NY 167: COMPLETELY NORMAL Mafia (GAME OVER)

[PeregrineV]

Who needs RVS when Radiant has found the best crumb ever?

Vote: MC Maraca

Let's talk about how you only shoot who you are told to.

[PeregrineV]

I'm known for self-voting/self-hammering, tho it's something im trying to move away from.
Hermy's known for self-voting IN LYLO as town.

How many times have she done it and what was the reason for her to do so?

-L. J.

Yuck.

Vote: MVP

[PeregrineV]

Wtf why didnt I get a game start pm

VOTE: goodmorning

On phone.. will post later

Goodmorning Guyett!

I admired your logical scumhunting in our last game together (Marvel vs DC) while cursing you under my breath.

I hope to see the same stuff here.

Or else.

[PeregrineV]

Mad, yes. But also happy that I found confirmed Town.

He can be confirmed town when he makes his avatar spin.

[PeregrineV]

other than that, the game has been pretty boring so far

someone wake me up when things get going please

Pedit: Both of them are mara posts, silly

When you SK kill someone tonight, who will be your first choice based on the 5 pages?

[PeregrineV]

Sorry, but most likely won't be here for the weekend.

@goodmorning- V/LA through 11/4

Unvote.

I didn't like the early Hermy discussion.

Player A: Hermy did this.
Player B: Tell me more, player A.
Player C: Tell me more, player A.
Hermy: I'm in the game and I can tell you.

Why not ask him/her directly?

Anyways, Maraca probably not SK.

[PeregrineV]

Curiously, the Large Normal is technically allowed up to two non-Normal Roles iirc.

This is correct but if you use them to make a broken role (*glares at peregrine's white mage*) I will hate you forever and kill your cats.

It was not broken, it was beautiful!

[PeregrineV]

VOTE: Sak

Lots of irrelevant fluff

She's on vacation.....

She's probably not the only fluff poster....

Hope there is more in 2 pages......

[PeregrineV]

Oh, also, my setup-dar is broken.
How many scums are we expecting in 17 players game?

-L. J.

4 in a 16, the plus cause mod loves town, or he threw in an SK.

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Guyett

[PeregrineV]

I'm not scuuuuum gawd
Guyett, yessiree, caled, do you wanna post content or...?
MVP why focus on Sangres?
Pidgeon stop being so cocky and post some reads will you?

You should vote Guyett. That will make you look more town when he flips scum.

[PeregrineV]

Hooray, 27 pages!

Skim-o-matic activated.

[PeregrineV]

Made it 4 pages before interest was lost.

Anyone want to catch me up instead?

Like....JacobSavage!!

@Jacob- What are the current game events?

[PeregrineV]

What's up guys? I'm back!!

Vote: Angry Frat Bros.

[PeregrineV]

Let me go through this playerlist.

1. MC Maraca (hydra of Mara and certainly not Cabd): we are ok with an orci lynch holy fucking why
3. Sakura Hana: can somebody TELL ME why I'm wrong on this read it's driving me nuts
4. sangres (hydra of Nacho and ffery): what the fuck nacho is high on i do not know
5. JacobSavage: lurking shitsack
7. caledfwitch: lurking shitsack
9. likeabauss: It's a rock that talks.
12. Hermy: lurking shitsack
13. PeregrineV: lurking shitsack
14. RadiantCowbells: lurking shitsack
15. Toomai:lurking shitsack
16. yessiree*: shitsack
17. TheIrishPope: useless with a smug sense of condescending ignorance

I think my feelings are hurt.

Vote: Orcinus

[PeregrineV]

Can we please wtf unvote RC? What's happening?

Is town too blind to see that a probable reason we cant lynch either FratBros or Orcinus is because townies have divided between the two wagons?

C'mon people. FratBros or Orcinus. I'm literally begging for votes, so confident I'll do the 1 v 1 thing, and consistently laying out more and more reasons why these two are scum. Their responses are "UR Shitlord" and or "BS prove it." I mean, is this an acceptable defense in anybody's mind? You dont have to buy into my psychobabble to see that something is seriously wrong with their play.

I'm not going any farther on my Rank read. I don't give a crap how many times anybody asks. I said why several times. He's not even in this game anymore, and aside from that we have players who know Orcinus who are actually scum reading his play.

Lastly Cephrir, why on Gods green earth would you vote for somebody on D1 that is a policy lynch or whatever, when you have two other options that both yield way more info to town? I don't need you to like me, and you can attack my cases all you want, but hanging between FratBoys and Orcinus right now does far more for town than a PL on RC.

Do you have any previously given reasons (you or anybody) about why either of these two are scum?

[PeregrineV]

Also, at least one guy who voted RC in the last 24 hours is scum, just so we're clear.

If you listed who voted him in the last 24 hours and gave thoughts on those people, it would become even more clearer.

[PeregrineV]

Do you have any previously given reasons (you or anybody) about why either of these two are scum?

On FratBros:
842
1048
1319

On Rank/Orcinus:
597
831
1059

This is what I like. You can be protected town. Check your mailbox for a 1-shot BP vest tonight.

[PeregrineV]

making scums feel miserable is my specialty

...
We have

5

lurkers and nothing is being done about them

Let me go through this playerlist.

1. MC Maraca (hydra of Mara and certainly not Cabd): we are ok with an orci lynch holy fucking why
3. Sakura Hana: can somebody TELL ME why I'm wrong on this read it's driving me nuts
4. sangres (hydra of Nacho and ffery): what the fuck nacho is high on i do not know

5. JacobSavage: lurking shitsack

7. caledfwitch: lurking shitsack

9. likeabauss: It's a rock that talks.

12. Hermy: lurking shitsack

13. PeregrineV: lurking shitsack

14. RadiantCowbells: lurking shitsack

15. Toomai:lurking shitsack

16. yessiree*: shitsack
17. TheIrishPope: useless with a smug sense of condescending ignorance

the fact that you can't count bothers me

This post loses one relevancy point, since it's not relevant to Orc's alignment.

[PeregrineV]

Nothing.. but when Caled is using meta to call me scum and a few others (cabd especially) are calling me town due to meta somethings up.

I would have to vote scum right now, but I did skip a few pages.

What would those skipped pages show me?

[PeregrineV]

I thought we were lynching Orc like days ago. What's the hold-up?

[PeregrineV]

Why do you not like the Caled wagon?

Whats the basis for it?

[PeregrineV]

Is there a viable caledfwitch case?

[PeregrineV]

CALED'S SUPER AMAZING (BUT ALSO SILLY) READS LIST

(yay content!)

:

town or

town

• MVP - Your direct posts are a big town tell for me (thumbs up coming soon)
  sangres - Confidence is a big town read for me, as more confident players usually take up leader roles
  Toomai - Also quite confident, which is reassuring.
  
  AFB
  - I don't actually see how these guys are particularly scum-ish, but I want to see more level-headed posts from BRO-head, because arguing on the Internet doesn't help. A case on this guy would be great
  
  JS
  - I liked that one reads post apart from what I felt was interpreting Guyett incorrectly.

null

• Cephrir - save the sarcasm for later, you have time to think your posts through
  Hermy - still looking for that reads list you mentioned in post 843
  PV - post 1395 sounds townish but I have a feeling that you'll be giving someone a twist package during the night instead >__>
  Sakura Hana - why would you change your meta this game?? wouldn't acting town give you a better chance
  TIP - Surprised your post count has been so low for someone who everyone argues about.

scum or

scum

• Guyett - I've seen how he reacts to a wagon as town, and this isn't it. He's acting way too chill to be town.
  yessiree - how is it so easy to catch scum?? is JS shit posting the only reason you voted for him?? "your opinion doesn't matter"??????
  
  likeabauss
  - Your posts are good but your reliance on the support of other people is suspicious. Make a good case, and others will follow.
  
  orcinus
  - *votes* 3 posts later *shifts vote* ???? put some thought into what ur doing
  
  RC
  - obvious town my ass

hrrrrrrrrrk idek

• MC Maraca - you two are like a tipping seesaw to me, idek whats going on!!!

Reads list. Whether you agree with it or not, it's content and there's substance. Oh look, Guyett and Orc are both scum-reads.

In light of my wall of text, which I probably should have put under a spoiler:

VOTE: Guyett

He is acting way too laid-back to be town. I've played with him in one game where he was town and he was always skittish and panicky – I'm not seeing this here.

It's going to take a lot to move my vote from him, Guyett you are going down.

PEDIT: Have you played any town games with this new meta?

Oh look! A vote on Guyett! A scum-read!

The italics mean they are LEAN-faction. (im dead)

likeabauss is too reliant on the support of other players; like I said, if you make a convincing case people will follow. Therefore he is kind of scummy.

Guyett is my top scum read though; he is actually a lot more laid-back as scum from what I've noticed, probably because he knows he has people to back him up. As the game goes on he might get progressively more nervous as scum dies, but right now no. Confidence is usually a sign of townish players, but not him.

Also Cephrir it wasn't just a little sarcasm; there was basically sass in every post. I sick-burned some kid six times in one hour IRL and decided that, like your sarcasm, it was a bit much.

More content!

I don't really believe in orc's claim, but it seems like an easy wagon so I'm also hesitant to vote for him.

A wagon on a scum-read. Already voting a scum-read. The second scum-read is stronger than the first. What's the issue?

I don't really believe in orc's claim, but it seems like an easy wagon so I'm also hesitant to vote for him.

Let me fix that for you:

I want to cast doubt on this claim in case the lynch swings that way, but I'm worried I might get heat for actually attacking him. I'll just post here and test the waters to see how town swings.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: caled

If you've actually learned anything useful you will know that input from various sources is needed, so here's another viewpoint:

Orc sounds kind of scummy but as said before I am absolutely convinced that Guyett is scum and I'm not moving my vote anytime soon.

My meta will reveal that I only vote when absolutely convinced of someone's guilt, and rarely move said vote.

Did nobody check the logic in Cabd's post? Did nobody go to check whether or not Caled's voting pattern is consistent with her meta?

These were the posts I remember reading last, and they gave me a townread on the slot stronger than 1805+1814.

You got anything else?

[PeregrineV]

She's not fence-sitting in favor of anything. She's massively cogdissing it up.

If it were newbtown being paranoid, I'd expect a full back-off to see how better players deal with it/to be safe. I'm a fairly experienced player, and I still don't like lynching un-CC'd PRs, even neg-utility ones.

Considering MVPs strong townread and defense of scum-caledwitch, which of the following is true, IYO:

1) Scum-Caled has totally fooled town-MVP (and me) into thinking they are town.
2) Scum-Caled is being protected by scum-MVP.
3) Town-Caled is being correctly read by town-MVP.
4) Town-Caled is being (buddied, whiteknighted) by scum-MVP.

[PeregrineV]

I actually think orc is more likely scum than caled at this point but I'm still not lynching him.

Some background on this conclusion please.

[PeregrineV]

you have balls to lynch and uncounterclaimed cop

good on you

I see your cop claim, and I get it.

Unvote.

I kind of want to understand this appeal to mafia theory that we shouldn't lynch you because you haven't been counterclaimed.

[PeregrineV]

Let's follow the witch.

Vote: Guyett

@Orc-

Your lack of strong obv-towning as you approach impending death to make up for crappy play does not really fall in line with the cop role and town wincon.

Why is that?

[PeregrineV]

Let's follow the witch.

Vote: Guyett

@Orc-

Your lack of strong obv-towning as you approach impending death to make up for crappy play does not really fall in line with the cop role and town wincon.

Why is that?

If you are going to try a flashwagon you should really choose a better target.

The lack of Guyett wading in here seems to me to not resemble his townplay from the Marvel vs DC game.

So not so much a flashwagon (6 days left) but a notice of intent that key players are not meeting their expectations that I think I would see from them if they had a town role.

[PeregrineV]

Let's follow the witch.

Vote: Guyett

@Orc-

Your lack of strong obv-towning as you approach impending death to make up for crappy play does not really fall in line with the cop role and town wincon.

Why is that?

VOTE: Orcinus

VOTE: Orci

VOTE: orc

Unvote
Vote: Orc

I don't really feel motivated, and I

don't know why.

You know that doesn't matter.

Should you live too long, you know you have to be lynched anyway.

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine has a poor looking ISO aside from promises of bulletproof vests.

I do what I can.

[PeregrineV]

Sangres, I feel like you're trying to talk yourself out of voting for Orcinus. All the indications you've alluded to suggest he's scum based on your experience? Nacho trusts my Rank meta and if my previous assumption is correct your gut read on Orcinus says scum... so what gives?

I just don't get this board sometimes. People will flash wagon a noob who didn't do anything scummy, but won't hang a well known veteran who is basically screaming "I'm scum."

Just so you have a non-you point of veiw- Orcinus cop claim carries some weight, because starting the game off lynching your investigative role is somewhat disheartening.

Letting scum kill him is annoying, but at least WE didn't do it.

I know you have other scumreads, why not lynch one of them for today?

[PeregrineV]

zero analysis.

You mean analysis based on interactions to those of known alignments?

[PeregrineV]

Cops dont act scummy.

Cops dont act scummy.

This is one of the dumbest posts I have ever seen

[PeregrineV]

You people are going to make me read, aren't you?

Vote: Sakura

[PeregrineV]

Cephrir, I'm just going to point out that your recent posts reek of horseshit.

Also, I was expecting to see come content from PeregrineV's catch up posts but lol why the fuck did I get my hopes up.

Have a nice day i'm off to shitty labs.

What were you looking for?

[PeregrineV]

back from thanksgiving-catching up today.

[PeregrineV]

Why are all my town reads dead by the third day?

Without reading,

Vote: Guyett

[PeregrineV]

This game went from really interesting to really boring really fast.

Why are all my town reads dead by the third day?

[PeregrineV]

Pv what do you think about the case on hermy?

Haven't read it yet. Highlights?

[PeregrineV]

Its appalling. Trademark easy mislynch wagon driven by scum

Any of the same scum that drove the other mislynches, that bussed Orc, or that were suspected by the NK victims?

[PeregrineV]

Why do I not want 80% the players in this game anywhere near lylo?

Because this game is full of ~geniuses~

I would argue with the "full" part.

[PeregrineV]

Could be MC Maraca tbh. His apparent PR could be faked and they bussed orc at the start of the day

what PR did she claim, and what results has she had?

[PeregrineV]

AA9's chronicles of Narnia mafia.

pedit: HOLY FUCK p5 are you not reading the game.

claimed follower, N1 followed Orc and got that he killed, N2 hit a protective role.

I'll probably read back, but last time I was here fully we were debating lynching Orc and lynched Sakura instead.

[PeregrineV]

Anyone else find it strange that Guyett said MC claimed role cop when the wording in 2087 indicates follower?

You think Freudian slip?

[PeregrineV]

If Maraca is a follower, there is no way it ("it" for hydra) could be certain of orc's assignment if orc didn't perform the night kill

If Maraca is scum they could have just bussed Orc to make their fake claim more believable....

This is true.

But why not give another day of contentious discussion, outting the cop, and trying to mislynch instead of bussing and lynching in just a few pages? Seems like a less-than-optimal move for scum.

[PeregrineV]

Holy shit I even claimed i'd be following him night one during day one. Like five fucking times.

There is one inconsistency with your claim on day 1, when you said

Attention people voting orcinus:

If shit is faked ill know tomorrow.

Thank you.

because

If Maraca is a follower, there is no way it ("it" for hydra) could be certain of orc's alignment if orc didn't perform the night kill

Ummmmm....

[PeregrineV]

Prod dodge.

**Too slow.**

[PeregrineV]

I think Sangres should be higher up your list? You shouldn't give him leeway just cause he's townreading you.

Sorry I think something cut out when I was writing thay. The list from afb to sangres are people I wouldnt object to lynching

You have mistakenly included me on the "ok the lynch list".

Whyfor would you do this?

[PeregrineV]

Sunday check-in, but Monday is when any real actions happens.

[PeregrineV]

Unvote.

Skimming indicates something has been claimed but I don;t have time to look into it now.

[PeregrineV]

The only way MC could be non-scum is if Roleblocking is classified as a protective action, which I've seen it as.

Jailkeeping

A Jailkeeper (or Jailer)'s Night Action is one that protects its target from kills, but also Roleblocks its target. Unlike Doctor, Jailkeeper's protection extends

[PeregrineV]

He can't be a jailkeeper. If he was, MCM wouldn't have gotten a result.

Did Angry say he "protected" McMara?

[PeregrineV]

The only way MC could be non-scum is if Roleblocking is classified as a protective action, which I've seen it as.

Jailkeeping

A Jailkeeper (or Jailer)'s Night Action is one that protects its target from kills, but also Roleblocks its target. Unlike Doctor, Jailkeeper's protection extends

PV do you really think AFB is a jailkeeper?

The questions I'm trying to answer:

Is Radiant a cop?
If so, he got 1 innocent (Hermy) and one guilty (AFB).

McMara "counterclaims" with "I followed AFB, he is a protective role".
Who did AFB say he targeted last night?
Scum doctors are not that common. It would, however, act as a GF to a town gunsmith.

Is IrishPope a gunsmith?
Got a gun on Sangres and no-gun on (I forget).
Scumdoc would act as GF to that role.

Sangres claims 1-shot vig who killed Caled n1. Ceph counters as X-shot vig. Sangres double-counters that he is scum, but Ceph is SK because kill on him failed.

Ceph can be sorted later, but I can see Sengres as scum based on Ceph counterclaim.

Circling back, if AFB is scum protective role, yet is not scumdoc, may be scum JK. This would give him both a protect and roleblock, giving the scumteam a little more versatility.

Why would Sangres claim knowing he may be counterclaimed?
To help the town out by locating the SK?
To get the town vig to claim so they can kill him?
To draw attention away from the Radiant cop-guilty claim?

Doubt it.
Probably.
Could see if Sangres is goon.

[PeregrineV]

Got it.

Another option would be scum JOAT.

This would allow AFB to be scum while leaving McMara as town and yet still correct.

But, McMara can't verify the target of AFB, just his action, correct?

Which doesn't answer "Is Radiant the cop?"

1- He could be the town cop with the results he stated.
2- He could be town cop lying about results.
3- He could be scum trying to lynch town AFB.
4- He could be town VT gambitting to get his scumread of AFB lynched and protect his townread Hermy.

1-Makes the most sense.
2-Makes little sense.
3- If that is the case, why the Sangres scumclaim?
4- Maybe, but most town backs off when called on it, because most are not egotistical enough to think they are never wrong. Which brings me back to probably 1.

[PeregrineV]

So if both Sangres and AFB are scum, why not lynch AFB, confirm Radiant, and have Ceph shoot Sangres?

That makes the most sense, really.

Am I missing something?

[PeregrineV]

why not lynch sangres and have csph shoot AFB?

Because should anything go wrong with night actions, the AFB flip will confirm Radiant as cop, giving the towndoc someone to cover.

And if Sangres fakeclaimed, then he's probably not a scum PR, while AFB appears to be.

[PeregrineV]

Based on voting, I'd put Jacob as additional scum, since he didn't vote AFB after a cop guilty, but voted Sangres as soon as Sangres claimed, without even the Ceph counterclaim taking place first.

[PeregrineV]

how do you know there is even a town doc? we're already overloaded with PR's....

There may or may not be a town doc, who may or may not protect the claimed cop, the claimed vig, or the the claimed gunsmith, or someone else entirely.

Know what I mean?

[PeregrineV]

My only argument for lynching sangres over AFB is that sangres could be a roleblocker, and AFB can't be. Also, if AFB is town, TIP survives the night.

I would think that scum-PR sangres woulnd't do the vig claim, because a counterclaim would mean his death. He could have avoided the thread until day4 in order to coordinate a "better" fakeclaim.

But for that, I see your concern.

Does this mean you do NOT think Radiant is the cop?

[PeregrineV]

Yay go town!

[PeregrineV]

I didn't like the fake-cop guilty, and I would have hated it even more if I was town. I can appreciate gambits, I have pulled some in the past and MC Mara games are so full of gambits (mostly made by C) that I know where they are headed.

I understand the feeling of never being listened to, but lying about something and not admitting that it's a lie isn't going to do anything. Other than, maybe make you less trust-worthy as time goes on so that, if you do ever truly get cop people won't listen to you (boy who cried wolf)

I am not fond of the execution of the claim, and I am definitely not fond of the lack of trust you have in your fellow townies.

A game isn't all about you (and this is coming from me, one of the most self-centered players ever) it's about knowing the strength of everyone else around you, working together to get scum/town eliminated.

It's all about being right. Since his gambit got scum to concede and town won, it all worked out in the end.