A uPick of Ice & Fire - Day 12 - #REKT?

[Tierce]

Man this sucks. Tierce, you picked a badass woomens like Tyene Sand or something, right?

Badass woomens all day long, dear. Aerion Brightflame the Fabulous was my first pick.

VOTE: Goat on a Raft

How dare Cephrir not jumpstart the game on page 1.

[Tierce]

We're not gonna sign probably. SSK and I have different enough voices though that it shouldn't be too hard to discern us though. Example: the other posts in this thread are all SSK. I sometimes refer to myself as a friendly wolf token, too.

I cannot tell the difference between posters in virtually any hydra because I am not very observant. As such, I would like to request that everyone sign.

If you're not able to differentiate hydra members due to writing/playstyle, they are able to fake who wrote each post if they are called out for inconsistency and whatnot. Signing is pointless; if differentiating people is important for you, go read their completed games to see how they write.

As for your "no [hydra] else gets a pass" on signing, bah. Get better at recognizing writers, then you don't need signatures and can try and figure out if they are impersonating each other. It's fun.

Empire, you should probably sheep me.

Hey PrideandJoy--less general theory talk, says the hypocrite. Play

this

game. Seems a bit silly to be worried about not having good Townreads by page 2-3. (I'm Town. There, that's one.)

[Tierce]

Tierce, why so aggressive?

Aggressive

is

my default mode. I could bring in puppies if it makes you feel better, though. Empire's Town, Tammy might be Town, I'm ready to roll this game and already irked by the posting spree because I need to leave for a few hours. The hypocrite bit was referring to

me

, though, in case you're wondering.

[Tierce]

Natirasha please sit SSK aside for a moment and explain why scummy posts are something you don't want to be doing. It's distracting me with all the

ooooo shiny

when I am pretty damn content with my vote.

[Tierce]

VOTE: Andrius

No godless man may sit the seastone chair.

Why randomly vote? It's page 4 now. There's enough content to be able to vote a player now.

Speaking of which,

Vote: Kanye

. Pushing too aggressively for a wagon that no one has explained and is ultimately fruitless in discussion. And he needs to explain things.

-SSK

Natirasha please sit SSK aside for a moment and explain why scummy posts are something you don't want to be doing. It's distracting me with all the

ooooo shiny

when I am pretty damn content with my vote.

Mind explaining what was wrong with my post Tierce?

Random vote by page 4 is fine, the game started two hours ago. No need to question that.

And a "wagon that no one has explained" and being "aggressive" as kanye is--not scumtells. Page 4. Chill. Let things develop naturally instead of attempting to curtail them immediately, you're coming across as too eager to jump on stuff before it has a chance to unfold.


And I'm gone like the wind.

[Tierce]

mmmmm the point brought up about roles-before-alignment pretty much invalidates that theory yeah

UNVOTE:

Actually it doesn't invalidate the theory--it can be Wights v. The Realm, with "wight-aligned" not necessarily being a wight.

$0.02. Not particularly interested in that wagon, I don't think, but Faraday has to call the scumteam

something

, and "Wights" isn't that far-fetched at all given the source material.

[Tierce]

I mean, I guess that Faraday could just flavor the scumteam as wights, but it doesn't seem like Faraday, especially when there are definitely a couple of explicitly undead characters that could get picked.

Sure are, but what if they weren't picked, or were picked and rolled scum? Or were picked and rolled Town and Faraday can make up a reason for those specific characters to be helping the Realm (see: Coldhands)?

I just don't think it's a safe assumption to make that a scumteam isn't named Wights or something like that--we have the Realm with its assorted characters bickering and playing the pointless game of thrones, and we have the Others trying to completely overwhelm the Town. Winds of Winter, etc.

The problem with the Wight theory is a different one: elleheathen is being flavorful in her posts, which means it's probably not a slip of any kind.

With that said, it's a 24p game, this is going to be multiball because Faraday and because common sense.

Still obviously not completely here. I'll have actual content later other than "these things are silly assumptions pls stahp".

Mr Bordenpire, pls to be metaing quadz asap thanks.

[Tierce]

Mine?

(You should watch the movie. You'll change your mind, promise.)

You should read the book.

[Tierce]

This post contains zero game talk, at a time when there should have been game talk. Talks about PnJ, for example, with NO comment on their alignment. Scummy.

How dare I not comment on PnJ's alignment by post 73, gasp. Did you miss the hypocrite comment? The point of that post was to get chesskid to address the game in a way that was relevant to

this

game, which I felt he was not doing. Why am I doing that? Because

I didn't have a read on them

.

Actually, let's go here. That whole post was a lot of actions over motivations.

UNVOTE: Goat on a Boat
VOTE: Amrun

[Tierce]

Mainly because since being voted, all Ella has done is react to her wagon, not scumhunt at all.

You're a bit of a rush there. Game started five hours ago and she's a newbie; sometimes the natural reaction is to react to the wagon and try and understand the logic behind it, not scumhunt directly; she's still trying to figure things out, though, and that's not scummy. Easy with those conclusions, tiger.

[Tierce]

p-edit: You, on the other hand... not so good at reading me, Tierce. And yeah, I expect you (or just about anyone) to make some sort of content comment by post 73. The "hypocrite" part was what made it scummy, to me. You're a very self aware player, and you're aware when you're being hypocritical and you're not. That doesn't actually make you town.

Post 50 and Post 92 not good enough for you? Too bad. I wanted actual game content from PnJ and was trying to obtain it. Right now, I think they are Town (Empire's bit about chesskid's puzzlement was good), I was trying to get it, and I wanted them to do something that was

readable

. Yes, I did so in a post that was more theory than content, and joked about it. Since a) I wasn't calling chesskid's actions as scummy and b) hypocrisy isn't scummy, what is your problem with me saying I was being hypocritical, again? How is self-awareness

scummy

, which is what you're accusing me of?

You're being a sucksack, Tammy. It's easy for anyone to say they agree with how you felt, regardless of the truth. Mine was more FUCK YEAH BADASS WOOMENS. But that's because I'm cooler than you and I had hoped Empire would draw scum for my long-delayed revenge.


Good grief quadz is turning into MoI.

[Tierce]

Good grief quadz is turning into MoI.

ouch

I know, I'd be worried if I were you. Next step is quote-striping.

Also, Tammy is right that she often doesn't act confident. She has this amazing fence that puppies can pass through. I like that you mentioned that, though, albeit your meta knowledge could do with some

blind sheeping of Empire and I on Tammy

updating.

[Tierce]

GREY BAKER

1) Do explain that Borden read.
2) No read on me? Bad wolf.

[Tierce]

1) Do explain that Borden read.

Spoiler:

Are you watching closely?

Vote: Stupendous Man

With this hydra, you're going to be getting Llamarble posting at weird hours while I stick mostly to the morning/afternoon.

Also, we won't be signing our posts as we feel our styles are distinctive enough that you should be able to tell who is who.

Also also, I tried trolling 'marble about our alignment in this game but it failed miserably =/

Mind explaining the vote then?

*rolls magic 8 ball*

"Ask again later."

A ball bounces across the stage

Yay I didn't want to already disagree about who we were voting!

VOTE: Elleheathen

*barks*

This is completely to be expected from Empire. Tammy and I know what he was doing with that first vote, and I can tell you it's probably null (because he knows we know and thus would duplicate it, etc. But he was talking the thread to post as soon as the game opened, and that looks

awesome

because Empire hasn't played scum in ages and would be more cautious as such. Plus he had a

ball!

and even if it is for a prestige

balls!

are awesome.

2) No read on me? Bad wolf.

*takes time sniffing cautiously*

Boring.

[Tierce]

Quick interjection here:

Thor,
1) Have you read/watched the series?
2) Why did you pick Casso?


Empire--I haven't played with quadz in a long time, but yeah, I think he's more comfortable as scum in face to face than he is in the forums.

[Tierce]

Tomorrow/the next day. Timing was terrible.

[Tierce]

Start being more entertaining and we will!

[Tierce]

I have this pocket wind-up Benmage for entertainment purposes. I'll bring him out tomorrow.

013s talking shit.

this site...*sigh*

You're cute when you let them get to you. Site age isn't a measure of competence. What's the problem with Syryana, Benedick?

[Tierce]

Benmage. Calm down. I know you're going through hard stuff IRL, but you don't even know Syryana. He wasn't being disrespectful, at most he was saying you are easy to wind up. Which, let's face it, you are. Besides, grouping people under "013ers" as if that means anything less than you is just as disrespectful as what you're saying others are putting you through. He is a competent player. A troll, yes (if you knew him you'd know his first post in the game was him impersonating fferyllt as if they were hydraing; frankly, it was hilarious), but one of my favorite MSers right now, and it should be pretty obvious I only like people I consider capable and competent. So please step down from your high horse, because you have some behaviors that are reminiscent of poor, inexperienced players. Syryana analyzes the game, is competent as both alignments, and a good asset to the Town (or scum).

Relax. Hunt scum (or be obvscum, please and thank you because I'm not even reading the game so you have to try really hard for me to see it). Let the 013ers and 011ers do their thing. If I don't break the site again tonight (and if I'm not in town, Syr--no promises with your timezone, but we can be night owls together), you'll see them dance. I promise we're excellent waltzers, and the band plays on.

[Tierce]

And with that, Southwest Night Owl is going to bed. >.>

[Tierce]

That goat needs a pirate hat. Pls fix asap, thx.

[Tierce]

Why bother posting a reads list if it's going to be stack of waffles?

Wat. There are 2 reads in there that could be construed as waffling (unless you count his "probably"s as waffling, which is completely ridiculous and you shoud stop doing that). Misreps are not cool.

Skimmed the last four pages like a pro over the time it took me to open my eyes without squinting. I agree with this and was about to call out Amrun for the "question". She hasn't had issues with other reads' lists in this manner before that I can remember, so this really is a nitpicky attitude. Instead of trying to figure out specific things that she feels are wrong about that list, she makes a sweeping loaded question that isn't even accurate. While not bothering to be accurate to past events is something Amrun tends to do, this is

one

event. One post. She misreps it when actively going through it and drops a pointless question.


Thor: you break my heart, seals are awesome. Thankfully, Goat on a Raft repaired it immediately afterward with those avatars. <3


I'm going to be in town tonight again and am deeply amused/kind of worried by the thread explosion as I engage Super Skimmer 3000. >.> Pls send help, I do like to read the walls and have hardly bothered to do with anything not-Prestige. Lokyana of Asgard, burdened with glorious purpose, you should probably start dancing without me. There are some excellent dance partners in this thread and I want to see you play

ball!

.

Someone force Empire to explain his Townread on me so I can abuse it for scum games go on please.

Someone asked my read on Tammy. Have you

looked

at me? I have barely read the game so far.


LLAMARBLE your Amrun Townread needs explaining.

[Tierce]

Let the 013ers and 011ers do their thing.

Apparently the 12ers are chopped liver

With onions.

Currently at a park. Currently not being attacked by angry geese. The situation may change at a second's notice, so excuse me, I need to be alert.

[Tierce]

I can pretty much assure you that Tierce is town in this game

Can you assure me with Tammy as well? I don't think I need it, but it's nice to be reassured.

I was answering Nacho, not you, mollie, I think? But as I said, I'm not reading the game, so I have no idea how you expect me to have answers about alignment that I do not have since my last reads post. :hitoshrug:

[Tierce]

tammy it is bothering me that tierce did not address my question about you except to blow it off and then syrlacious still...trolls.

am I being overly paranoid

oh and can you stop pestering the love of my life?
merciless trolling with minimal content is a mode of Syr-town and I <3 it.

Why the quote?

[Tierce]

Excuse me as I snipe in from the sidelines.

Thor665, who can't read obvTown and obvscum to save his life, is asking to be sheeped on wagoning Empire.

I may need a minute to catch my breath after all that laughter.


This is not a newbie game, Thor. I'd hope you had learned so from ADWD, but apparently notl "Because beard" is a kind of argument that goes nowhere with a playerlist of *actually competent* and somewhat experienced players who realize your charisma isn't nowhere near as capable or competent as you like to make it out to be. Misrepresenting people is not gaining you any favors, either, and the sad part is that you do it regardless of alignment.

I need to (gasp, gosh Tierce) actually read the game, but a bit of thinking last night made me realize this is not a vote I want to bother with on D1 because ~reasons~ and because Tierce likes being cryptic and oh look ball ball ballballball.

UNVOTE: Amrun

[Tierce]

Excuse me as I snipe in from the sidelines.

There was content in that post! It was mostly an excuse for me to unvote Amrun and then I got excited because Thor is kind of silly. So yeah.

I'll get to this when my circadian cycle makes some sense again. Hopefully that means tomorrow.

[Tierce]

I was about to say that the puppy was good and you were promised content from it, Nacho. But if you have me in your list of possible scum you're really getting terrible at this game.

[Tierce]

Oh, was 721 game-related at all?

Nah, they went and eloped on us. A scandal, really, but what thrills.

Can you explain how on earth you happen to have ten scumreads?

[Tierce]

Also if SafetyDance flips scum I am immediately calling for blood and lynching the Nautilius slot for the elleheathen/ellebereth/Ellibereth slip. In fact I am awfully tempted to go there immediately because how the heck do you do that unless Elli is present on your mind due to QT posts. I don't see the first post causing such an impression.

Nacho. You went and drew scum on us?

[Tierce]

Nautilius can you provide (obviously from completed games) QT threads where Elli has posted? Please and thank you.

Bed. I'll drown my sorrows on more Sanderson stuff.

[Tierce]

Yeah I am okay with this.

VOTE: SafetyDance


I hope to wake up and see GOOD THINGS from you, Nacho.

[Tierce]

Give me those QTs. Convince me this wasn't a blatant scum slip from SafetyDance with you as his partner.

In the meantime, I need to go move the pug that decided my pillow was where he wanted to sleep. Night.

[Tierce]

Also if SafetyDance flips scum I am immediately calling for blood and lynching the Nautilius slot for the elleheathen/ellebereth/Ellibereth slip. In fact I am awfully tempted to go there immediately because how the heck do you do that unless Elli is present on your mind due to QT posts. I don't see the first post causing such an impression.

Nacho. You went and drew scum on us?

If it was anyone but Nacho right now I would consider buying into this but I don't think I can accept that he could be scum at the moment.

Neither can I. The beautiful thing is that this is probably multiball (go ahead and deny it again, Zdenek!), so Nacho-scum is one of those freebies I don't have to worry about. SafetyDance's list, though, that one was crap.

Also if SafetyDance flips scum I am immediately calling for blood and lynching the Nautilius slot for the elleheathen/ellebereth/Ellibereth slip. In fact I am awfully tempted to go there immediately because how the heck do you do that unless Elli is present on your mind due to QT posts. I don't see the first post causing such an impression.

Remind me, are you usually a fan of scum-slips or is this one special?

I caught Feysal (at the same time Ser Arthur Dayne did) and Iecerint in ADWD. It depends on the thing--I wasn't enthused by "Wights" being a scumslip from elleheathen, because while it is viable as a name of a scumteam, elleheathen is posting flavorful posts and her reasoning makes sense. But yeah, scum do slip, etc.

Tierce's safetydance vote confuses the shit out of me. splain plz (also, SD's response to it is good)

Holy fucking shit no it's not good. He has ten scumreads after reading the game for the first time? No, quadz. (Bonus factor is that it shows Nacho-scum if he flips scum, but I won't care about Nacho for like three Days). See stuff like this:

A.) Those few lines make all the difference. For all I know you generated that list using an RNG.

B.) I'm also complaining about its actual contents (scum section including my 3 best townreads and literally only one player I think is scum). If your list is going to be that controversial and scumread a whole bunch of players no one else is you need to explain it.

You disagreeing with it doesn't make it controversial. I really don't get why you should have to have an arbitrary amount in your scums reads. I don't know the number of scum. Do you? Last Faraday game I played had just 4+1. So why do you have 6? Know something we don't?

He's not thinking of setup, he's not thinking of relationships between players, this is just a lynch with

ten bloody scumreads

because the poor thing doesn't know the number of scum.


Empire you are pretty and etc. but I really do want commentary on SafetyDance now.

[Tierce]

Nice typo there.

He's not thinking of setup, he's not thinking of relationships between players, this is just a

lynch

list

with

ten bloody scumreads

because the poor thing doesn't know the number of scum.

[Tierce]

17 more posts get moving

[Tierce]

While I agree with the above and I

hate

to use this reasoning, the fact that Benmage is going through difficult stuff IRL may also influence how much of his mood is passing on to his posts, regardless of alignment.

[Tierce]

quadz, post before that:

Oh, was 721 game-related at all?

Nah, they went and eloped on us. A scandal, really, but what thrills.

Can you explain how on earth you happen to have ten scumreads?

[Tierce]

pretended 2 be an idiot dog. his performance was lacking in comparison 2 such greats as tierce and vi

We even have otter plushies. (\u^_^u/)

StupendousMan--why so polite?

[Tierce]

u scum tierce?

can u plz answer teh question?

I'm as Town as they come. ^_^ No, I am not scum.

Please to be stopping defending SafetyDance when he's barely been touched and has yet to reply to satisfaction, kthx.

[Tierce]

Also, Tierce, I don't really buy the SD-Nacho slip thing. That requires them to be connected explicitly via scum QT and I can see SD making that error as town.

I know it does. I'm not voting SafetyDance for the Ellibereth bit.


macmollie--it doesn't matter if he does it or not. I'm telling you to let SafetyDance speak for himself (or reply when asked, as Empire's doing), please. If after he does so you still think he's being unfairly attacked, then by all means. Just don't try to cut the flow at this point.

[Tierce]

mebbe he comes off as forced cos he is newbtown worried about getting lynched.

or you mebbe right and he is scum and his scummates are trying to bus him.

there are actually a lot of reasons why he may across as "forced" but it may have nothing to do with his alignment.

he seems new. he seems like he is trying to find his way. <-----no way I am voting that, if he did something outstandingly scummy then yeah but he hasn't.that is why if he flips scum I will think it is a bus and if he flips town we know where to look.

You're talking about StupendousMan?

Not

that

new. Newer than most people here, sure, but don't use that as an excuse. With that said, I believe that slot is Town, but the over-politeness is somewhat concerning.

[Tierce]

but the over-politeness is somewhat concerning.

Notably, because of this:

It would be beneficial to scum not to make half the people in the game upset.

Which is also bothering me regarding Cephrir about me. That is some mighty high Town pedestal I'm getting from him. While true, he hasn't played with me before and it feels kind of awkward. Like that date you cut off with an "emergency call" because they are starting to feel just a touch too clingy too soon.

Dunno. Might be the sleep talking.

Hey Nacho I still haven't produced real actual content! Whatcha gonna do about it?

[Tierce]

I didn't think it was

that

confusing.

It means that StupendousMan is too concerned about making friends, which he admits is, for him, beneficial for scum.

With Cephrir, the impression I get is that he's buddying up to me.

Travel safe!

[Tierce]

Not

that

new. Newer than most people here, sure, but don't use that as an excuse. With that said, I believe that slot is Town, but the over-politeness is somewhat concerning.

Why call him town and ding him again on the over politeness?
I actually agree that it is weird coming from him, and also agree some of the people handing you pro-town oomph are being odd in general as I haven't seen anything of the sort yet.
I feel like this post is exceedingly fence-sitty and now support the idea of lynching you.
Whassup?

So I can't be wary and want to be damn sure of who I call Town, especially in a game that is likely multiball and probably has something like 6-8 scum? Good to know. ^__^

The things he is hitting seem Town. The way he's going at it seems too overly cautious/polite.

This worries me

. But I guess you can't see it~

As for

you

noticing proTown oomph, :hitoshrug:. You couldn't see it if it was a puppy riding an 18-wheeler with the word TOWN written in golden glittery paint on all sides.

But don't worry, in the future I will keep all my musings in private and only voice Sure Certainties in-thread. We wouldn't want the mighty Thor to think I am being fencesitting scum for thinking things through where others can see it.

tl;dr You wouldn't read me correctly if my role PM was posted in-thread.

[Tierce]

I didn't even see that post, I think? Hang on a moment.

[Tierce]

While I agree with the above and I

hate

to use this reasoning, the fact that Benmage is going through difficult stuff IRL may also influence how much of his mood is passing on to his posts, regardless of alignment.

I don't think so. When The Wire and Yoloville were going on at the same time, Benmage was working hard in Wire despite the circumstances that were making him /effort in Yoloville. I guess it's early to say it for sure but language-wise I'd be surprised if he was scum anything.

Do you think the whole Thor/Benmage thing is something besides two strong ego's butting heads?

Yeah, I'm not worried about Benmage at the moment.

As for Thor, I'm fairly sure he can believe the bullshit he says as scum without a problem--you only need to see his scum QTs to see how he apparently

actually believes

a lot of the stuff he says as scum, which is pretty baffling but essentially boils down to me completely disagreeing with a lot of his Mafia theory handling. /tangent
So while I didn't actually read it that closely yet and forgot most of what I did read, I think that that stuff is very little alignment-relevant for Thor. For Benmage, a bit more so do to his attitude.


Have your posts be more entertaining in the future and I might notice them sooner!

[Tierce]

So I can't be wary and want to be damn sure of who I call Town, especially in a game that is likely multiball and probably has something like 6-8 scum? Good to know. ^__^

If I said that it would be sorta odd, wouldn't it? Good thing I didn't.
Don't you have issue with me "misrepping" all the time? What do you call this? I don't call it a misrep, i call it an extreme take of a conclusion drawn from what I said...but ten I think that's fine to do in a game in order to see reactions from it. What's your call on this strategy, and if it's not what you're doing here...what are you doing here?

The things he is hitting seem Town. The way he's going at it seems too overly cautious/polite.

This worries me

. But I guess you can't see it~

I can understand if it worries you. But why defend him and then condone him?
If you're unsure of him...why defend?
If you want to defend...why condone?
If your read is truly mixed, why jump into the conversation with "as regards this point you raised that no one asked me about...I have no idea at all!"
I hav no idea or opinion about stuff *all the time*. I don't share it with everyone.
What it felt like was a defense post with an excuse to vote later built it - hence fence-sitty.
Do you not see fence-sitting as scummy...or do you not think what you did was fence sitting - clarify either way pl0x!

You're accusing me of scummy fencesitting for voicing that indecision. So no, I am not misrepresenting your position, because even if you did not word it that way on the first line, the whole post had certainly implied it, as you "now support a lynch" on me for voicing doubts on a Townread.

You might not share things with everyone all the time. Neither do I, but I

do

like to discuss them from time to time--and doesn't it seem like a logical thing to do

when you're not sure

? This game is rife with people I work well with and their input on my musings is extremely welcome. If and when I see the need to vote someone, I will do so. Having misgivings on a read and voicing them is perfectly legitimate; I was already looking for word from StupendousMan, so that beautifully-styled fence of mine is older than you think and you didn't seem to have a problem with it then.

[Tierce]

goat people - I do not even remotely want this to be true but he is scum I am pretty sure of it and it makes me want to cry. strongest scumread

I'm also growing more paranoid of Goat; I think I may be unintentionally giving them a pass because CDB is the Coolest Dude.

i think no matter what goat posts anymore im gonna be reading it as scum, no matter how objectively solid it is. its 1 of those reads i dont want to have but its gonna fester like fuck and color my judgments on him for a long time 2 come.

Right, this is getting ridiculous. If

anyone

would like to explain why we're more likely to be scum than town, please feel free, so that we may point out that you are wrong because

come on, guys

.

If you have a problem with our not having strong scumreads, wake up. We are 43 pages into the game, with 24 voters voting for 12 people. The largest wagon has four votes.

There are no obvious scum.

We are wagoning someone not in our now-quite-extensive list of townreads and you can all fucking deal with it.

I like you. Can I keep you?

Also you made me realize that this game is far too long for me to not have read it thoroughly lately but now I'm having too much fun spiting Nacho~

[Tierce]

Goat's response to the mild increase in pressure on them seems... strong. Filing that away for future reference more than anything.

From experience, it is mightily irritating when you're Town and people have the vaguest excuses to vote you out of what seems like nothing but paranoia. The reaction is strong, yes, but anyone that has gone through that knows how

annoying

the situation is. CDB's reaction reads like honest frustration.

[Tierce]

Well hallefuckinglujah, mollie finally showed up. Looking forward to your catchup.

I hope you're trolling. Otherwise you are

really

bad at telling them apart.

And if you are trolling, what you've done re: mollie (see:

nothing

) is a spectacular waste of time.

[Tierce]

I hope you're trolling. Otherwise you are really bad at telling them apart.

And if you are trolling, what you've done re: mollie (see: nothing) is a spectacular waste of time.

I find it spectacularly awesome and ironic that you're taking me to task for doing nothing and wasting time, Tierce.

Ouch. Is gallantry dead in Loki's Landing? Does a lady have to take the first step? Don't tell me Lady Tammy would be jealous of a dance.

You should understand about spiting Nacho

I do have reads and a good share of them are public, explicitly or implicitly. The question of whether you thought it was actually Mac posting so far (and why) was not rhetorical.

[Tierce]

Pedit: Tierce, I was attempting to troll the fuck out of mollie, and you are all up in me shit. Besides, I don't

need

gallantry, because I got bitches

lining up

to be all in me shit. Just ask Tammy and Shadoweh.

...You asked me to dance. Now you're leaving me hanging? When I went to

all this effort

to be awake and stuff?

Wow. Just wow. Excuse me, I may need to hit the bar.

[Tierce]

Blech. That ooba post was dreadful. It's okay though, I needed more scumreads.

Lokyana, darling, I don't understand none of that Asgardian slang.

Do call me when you actually feel like dancing instead of offering empty promises.

Dude, I'm here. I'm still awake. Be more entertaining than Penn & Teller and I'll happily discuss things with you.

Faraday -- there's one vote missing on SafetyDance, yes?

[Tierce]

These are all "bad/new at mafia" tells rather than scumtells.

Please explain how "reads list with no scumhunting process paired with a

lot

of scumreads justified with "oh I don't know the number of scum"" is

not

a scumtell.

We're having issues with this game. As CDB said, so one looks like obvious scum. I have a pathetically low number of scumreads which I

know

must be wrong, especially in multiball, and I know multiball will completely throw my Townreads all over the place and make them wrong because the T/s interactions exist between s1/s2. There are 12 different wagon attempts. And SafetyDance just happens to have ten scumreads. He magics ten scum with no justification, no explanations offered, defending the number as setup-ignorance instead of defending why any of them is scummy--

Do you see the problem here? In a game where people are remarkably difficult to read as scum, not only because of the setup but because we do have several people showing that getting strong scumreads isn't an easy thing, SafetyDance has no trouble churning out ten gakking scumreads on a first read, but they are all "vibes" he hasn't explained, narrowed down or discussed yet. I know this game is likely to have 6-8 scum (possibly a couple more if Faraxus got creative), but damn, I don't think I have more than four scumreads at the moment and I probably couldn't make a decent case for all of them. Ten, in multiball? Dayum, someone has a lot of mislynches he wants to push through.

[Tierce]

This list makes no sense whatsoever. And doesn't have a single reason on it even for the guy he's voting. What?

Cephrir, there's is no difference to my list to the one you posted a few posts down than a few extra lines attached to then.

Like yours, it's mostly a binary list. It's rudimentary, yes, I did quantify that in the very sentence above.

I did think people here had the intelligence to read that and understand it bt maybe I'm giving the site-meta too much credit in that regard.

Ultimately, it's no different to what Nautilius has been doing anyway with their list anyway.

Look at his ISO. Where is the attempt at sorting those people out? Why does he not answer the implicit question (which I believe was made explicit elsewhere) of why Garruk are scummy?

[Tierce]

Post 1104 brought to you by: Not Propped Up By Crappy Mafia Theory But Actually By This Very Game.

(Oh, he'll get it~)

[Tierce]

Lokyana, darling, I don't understand none of that Asgardian slang. Do call me when you actually feel like dancing instead of offering empty promises. Dude, I'm here. I'm still awake. Be more entertaining than Penn & Teller and I'll happily discuss things with you.

Penn & Teller are a hell of an act.

Tell you what.

Town:
Tammy
Empire (Llamarble is scum, though)
Tierce
mollie

Leaning town:
Benmage
elleheathen
Nautilius
Thor (Yes, I hate myself too)
goat
Syryana
pnj - Why are they null to you?

Null:
agar
shadoweh
messiah - I should probably read their posts. >.>
displaced
Amrun
garruk
kanye - I wanted to say leaning Town, but I get the impression he's playing stupid.
Zdenek
Cephrir - more Town than anyone else in this list

should be vig'd/policy'd:
StupendousMan - ...yes.

Scum:
ooba
SafetyDance

So this is even more pathetic than I thought, I don't even have

four

scumreads. That is an awful null mess, been too busy pushing people up the ladder instead of checking out the null pile. :/


AGar, darling, no stabbings. We just had a wedding, let's keep it safe and not bloody.

[Tierce]

AGar, darling, no stabbings. We just had a wedding, let's keep it safe and not bloody.

fiiiiine

I'm reading, but was there anything highlight reel worthy between pages 17 and now? (Still gonna read, but Sparknotes are the shit).

SafetyDance has ten scumreads. Make of that what you will. As for other CliffsNotes, Alfred Borden, Tammy and I are Town and this is pretty much non-negotiable because we just rock like that. (It's kind of unfair, really, but we're really good at reading each other. Feel free to treat us as that really idiotic masonry that claims on D1. Yell at us for it if need be.)

I'd suggest reading and skipping over the overly-elaborated quote wars. Read everything Alfred Borden have posted. When you're done, check your reads and go see if there's more stuff you need to actually read in the walls. Worked just fine for me.

As for the rest of the game, who knows, I didn't read it either. :hitoshrug:

[Tierce]

So this is even more pathetic than I thought, I don't even have four scumreads. That is an awful null mess, been too busy pushing people up the ladder instead of checking out the null pile. :/

So after reading this I'm not sure if you're saying I suck, you suck, or we both suck. Not that any of that is relevant.

Why are you pestering me to dance when you do fuckall with what I give you? Give me some feedback damnit, or pick someone for us to sort.

...you were the one who asked me to dance in the first place.

There was feedback there. Why are PrideandJoy null? Do you share my misgivings about kanye? Why is Cephrir scum to you? And yes, we should go through Messiah Complex, because I have trouble reading Desperado and he tends to have a rather unbalanced play regardless of alignment.

[Tierce]

Well, as for kanye, my only real point of reference for him is Paradox Prime. With respect to this game specifically, I haven't seen anything out and out scummy from him, but you already knew that. What's giving you misgivings, specifically? I'm not getting much from my ISO of him.

Also, I owe you an apology, cause I totally didn't realize until approximately now that you'd modded my list when you quoted it. Sorry.

You're still with that horrid bonneted vixen, I don't know if that apology is worth anything. (That's why I usually don't make alterations in quotes and find them bad form

and it drives me up a wall when people reply to quotes inside the same quote with bold, but that's beside the point

--I was feeling lazy.)

That last bit with Thor and kanye (which, incidentally, pinged Thor-Town for me). kanye's reaction to Thor answering for someone else seemed out of place, as it wasn't any sort of leading question, it was something that jut asked for a clarification. It seems like kanye is trying to ply that "Town who is annoyed at someone ruining their magic" line and doing it out of place--that reaction to Thor doesn't feel like it's coming from Town.

[Tierce]

@Tierce I'm going to stretch and guess when you say that you/Tammy/AB are all excellent at reading one another, you mean specifically one head of AB. Which is it, and how good are you at reading the other? Is it possible the other head could throw your reads?

Empire. And no, considering Empire is making the majority of the posts and is still posting without bawling like a toddler at posting where Tammy and I can see him. Llamarble is not impersonating him.

(It's kind of sad. Empire hasn't played scum in over a year and he hates it as much as I do.)

[Tierce]

ooba - Why am I a "neutral" read?

[Tierce]

ooba - Why am I a "neutral" read?

You're not - You're a "Neutral-" meaning "leaning scum".

Missed that. Better yet! Why?

[Tierce]

Syryana--I see your posts. I'm too exhausted to go through them in any serious manner of analysis. Either way, I hear those divorce proceedings usually take an awfully long time, so I'll get back to you soon.

[Tierce]

Okay. You opened the game calling me leaning Town. When did this change and why didn't the process of this change even get a mention in your reads list?

You say you always read Amrun as scummy--but someone else doing so is surprising and null-scum? They are on the bottom rung of your Townreads and I don't seem to recall you speaking out against either of those situations at the time. Why not? Why not push back against what you consider to be easy pushes on "leaning Town"? Why not dig more at it?

[Tierce]

UNVOTE: SafetyDance
VOTE: ooba

[Tierce]

That would be me.

[Tierce]

Because I don't need to. There's a wagon on the scumread I'd rather see lynched and others be pushing it. I'm

spiting Nacho

coasting like BADASS WOMENS ON A BOAT

taking a well-deserved rest. I'm voicing opinions/questions when I think they need to be voiced. Thread is large enough without me making :effort: walls.

[Tierce]

Hmm. Actually, BADASS WOMENS ON A BOAT would probably be sailing the wind and be all VICTARION IS A WUSS and stuff. Hugging the coast is for chickens like Theon.

Points for "Tbird", in any case.

[Tierce]

He wasn't my favored scumread until I voted him. Do try to keep up (or, alternatively, read my posts and see how I've been poking more at Townread stuff than scumread stuff).

The wine of the Arbor is sweet and winter isn't coming yet. Plenty of time for summer children to frolic.

[Tierce]

how come you mention his wagon as a reason youre not really doin anything initially then if my question was more broad than as of 4 pages ago ? i dont see the relevance @ that point.

I've already told you. I don't need to. If I had more solid scumreads I would be pushing them. If I was figuring out a way of rooting out more solid scumreads I would be doing it. I need to sort through Syryana's posts and work from there (tomorrow, she says), but I'm not going to run myself ragged unnecessarily when I'd rather approach the game through Townreads anyway.

[Tierce]

...Tierce zeroing in on Nacho? I'm

joking

with him, and he knows it. He also knows I have trouble reading him, and that frankly I'm treating him as Town Today (and probably until something like D3) because Nacho is a goddamn freebie if this is multiball. It's what happens to players with a reputation who draw scum in multiball: they bite it, because the other team can't afford to let them live because hey, they be dangerous. And no, I am not downplaying my play to not eat a kill by "the other scum team", before you assume that's what I'm doing. From experience, I can play the lousiest, most obvious scum game imaginable and still eat a cross-kill because the SK thinks I am a Town PR. >.>

I can tell you why this is multiball almost without a shade of a doubt. I've talked with Faraday, both in person and online/on the forums, about how unfeasible it is to have games this size (I believe he actually used the number 24, which is frankly the practical limit--can you imagine something like 12 Days, if there isn't a Vig/Weak Roles/etc.? No thank you) without something accelerating the Night kills. That is either weird mechanics, which isn't so much Faraday's purview (see Vi's Maf.Maiden for a game that did have alternative wincons), or with multiple killing factions. That doesn't mean vigs, that means two scum teams and/or a Serial Killer. (No, we don't have three scum teams, stop being unused to site meta. 23-{X+Y}:X:Y:2 is possible, though.)

I am genuinely taking this easy. I like the majority of this playerlist (a rarity), I love the flavor, I fucking love my character, and I have a good spread of Townreads. I may not be doing all that you expect of me, but anyone who

does

know both my Town play and scum play (unlike you and Mac) can tell you they are quite different. I'm relaxed, because goddammit I haven't gotten a break in a Mafia game that wasn't tugging at my nerves for one reason or another for

months

and I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying having people who can accurately read me in the game and not having to give a fuck about being voted for idiotic stuff, and still relieved as fuck the fact that I drew Town in these conditions. I'd say the word is "carefree", even though it's not literally accurate. Worry-free? Maybe something like that. You know those vacation package photos of a woman on a pool with a drink and sunglasses? That's me about this game. Knowing myself, I'll start fretting over this soon enough, so I'm enjoying the chlorine and sunshine while my brain doesn't go into full-blown tinfoil.

But you're saying I'm not doing

anything

, and that isn't accurate. I might not be doing things that you understand (this doesn't mean that I think you're stupid, just that what I'm doing might not be obvious), but don't assume there's nothing there whatsoever. If you want stuff from me, talk with me.

[Tierce]

DeliGoat: Where's the lemon?

[Tierce]

And not a peach. Not a single goddamned peach.

Why, HBO. Why.

(We got lobster and ham. WHY NOT A PEACH.)

[Tierce]

Actual post in a few hours.

[Tierce]

Behold my glorious

drive-by vote

contribution! What is this "actual post" thing.

UNVOTE: ooba
VOTE: SafetyDance

[Tierce]

Oh, something else that had stuck out to me. Nacho already went through it, but yeah, quadz, macmollie is a bad lynch. The inane paranoia is annoying and rather nonsensical, but it's not scummy.

[Tierce]

lolcuts DAMNIT TIERCE

I CAN SEE THE FUTURE
And I don't even need some disgusting leeches or some silly FWOOOOSHing flames.

And no, macmollie shouldn't spontaneously combust, though I'm rather chomping at the bit to return the favor there. Plus, haggis, ew. Seriously, Llalfred?


I get the feeling the Amrun situation is sitewide, though I wouldn't lose any sleep over murder death kill there. That's a slot I'm not taking RL excuses from.

[Tierce]

Benmage: why Thor over SafetyDance?

[Tierce]

Heh. I'm pretty fine with Benmage regardless, but stumped at this whole 63 page thing as he sits on a wagon going nowhere. Doesn't seem practical.

[Tierce]

Sooo getting SafetyDance riled up isn't going to fix anything. Stop trying to push him like that.

Let's say I entertain this claim for a moment. Yes, you do need to claim your character name and your abilities. Partial claims are not going to fly under the pretext of "you're not lynching Thor-miller so you're not lynching me because double standards lol". I want a full claim out of you.

My home internet is down, so phone posting, slow, etc.

[Tierce]

Yes, full claiming is definitely more proTown than this cheeky claim dodging you're doing. It's a 24p game, likely multiball, likely with protection roles. Fullclaiming is better than getting lynched if you are Town, and getting lynched after fullclaiming as Town is far better than claimdodging, because this game is only partial reveal. If you are Town, stop being an idiot and claim.


PEdit: what My Little Phoenixeh said.

[Tierce]

Tammy, please shut up. I know how you feel, I understand, trust me. You're not helping right now. Take a break.

SafetyDance--claim.

[Tierce]

He just did. Easy.


Have you posted in the QT?

What is "para"?

[Tierce]

It's a null claim. It's not the flavor he claimed, it's that Faranexus would very likely have such a role as either Town or scum and wouldn't likely be one of those roles that need severe adjustment after checking for alignment.

Why do you say your reads are worthless?

[Tierce]

Author Mafia had a scum fruit vendor. It's only useful in the sense that it makes a role confirmable, but is no indication of alignment until we are down to one kill and we can guarantee he can't kill and act in the same Night + has no buddies, etc.

And Nexus recently had a game with a partnerless Neighbor.

[Tierce]

No, SafetyDance. The issue is *you never explained the reads on that list*. It's a list with a lot of scumreads and a lot of unexplained stuff that you never went over. Why are you criticizing Tammy without taking a stance on what it means about her alignment?

The point is that you need to show your work. No one is a mind reader, so if you're being accused of stuff that makes sense with what you have graced us with--that reads list and a hop on a policy lynch with no other contribution--and you don't bother to refute it with actual FACTS like explaining your reads, no one is forced to believe you. Go ahead. Explain those reads, explain why you thought a policy lynch was the way to go, and why you have not been contributing until today.

And your "I told you so" is wrong, young grasshopper. If you're Town and get lynched, now we can use your role for setup analysis.

[Tierce]

UNVOTE: SafetyDance

Messieurs Borden, a moment of your time, if you please.

Benmage, I'm phone posting. The more I have to PEdit the slower I get.

[Tierce]

still happy w. thor lynch. ambivalent towards safetydance. i dont like that he disappeared until he finally had to respond to the wagon on him, and his reaction thus far has been underwhelming.

id also like to remind everyone that roles were created before alignments were assigned so if you are backing off of sd because of his claim id like to hear what about his claim has you backing off.

Roles may have been modified after alignment assignment, though.

[Tierce]

Unvote

Oh my god, I want this guy to be scum so so fucking badly but I just can't bring myself to keep my vote on him. Based on what I know of him, I'll be absolutely fucking floored if he's reacting this way as scum.

Thor's probably the least bad of the major wagons right now since my last talk with 'marble had lessened my scumread on ooba considerably.

Vote: Thor

One of 'marble/myself will be around near deadline, I think, if anything happens.

P-edit: Really kanye? In that one scum game I looked at, this dude pretty much awkwardly clammed up under pressure. The reaction here is like night and day.

Same thoughts on the reaction. It's especially the "I told you so" attitude. Why wouldn't he claim a role he thought had a better chance of escaping the lynch? Doesn't make sense, he doesn't seem like the kind of scum player who would do that as an extra layer of WIFOM.

I think Thor is Town--the stuff he's been accused at is the kind of thing he does regardless of alignment. Not voting there unless we need that vote by deadline.

Thoughts on Messiah Complex? 1671 bothers me, he's not looking deeply enough.

[Tierce]

How am I not looking deeply enough Tierce? I'm looking at SD's content, or lack thereof. He has Syry as uber town and Thor as a policy lynch. He has no read on Ooba, the other main wagon. He has no read on you or Tammy, the two people who orchestrated the push on him just now. How is any of this coming from the mindset of "I'm town and about to die?"

It's not GOOD Town play. He's not a competent player who realized he needed to get all his ducks in a row and do the best for Town in his final hours. He chose differently, but it does not make it play coming from scum. He was aware his claim was not going to help him--why would someone who is for all practical effects a poor scum player not want a BETTER claim than what he claimed? Even if it is his actual scum role, I don't see how he wouldn't have dressed it up. JoATs are easy to "redesign" to suit your purposes. Look at 4nxi3ty's claim in ADwD. Couldn't resist the urge to make himself be the bestest looking JoAT as scum. SafetyDance went with what he had and keeps insisting this is not useful information for Town after giving it--scum would be showing how good he is for contributing this data. It doesn't make sense as scum.

PEdit: What Benedick said (again).

As for D1 claims, I don't really have a problem with those.

I want to check something, back in a moment.

[Tierce]

This is all but impossible to do on a phone. I need a favor: can someone go through Faraday and his hydras' games and see if he has millers? Check the role PMs, he might not call them millers explicitly. I'd like the accounts Faraday, Eddard Stark, The Baltimore Sun, Lost Butterfly and Vu checked for this. I don't think I missed any recent modding accounts, but please remind me if I did.


I'm on my phone, Empire. Please ISO me for Thor thoughts. IIRC it was a reaction to a certain point, can't quite remember.

[Tierce]

This is all but impossible to do on a phone. I need a favor: can someone go through Faraday and his hydras' games and see if he has millers? Check the role PMs, he might not call them millers explicitly. I'd like the accounts Faraday, Eddard Stark, The Baltimore Sun, Lost Butterfly and Vu checked for this. I don't think I missed any recent modding accounts, but please remind me if I did.

I just scanned Faraday's wiki and there has been no Town Miller in any of his MS games (and there was definitely no miller in The Wire Season 1, only game modded under The Baltimore Sun account).

Can someone else please check this through the Search function on the forums? His wiki is outdated, IIRC.

[Tierce]

This is all but impossible to do on a phone. I need a favor: can someone go through Faraday and his hydras' games and see if he has millers? Check the role PMs, he might not call them millers explicitly. I'd like the accounts Faraday, Eddard Stark, The Baltimore Sun, Lost Butterfly and Vu checked for this. I don't think I missed any recent modding accounts, but please remind me if I did.

I just scanned Faraday's wiki and there has been no Town Miller in any of his MS games (and there was definitely no miller in The Wire Season 1, only game modded under The Baltimore Sun account).

Can someone else please check this through the Search function on the forums? His wiki is outdated, IIRC.

Seriously, this doesn't take that long and might be vital information. It'd take me five times that long on my phone. Please, someone do this for me.

[Tierce]

I

finally

managed to go through them. Thanks anyway, Tammy.


Yeah, Faraday doesn't use millers in the MS meta. Why? Because normal cops are boring stuff.

VOTE: Thor665

[Tierce]

roles came before alignments

Incorrect. This is a wrongful assumption in many uPicks.

Characters came before alignment. Role design may have partially come before alignment, but it's even stated in the rules it may have suffered alterations afterwards. Go look at Vi's Maf.Xenologue for an example. There was a Town and a scum version of Soren in case our slot had rolled scum; Vi kept the idea and revealed it in the postgame.

So no, I don't think he's a Town miller in a Faraday game.

And that's a flavor miller, Shadoweh. Very different thing, Faraday likes flavor/vanilla/goon cops. Because that's the kind of role that doesn't get absolutes.

[Tierce]

Oh, please. On the day me explaining myself makes me scum, you'll be the firsts to know.

mollie, I didn't do that. That was SafetyDance. What I said was "post in a few hours". I was busy for a while, and chose to jump right in instead of providing pointless commentary and :effort: walls.

My point is not that Thor is a poor Miller who happened to roll Town. My point is that Faraday does not use Millers as a role for Town, and thus has no reason to assign it in a game other than for shits and giggles *to people he already knows are scum*, which is what Tammy said happened with her partner in Westeros. This means Thor is not a Miller, because it's a silly thing to do before alignments are assigned and a role that Faraday doesn't use to balance Town negatively, thus was not added post-alignments--that makes Thor scum.

Additionally, he's trying to paint me as if I was retroactively amending my position on this post-facto, when it was pretty obvious what I meant when I voted him and after reading Tammy's point on Westeros games.

[Tierce]

Also, really curious on how Thor thinks the fact that I was talking about (normal) millers v. flavor millers is relevant since he claimed regular miller.

Why are flavor millers cool? Because they can be Hidden millers without being obnoxious. Because people know flavor cops may not always be trusted--they are not absolute roles. And you will note that the ADwD "flavor millers" were

Masons

. They could defend themselves from that "Hidden flavor miller" issue.

Regular cops and regular millers are boring for Faraday, which is evidenced by him using a scum Miller to spice things up. Here--Thor is not a Town Miller, which makes him not Town.

There, now you have two posts explaining my point with the whole miller-hunt through Faraday games.

Gasp two whole posts about it

she sure likes over-explanation!.

[Tierce]

Won't be around at deadline, most likely. My vote stays.

[Tierce]

@Faraday: Garruk are voting Thor, not themselves.

[Tierce]

Tammy--you said Faraday used millers in Westeros. Different metas, and scum millers are completely different than regular Town millers. Whatever. I could go on a rant on how you could have clarified that instead of bitching SafetyDance out, but right now I am all out of patience for yelling at you or anyone except these two.

Garruk: there are

no words

. Permanent?

[Tierce]

Oh, please. What a remarkable effort you're going to to misunderstand what they actually said. Nice one about their reads, too!

macmollie, you're voting Town. Scum Garruk had no reason to push a pissed-off Tammy off me when they did.

[Tierce]

tierce I just iso-ed them and I didn't see where they did that?

They did. They have a pretty damn good reason to think I'm Town.

[Tierce]

Town, leaning Town, both null.

[Tierce]

If I had thought that far out I would be voting!

Putting it simply: had a long day yesterday and going to have a long one today. I'll get back to this.

[Tierce]

vote terizo

Damn, you're good at this!

[Tierce]

Tammy: Why CAN'T messiah and Tierce be scum together? They both seem fairly scummy to me.

One, it was not Messiah Complex, it was Garruk. Second, right, because damn you are good at reading me and have really been trying to do so!

As for you not being "able to handle real life", you can take your RL AtE and shove it. If you're not well enough to handle this game, replace out. Voting you for your lack of presence in the game and trying to push you to contribute when you have yet to do anything worth attention is something you should be

expecting

at this point. You've had plenty of time and no one forces you to sign up for multiple games when you are perfectly aware that it's a time when your life gets in the way. You make this kind of lame excuse in every game and it's extremely irritating. Get your priorities and your life in order before insisting that others have to accept it in a game you signed up for out of your goddamned free will.


I mean, it's perfectly obvious that something happened between Garruk and I that tells them I am Town. You can't even be bothered to look through this stuff (or know who you are talking about), or see how ridiculous a connection it would trace between us if I were to flip scum.

[Tierce]

You still have plenty of time in the evening to add that pirate hat to the goat, CDB.

[Tierce]

...Alchemist is Syryana, quadz.

[Tierce]

Just going with what I'm told.

Did Syry get replaced by Alchemist or is that mechanical?

Yes and yes :p

[Tierce]

Also, Amrun's "I can't believe you people think I'm scum because of a sitewide activity issue" was super town because I went through something extremely similar and I never ever would have considered saying it in a scum game. She probably knew it would look bad as she was giving the excuse and she didn't give a shit because she thought the suspicion on her really was that ridiculous--towntowntown.

- Des

She does it regardless of alignment.

[Tierce]

Also, Amrun's "I can't believe you people think I'm scum because of a sitewide activity issue" was super town because I went through something extremely similar and I never ever would have considered saying it in a scum game. She probably knew it would look bad as she was giving the excuse and she didn't give a shit because she thought the suspicion on her really was that ridiculous--towntowntown.

- Des

She does it regardless of alignment.

That's great, does she sound as perfectly frustrated-town as she did in her responses to Nautilius as both alignments also?

- Des

Let's put this bluntly and shortly because I am still on edge about someone doing this: Amrun has used grief for the death of a family member as an excuse not to post as scum,

and

felt perfectly okay with others giving her a pass for it. While I do not doubt she has RL issues, she is not above using them as an excuse and throwing a tantrum because she knows it hits a chord.

[Tierce]

I don't think it's

faked

. I'm saying that I don't believe she is bothered on a moral level about doing something like what she did in this thread, and so it becomes very easy, regardless of alignment, to act frustrated in response to Nacho, because the source of the matter is genuine (RL issues). The only thing I do extract from her response is that she's not Nacho's partner. The force of the reaction is null.

[Tierce]

@mod - this slot will be V/LA until Sunday the 6th. Apologies for the inconvenience.

Tick tock, Empire.

[Tierce]

Also, Amrun's "I can't believe you people think I'm scum because of a sitewide activity issue" was super town because I went through something extremely similar and I never ever would have considered saying it in a scum game. She probably knew it would look bad as she was giving the excuse and she didn't give a shit because she thought the suspicion on her really was that ridiculous--towntowntown.

- Des

She does it regardless of alignment.

That's great, does she sound as perfectly frustrated-town as she did in her responses to Nautilius as both alignments also?

- Des

Let's put this bluntly and shortly because I am still on edge about someone doing this: Amrun has used grief for the death of a family member as an excuse not to post as scum,

and

felt perfectly okay with others giving her a pass for it. While I do not doubt she has RL issues, she is not above using them as an excuse and throwing a tantrum because she knows it hits a chord.

That's a pretty big statement to make. You better have something to back that up (like meta) then just speculation.

...

So you think I would say that someone used the death of a family member to garner sympathy and coast

as scum

as

speculation

?

No, darling. I was in that game. Vanillaside, run by Quilford. Large Normal. Amrun was scum. I was an Innocent Child who replaced Nacho. This game is lost to the ether from the 2012 forum crash, but Shadoweh was in it and I still have access to the scum QT where she mentions that I was letting her coast. And I have a goddamn good memory for people who show that their RL excuses are stuff that cannot be trusted in a game. It's on the same level as Knight of Cydonia using cancer to coast--guess what, he was scum. Cancer is a terrible thing, grief for a family member is a terrible thing, but if you use it as an excuse as scum, don't count on my sympathy in the future. I don't care whether it's "fair play"--it's also fair play to be cold-hearted about such people.


As for Alfred Borden's post, learn to distinguish between them. That was Llamarble, not Empire, who is the one who has been V/LA and made their latest post.

And guess what, my Garruk Relentless Townread explanation was useful because it gets people to vote someone who is not obvious Town~ If you find that it is nonsense, then by all means argue with me about it. Don't call it nonsense and ignore me.

[Tierce]

Wooo the above post was more useless than if I had been posting fluff. I'll go back to

coasting on Garruk's statement about me

lurking and making Zdenek chomp at the bit~

[Tierce]

I'm not even voting. Sheesh.


SafetyDance, why does a person voting Amrun even give a fuck about me saying that what she did in regards to RL excuses was

null

?

[Tierce]

!Syryana, care to enlighten us on why AGar is scum?

[Tierce]

Edit - ask Tammy.

No, I'm asking

you

, because you're voting Amrun and turned to me like what I was saying was something completely off the wall that I was "speculating" on. Why, when

you

are voting Amrun, do you care that

I

say that Messiah Complex's Townread on her actually has faulty reasoning because it's a null behavior?

[Tierce]

My point is that you don't get the luxury to sheep Tammy when you were Townreading Amrun Yesterday, not give any reasoning for this vote, and then stomp your foot at me when I was making a statement about Amrun's

null

reaction to Nautilius.

You had a null read on Tammy, a scumread on Alfred Borden, a Townread on Amrun, and end up sheeping Messieurs Borden and Tammy onto Amrun. WTF? I don't care about your little ego trip, if you're going to not play the game just get out. You were doing something Yesterday, but Today you are absolutely refusing to do anything worth reading. Get off that high horse and explain yourself.


Also

Llamarble

was being active. Since you apparently don't know their posting styles, I'm telling you that Llamarble has been posting, Empire was the one V/LA. Accept a reality that has no bearing in the game and

move on

.

...And not being "obvious Town" by your standard mean that I cannot explain how Garruk is obvious Town by my standard, from my point of view? Well done, excellent job there. Come now. Why would Garruk come into D2 defending me as they did from Tammy if they were scum? Why would they do that if they were my scumpartners? The logical following is that, if it does not make sense for them to do it as scum (which it does not, and you are free to argue with me on why it does make sense from your PoV since you are calling it "nonsense"), then we are both Town.

Not rocket surgery.

[Tierce]

Whatever. I have better things to do than attempting to extract responses from someone who decides to not play the game. Just do everyone involved a favor and don't sign up for games if you're going to be all pouty that someone called you out on being useless. Self-fulfilling prophecies are nice like that.

!Syr, AGar a question for you. And me and my absolutely appalling puns will be over there. (>")>

[Tierce]

Also, re: that alt being cryptic/roleplaying/whatever, I don't think so; there's only one player on the site who posts like that.

Hard to fake, that!

[Tierce]

Oh, you sweet summer child.

[Tierce]

!Syr, AGar a question for you. And me and my absolutely appalling puns will be over there. (>")>

Uh... I don't see a question?

You missed my terrible pun, then. It was to not-Syr.

[Tierce]

SafetyDance, if we wanted to do more than winking and nudging about role-related stuff we would have done so. We did what was necessary for us in the circumstances--and it is quite enough. Again, if you have a problem with that,

ask

instead of saying it's useless.

[Tierce]

!

[Tierce]

eeeeeee

Welcome!

[Tierce]

Tierce why aren't you voting Amrun?

Because I think her behavior is mindboggingly irritating, but null.

[Tierce]

And I'm still working, yes. It takes a long time. That's why it has been difficult to do, because finding a large enough chunk of time to sit down and do this is near impossible.

Hey, guess what? You are in this game because you want to be. You've had plenty of opportunities to drop out if it is that much of a burden. If you decide to stick through the difficulties and do it,

just freaking do it

. The time you spent complaining about a previous game could have been devoted to catching up. No more excuses.

[Tierce]

Borden-Empire - I've seen this post that you once made about Tierce's meta that you once made. I'll try digging it up if you can't remember it. I know Tierce likes to cite it as a reference to her meta. How do you think her play in this game fits with that earlier opinion?

Oh, this should be fun~ Pulling out the big guns already! Garruk vouching for me not enough for you?

*rests chin on hands*

[Tierce]

Not really helping your case, Agar. I clearly stated intent and gave a timeframe. You know, like how people who are not fools or scum do things. I wouldn't have even done it though if you hadn't set up the hammer though--half of this game is understanding tempo, and with the L-1 vote lain, someone was going to take the bait. I was hoping to head it off with our intent, but it didn't work.

And I am not giving a pass on SpyreX's hammer, but I find it paradoxically MORE acceptable than the person who sets up the hammer, ie you--you were baiting the hammer with that vote and you fucking know it. I mean, I pulled the exact same ploy in Syryana's Open, so I should know.

You find it more acceptable that someone hammered off of 12 pages of reading than someone voting to put someone at L-1.

Gotcha.

Good thing that's not what they said, and good thing that you're looking for what is "acceptable" over what is actually scummy,

non

? How the heck do you think scum Garruk start Today wondering out loud if they should claim? What sensible scum would do that? But no, you're just interesting in painting people badly, like you did with Amrun. And fuck me, as good as that lynch felt in a "stop signing up for games already if you're going to be a useless wretch" level, your vote on it was trash, because you sure as hell knew that this kind of annoying delay isn't scummy. It's something to put pressure on to force them to deliver and actually reveal alignment, but that L-1 vote was bullshit.

VOTE: AGar

Messieurs And Dragons Oh My!, with us.

[Tierce]

still don't like agar wagon, especially vs. Spyrex wagon (as he says, hammering based on 12 pages of reading is Supah Scummeh)

And how about you

ask him

what his reasoning was besides the fact that SpyreX is SDC and thinks quickhammers are

ridiculously stupid

fun?

[Tierce]

"The sky is falling, the sky is falling!" Pity no one thinks to ask "

why

is the sky falling".

[Tierce]

I mean, it's not even the "heh, fuck your defense, I think you're scum and you can wiggle out of it if I engage in actual discussion with you" angle that is plied by some players against certain other players. It's just a bland sort of pushing paper around. Get some force behind that push or don't bother going "this wagon is bad and oh look this person did this something that is BAD". Gah. It's like drinking americanos, that's how bland that is, quadz.

Me and my gaming session will be over here getting things

done

. Because someone must.

[Tierce]

Better. At least you're talking his language. Could do with more skulls for the skull throne and taunting about boring ass vanilla cats, but it'll do,

I guess

.

[Tierce]

Are you familiar with the book series, Natirasha?

[Tierce]

Spoiler: A Storm of Swords spoilers, relevant to "where do whores go"

"Where do whores go" is a reference to Tysha, Tyrion's first wife. Tywin Lannister had her raped by his guards and finally by Tyrion himself, upon which she was taken away. At the end of

A Storm of Swords

, Tyrion asks Tywin what happened with Tysha, and his answer was that she went "wherever whores go". Might be Littlefinger's brothels, might be some other brothel, might be dead.

The point is that Tyrion never finds out, as far as we know--so I believe your ability is just Faraday messing with you.

[Tierce]

Eeeengh.

UNVOTE: AGar

Need to think.

[Tierce]

I'll get back to you.

[Tierce]

hey tierce whats your stance on garrcuk?

You're kidding, right?

[Tierce]

vote garruck

Okay, part two! Why?

[Tierce]

io think hes scum and btw i think the argument of "hes not scum cus he said im town" is dumb because thats what you when you are scum in that situation (especially this early in the game.) i was gut reading him all d1 as scum and his deadline dancing was ass (as bad as yours) and i really wish thor was alive now instead of him *ksises fingers and peace signs the sky,"much love 2 my boy rip"

oh yah also his play around amrun wagon.

The way in which they said I'm Town (I know things you don't~) and wanting to claim Today makes them as much Town as can be, really. I don't like their ISO either, but their actions speak pretty loudly.

[Tierce]

PeaceBringer got called scum and replaced out. My experience is that do this disproportionately more often than town.

Wrong.

[Tierce]

PeaceBringer got called scum and replaced out. My experience is that do this disproportionately more often than town.

Wrong.

I'm pretty sure that it's not.

And I'm pretty sure that it is. Not only do you have to take into account PeaceBringer's recent history on the site, but also that Town will often not react to being called scum as you think they should. Everyone is different. And with Town:scum proportions and the fact that replacement ratios are frankly as null as can be as seen on several attempts at analyzing replacement ratios in the post, the burden is on you to prove how are scum more likely to replace out when being called scum than Town. Everyone is always being called scum all the time, you can't pick and choose and say that your experience shows that it is scum who primarily replace out under those circumstances.

[Tierce]

AGar--when you get back, less anger, less frustration, less pointless aggression, please. Need you to be as objective as possible. Hope everything is well.

[Tierce]

and tammy's town too.

Wow. Pushover.

[Tierce]

If you're doubting me Nacho we're going to need to have words and they will be words about you being scum.

Oi. Excuse me? How the hell are you treating someone who, to all appearances, is a Townread of yours, with a

threat

? You'd better call me Town or I'll call you scum! ...what is this crap? You're not interested in the nature of the Townread, you're interested in having it? Color me bothered.

[Tierce]

You'll find no meta-hating support here, Ur-Quan. But support for

poorly

done meta analysis, sign me up~

Nacho has only ever read me incorrectly when he was scum

So what? That's no excuse to threaten him, and that's piss-poor threatening technique, even. Instead of laying back and seeing if he actually scumreads you so you can nail him to the wall with "hey guys this is Nacho scum and this is why", you're laying down a bullshit justification for trying to repress his read. Does everyone always manage to read everyone correctly? No. Does Nacho always manage to read everyone correctly? Ahahaha

no

. You're not interested in knowing why Nacho apparently doesn't have a full-blown Townread on you, or at least one he wants to bring up v. SpyreX. You're just trying to cow him.

And that, my friend, means I get to do this--
VOTE: Cephrir

Mew.

[Tierce]

Actually. How did you EVER think I was talking about Amrun from what I said?

Even more important, in a game where the role has nothing to do with the alignment, why were you pushing for a

claim

?

Oh, come now.

[Tierce]

Actually. How did you EVER think I was talking about Amrun from what I said?

Even more important, in a game where the role has nothing to do with the alignment, why were you pushing for a

claim

?

Oh, come now.

No. How, from my words would you get I was talking about Amrun ?

And, if its the latter no way. You vote to make people dead. You dont vote for a claim. She didn't even say it was a lolpressure vote to get the fabled content. It was for the claim and in the best of worlds that stinks to high heaven.

On the former:

I'm up to page whole twelve and I hop across to see this?

This is too perfect for too many reasons.

Unvote, Vote: Amrun

I don't see why she (or anyone, including me) wouldn't think that "I have a scumread on Amrun" is one of those "too many reasons".

As for the latter, no. Not everyone votes for a lynch. Ask the majority of the people in the Amrun wagon; people wanted to see content out of her, and pressure is one way to achieve it. But that wasn't even my point, my point was that a claim, flavor and role, may not only be relevant for alignment (as Faraday games have plenty of informative/investigative/knowledgeable roles that can confirm other people), but also,

roles don't flip

. It HELPS to have claims before lynches, and what a person claims to have DONE with their role

is indeed relevant to alignment

. You're neglecting all these very sensible, Town-based aspects relevant to someone wanting a claim in a uPick to try and paint elleheathen's stance as scummy.


Cephrir, please stop bothering me by looking Town at inopportune moments, thanks.

[Tierce]

It's a nulltell but SpyreX could still totally be (and probably is) scum. I don't mind riding stupid hammer rage to kill a hard to lynch SpyreX-scum.

Wow this is awful. Can you explain HOW spyrex totally could be and probably still is scum? You haven't actually presented anything saying why you think Spy is scummy except "he wouldn't have hammered in such a boring way." (So far as I can see, if I'm missing something, please point it out.) Even your gigantic post is full of nothing but townreads, with a bit tacked at the end that says "I'd lynch these three dudes but I ain't tellin' you why."

That said, your gigantic set of posts was a decent start when taken out of the no-case-on-spyrex context, so I'm somewhat of two minds on it.

This is appalling. What's the problem with Townhunting? And what's your problem with Nautilius's handling of SpyreX when YOU were pushing SpyreX as well?

Done with Cephrir. His reaction to me was unpleasantly Town.

UNVOTE: Cephrir

More sleep, then thinking on this.

[Tierce]

What case on SD, AGar was voting ooba and said SD's list was a null-tell

Looked back and you are correct. If so, then why did Spyrex present it like AGar was using that as a case? Or did Spyrex mean that AGar presenting it as null was, in fact, scummy?

Spyrex also just claimed his role interacts with hammers. He probably saw L-1, saw 'IF HAMMER = USE POWER' and thought 'I'M GOING TO VEGAS'.

This reasoning can go jump off a goddamned bridge. Unless his power is "hammer a dude or two and WIN GAME," it's not worth hammering

someone you cannot possibly have a read on

.

I'm really confused about why so many people are saying thinks like Spyrex is bad, but LOL we can forgive him, vote someone else.

It's making me nervous.

this post is so awful. I agree with the first sentence in theory, but I don't think there are actually many people saying that in practice, so it's basically "this sounds good I'll say it." The second sentence is just fucking terrible. Are the "so many people" saying that all scum? Bad bad bad. (Benmage puts it nicely when he says it's disingenuous.)

Kanye continues to be holy-shit levels of town, and his 2329 point is quite good.

AH AH AH NAUTILIUS WHAT THE FUCK IS YOUR POSTING GOD AGH GET IT OFF GET IT OFF. (Seriously, you come into the thread with "x and y are town, oh and z wants to be town? sure she's town too" and

nothing else

? no fuck that
VOTE: Naut

In what universe is that case on SD 'perfectly valid'? There are some who were on him that were more legit than others, but parroting the volume of scum reads as some kind of magic tell sarcasm font isn't it. I didn't even blink an eye at it catching up.

I'm not 'justifying' it. I had reasons but even if I didn't I probably would have taken it - I'm just sayin after the fact I dont feel bad about it. If it was some kind of really bad wagon I shot through I'd have felt bad, at least. It is what it is. Replace into a hammer early? I'm takin it almost every time. This time it was just even more perfect.

Clarify for me if you thought AGar was calling SD scum or null with what you quoted, please.
Also, show me examples of you taking that opportunity in the past, or expressing willingness to do so. Forgive me if I don't just take your word for it.

oh christ Cephrir's 2348 is just fucking awful. I will be watching that one with interest.

It's a nulltell but SpyreX could still totally be (and probably is) scum. I don't mind riding stupid hammer rage to kill a hard to lynch SpyreX-scum.

Wow this is awful. Can you explain HOW spyrex totally could be and probably still is scum? You haven't actually presented anything saying why you think Spy is scummy except "he wouldn't have hammered in such a boring way." (So far as I can see, if I'm missing something, please point it out.) Even your gigantic post is full of nothing but townreads, with a bit tacked at the end that says "I'd lynch these three dudes but I ain't tellin' you why."

That said, your gigantic set of posts was a decent start when taken out of the no-case-on-spyrex context, so I'm somewhat of two minds on it.

...huh-huh. Yeah, this is terrible.

VOTE: quadz08

[Tierce]

Tierce, can you expound on that quadz vote, please? Is there more than meets the eye? (Not a dig, just your votes today have felt off-the-hip so I want to know if this one matches that profile or if you have deeper reasoning there)

They haven't really been off-the-hip--I've been trying to think things through, and occasionally it's only after I place a vote that I realize something and/or something happens that makes me change that read.


Anyway, on quadz--yes, he's perfectly allowed to have scumreads both on Nautilius and on SpyreX, but the form of the attack on Nacho for Nacho's stance on SpyreX was off. And his whole attack on Nacho over his latest posts is superficial; the things he has issue with make no sense from a Town PoV. Look at this:

AH AH AH NAUTILIUS WHAT THE FUCK IS YOUR POSTING GOD AGH GET IT OFF GET IT OFF. (Seriously, you come into the thread with "x and y are town, oh and z wants to be town? sure she's town too" and

nothing else

? no fuck that
VOTE: Naut

First point: Nacho was replying to SpyreX's list of reads:

Benmage
Cephrir
Garruk Relentless
Messiah Complex
quadz08
Shadoweh
Tammy
Tierce

Tierce is town.
Shadoweh is town.
Messiah

feels

very, very town but I need to finish a reread to be sure.

...so Nacho doing "nothing else" doesn't really apply, as that kind of thing can be brief enough. And this very post states Nacho was rereading. quadz ignores this and attacks Nacho for the absence of more. See below, because this point has developments.

Second point: the Tammy/Nacho interaction...

AHEM.

and tammy's town too.

...was

clearly

a joke and it was obvious that Nacho already had a Townread on Tammy, so acting like that was what Nacho was

really

posting is a disingenuous misinterpretation of his post. (See my "pushover" joke after Nacho's post, etc.)

Note that quadz is complaining about one of two things: either Nacho is not explaining enough, or he is not scumhunting (what?). Then Nacho goes and performs a dissection of several ISOs and explains how several people are Town. quadz's complaint becomes that Nacho isn't posting cases, and that reads != cases. I... what? Not even going into theory nonsense here, Nacho

is

posting cases[/i]. Look at Nacho's ooba read. That is a "this person is Town and this is why" case if I ever saw one. He's also making "these things are scummy and this is why" statements. He has reads in flux and shows his work. And what is with this moving the goalposts nonsense? Nacho makes several beautifully detailed posts, but it's still not enough because he ought to do something else in quadz's perception? What of what Nacho

is

doing? Why doesn't quadz care about that? I believe that's what Cephrir is saying when he complains that quadz has no real opinion on Nacho's posts; he doesn't seem to care about the

content

of the posts, just that they are not tailored to some measure quadz keeps changing.

[Tierce]

Hey look, Benedick quoted Pirkei Avot.

I think what Tierce is doing is pretty clear!

[Tierce]

>.> Busy few days, gaming session, etc.

[Tierce]

Still alive. Catching up tomorrow.

[Tierce]

Empire. You have two posts to convince me you are Town. I'm done with this lurky BS, it's getting worse everyday, and Friday and Saturday are past. Where are your thoughts about the game?

Benmage--it's more than fair if you call me useless

now

, but at the point I made that quadz vote, it was everything

but

useless.

I'm still in no state to properly catch up, so excuse me if I can't be bothered with the pages upon pages of Feirei and Bulbazak potshots.

[Tierce]

SpyreX

(6) - Tammy, ooba, Zdenek, elleheathen, Messiah Complex, Nautilius

AGar

(5) - Goat on a Raft, Benmage, Garruk Relentless, The Alchemist, Alfred Borden
Zdenek (5) - kanyeknowsbest, StupendousMan, Shadoweh,

SpyreX

,

AGar

This makes me feel sick even without reading the game. WTF?

[Tierce]

The same ultimatum goes for you, Syryana. Don't care what are your RL conditions. Shape up or GTFO.

[Tierce]

Syryana isn't in the game currently.

Wrong!

[Tierce]

Look, if I have to argue with anyone that The Alchemist is not CES and that it is a sham of an impersonation, I'll be very sad at your skills of detecting people from playstyles. And frankly, the absence is really really bothering me and you know why, Syr. Trying to duck out of contributing in a game with Empire, Nacho, Tammy and me looks really freaking disgusting. Don't care if you are busy, you've shown you're perfectly capable of replacing out in those circumstances. The fact that you're not doing so show that this situation is to your advantage.

UNVOTE: quadz08
VOTE: The Alchemist

Tell them Alleras sent you.

[Tierce]

I have no idea what Glass Towers means, but that's not CES. Look at the activity pattern. You're telling me he's posting in the middle of the night? How about when they are American timezones instead? Makes a lot more sense.

[Tierce]

Yeah, screw that, look at that ISO and tell me that this is Syryana playing Town. Go ahead.

[Tierce]

Tammy, we're three days to deadline.

[Tierce]

Does anyone actually have a reason for thinking that the Alchemist is Syryana other than Syryana went away and the Alchemist came in?

Oh, darling.

Look at the posts. Look how The Alchemist knows how Syryana's role works. Look at the timestamps. Look at how Syryana wouldn't simply replace out of this game like that, which means he

is

in the game in some fashion. Most of all, look at how The Alchemist

is not CES

.

It's not a difficult puzzle.

[Tierce]

*eyeroll* Go at it, Tammy.

[Tierce]

The fun part is that I don't need her to, I can just lynch you~

[Tierce]

third parties

This is kind of painful to watch, you know.

[Tierce]

Your problem is that it's assuming The Alchemist is

not

Syryana. I like your logic, but one of the base arguments for it is wrong.

[Tierce]

it's not Syryana

Do I get to point and laugh at you in the postgame?

[Tierce]

This is utterly ridiculous. Nacho, you're telling me that, even if it weren't Syryana (which it is), that this slot doesn't need lynched? A slot who has yet to do anything to contribute, a slot that when called on it only decided to flaunt it? A slot who is badly pretending to be CES--if you've ever actually paid attention to CES, timestamps aside, you'd see the behavior is completely different--a slot who has been prod-dodging from the start and more visibly on Sunday 13, Thursday 17, Sunday 20? Are you shitting me?

How

is this not scum play? How is this not the behavior of someone who is completely screwed as scum because there are several players who can read his scum game in this very thread, and whose only recourse is to play the crappiest cryptic impersonation game possible?

[Tierce]

Syr, dear, it's okay. Everyone but me draws scum sometimes. It's obvious it's you, and it's obvious it's your scum game. What is this "content" thing, after all!

[Tierce]

Hey kanye. Where's that theory that The Alchemist was very obviously not Syryana?

[Tierce]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... er_sort=Go

syryana was engaged in the game and active. the alchemist is not. if you believe they are the same person how do you rationalize this radical shift in behavior?

this 1 tierce? if theyre the same person theyre either trying 2 hide it by not posting any content whatsoever or they had an alignment change theyre super unhappy w. and i dont recall this being a bastard game.

that said idk nething abt sryrana or theyre Posting Stryle or w.e. nor do i rly care.

I don't believe an alignment change was necessary. The flavor behind this is pretty obvious--Jaqen H'ghar disappears after a certain point in the books, and when he appears again he is a different person. There might have been a change, but it's not necessary.

Plus any ASoIaF game is bastard by definition.

I do know his posting style, and I do care. quadz and Garruk care too. Even Benmage, I guess~ Care to join us and make something beautiful?

[Tierce]

i do care about why alchemist potentially beind sryrana all along (the audience gasps) lends credence 2 him being scum tho

Because he's using this as a mask to provide absolutely no content, and because there are several people here who are capable of reading Syryana (or at least I'd assume so, but then again, see Nacho being oblivious), which means that Syr-scum needs to dodge them as much as possible. Which better way than to pretend to be someone else who is cryptic by nature and just try to prod dodge as long as possible? Three prod dodges in a row--there's no way that's coming from Syryana-Town who has several sounding boards in this game.

[Tierce]

Three prod dodges in a row--there's no way that's coming from Syryana-Town who has several sounding boards in this game.

You really haven't read any recent Syryana games, have you?

I couldn't care less that you're on vacation. Either contribute or die.

[Tierce]

Oh, please. That is a hell of a push on AGar, truly impressive.

Tammy--why would you pick a Townread to Loverize? O.o Wouldn't a not-really-lynchable scumread make a hell of a lot more sense?

[Tierce]

Oh, please. That is a hell of a push on AGar, truly impressive.

Considering you've come out of hiding purely to mislynch two, almost three townies now, you're running a great track record yourself.

Conviction about what I'm doing is not and will never be a scumtell. But refusing to provide content and then complaining that others are not lynching the scumread you've barely pushed, that is scummy as hell. But sure, keep throwing potshots without any point to them.

kanye: Syr's been busy and his scum game tends to suffer on those occasions--having to fool people who know him, etc. It peters out.

[Tierce]

Oh, please. That is a hell of a push on AGar, truly impressive.

Considering you've come out of hiding purely to mislynch two, almost three townies now, you're running a great track record yourself.

Conviction about what I'm doing is not and will never be a scumtell. But refusing to provide content and then complaining that others are not lynching the scumread you've barely pushed, that is scummy as hell. But sure, keep throwing potshots without any point to them.

Fun fact: I wasn't even in the Amrun wagon, and I repeatedly said her behavior was null.

Do

keep going.

[Tierce]

When and why did you change your mind on us? Why does the gif solidify it?

He's joking.

[Tierce]

I... hate... Ferengi.

Wrong universe. But you could call him Vargo Hoat and it'd amount to the same!

[Tierce]

The detective work on Not-CES aside, it's not like he could have hidden forever since Tammy knew who he was all along. This wagon of sudden outrage gets as big an eyeroll from me as the wagon on Spyrex with warcries of HAMMERER!

We're talking about the same Tammy who was content with letting him coast for over a week, yes?

Mighty dangerous to his health!

[Tierce]

Let's make this clear: my point isn't that Syryana pretended to be someone else. My point is that Syryana pretended to be someone else to hide his complete lack of content, and now says he's been "contributing" through an all but blank vote on AGar. He's put more effort into pretending to be CES (even the vote format was non-Syryana type) than into the game itself.

[Tierce]

Vote: SpyreX

Come back!

I thought you were joking re: Goat. I've gone through your reasoning behind their claim as scum, but it still doesn't seem like something they would provide like that. They aren't my strongest Townread by far, and probably fall among the chaff that needs to be culled if the game isn't over at some point, but I don't think they're scum. And I doubly don't think they are scum if this happens to be multiball (multiple scumteams, not just SK), because they'd be making themselves a target and revealing numbers to the other team. The odds of that are dwindling, though, so we'll see.

[Tierce]

Also look how kind I am that I am not pointing and laughing. I am

classy

like that.

[Tierce]

His lurking is annoying, but I still believe that he's town from his the posting in the neighborhood.

You don't think that there's a chance of his alignment changing?

When I told mollie that I was trying to work some things out, I was trying to work out that and if he was scum overall. I had thought that if he were scum I would be dead as I claimed in the qt. and I decided that he's almost definitely not group scum, unless this is multiball and he feared getting caught out by the other team shooting me, but since we've only had one kill I don't buy that. So, if it's not multiball then he wouldn't have any reason to disappear to be separated from dying when I did and he could have easily used the qt to manipulate me. So I have very high doubts he's group scum.

So, concerning the alignment change...why bother? If he was town to begin with, which is what he would prefer to be, why disappear and change his alignment to lurk? And if his alignment changed to a serial killer, which is what it would have to have changed to, why not play the fuck out of that? Iirc we've talked about the serial killer role before, and he's said he's never been an sk and would like to be one. And then where's the extra kills he suddenly became an sk day two. Tierce mentioned him prod dodging to avoid notice, but if he's an sk, why not kill one of us? Hell why not kill me, the one person who knows for sure what happened with the alchemist thing?

I wouldn't mind knowing if anyone received a coin though.

If he's scum and you're not likely to end up lynched, he has to end the deal eventually so they can shoot you. Doesn't seem that far-fetched as a possibility, though I don't think the "ending the lovers pair" bounces toward one alignment or the other.

Also you're assuming "one of us" was not shot N1. Lack of kills tells ~something~ happened.

[Tierce]

Yes.

[Tierce]

UNVOTE: The Alchemist

Give me the coin and I promise awesome things. This isn't a joke.

[Tierce]

Give me the coin and I promise awesome things. This isn't a joke.

Not saying this just to be cute.

[Tierce]

Just curious, Tierce-y poo, but was our gift of use to you?

Your gift would've been nice, but I found out that more things happened N1 than I'd have liked. (Which makes your explicit defense wording at the start of D2 kind of puzzling, but I'm still not complaining, so etc.) I was talking about something else when I chided you and things made a lot more sense one Night in.

~cryptic business~

That said, I cannot stress Post 2886 enough.

[Tierce]

Look, let's make this simple for everyone.

I have a shared Bulletproof ability. X times during the game, I can shield myself and one other player (remember Night 1? I do!). And I know where that kill MUST go. I can protect Syryana and myself for the next two Nights.

So give it over. This girl has quite the name to whisper~

[Tierce]

Is there any special terms in the description of your ability?

If this is to me, I don't see a need to elaborate. Don't lead them fish to etc.

[Tierce]

...

[Tierce]

Did you fucking idiots fo..
...
SO Tierce how is your day?

Pretty good! Being BADASS WOMENS, shielding puny Faceless Men, the usual, really.

[Tierce]

Hey, Syryana dahling.

Why didn't you use your awesome VALAR MORGHULIS SKILLZ over N2?

[Tierce]

Didn't Tierce claim bulletproof?

I did. With extra sprinkles.

[Tierce]

Don't really believe in this lynch, but frankly there is very little I believe in right now. Will be hammering in two hours.

Syr, coin goes here or I will look sternly at you.

[Tierce]

Hammer minus 25 minutes. Say your pieces if you have 'em.

[Tierce]

This silence is deafening. What do you mean, timezones.

Sorry, Spy. I don't particularly think you are scum, but you haven't really given me much of a Town feeling either and the show must go on. It's good seeing you back and I hope to play with you in other games soon.

VOTE: SpyreX