Newbie 1436 ~ Game Over

[goodmorning]

Hello all, I am your lovely IC. I am expected to help you learn to play the game, particularly in the context of this forum. Towards the pursuit of that goal, I will answer all your theory questions truthfully.

That's right,

I will not lie to you

about theory.

Now, you may be thinking "no fair, she's got more experience, clearly she will pwn newbs". That's only somewhat true. Some newbies have played many a game of Mafia elsewhere. Besides this, experience counts against me as well: you all are able to look up my past games and see how I've played in them. I can't because most of you don't have any. So it's a fairly even split.

Some helpful Wiki pages:
Quick Guide to Mafia
Quick Guide to Mafiascum
A Beginner's Guide to Being Awesome At Mafia

And some terms:
Glossary
Commonly Used Abbreviations

[goodmorning]

I also want to get this out now so as not to interrupt gameplay later:

HELPFUL TAG TIME

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[post]0[/post]

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0
and link you to that post.

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[url=http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31040&p=5258127]Newbie 1426[/url]

will look like
Newbie 1426
And link you to that url (this one is this game).

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[spoiler]OH NO WHAT IS HAPPENING[/spoiler]

will look like

OH NO WHAT IS HAPPENING

(highlight to read).

The code for a big spoiler is this:

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[spoiler=A SPOILER??]IT IS[/spoiler]

which looks like

Spoiler: A SPOILER??

IT IS

Some mods are fine with spoilering of REALLY BIG WALLS O' TEXT. Some are not. Always be sure to check.

[goodmorning]

And for good measure

Vote: notsci

HEY LET'S DO MORE CAPSLOCK PARTIES OR SOMETHING

HI SAKURA ALSO

[goodmorning]

Hi GM can i sheep you

Vote: ns

DAT WAGON

IC is scum.

Vote goodmorning

Lay off my partner ns and I'll relent.

WHY DID THE CHICKEN CROSS THE ROAD?

VOTE: Sakura

FOR NOT CONTINUING THE CAPS LOCK CHAIN

CAPSLOCK FOREVER

Hi. I'm letting you all know right now, I have Asperger's Syndrome. I may make mistakes that the rest of you won't, like misreading certain signs. However, I may also notice things that others don't, like tiny, tiny abnormalities in people's posts. Please don't attack me if I say something that you don't like, or that offends you.

COOL. THERE SEEM TO BE QUITE A FEW FOLKS AROUND THIS FORUM WITH ASPERGER'S, SO IT'S ALL GOOD.

Well fuck you too

UNVOTE: Array VOTE: Gravija

DAT OMGUS

IC is scum.

Vote goodmorning

Lay off my partner ns and I'll relent.

Your, eh,

partner?

UNVOTE: agi VOTE: T S O

Interesting.

lol

UNVOTE: VOTE: Jimi For not posting.

FOS: Array, cliche

for the same reason.

Also interesting.

I may also notice things that others don't

And you miss an entire post?

lolno

NOTSCI

NOTSCI LISTEN

THIS IS THE POINT






THIS IS YOUR HEAD

Theory

Array is scum for lurking
Jimi is scum for lurking
T S O is scum for unlikely reasoning
Notsci is scum for mediocre reasoning
Sakura is scum for sheeping

Pick two. Discuss.

Everyone UNVOTE: until discussion ends.

No.
No.
lololololol
Maybe.
No.
(lurking is not a scumtell (even if they were lurking (which they aren't)), sheeping in rvs is not a scumtell, T S O isn't serious, and the notsci one might have some merit to it if you replace "mediocre reasoning" with "grasping".)

I picked all five. Discuss.

I won't unvote. I like it OK where it is.

GM I'm thinking we have an Agi/Grav scumteam.

notsci I'm thinking that Grav missing that joke is not a scumtell and that agi is actually leaning Town for me based on his line of questioning and the fact that we're having serious conversation early p2.

T S O looks a bit odd but quite frankly he looked like that the last time we played despite being confTown the entire time he inhabited the slot.

WALLPOSTS

[goodmorning]

Does there happen to be a doctor in this setup

Why?

Ebwop again
GM: "Grav missing that joke"
Wait, where was the joke? I'm confused now...

The joke was when he said "lay off my partner." He's not actually claiming Scum seriously (although that is something that can be used to certain effect in other situations; see Cheery Dog in this game), he's claiming it as a joke. This is why I responded to that post with "why did the chicken cross the road?"; it's a fairly frequent joke and sometimes a bit overused.

@T S O: I do not see what you see here.

But you don't bus on page 1 when a wagon hasn't formed or anything, because that's probably playing against scum win con

Actually sometimes Scum do it specifically to distance.

PEDIT: WHY?????

PEDIT2: I AGREE, YOU DIDN'T

[goodmorning]

The six setups:
A. JK, BP, and Maf RB
B. Cop
C. Doc, Tracker
1. JK
2. Cop, Doc, Maf RB
3. BP, Tracker

Please stop trying to out the Doc as that is literally the worst possible play for Town, especially D1.

[goodmorning]

@agi: Why did you want to know, out of curiosity?

GM IM HURT YOURE GOING TO GO ALL PARANOID ON ME AFTER 1402 ARENT YOU

WELL YEAH

vote: agi

Because rolefishing

Really?

Ah, thanks for explaining the joke, GM.
I'm getting a few scummy vibes from agi, but not enough to make a conclusion. He keeps asking if there's a doctor, he might be attempting to figure out a night kill or something. He also claimed town, which isn't a good idea (though I think it was a joke).

This is a good post in a lot of ways. There's a lot of transparency of thought here which is very townish and there's definitely some protown motivation here.
I do disagree with some of the actual points though. There are reasons that newbtown would try to determine PRs just as much as newbscum would, and claiming town doesn't really mean anything imo.
At any rate this post has given me a nice strong townlean.

[goodmorning]

wat is rolefishing

Oh wait it's exactly what it says it is

Ok explain how it's scummy

For Scum, the best strategy is to attempt to kill the Town PRs early on so they do the least damage. They don't know who these PRs are, though, so they have to guess UNLESS they can get someone to claim.
And a claimed PR tends to be a dead PR, unless there are gambits going on or it's fake.

Now that you ask me why I want to know I don't know, don't ask why

Why not?

[goodmorning]

GM am I deluded? I find agi p town

idk whether you're deluded but I also have a bit of a townlean on him still, though I'd really like him to answer at least a little bit.

Don't treat me like an inferior. Just because I'm retarded doesn't mean you can treat me like a dumbass.

Tbh notsci is a bit of a troll.
It's quite entertaining at times.

[goodmorning]

PEDIT STOP RUINING MY FUN GM ;-;

NO

Nice scumclaim.

VOTE: TSO

shiiiiiittttttt I actually kind of agree with this somehow

GM I FINALLY REMEMBERED WHY I ASKED

I WAS JUST CURIOUS

WAS THAT THE ANSWER YOU WERE LOOKING FOR

NO, BUT IT IS AN ANSWER SO I'LL TAKE IT

Time to try and gambit.

VOTE: agi102

^
Scum claim.

Really?

[goodmorning]

Okay, can we get agi replaced? Like seriously. I don't know if he's TRYING to be an idiot, or if he's really that much of a ditz.

This is a newbie game. I've seen far worse become quite decent. He seems on the right track IMO.

Oh and GM and I played together and she thought Wisdom was town and he was scum(that was 1402)

FTFY
I think I thought it was EEE and you, but I don't really recall that so much as the painful fuckup that precipitated the Scum win.

inb4 wisdom

THAT WOULD BE SO COOL

Ok, so Sakura and Gravija don't understand this gambit. That's ok.

Also, link me to a game where someone has been replaced for idiocy.

I'm not 100% sure selfvoting counts as a gambit. Strictly speaking.

Even if you were being a complete idiot, you could really only be replaced if you were doing it on purpose.

Fair warning: many people frown on selfvotes, partly because they tend to be anti-Town and partly because they tend to be against one's wincon.

Vote: Sakura

[goodmorning]

Does it work if everyone ignores it? Because quite frankly I doubt there's going to be much more discussion on the topic.

[goodmorning]

OMFFG CABD AND FFFFFFFFF <3

ANY CHANCE OF THIS GAME BEING LESS THAN 50 PAGES JUST WENT RIGHT DOWN THE TOILET

AM EXCITED TO SEE YOUR CATCHUPS

[goodmorning]

Wow. So many posts while I'm sleeping. -.-;
Anyway, I'm gonna
VOTE: agi
Because I'm getting rather annoyed by him.

Is being annoying a scumtell? Do you have any scumreads on anyone else? Townreads?

[goodmorning]

Light townread on cliche, agi looks like day one lynchfodder of choice.

ffery/GM, thoughts on these two? Notsci, do you agree with cliche-read?

I have actually been blatantly ignoring cliche in hopes that he'd say something about it. He didn't, but I have a slight townlean on him because he kinda reminds me of me in my first game. Agi is probably my strongest townread at this point and so I don't see where the "lynchfodder" statement is coming from as only two people seem to disagree.

Bah. Ok Cabd

UNVOTE: agi

Warning, I don't know if you'd call this a gambit or a reaction test. Maybe it's both.

I want scum to try to quick hammer (I am L-2 (L-3 after my unvote)). If they don't within the next 6 hours after I revote myself I'm unvoting myself because then it's clearly not working, or scum isn't paying attention.

Maybe it's both

I don't know how town reacts, but if anyone votes I vote them back. If you think this is OMGUS you haven't read any of the above.

Please specify what false positives that could interfere with this could occur.

I'll estimate its chance of working as 50%, plus or minus 10%.

Scum won't quickhammer D1, or indeed usually outside of LyLo. This is because that would be tantamount to a Scum claim and they would quickly be lynched the next Day.
That is the definition of OMGUS and I fail to see what any of the above has to do with others voting for you.
False positives: I've personally seen Town quick- or drunk- hammer much more often than Scum.
I'd estimate its chance of working low, lower now you've spelled it out.

You know offhand if scum ns likes to hand out townreads to newbs, or is this a research project?

I'M ANSWERING A QUESTION FOR THE WRONG PERSON LOL
From my experience with scum-ns, no, but he has pretty adaptive play.

You know offhand if scum ns likes to hand out townreads to newbs, or is this a research project?

You know, I don't have quite enough data there yet. I can dive it tomorrow, remind me when I'm awake and posting.

Don't dive 1402, it makes me sad.

EBWODP LOL FUCKED UP POSTING THAT ONE

[goodmorning]

EBWOTP: YES IT WILL STILL COUNT

[goodmorning]

From my experience with scum-ns, no, but he has pretty adaptive play.

What are you thinking about him?

I have a very faint hint of a townlean on him.

But he needs to behave. Stop baiting people for now.

@Grav: Who has provided more content thus far, Sakura or notsci?

[goodmorning]

1. Just a little bit.
2. Let me explain this with an extended metaphor: we are out of the kiddie pool and into the grown-up pool, but we're still in the shallow end. Sharks will only fit in the deep end. Make sense?

[goodmorning]

Ah, okay.

What're you thinking about cliche? I know you said you were ignoring him, but does his "no explanation" shtick give you any leans?

What no explanation schtick?

[goodmorning]

Where he's like "blah noone gives reasons for things"

The meta stuff

Well, it does read a bit like frustrated Town but that's not something that's hard to fake either.

I am familiar with any and all strategies, but I don't remember everything about them. That's why I can't scum hunt effectively.

Just saying.

Don't worry about strategies. Just think motivation. Why do people say and do things?

@GM: sorry for the late response, was sleeping. Honestly, Sakura has given more actual intelligent content in 5 or 6 posts than Notsci has given in idk how many posts.

Really?

[goodmorning]

lol

Vote: T S O

(misrep is the shorthand for misrepresent)

[goodmorning]

Vote: Sakura

[goodmorning]

To demand an explanation for something?

Yes.

You aren't pushing anyone. You aren't looking for scum. Because I know your eminent "oh yeah I'm just making a townblock" business will come in, no. It doesn't work that way. You're not using your best form of pressure to make reads, moreso looking for reasons to call people town.

Pedit GM I think Cabd is scum

Notsci this is how Cabd acts all the time.
In other words, I'm not seeing alignment either way.

[goodmorning]

Well I think this is Town v Town unless one of {Sakura, T S O} flips Town in which case Cabd (tinysmall chance ffery) is Scum.

[goodmorning]

Honestly atm it's mostly gut-meta amalgams.

[goodmorning]

Despite that tho, I haven't seen GM do much of anything and just tries to get me dead just like in monks and masons

Pot, meet kettle.

V/LA til Monday.

[goodmorning]

^Also, insofar as doing things goes, compare myself and fferyllt and see what you get.

[goodmorning]

I think I need to reread this, but I doubt my opinions will change much.

[goodmorning]

186 - Why, though?

Because.
I am thoroughly satisfied with a lynch on either one (the other is T S O, obvs) at this point and so will continue to sway between them until it becomes clear which one is today's lynch (probably T S O, probably the better option).

I can't read GM worth a damn. Had like one decent post to my knowledge but mostly idfk. Sorreh. Null.

Considering my lack of presence thus far, Null's definitely not what most people would say.

I think you may be a person I need to be in more games with immediately.

BUT: Why didn't you address Sakura in your end-of-post readslist?

I just realized I'm voting with my other scumread and a null read. But my other scumread is being voted by...my other scumread. -twitch-

I'm not gonna wagon analyze right now.

Yeahhhhhh after a while you stop giving a shit if you ever did in the first place.

[GM is GM and I need to go baseline hyrule yet again

LOLOLOLOLOL

Also, notsci is town.

QFT

GM has made no impression on me. Need real time interactions to get some feelings going. Talk to meee, who do you think is scum? Re-read done yet?

Yes it is done, and still T S O and Sakura with low-and-unlikely chance of Cabd.

GM, you low level of engagement (and long-ish absence) is starting to bug me.

It's been a hectic time for me, particularly over the weekend which is why I went V/LA. I'm back and better than ever though.

Why hello there, darling.

Would you like to meet Bert? GM, meet Bert because you haven't been here to meet him yet. Don't break my heart...

Wait. Wait. You look really familiar. Didn't we meet that one time at that masonic lodge in Serona?

With GM it's really more the low level of engagement. I kinda expected some significant catch up from her yesterday. Our last MS game together she was scum. She kinda messed with me on day 1 of that game. She made a joking reference to that in a post right after my replace-in. Other than that, I feel like any reach-out has mostly been from my end.

Probably I should have extended my V/LA til today instead then.

With GM it's really more the low level of engagement. I kinda expected some significant catch up from her yesterday. Our last MS game together she was scum. She kinda messed with me on day 1 of that game. She made a joking reference to that in a post right after my replace-in. Other than that, I feel like any reach-out has mostly been from my end.

GM was scum in your modded game, that's my last experience with her. She's being lurky IMO, absence notwithstanding. I do remember her saying that she felt her scumplay was better during her early/earlier years on this site...that's just a random recollection of a thought/memory.

It's true. You remembered?

I think I need to reread this, but I doubt my opinions will change much.

This sort of bothers me, because I would think she's more opinionated than that...

It's because I'm opinionated that I kind of assumed they wouldn't change.
Surprise, they didn't.

Now I have to go back and find that question of mine that Sakura didn't answer.

[goodmorning]

vote: agi

Because rolefishing

Really?

Time to try and gambit.

VOTE: agi102

^
Scum claim.

Really?

My point isnt the self-vote, but that he had to come and say that he was gambiting, why would you need to specify you're gambiting if you're gambiting is like applying a pressure vote and saying it's for pressure.

(This appears to be some type of answer to my latter point but definitely not to the intent of it, which I will attempt to elaborate on after she answers the first question)

[goodmorning]

Yes it is done, and still T S O and Sakura with low-and-unlikely chance of Cabd.

The Sakura read puzzles me, but I know I'm swimming upstream there. The Cabd read astounds me. Aside from that Rage mini game, have you played with Cabd when he's not town? What games?

The Rage and the Achievement, both with Morph.

It's not that I find him scummy as such, more that I find him the least towny of everyone I'm not reading as Scum.

@notsci: NO

I PICK THE LATTER TWO BOTH

@fffffff: I CONCUR

@Sakura: COOL, PLS ANSWER MY QUESTION I JUST RECENTLY QUOTED

[goodmorning]

@GM: Your question is "Really?" Answer is: I don't remember, I might have had a point back then, but I don't remember it anymore.

Interesting.

The Rage and the Achievement, both with Morph.It's not that I find him scummy as such, more that I find him the least towny of everyone I'm not reading as Scum

I misinterpreted the emphasis you were putting on "unlikely".

But, as a side note, Morph is a joint venture of Cabd and me. Why am I not in that pool?

I didn't realize you forgot your hydra posts were signed, or that you were hydra-ing this game, because obviously finding one of you less town instantly means I have to go the same direction with the other.

I am, after all, completely incapable of differentiating you as players.

[goodmorning]

goodmorning, I'm nachopappa and we were in Newbie 1402 and Micro 189 together - also 514 Masons in Serona (sp?) Ffery's game where I was Bert.

I know. I was being facetious.

[goodmorning]

@Bert: Gut? Town. Meta? Maybe, maybe not.

@fferyllt: I don't recall having found it particularly difficult. Cabd is slightly more excitable generally.

[goodmorning]

186 - Why, though?

Because.
I am thoroughly satisfied with a lynch on either one (the other is T S O, obvs) at this point and so will continue to sway between them until it becomes clear which one is today's lynch (probably T S O, probably the better option).

I don't get the tactic here.

It's not really a "tactic" as such. I just happened to have equal scumreads on them at the time.

Vote: T S O

I think I'm already voting him but just to be sure and also obvious...

BUT: Why didn't you address Sakura in your end-of-post readslist?

Forgot. She's eh.

I see.

Yet your post after this feels genuinely resigned so, leaning town now.

Is resignation a towntell? Can Scum never be resigned?

- Why was GM's lack of activity troubling?

Normally, and especially as Town, I'll have one of the higher postcounts in a game, as I tend to post reactively (that is, to increase my posting when others post more).
So I'm guessing that.

Or what ffery said.

- What is "trajectory"?

It's a thing whereby you look at the development of someone's reads and decide whether it looks realistic for Town.

Or apparently it's on the wiki as well.

- There is metric fucktons more metaing in this game than I'm used to. I'm not good with metaing people. I really dislike this.

Some people fall more on the logic side than the gut side. Nothing to be worried about, just decide how much stock you want to put into other people's claimed meta of everyone.

Plus what ffery said.

i don't know what to post
i apologize for shitposting

I've forgotten your reads already. Could you do me a favour and post them again?

Also what Kaze said.

186 - Why, though?

Because.
I am thoroughly satisfied with a lynch on either one (the other is T S O, obvs) at this point and so will continue to sway between them until it becomes clear which one is today's lynch (probably T S O, probably the better option).

I don't get the tactic here.

Reading this again I'm not sure why I drew such a blank reading this. Pretty straight forward.

I can kinda see why, because it's not the most sensible play tbh but there it is.

[goodmorning]

Hey GM, what's your case on TSO? I can't find a post of yours detailing one.

Can't you? Let me remedy that in a bit then.

For now, I notice I haven't posted a real readslist.

Very Town: notsci, Bert, agi, Kaze

Less Town: ffery

Still pretty null though slightly townleaning: Cabd

Scum: Sakura

Very Scum: T S O

EDIT: As per your 508, will elaborate later. It takes time when there are suddenly four more pages.

Scum try their hardest to be consistent and not make stupid mistakes, so forgetting who you're voting/not bothering to look back at your last vote feels town, albeit careless.

Not necessarily. I've seen Majiffy forget set-ups, who just died, etc., as scum. It goes both ways, but I understand your sentiment.

Who the fuck wants to play like Majiffy?

Spoiler: fferyllt's 442

Ok, so Sakura and Gravija don't understand this gambit. That's ok.

Also, link me to a game where someone has been replaced for idiocy.

I'm not 100% sure selfvoting counts as a gambit. Strictly speaking.

Even if you were being a complete idiot, you could really only be replaced if you were doing it on purpose.

Fair warning: many people frown on selfvotes, partly because they tend to be anti-Town and partly because they tend to be against one's wincon.

Vote: Sakura

This vote on the other hand is at the bottom of a midsized quotes wall and has no reasoning shown.

I kinda figured my "really?" ing of her would speak for itself.

Then there are a bunch of posts including posts about Cabd and me joining the game with no mention at all of sakura.

She wasn't posting frequently, or much content. Not much to say except whinge about her V/LA, and that's not alignment-indicative.

In 168 she votes T S O (another vote without reasoning). In her next post 186 she switches back to Sakura with no explanation.

That's to do with the fluctuation of the wagons, I believe.

Well I think this is Town v Town unless one of {Sakura, T S O} flips Town in which case Cabd (tinysmall chance ffery) is Scum.

^^ I remember thinking this one pinged when I first read it. "this is Town v Town" refers to the exchange between NotSci and Cabd. The pingy part though, comes next. She's doing pre-flip associations here. I need to go back and check a couple of games to be sure, but I am pretty sure GM has actively discouraged pre-flip/day 1 associative stuff in other games we've played.

I do discourage pre-flip/D1 associative stuff. None of my tells on them are associative. They are just 2 strong scumreads in a game where I have quite a few strong townreads.

I think I need to reread this, but I doubt my opinions will change much.

Given her posts/vote today this one in particular is ironic. She doubts her opinion will change but apparently she doesn't remember where her vote was. And the reread didn't refresh her memory.

I addressed this in a post to I think Kaze.
I don't tend to worry about reading myself too carefully on reread, as I like to be able to form opinions somewhat fresh.

Agi is town because of how he's played (and I was still first to call that)

lolnope

GM I'm thinking

we have an Agi/Grav scumteam.

notsci I'm thinking that Grav missing that joke is not a scumtell and that

agi is actually leaning Town for me

based on his line of questioning and the fact that we're having serious conversation early p2.

I kinda found Agi's posts towny tbh

so yeah

goodmorning, who just switched onto the wagon because he thought he might get away with it.

lol u so funny

The scumspect pool is voting each other, pretty much, so wagon analysis isn't doing me any good - it makes me paranoid, if anything.

Yeah hey stop doing pre-flip wagon analysis. Post-flip is shit enough without this pre-flip bullshit cluttering up people's brains.

@goodmorning, you seriously need to come back and answer the questions posed to you throughout the past few pages.

STOP POSTING CONSTANTLY AND I MIGHT JUST BE ABLE TO

[goodmorning]

It's not going to be tonight, it's midnight here and I have to be up early.

[goodmorning]

Not terribly impressed.

The part about fluctuating wagons, I'm not sure what she means or why that would make her want to move her vote.

As I said:

186 - Why, though?

Because.
I am thoroughly satisfied with a lynch on either one (the other is T S O, obvs) at this point and so will continue to sway between them until it becomes clear which one is today's lynch (probably T S O, probably the better option).

Well I think this is Town v Town unless one of {Sakura, T S O} flips Town in which case Cabd (tinysmall chance ffery) is Scum.

He's calling me and Sakura Town at this stage, but then says if we flip Town then Cabd or ffery are scum.

No. I am saying notsci v. Cabd was Town v. Town. I was saying that you and Sakura are the Scum, but if by some anti-miracle one of you flips Town then Cabd could be Scum, meaning notsci v. Cabd was NOT Town v. Town after all.

Try reading comprehension, please.

[goodmorning]

No. I am saying notsci v. Cabd was Town v. Town. I was saying that you and Sakura are the Scum, but if by some anti-miracle one of you flips Town then Cabd could be Scum, meaning notsci v. Cabd was NOT Town v. Town after all.

I thought you didnt like pre-flip associative tells?
Why are you lining up lynches?

I do discourage pre-flip/D1 associative stuff. None of my tells on them are associative. They are just 2 strong scumreads in a game where I have quite a few strong townreads.

I did misinterpret that.

Your lack of anything resembling an accusation, a case, etc. means I'm concluding you have nothing.

Hey GM, what's your case on TSO? I can't find a post of yours detailing one.

Can't you? Let me remedy that in a bit then.

The lack of reading from the scum in this game is legendary.

[goodmorning]

Yeah saying X is town if Y flips scum and hence Z would also be scum is totally not an association.

No. I am saying that you and T S O are two very strong scumreads of mine, and that IF AND ONLY IF one of you were to flip Town, then Cabd would be Scum.

In other words, X and Y are Scum. If I am wrong about one of them, Z is Scum.

No. I am saying notsci v. Cabd was Town v. Town. I was saying that you and Sakura are the Scum, but if by some anti-miracle one of you flips Town then Cabd could be Scum, meaning notsci v. Cabd was NOT Town v. Town after all.

Dislike. "Ohey this is/could be town v. scum." This is usually a free pass to push one to lynch and say "Oh, well obviously it's the other one" when they flip town. This gives me bad feels.

IT'S TOWN V. TOWN
CHRIST ON A MOTHERFUCKING BIKE
NOTSCI V. CABD HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY PERCEPTION OF T S O AND SAKURA AS SCUM

[GM is GM and I need to go baseline hyrule yet again

LOLOLOLOLOL

What is so funny about me needing to update my meta-reads of you? A question for you. Do you or do you not get the vibe from me I gave off in newbie 1390?

It's Hyrule that's funny.
Do I get that vibe from you? Kind of yes, kind of no. You've evolved as a player massively since then and that's the only game I've been in with you not hydra-ing.
Some of the talk is the same, as far as scumhunting and all, but then you ask questions like that one, which is entirely different in tone.

Yes it is done, and still T S O and Sakura with low-and-unlikely chance of Cabd.

To GM:
I know you said you're going to elaborate on these and a nice big lovely "I want to ship SakuraXnoose" fanfiction would be great.

Well, the T S O one is coming today. The Sakura one may have to wait till D2, depends how long the T S O case takes and how much it saps my will to live.

[goodmorning]

Do you not have a back-up plan in case you're wrong? The only people who can be certain in this game are the Scum.

Did I say X is Scum WITH Y? Did I say XY is the scumteam? No. X is Scum. Y is Scum.

That they happen to be on the same scumteam is simply coincidence.

[goodmorning]

Z is simply my third-scummiest read, or conversely my sixth-towniest read (as in this case).

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VT. Do it if you like. I have revised my reads slightly in that I've switched Cabd's and fffff's places.

If you don't mind waiting a bit I'd like to finish the T S O case while I can.

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^Am more than willing to pull an O480 if it becomes necessary.

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Have six points so far in varying stages of finished-ness

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Of course my thoughts are lynch T S O, why else would I be making a case?

Speaking of which, am nearly done.

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Your lack of anything resembling an accusation, a case, etc. means I'm concluding you have nothing.

Perhaps this nothing won't look like a spoiler'd wallpost then OH WAIT

IT'S HERE, BITCHES

Spoiler: 1. How much wood would a woodchuck chuck?

In case you hadn't noticed, Scum tends to make accusations, either directly or indirectly, in an attempt to make others look bad and/or to deflect these accusations from themselves.
These statements may be (are usually) poorly fleshed out.

Agi, you're now my #1 scumread.

Gravija, when you do something/wrong scummy, you can't just justify the whole thing by saying "I have Asperger's."

~reasons~ and it is best left at that.

I'm simply saying that you're wrong. I'm not treating you as inferior, I'm treating you as the latest in a long line of people to say they suspect me.

PEDIT STOP RUINING MY FUN GM ;-;

Stop buddying gm, thanks. It's making me lean on him and scum on you.

It's like you're constantly using psychology to put yourself in the Town driving seat and I just get a bad feeling from it.

Besides, making a case wouldn't even be hard for Cabd this game. Him going from foolish-town to lazy-scum on me with no change, Sakura's odd play in regards to him, his ott jokiness upon ffery's arrival etc. all make convincing points.

The above is particularly egregious for attempting associative tells.

Scum

T S O - aggressively low content, and reacted to pokes about content by showering the thread with...content

Vote: T S O

TSO has no content. He was asked for content, so he gave content. Therefore, he's scum.

What the fuck is this?

Sakura does that as a suicidal play because

she knows it works on you.

And it's working right now.

Sakura isn't going to flip because if I went for her then Cabd would turn on me for going for an "easy lynch." It works both ways.

This one is particularly egregious for the care about his appearance. Town would go for Sakura if Town thought that was right, and hang the opinions of anyone else.

Sure I'm caught up

I don't have special thoughts about anyone

I'd use my vote if I did

Didn't you do this before, see people call you Town for it and do it again?

God, you're town.

Spoiler: 1B. Do you think I'm pretty?

A subset of the above, this one attempts to get positive words directed towards/about the Scum.

T S O is very Jason Wazza like from what I remember of 1462. I played scum with him for like 2/3 of Day 1 during that game.

Do you think I'm scum here? If I am, what are my meta similarities?

Note that he didn't ask me to elaborate on my meta of him, because it was clear it was going to be negatively.

Why do you think I'm lazy as Town?

Spoiler: 2. An Utter Contradiction

We all know Scum may contradict themselves on certain matters. Not change. Contradict.

Stop buddying gm, thanks. It's making me lean on him and scum on you.

Nah, I'm not gonna vote you unless you continue to do it.

Spoiler: 3. NO I'M NOT

This one is self-explanatory, I think.

Does anyone notice how TSO got called out for his shtick about me then instantly nakedvotes without so much as a reason on Cabd?

I called TSO out for doing something arguably scummy, then he nakedvotes! This type of unconservative play is strongly alignned with standard scum play.[/SARCASM]

Come and play for real, TSO. Throwing out a vote on me for no stated reason is a bit low quality given your usual play as town.

Actually, my play in Newbies tends to be not-so-great. Laziness and an "unusual" (read: scummy) playstyle mean them and I don't always gel.

I don't understand why I'm scum though.

My vitriol is a tell of anger, not of alignment.

And TSO loves to get a scum PM with one of the strongest players in the game and immediately hard-bus the slot.

Spoiler: 4. Heat Shield

We return to some of the concepts from 1. Here we look specifically at deflection.

Vote: Cabd

This game's looking good.

You're not. :/

Why do you think Cabd is Town?

Ffery can I have meta of Sakura doing it as scum and as Town?

Spoiler: 5. My evidence is cool, my evidence is poppin'

Yet generally speaking they have little, or fake.

Not too much to catch up on, though. Looks like you guys managed to transition out of RVS nicely.


This is the part where I play scummy all day one, obvtown it up in twilight, and get shot at night one, right?

Sup. We're here to wreck shit.

AND I PROMISE NOT TO KILL YOU THIS TIME GM I KNOW MY PAST RECORD OF KILLING YOU DEAD SUCKS BUT HEY AT LEAST I ENDGAMED YOU LAST TIME

Ok, so Sakura and Gravija don't understand this gambit. That's ok.

Also, link me to a game where someone has been replaced for idiocy.

Treat me like i'm five years old. Explain exactly what you hope to accomplish with this gambit of yours. How will town react? How will scum react? How do you account for false positives, and what percent chance do you feel it has of working?


Lots of players here know me as somebody who has done quite a few gambits, including claiming scum as scum, so from one gambit guy to another, tell me what you want out of this.,

Light townread on cliche, agi looks like day one lynchfodder of choice.

Sakura, you have until page 15 to be obvtown.

Ffery has until the end of this page to form a townbloc.

And notsci, you seem vaguely more interested in this game than some of your recent finished ones. You scum bro?

Light townread on cliche, agi looks like day one lynchfodder of choice.

ffery/GM, thoughts on these two? Notsci, do you agree with cliche-read?

Come and play for real, TSO. Throwing out a vote on me for no stated reason is a bit low quality given your usual play as town.

These quotes basically give me a gut feeling of scum.

It's like you're constantly using psychology to put yourself in the Town driving seat and I just get a bad feeling from it.

Kazekimaru

Literally, he jumped back on the wagon with no reasoning whatsoever.

He's literally laughing and spitting in our faces by doing that.

Spoiler: 6. "It's like you're constantly using psychology to put yourself in the Town driving seat and I just get a bad feeling from it."

(i hope you see what i did there)

notscience is my sheep, though.

indirectly you are of my herd.

Sakura-Cabd team.

Game nailed.

TSO you have literally done jack shit this game don't even pretend like this is you

You're his scumbuddy though /shrug

I called Cabd as scum first, while you were busy barking up the wrong tree (me).

So who's the shepherd? You? Don't make me laugh.

The good news is, Kaze agrees on my scumteam. So she can sheep me and ride to Townland.

How- voting Cabd without actively pushing people to vote him

Why- towncred

PEDIT

SEE

This makes no sense.

I want towncred for bussing Cabd, according to you. And my method of doing this is to proclaim myself as the leader of his wagon. (Which you've actually done for cred, you filthy hypocrite.) But I don't actually want Cabd's lynch to go through so despite championing the lynch I'm actively hoping it will fail.

What a load of bullshit.

notscience, please. let's try to be useful.

as of now, all you've done is tunnel my scumread and try to take credit for it. which is great, but makes you pretty useless all the same.

[/quote]

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I'm here as well but already voting him.

Happy to talk though.

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Why would that make you nervous?

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And would different flips change your opinion?

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Possibly.

What happens to your piles if TSO is scum? Town? You still feel the same as your last post about it?

As I mentioned, I'll be looking at you if he flips Town.

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As I mentioned, I'll be looking at you if he flips Town.

Why Ffery?

It's been a few little things. I'll try and elaborate tomorrow depending on flips and my continued existence.

@Cabd: Wait, why are we saying emotional detachment is a good thing again?

I'm turning in for the evening quite soon ftr.

[goodmorning]

Anyway other than that, im probably going to give my thoughts later, after the IC gives her thoughts on the game and the players.

GG everyone

I don't usually do that unless people ask me, because I never know what to say.

Speaking of things to say, I know this is going to sound like a lie/exaggeration, but by the time my "I'm swapping ffery down to third-least Town" post happened, I'd already been scumreading her pretty hard for posts like 374 and 442.
By the time she got down past T S O on the list it was pretty close to deadline, so I figured I'd say more about it the next day and catch her by surprise. (Though I did hint at it in 709.)
And then dead.

Probably wouldn't have got Wisdom though, so there is that.

[goodmorning]

Vaguely curious as to why I was killed.

Also vaguely grateful, I probably would have done a murder if I'd had to sit through another 80+ page Newbie.

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So GM got to see my new playstyle, what do you think of it?

It wasn't that different from the old, really. It is slightly more adaptable now, I think.

And that's good. I like it.

[goodmorning]

Nooooooooooo
meh i didn't live to nudge people about Wis buddying ffery

You did quite well, honestly, other than the lurking.

I'd be proud if I were you.

Being a strong player is why. I can't see a lylo group in this game that wouldn't decide I should have been NKed if I were town.

I was hoping this would come up, but NOPE

Then again, there were so many strong players what with all the replacements...