Mini 1464 - Game Over

[Haschel Cedricson]

His role PM

[Haschel Cedricson]

Haschel has read

[Haschel Cedricson]

So he confirms

[Haschel Cedricson]

In the thread

[Haschel Cedricson]

BURMA SHAVE

[Haschel Cedricson]

I think we all know what everybody is thinking right now.

Vote: Feel It

[Haschel Cedricson]

If you do

[Haschel Cedricson]

Not like my rhyme

[Haschel Cedricson]

The reference may be

[Haschel Cedricson]

Before your time.

[Haschel Cedricson]

BURMA SHAVE

[Haschel Cedricson]

Looks like we've lost some posts, which is unfortunate. As some of you may recall, mnemonicdevice had just voted for Zhero. Care to give us an explanation?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I believe that question was directed towards mnemonicdevice, although looking over my phrasing I guess that was only implied instead of implicit.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Er, that last word of my last sentence should read "explicit."

[Haschel Cedricson]

I always find it strange when somebody answers a question that was intended for another player? Don't you think mnemonicdevice is a big boy capable of answering his own questions? Why does he need you to answer for him?

At any rate, I would like to know why you assumed it was an OMGUS vote, but I don't want you to answer that until mnemonicdevice explains the real answer.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Don't know how to try to get an archive somewhere, but I can throw up part of my tracksheet.

Spoiler: Pre-crash game state/votecount

(the

is me, other abbreviations should be self-explanatory)

Unofficial Pre-Crash Vote Count

Captain Corporal (2)

- Daemon385, pitoli

Feel It (2)

- Monkeyman576, Haschel Cedricson

mnemonicdevice (2)

- N64Lord, Zhero

N64Lord (2)

- Toomai, mvmafia

Daemon385 (1)

- 2birds1stone

Haschel Cedricson (1)

- Captain Corporal

Monkeyman576 (1)

- Feel It

Zhero (1)

- mnemonicdevice
2birds1stone -
mvmafia -
pitoli -
Toomai -

Not Voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

I am assuming that votes and such got rolled back with the lost posts, but people might still have wanted to see this.

Unvote

Vote: Toomai

Scum trying to look like helpful townsperson, methinks.

*raises eyebrow* Bit of a random assumption?

Did we lose any other posts aside from mm voting Zhero?

Mnemonic asked everybody a five-question survey. I believe the questions were:

1) Why did you pick your username?
2) Are you scum?
3) What is your favorite Mafiascum game?
4) Don't remember this one
5) Do you think I (HC) did the Burma Shave thing just to be annoying?

A few people answered with varying degrees of helpfulness, and there was a minor discussion about whether random questionnaires are scummy or not.

I think that's everything of note.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Now the thing is, is that Zhero's response was deleted to my questionnaire, which was my main vote change reason. I also just wanted to see how he would react.

What specifically about his response caused the vote change?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Thanks for the reminder.

Now answer the question in post 47.

[Haschel Cedricson]

tfw my vote is lost
VOTE: pitoli

And how does that feel? I'm assuming tha "tfw" stands for "that feel whe(n/re)".

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote: mnemonicdevice

.

Your question-dodging has been noted and judged accordingly.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Is pitoli a better vote than your previous vote?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Now you're doing what you voted pitoli for doing.

[Haschel Cedricson]

If I'm reading Toomai's chart correctly, you voted for MonkeyMan.

At any rate, while your response tells me that your first vote isn't a fruitful avenue to travel down, it technically didn't answer my question about pitoli, so let's try again.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Now the thing is, is that Zhero's response was deleted to my questionnaire, which was

my main vote change reason

. I also just wanted to see how he would react.

Sorry, my response didn't post to 47.

Mostly my Zhero vote is an OMGUS

, because he voted me. I also want to see his reaction. But apparently that isn't happening.

Yeah. That was another reason. I just felt like I didn't need to add that again, and I don't remember what your response was, for it was deleted.

First of all, if my main reason for voting for a player was their crappy response to a question, I think I would remember at least the basics of their answer 24 hours later, especially if it apparently made a strong enough impression to vote for them a SECOND time after the first vote got deleted.

More importantly, however, you are lying about Zhero's response to the questionnaire. As Zhero pointed out, his answers were basic yes/no's, even on questions that did not merit a yes/no response. Admittedly, his survey answers were pretty much useless and in a vacuum might merit a vote. However, we are not in a vacuum; there was a second player who gave equally useless answers to the survey. Again, normally not a big deal, because you can only vote for one person.

In this case, however, that second person was myself... and you were already voting for me! If you REALLY had objections with Zhero's response, then you should have had the same problem with me and not moved your vote!

Your claimed reason for voting Zhero is fake, and so are you.

[Haschel Cedricson]

In response to

what

about the questionnaire?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I keep this stuff behind the curtains every game I do, and

why would I make information more available as scum?

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT

See that squiggly "?" symbol that some people have been placing after sentences? Oh, look, there's another one right there. Anyhoo, it's called a "question mark" and it's used to indicate that a question has been asked. When you see one of these "question marks", you should see if the question is directed towards you, and if so, answer it!

[Haschel Cedricson]

PUBLIC APOLOGY ANNOUNCEMENT

It appears that Toomai's question was directed at 2birds, not pitoli, and as such my sarcasm was excessive. Sorry 'bout that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I thought pitoli was ignoring a question, and I tend to get worked up over that sort of thing. Then I made my post and realized I was mistaken, as not only had pitoli NOT been asked the question, but if she HAD answered it I would have attacked her for answering a question intended for another player.

Hopefully that answers your question.

[Haschel Cedricson]

@Zhero: you voting me is not necessarily scummy. We are still in RVS/RQS stage, and so voting me without a good reason isn't a tell either way. How is initiating a RQS a scumtell?

@Feel It: Nevermind, you did answer the question.

@HC: your not doing a good job of convincing anyone that your town.

First off, we left the RVS stage a long time ago.

Secondly, I'm not trying to convince anybody that I'm town; I'm trying to convince everybody that you are scum.

Thirdly, that being said, pitoli and 2birds have both said that they think I'm town and nobody has called me scum, so it appears I AM doing a good job of convincing people that I'm town.

[Haschel Cedricson]

VOTE: feel it

let the wagon start!

Really now?

Really

really?

[Haschel Cedricson]

You skipped post 101.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Toomai

: I simply wanted to let him know that his actions were causing me to be suspicious.

Which actions?

[Haschel Cedricson]

1.I am the doctor. I figure I am going to get lynched anyways, so I might as well roleclaim

Not buying it. I think it's more probable based on your behavior that you're trying to force a counterclaim.

Also, if me and Pitoli were a scum team, like most people seem to think, and her posts in my defence were her coaching me, why would she do it here, instead of talking through mafia chat.

I don't recall anything saying the scum had daytalk in this game. Why would you make that assumption?

Haschel I dont like because of reasons stated before..

No, you haven't stated reasons before. You have literally stated no reasons as to why you don't like me, and when I specifically asked you in 133 to elaborate, you COMPLETELY IGNORED THE QUESTION YET AGAIN.

Frankly, I don't care about his claim; mnemonicdevice is so scummy that I feel comfortable lynching him despite the claim.

[Haschel Cedricson]

By the by, just to cut off any speculation, I will unequivocally state that I am not the doctor.

[Haschel Cedricson]

wow lots of to read i've got to catch up here.

MD on L-1 claiming doctor so soon ? strange.

Is there scum at his wagon ?

What do you find strange about it? And what do you think the answer to your latter question is?

Gotta read pitoli too. She just jumped at my random vote under pressure.

While pitoli may have been under pressure at the time, your random vote was horrible and I too would like an explanation.

[Haschel Cedricson]

2. I think probably yes. Mainly if we lynch him and he flips doc.

That's some hard-hitting analysis right there, chief.

I'm asking what you think NOW, before we know the flip.

Also, did you know if you highlight part of a post and press the quote button, only the part that you highlighted will be quoted?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Doesn't the scum having daychat make coaching in-thread useless? That really makes no sense.

This point is partially why I'm avoiding the Pitoliwagon; the irony is that if the daytalk thing WAS a scumslip then some of the reasons Pitoli was suspicious go away. In addition, it seems to me that the Pitoliwagon is largely (I acknowledge not entirely) built off of the assumption that Pitoli and mnemonic are scumbuddies. In cases like this, I never prefer to lynch the suspect that is merely linked to the scummier suspect.

NicCage is a fresh summer breeze compared to his predecessor. I would like him to be more specific about his feelings on Feel It; I find post #170 to be incredibly pro-town.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Assume that mnemonic actually is the doctor. Scum would either a) kill him tonight, or b) leave him alive and try to push a mislynch on the grounds that a real doctor, being unprotectable, would have been killed and therefore mnemonic is lying. By actually mentioning this possibility out loud, it makes it much less likely to actually happen. If Feel It is scum, he just unnecessarily limited his teams options for tonight/tomorrow.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Who'd you protect, mnemonic?

Vote: mnemonic

[Haschel Cedricson]

... Why did we lose two townies?

Excellent question. What theories do you have?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Is it best strategy wise to tell who I protected?

Yes.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I figured that he was going to be the most likely kill during the night, I dunno really.

What made him a likely kill?

[Haschel Cedricson]

It's not me, it's obviously not MonkeyMan, and I strongly doubt it's 2birds1stone.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Ok have read through and here is what I am picking up.

mnemonicdevice's post at 156 should be taken on board at this stage and the question asked about the order of those she felt should be lynch. While a lot of what she is saying here could be regarded as subjective and based on gut as opposed to experience. This should not be overlooked and also be looked at in conjunction with Infintiy’s posts to compare any possible links. And there is one thing that stands out and that is HC.

HC sits on MDs list towards the top, why would this be of note well shortly after MDs claim the following happened. Zhero and CC unvoted immediately with Feel It following with an unvote shortly after that. Others continue to discuss it but HC stands out as flatly refusing to believe the claim and, as MD points out, HC has been tunneling on MD up to that point. Another who did not believe was Toomai who described it as a null tell, and then elaborated with a brief outline of why he would think that 177, Immediately After this 2B1S unvotes.

You know, I don't mind if people think I was tunneling on mnemonicdevice*, but it seems to me like you're placing an undue amount of weight on MD's list.

*I would argue that his play was so bad that I'm baffled EVERYBODY wasn't tunneling on him.

[Haschel Cedricson]

These are the reasons why. At first he seemed to hide behind and even "sheep" behind mnemonic for a moment. Then he goes on an off on fit about him being scum and about a him and pitoli team. Vote infinity then the next day jumps right on mnemonic as the first vote. I feel maybe he threw infinity under the bus for his recklessness and proceeded to go jump on the mnemonic wagon to even the field a little more.

Where is this sheeping you're referencing? Are you talking about post 112?

[Haschel Cedricson]

That doesn't look like sheeping at all, especially given mnemonic attributed his prior vote to mere OMGUS and had given no scum reads up to that point.

In addition, mnemonic's reply to the question is that Toomai and Feel It are scummy, yet Zhero never votes for or expresses suspicion of either of those two players.

Either we have two very different definitions of "sheeping" or you are doing bizarre mental gymnastics to push a crappy case.

[Haschel Cedricson]

It is very feasible that I will not have any internet access until Monday morning. I

might

be able to check once, but I'm not counting on it. My apologies.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Alright, I'm getting caught up now. Today is an unusually busy day at work so don't get mad if I don't post immediately.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The combination of Daemon ignoring #324, the points made by RC's excellent post, and Daemon's craptacular response to said post have me ready to hammer.

Before I do, though, I would like to hear the REAL reason 2birds is suspicious of Toomai.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The combination of Daemon ignoring #324, the points made by RC's excellent post, and Daemon's craptacular response to said post have me ready to hammer.

Before I do, though, I would like to hear the REAL reason 2birds is suspicious of Toomai.

*sigh*

First, my RVS suspicions never went away.

Second, Infinity/Toomai interactions are freaking weird

Third, Toomai cared way too much about my suspicions against him even before I had him revoted.

Fourth, 275 was too specific for my liking, specifically "one scum".

Having said that, as much as I really want to lynch Toomai, I'm having trouble believing that he'd actually bus the even-scummier Daemon after losing a roleblocker day one (but eh, WIFOM and all that).

Fair enough. I personally have doubts about him being scum, but I understand your arguments.

Vote: Daemon

. Smudger is right about 359 being a giant white flag.

[Haschel Cedricson]

-I was really surprised to see Haschel Cedricson support mnemonicdevice's lynch. I can see the logic of getting him out of the way so the doctor is hidden again, but it still surprised me.

There were a few reasons for that. I honestly thought he was scum, and doctor is generally a good fakeclaim for scum who get wagonned on Day 1. Also, my role made me even less hesitant about pulling the trigger because I knew that if I was wrong then not only would the town still have a powerrole but it would make scum more likely to keep me around as a possible mislynch.

For a moment I thought that RC was the last scum, since I protected both Toomai and Feel It on a night where nobody died.

Thanks for running the game, Ankamius. And thanks to all the other players for keeping things at a lively-but-not-ridiculous pace.