcinus on me (#29). The reason orcinus threw my name out there was clearly arbitrary (he even admitted to that later, #40) and she sheeps him anyways. Someone kindly correct me if I'm off-base here, but I don't see the town motivation in that. Furthermore, a cursory inspection of her meta along with analysis of her play here has proved one thing: Do not, under any circumstances, underestimate this chick. She is not the type to do something without a reason, so there's a reason behind her early orc sheep. I can't think of any town reasons why she'd do this, perhaps someone can enlighten me later.

Another point against FF was pointed out by orcinus in #81. She seems to be catching on to minor inconsistencies (e.g. orcinus contradicting his intentions w.r.t. Nero, pitoli getting flak but not buldermar, etc.). Now, IMO latching onto contradictions is not itself a scumtell, but latching onto minor contradictions that have reasonably apparent explanations is. For example, she complains that people are getting onto pitoli but not buldermar (#86), which has the immediately obvious explanation of "buldermar hasn't done anything questionable and pitoli has" (#88). Why is FF latching onto these minor things? Again, a situation arises where I can't think of a town motivation for FF's actions.

Moving onward. Not a whole lot of relevance from FF until we get to the 150's range (gods, orcinus and buldermar are windy bastards), where we have this post:

I expect to get lynched early as town more than is my "normal" at MS, in part because my play style evolved elsewhere and it's going to change as I get used to this site. changes are almost always suspicious in mafia. I think my insistence on earning my reputation here instead of importing it from elsewhere is also going to cause trouble, but I'm ok with that.

The above bothers the hell out of me. Out of all the games I've played, never once have I seen self-meta come from a townie. I read the above as an excuse to why FF's play is different now than it was in prior games (she essentially tells us meta-ing her is meaningless, through self-meta). Townies fight lynches to the death, they don't just go "Oh well, my playstyle is changing, so I'll probably be lynched early a lot now, whatever". Even if a mislynch occurs, the more interactions that person had before death gives the remaining town clues as to whom to lynch next. This passive "I'm gonna die, whatever" is very anti-town.

A great deal of her following "content" involves discussing other completed games. I treated this as filler. However, one point that stuck out for me is that FF justified her townread on orc by way of her impressions gathered from his play in a prior game (#183). I think that's a load of crock. I don't care if you've played 1 game with a person or a thousand; you don't get a townread that fast. If you assume alignment based off what you've seen from someone in a prior game, you're being very sloppy with your reads. Meta is a nice bonus, certainly. Early townreads based purely off meta are unacceptable.

Most of the rest of her stuff involves Nero and buldermar. The Nero vote and unvote (#230 and #235) seems manufactured. Nero's been trolling the entire game (and indeed, the entire time he's been on MS) and now she takes him seriously? Then decides to unvote 5 posts later due to a possible buldermar conspiracy theory? What?

In short, she's inconsistent and anti-town. Looking for possible partners.
VOTE: fferyllt

[Syryana]

Kara Thrace, the superstar Viper pilot who died, came back, led the fleet to Earth and killed countless Cylons is a vanilla townie? Pshaw. Vote stands.

[Syryana]

In the interests of giving you last interactions with people:
UNVOTE:

I don't trust Nero enough to leave you at L-1. I'll put my vote back if your final interactions don't change my mind.

[Syryana]

VOTE: buldermar

[Syryana]

Back. Catching up now. Have an update soonish.

[Syryana]

Alright, the orc/buld/ff spam has me a bit winded, but I got through most of it.

Thoughts: Lurker and deltabacon have posted nothing, so I got nothing. Lurker's vote on buldermar was totally random. Justification?

Vote on buldermar: After reading ff's claim and thinking about it, I decided that it's unlikely to be made up. Bulder's probably gonna shit on me for this, but I don't see scumFF dropping a name like Kara when pretending to be a VT. My first thought was "Kara Thrace, VT, lolnowai". Kat, Dualla, Callie, hell even Tori or Ellen Tigh would be a better name drop for a VT. She goes with Kara though, and the more I thought about it the less sense a scum VT claim would use Kara makes. Claim a PR or claim an obvious VT role, but claiming a great possible PR name and claiming VT makes zero sense from a scum perspective.

This led into my Buldermar vote. The guy went from WKing FF hardcore to now (if I'm getting info from his quotewalls correctly) wanting to have her lynched most of all. What most prompted my vote was his apparent obtuseness in dealing with her claim; he seemed to be twisting it to get her lynched at any cost. That and the 180 from WKer to guy with the rope was what prompted my vote at the time.

However, after leading the latest pages, I found FF's latest post to be most illuminating; detailing the paranoia/trust circle that's been going on between her, buldermar and orcinus. It seems to me that these three players know each other well enough (and have been spamming the thread enough) to be paranoid about being fooled by each other. Looking at these interactions from the outside, it's looking TvTvT.

Working under that assumption, I have: Lurker, Nero, deltabacon, pitoli, SafetyDance. Lurker voted Buld with no reasoning, love to hear justification. Nero's still trolling his ass off, with occasional not-anti-town posts peppered in for good measure. Delta hasn't said a word in 15ish pages. SafetyDance is null leaning town.

@Safety: Was that list of reads you gave serious?

I liked pitoli's responses to her initial wagon and I was leaning towards town, but I really don't like her #517. She calls me opportunistic scum for "voting buldermar as soon as available so it wouldn't look like I was backing off FF". That's an awful case. Opportunistic scum would have left FF at L-1 and waited for a hammer. Not only that, but scum backing off a case

to side with the person he made the case against

to lynch someone else with no votes on them is madness. Also, even though she says I'm a good idea for a day lynch, she doesn't vote for me. Feels like she's testing the waters with her case before she dives in and votes me.

In short, Pitoli, Nero or Lurker.
VOTE: pitoli

[Syryana]

Thank god somebody got it re Kara and the stupidity of a VT fake claim.

I don't think it's the VT claim so much as the combination of Kara and VT. I think as scum you'd be more interested in blending back in by presenting a more reasonable claim than that.

Of course on the flip side you could have done just that to make me think you're town knowing that it makes no sense to claim such as scum, but I'm trying not to let my paranoia get ahead of me.

[Syryana]

What do you think of my points about you/orc/buldermar, FF? Also about my points on pitoli.

[Syryana]

I like pitoli for a lynch today, or Nero. Pitoli's keeps saying these scummy things and Nero's one of the most anti-town players I've ever come across.

I'm not as sold on Lurker yet. I played a game with him before and he played a lot like he's doing right now. Want to see his justification on buldermar before deciding.

[Syryana]

That's awful nice of you <3

[Syryana]

After reading ff's claim and thinking about it, I decided that it's unlikely to be made up. Bulder's probably gonna shit on me for this, but I don't see scumFF dropping a name like Kara when pretending to be a VT. My first thought was "Kara Thrace, VT, lolnowai". Kat, Dualla, Callie, hell even Tori or Ellen Tigh would be a better name drop for a VT. She goes with Kara though, and the more I thought about it the less sense a scum VT claim would use Kara makes. Claim a PR or claim an obvious VT role, but claiming a great possible PR name and claiming VT makes zero sense from a scum perspective.

It makes perfect sense if it prevents you from getting lynched, which is what it presently seems to do. I'm inclined to just disregard it, but I find the fact that she's trying to use it as a town-tell on herself troublesome.

Though in general I agree that someone using the excuse that "I'd never do something that dumb as scum, so I must be town" is pretty alarming, it's honestly your presence in the game that moves me to think it's genuine. I don't see FFscum making a move like that when she

knows

you'd be all over her for it. Yes, it's still a WIFOM argument; we could go at this all day and not convince each other. I'm getting a gut town read from it though so I'd prefer not to lynch FF at this time.

This led into my Buldermar vote. The guy went from WKing FF hardcore to now (if I'm getting info from his quotewalls correctly) wanting to have her lynched most of all. What most prompted my vote was his apparent obtuseness in dealing with her claim; he seemed to be twisting it to get her lynched at any cost. That and the 180 from WKer to guy with the rope was what prompted my vote at the time.

I think this is a rather biased presentation. I never claimed to have a town read on her in the first place and getting tedious that you, her and possibly others insist that because I point out her skills it necessarily means I think she's town.

I never said you had a town read on her. I was referring to the number of times you pointed out her skills and that you used it as a reason not to lynch her. In my experience the more you get to know someone, the more they get to know you, and they correspondingly get better at fooling you. My reaction in a situation where a really good player I know is acting strange is paranoia, not "save her she's awesome and if we mislynch her we're losing such a great player." That's what gave me the heebie jeebies about your earlier reactions w.r.t. FF.

Syryana, my scumread on you was based on what I saw as your inexplicably floppy votes (ffery #276, and buldemar #313) since you offered zero justification at the time. You had built enough of a case on ffery and I didn't see the next page as warranting your sudden change of heart. I could see ffery's Kara claim as preventing you from wanting to lynch her immediately, but to change your read on her completely?

I'm less suspicious now that you have supplied a (kind of) plausible reason for the switch, but I'm hardly ready to call you town just because "only stupid/sloppy scum would make such a move" as you seem to suggest.

I'm not testing the waters. What do you want me to say? I'm sorry that my reads aren't more concrete? I tend to be a very reserved player and will second-guess myself, especially around more experienced players (such as yourselves), and unless I'm more sure, I don't feel like voting.

Hmm. It bugged me that you didn't vote me after making a case against me. Going back and seeing your only game on site, I see it's your style to not vote anyone until you're sure they're scum.

[Syryana]

I think the main problem here is that we've got zero good info from Lurker, Nero, Deltabacon.

Vote Count 1.16

fferyllt [3/5] - Deltabacon, Nero, buldermar
buldermar [2/5] - Lurker, SafetyDance
Lurker [1/5] - orcinus_theoriginal
pitoli [1/5] - Syryana

Pacifists (Not Voting): pitoli, fferyllt

-Angry P

[Syryana]

Sorry bulder look elsewhere we're PLing today

And just so you know, Nero lynch is also a PL because for him, intentional trolling may not be alignment indicative, only anti-town. Anti-town and scummy are two different things.

It's lurker or Nero, both I can dig if it really comes down to it, but lurker is my preference. Not a strong one particularly though

Or we could wait for lurker to be replaced and for bacon to come off VLA and for more info from Syryana (who I really need to reply to and I think has started giving some good points).

Oh and syryana is same alignment as fery because if fery town, syryana's suspicions look legit and I trust fery's read, and obviously if fery scum the interaction is too awkward for me to accept

Do scum have day talk?

Pedit: I like syryana

My main problem with Lurker is that I got him mislynched (I was scum, him town) in another game for doing exactly what he's doing here. He's great mislynch material because he lurks all game then under pressure shits out some awful logic. His lurking is about as alignment indicative as Nero's trolling.

[Syryana]

As long as you admit it boils down to pure WIFOM you've made a correct logical deduction that ff is yet to make. fwiw I can definitely see scum-ff make a move like this.

Yes, it is pure WIFOM. And I'm going from her site meta. I understand you've played with FF a lot elsewhere?

[Syryana]

Any suggestions on how to make it a more productive and less long-winded game day?

VOTE: Nero seems like a decent suggestion.

[Syryana]

In my opinion knowing that she's awesome is important regardless of her alignment.

While I agree that knowing a player's competence is good, your description of FF in the early game seemed excessive, to put it mildly.

[Syryana]

a pretty terrible one if you ask me

Good thing no one asked you then.

[Syryana]

In my opinion knowing that she's awesome is important regardless of her alignment.

While I agree that knowing a player's competence is good, your description of FF in the early game seemed excessive, to put it mildly.

That's fair, but I think most of you are still underestimating her. In particular, I think orc allowed himself to be manipulated into unvoting her due to a neat little stunt she made in which she suddently changed her opinion of me while insisting that she could have gotten me lynched if she wanted to and therefore must be town.

I will investigate this.

[Syryana]

Alright, enlighten me then: what changed your read of me so drastically if not hopes of not getting lynched?

Other than that, I agree that Nero should be looked at should you flip town. Actually IIRC I have a question to ask you specifically about Nero, I'll see if I can find it.

If my motivation were to not get lynched I would still be sledging you, because I think I could probably swing another vote or two your direction. My earlier interpretation of your posts may be wrong, but it's plausible and I felt sure a few hours ago that it was right. As town, losing that conviction takes away all interest in trying to swing another vote or two.

"I'm not scum because if I were I'd be trying to mislynch you still."

She does seem to have a lot of "I'm not scum because I would have done X as scum" doesn't she?

[Syryana]

It's a good point. I keep thinking that you'll take it as a scummy admission if I stop replying to you but I don't think you could possibly become more convinced that I'm scum. Maybe we could talk about something else? Like what it would take for you and orcinus to reach consensus on who to lynch? Or what inputs we need from quiet players?

You seem inordinately concerned about buldermar thinking you're scum. This also implies you're trying to tailor your actions to make buldermar think you're town.

[Syryana]

So why exactly are you voting Nero instead of lurker

Because Lurker's matching his townplay right now and he's provided more to the game than Nero has.

[Syryana]

EBWOP: *town-play I've seen from him

[Syryana]

So why exactly are you voting Nero instead of lurker

Because Lurker's matching his townplay right now and he's provided more to the game than Nero has.

I don't know about pt 1 but pt 2 of that post is a blatant lie

Hmm, you're right. I had thought Lurker provided more content than he did.

[Syryana]

I mean, my posting style from some of my early games has changed drastically so a comparison between this and an early town game would paint me as scum.

Comparison isn't valid.

Pedit: just vote lurker.

Wow. I just went and looked at Lurker's more recent ongoings, and

damn

his posting style has changed since the last game I played with him.

VOTE: Lurker

[Syryana]

Can you link to the game you are talking about, Syryana.

Street Racers

A lot of arguments regarding scumtells can be boiled down to WIFOM; but this one in particular I do not like. How do you know I would be on ffery's case for it as opposed to the other players here?

Um, I was talking about buldermar.

I'm sorry you don't have more meta to crosscheck me against. Actually, for my only game here that didn't get wiped out completely by server crash (Newbie 1176), I was scum. So you can toss that out.

How many Mafia games have you played, roughly?

[Syryana]

A lot of arguments regarding scumtells can be boiled down to WIFOM; but this one in particular I do not like. How do you know I would be on ffery's case for it as opposed to the other players here?

Um, I was talking about buldermar.

Oh gotcha. For some reason I thought all of #640 was directed at me, lol.

No. Only the last part.

Completed three forum games; one as town and two as mafia.
I play often in real life but get bored quickly.

So how would you characterize your town play versus your scum play?

[Syryana]

My main problem with Lurker is that I got him mislynched (I was scum, him town) in another game for doing exactly what he's doing here. He's great mislynch material because he lurks all game then under pressure shits out some awful logic. His lurking is about as alignment indicative as Nero's trolling.

According to the thread you linked, he was NKed on night 5. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p4796912

Aye. Shows his town play, which is pretty wildly different from the game I first encountered him: Open 481.

[Syryana]

ISO'ing SD.

[Syryana]

Yeah, I'm with Orcinus on this one. SD's been super aggressive against everyone for no apparent reason.

Also, there's this:

SD:
I'm universally town read and so is buldermar if you need to sheep, we're good targets

We have two prof lurkers in town, Lurker and Nero.

Fery is an experienced player with a good town game, claimed VT after getting to l-1, I don't want to lynch but buldermar does. I built case first (ill find it later), buldermar argued that fery shouldn't be lynched because she could be a boon to town. We've basically swapped positions since.

This is the thing,

why

? Because all I'm getting from fferyllt is a town read. So why are you two town? And I never blazeningly sheep for the sake of it.

Followed by:

SD: T->S list and your opinion on a syryana or deltabacon lynch

Scum in: buldermar, fferyllt, orcinus_theoriginal
Possible scum in: nero, Lurker
No idea: pitoli, Deltabacon, Syryana

Blatant contradiction. Nothing in his "in-between" posts justifies this flip-flop. Forgot he originally had FF as townread. Get the rope.

VOTE: SafetyDance

[Syryana]

Can you link to the game you are talking about, Syryana.

Street Racers

This is an ongoing game (note that it doesn't matter whether he is alive or dead in the game). I don't personally want you banned, but don't do this.

Ah. I posted it because he's dead in that game. It never occurred to me the game has to be totally over.

[Syryana]

I'll explain either if anyone else is interested, but I'm not doing shit for you.

May I ask what purpose you were trying to convey with that quote-wall?

[Syryana]

Reminder: please try to to be civil as much as possible. Also make sure not to mention other ongoing games

Thanks!

Lurker is due a prod in about 20 hours.

I'm so sorry about that. It won't happen again.

Can we get a VC please?

[Syryana]

Christ. Will you stop complaining about the amount of posts in thread or replace out.

Or we could lynch him!

[Syryana]

guys, don't lynch him

Your sources tell you he's town, Nero?

[Syryana]

Buld: put him to l-1 or give me your reasons why you aren't

I've been drinking wine and I still have unread posts in this thread.

wine-laced stream of consciousness. Thread needs more drunkposting.

This.

[Syryana]

Oh my.

[Syryana]

When I drunkpost everyone's all lynchy and serious. It's not fair.

Start drinking. Watching you and buldermar drunk post at each other would totally be worth it.

[Syryana]

I wonder what the record is for highest D1 page count in a micro game is.

[Syryana]

Also, more votes for SafetyDance.

Pedit: YOU! Post lots of content, stat.

[Syryana]

I don't see much in it, myself. Any vote by Nero is a null tell and Delta is supposedly coming off V/LA today, yes?

[Syryana]

I wish we had four or so more players so we could PL everyone that needs it right now.

[Syryana]

Lurker's occasional drivebys in the face of all the calls for participation are pissing me off.

This, and this, also this, THIS, ^, ThIs. And tHiS for good measure.

[Syryana]

Children, be nice.

[Syryana]

I'm becoming torn between SD and Lurker. They're both so.... lynchable.

[Syryana]

Jesus Christ, it's like you can't even take eight hours to go sleep around here. I leave you people alone and there's a dead person by the time I get back. For shame.

We had eight days left on deadline, you people couldn't have waited or even given things a bit more thought?

[Syryana]

Have you ever played mafia on another site before Syryana?

Yes, but it was a game between friends. Nothing on the scope of either this or EpicMafia.

[Syryana]

Don't forget about Lurker too, orc.

[Syryana]

I think the votes were just cast in the interest of gathering information as quickly as possible.

Um, waiting 2 days for Delta to get replaced/post (since he only came off V/LA yesterday IIRC) is kinda worth more than speedlynching a probable townie. Nero would have been a better lynch, Lurker/SD would have been a MUCH better lynch. Now we're saddled with trollface AND lurky mclurkerton pretty much permanently unless we get lucky tomorrow.

[Syryana]

Don't forget about Lurker too, orc.

Lurker's alignment is not impacted by SD's.

Why not?

[Syryana]

Mod Notes:
*Anybody else see the irony behind Nero rolling Miller

Indeed.

I find Nero to be a most curious NK choice. Maybe we can get them to NK Lurker too.

VOTE: SafetyDance

[Syryana]

I'll be out until late tomorrow. Vote on SD was due to I thought he was scum yesterday. Neighbor argument is interesting, will look at it more tomorrow. Unvote til I get chance to look at it in depth.

UNVOTE:

Why pitoli, orc?

And who dafuq is this Selkies?

[Syryana]

I could definitely see buldermar NK'ing Nero just to get rid of the irritation factor.

Point about SD being neighbors with Nero makes sense, but I don't approve of Mala's "well, neighbors usually have a scum in them, so SD is probably scum." SD was scummy yesterday for various reasons, but assuming alignment because of the neighbor thing is sloppy.

Still waiting on orc to expand on his pitoli scumread. I'll go ISO her in the meantime to see if I can figure out what he's talking about.

[Syryana]

As much as I like people who call me town, I hope you're not basing that purely off of Nero's ISO, that's just insane!!

You won't like me then. You're scum.
VOTE: pitoli

I have my reasons for this, which involve pitoli/me ISO and I will disclose in due course. I want to see orc's reasons first though.

[Syryana]

VOTE: Lurker

[Syryana]

Hey, SD. Out of curiosity, since you claimed Nero's neighbor and all, what's your flavor role? Fery was Kara, Nero was Baltar, who're you?

@Buldermar: Just because I think the Nero NK makes sense coming from you doesn't mean I think you killed him (yet).

I'll elaborate on my pitoli read in the next post I make. It's clear orcinus isn't going to answer me.

[Syryana]

I've town-read Syry but his reactions and reads are really bad, so I'm re-considering.

Do elaborate.

[Syryana]

Hey, SD.

Out of curiosity

, since you claimed Nero's neighbor and all, what's your flavor role? Fery was Kara, Nero was Baltar, who're you?

This is utterly irrelevant for every aspect of the game related to actual alignment.

Read the quote, thanks. Besides, he might be a liar depending on what name he claims. Like William Adama, for example, would never be a Gaius neighbor.

[Syryana]

... I hate you.

Why couldn't you use an analogy like I did? Huhuhuh?

Sometimes you have to hit buldermar over the head with things before he gets it <3

[Syryana]

I've town-read Syry but his reactions and reads are really bad, so I'm re-considering.

Do elaborate.

For starters you're wrong about me and your vote d2 (based on d1) is bad.

So being wrong about you is a scumtell? Also voting my greatest scumread (which I was also coincidentally voting when fery was mislynched) at the start of Day 2 when the PL material from Day 1 turned up dead is also a scumtell? Try again.

Pedit: A

Caprica

character? You're claiming a

Caprica

character?!?! Not to mention that said character was a bloody Cylon.

[Syryana]

Also
UNVOTE:

No hammers yet today, kthx.

[Syryana]

... I hate you.

Why couldn't you use an analogy like I did? Huhuhuh?

Sometimes you have to hit buldermar over the head with things before he gets it <3

I still don't get it, though.

FuriousFalcon is obligated to say that flavor is not related to the game. I'm personally not convinced this applies to the names of the characters. We have two confirmed town, Kara Thrace and Gaius Baltar. Their roles (VT and Miller Neighborizer) currently correspond at least superficially to their character roles in the show. I wanted to hear what name SD threw out there, because it's incredibly unlikely that certain names would be the neighbor of Gaius Baltar (e.g. William Adama, Laura Roslin). Nor would I find it likely that certain names would be town names (e.g. Brother Cavil, Simon).

That's why I wanted to know SD's flavor name.

[Syryana]

Bah, that came out poorly. I don't think this is a bastard game, and my apologies to AP for implying such.

Buldermar, I think there's a correlation between the role name and alignment. That's all I'm trying to say here.

[Syryana]

What do you intend to get out of massclaiming rolenames, Orc?

Pedit: It does, considering he had a Playboy model in his head telling him what to do.

[Syryana]

Which brings the question up.. Is SD actually town or scum? So far his character name makes zero sense and tbh I don't even know what she has to do with Gaius..

From the brief wiki research I did on the girl he's claiming to be (what a phrase), there's multiple instances of her (the real Zoe, Zoe avatar) and that the actual girl blew up a train. The avatar got downloaded into a body, becoming the first Cylon.

I don't really see how she would be neighbors with Gaius, since they never interacted in any way ever. Hell, they weren't even in the same series.

Pedit: Orc, how do you know this? The part about the neighbor QT?

[Syryana]

EBWOP: Unless you're referring to SD's entertaining paraphrase of the QT.

[Syryana]

Mala, you need to go watch BSG. It's all on Netflix. Shouldn't take you more than a day or so, if you're determined.

[Syryana]

.... Do you know how many shows I do watch?

Grey's, Scandal, Castle, OUAT, Chicago Fire, Survivor, The Voice, NCIS:RED(when it appears).
I'm currently watching HOUSE series.

Let's just say I once.. finished Grey's Anatomy.. 7 seasons in less than a week. >>

Then you shouldn't have any trouble with 3 small seasons of BSG, should you? Besides, judging from your list there you'll probably love it anyways.

[Syryana]

Bah, that came out poorly. I don't think this is a bastard game, and my apologies to AP for implying such.

Buldermar, I think there's a correlation between the role name and alignment. That's all I'm trying to say here.

There can't be if flavor is assigned randomly.

To clear up any confusion, when I said flavor was unrelated I mean whatever I write for updates.

Role flavor may or may not be relevant to the game, but I will guarantee the game is not breakable by flavor.

[Syryana]

I am Galen Tyrol, Deck Chief.

Popcorn Malakittens.

[Syryana]

Popcorn Lurker.

[Syryana]

Hey, bulder. What are you thinking about orcinus right now? Also Mala.

[Syryana]

Hey, bulder. What are you thinking about orcinus right now? Also Mala.

Still think orc must be town - even with him dropping in level of activity.

I havn't found a single good argument against Mala being scum. I don't like her initial reactions and statements - I think she was pretending to have read parts of the game that she at the time had not yet read, and I think she was pretending to make thoughtful reads when in fact she said some things that makes absolutely no sense.

I'll have to go back and ISO Mala. Could you do me a favor and go back and ISO orc for me? I'm starting to get suspicious of him and I want to know if you pick up on the same tells I am.

Pedit: Sorry, Mala. Lol

[Syryana]

I'm giving Mala a scum lean for making weird statements, taking them back, and generally being all over the place.
But not sure if voting her while technically V/LA is alright.

Funny that you would mention this now that I've just declared my intentions of voting Mala as opposed to mentioning it at any time prior to this. And funny how similar your reason looks to the one I gave.

Excellent point.

Pedit: Buld, Bill Adama is the biggest baddest m-fer in the whole show. If Mala really is him, she's a town PR.

[Syryana]

Hey, bulder. What are you thinking about orcinus right now? Also Mala.

Still think orc must be town - even with him dropping in level of activity.

I havn't found a single good argument against Mala being scum. I don't like her initial reactions and statements - I think she was pretending to have read parts of the game that she at the time had not yet read, and I think she was pretending to make thoughtful reads when in fact she said some things that makes absolutely no sense.

I'll have to go back and ISO Mala. Could you do me a favor and go back and ISO orc for me? I'm starting to get suspicious of him and I want to know if you pick up on the same tells I am.

Pedit: Sorry, Mala. Lol

Sure. Just this day?

Aye.

[Syryana]

Pedit: Buld, Bill Adama is the biggest baddest m-fer in the whole show. If Mala really is him, she's a town PR.

I think we made a mistake in outing flavor knowledge - I don't see how it could potentially have been helpful for town.

Not necessarily. Scum had to lie about their flavor, and I think it'll help us point out who they are. I'll elaborate when you get done with your ISO.

[Syryana]

That's what I noticed from ISO'ing him - what did you have in mind?

Gimme a couple minutes, I'm eating.

[Syryana]

Alright, here's my beef with orc. As you said, he switched his read on both you and SD at the start of the day. He somehow figured out SD was the neighbor of Nero almost as soon as the Day started. He equally quickly blew the Nero NK onto you and off of SD, because "why would SD kill neighbor lololol". He hasn't mentioned SD since, even though SD claimed the scummiest rolename in the game thus far (Zoe Graystone was a Caprica character, not a BSG character). He scumreads pitoli and has ignored repeated requests to give out his read on her until #1085, where he gave a half-assed read based on waffling and her popcorn choice. I also really don't like his "I'm busy, sorry guys, I'll just sheep Syr". I don't buy this after his D1 frenzy with buld/fery, nor do I think town orcinus swarmed by games would just stop giving a shit about one of them. I think he's civic minded enough to replace out if that really were the case (yes it's subjective, but it's a vibe I've got). I also distrust his "syr is obvtown, I'll sheep him" because I'm a paranoid bastard.

[Syryana]

I'm not 100% sure of SD's alignment.

vigbait

I kept coming back to this post when reading his iSo.

Why?

[Syryana]

Well if you put that in conjunction with his Roslin claim and my recent post, it seems like he was already planning to NK Nero and claim vig if he ever got any heat for it.

[Syryana]

That's in accordance with how I read it. My main issue is the fact that I really give credit to ff's reads, and she read him as town. If we pretend that he's scum, does this almost guarantee SD being his partner in your opinion?

The problem with this is that fery's reads stopped yesterday. I had him as town at the end of yesterday too, but some of his latest posts have caused me to reconsider. Fery didn't have that luxury.

I feel like you should have realized this already.

Also, his partner if he is scum would be SD... or you.

[Syryana]

I doubt that he changed alignment over night so if ff's reads were initially accurate, they necessarily must still be.

So, if SD is scum, how likely is orc to be his partner?

lolwot. lolWOT. LOLWOT.

So if he was town yesterday, he's town today? If fery was right about him yesterday, she's right about him today? Could you BE more banal? This whole statement of the obvious rests on the assumption fery was right and wouldn't have changed her mind about orc based on what he said today. Assuming fery's reads were right simply because she flipped town is very sloppy.

An SD scumflip implicates orc or pitoli. An orc flip would implicate SD or buldermar.

[Syryana]

Read in above post is past tense. I don't anymore.

I think I'm going to assume Buldermar town for a bit, even though the Nero NK implicated him heavily. I would be open to a SD lynch based in everything.

For neighbor, I have an excellent memory of game events. Remembering neto's awk talks about sd wasn't hard

So you want to kill Lurker or SD, correct?

[Syryana]

What changed your mind on pitoli?

[Syryana]

Buldermar won't like this

"Reread"

If that's in reference to your flop on pitoli, your most recent post about her (#1085) indicates you think she's scum.

So I ask again, why do you now not think she's scum?

[Syryana]

As much as I like people who call me town, I hope you're not basing that purely off of Nero's ISO, that's just insane!!

You won't like me then. You're scum.
VOTE: pitoli

I have my reasons for this, which involve pitoli/me ISO and I will disclose in due course. I want to see orc's reasons first though.

You can do this first

Going back through pitoli ISO...

Got a bad vibe off her early with the terrible RVS wagon comment. The responses she gave afterwards lessened my scumread on her, though looking back now she makes a point to mention she's newbtown in #232, which as of my latest experience has been more of a scumtell than a towntell. Waffles on the fery wagon, pulls a scumread on me when I changed my mind about fery being scum. Waffles on voting me after calling me scum.

I don't like her #576 where she says she didn't know SD was FoSing her. It just kinda comes off as "lol I'm a silly noob ignore me" post.

Blablabla, suddenly she has a scumread on SD. Hmm. More fluff later, she votes Nero. Well, so much for the waffling.

Fluff, fluff, fluff. Then HOLY SHIT #968.

As much as I like people who call me town, I hope you're not basing that purely off of Nero's ISO, that's just insane!!

I don't think Orc whiteknighted anyone... It seemed like yesterday him/Buldermar had some sort of functional coalition to decide who to lynch, but that's far from saying he whiteknighted him or even thought him obvtown.

Nero ISO makes her town? Where the hell did she get this from? Nobody was talking about her being town with Nero ISO.

Then Mala BS. This chick is way scummier than I remembered after going all paranoid on Orc.

VOTE: pitoli

[Syryana]

hi buldermar what do you think about all this

What do you think, orcinus?

[Syryana]

Oh wait malakittens

that doesn't work

let me think

I knew I forgot something.

Need to investigate Mala.

[Syryana]

Buld/Syr:

Who's your 'strongest' town read in pit/lurk/sd/mala

Honestly, Mala.

[Syryana]

Post #1065 » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:16 pm

Post #1071 » Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:13 pm

Buld

Does this strike you as odd? (you sort of have to view the posts to see what i'm talking about, it's the time gap between buld read my request for a massclaim and the time when he actually posted, I find it very suspicious)

Stand by.

[Syryana]

Post #1065 » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:16 pm

Post #1071 » Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:13 pm

Buld

Does this strike you as odd? (you sort of have to view the posts to see what i'm talking about, it's the time gap between buld read my request for a massclaim and the time when he actually posted, I find it very suspicious)

It is pretty odd. Considering you claimed two posts after the post he quoted, I find it strange he wouldn't be sure whether "we're doing this or not" until four hours later. Whatcha thinkin?

[Syryana]

Buldermar/lurker

Esp given buldermar's focus on Nero over lurker

Nero was a buld NK

I'd rather lynch Lurker over buldermar. Your case on buld is kinda shaky.

And what happened to your case on pitoli?

[Syryana]

I freely admit my case on buld is shit. sheep me onto the lynch we should've made d1 then.

As in where is it, or why did I end up retracting it?

What, Lurker? As I recall, you are the one that caused the D1 lynch to happen.

Also, both.

[Syryana]

My point was fery wouldn't have hammered herself if you hadn't put her at L-1. But anyways.

So, what did you think of my case against pitoli?

[Syryana]

My point was fery wouldn't have hammered herself if you hadn't put her at L-1. But anyways.

So, what did you think of my case against pitoli?

Well that first point is pretty bullshit. There's no point keeping a suicidal player in town, no matter how good a scumhunter, she was basically pushed to the point of so much frustration. I also felt that town was getting far too bogged up towards her. The fact that BOTH wagons yesterday were on town means that something is off (and on that note it sort of clears me as scum because there isn't a single reason why I wouldn't have pushed for a fery lynch). It's okay, she's learned not to do that anymore.

Fair enough.

[Syryana]

I know I said I would like to policy someone before, but I don't think lynching Lurker would give us a whole lot of information regardless of what he flips.

I'd be more okay with the suggested Syryana lynch today since his quickly voting fferylit and then buldermar in the span of one page - yeah that was tripping all sorts of alarms in my head. I think Syr didn't want to look like he was backing down on his possible ffery "investigation", but voted buldermar when he saw the chance. In regards to the ffery+Syryana team, eh it's a bit of a reach. I can't seem to put my finger on why, but ffery's posts still seem to lean town.

But I never like trying to call the scumteam on day one because probability says you're always going to be horribly, horribly off.

Syryana, my scumread on you was based on what I saw as your inexplicably floppy votes (ffery #276, and buldemar #313) since you offered zero justification at the time. You had built enough of a case on ffery and I didn't see the next page as warranting your sudden change of heart. I could see ffery's Kara claim as preventing you from wanting to lynch her immediately, but to change your read on her completely?

I'm less suspicious now that you have supplied a (kind of) plausible reason for the switch, but I'm hardly ready to call you town just because "only stupid/sloppy scum would make such a move" as you seem to suggest.

She calls me scum a couple of times, but never votes me. Called her on it, and she responded with that final sentence.

[Syryana]

Seemed overly flip-floppy and had some sketchy logic in it.

[Syryana]

You really need to be more specific

Are you accepting the rest of my comments and just zoning in on this minor point now btw?

Yeah, I'm seeing what you're seeing w.r.t. pitoli. I just remember being so sure she was scum when I wrote it :/

[Syryana]

Is the movie/series that the flavor is based on one about good/evil or some sort of two faculties that could easily be converted to this context?

BSG is about two factions: humans and Cylons. The Cylons are humanoid robots made by the humans, and they blew the shit out of the human colonies. The show is about the tiny human fleet traveling through space fleeing the Cylons with only the Battlestar Galactica for protection. However, it gets a bit murky near the end cause there end up being Cylons that help the humans and humans that help the Cylons and humans that end up being Cylons but help the humans anyways and all sorts of weird shit.

This is also why I'm highly suspicious of SD's claim. His character isn't even FROM the show, it's from a completely different one called Caprica, which was a terrible offshoot of BSG some couple of years later. This one was set way before the events of BSG. Shame on FuriousFalcon for even putting her in here if SD isn't lying, shame on SD for picking such a terrible flavor claim if he is.

P.S.: Mala, who are your scumreads?

[Syryana]

Yeah lol scum

VOTE: mala

Wait, what?

I was about to ask you to explain your vote. Then I realized it actually doesn't matter.

Wait, what?

[Syryana]

I've been thinking about this... What does it mean for characters like Galen and Saul, who are Ceylon but loyal to the humans as well? We can assume that their flavor makes them town?

My flavor actually never mentions the character turning into a Cylon later in the show. It just says I'm fiercely loyal to Galactica and its crew. I'd assume the same holds true for Saul Tigh, if Lurker is telling the truth about his role name.

[Syryana]

I have it!!! I have it I have it I have it!

I know who the scum are.

Look at the following list and you all tell me if you see it too.

Player List:

buldermar - Lee Adama
fferyllt - Kara Thrace (dead/confirmed)
Nero - Gaius Baltar (dead/confirmed)
Sotty7 (now SD) - Zoe Graystone
pitoli - Karl "Helo" Agathon
Lurker - Saul Tigh
Syryana - Galen Tyrol
orcinus - Laura Roslin
Deltabacon (now Malakittens) - William Adama

Two people on that list are lying about their flavor. Can you figure out which two?

[Syryana]

Wasn't helo a friend of one of the antagonists of the show?

I would say SD/Pit from a glance. Likely I'm wrong.

Anyways I watched one episode.

I'll answer once a few more people respond.

[Syryana]

Where oh where has my buldermar gone, oh where oh where can he be?

I wanna know if he sees what I see

[Syryana]

One thing I noticed.. There is certainly an abundance of Main characters in claims.

The secret is actually more basic than that. Keep looking!

Pedit: Because you don't need BSG knowledge to figure out what the lie is.

[Syryana]

If it's about Pitoli putting a nickname in her claim it's weak as hell

Nope.

[Syryana]

I'll give you a hint. We're lynching pitoli today.

[Syryana]

Very well. I'm tired, so I'll be brief.

The scum are pitoli and orcinus. They're the only ones whose flavor claims don't match their genders.

[Syryana]

Very well. I'm tired, so I'll be brief.

The scum are pitoli and orcinus. They're the only ones whose flavor claims don't match their genders.

For this to be the case, AP would have had to look into genders before distributing flavor roles...

Perhaps, but I find it hard to shrug off as coincidence the fact that 2 of the 9 don't match up when there are 2 scum.

[Syryana]

*shrug*

I'd prefer a Lurker lynch to Mala.

Pedit: You replaced in. Your predecessor was male.

[Syryana]

So anyone want to present a case to why I'm a good lynch. Still don't see it.

Don't look at me, you're not on my hate-list.

[Syryana]

VOTE: SafetyDance

Let me know when it's Day 3. I am so incredibly done with this game right now.

[Syryana]

Grumpy OMGUS over.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Lurker

[Syryana]

SD's diary was great reading.

Can I get scum QT?

Congrats to SD for making the right judgement, Buld played a great scumgame.

This. I thought Buld was town right up until the flip <.<

Well done, all!

[Syryana]

I think it was slightly swingy (obviously) in that both roles could land a hard guilty, but barring that neither was able to clear anyone if they didn't land properly.

Well considering Syr would've gone after me because of her night result...

Dude after all that anti-town shit Day 2, I thought you were a Maf role cop generating a fake result on Bulder haha.

Didn't think all the way through though, Ninja makes perfect sense in a watcher setup. Need moar experience!