The Fall of Gondolin Mafia: Game Over (The Tale of Gondolin)
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Shos is eh.In post 78, sirdanilot wrote:Yes I am from the old days too. I still only play in a small amount of games at a time.
Good I like your reads.
What are everyone's shos, shadoweh and especially Esp reads? And does anyone else feel like Esp should die?
Shadoweh is town.
Esp, I think I could actually get behind as scum.
Reck is fine, btw. UNVOTE:- MafiaSSK
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There's only about 4 or 5 players in this game that are post '08. You just happen to be one of them.In post 84, Shadoweh wrote:##Vote: shos
It's 7 days to early for the paranoia to be that unspeakable though!
sirdanilot: Why do you keep bringing up my join date like it matters? I don't know you from years ago or something if that's what you're asking. I'm saying your posts are town but terrible and will only result in tears for everyone.- MafiaSSK
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I think I actually have to sort of agree with shos here. Nat feels off.
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Shadoweh read mostly comes from upick of ice and fire, where I feel like she acted similarly.In post 101, sirdanilot wrote:In post 98, MafiaSSK wrote:
Shos is eh.In post 78, sirdanilot wrote:Yes I am from the old days too. I still only play in a small amount of games at a time.
Good I like your reads.
What are everyone's shos, shadoweh and especially Esp reads? And does anyone else feel like Esp should die?
Shadoweh is town.
Esp, I think I could actually get behind as scum.
Reck is fine, btw. UNVOTE:
How do you read shadoweh town? Though he is number three out of my scumreads, and obviously mot of the game I haven't had any meaningful interaction with yet.
THANK you for seeing the err of Esp's ways- MafiaSSK
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How is that a voteworthy vote?In post 119, chamber wrote:
Nice reading mate A+.In post 117, xRECKONERx wrote:In post 51, shos wrote:Reck is obvtown what are you all doin?!?!
?????
VOTE: shos
Unvote Vote Reck- MafiaSSK
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So in making my post I noticed a lot of bullshit. It mostly has to do with how I've been lurking. Well, I've been VLA since Wednesday, I told Plum this. Sorry I didn't post in this thread, I was already on limited access by that time. But next time, I'll do so.
However, I noticed something funny. Not only did (nearly) all of the votes happen on the last page or so, but on page 21 the leading vote count wagon looked like this:
I found it looking eerily similar to the votecount on this pageIn post 504, Plum wrote:
Three players all quick to leave and join wagons. I mean, we can even look at their amazingly reasoned posts.In post 560, Plum wrote:MafiaSSK - 6 - Cogito Ergo Sum, chamber,ActionDan, Aegor,sirdanilot,EspeonageIn post 534, ActionDan wrote:
Ok.In post 532, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:Yarr. Time for a MafiaSSKlynch.
VOTE: mafiasskAt least ActionDan attempted to give a sentence on why he's sheeping, but the other two didn't even try. Even when asked afterwards, Espeonage's lovely post 555 gives bad logic.
So those three are definitely bad, but the one I have a serious problem with is CES. He's been voting me for a while, granted, but what he did there and what he's been doing has just been bad.
Like this was the post that he originally voted me with.
Not only does he not give a reason but he tries to get one of the stronger players in this town to sheep him. Super iffy.In post 366, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
Totes true.In post 358, JacobSavage wrote:Before that post it was more that his posts in the "Neighbourhood" seemed to be relaxed in a away CES weren't quite.
Unvote, vote: MafiaSSK
Tierce, with me!
Then after giving some bs excuse, he gives this great post about chamber.
Now tell me how that doesn't look like buddying or defending.In post 448, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
Chamber is notably good at looking town though. And he even had a concrete reference that wasn't based solely on chamber's iso (and thus unlikely to have been made up in response to the situation).In post 441, Elscouta wrote:He provided a "list of reads" and when asked about why he thought chamber was town, refered to a post after the list was made (implying the list was made up and that he actually didn't think about reasoning). When pressed to explain, he said that the original reason of the read was "posts looked genuine", which doesn't convince me either: in a game that had already picked up a decent amount of steam, if he only has two reads, I expect these to be based on factual/loudly spoken reasonings, not based on a very weak reason, on someone that has never been really in the light.
So this is the basis for my VOTE: Cogito Ergo Scum
But he did, actually give some attacks on me this page or the last page as well, so open the spoiler below to see how I responded.
Spoiler: My Reponse to CES's most two recent posts- MafiaSSK
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Convince me that I shouldn't switch my vote over to you. Do a detailed reads list.In post 568, Espeonage wrote:I dunno where to start tbh. Ask me stuff. I'm here and willing, but not motivated to reread because it's a shitfest. Contributed by me, but still a shitfest. Directed and scaled questions are more than welcomed and will count as townpoints for actively helping town get a voice.- MafiaSSK
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Actually, you have a rather large offering. 4th largest as a matter of fact. But that doesn't come in content.In post 570, Espeonage wrote:What part of scoped was difficult to understand? What part of I'm currently over my head was difficult to understand? Detailed reads list. I don't even have two townreads to rub together.
I do need to do this though.
Unvote
And truth be told, the only reason to not lynch me is because you're waiting for me to contribute. Because I doubt anyone can really have too firm of a read on me from my meager offering.
Give me some reads in your next post, or my vote will be on you. You've had enough posts to question enough people to be able to determine reads. So do so.- MafiaSSK
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Hey Shadoweh, as long as you're here mind if I ask you a couple of questions?
I like the reads list you did and all, but that was a while ago and yet your vote has stayed on Esp without much growth in the reasoning. Like the original reasoning was super weak. Tunneling for a couple of posts that were nearby each other after a gambit? Eh. And now you've seemed to be focused on his lack of responding to reads requests.
So my questions are
Do you still agree that what Esp did with sirdan was tunneling?
How scummy do you think his lack of response is?
What are three reasons that I should be voting him?- MafiaSSK
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How do you not have something yet? Can you explain that?In post 573, Espeonage wrote: Pedit: Wow, k. And yeah, more what I was getting at. And your logic is, you didn't use your posts effectively so pretend you have something you don't or I'm voting you. Cool man.- MafiaSSK
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But now he's starting to look like a bored townie, Nat. Illuminate me, convince me.In post 577, Natirasha wrote:SSK join the wagon of JUSTICE.- MafiaSSK
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Just as you have always planned to get bored in mafia games?In post 579, Natirasha wrote:
I'd defer to chamber here to ask how he feels about this vs Espeon in Red Wine, where he was equally super shady day one to the point that his entire scumteam was bussing him. I get similar vibes.In post 578, MafiaSSK wrote:
But now he's starting to look like a bored townie, Nat. Illuminate me, convince me.In post 577, Natirasha wrote:SSK join the wagon of JUSTICE.
I also think his play today has been way on eggshells and...plotted? Planned?- MafiaSSK
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CES. What do you think of my read on him?In post 581, Shadoweh wrote: Cut: I can't read minds, I just have good intuition. I have a belief that people should be unvoted for the things they've done, not for what other people have said about them, and there is no done being having. Considering sirdanilot is the only scum read he's refusing to let go of and he doesn't have any new ones, I think it's a dimension beyond tunneling into the Pangalactic Didn't Read The Game Gargleblaster.
Honestly I'm not sure. I'm starting to get tired of trying to squeeze water out of a stone. Who else would you suggest lynching at this point?- MafiaSSK
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Because?In post 585, Shadoweh wrote:CES always reads as scum to me, I'm pretty sure he was born on another planet. chamber and Tierce seem to think he's town though. I trust their judgement about it.- MafiaSSK
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TIP, have we ever played together?
Also, why was my response horrible?- MafiaSSK
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...Nat. Why am I being lynched? Why do you think I'm scum?
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Except he didn't have reasoning. Or at least didn't have reasoning that was explicitly explained in the post of the vote or in any serious way beforehand. And might I remind you that he was trying to start Because Reasons by himself by trying to recruit Tierce onto the wagon.In post 596, Shadoweh wrote:They're better at wizardry. Although CES has posted alot more in this game then I'm used to and I don't remember getting any bad feelings about it, so saying he looks like scum this game is wrong, he just doesn't look bad to me. He's also the only person who posted actual reasoning that people should be voting you, instead of hopping on the rapidly growing train for Because Reasons.
And he probably tried to recruit Tierce for the same reason you trust Tierce's opinion, and excuse me for stating a tautology, but you trust Tierce's opinion because Tierce's opinion is trustable and if scum-CES could get a vote like that on his wagon then he could have an even better and quicker Because Reasons wagon.- MafiaSSK
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First off, I totally agree with you that it is a problem with half the thread if not more and definitely a problem with site meta in general. But it is scummy behavior and it is also definitely scummy behavior for CES, he's been around long enough to know better. He knows to make for a convincing vote that you need to be able to have solid reasons to be able to back it up.In post 598, Shadoweh wrote:In post 538, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
Except that his play was superscummy? He unvoted Reck based on obvious nonsense when that wagon took off and didn't revote anyone despite saying multiple people were scummy.In post 535, sirdanilot wrote:Yeah guys let's go for a lurker lynch on someone who wasn't even half bad before they flaked.
I was referring to when his reminder to people that you exist pushed you into being a real wagon. If you meant he didn't post reasoning when he voted you, half the thread is guilty of that on everyone.In post 542, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
Which wasn't his stated reasoning. The Reckwagon was a good thing because it created pressure and informative situations without significant chance of it turning into a lynch (because Reck); but regardless of what you think of the wagon, "Reck is fine, btw." combined with an unvote is just a scummy reaction.In post 539, sirdanilot wrote:Firstly, the reck wagon was horribly terribad. Some of the biggest scumbags were on it (Esp, you, aegor doesn't look too good either though I haven't read him yet, that'll come later) and it was half RVS anyway.
I doubt he flaked either; he lurks on purpose.
This is actually another reason why I think he might have been targetting Tierce for that initial secondary vote. Tierce doesn't just sheep, that's partially what makes her so good. She will always have and state reason(s) with her vote or else it would have been clear in posts prior why she would be voting them. This is what CES didn't have but wanted.
So when he finally became able to come up with the flimsy (I explain how they're flimsy in the spoilered section of my catchup post, but if you'd like me to explain it in greater detail I'd be happy to) reasoning he does it as a push and it works. Which shows that he knows that there has to be obvious reasoning behind a vote. And that he had none when the wagon began.- MafiaSSK
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There we go. You see, these types of posts make me think that you do have reads even if they're muddled. And I just want to know them, even if they are. So pretty please tell me your opinion of everyone?In post 599, Espeonage wrote:I think SSK looks good here, actually.
btw @Nat: If you're going to bring up Red Wine (Where I had no townie heat on me for a long while but we went for it because it was working, not because they felt they had to.) I'd present Marketplace in response, I feel very similar here to what I did there towards the end. You were in the game too.
TIP's vote looks forced, could be a bus as people have said, or could be a desperate shove off of a bad judgement call.- MafiaSSK
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What? That I was lurking? I addressed that. I was VLA. Thanks for playing, though.In post 607, TheIrishPope wrote:People seem to obviate the fact that he's attacking the people on his wagon but not the argument being made against him...?
And you find that town? Wake up- MafiaSSK
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Screw it.In post 621, Espeonage wrote:
Everything I currently have is out here. I'll post as I see it.In post 606, MafiaSSK wrote:
There we go. You see, these types of posts make me think that you do have reads even if they're muddled. And I just want to know them, even if they are. So pretty please tell me your opinion of everyone?In post 599, Espeonage wrote:I think SSK looks good here, actually.
btw @Nat: If you're going to bring up Red Wine (Where I had no townie heat on me for a long while but we went for it because it was working, not because they felt they had to.) I'd present Marketplace in response, I feel very similar here to what I did there towards the end. You were in the game too.
TIP's vote looks forced, could be a bus as people have said, or could be a desperate shove off of a bad judgement call.
VOTE: Esp- MafiaSSK
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This whole post is entirely bull.In post 611, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
I felt JacobSavage's elaboration made that whole sideshow Tierce was engaged in fairly uninteresting, so it seemed like a natural angle. And then I worked that angle more by defending JacobSavage too.In post 598, Shadoweh wrote:CES, why did you target Tierce in specific and why did you give up so easily on convincing her to vote with you?
SSK, chamber can confirm that I already posted my reasoning in the Neighborhood before I voted you.
Unvote, vote: Espeonage
I'm going to start by addressing CES's response to Shadoweh.
First off, his whole defense of JacobSavage, (as far as I can tell), consists of
. That's one hell of a defense and a way to improve that "angle".In post 408, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote: I put it to you that I am in fact being nice by giving you a neat little wagon to jump on for when you realise JacobSavage doesn't look scummy.
But I honestly don't even still see why Tierce was the one CES was focusing in on. His reasoning is that Tierce sounded bored? So he wanted to help her? Right.
But maybe his reasoning was "in the neighbourhood". Which is another thing that I don't get from this post. Chamber can confirm the reasoning was posted in the neighborhood?
Why not make it publicly out there where we can all respond? Why not make it publicly out there so everyone will definitely read it? Or is it because you wanted an excuse to be able to start a Because Reasons wagon. I feel like that is more believable.
But you're not the lynch today. Because Deadlines.- MafiaSSK
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Tierce!In post 677, Tierce wrote:It was still pointless. The kind of stupid "oh, I'll wing it, I haven't thought that far ahead" reaction test that people so love these days.
Can I get someone interested in this lovely JacobSavage wagon? No? How about with the fact that he's questioning Espeonage about why he chose to do something here that was obviously a premade decision and that has nothing to do with his alignment? He's asking him why he chose to claim VT PRIOR TO THE START OF THE GAME. Oh, I don't know, the answer "because Espeonage is an idiot" might be relevant to his alignment before he even gets a role PM. You can judge someone on WHY they choose to follow the decision they made on an isolated, no-role-PM context, but not on why they made the decision in the first place and it should be obvious why.
Discussing CES Today is a waste of time.
SSK has a far more developed meta assessment of me than I expected. Where've you been hiding? Bring Natirasha over and vote with the cool kids.
First off, I've donewaytoo much meta research on you for my own good.
Secondly, I just don't feel as if the JacobSavage wagon is viable today. What do you think of Esp?
Oh, also, why do you think discussing CES today is a waste of time? He at least needs to be discussed.- MafiaSSK
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I'm afraid I only know him from my Micro. Where he was a Jester.In post 737, Natirasha wrote:
You do know who JacobSavage is, right?In post 733, MafiaSSK wrote:I dunno. I feel like JS would be more active if he were scum in this situation. I dunno. I could see it, but I dunno.- MafiaSSK
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You know what, Tierce? I'm just going to say it. You're being pretty anti-town here. You're being selfish. You're claiming the whole JacobSavage wagon is your doing. You keep repeating just how "town" you are. But you're not the lynch for today.
I'll let JacobSavage be the lynch for today. But only because that's the real main wagon and it's deadline. It's a wagon that's based off of false premises by a bad wagon leader.
Vote: JacobSavage- MafiaSSK
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Nat, CES will come out as scum.In post 807, Natirasha wrote:Whatevs, SSK, if you're scum and are making me kill a good townie I hate you. AND I WILL HUNT YOU DOWN.
VOTE: CES
VOTE: CES- MafiaSSK
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QFT.In post 627, MafiaSSK wrote:
This whole post is entirely bull.In post 611, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:
I felt JacobSavage's elaboration made that whole sideshow Tierce was engaged in fairly uninteresting, so it seemed like a natural angle. And then I worked that angle more by defending JacobSavage too.In post 598, Shadoweh wrote:CES, why did you target Tierce in specific and why did you give up so easily on convincing her to vote with you?
SSK, chamber can confirm that I already posted my reasoning in the Neighborhood before I voted you.
Unvote, vote: Espeonage
I'm going to start by addressing CES's response to Shadoweh.
First off, his whole defense of JacobSavage, (as far as I can tell), consists of
. That's one hell of a defense and a way to improve that "angle".In post 408, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote: I put it to you that I am in fact being nice by giving you a neat little wagon to jump on for when you realise JacobSavage doesn't look scummy.
But I honestly don't even still see why Tierce was the one CES was focusing in on. His reasoning is that Tierce sounded bored? So he wanted to help her? Right.
But maybe his reasoning was "in the neighbourhood". Which is another thing that I don't get from this post. Chamber can confirm the reasoning was posted in the neighborhood?
Why not make it publicly out there where we can all respond? Why not make it publicly out there so everyone will definitely read it? Or is it because you wanted an excuse to be able to start a Because Reasons wagon. I feel like that is more believable.
But you're not the lynch today. Because Deadlines.
Granted the in the neighborhood bit was weird, but you know, I still don't feel like we're supposed to be able to reply to the green text.- MafiaSSK
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Mind explaining anyways?
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I'll bite. Why Shadoweh?
- MafiaSSK
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MafiaSSK Jack of All Trades
- MafiaSSK
- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 5291
- Joined: November 25, 2007
- Location: Washington, D.C.
- MafiaSSK
-
MafiaSSK Jack of All Trades
- MafiaSSK
- Jack of All Trades
- Jack of All Trades
- Posts: 5291
- Joined: November 25, 2007
- Location: Washington, D.C.
It's disappeared. But for good reason. But it's gone.In post 1291, PeregrineV wrote:In post 1286, PeregrineV wrote:Vote: MafiaSSK
No, just looked back through his ISO.
@mafiaSSK- Where has your CES=scummy scum scum read gone to?
Vote: Shadow - MafiaSSK
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