Newbie 1356 (OVER)

[Paid Pyro]

SE #2 here.

Vote dexter9264

Named after a serial killer

[Paid Pyro]

Dexter, experience doesn't make you good at this game. All it means is some have played a few games before. I'm not very good but, by this sites standards I'm an SE.

Oh, hey hi DDDP. Been a long time. Have you decided to cut the town in half again? Half good half bad then lots of guessing/speculation ensues?

Vote Freshman

[Paid Pyro]

RC, So how about you do something other than complain.

Try not voting for yourself for starters, unless your scum, then hold your vote.

What are your thought on Mist's people better not sheep the IC's comment?

[Paid Pyro]

IF ANYONE ELSE VOTES MUTLEY WITHOUT A GOOD REASON, YOU WILL BE SCUM SUSPECT. THIS GOES DOUBLY IF ANYONE JUST HAMMERS HIM, ESP. IF HE FLIPS TOWN

I think we should seriously discuss the possibility of him being town or scum. Honestly, I'm null-leaning town right now, but my opinion is largely painted by how he reacted as well as his previous game.

I'm happy keeping my vote right where it's at thank you, (PS it's Varsoon) So if you are trying to find scum, why tell scum what is "scummy". I think you are trying to seem town by these statements but its not working.

[Paid Pyro]

I don't know your town. So why should I believe you, cuz you said so? How many times have you professed your townieness this game?

Wait I think we should take a straw poll of everyone here. Everyone should claim. I wonder what the response will be. So please explain why I'm scummy, because I do t trust you?

[Paid Pyro]

What are you smoking?

I call BS on you not pushing the mutley wagon. You posted a flat out dare. BS BS BS.

Oh, so by analyzing your bickering with DDDP clears you? Oh wait it was asking for people to UNVOTE you. Right, that must have been it. Sorry. Also, you BAIT was garbage and you know it. Again, so the whole agreement against mutley is him doing instantly scummy thing. So now that you've done it we should PL you next right. PL are crap.

DDDP, I'm thinking back to our first game. Worst mafia did this same very thing and he was town. I don't like this lynch it just too easy. I see him as town.

[Paid Pyro]

Hey DDDP, I think he's saying we're buddies. I guess we'll laugh it up in the QT later

[Paid Pyro]

So I'm scum bluffing AND scum all at the same time. Do I get an award or an achievement for this?

[Paid Pyro]

Prod dodge. Home for work (really busy week), will get on later tonight, after the kiddos are in bed.

[Paid Pyro]

Ok so I dropped a Spoiler down on a partial iso of Varsoon. I've left my comment out of the spoiler so they can be easily spotted

Spoiler:

I guess I'll have to agree to disagree at this point, mostly because our back and forth is a whole third of the game right now.

I would like to express two things, though:
I am town.
I am not an ally of Mutley's. In fact, I can't stand his posting style or how he's played the game so far. I'd probably have a vote on him now, if only to lynch him as a player, but I must put personal desires aside for what's best for town. I hope he's scum this game, so that if we lynch him, it'll be all the better.

1. He is very quick to claim town. He has one vote on him but he's professing he is town. Right or wrong, it's early and entirely unnecessary.
2. His next line is a soft push. I read this as I'm not a fan so I think I'll vote him, hope he's scum.

Spoiler:

Vote: Mutley

Seriously douchebaggy style of play, not working towards town win condition, just trying to get himself a meta.
Or can he be replaced? I don't want to play with one potential town acting scummy all game so that he doesn't look scum when he is scum.

Very tempted to put a vote on him to lynch his playstyle, too, but Policy Lynching usually turns up town. :/

I'd rather get some real scumtells out of people.

Now here is some distancing from a potential lynch? I understand the drive to move away from a PL but this was 4 posts later, and you are changing your tune.

Spoiler:

What the hell is a meta? You guys take things more seriously than the other game it's only 3 pages of inactivity! Lighten up! Definitely looking at mist though as possible scum. Seemed an easy vote for a scum covered up in crappy reasoning. Trying to get a easy day 1 town lynch.

A meta is when a player plays a certain way over a series of games so that they can argue that it is simply their playing style.
For instance, I tend to be very thorough and I voice when player's personalities rub me the wrong way.
If I ever get called out on that, I'll tell them to look at my previous games and realize that's just how I play.

I do think that one person with a vote on you is scum.

So in the next post is the vote count:
Mutleyddmc [L-2] - Zoggoth, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Mist7676

Per Varsoon he believes one of: Zoggoth, DDDP or Mist is scum.

Spoiler:

IF ANYONE ELSE VOTES MUTLEY WITHOUT A GOOD REASON, YOU WILL BE SCUM SUSPECT. THIS GOES DOUBLY IF ANYONE JUST HAMMERS HIM, ESP. IF HE FLIPS TOWN

I think we should seriously discuss the possibility of him being town or scum. Honestly, I'm null-leaning town right now, but my opinion is largely painted by how he reacted as well as his previous game.

I've already posted my comments about this post. So he's already claimed one is scum on the mutely list. Now if anyone else votes or hammers they would be scum also. Why as town would you alert scum to scummy play? In fact I see this as him signaling his partner not to vote. He's feels Mutely is leaning town, but want's discussion about him being scum? He's fence sitting here. Playing the middle to gain credibility depending on which way everyone sways.

Spoiler:

Well, Paid Pyro, since I know that I am town, I know that people levying baseless arguments against me are more likely to be scum than other players.

So, by saying something like I did just earlier, or making other intentional missteps

, I'm inviting scum and town speculation.
It's helped me get better reads on people so far, and your reaction was pretty genuinely scummy.

1. Here he is claiming town again, with one vote? I'm not sure what's prompting it. I see this as "the more he says it, we the town just my believe it"
2. My agruement wasn't baseless it was "Based" on my feeling of your post.
3. Vasoon admits to intentionally posting something scummy and when I call him out on it attacks me

Spoiler:

I don't know your town. So why should I believe you, cuz you said so? How many times have you professed your townieness this game?

Wait I think we should take a straw poll of everyone here. Everyone should claim. I wonder what the response will be. So please explain why I'm scummy, because I do t trust you?

You should believe that I'm town by evaluating all my posts so far and understanding that all of my motivations have town's interest at heart. When the Mutley wagon was started, I didn't slam my vote on another player in response, nor did I push the mutley wagon even more (although I could, and I could even hammer him at this point, but I won't, because I'm not scum and I'm not sure he's scum either). The point of playing town is to scumhunt and to make plays that are at town's best interest.

You're scummy because you fell for the bait. You were quick to make accusations of me, because I didn't jump on the wagon like everyone else. It's a scum tactic. Should scrutiny fall on me later, I'll be sure to defend myself and prove that I've got town's best interests at heart. If you were simply scumhunting, my earlier replies would have been enough to vindicate me, and if this reply doesn't do it for you, then you're truly grasping at straws.
The fact that your response to being called out as scum isn't to vindicate yourself, but to call me out even more as scum is pretty trashy, too. If you're town, stop making such baseless accusations. It does nothing for town.
You'll probably advocate a Mutley/Varsoon scumteam if it'll get lynches, because it seems like I'm defending him. Mutley could flip scum this game, but going from how he played his last game, and how he's playing this one, I'm less sure of him being scum than I am of other players who don't have such an outlandish playstyle.

The way I see it, Mutley should give us his reads right now and make a case for why he isn't scum.
Hopefully, it's more than him hammering himself like he did before.

- More town I'm town.
- He's pretty sure Mutely not scum
- how is me questioning you not scum hunting?
- He says twice in this post Mutely probably isn't scum but asks for a case for why he isn't scum? If he believes he's null / town and pushing me, why does Mutely have to make a case for why he isn't scum?

Spoiler:

Hey DDDP, I think he's saying we're buddies. I guess we'll laugh it up in the QT later

Scumbluffing is not a town tactic.

Didn't he just say earlier he posted something scummy to get a reaction, and it was "town motivated". How is it when I do it it's not? Varsoon is continuing to argue both sides of the fence again.

Spoiler:

sorry should have posted it before. So when I joke about being scum its harmful to town. When pyro does it its fine and not the same?

This. There's a fair deal of hypocrisy in this game.

Wow we have a bunch of uptight people in here 4 pages prob about 15 posts by me and that's too much and harming the town. Nice....... Can't see how in 4 pages anyone could possibly actually be 'harming' the town. If I had only posted once or twice. Would you guys have had some huge leads then? No it's day 1 with 4 pages.

For me I'd say mist is my only mafia target at the moment. Covering it up by calling it a policy lynch etc even though its 3 pages in etc. just mafia covering for poor reasoning really IMO.

In terms on that meta thing varsoon I would really care enough to do that. Every game is different and I'd never actually look at other people's previous games. As while they could be useful I am sure people do that to trick people. They say oh look that's what I'm like etc or act different to their advantage. Eg they could say look how I was when I was scum in this game nothing like I am in this current game etc

I disagree, it's quite easy to completely alter the flow of the game within the first four pages. I wish that players would realize RVS isn't eons long and ends as soon as anyone makes worthwhile plays and that, as a pro-town player, people should try to make such plays.

I'm leaning scum on Mist, too.

I also agree that meta'ing a player is a poor method of ISO'ing them. People will play differently under different circumstances and assuming a modernist approach to identity simply doesn't work in a game of rhetoric that has every player review their words before posting them.

As far as your other posts go, I wouldn't make such personal attacks on other players regardless of alignment.

I'm fairly certain RadiantCowbells is town, and I'm leaning town on you, too, due to your responses.

Regardless of Mutley being scum or not, everyone shouldn't forget that there are two scum players in the game.
I suggest we find good evidence of another one--one who is likely on Mutley's wagon.

As far as thinking things over, just hit preview before you submit. Re-read your post, and if you've thought of new things to add, do it then. That way, you don't clutter discussion with several posts back-to-back. I'm guilty of this, too, though.

- So this is a great post by Mutely. Varsoon chainsaws his argument to say the rest of the players who voted Mutely are hypocrites. I seem to recall him arguing both side of the fence earlier.
-Mist leans scum
-RC lean town
-Again says someone on Mutely's wagon is likely scum. They are: Mutleyddmc [L-1] - Debonair Danny DiPietro, Mist7676, dexter9264, Zoggoth

Spoiler:

I'd like to hear from Zaggoth and DDDP on why they still have votes on Mutley, and if/why they think he should still be the D1 lynch.
Especially since neither have posted much since voting on him.

I'm suspicious of Mist, especially since she seems so adamant to keep this wagon rolling. Could just be town doing the whole scumhunting thing. Mist, how do you feel about lynching Mutley D1--do you think it's stupid to have a player at L-1 when two of the votes on him were parked there and the players who made them (DDDP and Zaggoth) haven't posted since? What do you think will happen if he flips town? What if he flips scum?

-If Mutley is at L-1 and he thinks Mutley is town why is he asking for their case again. I think he's soft pushing for a lynch here. He didn't hammer because he could at this point and is looking for an excuse.
-Mist is leaning scum

Spoiler:

As of now, I am not convinced that Mutley is scum. Why?
He hasn't led a wagon on a single player, nor has he strongly advocated lynching anyone.
The only player that he's given a scum-read on is Mist, but his vote is still parked on Shaboos despite it seeming more like an RVS vote/reaction test.

Honestly, he's done the most pro-town work so far, because by scumbluffing like he has, the other players have responded in a myriad of ways. Even if he is scum, this has given good reads and taken the game in a solid direction that was necessary during RVS.

Regardless, I wouldn't rule him out as scum so quickly, but I'd prefer to lynch a scum-candidate whose flip would do something more constructive for the game.

-Varsoon now decides Mutley has been pro-town by scumbluffing. Scum bluffing before was not town aligned. He's flipping again. Again distancing himself from the potential lynch.
-Wait, at the end of this post did he give ONE more soft push. He still could be scum.

Spoiler:

Good reads, Zoggoth, this is a good example of how to produce reads and what they should look like.

With that, you're definitely more town in my book.

Right now, I'm largely null on most of you, leaning town on Mutley, Mist, Zoggoth, and DDDP.
Leaning scum on Paid Pyro, and with the points that Zoggoth made about Dexter, I'm suspecting him as well.

-Mutley wagon less dexter is now leaning town? What happened to one on mutley's wagon is scum? It took Zoggoth to point Dexter out? And with one post Varsoon goes from Mist leans scum to Mist leans town. In my opinion he is completely fence sitting again. He trying to stay neutral with the game so he has fall back positions.

[Paid Pyro]

Because the pressure on me makes no sense and no town in their right mind would confirm intent to hammer based on the logic given by the three votes on me thus far.

You want out of this game, right?
Better start working on doing a good job of being town, and real fast.
Currently, this response is pretty OMGUS and base-covering if anyone does express intent to hammer.

Have an L-1, it'll help town more than the content you've produced so far.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

This is bad guys.

Don't LYNCH RC.

I think she is town also.

Why does Varsoon put someone who he thinks leans town at L-1? He is scum.

MORE VARSOON VOTES!

[Paid Pyro]

I'll say it here, just in case I happen to forget to some other time.

If you guys do decide to build a wagon on me,
and you actually lynch me,
when I flip

(scum)

, keep in mind that it was Pyro who, in boldface, asked you to do it.

Here let me edit your post for you.

[Paid Pyro]

I'm fairly certain RadiantCowbells is town, and I'm leaning town on you, too, due to your responses.

Varsoon: "fairly cerain" RC is Town

I'm not so sure about the Radiant-lurk-scum idea.

I've checked the thread a few times without replying, too.
Nothing's happening and lots of people are inactive.
Does this make me scum?
Hardly.

Varsoon: Defends RC wagon

DDDP, thanks for the pressure, actually got me to bust my butt and find a computer to get on. (I'm assuming it was pressure)

RC's acting weird. His arguments against mutley, as well as the entire mutley wagon made sense, but now that mutley's actually trying to post content and get involved (versus making the scum-slip jokes), I don't think policy lynching him D1 would be beneficial. I find the game lacking in scum reads right now though, especially with the multey wagon still being disputed.

I'm fine with leaving my vote on RC at the moment. Start playing or get replaced. (I'm not sure what the replacement procedures are. Just PM the mod I guess)

You seemed to react pretty quickly to the 'pressure' put on you, despite being absent for so long.

Anyway, I agree with your points on the RC lynch

, but Policy lynching is always a dumb idea. Always. Let her replace out, and if the replacement gives us scummy content, then we can lynch. As of now, it's just too easy a wagon for scum to push, too.

Varsoon: Likes to pressure RC to play, but too easy of a wagon for scum

Because the pressure on me makes no sense and no town in their right mind would confirm intent to hammer based on the logic given by the three votes on me thus far.

You want out of this game, right?

Better start working on doing a good job of being town, and real fast.

Currently, this response is pretty OMGUS and base-covering if anyone does express intent to hammer.

Have an L-1, it'll help town more than the content you've produced so far.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

WHY PLACE A TOWN READ AT L-1? Where does his opinion change. Also look at the bolded. This is a slip in my opinion. If he thought RC needs to be at L-1 and scum why ask RC to work at being town?

Guy's please unvote RC at this point. I really think Varsoon is scum. He's the one we should be voting.

[Paid Pyro]

Wait didn't Varsoon say earlier that whoever puts someone at L-1 is scum?

Notice how no one hammered RC?

In the span of 36 minutes.

[Paid Pyro]

Paid Pyro's logic is solid and I find little wrong with it.
At the very least, Varsoon should defend himself.

Vote: Varsoon

Nice OMGUS and hop onto a wagon to distract from attention that's on you now that you're L-1.
Instead of defending yourself, I should do so, right?
That's a deflect, and quite the slip considering that Pyro came in and put a vote on me and mentioned how he didn't agree with your wagon in his post. That's either scum-team or serious buddying.
Either way, your play isn't very town.

What points would you like me to defend myself on, though?
Do you have any questions of your own?


Haha, you're squirming pretty hard, Pyro.

Keep squirming.

While RC, who I still think is town, hasn't replied yet, I've gotten plenty out of you.

VOTE: Paid Pyro


Welcome back to the thread.

@ Anyone: can you spot the blatant contradiction between these two posts?

[Paid Pyro]

Mutley, shab's replacing so how about you hop on the Varsoon train, until a replacement is found.

@Zogg and Mist, why are you not voting at this point? Who's you top candidate and why?

[Paid Pyro]

Mutley, why is pressuring RC to contribute ideal after Varsoon's L-1 antics?

RC, if you haven't found it yet, serene forest, is a good fan site for FE. They play mafia there also (FYI). How many games have you played here and offsite?

Welcome, Freezeing-hell.

[Paid Pyro]

Totally admitting to tunneling hard on Varsoon. My last few post have been to start working out scum #2.

[Paid Pyro]

@Everyone and MOD. I may need a VLA until Thursday. I'm traveling for work and didn't check if the hotel has free wifi.

[Paid Pyro]

Acknowledging prod!

Hey guys m back. Mist, I think Varsoon is scum read my post #156. I haven't seen anything different, which would change my opinion.

Those who aren't voting, why?

[Paid Pyro]

I have the real urge to hammer.

At least ask him to claim. Prior to Hammering.

If he is truly town he's been rather cool about it. Their isn't much survivalistic desperation from him.

[Paid Pyro]

Zogg, why are you not voting. You have had all day to formulate opinions and reads. Why the hesitation? To should have your vote on your top scum at this point. If its Varsoon and you don't want to hammer yet, it should be on your number two. Not voting is not an option (if your town).

[Paid Pyro]

Alright, gimme awhile to recoup, sleep, wake up, look over the thread, and make a good argument towards my townhood.

Until then, please don't lynch me. I don't think town gets much from just lynching town.

How hard is it to claim? It shouldn't take this long if you are truly town.

Zogg, did I miss your vote?

[Paid Pyro]

Honestly, I could see RC as scum easier than I could see Mist.
We've only got 22 hours left, though, and the flip would help me better gauge DDDP, FH, and the other fence-sitters in this game.

Vote: Mist

Mist'll flip town, though.

Tunnel alert. He's positive she's town yet votes her. This guy is scum. Votes here please.

[Paid Pyro]

Honestly, I could see RC as scum easier than I could see Mist.
We've only got 22 hours left, though, and the flip would help me better gauge DDDP, FH, and the other fence-sitters in this game.

Vote: Mist

Mist'll flip town, though.

Tunnel alert. He's positive she's town yet votes her. This guy is scum. Votes here please.

Keep squirming and trying to line up lynches, PP.

You're so scum it pains me, but I'll spend Day 2 making my case against you.

Explain how this is lining up a lynch?

Oh wait read your response!!!! You know you'll be here tomorrow. I don't know if I will. Eat rope scum!

[Paid Pyro]

Honestly, I could see RC as scum easier than I could see Mist.
We've only got 22 hours left, though, and the flip would help me better gauge DDDP, FH, and the other fence-sitters in this game.

Vote: Mist

Mist'll flip town, though.

Tunnel alert. He's positive she's town yet votes her. This guy is scum. Votes here please.

Tunnel alert. You haven't said anything about any player other than Varsoon for what's probably about two weeks. And Varsoon's obnoxiously wrong honesty is probably a towntell, scum don't generally say they think they're lynching town, they come up with a reason to pretend the prerson they're votinf is scum.

If I'm around tomorrow, I have more. But Im not going to compromise my vote. Cost me in a game a long time ago. Hmmm,, you remember? However, we'll have more info tomorrow (how ever is around) to process info.

[Paid Pyro]

Newbie 1356 - Vote Count 1.14

---

Varsoon [L-1]

- Paid Pyro, RadiantCowbell, Debonair Danny DiPietro, freezing-hell
freezing-hell [L-2] - Mutleyddmc, Mist7676, Zoggoth
dexter9264 [L-4] - Varsoon

Not Voting (1):

dexter9264

With nine alive it takes

five

to lynch.

---

Deadline:

(expired on 2013-04-24 20:00:00)

Not twilight. I believe this is still accurate on the countdown.

Mist, I don't know if I'll be night killed. I Will have to wait but I'm sure not going to assume I'm going to be here along with someone else.

[Paid Pyro]

@mod I think you missed mutley's UNVOTE

post #425

Everyone has me as town now Ffs. Definitely dying tonight now.

I don't actually think mist is in my top 2 scumminess players right now. Ill unvote and think more if I want to be on this wagon tomorrow.

unvote

Mist and ogg, do you really think holding out for FH is the play today?