Newbie 1393 Game Over

[FuDuzn]

VOTE: DDDP

When in doubt vote the person who hammered you in a game when you were town and cost town the game.

/notbitter

[FuDuzn]

Notscience, how dare you leave the DDDP wagon.

I am filing that away for future reference.

[FuDuzn]

I had this post ready to go literally just as the site crashed, thank God I copied it before it crashed:

Veg, your reason isn't random but you didn't really give a reason why you voted me.......and then asked me why I wasn't commenting on your vote......which gave no reasoning.

And know you are basically making up things.

VOTE: Veg

[FuDuzn]

Actually, oops!

That post was supposed to be for another game.......

Mod plese remove post 43

Sorry, just so excited to post again!

[FuDuzn]

Tbf Notscience, a lot of players refuse to do rvq. I wouldn't go nuts trying to get people to do it.

[FuDuzn]

Cynical, why do you still not have a vote down?

[FuDuzn]

My voting of DDDP was initially a rvs vote, but I am keeping it on him until he posts some actual content.

But to answer some questions about the IC, he is a regular player just like anyone else. He is here to give general advice, but if he dies he is gone like anyone else.

[FuDuzn]

Notscience, what exactly did feel it do to make it feel like a personal insult? The game of mafia is people accusing each other of things, some things are true and some things are false, but that's the game. You basically are mad at feel it for playing the game, so man up a bit.

And actually, with you sheeping my call out of Cynical(and omgus'ing him at the same time), I think you are being fake more then needing to man up.

So which is it?
VOTE: notscience

[FuDuzn]

Sorry about that, I got caught up in two other games and need to get caught back up in this one.

I will make a actual post with content hopefully later tonight.

[FuDuzn]

I will make a actual post with content hopefully later tonight.

It appears hope has been lost.

Lol, sorry I got home from volleyball and was just dead tired. At work now and hopefully tonight or worst case tomorrow afternoonish I will make a legitimate post.

Scouts honor.

[FuDuzn]

I am not making excuses, I have been posting from my phone almost exclusively the past few days(including now) and the one night when I was going to check in on my computer shower then sleep took precedence and I don't want to make a catch up post from my phone(done it before, too much of a pain in the ass to do it again). Real life sometimes can get in the way a bit of mafia.

I don't think I have anything going on tonight, will catch up and make a proper post then. I said I would by today and I will.

[FuDuzn]

First, it is FuDuzn......I think it has been a conspiracy that everyone on this site spells my name wrong lol

Second, are you voting me as a prod or do you think I am scum? Or is this just a pre emptive sheeping(sounds like an oxymoron I know)?

Third, on my computer. Gonna catch up and post some thoughts.

Andddd......Go!

[FuDuzn]

Woah, got pretty scared at the site crash!

God damnit we lost a lot of responses. People, post opinions on mine and dessew's debates.

I think what FuDuzn means is that any posting activity at this point is helpful, but just because you do so it doesn't make you town?

Yes, that actually is exactly what I meant.

It's intresting that

notscience

asked what people think about no-lynch (#25). No-lynch always bad for town execpt in very specific situations like mylo. So anyone wanting to go for no-lynch is either poor player or scum. This was a weird move to ask peoples opinion on thing like this.

Scummy move from

Feel It

to ask (#46) why we don't want to put people to L-1 in random voting phase. Might not be dangerous in other games but in newbie games a new player might hammer recardless of aliagment. This could mess up the whole game.

What? I have Feel It's 46 quoted just above this, he didn't mention anything of the sort. Did you mean a different post, or is that a serious misrep?

Asking it is interesting. Answering yes to it is either poor or scummy. Just felt like he was sizing up the competition. Again nothing to do with alignment.

You can size me up any day, baby.

Now I like to have fun with a lot of my posting, but this was all fluff a zero content when we are clearly out of rvs. Not a fan of this but in a newbie game I wouldn't see scum being this comfortable to make a post like this.

I had posted earlier, but it looks like it got ate in the site crash sorry guys.

I think that the exchange between notscience and Dessew comes mostly down to a misunderstanding in terminology, but I also think that Dessew backtracking looks pretty sketch. It may have been a slip of the tongue, but his word choice was very interesting to me.

In regards to activity correlating to alignment, just because someone posts frequently doesn't make them good or bad. In fact, someone who is town could post a lot of bad information and have that be potentially more dangerous to us in the long run.

There are rare occasions where no lynch is acceptable, but I feel 98% of the time no lynch is a very poor play. It's also a pretty basic ploy to get newer players to mess up.

Cynical, why do you still not have a vote down?

I am very new to forum posting stuff, so hopefully this turns out all right...

Vote: notscience

I agree he has been posting frequently while saying very little. For now, I am going to vote for him. I was just waiting to see what developed bandwagon-wise, etc.

DDP, can I get a clarification on a facet of your role as IC? If you die, are you no longer able to help the newbie players out?

I feel like those trying to bandwagon DDP have targeted him as an experienced player. Removing him under the guise of a bandwagon could be a convenient early play.

Okay, you want me to do stuff?

VOTE: Cynical

He essentially just sheeped Feel it's reasoning and placed that vote in an attempt to blend into town. Atm, he's also trying to say a wagon that was established in RVS is a ruse to eliminate the IC, and yet does not elaborate on the people on the wagon, and choses to vote someone else. Admittedly, I was on the Danny wagon, but I was the FIRST on the wagon. Note how that's not in his reasoning for voting me, only reasoning brought up be Feel it is. Not to mention, they say they targetted him as an "experienced player" when the people who were on his wagon were primarily the SEs.

Feel it, I'm taking that as an insult and will ask you not to make comments such as that more please. You're riding my ass for not posting content when other people are doing the exact same thing and not getting called out for it.

Exhibit A) Danny
Exhibit B) MVM
Exhibit C) You yourself up until that post had no content whatsoever

Fu, what call am I sheeping? The fact that I used something you did and his reaction in my case=sheeping?

You want to say I'm scum feel it? Go ahead. Don't care. I'll be over here trying to catch actual scum.

I find it insulting when he depicts the entirety of my play as posting a lot without actual content.

Tell me Feel It, because you seem to be a

professional

on my meta, do I post like this as town or scum, and provide proof of it to back your claim up.

I haven't had content based on everyone else posting so little and essentially RVS, so it must be I'm sucm, the two must not correlate.

Here, I'll ISO so You get that content that you say I'm lacking

DDDP has done jack and yet I'm apparently worse than him

Dessew has posted a crapton and hasn't done much of anything other than debate with me and ask if someone read every post on page 2

Feel it, as much as he pisses me off is looking town thus far. He's asking questions and getting involved in stuff. Still hasn't had a lot of content pre-this debate.

Fu- he says I sheep'd him and I don't see any sheeping whatosever, misrepping to the max as well as quick to jump on the wagon outside of RVS makes him possible scum. I'd bet it more if Cynical wasn't on this wagon, as scum like to have 1 on 1 off every wagon, but I'll come back to that later.

Cynical hasn't done anything but according to Feel it neither have I so I can't say anything

mvm hasn't done anything and see above for the rest of this line

Smudger looks logical, nothing indicative of either alignment

Z7 is town just for calling out Feel it's bit about L-1 and the derphammers.

Happy, or is this just another low content post that doesn't appease you?

Ok, this was a thing. Starting with Cynical making a post somewhat calling out notscience but not voting for him, seems a bit odd that he would do that so I politely ask him about not having a vote down, suprisingly enough I guess he was ready to vote him just needed a prod(?). Then notscience responds and goes a little faux batshit insane(that is right, I don't believe his anger was genuine). Tbh I have seen scum buddies fight like this in newbie games, I don't want to make that leap quite yet but struck me as interesting nonetheless. And I this point I feel very good with my vote on notscience, but then we fast forward and look at this little nugget.

How would you guys feel about lynching mvm? I don't think any of us have a read on him due to his inactivity. Even if he is a town, for the rvs it might do us good to lynch him simply because he isn't being very helpful or productive. I also am leaning towards scum on him.

Danny, can I get a little bit more on why you don't like Z7 other than he makes you feel uneasy? I know it's Day 1 so there I don't expect incredibly detailed answers, but your reasoning is a little vague.

Smudger, I echo Feel It's thoughts on your accusation. Why single him out for not contributing specifically? I feel that he has contributed a fair amount. And Smudger, when you say Z7 should be higher than me, do you mean he should be more towny or more scummy?

I'am with notscience (#102) concerning

mvmafia

. That guy really needs to come to this game. Passivity without reason is scummy and because he is posting to two other games beside this means there isn't a good reason. But HopefullyCynical is little to eager (#104) to lynch him on just these bases. I would agree that we should at least put some votes on him, but never lynch people without hearing them out.

VOTE: mvmafia

Ps. Right side is the scummy side on my scumometer (tm) So currently I'am getting bad vibes from DDDP and Feel It. But most of this is just a gut feelings at this stage. There have been some small slips but nothing I could use for a solid case.

Scumometer (tm)
HopefullyCynical < Smudger < Dessew < FuDuzn < notscience < mvmafia < DDDP < Feel It

Personally I think mvm's passiveness is a null tell, he's a lurker in general and it looks to me like he's gonna be scapegoated into an easy lynch.

Stating at you are posting from phone or that you have real life urgencies are (by definition) excuses. I'am not judging are they good or bad or real or made-up but they are excuses. Real life sometimes comes in way of my mafia games and I completely understand that. Only thing I have problem is promising something (like posting) and not doing it.

A couple things here Z7, MVM and I were both lurky in this game at the same time and MVM even said that he was vla.....so why does his lurking seem scummier than my lurking? and if you don't want him lynched then why do you want to start a wagon on him? And why not then start a wagon on one of the two people you have listed as scummier on your scumometer? Could it have something to do with that you don't think you could get them mislynched, so easier to go for the lurker? And I said I would post by today, and I am. I am never a big fan of lynch all lurkers, bad scum hunting strategy imo. But this goes beyond that, and basically admit that MVM isn't actually scummy.......just easier to make it seem like he is.

UNVOTE: VOTE: Z7

[FuDuzn]

Oh shoot, forgot to give reads as well.

Basically Z7 is my top scum read, followed by notscience and Cynical. DDDP and Dessew are both null to me, Dessew leading a bit more towards the scum side of null since he seems too afraid to make a mistake. I lean towards MVM being town, though admittedly it is partially because of the people who want him lynched. Feel It is my most solid town read.

[FuDuzn]

I think you might be scum for your interaction with Cynical and your overall fakeness to your posts.

And I don't understand the second paragraph, I never said Z7 was lurking. But about the second point, I don't like mvm's vote on me either(more specifically the reasoning), but I want to hear more from him. Hence why I was asking if his vote on me was anything more then a prod vote.

But Z7 has been much more scummy then anyone considering all available info.

[FuDuzn]

What comment did I make about mvm's lurking being worse? Thought is was similar to mine.

Also yes, you being pissed off was part of it. Your omgus towards cynical was just strange and your anger seemed forced, you just had a reaction that seemed off to me.

[FuDuzn]

FuDuzn, what do you think of Smudger?

Jeez, my lack of a read on him should tell you how much of an impression he has made lol.

Seriously though, after a quick iso he has pretty much said some things but really has said nothing.......from my count doesn't even have a vote down. He(clearly) has flown under the radar but I get a 'quietly pulling the strings' vibe from him.

[FuDuzn]

Why does Z7 lean town to you?

[FuDuzn]

Now I like to have fun with a lot of my posting, but this was all fluff a zero content when we are clearly out of rvs. Not a fan of this but in a newbie game I wouldn't see scum being this comfortable to make a post like this.

why do people do this,” If I was scum” I would not do this? WIFOM much?

I never said 'if I was scum', just saying that in my experience playing newbie games I haven't seen a newbie player act like that as scum. Most newbies don't get that comfortable that early in a game as scum.

Also, Feel It only asked me about you(smudger) because I had inadvertenly left you out of my reads. I don't know why that would be a 'thing' to point out about Feel It.

And Dessew, on my post 149 I totally did not say Z7 was lurking. That post was about how he was going after lurkers.

[FuDuzn]

*cough* Hello? I am in this game as well right?

Also, so part of your reasoning to vote DDDP is him quoting Goodfellas?

[FuDuzn]

Dessew, about your 204......what did I miss that you asked me?

[FuDuzn]

*cough* Hello? I am in this game as well right?

Also, so part of your reasoning to vote DDDP is him quoting Goodfellas?

Do you agree with a goodfellas quote explaining why he wanted to build a wagon on someone ?

I thought he was just making a jokey sort of post using the Goodfellas quote.

And I am with you on Z7 mvm, but since I wasn't explicit in asking you before........why did you vote me when you came back from vla? That is the one thing that is making me doubt you.

[FuDuzn]

Fu:

Well, in #150 you stated that mvm is your no. 2 townread. I asked you about your argument.

Z7:

I know it's not fair but let me guess: mvm didn't give his read about FuDuzn because there isn't enough content to have one.

Well tbf Dessew, I don't think I have him there anymore. After looking at his vote on me I am starting to agree with the argument against him, I just can't think of much of a town reasoning behind that vote.

[FuDuzn]

Umm, unless I read it wrong deadline just passed.

Disappointing that mvm kind of flaked on this game.

[FuDuzn]

Notscience, why are you trying to make somethings out of not really anything? HC is bringing up a good point, when you have a couple flips it is good to look at interactions the dead players had.

And about dddp, again I will say this, lurking in itself is not an alignment tell. You and Z7, at least yesterday he was, keep going after the 'easy' targets.

And Dessew, is this still about my mvm read?

[FuDuzn]

After a very quick iso of feel it he was riding notscience early on then switched to smudger, but he seemed a bit more concerned with just getting a lynch in then hardcore scum hunting(not a knock on him, once a flip or two occurs it does become easier for me to scum hunt as well).

I for one am still weary of the people that pushed on mvm simply because he was lurking(z7 I am looking in your direction).

[FuDuzn]

Then who is the other scum if they wanted Feel it off their back?

Notscience, why do you continue to badger HC about him bringing up good analysis? It is like you are trying to discredit him because he hasn't figured out the scum team yet.
VOTE: notscience

[FuDuzn]

First off, really stupid question because I feel I should know it, but what exactly is a chainsaw?

Second, you are looking for an absolute answer to a question that is extremely tough to answer without a scum flip. Unless you actually think HC is scum.

[FuDuzn]

Ah ok, thanks for explaining chainsawing and wk(I have heard of white knighting before).

But again, I feel as if you are nitpicking his posts in an attempt to discredit. He proposes a theory based on factual info we have gained, like 'hey guys, how about we look at this?'.

And when he doesn't give a solid response you will just keep badgering him about it how he couldn't deliver. You are trying to strongarm him so his scum hunting looks weak.

[FuDuzn]

When I say severe omgus I was talking about my own, you clearly don't take a joke

so, here's the question. Is there 1 stupid townie on me, or 2 stupid townies on me?

See you are making my point here, notscience. All you have been doing is trying to discredit people when you don't like the direction they are going in, in this case voting for you. It is natural to get defensive with votes on you, but you aren't providing any substance to why votes on you are stupid or providing any substance on who would be a better lynch besides you. All it is from you is 'people who are voing me are dumb' and then nothing else.

[FuDuzn]

Seriously smudger? That is about the most anti town thing you can do, if you aren't scum then I don't know what to think.

And judging by notscience's reaction I am guessing he is town.........

[FuDuzn]

Dessew, thought I made myself clear. People were going after mvm simply because of lurking, but I had seen nothing scummy from him and I don't see lurking as a scum tell in and of itself. I tend to find a lynch all lurkers mentality is often pushed by scum on Day 1, hence why I was and still am suspicios of Z7.

Smudger, between not really explaining why you quick hammered notscience(calling him annoying is no excuse) and your extremely defensive omgus-isng to Dessew understandably questioning you I think I would be confident on a vote on either you or Z7, given all that has happened I am growing confident you are scum and I am not going to go back on my first instint in regards to Z7.

[FuDuzn]

Lylo = Lynch or lose, if we don't lynch scum today then it is game over and scum wins.

PR = Power role, any roles that isn't a vanilla townie(cop, doc, jailkeeper, etc).

Smudger, you seem surprised that people are questioning what you did as possibly being scummy. The fact is that there is no town focused reason to do what you did, even you were a cop with a guilty on notscience it is still anti town to quick hammer like that.......and obviously we know that wasn't the case.

And what spotlight am I shifting away?

Hello pot, I would like to introduce you to a kettle.

[FuDuzn]

Smudge, care to link us to what you are talking about in regards to Dessew.

Also, are you trying to figure out pr's? I say unless there is a cop with at least one guilty then you shouldn't go outing anybody. Though I could see a mass claim working here, if Z7 was not vla for awhile though.

[FuDuzn]

Popcorning works best when everybody is active. The way it is now Z7 would have to go last and that totally defeats the random purpose of popcorning.

But I disagree with Dessew and say there is really no need to wait on any potential reads and breadcrumbs you may have found.

And I think Dessew asked, and thought I was clearer before, but I still lean towards one of(most likely both) Z7 and Smudge as scum and HC my one top town read. Dessew has floated around in the null zone most of the game, partially based on omgus since I don't understand why he keeps bugging me about mvm.

[FuDuzn]

Dessew, yes at the time I was more suspicious of HC and part of that was tied to mysuspicions of notscience. As Day 2 progressed before the quick hammer I was seeing what I thought was strong town vibes from HC(also strong scum vibes from notscience which I guess influenced my town read). I still believe that all things considered HC is the towniest.

And I will make it simple, there was heat on mvm simply for lurking. It is not a n alignment tell and since there was a call for his lynch I saw it as scum motivated, therefore mvm is town. It did start to change after he came back, but I still wasn't comfortable lynching him.

[FuDuzn]

When is the last time HC posted?

I don't want this to drag even with two people on vla. I know we can't popcorn, but a quick question. If you were forced to vote someone right at this second, who would it be? For me it would be Z7.

Pre Edit: Okay HC posted yesterday

[FuDuzn]

I won't be near a computer until at least Sunday so I can't really give detailed reads. But, my read on Z7 is based mainly on him going after mvm on Day 1 and my read on Smudge is based off of his quick hammer and how he has reacted to the suspicions on him today.

[FuDuzn]

Jesus man, firstly I am all in favor of popcorning but I wanted Z7 to be back to ensure he is guaranteed to go last and to ensure the randomness of popcorning. Please don't subtely twist what I am saying into some scum motivated ploy. We don't popcorn until Z7 is back.

And how is 369 scummy? I explained why part of my town read on HC was the interactions with what I thought was scum notscience, it wasn't wholly dependant on that and the impressin I got from HC after that back and forth was town.

And please explain why you are witholding your reads(and ironically calling my reasonings weak)? You keep say you have some great info for town but won't share. Explain town motivation here.

[FuDuzn]

We should wait for Z7's reads then we need to decide who will start.

[FuDuzn]

I am also vanilla town.

Smudge next.

[FuDuzn]

Why are you implicating me here Smudge? Dessew wanted me or Z7 to go first, why not mention Z7? And I chose you after me since in popcorning you choose who your biggest scumread is, basically everything you are saying can be applied to Z7 as well(yes I am saying Z7 is scum with whovever is lying). I think you definitely thought this out, but this is everything scum can do to try to find pr's as well(including searching for breadcrumbs, which is something I avoid doing as a pr for this very reason).

I want to hear from Dessew.

[FuDuzn]

I am not going to vote yet for the very reason you just stated Smudge, I don't want to choose wrong and scum swoop in for the win. I also will not quick hammer as soon as someone as soon as someone is at L-1(obviously). And tbh I am not sure where to go with my vote when it comes down to it. Smudge you are bringing up good points about knowing the setup and knowing what to do in case there are claims, but this is something scum would do as well in regards to fake claiming. Basically that whole argument doesn nothing for me in regards to proving you are town and proving Dessew is scum. On the othe hand, Desse seems like the type who would cover all his bases as a town pr so he could do the very thing youh are doing, and it seems like he is really trying to discredit you. Problem is that also isn't alignment indictive, he could just as easily be frustated townie trying to convince us idiots or a lying scum using snottiness as a weapon.

Basically, neither of you are convincing me either way right now.

[FuDuzn]

Well since talking to Smudge and Z7 is clearly pointless since they clearly, and effectively I will admit, pushing the mislynch(I say this with confidence now since Z7 is going all in only now that he sees that HC is leaning towards voting Dessew and Z7 can just fully commit now).

HC, and I can't believe this just hit me, hasn't Smudge been pushing for you as scum most of the game? The same Smudge who has clearly been following breadcrumbs and pr tells all game just so can be prepared for this situation? You don't think he didn't have a pretty good idea you were a pr while he was trying to get you lynched?

Seems a bit strange right HC?

[FuDuzn]

Oops, also.
VOTE: Smudger

[FuDuzn]

He has said he thinks I am scum, which if you read my last post makes sense(pretty clear now to me it is Smudge and Z7).

[FuDuzn]

Well firstly I never thought he was scummy throughout the game, he wasn't super townie but he seemed to poke and prod in ways that indicate town. Plus it involves some PoE(process of elimination), Z7 has been a top scum read of mine pretty much all game and when he just flat out said I was scum while voting Dessew it made the writing on the wall pretty clear, from my perspective at least.

Circusmstances have dictated that Smudger is much more likely scum then Dessew.

[FuDuzn]

Z7, how would scum quickhammer Dessew? You are voting him and Smudge is voting him(is he?) and we all know HC isn't scum. Even if Smudge hasn't voted Dessew yet I would think HC would know not to vote anybody until everyone else has voted. I am not voting him because he isn't scum, you and Smudge are.

So you are basically making things up now and by talking in absolutes(FuDuzn is scum) you are trying to really convince HC to support the mislynch.

[FuDuzn]

Well no shit, but saying that he(and I) are scum because he hasn't been quick hammered is quite frankly an outright fallacy.

[FuDuzn]

See this is the thing, I can say the same thing about you.........the exception being I am telling the truth.

You haven't given any reason why I am scum, and barely a reason why Dessew is scum. There has been reasons why you are scum and documented truth that Smudge wasnted HC gone even as he was furiously hunting for PR's. It all just adds up that you two are scum.

[FuDuzn]

VOTE: Z7

Or maybe he did and obviously I am not scum. Think about that?

[FuDuzn]

I just really felt that given all the actions that you and Dessew made throughout the game you were scum, probably over thought things a bit thinking you looking for breadcrumbs was scum motivated. And Dessew really never did anything scummy up till that point, one of those situations where logic was clearly telling me you were scum, clearly my logic was way off.

[FuDuzn]

Way to lose the game for town Smudge

[FuDuzn]

Jk, clearly I was scum. I wish I hadn't gone all in yesterDay, thought I really could push HC to vote you Smudge.

My apologies to Dessew as well, thought I could have done something more to save him.

Ah well, good game everyone and see you around.

[FuDuzn]

Sorry Feel It and DDDP, my pr hunting apparently is off since I thought I saw signs of breadcrumbs from both of you. Ah well.

And Smudge, well played after your bad quickhammer of notscience. In a weird way that was the turning point that lead to a town victory.