Mini 1496: The Cash Cabd (Game Over)

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

this hydra is a private hydra, with the heads being StubbsKVM and Nachomamma8.
this is Nachomamma8.
this will be the only time I will sign my post.

Vote: Mario and the Diamonds

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

it's my scumday today!

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

@Hydras:

1) Are you ok with this?
2) Do any of you think they will do this?
3) Do you consider you'll be fully committed to the game despite having a fallback guy who can carry you even if you don't pay attention?
4) Do you have a regular mean to confer with your other head?

1) yes
2) definitely, it would be weird if we didn't disagree on some points.
3) I'll be committed.
4) working on it.

Stubbs

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Fegelein

That was fast...

It probably was. Unfortunately, I have no idea what you ever wanted to say with this and you missed some other things that happened in thread already :/

Brian Skies concerns me a little. He comes off rather agreeable. He's on my list to meta-check for completed MS games, but given his join date I don't expect to find any.

He does come off as agreeable, but I liked his approach to Saki's PGO claim. Why didn't you?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Peirot, Rail Tracer, and Brian all seem rather town from early game.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

What assumptions can be safely made?

Follows these standards, game will be balanced, probably three scum, probably at least one investigative role & one protective role.

What assumptions can we not make?

Anything else, pretty much.

elaborate on why poirot seems rather town to you.

I think that his hate of hydrae from two years ago is genuine or else he wouldn't make a giant ranty post against it, and the way he's acted upon this hate is more indicative of a town mindset than a scum mindset. I don't really see an advantage as scum of "hydras suck!!!" either, so that's an added benefit. Why aren't you townreading him?

I'm really struggling to see how this raised a flag for you.

Do you think he sensed it as a point of weakness as scum?

I want HC to react to #98&99 first.

Why does your vote need to be on him in order for him to react?

Wasn't there anything you could talk about? anyone you could vote?

We could have voted Fegelein again, but I'm pretty fine with my vote on him and would find it a little redundant if we unvoted and voted the same person.

You ommited SOS. Why? What do you see in us that you don't see in him?

My sorting process usually goes something like: 1) Read someone as leaning scum, leaning town. 2) Treat them as town/scum, get into their head a bit. etc. etc. I've played enough with SoS that I usually get a strong read from the first few posts, so the "declare town" part usually isn't necessary, and ends up being detrimental when dealing with her as scum (the more uncomfortable, the better).

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Yeah, I was writing a catch-up post yesterday but I fell asleep so there's that.

How long does it take you to catch up on 5 pages?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

fuck, doubleposted.

Cabd, can you merge my previous two posts and delete this one? Tyvm!!

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

You're kidding, right?

Mod please delete one......or leave it. Who am I to tell you what to do.

15. I do not fix tags or edit posts, even if you ask me to.

Cabd

, please delete this post as well.

You basically answered your question. He might react in a scummy way. I have enough time to change my vote later.

I mean, he might react in a scummy way whether you're voting him or not. Why not vote who you think is scum?

What do you make of his posts overall and of our exchange?

I have a slight townread on that exchange, simply because he's finding something he doesn't like and biting into it. I have to be careful with him since I occasionally lynch the hell out of him and he's usually not scum when that happens.

Not so much discomfort as hall of mirrors style self-wifom.

And the fewer escape routes you have, the better.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

And the fewer escape routes you have, the better.

I'm talking about my read of you. Figuring out whether town- or scum-nacho is more likely to make this explicit could take a while. It's bollixed up my methodology for reading you almost as much as your ambiguity-injection post-buzzword bingo did.

I'm being more transparent than I usually would be because of hydraing with Stubbs, but I'm glad that being transparent has the unexpected side effect of knocking you even more off your game.

you are both correct in thinking I am scummy for not having placed a vote yet. I wanted to make sure I understood hydras before I posted further/made a vote.

Wait, why are you scummy for not placing a vote?

but he's making a much bigger deal out of it than he should be considering a single bad experience with a single hydra.

This is the rational interpretation, yes. But I find emotions to be irrational things, he's going about this in an irrational way, things match up so far.

In the short run, it makes it seem like he's doing something when he really isn't. Compare the game-relevant content of his posts so far to the amount of times he's mentioned his feelings about his hatred for hydras. It appears he's written a lot, but only a very tiny fraction of what he's written is game-relevant. In the long run, had he not been called out on it, he would have had the option of, at some point down the line, saying, "omg, this is why I hate hydras!!!" if he ever felt like pushing a lynch on one of them. These are just a couple basic reasons I could see it benefitting him as scum.

If he's using it as an excuse for actually scumhunting, then I'm sure we'll find that out really really soon. In the long run, that's not the type of reason that I would accept as valid or vaguely townie so all that wonderful groundwork he's laying down is pretty much all for naught.

The better question is, what town motivation is there in talking about his hatred of hydras this much?

Minimizing damage.

The only thing that stuck out to me was Rebel's attempted interactions with the mod. The likely-joking tone didn't fit in at all with the content of his posts and that struck me as odd.

The rest of the post was serious. I try not to make my jokes sound too serious.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Dessew and SOS, you are both correct in thinking I am scummy for not having placed a vote yet. I wanted to make sure I understood hydras before I posted further/made a vote. I feel like if I posted without somewhat of an understanding it would only be hurting the townies and I since I could potentially mislead them. That being said, it is scummy of me to not have a vote down yet. Thank you for the explanation of the hydras SOS, it helped me a lot. I also want to apologize to the group for contributing to the "hydra nonsense" but it helped me, so thank you.

So far HP, and Rail seem town to me. FuDuzn is kinda scum so far, especially in (116) where he just sort of gives up and resigns to his fate after fighting it quite a bit. Could be an appeal to emotion? I definitely think there are some scum on his wagon though.

I would also like to know why you voted for me Dessew. We have quite a few players not voting, why pick me?

Vote: Fegelein

HC, you think FuDuzn is scummy AND you think there's scum on his wagon? Why both of these? And why not vote on of them?

Stubbs.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

I think HC is due for a prod.
Waiting for Nacho to post in our QT.

Stubbs

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

We both played in Newbie 1393, along with Fu, that's why I placed my random vote (I know I said "serious vote", but come oooon) on HC. Because I thought I could get something out of his reactions. He's hasty, joking a little, concerned about the vote on him (even starting to suspect the one (me) who is voting him.) There's also the "I don't know who to vote, I don't want to harm town by voting to the wrong place." Also, there's the fact that he placed his vote on Fege with a stupid reasonong, and his last post (#133) screws up chronology, Mario had contributed to the game as much as Fege had when HC voted Fege.

You summed up his actions decently, but you didn't follow up with anything like "so he's probably town" which is usually the important thing in these parts. I thought this was translating to a HC = scum conclusion, but then you unvote him and go for Fu. Why?

His retracting the PGO claim points to town-Saki IMO.

I pointed that out to Stubbs! <3

so he's being emotional and irrational and this is making you read him as town? or what part of the irrational approach made you think "town mindset"?

The part where he attempts to mitigate the damage that these hydras will do to this beautiful game. Yes, it is a perfectly valid approach for scum to attempt to discredit the hell out of all hydras. Do I think that's what HP's going for? No, not really. In this game the hydras are generally leading pretty strongly, so I think he would back down a bit as scum when no one really bought his reasoning. Here, he didn't.

Anyone else feeling Brian scum?

Not really, no.

Why would a town player act so defeated so fast? This looks like misdirection. It's not done after a wagon, it's done immediatly and without actual intent of showing who you think is scum.

Signs of giving up are usually just inexperienced or not that confident of a player tells.

Mario feels weird. He's not under any fire and yet "If you dont like when I post just lynch me" seems very forced. Like a forceful way of trying to say "I don't care if I die"

I very strongly agree with this.

Kitty is leaning scum. It seems for someone with 14 posts they only have 1 townread and 1 scumread. It kinda looks like they're trying to buddy up to fu.

So the artemis head of the hydra is someone who plays with mollie/ffery and I in a different place where ffery sort of dominates everything. The fact that she's getting paranoid of ffery here is a strong towntell to me.

i can see some things that i can maybe see as town, but i really don't like how he has apparently arrived at his scum reads.

You noted earlier that when you are looking for genuine scumhunting, you look for players that don't read between the lines. Some players start out with surface attacks and sort of ease their way in. I think HP is one of those players.

I responded to your reads where I thought I can say something that hasn't been said yet. Or should I have responded to your read on me? Because I don't want to. It would create only WIFOM, so it'd be pointless.

What WIFOM is created from you defending yourself?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Hey stubbs, care to talk?

Sure. I finally got over my hangover! I have not seen you claim to be obvtown. Should I be worried?
Nacho says you're town though.

btw, what's your read on ns? is there a reason you're still voting him?

Town. Nacho forgot to unvote.

Idk what it is, but I feel like notscience is too agreeable here, Im getting a light scum read on his slot. I dont like his attack on kitty by saying that they have 14 posts, ergo they must be scum.

Why do you feel the need to bring this up, after Ns's #231?

Well its ironic that Rail Tracer has been accusing HP of hiding behind the hydra discussion when the attempts at scumhunting are there and the only reason HP keeps talking about hydras is because Rail Tracer keeps bringing them up. Makes sense?

Explain how this affects your read on Rail Tracer.

"I can see the reason why he calls me scum"

Yeaahh, Im doubting my scum read on Dessew..

What about that sentence makes you doubt it?

He's expressed more interest in disrupting my game than in figuring me out.

I have told Nacho I was townreading you, he agreed with me. What disruptions are you talking about exactly?

UNVOTE:

I agree on NS being town. We are still sorting out Dessew.
HC hasn't posted since thursday, so is long overdue for a prod.

Can we get a prod on HC??

Stubbs.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

I pointed that out to Stubbs! <3

Yeah, well I'm not getting town read that easily.

Maybe, maybe not.

Nacho what do you think of Dessew?

I think Dessew is town. I think that some bits of his thought process are awkwardly transparent (I won't respond to you because it would look too weird), and some of his attacks are pretty clearly geared towards scumhunting (such as his sorting out of HC), so I'm pretty good with the mole thing for now.

i don't think him not backing down means much.

Fair enough.

btw, what's your read on ns? is there a reason you're still voting him?

No, not really. I don't have any pushes I feel particularly strongly about at the time of my last wall, and I'm not an unvoting type.

Since the "cat" is out of the bag anyways

hahahahahahaha

I can't be the only one bugged by that middle paragraph. It looks like he's trying harder to SEEM townish rather than find scum.

Hmmm.

I metadived his completed scum game this weekend.

What did you find?

He's expressed more interest in disrupting my game than in figuring me out.

I've told you that I'm going to be playing more transparently than I usually do for Stubbs's benefit. I think that is pretty much the opposite of disrupting your game, no? I mean sure the meta might look a little different, but my play this game will be most effected by my hydra partner and not by you.

It would be cool though, if people refrained from giving this "be anti-town" card out so often.

I don't like wasting my time, and I feel that public shaming for playing anti-town is a waste of my valuable time when I can lynch scum instead.

Hate to be a pain, but I'd like to answer that question after Rebel accepts my invitation.

However, it's hard to gauge FuDuzn's flailiness when he's not posting.

Are you inviting me to a party??

Accept: Invitation

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

TOWN:
SoS
Rail Tracer
notscience

LEAN TOWN:
artemiskitty
Brian Skies
HopefullyCynical
Dessew
Humble Poirot


LEAN TOWN (but considerably less so):
FuDuzn
Brian Skies

LEFTOVERS:
Mario and the Diamonds
Saki
Daniel Bryan

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Right so poking someone a bit about the way a post was worded is obv scum tell now.

I hate early game time, no one is catching scum from a couple posts, you aren't that good.

This frustration about people looking too far into things and getting convinced too strongly about things seems like a towntell in the early stages; not only is he failing to blend in, but he's bitching at others for trying to scumhunt and do things. That seems surprisingly ballsy from Fu-scum.

Rail, explain my anti town intentions in my questioning? Enlighten us all as to how they are scum and not town motivated?

It is early Day 1, people were still stuck in stupid rvs and rqs or being overly concerned about the hydra infestation in this game, I chose to question a player about something that seemed a big off to me. When they didn't answer my question in a way that satisfied me I prodded a little bit.

Again, explain anti town motivation.

I will not back down from this and will question everyone who is voting me, and those who are apparently too scared too vote me(and that isn't a scum tell?),until I get a solid explanation about this.

This, especially the last quoted line, seemed like Fu was drawing a line in the sand, in a way, which reads as an attempt to shut down all the ridiculousness of the people posting in early game. I liked that quite a bit, and it has nice trajectory with his previous mindset in mind. "OH YOU FUCKS ARE TOO SCARED TO VOTE ME" is interestingly suicidal, but I see scum going for early ballsy plays like that in chatmafia as opposed to forum mafia where they actually have to take a step back and explain themselves.

In this game it is more about the forest, not the trees.

I chuckled at this because of a conversation we had a while back where you said these exact words. I don't think FuDuzn as scum would be likely to start this type of lecture with you and I'm not really sure that he would really have a goal with the whole "let me teach you mafia" line as scum. It's not like he has a distinct reputation advantage in this game or something like that.

Ok SOS, I [don't] get really get a bad vibe from you. Though trying to reads purely off of meta is a bad strategy imo.

Those piggybacking off of SOS's weariness of me, scum in there me thinks.

And mod, shut it. I told you I couldn't tell you what to do

Here, he backs off you (because he's scared? scum-FuDuzn hasn't been showing many signs of fear) and starts to look at others suspecting them. This reads a lot like he's sorting out his primary antagonist, and then when he's satisfied on that front, moving in on other people.

To those leading my wagon, answer my damm question please. To those sheeping, I am getting ready to vote one of you.

If I am lynched, the blood will be all over one of the sheep.

This screamed town. The last line alone means I won't be able to vote him today, most likely.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

The only thing that stuck out to me was Rebel's attempted interactions with the mod. The likely-joking tone didn't fit in at all with the content of his posts and that struck me as odd.

It's odd, yes. What's stranger to me is that you didn't pick it out to be a joke.

Interpreting this post, it (somewhat) makes sense to translate it as "oh, since I need to throw out solid reads on players to make people think I'm trying to find scum, I'll give the name of a player who has just enough posts for me and others to remember their name, but not enough posts for people to disagree with me on the inactivity callout. I'm not looking at the playerlist at all, since only accusing specifically Fegelein for lurking shouldn't garner too much attack."

Here, Mario tries to say that HC's choice of attacking Fegelein over other lurkers was somehow special and that it made him scummy in a significant way? In particular, suspecting him for attacking a lurker with "just the right amount of posts" seemed contrived.

Sorry if you want to appeal to me now, but I'm most likely going to tunnel you for the rest of the day with limited evidence that other people won't understand, and rely mostly on my gut and what I believe was your most likely train of thought at the time of your scummier posts. I'm a tone and voice player; if it sounds scummy when read to myself, I will see it as scummy in its original context as well.

I didn't like this post because it had very strange parts joking/not joking. "I'm going to tunnel you" was a joking tone but sets up for him making a poor push. "I rely mostly on gut" was the not/joking portion, but all that seemed to do was explain why he wasn't going to see him as town even if he probably was. And it makes no sense for me for a player to realize they tunnel too much, announce they are going to tunnel even though they don't seem to believe they are passionate and then ???.

pedit: I forgot to delete him when I moved him from one section to another. It seems fitting now.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Daniel Bryan

I personally will speak on this subject later. Stubbs gets first dibs because he found him first, though.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Which is the spot you moved Brian Skies to?

Less leaning town spot.

Nacho can you walk me through the DB case please

Give Stubbs a moment to push the case.

You're either defending someone or finding someone to be town. In fact, your list doesn't even call anyone scum, you seem to put mario/saki/DB in some sort POE so I'll vote one of them.

"Leftovers" = Not Town = Scum.

If my assumption is right, than you're reading Mario and Daniel as (leaning) scum, aren't you?

I'm reading them all as leaning scum. Daniel is the hardest lean, then Mario, then Saki.

Obligatory response: inactivity is not lurking, and inactivity is not a scumtell except in the case of newer players who don't know how to play as scum. I am an alt, and while you have no confirmation of any of this reasoning applying to me, simply trust in the fact that an individual would not wish to be known simply as "Mario and the Diamonds" for everything they do on this site.

I know you're an alt. I want you to post like an experienced player and do something useful for once.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Daniel Bryan

I personally will speak on this subject later. Stubbs gets first dibs because he found him first, though.

What do you think I mean when I say "found him", HP?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Null. I liked the catch-up post, even if it was done pretty roughly. Is willing to offer
information to help get a better read. I need more content though (previous slot-holder didn't
generate anything worthwhile). information to help get a better read. I need more content though (previous slot-holder didn't generate anything worthwhile).

Why does NS's predecessor matter? I'd say that he's produced more content than ak, yet they've produced enough content for you to get a more solid read on them.

303 So why not just directly call us scum?

Why does it matter what we call you? A scum by any other name will flip just as red.

"Mini 1480: Uncreative Paradise",

Don't mention ongoing games, just say that you know he can do better.

@Random-Stubbs, I'd like to see your case on Brian.

I would too!

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

When did Stubbs found him?

September 08, 03:19PM.

Who wrote 303?

If it wasn't signed by Stubbs, it was probably me.

Could you/him/both (This is confusing) have written DB as scum earlier than 308?

We could have, that's just not how the way I decided to write the posts decreed it would go. I might be misunderstanding what you're saying here though.

I say we wagon Dessew-scum, because as HP said we're too far apart and it's risking a deadline scramble.

What do you think about Daniel?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

In any case, its probably not alignment indicative that he hates hydras, but those questions seemed like they were there to give excuses to vote for hydras.

So the questions

are

alignment indicative??

you liked his stance but you "never said you liked his questions" well why didnt you say that earlier?

He did, actually. You even commented on the post where he did. Looks like you're not really reading.

86 kinda feels like "i dont want to look like we're having hydra dissonance because theres a player here who doesnt like hydras and has stated he wont accept dissonance as an excuse".

It's only logical to discuss with your other head before laying down a vote. You don't want to vote someone your other head is townreading. The fact that you see it as scummy, raises question marks for me.

So if you dont vote Cynical and simply tell her to react or something, then she wont react. Its like "person A is scummy, but I'd rather not vote yet"

Ask a question first. If the reaction to it is unsatisfactory or there is no reaction, then you vote. I don't see why you're attacking Dessew for this.

108 im not sure, i dont feel like theres much scum hunting going on here, or in any of rebel's posts for that matter, except for the point about Dessew.

Im getting town vibes from Rebel

I'd like to know how you got from that first quote to the second.

Basically, your entire #152 contains comments on what people are doing wrong, without following it up with any actions. There's only a few points in which you said you liked anything anyone has done. The one about Mario, who only had 1 post, stands out to me.

Idk what it is, but I feel like notscience is too agreeable here, Im getting a light scum read on his slot. I dont like his attack on kitty by saying that they have 14 posts, ergo they must be scum.
I think he may have a point about Dessew but Im having a gut scum read on him.

Again, he tries to paint players in a negative way. Encouraging the scumreading of Dessew, but also claiming a scumread on NotScience. This was after NotScience already claimed he was wrong on kitty. Why the need to bring it up?

"I can see the reason why he calls me scum"

Yeaahh, Im doubting my scum read on Dessew..

Why? When HC claimed the same thing, you thought it was scummy.(See Below)

120 "You are both correct in thinking Im scummy" theres a level of self awareness I not liking here. Agree with your FuDuzn point but you saying youre scummy feels off to me. Like "I know it was scummy, hence im not scum"

There's an off feeling about his posts. I've seen ns in a game to get a grasp at his meta and he is usually uhm, less serious(?) when he is town. Thats why I felt his posts were odd.

Now I believe he said he's changing his meta, so I dont think this would make much sense

This doesn't answer why you brought it up, after he claimed he was wrong.

Because i dont feel like he's scum hunting as much as he is trying to discredit HP.

But you had him leaning town in your catchup post??

Again why mostly "leaning" reads and no hardline "SCUM" read. it feels like you dont want to call anyone scum.

Why is not having big scumreads a problem at this point of the game?

So I have HP, Mario,

Rebel

and SoS as town

again us as town read? Yet you have not commented in a positive way about anything we have done, on the contrary.

To conclude. You seem to make a habit to comment on what people are doing wrong. Your reads don't seem to match with the comments you're making. And you aren't talking to your town reads, and you aren't pressuring your scum reads. I fail to see any town motivation in what you're doing.

Nacho, if you have anything to add, feel free to do so.

Stubbs.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

in general terms, when stubbs had decided DB was scum and if that was consistent with the list you (head) posted. Considering you didn't state DB in a separate category beforehand.

Yeah, Stubbs decided DB was scum before I posted the list, and it was consistent with the list.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Rebel

1. Yes. His questions are alignment indicative. I was calling him scummy for that
2. No idea what youre talking about
3. Well I've seen hydras who do vote without consent, then the other head retracts. So I thought it was odd for them to aboid the dissonance
4. Lol. We all have our own ways of hunting.
5. Its called Gut.
6 . Apparently suspicion always means painting negatively
7. I said it felt weird. But then I saw it in Dessew, so I thought again
8. No idea what this is supposed to attack
9. Its weird how my reads are supposed to be constant and cant change according to new situations. That my catch up read him town but apparently his current actions CANT change that
9. Because it shows a lack of commitment, a lack of conviction to call someone scum, like theyre scared.
10. Again, Gut.

But consider that gone, your case on me is bad. I felt like you had to blow up minor points to make me look bad.

1. you never used the word scummy.
2. look it up.
3. That doesn't explain why you're attacking SOS for not laying down a vote.
4. Exactly. Why do you attack someone else's ways?
5. you got a gut townread on us when we're not scumhunting, according to you? Really??
6. True. But the fact that you're doing it on your so called "townreads" doesn't make sense. You also avoided to answer why my question.

Again, he tries to paint players in a negative way. Encouraging the scumreading of Dessew, but also claiming a scumread on NotScience. This was after NotScience already claimed he was wrong on kitty. Why the need to bring it up?

7. Explain this. Why did it not feel wrong when someone else did it?
8. I'm attacking the fact that you didn't answer my question. You still haven't. It's about this:

Again, he tries to paint players in a negative way. Encouraging the scumreading of Dessew, but also claiming a scumread on NotScience. This was after NotScience already claimed he was wrong on kitty. Why the need to bring it up?

9.what actions made you change your read? He had been going at HP pretty much the entire time.
9. scared of what? What's the reason for scum not attacking weak reasoning?
10. You have only made negative comments on us, and have a gut townread on us? This is what I'm talking about when I say your reads don't match your comments.

Why aren't you talking to your town reads?
Why aren't you pressuring your scum reads?
Where is your town motivation?

Allow me to quote your post 10 again:

Because it shows a lack of commitment, a lack of conviction to call someone scum, like theyre scared.

I would prefer someone who is discussing with their town reads, not being sure of their scum reads, other than someone who points out the negativities in everyone's posts, doesn't question anything about the posts, but supposedly has a number of scumreads he's not pressuring.

Where is the commitment in your posts?

Stubbs.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Daniel's answer is actually pretty good, I'd like to hear Rebel's response if there's any.
And the Fu-wagon is stalling right now, consider as if my vote was on him, but
UNVOTE: Fu
VOTE: Brian Skies
HP has a big role in this read. First: his #430 is on the spot (maybe his other posts are, too, I won't iso now.) Especially the Daniel-vote seems off, Rebel announced he had a case on him, and Brian joined the wagon with some stupid, made-up reason. And I also don't like that in his read on HP the hydradiscussion is overrepresented, but that's a minor issue in comparison.

What do you think is good about DB's answer?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Nacho V/LA until Tuesday

Hopefully gonna be back monday but you never know.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Rebel: I kind of belived him the 1., I didn't look it up, and it does come off bad, after all. But his answers 3, 5, 6, 9, 9, 10 were proper, and his other answers (except 1 and 2, but the latter isn't a big deal) make sense, too. But, yes, there's that fisrt one, I can't find the part in that post when he calls HP scummy, he gets "town vibes" from HP at the end of his post.

So you think it's logical he's leaning gut town on our slot, when he has only mentioned us in negative ways?

Please tell me if there's anything you think I should focus on.

You should read the case on Daniel Bryan and the follow-up. Why didn't you comment on it?

Stubbs

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

NS, can I get you to vote Daniel Bryan?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

No shoutout for me?

Truthfully, I forgot you were in the game for a moment there.

ZING

Rebel: I kind of belived him the 1., I didn't look it up, and it does come off bad, after all. But his answers 3, 5, 6, 9, 9, 10 were proper, and his other answers (except 1 and 2, but the latter isn't a big deal) make sense, too. But, yes, there's that fisrt one, I can't find the part in that post when he calls HP scummy, he gets "town vibes" from HP at the end of his post.

I don't think you answered the question quite how I wanted you to. Less question numbers and "I like this answer" and more reasons why you like those answers, please.

My town block right now is SOS, Rail Tracer, Humble Peirot, Bryan Skye.

Talk to me about your read on us a little bit because I might have just been away too long but I don't remember it.

VOTE: Rail Tracer

Scared to come out and play?

Is anyone else bugged by the lack of another wagon? Everyone seems to be on a different page and not trying to convince people to follow them (which I admittedly am guilty of myself) and it's bugging the shit out of me.

Not necessarily, no. Should I be?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

What do you think of the lack of any counterwagon?

I'm not interested in any counterwagon right now. All reasons for there not being one are all WIFOM.

I still like my vote on Daniel Bryan. I wish he was here to attempt to change my read, but it looks like he's given up already.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

^
Stubbs.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Mario, do you think it's scummy for someone not to have a single read 21 pages into the game? I do.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

UNVOTE: notscience
VOTE: SOS

Do you wanna lynch Daniel Bryan with me?
Please?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

<3

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

In other news, I'm losing faith in Dessew. Ffery, what do you think of that?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

This is Stubbs's big post on him.

and i'm kind of null on mario atm. i don't think it's "apathy" in his posts. he could be town who just has no solid reads (i felt kind of like that a bit earlier in the game). i find the lack of reads more townish than scummy.

I would too if he didn't push that "lurking isn't scummy because I'm an alt and didn't need to lurk" crap earlier. If he was good enough not to lurk as scum, he would be good enough as town to not feed us that sort of thing.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

i really hate these drive-by post-and-runs by DB. it's so blatantly scummy that it's making me second guess.

There's no shame in admitting you were wrong, Muffin.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

HEY CABD YOU FUCKED UP BIG TIME BUDDY
DANIEL BRYAN IS AT 6 VOTES, NOT 5
:[

worst mod 2013

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

My theory is that (they might be scumbuddies and) DB thought it was a counterwagon attempt and Titus will come up with an actual case. He didn't know that Titus wanted to dive deeply into nullishness, so he won't post any case. But he later clinged to his RT-vote, because the connection either would be unnoticed or would be considered so obvious that Titus gets towncred. So I'm saying that if Daniel flips scum, I'm willing to lynch Titus tomorrow.

I like your theory. Scum aren't expected to vote in blocks here (even during a counterwagon attempt), so I'm not sure that DB would expect that his buddy was making the counterwagon case for him or follow along so quickly, but this shows an independent thought process that I was hoping to see before.

I see it as a response to the comment of her playing fluff-like such as her predecessor.

It is, but that's a defense to an accusation.

i'm sure it's been used to mislynch more than it has to correctly lynch scum using the "tell"

Lately. It certainly did have a hell of a heyday though.

UNVOTE: DB
VOTE: notscience

Your propensity for naked votes is starting to bug me a little.

Are you really that bad at reading mantis?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote Count of the First City, Eleventh Block

Players Alive: 13
Votes to Lynch: 7
Format of:
Wagon (size): Voters on wagon

Rail Tracer (2): Titus, Daniel Bryan (L-5)
Dessew (1): Notscience (L-6)

Daniel Bryan (6): Rebel Without a Pulse, Rail Tracer. Brian Skies, Sound of Silence, Natirasha, Dessew (L-1)

Natirasha (1): Humble Poirot (L-6)
Mario and the Diamonds (1): Mogamma (L-6)
notscience (1): artemiskitty (L-6)
Not voting: Mario and the Diamonds

Deadline for Day One falls on: 9/23/13 which is (expired on 2013-09-23 19:00:00)

Mod notes:

~Cabd sucks

Can I talk about how awesome this wagon is?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Dessew's nearly in that 2nd group.

Wait, what do your reads look like?

Hope you're with us nacho!

That would be cool, yeah.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Wait, what do your reads look like?

You disagree about dessew?

Yup. I was probably wrong.

i think nat and mario are town.

can we lynch notscience today?

VOTE: notscience

I think both are scum. Talk to me about Mario.

Rest assured, I'll place a vote on him when I'm ready. Let's see how he enters the thread today at least.

Why wait?

You didn't even gave me a day

I did! What are your thoughts?

If Natirasha isn't scum on that wagon in my sexvotecount, I'm guessing Brian is.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

who are you thinking about voting nacho?

Mario.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Mogamma, probably.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Ran out of time while making the rounds. When I return, I will be drunk.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Also I'm pretty sure this is ObvtownFfery so there's really no point in poking her with sharp things.

Why is this obvtown ffery?

I'm not sure what you want me to address?

What, am I not cool enough to get a reaction after you call me scum?

I don't consider myself a strong Day 1 player and so far, Day 2 feels like Day 1 again.

You usually look pretty fucking town by the end of Day 1 because of your frustration with it, but you haven't really seemed that town here. This is concerning

i think brian skies is town. remind me to talk about why #811 was almost certainly a town post at some point later on today.

#811 did look townish, but I feel uncomfortable. Why do you think he's town?

Ceph inherited a slot I had as town. He seems to be doing something that I do with a few players if they happen to be in a game with me - using me as a sort of stake in the ground for judging other players' reactions. Given how cautious he was about me in the Dixon Hill game, this raises a small flag.

I agree with this.

The come chat sometimes was due to wanting to chat with them. Perhaps it was unfair to lump the HP slot in their, but that was worded in such a way as to deliberately not be much of a judgment of scumminess.

On the second point, once again, I was speaking in the hypothetical. I do that quite a bit.

I don't think you answered RT's concerns about you and Mario. If you actually wanted to policy lynch, I figure you'd call it a policy lynch and push it like a policy lynch but you aren't. Why?

I'll provide a formal case for titus later tonight.

You kinda dropped off the face of the planet. What's going on with you?

At the risk of sounding like Scumrir, why isn't Mario dead yet?

Seriously, can anyone honestly answer that question?

We're sorting out his partners, mostly.

because i very much think NS is scum.

I don't think I'll be able to lynch ns ever.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Also I'm pretty sure this is ObvtownFfery so there's really no point in poking her with sharp things.

Why is this obvtown ffery?

I'm not sure what you want me to address?

What, am I not cool enough to get a reaction after you call me scum?

I don't consider myself a strong Day 1 player and so far, Day 2 feels like Day 1 again.

You usually look pretty fucking town by the end of Day 1 because of your frustration with it, but you haven't really seemed that town here. This is concerning

i think brian skies is town. remind me to talk about why #811 was almost certainly a town post at some point later on today.

#811 did look townish, but I feel uncomfortable. Why do you think he's town?

Ceph inherited a slot I had as town. He seems to be doing something that I do with a few players if they happen to be in a game with me - using me as a sort of stake in the ground for judging other players' reactions. Given how cautious he was about me in the Dixon Hill game, this raises a small flag.

I agree with this.

The come chat sometimes was due to wanting to chat with them. Perhaps it was unfair to lump the HP slot in their, but that was worded in such a way as to deliberately not be much of a judgment of scumminess.

On the second point, once again, I was speaking in the hypothetical. I do that quite a bit.

I don't think you answered RT's concerns about you and Mario. If you actually wanted to policy lynch, I figure you'd call it a policy lynch and push it like a policy lynch but you aren't. Why?

I'll provide a formal case for titus later tonight.

You kinda dropped off the face of the planet. What's going on with you?

At the risk of sounding like Scumrir, why isn't Mario dead yet?

Seriously, can anyone honestly answer that question?

We're sorting out his partners, mostly.

because i very much think NS is scum.

I don't think I'll be able to lynch ns ever.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Prohawk, what's your opinion on SoS this game?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

after I call you scum*

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Rebel, you totally missed NS's formal case and my response.

didn't miss it.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

NS COME FUCKING TALK TO ME AND STOP TUNNELING TITUS
-nacho

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

You didn't sound particularly confident in that conviction. You didn't give me anything to really respond to. My reaction was somewhere between complete apathy and mild surprise. Rail Tracer came at me with gusto, and engaged me in a dialogue. You didn't.

You can say "why are you reading me as scum?" without me full tilting at you. When I tilt you, I'm lynching the hell out of you.

What do you want to talk about Nacho?

Nastyrasha.
Talk to me about him!

would you help me lynch nati today?

Hell yes.

Vote: Nastyrasha

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Hell yes.

Vote: Nastyrasha

Now this. This reminds me of Xeno.

Behind the Scenes=QT

This seems townish from you.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=30297

ffery, what's your take on this? saki fakeclaimed early and got wrecked. he rescinded his fakeclaim here while this game was ongoing. i haven't checked timestamps, but this game has been on the back of my mind for a while.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

<<missing stubbs

Titus-Nati scumteam.

So what happens if Nati flips scum? Do you drop the Titus scumread?

nati+titus+mario

Titus is where you lose me. I think Prohawk or Brian both make more sense for the middleman.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

You asked why.
I didn't want to answer.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Brian Skies

not bad for your first scumgame!

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Nacho I still want to know why you think Titus is town

2- I don't see the possibility for a Titus-Nati scumteam.

Why don't you think Titus is town?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

other than everyone should think hard and long about how scummy beastslot seems at the moment?
no, not really.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

I'm a miller doctor. I protected Rail Tracer last night after ffery urged me to in our neighborhood quicktopic (she's a one-shot compulsive neighborizer). I don't think she'd pull a crazy gambit like that because Cabd is the one that pulls crazy gambits and I'm already reading her as town so this is completely unnecessary. It also makes Rail Tracer pretty ridiculously town, considering I've protected him two nights in a row. With AK and NS as unbelievably strong townreads and those two as pretty much confirmed town, I'm happy to powerlynch Beast then ProHawk then Titus. If one of those three wants to claim something relevant than I would appreciate it since now feels like a decent time to massclaim.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

I figured Stubbs and I would end up looking incredibly town and not get investigated, wanted to draw a kill early because "miller doctor" seemed like a claim that could cause problems. What did you want to talk about today?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

I protected Rail Tracer last night after ffery urged me to

Why not do it on your own accord? You stated that you protected Rail Tracer every-single night since N1, why did you need ffery's prodding to get you to protect him again?

I protected ffery night 1, protected RT the other two nights. I was waffling between protecting the same person twice.

With AK and NS as unbelievably strong townreads and those two as pretty much confirmed town

You need to explain AK from start to finish.

It's mostly meta, but I'll explain it later.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Can someone tell me how my slot is scummy?

PoE, mostly. What did you think of those claims?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

VT. I absolutely disagree with Rebel's reads but Rebel will be dead soon enough if he's not lying. The end of that day made me think RT and SoS quickhammered their buddy. I cannot see why that doc heal would happen.

Wait what why?

They are all believable. I was trying to figure out the logic of popcorning to kittens though. I just don't see the train of thought there. i popcorned because they were thought to be scum by someone like I am so I figured they sooner they claim the better since it will allow for more conversation on their claim.

Who do you think ProHawk should have popcorned to?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

me too
i'm starting to read fast at this point, so i can be caught up and vote for him already

I liked this post quite a bit, actually. It felt pretty genuine to me.

not terribly confident. but SOS was the first person to get my back up a little. she's good as scum.
i haven't been pushing because i've been slacking on actually reading the thread. which is what i'm doing now.
and i'm still not confident that they are TOWN. but also, not really thinking that our vote on them, today, is in the best place.

I thought the initial push on ffery was pretty town. A lot of players that come from offsite are more paranoid of ffery than they should be, and usually end up having immediate issues with her playstyle here because she's too hesitant/less aggressive in her pushes. It would also be pretty nicely faked paranoia if scum; ffery and I both deal with mollie's fake paranoia a lot, so we're pretty good at distinguishing the two with people we are familiar with.

UNVOTE: DB
VOTE: notscience

Your propensity for naked votes is starting to bug me a little.

sorry :/

just not that sure of Daniel Brown as being scum, despite nacho-hydra being certain.

i don't think Titus looks as bad as NS is making him out to be

The hydra had every reason to sheep me onto this mislynch at this point (occasionally follows me when I ask her to trust me on a read), but decides not to. Maybe it's a push for towncred as scum, but it makes a lot of sense from a Mantis-town perspective. It also means that she was willing to join both scumbuddies on the wagon for a while, which seems unlikely.

If there

must

be scum on the wagon, it's probably between Brian, Rail Tracer, and Titus. I am not happy with any of those choices, though, so I'm going to assume worst case scenario here.

titus is town, trust me!!
this is mantis
look at NS's ISO again

I like this post a lot.

Only thing I could maybe be thinking is that there is no scum on the wagon (hard to agree with that when we maybe have 3 scum in the game) and that the kill HAD to be on the wagon because killing someone off the wagon would do harm in VCA along the way.

Hard to see someone coming up with a theory like this when they have two buddies on the wagon.

you are never *this* concerned whether your reads are screwy,as town... cause you are normally very confident.
this is why i don't trust you.

This is what I'm referring to re: ffery's two metas.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Titus is who I think they should have popcorned to based on what I perceive to be the scum reads from the town.

doesn't seem that significant to me.
prohawk suspects ak more --> prohawk popcorns to ak.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Prohawk

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: Prohawk

Because I totally threw this game by hard-bussing my team all in a row amirite? Was this vote placed by Nacho-perchance?

Probably not, no. What do you think of Titus?

What inno result?

With hypo cop, I would expect gf or roleblocker. Gf means an inno is worthless.

There's a miller and cop is already limited by being odd night. Try again?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Unvote, Vote: Titus

mebbe ns.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Vote: notscience

Prohawk, I don't think they landed on the wagon either. Why are you voting AK?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

what happened to the whole "titus is scum" rampage?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

What makes you think I still think she's scum?

Could you answer my question?

I'll get you guys my full reads tomorrow (@RT, these two flips have really shook things up for me)

And >.>

scumtell.

Actually, can you explain how Natirasha cleared them?

Vote Titus with me?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Rebel, I am voting Titus.

notscience****

You have already had that discussion with ns.

So?

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Beast- Nati's final post, as well as everyone else (except GIF) seems more town

cop innocent didn't do anything for you?

GIF- Here's what gets me- GIF has a continuous townread on me the entire game, then when the lynch pool is limited to 4, I'm suddenly scum. It's a really weird transition, given how active he is in trying to get me mislynched now when he's spent majoriy of the game kinda lurky.
Scum

ffery pegged rt as a power role, told me to protect him, and then no killed?
that seems a wee bit unlikely.

[Rebel Without a Pulse]

Why the hell cover what you've already asked and had answered without acknowledgment that the question was already asked?

I didn't remember asking the question, was too lazy to look back. I found that I asked ns why he was still reading you as scum. He said "no, I'm not still reading you as scum". I later asked why you were town. It's an extension of the conversation we were having before Skies died by hider guilty.

The doctor claim makes sense. However, there is another explanation. Scum faking a doctor claim.

why two no kills?

cop innocent didn't do anything for you?

What's the meta for Godfathers, nacho?

didn't answer my question.