The Fall of Gondolin Mafia: Game Over (The Tale of Gondolin)

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Aegor

Since I've never played with you.

Sunday post, so probably not much until Monday.

[PeregrineV]

Well, that was groovy.

Vote: Shadow

Reck is leaning town. I'll need to see more to fully detrmine, but any attempt to move will start from there. Tierce is less so.

Sprye I wanted to say "Town!" at his early posting. But, I think he is fully capable of vote parking and then justifying it as scum. So, one null it is.

[PeregrineV]

Sprye I wanted to say "Town!" at his early posting. But, I think he is fully capable of vote parking and then justifying it as scum. So, one null it is.

This is what honestly bothers me about SpyreX here.

He seems to be trying WAY too hard to justify voteparking early D1. That doesn't seem like town SpyreX. Town SpyreX just IS and requires minimal effort to effect the gamestate. Going "bawwww gonna votepark to make a point and then spend a few posts justifying it with too many words" doesn't seem like townSpy.

That's why we make no judgement at this point, and see what we see.

[PeregrineV]

why the fuck do people keep posting in code? do you guys have a post restriction??

These are the posts that are being made in the public neighbor QT, which exists in the thread.

[PeregrineV]

The neighbourhood thing is confusing.

At this point in the game, I'm confused about how you are confused by non-standard posting.

Can you read this?

How about this?

[PeregrineV]

I like PV just as much as I dislike Els. Its truly an amazing yin yang

I like me too!

Let's hypothesize Elscouta as scum. you know, just for argument's sake.

Based on his posts, who is most likely to be his scum buddy? Who is least likely?

I'll accept answers from the studio audience also, as long as they are answered.

[PeregrineV]

There still appears to be 5 votes on the RVS wagon.

Back'em up or pick a new one.

[PeregrineV]

Uh, without ISOing - Nat has been rolefishing in one post mildly(gamestart) and one post heavily(page 3 or so). other than that, her attitude to this game is MUCH unlike her town meta; and her posts have all been shallow as shit.

Do you think Natirasha is scum who asked for a role claim (15) and entirely expected to get away with it, and is currently laughing at us in his QT because we are too dumb to catch him?

[PeregrineV]

Dear god, sirdanilot, SHUT UP.

I just checked this thread for the first time in however long and you have more posts than any two other people combined. You are making noise. You are not charismatic enough to push a wagon by force of personality, and everyone knows your scumspects already. If you are Town, shut up and sit prettily. Let other people actually chime in of their own volition, it gets much harder to read someone else when you have more than double the amount of posts of every other player and keep pushing for irrelevant commentary that doesn't show people's natural trajectories. You're probably Town, but damn, you're as bad at this as you are at letting people discuss their business elsewhere without butting in. Let the thread breathe.

And when it's

me

telling you you are posting too much, it's probably a sign you're posting

too damn much

.


chmaber's Elscouta and ESL post was :goodposting:.

Multitasking, will be here and there.

I'm good with him talking. If he starts fluffing, then we'll have issues.

[PeregrineV]

PV/SSK help me out here.

I can go as far as to say, gut-based, I don't think you are scum.

[PeregrineV]

2. JacobSavage - Postcount: 6. I honestly didn't realize he'd posted before Scummy Butt: The Buttening. Not really much to go on, instead of explaining townreads please explain which of your fourteen 'scumreads' you think is the scummiest and why, possibly with a vote even, which you are not doing and should.
4. Aegor - I didn't like post 141 as an entry post, it felt like throwing a bunch of things out to see what sticks, plus what I said earlier about his views on Esp. Also not sure what brachylogy means, but if it means empty voting you're basically voting ABR for being ABR, he always does that as far as I've seen? I don't think you'd know that though. Conversation with Sirdan is sensical but you haven't actually mentioned anything about who you think is scum, so not really much to go on. Please explain which of the sixteen people who isn't yourself or ABR you also think are scummy and why. I'm preparing to copy/paste saying that alot!
5. Natirasha - I really want to like your posts but I think it's because you're posting like ActionDan in a non-caring kind of way. You're not Dan thhough so it's weird. I expected you to be more.. cheerful I guess? You were more wordy in the quicktopic, I think. I'm not really sure what I want you to do different to be honest, I just don't want to think of you as scum.
7. MafiaSSK - Last post: four days ago. Considering there wasn't really any meat to sink into at the time, there's not really much to go on here. Please follow up on question aimed at chamber, and answer if you still think Nat and Esp are scummy. SSK was quiet to the point of me not expecting him to reply to posts in the QT, and he's kind of a lurker in general, so it's hard to get a read either way.
9. Espeonage - I actually thought the whole VT on the scene thing was a good reaction test way to start off at first but the overblown NOW YOU'VE ACTIVATED MY TRAP CARD SIRDAN YOU ARE THE SCUMS tunnel is just.. bad.

@sirdan's posting. Look at how he demands to know everything, town definitely wants information yes, but scum need it. It's like how White shouldn't lose tempo because they have the foot up on black in chess.

Nonsensical is probably a better word, and crazy paranoid. "Town would do this, but scum need to do it MORE, so sirdan spamming up the thread demanding to know everything means he's super scummy!" What I really want you to do is stop tunneling Sirdan and make a scum read that isn't based on The Most Easy to Hate Dude making posts at you.
11. Albert B. Rampage - Post count: 6. I don't know if there's a difference between ABR's town and scum games, but I'm already remembering why my eyes keep glazing over as I reread this game. Uhm, you said you would explain one of your votes if people picked one, and the only one person have shown interest in in the sirdan vote, so explain?
13. Desperado - Post count: 5. Please kill me. Wow, are you still voting me? I know I wanted to die while we were buddies, but I think you'll find I was equally suicidal in the game you were half-scum in too. If you're going to use meta then maybe you should use more then one game. You have plenty of my posts to look at and tell me if you still think I'm scum at least. also question, do you think sirdan is town or scum because when I tell someone I have a problem with their posts in your tone, it usually means I'm suspicious of them, but it's not clear in the way you're asking.
15. Elscouta - didn't like entry post of hopping onto the for some reason growing Sirdan wagon. Looking at his later posts though I'd have to say he's at least taking it seriously? Like, the opposite of how I feel about Esp's tunnelrageback. Still needs more scumspects who could actually be scum (tm)
16. PeregrineV - brain asdfghkjing why are you voting me and stop it reads as peregrinev
17. TheIrishPope (replacing xRECKONERx) - is a dude that's here

its hurting to think but I think I think Esp is the worst right now? Really what I'm remembering is that the game still practically hasn't started because half the people still haven't posted things. PS TIP if you seriously would have vigged someone who is obvtown instead of any of the above excluding yourself yyou would deserve to have the shit kicked out of you.

##Unvote
##Vote: Espironage

Tierce, I think you will find I was never actually a voyeuristic old man, I was always a sexy fiery temptress hiding in an old man's clothes. Also I'd have to say I'm as far opposite to being a voyeur as possible. Just pretend you can't read him and remember he's at least trying to help, in his own.. way. I'd stop posting if I were him too, wondering if I were still alive? (Or I'd start swearing at the 'vig' I supose if I was in the mood)
PPS i will take this as your admittance that i was in fact the bestest girl

Mine eyes hath devoured your wordiness. For the length of the post, I was fulfilled.

Then I finished the post.

Alas, my brain is once more hungry.

[PeregrineV]

Neighbor post:

Code: Select all

Yarr.

Shadoweh's last post looks pretty off to me.

You should totes claim to me by the bye.

This first post by CES reads clumsily, and disjoined in a way which this following post by chamber doesn't:

Code: Select all

I don't like the way Peregrine came into the game like that. I'm wondering if he even read the thread.

tiercexReck is really boring. I don't think I see any useful information there, were you expecting reck to do anything other than FAKERAGE by piling on the pressure? Hard to get meaningful reactions from him.

I don't really get the shos wagon. He's being a bit of a derp but most of that was after it started. I need to go look for the root cause of it.

Shadoweh has had some more bad posts since her first. Especially post 64.

I'm VT, just going to obv town it up and get NKed though, nothing special. Spryex locking in his vote means it will happen sooner than later.

This especially as I can't imagine that they discussed this pre-game really, and that fact that his reply is calm suggests calm mindset which tends to come from town a lot more in the very early game.

Do you speculate they are in a town-town, town-scum, or other type of neighborhood?

[PeregrineV]

I like Eol. Tierce is not yet town

I failed Abbreviations 101. Who is Eol?

[PeregrineV]

You failed flavor 101

*SNAP*

I did at that.

[PeregrineV]

However chamber reading Els's games and noticing a different in style of posting and then probing to see why feels waay more town motivated then scum mostly because, even if he did find something, scum-chamber trying to push a lynch through on HE TYPE DIFFERENT would be the most uphill and eye pulling kind of thing ever.

Is this assuming from chamber's posting, or did you follow up on the claimed work and look at Elscouta's games and notice a different posting style yourself?

[PeregrineV]

I got the impression it was made up to be annoying in the first place, but I agree that it was pretty terrible. That's better reasoning then I expected actually. And it's easy to forget about people when they aren't posting. :V

Why is it better than expected when he almost literally c/p'd Tierce's reasons?

Albert: Still waiting on that Dan explanation.

ActionDan or sirdanilot?

[PeregrineV]

Now that red whine is over, I can say that natirasha's play here doesn't look at all like his play there to me.

I'm going to translate this as you saying that in that game, Natirasha was scum, and his play here does not remind you of the scum he was in that game. You are saying he is town based on the single game play comparison.

[PeregrineV]

Is there a reason you are still voting shadoweh peregrine?

Probably because I still think he's scum. But, I'll listen to the arguements for why he is town.

[PeregrineV]

Could someone please vig sirdan or Esp tonight? I really do not want this inane conflict to last longer than it has too.

Why are they not scumhunting each other, in your opinion?

[PeregrineV]

Could someone please vig sirdan or Esp tonight? I really do not want this inane conflict to last longer than it has too.

Why are they not scumhunting each other, in your opinion?

It is possible. Hence my request.

It is, but your classifying it as inane conflict means you think it's silly or stupid, and thus there is no merit to the conflict. I don't think that's the same as scumhunting each other.

[PeregrineV]

Sorry, our last holiday until May. Catching up today.

[PeregrineV]

That turned out to be less productive than I hoped.

Was feeling the Espeonage lynch, then went back and reread 603, because the first time I read it incorrectly.

What's the basis for the Jacob wagon?

@Shadow

- maybe. Your town and scum posting is very similar.

[PeregrineV]

I had words for Shadoweh and can't recall them. It'll come to me.

ehhh.

Tierce should still be lynched first.

I'll buy whatever you're selling.

For now.

Vote: Tierce

[PeregrineV]

Peeregrine: That's kind of depressing. My scum posting is horrible and I don't understand why people can't tell the difference. In one of them, I'm actually enjoying myself playing the mystery game. In the other I want to sleep until I wake up and my role pm turned green.

Scum-you
Mini 1489: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=30846
Otherworld Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=22453
Good v Evil Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=21408

Town-you
Experimental Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=21773
Mini 1376: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=23295

[PeregrineV]

PeregrineV

WHAT IS IT THAT YOU THINK YOU ARE DOING?!?!
read the fuckin game please
especially read that post with the big picture

I agree with chamber that Tierce is scummy.

I want to hear from Aegor now that he's getting a lot of love.

I am reading.

[PeregrineV]

1. Aegor has 5 votes on him.

2. @Aegor- Why the lack of response to shos' "case" on you, and the 5 other people following him?

3. @Aegor- Why the eagerness to claim, considering you have less than 50% of the votes need to lynch you?

4. @shos- Why are you not voting the wagon you are pushing?

5. @shos- your total conversation or mention of Aegor includes the fact you are also starting the book. Until your 847. Why?

[PeregrineV]

no other lynch is going to happen, so it's either NL or lynch you. I think you should claim the other part as well.

You know what, you are right. I guess even if I only get to use it once, it would be worth it because it is so awesome.

I am a town-aligned Godfather (again, unsurprising, given Maeglin). My ability lets me choose someone (1) who will kill someone else (2) of my choice. The kill will go through if (1) is town. If (1) is maf, the kill will not succeed. It is thus a combination cop-vig ability.

Oh, and (1) is not informed of what happened.

More like a town-aligned ninja vig miller cop?

You'll show up as guilty to the non-ninja non-vig non-miller cop.
You're kills cannot be tracked back to you.
You can kill someone by having a town player kill someone without that killers knowledge, so any watchers will think the town player did it.
If the kill does not happen, you've copped a mafiate.

Does that about cover it?

[PeregrineV]

I'll be here for another hour or so.

Current final reads based on 38 pages would be appreciated right about now.

[PeregrineV]

Is that a question for me or people generally?

You, seeing as how you are strong town PR with town wincon and 5 hours from being lynched.

[PeregrineV]

PV, hammer please, I don't trust him

His silence speaks volumes.

Besides, gotta go home.

Vote: Aegor

[PeregrineV]

I thought we lynched mafia but now I'm not sure.

[PeregrineV]

CES, why? Because I felt Chamber was probably going to be WIFOM'd by scum (why kill the easily lynchable townie) and CES's actions towards the end of the day made him very town.

Shadow has a point. Maybe show the posts were CES' actions "made him very town".

And why you think chamber would have been "easily lynchable".

[PeregrineV]

Catchup today, but lots of work, so minimal posting.

[PeregrineV]

Catchup today, but lots of work, so minimal posting.

I lied- no time.

[PeregrineV]

Got today only until Monday. What's going on?

[PeregrineV]

Got today only until Monday. What's going on?

Town Majiffy replaced in and revitalized the game.

Vote sirdan?

Nah, don't feel that's a vote on scum.

Almost want to go back to Shadow, or vote Tierce, since I agree with Dan.

But, ABR is running at 100% below minimal.

Vote: ABR

[PeregrineV]

PV Are you still scum now that you have 6 votes? If not, who is scum? Is the wagon on you scum-driven?

I'll answer in 3 pages.

[PeregrineV]

That went faster than I expected.

[PeregrineV]

PV Are you still scum now that you have 6 votes? If not, who is scum? Is the wagon on you scum-driven?

PeregrineV - 6 - shos, Majiffy, Shadoweh, sirdanilot, Albert B. Rampage, Cogito Ergo Sum

This is was the height of my wagon, although I think it's gone down since.

shos- I remain neutral on. His meta to me was not saying town, but it was based on an older game. More recent games it still doesn't look like his recent town games, but it's more gut than anything I can point out.

Majiffy- Could be. Crap votes aren't his forte, but he has been known to hop on a wagon or two. Frankly, he did vote his scum reads in the beginning, and I was null to him, so it's not unreasonable. However, if Majiffy flips scum, then I found another.

Shadow- Had early game suspicions, and they haven't gotten much better (a little, not much). Part of this is tied for the 5th most posts, yet hard to find actual opinions. Today's consists of jumping on the Desp wagon and my wagon, but not original wagons or content. I'd say scum.

sirdanilot- Seems to have incurred a large amount of scumreads. And I can see why some may think so, but overall, town enough not to lynch.

ABR- Is pretty much voting everyone who has voted him or called him scum. I'm torn, since I feel this is how he would play as scum, but glancing at his recent games (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?tit ... B._Rampage) there's not much to differentiate him. As town, he'd probably be scum protected to take into lylo, although if scum looks at his game stats, they are more likely to win if they lynch him now. Would maybe default lynch, but probably not today.

CES- Crappy vote. Can't tell if crappy town or crappy scum.

That sums up my wagon, unfortunately.

Would currently be for a Shadow or MafiaSSK as scum.

Vote: MafiaSSK

[PeregrineV]

Els will you be a doll and be like Action-I-Hop-Onto-Every-Wagon-Dan and hop onto the Spyrex wagon please thanks.

Sigh. It seems to be another playstyle-based wagon, which means that I would need to do a meta analysis on him. Add to that the fact that it was launched as a counterwagon to wagons I like (and by people far from my townlist) means I will most likely not be on board.

Wagons I would support currently : ABR, Desp, sirdan

I kind of have you as a town read. What are your MafiaSSK, Shadow TiP, shos reads, and what are they based on?

[PeregrineV]

Vote: MafiaSSK

No, just looked back through his ISO.

@mafiaSSK

- Where has your CES=scummy scum scum read gone to?

Vote: Shadow

[PeregrineV]

Gah I just don't know this game anymore....

you know, this kind of implies you did at one point. With your townreads of ActionDan & SpyreX & CES and nothing else, that seems kind of.....fake.

Hey, since we're on the topic of you,

Maybe show the posts were CES' actions "made him very town".

[PeregrineV]

VOTE: Tierce

ABR is coming out as town.

I would build a case on Esp or some of the other scum right now, abr, but I am tired, hungry have no energy yadayadayada. So not now.

Thoughts on 1329?

[PeregrineV]

Back and reading.

[PeregrineV]

I'm behind a few pages, but have all of the night actions been claimed and why?

[PeregrineV]

vc 4.1A (unofficial)
Tierce - 1 -
Albert B. Rampage - 6 - Cogito Ergo Sum, Tierce, shos, Desperado, Elscouta, JacobSavage
Cogito Ergo Sum - 1 - Espeonage
Espeonage - 3 - SpyreX, ActionDan, sirdanilot
Elscouta - 1- Albert B. Rampage

Not voting (1): PeregrineV

Not for an ABR lynch today. Maybe next week, if nothing better can be found, but not right now.

[PeregrineV]

2. JacobSavage - Postcount: 6. I honestly didn't realize he'd posted before Scummy Butt: The Buttening. Not really much to go on, instead of explaining townreads please explain which of your fourteen 'scumreads' you think is the scummiest and why, possibly with a vote even, which you are not doing and should.
4.

Aegor

- I didn't like post 141 as an entry post, it felt like throwing a bunch of things out to see what sticks, plus what I said earlier about his views on Esp. Also not sure what brachylogy means, but if it means empty voting you're basically voting ABR for being ABR, he always does that as far as I've seen? I don't think you'd know that though. Conversation with Sirdan is sensical but you haven't actually mentioned anything about who you think is scum, so not really much to go on. Please explain which of the sixteen people who isn't yourself or ABR you also think are scummy and why. I'm preparing to copy/paste saying that alot!
5.

Natirasha

- I really want to like your posts but I think it's because you're posting like ActionDan in a non-caring kind of way. You're not Dan thhough so it's weird. I expected you to be more.. cheerful I guess? You were more wordy in the quicktopic, I think. I'm not really sure what I want you to do different to be honest, I just don't want to think of you as scum.
7.

MafiaSSK

- Last post: four days ago. Considering there wasn't really any meat to sink into at the time, there's not really much to go on here. Please follow up on question aimed at chamber, and answer if you still think

Nat

and Esp are scummy.

SSK

was quiet to the point of me not expecting him to reply to posts in the QT, and he's kind of a lurker in general, so it's hard to get a read either way.
9. Espeonage - I actually thought the whole VT on the scene thing was a good reaction test way to start off at first but the overblown NOW YOU'VE ACTIVATED MY TRAP CARD SIRDAN YOU ARE THE SCUMS tunnel is just.. bad.

@sirdan's posting. Look at how he demands to know everything, town definitely wants information yes, but scum need it. It's like how White shouldn't lose tempo because they have the foot up on black in chess.

Nonsensical is probably a better word, and crazy paranoid. "Town would do this, but scum need to do it MORE, so sirdan spamming up the thread demanding to know everything means he's super scummy!" What I really want you to do is stop tunneling Sirdan and make a scum read that isn't based on The Most Easy to Hate Dude making posts at you.
11. Albert B. Rampage - Post count: 6. I don't know if there's a difference between ABR's town and scum games, but I'm already remembering why my eyes keep glazing over as I reread this game. Uhm, you said you would explain one of your votes if people picked one, and the only one person have shown interest in in the sirdan vote, so explain?
13. Desperado - Post count: 5. Please kill me. Wow, are you still voting me? I know I wanted to die while we were buddies, but I think you'll find I was equally suicidal in the game you were half-scum in too. If you're going to use meta then maybe you should use more then one game. You have plenty of my posts to look at and tell me if you still think I'm scum at least. also question, do you think sirdan is town or scum because when I tell someone I have a problem with their posts in your tone, it usually means I'm suspicious of them, but it's not clear in the way you're asking.
15. Elscouta - didn't like entry post of hopping onto the for some reason growing Sirdan wagon. Looking at his later posts though I'd have to say he's at least taking it seriously? Like, the opposite of how I feel about Esp's tunnelrageback. Still needs more scumspects who could actually be scum (tm)
16. PeregrineV - brain asdfghkjing why are you voting me and stop it reads as peregrinev
17.

TheIrishPope

(replacing xRECKONERx) - is a dude that's here

its hurting to think but I think I think Esp is the worst right now? Really what I'm remembering is that the game still practically hasn't started because half the people still haven't posted things. PS TIP if you seriously would have vigged someone who is obvtown instead of any of the above excluding yourself yyou would deserve to have the shit kicked out of you.

##Unvote
##Vote: Espironage

Tierce, I think you will find I was never actually a voyeuristic old man, I was always a sexy fiery temptress hiding in an old man's clothes. Also I'd have to say I'm as far opposite to being a voyeur as possible. Just pretend you can't read him and remember he's at least trying to help, in his own.. way. I'd stop posting if I were him too, wondering if I were still alive? (Or I'd start swearing at the 'vig' I supose if I was in the mood)
PPS i will take this as your admittance that i was in fact the bestest girl

I'm at least ready to make a no-chance-in-hell pact on not voting Tierce,

chamber

, Actshun Dan, sirdanylyots (who people keep calling Dan, which is messing me up, there are two Dans in this game say their full names plz) and shos. I don't really have a read on Spyrex or CES other then 'is Spyrex' and 'is CES' but I don't really want to lynch either of them either. That still leaves.. a pretty decent list of people now that I look at it. Will look at actual list in next post since people are posting and I don't want to pass out first

[PeregrineV]

@elscouta:
I ignored 1586 on purpose, and will keep ignoring anything people might say about me being JK. there's a purpose behind all this.

if I ever come up as a lynch candidate, I will fully disclose everything and stuff, and explain everything; but not before then.

So far, my night actions, in accordance to the supposed fakeclaim, make absolutely no sense for ABR town, the way I see it.

I'm more talking about the bodyguard claim.
If you are JK, and someone claims cop, do you JK them?

It depends. Do you believe them? Do others believe them? Do you think scum will believe them? Is their day play good enough so that they can be a leader even without results? Is there someone better to take a chance protecting while leaving the cop unprotected?

Basic answer is really personal choice based on all of the above, so there is no one set answer.

And who are your other choices for scum?

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine will you join me in an Esp lynch, pretty please? You're in the good camp aren't ya ?!

I am, and I might, but let's see what Shadow said or didn't say first.

Vote: Espeonage

There. Now go look at Shadow's posts.

[PeregrineV]

Looking through Shadow iso, early day1 he sloughs off anyone voting CES (373, 585, 596, 598, 622, 756, 763). Then, day2, after Jacob claims to have protected CES, Shadow criticizes that decision (992).

[PeregrineV]

well the idea was to get an understanding of 'if you were a JK, what would you do in the last two nights'.<<<everyone can answer this. answer truthfully.

Let's see. If I were JK, I'd try to block some sort of nullread night1 like ActionDan or SpryeX, hoping to prevent the kill.

night2 I might target ABR to protect him, but then he'd have no result, and his WIFOM claim would live on. So I'd probably leave him unprotected, since his play has sucked anyway, and a half cop played suckily is no PR at all. I'd probably try for the block again on you or Shadow or Tierce.

night2 after the RB claim, I'd kind of figure that, so would ignore the claim, and try for a protect on SirDani or ElsCouta.

Assuming there was no results from my n1 or n2 actions, that is.

[PeregrineV]

Didn't see Jacobs claims, and nothing is obvious to me.

@Desp-

Good on ya!

[PeregrineV]

I targetted ABR N2,
ActionDan N3.

Cool enough.

Vote: JacobSavage

[PeregrineV]

:/ i really want to believe him

That was actually the fastest wagon/lynch I've seen recently.

[PeregrineV]

Did some preliminary overnight reading, and starting (and ending) here today.

Vote: Tierce

I was distracted while finding a paper bag to breathe into. This is looking inevitable and the arguments are starting to attain maximum levels of dope. The sooner Jacob

claims

and this either goes forward or not the better. Also responsible or not, this probably wouldn't have happened if Tierce hadn't reminded everyone Jacob exists. It's not selfish, it's the truth.

##Vote JacobSalvageGuy

JacobSavage--we need a

claim

. There be hammer-happy people here, and the clock has run out.

No. Let him

claim

first.

UNVOTE: JacobSavage

I am Scum Rolecop.

Also, based on 790, going with SirDani 90% likely NOT SCUM.

[PeregrineV]

Oh for fuck's sake. Yeah, it was terrible of me to give him the chance to claim. You probably want to go through all my games and change my Town flips to red, then.

Still eagerly waiting for sirdanilot's explanation of how I'm scummy. Must be all the man-hate blinding me to it.

Well, Shadow said the same thing.

And his claim was the only thing stopping him from being the lynch.

And you never spoke to or mentioned him again, even when he was counterwagonning you on the day of no-lynch (day2).

And he flipped scum.

And Shadow flipped scum.

But, I if someone has something better I'm willing to listen.

[PeregrineV]

That is still odd; the doc is weak, why dedicate an entire role for that?

Why dedicate an entire role for a Cop--oh, wait.

Weak Doctor balances like a Cop, not like a Doctor.
Something else that came to mind, if Shieldrender is indeed Strongman--they could Jail someone and kill them. Roleblock + Kill OP.

shos, saying something scum also did is not a scumtell--their job is to look Town. And PV's posts are not coming from a Town player who actually read my ISO when he says that I ignored JacobSavage, so...?

Actually, after his claim, you had NO interaction with him. Period.

You bring hiim up here:

Oh and JS please explain more about the specifics of your bodyguard claim when you get the chance.

i.e. are there conditionals (% chance of success, % chance of killing killer, etc)

What the hell are you doing?

Why the heck would you, as Town, want him to claim this?

It's pretty obvious. If JacobSavage is scum and is ever tracked anywhere but the person he claims to protect, he's dead. If he's rolecopped and shown to be lying, he's dead. NONE of this nonsense you're asking would ever help Town.

Then he votes you here:

VOTE: Tierce

And you defend him here:

VOTE: JS

This is a terrible vote. You're moving from a wagon with no momentum to another wagon with no momentum, and not making an ounce of effort to push it. If you're not voting your Townreads, then push your nullreads already.

But when you vote Shadow:

UNVOTE: Albert B. Rampage
VOTE: Shadoweh

Jacob follows:

VOTE: Shadoweh

Then you agree with SpryeX:

Regarding Jacob, I agree. I was thinking yesterday that one of {ABR, Jacob} had to be scum, but SSK flipping tracker pretty clearly means that one extra protection that doesn't alter the lynch threshold + Aegor's role makes sense as Town in a game that starts at evens, while ABR being fakeclaiming scum slots in nicely with the silly amount of investigative roles.

200 posts later, Jacob flips scum.

[PeregrineV]

My point about 1889 is that compared to the wire-brush enema you were giving Jacob day1 pre-claim, there was a very distinct lack of

anything

after it.

[PeregrineV]

Did some preliminary overnight reading, and starting (and ending) here today.

Vote: Tierce

I was distracted while finding a paper bag to breathe into. This is looking inevitable and the arguments are starting to attain maximum levels of dope. The sooner Jacob

claims

and this either goes forward or not the better. Also responsible or not, this probably wouldn't have happened if Tierce hadn't reminded everyone Jacob exists. It's not selfish, it's the truth.

##Vote JacobSalvageGuy

JacobSavage--we need a

claim

. There be hammer-happy people here, and the clock has run out.

No. Let him

claim

first.

UNVOTE: JacobSavage

I am Scum Rolecop.

Also, based on 790, going with SirDani 90% likely NOT SCUM.

What about this?

JS scummypants

claim

scum already so we can get this over with

You think SirDani, Jacob's scum buddy, insisted he claimed and continued to call him scum while doing so?

I am Glorfindel, Town Bodyguard.

Basically I fought the Balrog but lost but in doing so I saved Idril Celebrindal.

Not lynching you today but you're not off the hook scummyboy-with-good-safeclaims

VOTE: CES

ABR TIME TO SWITCH BACK

(ftr I am willing to compromise and lynch tip but it's really just that, a compromise)

JS-scum, please be a doll and vote CES will ya

Haha you really think Jacob is town, esp?

Ahahahahahahahaa

Dan JS is not getting lynched today, unless the next wagon has a better laim than JS, then we lynch JS anyway.

[PeregrineV]

Singling out Tierce for not seeing shadow scum is super mcduper strange.

Okay tell me on what earth would a not-shitty pro-town player not have seen at that point that Shadow was obvscum.

I don't buy it. Also she is lurking, trying to avoid my accusation.

Sirdan, explain to me Why shadoweh was scum then.

Uhm, for having read me-town the entire game, then on that day switching to finding me scum and wanting to lynch me and being quite zealous about it too for no reason? And that goes for me, one of the most universally town-read people in this game?

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if shadoweh did this to defend Tierce, because there was talk of a Tierce wagon that day.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

OH MAN

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

VOTE: sirdan

See, exactly. Your scumreads are omgus. You claim shadoweh was obvscum because she flipped 180 on you, the 'universal townread'?? Lol man, literally everyone called you scum,bsince when are you a townreas of ANYONE?

you try to get towncred for bussing pre-crumb, but in fact the crumb was the only thing that made shadow confsxum - many people had him as yown ( i had him aa strongest townread}. And now - you juat sheep popular wagon(s) with nothing to add.

Eyes on the prize, shos. Town come sin all shapes and sizes. Don't let it distract you from lynching scum.

Vote Tierce, stick on Tierce, and look for her buddy.

[PeregrineV]

And why, I dunno why, all I remember about you is that practically everyone called you spewing shit and spam (and you even got offended by that a few times iirc), don't remember people calling you town.

Wow you are such an amazing pro town player.
If anyone on that list denies they called me town, so be it, but I think the vast majority of those read me town. Even tierce. So you can stuff the 'everyone thinks sirdan is scum' thing back up where you pulled it out from.

Stop antagonizing shos. Figure out who Tierce's buddy is.

[PeregrineV]

Historically through this game I've been good for Tierce, so if all else fails consider my support behind that wagon.

So does this mean you will be looking for something else, or are you merely announcing the fact that you may possibly in the future may or may not look for something else and possibly in the future may or may not vote Tierce?

[PeregrineV]

See, exactly. Your scumreads are omgus. You claim shadoweh was obvscum because she flipped 180 on you, the 'universal townread'?? Lol man, literally everyone called you scum,bsince when are you a townreas of ANYONE?

you try to get towncred for bussing pre-crumb, but in fact the crumb was the only thing that made shadow confsxum - many people had him as yown ( i had him aa strongest townread}. And now - you juat sheep popular wagon(s) with nothing to add.

That's what shadoweh does as scum. She'll flip 180 on a townie.

Espeonage ces escoultA

You know what would wrap this set of posts up nicely and tie them all together? A vote to lynch scum-Tierce.

[PeregrineV]

Why is Tierce such an obvious scum that today focus should be on finding her buddy, PV?

Everyone has posted and no one has refuted my initial case on Tierce. Then, when I went back to look some more, it only reinforced it. Furthermore, no one has a single better reason for any other player.

If Tierce flips town, then no harm, her reads are merely reads.

If Tierce flips scum, then we are already ahead of tomorrow.

[PeregrineV]

I'm not sure it's teirce. I'm taking the day slow

OK, but unfortunately for the rest of you, every single one of my games is in night. that means when I try to avoid work, I'm going to come here and harass everyone to vote for Tierce, or convince me otherwise.

So while you take it slow, you should votepark on Tierce.

[PeregrineV]

That seems a tad bit too fast, doesn't it pere? We're gonna have a hard time getting her lynched in the first place.

It depends. The day is half gone, and we have half the needed votes. If we need to wait until deadline, then I expect to see some work product from everyone.

[PeregrineV]

Actually, you know what? That's bullshit, JacobSavage. If I ask you what was the source of a Townread at a certain point and you give me an answer that has nothing to do with the time you posted the read at, it means the original read was made up and you don't have a good reason for it. (Furthermore, it's not like scum don't use meta and you know it, the reason the meta bit was good was because chamber looked for possible non-scum motivation before making accusations.)

UNVOTE: TheIrishPope
VOTE: JacobSavage

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +2

Jokes are great, but explaining the two Townreads would be even better! Why was chamber Town as of this post

He actually took time to read an old game and posting something quite meaningful.

See post below, which was why the "as of this post" line was here. Try again.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+3)

(Plus you called me Possibly a Scummy Scum Butt and that's just Not Acceptable.)

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +.5 (+3.5)

(Furthermore, it's not like scum don't use meta and you know it, the reason the meta bit was good was because chamber looked for possible non-scum motivation before making accusations.)

ummm... its not like his language had been broken or stilted this game? If anything what I did kept open the possibility of him being scum instead of closing it... which is the opposite (though less extreme) of what you said implied.

I didn't say you closed that possibility, I said (or implied) you were trying to figure out what his style in another game might mean in this game.

Actually, you know what? That's bullshit, JacobSavage. If I ask you what was the source of a Townread at a certain point and you give me an answer that has nothing to do with the time you posted the read at, it means the original read was made up and you don't have a good reason for it. (Furthermore, it's not like scum don't use meta and you know it, the reason the meta bit was good was because chamber looked for possible non-scum motivation before making accusations.)

UNVOTE: TheIrishPope
VOTE: JacobSavage

mmmmm this doesn't follow. town can't be mistaken about their reasons of having a townread? it's just as likely that he forgot

He "forgot"

within ten hours

of making that list, and within nine hours of saying he has a mild Townread on chamber?

Yeah, I'm not buying that. And I'd prefer it if you'd let him speak for himself before presenting handy excuses.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +2 (+5.5)

Nothing, in principle. In practice, you're meddling. Let people speak for themselves before you intervene. I second guess myself enough, I don't need the "help" of others to do so.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+6.5)

siridanilot, for the last fucking time:

Shut
the
hell
up.

YOU have no concept of what a team game is. YOU have no charisma whatsoever, and keep doing the same noisy bullshit you've been doing since the start of the game. You're not actually pushing for consolidation, because every single one of your posts is a torment to read. You're never going to manage to get the players to work together, so be quiet and let the grown ups do their thing. Post when you have something

new

to say.

Gaaaaah. This isn't the Fall of Gondolin, this is Morgoth's cry over and over and over again.


JacobSavage--let's play spot the difference between chamber and CES's "neighborhood" posts.


Spyspy:

Now that you made me go back and actually read it I'm not surprised at it bodes well for the future.

However actually trying to engage in something in this morass is a good sign.

Chamber taking the time to go meta as scum at this point looking for a bite under what would have been the strangest pretenses ever is waay more likely town and scum.

The English-Ur-quan translator failed in these sentences, I suspect. I think I know what you mean in each, but could you just clarify them?


PEdit: O hai!

Slow and steady and etc., I know, but humor me and be not-so-cryptic for a little while. Why SSK?

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+7.5)

It's pretty damn obvious that if I thought one of them was scum I would be voting them. Natirasha's Post 464 was Town irritation.

Desperado, you're reaching

hard

with the "SSK would only be reading Natirasha if he's Town". I refer to my scumreads' reads as "true" reads all the time to be practical, that doesn't mean anything.


JacobSavage's blatant "memory lapse" in less than half a day is still scummy and there should be more votes on him and CES is wrong.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +3 (+10.5)

It was still pointless. The kind of stupid "oh, I'll wing it, I haven't thought that far ahead" reaction test that people so love these days.

Can I get someone interested in this lovely JacobSavage wagon? No? How about with the fact that he's questioning Espeonage about why he chose to do something here that was obviously a premade decision and that has nothing to do with his alignment? He's asking him why he chose to claim VT PRIOR TO THE START OF THE GAME. Oh, I don't know, the answer "because Espeonage is an idiot" might be relevant to his alignment before he even gets a role PM. You can judge someone on WHY they choose to follow the decision they made on an isolated, no-role-PM context, but not on why they made the decision in the first place and it should be obvious why.

Discussing CES Today is a waste of time.

SSK has a far more developed meta assessment of me than I expected. Where've you been hiding? Bring Natirasha over and vote with the cool kids.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +2 (+12.5)

It was still pointless. The kind of stupid "oh, I'll wing it, I haven't thought that far ahead" reaction test that people so love these days.

Can I get someone interested in this lovely JacobSavage wagon? No? How about with the fact that he's questioning Espeonage about why he chose to do something here that was obviously a premade decision and that has nothing to do with his alignment? He's asking him why he chose to claim VT PRIOR TO THE START OF THE GAME. Oh, I don't know, the answer "because Espeonage is an idiot" might be relevant to his alignment before he even gets a role PM. You can judge someone on WHY they choose to follow the decision they made on an isolated, no-role-PM context, but not on why they made the decision in the first place and it should be obvious why.

Discussing CES Today is a waste of time.

SSK has a far more developed meta assessment of me than I expected. Where've you been hiding? Bring Natirasha over and vote with the cool kids.

Tierce!

First off, I've done

way

too much meta research on you for my own good.

Secondly, I just don't feel as if the JacobSavage wagon is viable today. What do you think of Esp?

Oh, also, why do you think discussing CES today is a waste of time? He at least needs to be discussed.

SSK!

We can still conjure up a wagon. Less feelings about viability, more votin' him. Let's make it viable in our hour of need.

CES is a tough nut to crack and would only end in a deadline lynch on someone else that is not Mr. Savage because people would be all waffly about Mr. Nibbler's one-liners. Discussing CES would be a distraction and not really help Today's resolution, because THAT lynch is not viable at all (hint: I'm not in it, it ain't happening). Besides, courtesy and what chamber said~ I can't read himwell enough to make a decision on D1, better to accept him as Town until I start reaching for the tinfoil headgear.

Espeonage is an idiot and probably a Town one. Of all the compromise options, it's the least bad one due to the claim, but I'd rather be lynching scum.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+13.5)

I did say a role PM can change your mind on how you act, but inquiring about the initial, rolePMless reasoning is just faking scumhunting. It's something that has no relevance to the game.

I'm pretty sure I've been calling your wagon bad ever since I said that Reck's description of SpyreX made sense for a Town player who didn't realize why SpyreX is acting this way (hint: it's my fault). You're accusing TheIrishPope of being incompetent, not scum.

SpySpy! Good AND perfect lynch right here.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+14.5)

I'm as obvTown as they come and that is a ridiculous vote with such timing as to not even result in proper wagon analysis. Vote Jacob.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+15.5)

Why, TIP? Because I didn't bother to answer your reads question?

How is any of that is relevant right now? I'm voting the wagon that I think is on scum, I pushed it to where it is (hey look, someone who actually has logical skill and the charisma to back it up~), I really have no business haring off with other reads. Some of them are obvious as it is, and if you can't tell them by now, you're not going to get any more enlightenment through a reads list.

I'm being cryptic because I can and because there's really no point in discussing other things right now. Deal with it.


JacobSavage: if sirdanilot's (nonexistent) wagon is the "best of a bad bunch", why do you follow it up with this:

Literally the only reason I'd vote ANY of them is to avoid a no lynch and 24 hours is long enough to get a decent wagon on someone actually scummy.

Who is "someone actually scummy" and how do you expect to get them lynched? Where do you want this wagon?

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+16.5)

You know what, Tierce? I'm just going to say it. You're being pretty anti-town here. You're being selfish. You're claiming the whole JacobSavage wagon is your doing. You keep repeating just how "town" you are. But you're not the lynch for today.

I'll let JacobSavage be the lynch for today. But only because that's the real main wagon and it's deadline. It's a wagon that's based off of false premises by a bad wagon leader.

Vote: JacobSavage

Uhm, no. I did push the wagon, that's obvious--it was at two people and going nowhere until I did something about it. And if you've actually meta'd me, you know that yes, I am obvTown as Town and hardly have problems saying so, and that I push my suspects and manage to summon up wagons. You're putting it like I'm smothering the game with that stuff, when what I'm doing is trying to push my preferred lynch through (and doing it pretty successfully, apparently!).

How is any of that is relevant right now? I'm voting the wagon that I think is on scum, I pushed it to where it is (

hey look, someone who actually has logical skill and the charisma to back it up

~), I really have no business haring off with other reads. Some of them are obvious as it is, and if you can't tell them by now, you're not going to get any more enlightenment through a reads list.

I'm being cryptic because I can

and because there's really no point in discussing other things right now. Deal with it.

Will this continue the entire game? Let me know so I can act accordingly.



JS wagon is awful, but I want to see where it goes anyway.

VOTE: JacobSavage

The former is a jab at the Messieurs who keep clamoring for wagons without any real effective attempt at pushing them. Yeah, it's mean. I'm tired of them.

Me being cryptic? Nah. But there's really no point to do otherwise at this moment. When my reads are worth sharing more thoroughly, sure.


I keep seeing a lot of people saying JacobSavage is a bad wagon (why?) even as they compromise onto it because it's the main wagon. It being the main wagon is a self-fulfilling prophecy, y'know.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +1 (+17.5)

JacobSavage--we need a claim. There be hammer-happy people here, and the clock has run out.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +0 (+17.5)

No. Let him claim first.

UNVOTE: JacobSavage

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: +0 (+17.5)

I am Glorfindel, Town Bodyguard.

Basically I fought the Balrog but lost but in doing so I saved Idril Celebrindal.

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: -25 (-7.5)

Day2:

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: N/A (confirmed town)

Day3:

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: N/A (confirmed town)

Day4:

Tierce's Jacob-is-scum scale: N/A (confirmed town)

In my experience, rarely does one get off the roller coaster at the top of the hill.
Exceptions are confirmations (cop innocent, etc.) of alignment.
I saw no sign of that, and Jacob's alignment was scum.

[PeregrineV]

ABR is conftown
Scum have a jailkeeper. A stupid one, lol.
Well done ABR; you got lucky; lucky in that your actions didnt hurt town - and with that, they helped town.

As scum, my priority is Town-looking targets, because they're not lynchable--everyone in a game will likely suspect you at one point or another, so it's pretty stupid to leave a paper trail like that. shos and you would likely have been kill targets for me if I were scum.

[PeregrineV]

Everyone has posted and no one has refuted my initial case on Tierce. Then, when I went back to look some more, it only reinforced it. Furthermore, no one has a single better reason for any other player.

No one "refuted" your case because there isn't anything to refute, it's just a recitation of the facts. Tierce pushed JS early, forced him to claim along with someone who flipped scum, and then largely ignored him the rest of the game. This is scummy...why?

I want you to answer that.
What can be gained by getting the Mafia rolecop as a claimed bodyguard on day1?
It's Jacob, so chances are people want to lynch him anyway. A claim fends that off.
He claimed PR. But it's the kind that dies when it succeeds, so another way to fend off the lynch.
Everyone is skeptical, and harasses him about it all game, EXCEPT Tierce, who pushed him all the way up to the claim.
Tell me why this behavior is NOT scummy?

He was a claimed BG in a large game, which is exactly the kind of thing that resolves itself and isn't worth wasting time on and, lo and behold, he fucked up his night actions! Imagine that.

Did he fuck up his night actions? He claimed Bodyguard and flipped mafia rolecop. Explain the realtionship between his claim and his actual night actions.

And I

have

presented better reasons for sirdan, I've just been consistently stonewalled by an endless string of shitty pseudo-town clears for him, the latest being your "you think sirdanscum saw JSscum drowning and forced him to claim while still distancing? Impossible!" track.

OK, give me your rational recitation of the facts where sirdanilot is scum. Because this would actually be the first time I've gotten anything like that from you.

[PeregrineV]

Ok I thought his last posts might have changed your mind.

VOTE: tierce

You mean the posts in which he continues to push a crappy case based on things that aren't scummy, and cherry picks through the posts that are convenient to said case instead of doing proper analysis?

Show me proper analysis.

And make it not based on how someone reads you.

In addition to everything else, You've pushed and released Jacob (scum).
Pushed Majiffy-scum (town).
Pushed Shadow-scum (scum)
Pushed ABR-scum (town).
Pushed CES-scum, but he's now town.

[PeregrineV]

Everyone and their mother has said that compromising on you at deadline is not scummy. YOU compromised on me because there was no time to get a wagon elsewhere, so don't start that shitty argument again because if you are Town you should know deadline switches to avoid no-lynches are not scummy, even if they fall in your royally super duper obvTown Highnass. She didn't look like scum, so I voted her when I found the actual evidence against her.

1. I was obvtown (and am epecially since the shadoweh flip); you were not. She firmly townread me throughout the entire game, she assumed I was town. And she was right in doing so of course. Her flip made no sense. She could have also flipped to you, but she didn't.
2. The way in which she did it does not ring like a 'meh I still think sirdan is town but I want to lynch him anyway'to me. It rang like she was fabricating a scumread on me to get away with it. You, as the selft proclaimed mafiascum goddess should have spotted that.

Tell me who is scum in 2 scenarios.

1. Tierce flips scum

2. Tierce flips town

[PeregrineV]

I have no idea. I read CES as scum for the most part, but now there's talk of him being town? Why is this?

No clue. Only one saying it is Teirce (unless I missed something and someone wants to point out their CES townread.)

He' still a pretty big null to me, which I don't like, frankly, on day5 of a game.

Esp scumread is kinda independent from Tierce.

VC1.15-644

Shadoweh

- 1 - PeregrineV

Natirasha

- 1 - Desperado
Espeonage - 7 - SpyreX,

Shadoweh

,

Natirasha

, Cogito Ergo Sum, sirdanilot,

MafiaSSK

, ActionDan
sirdanilot - 1 -

Albert B. Rampage

JacobSavage

- 2 - Tierce, Elscouta

MafiaSSK - 2 - chamber, TheIrishPope

ActionDan - 1 - shos
PeregrineV - 1 -

Aegor

Not voting (2): JacobSavage, Espeonage

With 18 players alive it takes 10 votes to lynch.

Then look at this and give me the whys.
Why, if he is scum, did the wagon shift to JacobSavage, thier rolecop?
Who, if he is scum, is bussing?

I would guess desp and tierce make a good pairing?

If Desp were scum WITH Tierce, then he either
1. Hopes to defend her, so she is not lynched. Considering she is the only actual contestant so far today, kind of a risky move should she actually flip.
2. Busses her to gain town credit, since he'e also been riding the null wagon for 5 days.

Do you feel his posts are #1?

[PeregrineV]

Is it the usual town meta of PV to stay on the sidelines for 4 days, then suddenly launch a crusade on day 5?

Currently investigating the dead QTs of scum-Tierce.

It depends. If I find something relevant, I crusade.

[PeregrineV]

I have shown proper analysis. Guess you're too busy in your cherry picking skimming fields of happiness.

"In addition to all this other bullshit, here's a list of people Tierce has suspected that does not have any sort of analysis from my end but I'm trying to pass off as relevant."

So I ask

you

for analysis on

your scumreads and townreads

, and you call

me

out for not providing analysis on

your list of scumreads and townreads

?



Um, that response is no response at all. It's some sort of odd deflection.

[PeregrineV]

And make it not based on how someone reads you.

Can I once again bring up ActionDan not making any effort to show differences between this and our last CONCURRENT game together, where I was Town? All this "I usually read Tierce as Town when she's Town" but not a word about that game, we wouldn't want to delve into meta after bringing it up. Let's just try to make sure we can push the alternative mislynch instead, even when D1 is really bloody good evidence that I'm not scum and certainly not with Espeonage.

:sigh:

And how does day1 point to you "not being scum and certainly not with Espeonage."?

[PeregrineV]

Pushing a disingenuous case under convenient circumstances is not Town, attempting to gather gullible voters specifically is not Town, and I have shown that is not my kill pattern. Too bad you can't actually be bothered to connect your reads to the game you're playing.

This part kills me.

The circumstances such as day start? 1843

And the case based on similarity of thought with scum (claim requesting, the result of which derailed the lynch of scum rolecop, and which you NEVER followed up on), and how much it looks like you bussed both Jacob and Shadow?

Tierce votes:

Day1

TheIrishPope- 14 pages & 17 posts
Jacob- 14 pages & 29 posts

Day2

CES- 10 pages & 18 posts
ABR- 10 pages & 18 posts
SirDani- 1 page & 6 posts

Day3

ABR- 1 page & 1 post
(Shadow posts 1464 and votes Jacob)
Shadow- 3 pages & 13 posts
(And I want to note that your Shadow vote was 12 minutes prior to your Shadow "case" of quoting a single Majiffy post, and then, 6 minutes later, giving a select spoilered ISO of Shadow).

Given how Majiffy gave a link-laced case IN-THREAD for Shadow-scum (1146), he could just as easily protected (investigated) you:

Majiffy's correlation of strong players:Townreads is terrible and would lynch too.

I must have you as scum, then, because there's no way you could be a strong player with this shit logic.

Day4

ABR- 8 pages & 25 posts

Yeah, now that I think about it-
Does Majiffy think
"I will kill myself on my scumread, and hope town lynches it the next day!"

or does he think

"I'll protect town-Tierce who stupid scum might try to kill and then the next day lynch scum-Shadow."

Don't really see Majiffy as the whole suicide-type. Do you?

[PeregrineV]

Was reading the ActionDan iso and I found this:

Wait shos if you voyeur ed ABR and got protective along with role blocker you probably just confirmed js

ActionDan is 100% town. Get off him.

Talk me through the HOW this makes ActionDan town.

[PeregrineV]

My entire list of people I'm not ok with lynching is shos, CES, Sirdan, PereV. Everyone I will happily vote for given a wagon.

Why CES?

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Tierce

Would like to hear from the rest before proceeding with her lynch, though.

[PeregrineV]

Well, let's hear from Tierce and SpyreX, shall we?

[PeregrineV]

Tierce, what do you think about the kill? Implicates Spyspy, no?

CES, am I scum?

[PeregrineV]

You've been pretty null in a game with actually scummy people - the Tierce thing yesterday was a bit wacky but not really scum wacky. And I don't see why you'd kill sirdan either. So I'm guessing (hoping) no.

Then who are the top 2 I should consider?

[PeregrineV]

Double downing on escoulta town. Rest is up in the air

In the air up there,who are your top 2 favorite choices for scum?

[PeregrineV]

I think you are town kinda.

I don't really have a top 2. I kinda think Spy is scum again.

(I also think there is only 2 scum left)

So, to you,

town

is
ActionsDan
Elscouta

Kinda town

PeregrineV

null

shos
Desp
CES
Tierce

scum

SpryeX

???

[PeregrineV]

This is good, and we should all do this.

TO me:

Town

me
shos

Probtown

ActionDan
Elscouta

Null

CES
SpryeX
Desp

Scum

Tierce

[PeregrineV]

and he hasn't full claimed yet which is worrisome

It's 6:2 now and will be 6:1 by the end of today.

[PeregrineV]

Certainly town:

Sho

Probably town:

Desperado
ActionDan

Null:

SpyreX

Unsure, maybe scum:

Cogito Ergo Sum
Tierce

Probably scum:

PeregrineV

why do you perceive town-Desp while others have scum-Desp?

[PeregrineV]

@SpryeX- conclusions from your VCA posting?

Also, reads list

por favor

.

[PeregrineV]

Monday check-in, will catchup later.

[PeregrineV]

Or another rousing Tierce wagon?

Because at this point I'd expect your Town-brain to kick in and you to vote Tierce.

The fact you haven't done so is disappointing.

[PeregrineV]

I have to say that the kills look so dumb that im considerong a superpro scumteam. Tierce-ces scumteam, mark my words for endgame

Then you should vote Tierce.

No, really.

[PeregrineV]

PV, if Tierce is scum, do you have an idea for a partner?

That's what I spent yesterday and today trying to figure out.

But, since I'm one person, I've been asking for 6 other opinions for 2 days.

I start with ruling out you, Els, and ActionDan.

This leaves me with a pool of CES, SpryeX and Desparado. I could be wrong on the 3 above, but this is a starting point that I'm fairly confident in.

[PeregrineV]

Let's give out information.


Night1, Action Dan did not kill anyone.

Discuss.

[PeregrineV]

Hadn't JS claimed then? I'd assume the scum team would have him make the kill then.

Does this mean you do actually have info on Tierce?

JS claimed bodyguard day1.

He flipped rolecop. Do you think PRs are allowed to both make the kill and perform their roles while not being the last scum alive?

There is a 30-post case on why Tierce is scum. If you want more info than that, let's finish our ActionDan discussion first.

Let's see. If I were JK, I'd try to block some sort of nullread night1 like

ActionDan

or SpryeX, hoping to prevent the kill.

[PeregrineV]

Oh, please do say he's trying to claim a JK guilty on me~

Yo ActionDan, forgot your character name by any chance?

What night would I do that? We've had kills every night.

[PeregrineV]

And just for giggles while we await Desp and Elscouta, can we unvote Dan, to make sure there are no "accidents".

[PeregrineV]

Rog, VT.

If someone must be lynched between Desp and ActionDan, i'd rather it be Desp, because #1740 still reads to me as a major townslip.
But PeregrineV "oh i didn't believe the Majiffy crumb but I didn't say anything while Shadoweh was lynched for it" is still the #1 scum act of the game.

Yeah, I guess it's a good thing I never had any Shadow suspicion before Majiffy suicided on his prime scum suspect just to show us, by dying, that he was right.

Spoiler: Shadow was scum before he was scum

2. JacobSavage - Postcount: 6. I honestly didn't realize he'd posted before Scummy Butt: The Buttening. Not really much to go on, instead of explaining townreads please explain which of your fourteen 'scumreads' you think is the scummiest and why, possibly with a vote even, which you are not doing and should.
4. Aegor - I didn't like post 141 as an entry post, it felt like throwing a bunch of things out to see what sticks, plus what I said earlier about his views on Esp. Also not sure what brachylogy means, but if it means empty voting you're basically voting ABR for being ABR, he always does that as far as I've seen? I don't think you'd know that though. Conversation with Sirdan is sensical but you haven't actually mentioned anything about who you think is scum, so not really much to go on. Please explain which of the sixteen people who isn't yourself or ABR you also think are scummy and why. I'm preparing to copy/paste saying that alot!
5. Natirasha - I really want to like your posts but I think it's because you're posting like ActionDan in a non-caring kind of way. You're not Dan thhough so it's weird. I expected you to be more.. cheerful I guess? You were more wordy in the quicktopic, I think. I'm not really sure what I want you to do different to be honest, I just don't want to think of you as scum.
7. MafiaSSK - Last post: four days ago. Considering there wasn't really any meat to sink into at the time, there's not really much to go on here. Please follow up on question aimed at chamber, and answer if you still think Nat and Esp are scummy. SSK was quiet to the point of me not expecting him to reply to posts in the QT, and he's kind of a lurker in general, so it's hard to get a read either way.
9. Espeonage - I actually thought the whole VT on the scene thing was a good reaction test way to start off at first but the overblown NOW YOU'VE ACTIVATED MY TRAP CARD SIRDAN YOU ARE THE SCUMS tunnel is just.. bad.

@sirdan's posting. Look at how he demands to know everything, town definitely wants information yes, but scum need it. It's like how White shouldn't lose tempo because they have the foot up on black in chess.

Nonsensical is probably a better word, and crazy paranoid. "Town would do this, but scum need to do it MORE, so sirdan spamming up the thread demanding to know everything means he's super scummy!" What I really want you to do is stop tunneling Sirdan and make a scum read that isn't based on The Most Easy to Hate Dude making posts at you.
11. Albert B. Rampage - Post count: 6. I don't know if there's a difference between ABR's town and scum games, but I'm already remembering why my eyes keep glazing over as I reread this game. Uhm, you said you would explain one of your votes if people picked one, and the only one person have shown interest in in the sirdan vote, so explain?
13. Desperado - Post count: 5. Please kill me. Wow, are you still voting me? I know I wanted to die while we were buddies, but I think you'll find I was equally suicidal in the game you were half-scum in too. If you're going to use meta then maybe you should use more then one game. You have plenty of my posts to look at and tell me if you still think I'm scum at least. also question, do you think sirdan is town or scum because when I tell someone I have a problem with their posts in your tone, it usually means I'm suspicious of them, but it's not clear in the way you're asking.
15. Elscouta - didn't like entry post of hopping onto the for some reason growing Sirdan wagon. Looking at his later posts though I'd have to say he's at least taking it seriously? Like, the opposite of how I feel about Esp's tunnelrageback. Still needs more scumspects who could actually be scum (tm)
16. PeregrineV - brain asdfghkjing why are you voting me and stop it reads as peregrinev
17. TheIrishPope (replacing xRECKONERx) - is a dude that's here

its hurting to think but I think I think Esp is the worst right now? Really what I'm remembering is that the game still practically hasn't started because half the people still haven't posted things. PS TIP if you seriously would have vigged someone who is obvtown instead of any of the above excluding yourself yyou would deserve to have the shit kicked out of you.

##Unvote
##Vote: Espironage

Tierce, I think you will find I was never actually a voyeuristic old man, I was always a sexy fiery temptress hiding in an old man's clothes. Also I'd have to say I'm as far opposite to being a voyeur as possible. Just pretend you can't read him and remember he's at least trying to help, in his own.. way. I'd stop posting if I were him too, wondering if I were still alive? (Or I'd start swearing at the 'vig' I supose if I was in the mood)
PPS i will take this as your admittance that i was in fact the bestest girl

Mine eyes hath devoured your wordiness. For the length of the post, I was fulfilled.

Then I finished the post.

Alas, my brain is once more hungry.

That turned out to be less productive than I hoped.

Was feeling the Espeonage lynch, then went back and reread 603, because the first time I read it incorrectly.

What's the basis for the Jacob wagon?

@Shadow

- maybe. Your town and scum posting is very similar.

Peeregrine: That's kind of depressing. My scum posting is horrible and I don't understand why people can't tell the difference. In one of them, I'm actually enjoying myself playing the mystery game. In the other I want to sleep until I wake up and my role pm turned green.

Scum-you
Mini 1489: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=30846
Otherworld Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=22453
Good v Evil Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=21408

Town-you
Experimental Mafia: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=21773
Mini 1376: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=23295

PV Are you still scum now that you have 6 votes? If not, who is scum? Is the wagon on you scum-driven?

PeregrineV - 6 - shos, Majiffy, Shadoweh, sirdanilot, Albert B. Rampage, Cogito Ergo Sum

This is was the height of my wagon, although I think it's gone down since.

shos- I remain neutral on. His meta to me was not saying town, but it was based on an older game. More recent games it still doesn't look like his recent town games, but it's more gut than anything I can point out.

Majiffy- Could be. Crap votes aren't his forte, but he has been known to hop on a wagon or two. Frankly, he did vote his scum reads in the beginning, and I was null to him, so it's not unreasonable. However, if Majiffy flips scum, then I found another.

Shadow- Had early game suspicions, and they haven't gotten much better (a little, not much). Part of this is tied for the 5th most posts, yet hard to find actual opinions. Today's consists of jumping on the Desp wagon and my wagon, but not original wagons or content. I'd say scum.

sirdanilot- Seems to have incurred a large amount of scumreads. And I can see why some may think so, but overall, town enough not to lynch.

ABR- Is pretty much voting everyone who has voted him or called him scum. I'm torn, since I feel this is how he would play as scum, but glancing at his recent games (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?tit ... B._Rampage) there's not much to differentiate him. As town, he'd probably be scum protected to take into lylo, although if scum looks at his game stats, they are more likely to win if they lynch him now. Would maybe default lynch, but probably not today.

CES- Crappy vote. Can't tell if crappy town or crappy scum.

That sums up my wagon, unfortunately.

Would currently be for a Shadow or MafiaSSK as scum.

Vote: MafiaSSK

Vote: MafiaSSK

No, just looked back through his ISO.

@mafiaSSK

- Where has your CES=scummy scum scum read gone to?

Vote: Shadow

[PeregrineV]

I'll let shos go next.

Last night, Elscouta did not kill anybody.

[PeregrineV]

Rog, VT.

If someone must be lynched between Desp and ActionDan, i'd rather it be Desp, because #1740 still reads to me as a major townslip.
But PeregrineV "oh i didn't believe the Majiffy crumb but I didn't say anything while Shadoweh was lynched for it" is still the #1 scum act of the game.

I think this should leave AD out of the lynching pool

I wasn't getting this before, but I think I get it now (ie 1740).

[PeregrineV]

I expected to see someone jump out and try to do something but it failed. in fact, i *have* been jailkept again.

Oh. Boo.

PeregrineV, give us your N4 target and tell us why you didn't spot the importance of your N5 target even with me explicitly telling you why it was important.

I don't get what you are saying here. Which post did you tell me the "importance of my N5 target"?

[PeregrineV]

Anyway, you should be fullclaiming.

I am. I'm just trying to get as much information as possible from each of my night actions.

For example.

Night3, shos targetted ABR

[PeregrineV]

I knew this going into day4, but shos started climbing all over ABR, which I can't imagine scum doing to town based on a night result (well, I can, but I wanted to see where he was taking it, and what the various reactions were).

Voyeur claim is null, but pressing for possible JK choices as he did also didn't seem like a scum motivated thing. It would kind of be pointless unless it ended in an ABR lynch.

It ended with this:

Well then i guess we can stop now
ABR is conftown
Scum have a jailkeeper. A stupid one, lol.
Well done ABR; you got lucky; lucky in that your actions didnt hurt town - and with that, they helped town.
Back to scumhunting: VOTE: ces

Now, shos could have targetted ABR just to run that whole thing, but it seems pointless to me, especially since they killed the Tracker (MafiaSSK) that night, so why bother with all that? ABR's continuing to get "no results" would have led to his lynch anyway.

So, while not definitively town, shos told the truth and his play doesn't seem like it comes from scum.

[PeregrineV]

Going to finish, because I need the remaining town to discuss, but not sure I'll be back on until tomorrow.

n2- JacobSavage targetted MafiaSSK

I targetted ABR N2,
ActionDan N3.

Cool enough.

Vote: JacobSavage

n4: Tierce targetted ABR

Behold, the tower leapt into a flame and in a stab of fire it fell, for the dragons crushed the base of it and all who stood there. Great was the clangour of that terrible fall, and therein was lost Turgon King of the Gondolindrim, and for that hour the victory was to Morgoth.

Albert B. Rampage

-

Turgon,

House of the King

, Gondolin Vanilla

-

Removed from Gondolin Night 4

VOTE COUNT 5:0

Not voting (10)

: Tierce, shos, ActionDan, Espeonage, SpyreX, Cogito Ergo Sum, Desperado, sirdanilot, Elscouta, PeregrineV

With 10 players alive it takes

6

votes to lynch.

Did some preliminary overnight reading, and starting (and ending) here today.

Vote: Tierce

In conclusion,

VOTE: Tierce

[PeregrineV]

And for full clarity, unless ActionDan and Elcouta are the Jailkeeper and choose nights1 and night5 respectively to NOT action, then they are not Jailkeepers, for those nights they targetted no one.

[PeregrineV]

n4: Tierce targetted ABR

Nope.



Peregrine let Espeonage be lynched instead of claiming Yesterday--it's probably three scum left and Today is LyLo, because otherwise this play makes no sense.

UNVOTE: ActionDan
VOTE: PeregrineV

It was a quandary. But, you've been bussing all game, so was hoping you would try to take out the last one and ride that to victory.

Took a small chance, but if I caught your partner, it would be worth it.

And if I cleared a player from being your partner, also worth it, since the pool of players remaining would grow smaller.

If I was NKed before I gave my results, then you'd have been lynched anyway with my flip. Spin how you like, I have 20 posts declaring you as scum (and all are accurate in and of themselves).

[PeregrineV]

n4: Tierce targetted ABR

Nope.

Mod confirmed. And

THIS IS NOT A BASTARD GAME.

So, really, your day1 play was instructive once I got the result.

As was your day2.

The Shadow lynch through me somewhat, but I think they were almost as surprised by it. But maybe not, because they didn't even challenge you on it.

[PeregrineV]

I don't believe there's 5 scum if peregrine is scum. If he's town I don't think there's 5 either. People thinking there is 5 scum seem kinda derpy to me

Tierce wants you to believe there's 5 scum and it's lylo after she had a guilty on her. How is that derp and not scum?

[PeregrineV]

There's some stuff directed at you earlier. I haven't read it but some people say it's incriminating.

I'm willing to answer everything. I'm going to keep my cool right now and avoid the obvious posting that I so desperately want to do.

So, what are your questions, ActionDan?

pedit- Sure, I will start with that.

[PeregrineV]

He is scum because it is the second guily that he gets, and he never spoke of the first.

There was no first guilty.
Night2 I tracked Jacob to MafiaSSK.

Why Jacob?
Because he was a claimed PR that was still alive, and I failed night1 to catch an under-the-radar ActionDan performing any nefarious deeds. Night2 I would either catch him trying to protect someone while being killed, or, if the player he was "protecting" died, I'd have caught scum.
TiP/Reck died that night.

ABR claimed Even Night Cop on day 2 when JacobSavage was a claimed bodyguard.
PV is supposed to have tracked JacobSavage to MafiaSSK day 2, which would be at least a very strange target.

Yes, quite.

There is scum in ABR or Jacob, possibly both.

But, choosing bad targets as town happens. You can argue the whys, but there was, at that point, no reason to out myself when I had no usable results.

He doesn't speak of it. He doesn't even pretend to be interested in what JacobSavage did, when asking "who did you target, JS" would have been totally fine on day3.

Tierce was busy bussing day3. Jacob was bussing. Since we were lynching scum, what's there to say?

He waits until day 4 when JS is confirmed scum to hop on the bandwagon.

At what point was Jacob confirmed scum TO YOU?

To me, it was right here:

I targetted ABR N2,
ActionDan N3.

Cool enough.

Vote: JacobSavage

[PeregrineV]

Which shos had said he wasn't, so...?

Doesn't matter. Scum would know better and that doesn't match your proposed rationale for unclaiming Jailkeeper.

If you're town, Tierce, there's a 3-man scum team out there to catch with connections between them. So catch that scum team.

Like this

I'm not expressing a belief in a 5-man scum team there. I'm trying to see where Tierce takes that logic.

She's not taking it anywhere. She's scum.

Tell me you don't see it, and tell me why.

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine after the comment "i want to believe Jacob" i made, what were you feeling in your next post?

This one?

:/ i really want to believe him

That was actually the fastest wagon/lynch I've seen recently.

This was my attempt to make scum not connect 1764 with a results-oriented counterclaim. I was hoping to squeeze out at least one more result.

[PeregrineV]

It was a quandary. But, you've been bussing all game, so was hoping you would try to take out the last one and ride that to victory.

No she hasn't. She pushed Jacob to claim and then treated him as conftown, remember? It was pretty important to that case you made on her yesterday.

Read "Reverse Bus" for more details.

And Espeonage was Spyrex's lynch, which Tierce had already pledged to help him push through previously. Why would Tierce-scum willingly feed in to Spyrex's tunnel when there was no risk in refusing to indulge him?

Are you asking me why Tierce-scum would willingly MISLYNCH Espeonage?

If you are,

If you not, then please rephrase the question.

And if your asking me why scum-Tierce would do something, you should probably also ask her.

[PeregrineV]

Are you asking me why Tierce-scum would willingly MISLYNCH Espeonage?

If you are,

If you not, then please rephrase the question.

You claimed that the reason you didn't out your guilty result on Tierce yesterday is because she had been "bussing all game" and you hoped she would lead you on to her last buddy.

Yes. Who defended her when I attacked her? Who chainsawed me? Who ignored her, who did she ignore?

She had already pledged to lynch Espeonage with Spyrex. Therefore, you must have thought that Espeonage was her partner, right? I want to know why you think Tierce-scum would have done that.

Her "pledge" means nothing.

Yes, Espeonage could have been her partner. I thought he was town enough, and would have allowed a NL to happen if possible. But, I've been wrong before.

You want to know why I think Tierce-scum would help lynch her partner?
1. Bussed Jacob all of day1 without actually activating the Jacob lynch.
2. Bussed Shadow day3.

[PeregrineV]

shos, what are you even getting at in 2306?

I'm not hammering Tierce.

Then, based on your past voting/posting, you better work hard to find Tierce's buddy you don't think exists. You got less than a day.

[PeregrineV]

So I need to be sold on PV-scum not lylo making this play

He's a goon, his buddy is the roleblocker and isn't in danger of being lynched. Sacrificing PV (who has had heat all game) to mislynch Tierce and put us into a 4p MYLO of the scum's choosing after PV gets speedlynched tomorrow.

Why do you think it's outrageous for scumPV to pull this in order to control two consecutive day/night phases going in to LYLO?

There's so much wrong with this that others can address it.

While they do, and since you agree two scum left, then who is the last when Tierce flips scum? If I flip scum?

[PeregrineV]

There's so much wrong with this that others can address it.

It's you and CES. Tierce is town.

So you refuse the answer the question "Who is Tierce's buddy if she flips scum?"?

Consider it a thought experiment.

Also, considering your previous proclamations, you'll understand if I don't believe you over the mod.

Spoiler:

PV is town, AD could be scum and is more likely to be if I get my sweet sirdan scumflip.

ABR and sirdan are scum and the last one is Jacob or Peregrine.

Ok I found scum
VOTE: Tierce

Nope, Tierce is pretty fucking town this page. Shadoweh too.

[PeregrineV]

Day 3 wasnt a bus though? Day 3, even if scum, was caught and expediting the inevitable.

If PV is scum this only makes sense if its lylo. So, what'd we be looking at is:

Scum Strongman?
Scum Rolecop
Scum Jailkeeper
Scum (I'll assume goon)
Scum (I'll assume goon)

vs:

Town Cop-Vig
Voyeur
Weak Doctor
Tracker
9 VT

That puts base-lylo at 11 alive
Worst-Case is D3 lylo (D1 T, N1 Scum, Weak Doctor, Vig, D2 T, N2 Scum, Vig). Highly improbable, but there.

In that situation every town role has a foil. I have a hard time buying that.

I have a hard time with PV throwing this out now too to just fall on his sword tomorrow.

Sooo the only situation that "makes sense" on the cuff for 5 scum is PV town which well.

So I need to be sold on PV-scum not lylo making this play

Hammering Tierce in one hour

Looks like it's up to one of you two to hammer.

[PeregrineV]

Pretty sure Tierce will flip goon, so JK/?? is still out there.

[PeregrineV]

Why?

Because there are more than one scum.

Shos is claiming jailkeeper activity, so if they are jailkeeping, then goon-Tierce is doing the killing.

Do you think PRs are allowed to both make the kill and perform their roles while not being the last scum alive?

Not sure how tonight works, but newbie games allow both actions if last scum.

[PeregrineV]

The only other thing is this. Not sure what it means, but it could be a slip of some sort.

>_> Wow, even when he's dead he's trying to be an asshole to me for no reason.
It's not possible for him to have targetted me. Or anyone, actually.

[PeregrineV]

Even with PV town / Tierce scum I'm not sold on 5 town.

Unless this ends the game here I think regardless I'm happier with this then the reverse.

I don't get this. Do you think there are 5 scum or 4 scum total in the game?

[PeregrineV]

scum, I'm tired.

I still think its 4. It doesn't ~change~ things to pretend 5, but.

Why no BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD the whole game?

[PeregrineV]

And in case the thread is closed before I come back,

Good luck town! Catch scum and don't f*** this up!!

[PeregrineV]

No kill. Massclaim? I was not blocked tonight, no lies

Results?

[PeregrineV]

People can forward relevant info if they have any.

Could just be a missed Night action, to be fair, not sure. Let's just

Vote: Desperado

for now.

Between the NK, Tierce yesterday in regards to AD vs Desp and the fact that this pretty much ties up PV and Shos as town I think we be good.

It looks like one left, can't RB and kill.

Unvote, Vote: Desp

The only problem I have with a Desp vote is stuff like this:

shos, what are you even getting at in 2306?

I'm not hammering Tierce.

There's so much wrong with this that others can address it.

It's you and CES. Tierce is town.

when it was obvious Tierce was going down.

[PeregrineV]

People can forward relevant info if they have any.

Could just be a missed Night action, to be fair, not sure. Let's just

Vote: Desperado

for now.

Between the NK, Tierce yesterday in regards to AD vs Desp and the fact that this pretty much ties up PV and Shos as town I think we be good.

It looks like one left, can't RB and kill.

Unvote, Vote: Desp

The only problem I have with a Desp vote is stuff like this:

shos, what are you even getting at in 2306?

I'm not hammering Tierce.

There's so much wrong with this that others can address it.

It's you and CES. Tierce is town.

when it was obvious Tierce was going down.

You guys can at least quote me and tell me Desp really sucks at being scum.


I probably won't vote him until this is addressed and I finish the CES-scum, SpryeX-scum and Desp-scum interactions checking.

[PeregrineV]

No kill. Massclaim? I was not blocked tonight, no lies

Results?

@shos-

Results?

[PeregrineV]

@PV:

I'm not sure what you're lookin for there? It was like pulling teeth and its not a hard argument to make that holding the last hope because getting knocked to one with double-fucked PR's is not a place scum want to be right now.

The problem is I can make arguments for literally everyone but you and shos being scum.

I'm still floored that I'm not getting the white hot irons because I even said that I was surprised the SpyreX-Tierce angle wasn't pushed before she was lynched once esp flipped town since I derailed the shit out of that.
Els and Desp defending Tierce yesterday confuses in each way. I don't see the rationale for foot down hard there and I'm pretty sure Els helped start the 5 man scumteam jabberwocky. The "if you're scum I hope you win" COULD be cheeky as scum expecting to go down beforehand but.
AD's big save is being lit up by tierce and, if he was scum, being the scum RB but again Tierce had hot firey death planned for most of her allies and that kinda fit that bill.
CES is still just kind of there in my head and ~meta~ could definitely make the argument for some of the things this game (chamber kill, double ABR block assuming he was lying, kinda just there).

So talk it through with me here. I'm not even gonna /wrists if I go but all I ask is sooner versus later.

Exactly that.

And it's true. My plan was to look back at Tirece/Shadow/Jacob stuff from day1, 2, and 3. Before anyone was "caught".

[PeregrineV]

Did a Tierce-Shadow-Jacob-SpryeX combo ISO and while SpyreX

could

be scum with them, finding it most likely NOT the case. Some posts make me squinty-eyed, but not reading them as scumbuddies.

[PeregrineV]

And I can;t wait to see the scum QT. Did it catch fire?

[PeregrineV]

Actually MafiaSSK's posting is looking a shit-ton more topical.

[PeregrineV]

Super iso combo of CES-Tierce-Shadow-Jacob. Can't even get past 763 and I have to

Vote: CES

[PeregrineV]

OK, yeah this is it.

[PeregrineV]

Wait a second.

I'm pretty sure MafiaSSK crumbed tracking me N1, so I don't make sense as the Jailkeeper. Why do I keep forgetting that. Desp is the lynch.

Vote: MafiaSSK

No, just looked back through his ISO.

@mafiaSSK

- Where has your CES=scummy scum scum read gone to?

Vote: Shadow

It's disappeared. But for good reason. But it's gone.

Seems pretty clear to me?

If MafiaSSK tracked you to another player, and that player did not die, he could easily assume cop, doc, etc. For that reason, he would not reveal nor would he want to lynch you.

If he tracked you and you went nowhere, that, too is inconclusive, as it would mean only that you were either a VT/Goon or non-actioning PR.

If he got no result, I don't see why he would remove his scum read.

If he got a result, I could see him giving you the benefit of the PR doubt and removing his scumread.

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine what we're your results again? And shos could you detail your results as well?

N1: ActionDan targeted no one
N2: JacobSavage targeted MafiaSSK
N3: shos targeted Albert
N4: Tierce targeted Albert
N5: Elscouta targeted no one
N6: CES targeted no one

[PeregrineV]

If you track someone and get a result, that might give you pause about lynching them (unless you really think the target implicates that they're a certain PR), but it shouldn't make you think they were town - there is a higher percentage of scum with actions than town with actions in most games. I mean, I got scum lynched in Author Mafia based on a Tracker result on a Night without a kill.

It's definitely a bit much to think I'm town based on a Tracker innocent but it is an attitude that I know people have and that's what the crumb says.

Nobody wants to be the town PR that outs themselves and the the town cop/doc/whatever unnecessarily. And assuming it's a scum PR can lead to outting the town cop/doc/whatever unnecessarily.

Being as I tracked, if shos had lied about ABR when he claimed, I'd probably have followed him the next night to see why he lied.

When Jacob was tracked to MafiaSSK n2, I thought it odd since I don't recall Jacob calling SSK town, but SSK didn't die, so moving on. When SSK died the next night and flipped tracker, was 70% sure Jacob was scum, but since he was already "outted" as a bodyguard, his claim made it 100%.

So, net result, SSK attitude is consistent with backing off a possible town PR.

[PeregrineV]

Is there a scum QT/dead thread?

[PeregrineV]

Also, not sure why I was alive day6. Was not expecting it to say the least.

And chasing CES was why I don't trust myself sometimes.

[PeregrineV]

I still don't get why a claimed PR would be lynched on Day 1. Even if I were an SK, I would have been leashed.

More the nature of the role/claim, at least on my part. I can wait until Plum does it, but can you post your role PM if possible?

[PeregrineV]

Also deadline lynching didn't help.

[PeregrineV]

I know it was a weird role/claim, but lynching a claimed PR on Day 1 always seems like a bad idea unless it is demonstrably false.

Spoiler: Gondolin Godfather

Factional Abilities:

Godfather Kill

- Once every Night, you may choose one player (other than yourself) to carry out a kill on a specified different player. This is not considered a targeting action. The player assigned to perform the kill will not be informed. If the player you assign perform the kill is a member of your faction (Town), the player will automatically attempt to kill the player specified to be killed as a normal targeting action (in addition to any other action that player takes, if applicable). If the player assigned to perform the kill is not a member of your faction, nothing will happen. This action is preferably submitted in the format Assign Playername to kill Playername.


Passive Abilities:

Miller

- A Sane Cop would receive the result "Not Town Aligned" upon investigating you.

Then all scum has to do to not be lynched is fake claim. NOPE. Suspicious claims get killed and lets face it, no one was going to believe yours when it came out from you being run up.

You were also effectively a cop if your kill was not performed, I suppose. But that explains the 2 trackers in the game. Probably best that you WERE lynched considering how things worked out.

[PeregrineV]

How did you post so much as Messiah Complex and then go back to making CES look wordy?

[PeregrineV]

@Plum- real night actions, although we've speculated for almost 100 pages?

[PeregrineV]

How did you post so much as Messiah Complex and then go back to making CES look wordy?

Hell if I know.

Funny thing is I

still

got lynched for not posting enough in ASoIaF.

If it makes you feel better, you were my next choice AFTER CES. (sorry CES- the scumteam did you good when you read them all together, and knowing I was around I could see you doing a no-kill last night).

[PeregrineV]

@Plum- Thank you, and thanks for running the game. I really enjoyed it!!!

[PeregrineV]

Very enjoyable gameindeed! Reading scum qt

We were ridiculed for being sucky town at least 3 times...lol

And I was still suspicious of you, and reread your ABR conf-town posting like 50 times- everytime I thought "Is shos the JK?"

[PeregrineV]

Oh,

dahling

.


Good job, Town. You could have done better if some people didn't insist on being big distractions, but the power roles did good work. SpyreX, CES, Elscouta--would very much play with again.

ABR, somehow I was "obvscum" who was only lynched due to a guilty on me (and almost got the real PR lynched), while you are the one fakeclaiming pointlessly. Do check your own play before coming in with confirmation bias at the end of the game, please.


Thanks for the game, Plum. <3 The flavor was everything I wanted it to be and CES getting the sociopathic little hellion is all too fitting*~
This game is yet another example of "the role the game is modeled after is not going to survive until Day 2".


___

*

and

[Maeglin's]

body as it fell smote the rocky slopes of Amon Gwareth thrice ere it pitched into the flames below.

This implies that someone stood there and

counted

.

It was probably Eärendil.

We only mislynched Aegor and Espeonage, the rest we were spot on. Not sure how we could have done much better as a town.

[PeregrineV]

Did I miss dead QT?

Would like to see this too, please.

[PeregrineV]

Great job, shos!

+1 this, because voyeur is a pretty weak role, and getting useful results is only useful in limited circumstances (like when a VT claims PR but scum doesn't want to kill them outright in case they are fakeclaiming).

[PeregrineV]

@Tierce- There is going to be town noise in any game, so that is technically a constant. With that as a constant, town performed exceptionally well.

[PeregrineV]

@Tierce- There is going to be town noise in any game, so that is technically a constant. With that as a constant, town performed exceptionally well.

No.

It's understandable that you think the Town performed well. You, individually, caught two scum, and, again, Town deserved the win, not just due to scum performance, but by power role play catching three scum and the four failing to participate in the game. But Town "noise" is not and should not be a constant, and should not be something that lines up with "exceptionally good" performance. I'm not talking about Night action choices, I'm talking about things you can openly point as bad Town Dayplay when you were inquiring how you could do better. There were plenty of moments in this game where, if you stopped a Town player in their tracks and asked them why they were doing what they did, they'd say something along the lines of "I don't know, I thought I'd wing it". ABR even mentioned that he was self-sabotaging by fakeclaiming because of someone's play. What the hell?

Doesn't matter if you agree or not, there are things that this game did not need to see. You asked me, I answered. There was plenty of "noise" beyond this, but you will notice that I did not mention it, because those are normal things in a Mafia game. This specific set? Was not.


ABR--gloat as you will? Your fakeclaim did not help the Town, shos's play did. I was trying to spot where more Town power would be, and was wrong on the where, but not on the fact that it existed. Since JacobSavage did not leave a readable crumb on PeregrineV's result, we couldn't guess that there were two Trackers and were playing with the tools we had. When you say that I'm criticizing everyone, you're missing two important facts: I was asked to explain my comment that the Town could have done better, and I have made a point of saying the Town win was deserved

anyway

. If you're choosing to ignore that and just gloat instead of learning from this game, that's on you.

If you compare noise to a town full of lurkers, then I prefer the noise. It makes playing more fun and makes it easier to get reads.
Take Sirdani for example. Why do you think he wasn;t lynched? And you guys had to NK him instead.

Same with ABR. If he hadn't fakeclaimed (poor play) then shos would not have voyeaured him and did his gambit (poor play) which confirmed ABR as town AND gave us a scumrole at the same time, and required you guys to kill him AND roleblock him which meant you weren't killing actual PRs.
So yes, in theory, poor play. But, that poor play is the springboard for good future decisions, and the fact we made the best of the poor play (by both town and scum) to win is important.

[PeregrineV]

Take Sirdani for example. Why do you think he wasn;t lynched? And you guys had to NK him instead.

That was just a bad nightkill, really. Sirdan came pretty close to getting lynched.

I dunno.

sirdanilot - 8 - Desperado, Espeonage, MafiaSSK, Elscouta, shos, Shadoweh, Tierce, ActionDan

Led by Desp (no read), Esp (that claim...), Elscout (scummy), shos (c'mon! you know better!), Shadow (scummy), Tierce (deadline lynch), AD (deadline lynch)

Once Shadow was gone and Sirdani kept pushing the Tierce lynch, there were plenty more scummy people than him. I'd never have lynched him.

[PeregrineV]

The weak doctor crumbing by nat was fine

Yes, but I would have preferred him to actually protect his strongest townread instead of suiciding. But I think that with the Shieldrender role that scum could kill past him, so it's probably better in this game that he did.

And I still consider Shadow a bus, because Tierce brought it up and pushed it first/the hardest.

[PeregrineV]

I have no idea how the words 'sirdanilot could be scum' were ever uttered after that in seriousness, but I think it's a testament to how badly people wanted to lynch him.
Tierce had no intention of bussing me until she had to. It was a bus as much as voting your partner after a cop claims guilty on them is.

shos mentioned it. Then Tierce starts on ABR, you start on Jacob. Another day in the office.
Seems someone else could have brought it up first, is all I'm saying. I focused on the doc portion more than the "weak" modifier.

Time to see who majiffy crumbed and cross fingers that he crumbed

WOOOOOOOOSH

VOTE: Albert B. Rampage


Weak Doctor + Cop/Vig + Half Cop. Yeah right.


Question. Was Majiffy killed, or did he suicide? First post suggests the latter.

The death flavors are different, so it implies different things killed them.

##Vote: JacobSavage

If we're going to point out the role that doesn't make sense, a Bodyguard and a Weak Doctor don't make sense in the same game. Also the kill is weird enough to suggest they're just trying to make him look like he should still be alive.

Well I have no idea what Natirasha did N1.

But!

UNVOTE: Albert B. Rampage
VOTE: Shadoweh

Fire priestesses never bothered me anyway.

Tierce is scum.