Left 4 Dead Mafia! (Game Over!)

[mastin2]

This is semi-serious btw.

They confirmed way too late so they were being either lazy or scum.

Right, so I'm pretty dang certain this opener makes you town, but serious question--I was the third-to-last to confirm; does that make me scum, too?

Who will be the top bird in this game?

That goes without saying; regardless of either one's alignment, AP. (Doesn't mean pidgey's bad. Just AP's better.)

DGB, why would you hydra with someone who was scum last game?

VOTE: SweatingChessball

And why would you assume they're scum again?

VOTE: dopog

I am scum and trying to push a mislynch.

Okay, you are also town. That said, you're almost certainly right that dopog is a mislynch, soooooo, don't push there.

I didn't see you in the QT.

I also think you're town, here, for this.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Aegor

Okay.

If you're not obvtownning within the next 48 hours, you're scum.

Vote: sekai no ki.

Because I'm a rebel and Aegor is obviously town. You can random wagon him all you'd like, it's all fun and games and such, but I'd prefer to actually have a random vote that's got a chance of being serious.

[mastin2]

mastin2 is scum, he's going to have to NK us.

Indeed.

Vote: sekai no ki.Because I'm a rebel and Aegor is obviously town. You can random wagon him all you'd like, it's all fun and games and such, but I'd prefer to actually have a random vote that's got a chance of being serious.

So doesn't that make it, "not random?"

I suppose.

VOTE: Aegor

I COUNTERCLAIM

VOTE: Rubicon

Okay, Rubicon's actually scum.

VOTE: Rubicon.

Why is he a mislynch?

Because by numbers alone, he's likely to be town. Because by the players in this game, he's likely to end up mislynched because he's not as intertwined. Because of my gut. And most importantly of all...because I said so.

Why so serious?

'Cause I felt like it.

So is mastin scum for not doing the rvs readlist?

No, but I can be scum for being super-serious and actually explaining my reads in as much detail as humanly possible.

[mastin2]

Realized my explanation for Rubicon-scum is too close to normal-me for my comfort. I need to elaborate.

VOTE: Aegor

I COUNTERCLAIM

VOTE: Rubicon

This is a legitimate scumclaim, rather than Aegor's faked scumclaim, because it's taking the fun but instead of running with it (voting Aegor), he takes this approach, to avoid drawing attention to himself. Especially since Aegor (having self-voted first) would take the brunt of the blow. It's scum trying to blend in during the RVS, while also trying to avoid becoming part of something they'd rather avoid. (For instance, if Aegor got wagoned to, say, L-1, it'd be something a scum-Rubicon would want to be off of like the plague.)

[mastin2]

How can you have a gut townread of a player that hasn't posted yet?

I'm Mastin. It's what I do.

(Actual answer: Not everything I'm posting is

actually

serious. It's just meant to look that way. Everything I post is at least semi-serious, in that I do have reasons for it--but I do exaggerate. I have a legitimate feeling dopog is a mislynch-waiting-to-happen, for exactly the reason I mentioned: dopog is a fish out of water; almost nobody knows dopog, and vice-versa, whereas basically everyone else knows everybody. But I don't actually know dopog's town. He could be scum-fish-out-of-water. Basically, I feel like regardless of dopog's alignment, he'll end up dead at town's hand.)

[mastin2]

Otherwise, she just looks like normal mastin self.

I'm specifically trying not to be my normal Mastin self.

[mastin2]

(sorry about the pronoun mixup, Mastin)

S'okay. Takes time to adjust, I know.

And, yes, I am being hyper-aggressive, moreso now than normal, but I actually normally am steering to my old self of not being aggressive. This time, I just so happened to decide to go the opposite.

I thought Mastin was a guy?

I suppose in a sense, what you say is true. Mastin

was

a guy. But I'm not. It's...it's, uh...complicated.

[mastin2]

I suppose in a sense, what you say is true. Mastin

was

a guy. But I'm not. It's...it's, uh...complicated.

(Better answer. If you asked me "Since when have you been a girl?", that's actually much easier to answer--
I always was one; it just took me until recently to realize it, and a bit longer to gain the courage to say so.

Seems like a cop-out answer, but is actually a pretty dang accurate summation of the situation.)

[mastin2]

DGB is town.

That goes without saying.

[mastin2]

(BTW, I think mastin is town now)

Do tell. That's going to need explaining.

[mastin2]

Ask a simple question of "why" and I'll answer.

Okay.
Why?

Mastin, you're just going to have to deal with it.

I am not. I repeat. NOT. Accepting townreads on me, when I've specifically gone out of my way to weird players out. Like...Nero's response is probably from town. That, I'd expect. Not...this.

Sven's probably scum, because this is the same Sven from Anything Goes.

This is a legitimate scumclaim, rather than Aegor's faked scumclaim, because it's taking the fun but instead of running with it (voting Aegor), he takes this approach, to avoid drawing attention to himself. Especially since Aegor (having self-voted first) would take the brunt of the blow. It's scum trying to blend in during the RVS, while also trying to avoid becoming part of something they'd rather avoid. (For instance, if Aegor got wagoned to, say, L-1, it'd be something a scum-Rubicon would want to be off of like the plague.)

You make good points and I like the cut of your jib.

Oh?

You're probably not serious but I could see a mastin2 and BBmolla as both scum at this point on the grounds that they were both being weirdly serious in RVS: mastin2 for example, "I was the third-to-last to confirm; does that make me scum, too?" and his thing about me. BBmolla making a big deal about policy lynching people for claiming scum, exaggerated irritation with it, etc.

Says otherwise. Dat cog-dis.

VOTE: mastin2

Dat OMGUS.

[mastin2]

You'll just have to deal with it.

Okay. This is me, dealing with being townread against any semblance of logic.

Vote: sekai no ki

.

You get a scum read on me because I start the game with a gif? Have I understood that correctly?

Not exactly, but...basically?

[mastin2]

Thats a shitty reason to get a scum read on me
VOTE: Bulba

And yet, you randomly choose to ignore it, and instead vote Bulb.

Vote: SweatingChessball

Because based on my last 2 games with you both, you probably won't be around tomorrow.
If you somehow are, we may revisit this.

This type of insane troll logic is basically something I can only see coming from a town-Peregrine.

VOTE: Vezok

Did I mention that Sven's scum with Rubicon?

...Yeah, well, Sven's scum with Rubicon. In this case, blatantly chainsaw defending Rubicon and starting a counter-wagon to Rubicon.

Your "but then" and "of course this blah blah id possible" kinda posts ring town to me.

You mean the elements of my posting

most

like my null-normal self?

The clincher IMO is this snippet about dopog

Because by numbers alone, he's likely to be town. Because by the players in this game, he's likely to end up mislynched because he's not as intertwined. Because of my gut. And most importantly of all...because I said so.

You mean the elements of my play

second

-most like my null-normal self, perhaps arguably even *the* most like my normal null self? You're townreading me for THAT?

You guys, Mastin just posted but ignored EVERYTHING about me calling her scum.

Umm...no I didn't?

I am not. I repeat. NOT. Accepting townreads on me, when I've specifically gone out of my way to weird players out. Like...

Nero's response is probably from town.

That, I'd expect.

Do you want me to count the reasons why?

Yes.

Also, Thor's pretty likely town. His stances are reasonable and well-backed. I really like his approach to the game so far. Pretty much the only thing not to like is the DrippingChesskid vote, and even then, that's strongly Thor being Thor, not Thor being scum or Thor being town.

I am also thinking Bulbazak is town, though I'm not entirely sure. The change in Bulbazak seems really legitimate, and I of all people know what it's like to be down on your luck as town. Basically, it's not something I see as being a likely scum approach. While there are theoretically advantages to doing so (helps justify 'off' play, helps keep his options open, and such), it just seems, well, like something that he simply wouldn't do as scum. It'd be all too easy to just be his normal arrogant self as scum; why this game of all games to be humble? Far more likely than not, it's from town.

Mastin demanding that people explain their town read on her doesn't seem genuine. She often gets town reads on people for fairly weak reasons, and kind of doubt that she didn't understand why SNK would have a town read on her.

Normally, yes. But normally, I am my normal self during the game. Normally, there are things in my posting that I know are town and I know people will pick up as being town.

...I specifically went out of my way to

avoid

doing those things. I specifically went out of my way to do things that I knew would freak people out who know me. Which is why people like Nero and Thor are town: because they're reacting how I expected of someone seeing that. I get townreads on me for reasons that might seem weak, but have legitimate bases. This game, I've gotten townreads on me that

are

weak, with absolutely none. I should be null to nullscum to them. That I'm not is quite frankly deeply concerning.

All of the following posts are sketch and trying too hard:

Why are mine not among them? I was being sketch and trying too hard more than any other player. Heck, I still am.

Would also lynch Thor or Rubicon.

Rubicon it is, then.
VOTE: Rubicon.

Vezok is town, the counter-wagon to the scum-Rubicon.

/Through 9.

[mastin2]

Mastin I don't think Im willing to call you a scumread yet, but you are par for the course with this wall alone.

See this?

This

is what I expected from a town player reading me. THIS is a town reaction to seeing me post what I did. AP is town.

I'm also thinking BBMolla's town, too. I asked him to obvtown himself, and he delivered, in his own unique charming way.

[4] Rubicon: Vezokpiraka, PeregrineV, Zdenek, Toogeloo
[4] Vezokpiraka: Svenskt Stal, Aegor, pidgey, AngryPidgeon

Seriously, Vezok's the town counter-wagon to the scum Rubicon-wagon.

Forgot to mention it, even though it's kinda clear. Aegor's in fact a decently-strong townread of mine, and Zdenek is also a very strong townread, because Zed's (ha!) posting pretty similarly to Thor, in that all of his posts are strongly-reasoned and seem highly, HIGHLY town-oriented in their thought process.

Vezok IS a Rubicon buddy.

Well, then, you won't mind lynching Rubicon first, now, will you?

Also, I change my mind: dopog's ridiculously town. Never lynch this guy. He is town, through-and-through. This one, I'm having a bit of trouble explaining right here and now (which is bad; I'm specifically trying to break that habit this game), but it is towntowntowntowntown.

[mastin2]

Mastin if you wanna be town you gotta stop misreading this hilarious scumbutt.

Well, then, I guess I'm scum because I'm townreading Vezok and quite strongly so.

[mastin2]

I may have missed it although I dont think I did. What wa the lowdown?

I don't really remember my posting that well from yesterday, but in essence, I'll be keeping some of the new me but not all of it and will be doing a little more normal Mastin stuff. (I also remember explaining my stances some more, and addressing a few players. Zdenek, Aegor, and one or two others. [You probably among them.] As the Tierce post says, I can try to recreate that stuff for ya, but it'll be an extremely faulty memory and highly inaccurate*.)

I think I'd prefer to wait until we've got the posts back in order to do so, though.

*This is actually something I consider to be a strength in my games, by the way. A darned pain because if I need to remember my reasoning for something and I never gave it, I can't. So people inquiring about my earlier posting are often left just as frustrated about my lack of reasoning as I am, because legitimately have no clue what an earlier-me is thinking in any game I play. (Which was one of my motivating factors in choosing my strategy this game, by the way.) I can guess, though. And that's strength number one. By not knowing my own reasoning and guessing, I can often create a new, stronger reasoning than whatever weak reasoning I had originally possessed.

Strength number two is that because I have an extremely short memory capacity, my reads are always fresh. It helps keep me having a new perspective consistently on the game. It also serves to help my scum-game, too, because while the memory loss is inconvenient for me forming long-term plans (mind you, any plan I'd have trouble remembering as scum is something I'd concoct in my head--QT plans, I never forget), it also increases my ability to fake whimsy. A scum-me is fairly calculating and always has a plan, always doing things for a purpose. But specifically because I don't always remember what my purpose was, I can shift my trajectory fairly convincingly mid-way through a day, and typically, nobody bats an eye at it. (Or if they do, quickly write it off as a towntell.)

[mastin2]

Mastin is intentionally obfuscating emotions / content by being willfully scummy. This is anti-town at best, potentially scum motivated, and not allowed to live beyond D3 unless somehow confirmed.

Day Four, actually. Unless your scumread on me strengthened by one day.

[mastin2]

Yeah, Sven's still scum. (:P) Majiffy is too, by the way. So's Rubicon.

Vezok is ridiculously town. He's like a more subtle me.

[mastin2]

But, I think the basic idea of looking for town motivations behind posts, especially in the early game is something that either Mastin taught Nacho or Nacho taught Mastin or they both learned from someone else.

A bit of column A, bit of column B, and a bit from a column D not listed. Back in late-2010, Nacho was the first player that I really connected with after my return from 2009. When we hydra'd in Calcifer, Nacho basically laid the foundation for the new-Mastin, because from him, I learned how to be charismatic and also began to hone in on the more important aspects of things. Whereas before, I had walled needlessly, progressively, he helped me wall necessarily. However, while he influenced me greatly, I'm decently certain that he was not the one who taught me about motivations. In fact, I'm fairly certain that I came up with that idea, myself. I've been making MD threads since 2011 (when my play really began to improve), and this was something I learned, basically: that the old me had the right ideas, but completely wrong reasoning, because I was focusing on the wrong aspects of things. In other words, my needlessly-wordy theories were wrong because they had the wrong focus, but the heart of the idea was actually right, and finding that true focus refined these methods into actually-useful tools. Among them being motivation. I think that popped up as early as my revised-MITs. (Insane Tells. Which after the revisions, weren't nearly as insane.) So to some extent, I think I mighta taught Nacho about it at some point. However, largely, I suspect he also came up with the idea by himself. He certainly doesn't strike me as the type to have learned it from others.

Basically, I think we both individually came to the same realization after some amount of time, recognizing the evolving site meta and adapting to it quite well. It makes sense, because both of us had similar styles thanks to me having largely inherited his. (I consider Nacho an equal, but to some extent, I also consider him an honorary-IC of mine, thanks to him having helped define my play so much.)
/rambling.

[mastin2]

Unless you consider being batshit-mastin a towntell, then I really dont see the townieness behind that.

Being batshit mastin IS a towntell, 'cause the specific kind of crazy I employ can only consistently come from town. (I can do insanity as scum, but my natural desire to fulfill my wincon as scum means that eventually, the act fades and you can see the method that was present in the madness.)

Also, does this mean you consider me synonymous with craziness?

[mastin2]

Dead serious: vezok is a more subtle version of me. (This isn't something I was aware of before this game, but having seen it now, I'm certain of it.) With that in mind, try reading him. He's town.

[mastin2]

When our different perspectives start aligning, its usually a sign we're both digging into the same picture.

Odd that you're scumreading me then, considering how much your reads seem to align with mine. Including...

I think I just WANT ffery to be scum this game so I can catch HER for once, but she might not actually be. If Im being honest with myself, shes towntold a reasonable amount. She feels different outside of the sangres hydra to be sure though.

Like, I still am suspicious-as-hell about them, but being perfectly honest with myself, for some reason, I don't actually feel like they're scum. There's reasoning for it, but I'm not sure I actually believe it.

[mastin2]

Dead serious: vezok is a more subtle version of me. (This isn't something I was aware of before this game, but having seen it now, I'm certain of it.)

I don't really understand what you mean.

Your reasoning, train of thought, mindset, and overall posting is VERY Mastin-like, just not as obviously-stated. When I see you posting, I can easily see that being me having posted it, only not quite, in that your posting is less...attention-grabbing, I guess? Subtle is the best word I can think of to describe the difference.

[mastin2]

What do you think of the Alpacazard?

I said it before, I'll say it again: I'll get back to you on that.

Like, I literally remember nothing about them. I know they've been posting. I remember seeing and reading their posts. I remember absolutely nothing about their posts other than that they exist. I need to get back to ya on it. Because my current read on them is the same as if they hadn't posted at all. (Dead-null.)

[mastin2]

^ AH HA, THE TRIED AND TRUE

PHONEPOSTING
WORK
LURKER

SITE-CRASH SCUMTELL. SCUM DETECTED.

What you say with irony, I say with sincerity. Scum using the excuse of lost posts not to contribute is exploiting the site crash for its maximum value.

I'm waffling on Vezok. I won't let mastin persuade me just yet.

Would it help or hurt your read if I

fake

claimed masons with Vezok?

Vezok lynch is pretty bleh.

Indeed.

Alright, I just read up the game. I don't expect anyone to read over my notes word for word since I will sum everything up at the end, but you should read through them if you want a better idea about how I'm arriving at my conclusions. I would also like it if you read the questions I ask of you specifically.

GAH.

I want to call RC scum for this. I want to say that he's misrepping, that he quote-stripped and removed context to paint a scummy picture, and that there's absolutely no sense in his reads. I want to say that this is a scum-him. This game would be SO much easier if he was actually scum. But no. He's not. I'm pretty dang certain that this is a town-RC. Just an RC who might be accurate in some areas but is otherwise completely and entirely off-base.

I think he would draw more attention to himself by voting himself (even though he's the second player to do so) than he would by joining the leading wagon.

Then you don't know anything about players looking back on RVS wagons. They do so immediately, analyzing the size of the wagon and determining who (if any) the scum are on it...and

they never stop

. They come back to that same RVS wagon throughout the entire game. No, seriously. I see it done, time and time again, across all games. The easiest example to cite is in Xenogears, where there was an eight-person wagon in the early-stages of the game on TiphaineDeath. All nine players were analyzed to death (literally, death) on that wagon--not just immediately. But continuously throughout the game. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out. That's why it was a scumtell from Rubicon.

(Yes. I am fully aware that I intentionally avoided the Aegor wagon, too. I pointed it out then, too, that it was a scumtell. If I was playing like my town self, I would have mindlessly jumped onto the wagon, in spite of my townread on him.)

Not everything I'm posting is

actually

serious. It's just meant to look that way.

Everything I post is at least

semi-serious

, in that

I do have reasons for it--but

I do exaggerate

.

I despise this entire post, but this segment in particular seems very forced.

Except the dialog you paint below is explained in the second half of the quote. Ignore the word "actually" and use the more accurate "entirely". Throughout that post (and all subsequent posts!), I make it crystal-clear that's what I meant. I've even bolded the relevant parts, emphasizing it. No, my dopog townread was not entirely serious. Yes, it was still somewhat-serious, in that I picked up the vibe that dopog would be lynched this game, and that it was more likely to be a mislynch. I explained this. It's present throughout my posting, that semi-serious-but-not-entirely-serious mindset. My entire RVS presence was meant to look serious because it was meant to be taken seriously. Yet if you bother to read those posts for more than a second, you'll realize exactly how transparently semi-serious (rather than entirely serious or entirely joking) they are.

And if you think that being semi-serious in the RVS is a scumtell for me or for anyone, you can go straight to hell because that's a fundamental scumhunting technique that I've used even when I was a VI in 2009. It's carried over throughout my games over the years, and likely influenced other players to act similarly. (For instance, AP's posting in Anything Goes started out semi-seriously. He was not entirely serious...yet he was not entirely joking, either. It was a mid-way between the two, scumhunting in his own unique way.)

...I specifically went out of my way to

avoid

doing those things.

Eh, cop out. I don't buy it.

Then you don't know me. At all. It's right there. In my posting. That painfully-obvious effort to not be the same person. There are elements of my posting that are still Mastin-in-general. There are elements of my posting that are a town Mastin. And there are a

lot

of elements in my posting that are a scum Mastin, intentionally so.

(Why? Because bluntly...my scum game is currently better than my town game. As scum, I have a plan, and my plan always works, or comes close to working. As scum, I can control the system, manipulate the strings, and make town players do my bidding. But my town game

hasn't

been going that well. I've been making the wrong calls. I've been becoming mislynch-bait. I've been a mediocre-at-BEST player, who can only hope to provide moral support to the town players actually effective at hunting scum. I'm sure of the wrong people, and paranoid of the wrong people. I want the magic of my scumgame to apply to my towngame. I want to bring my towngame back up from the brink of extinction. I want to stop sucking. I want to stop being a bad town player. So I'm deliberately playing partially to my scum meta. Explaining all of my reads in as much detail as I can among the more obvious things that I've done differently. Because a scum-me can do that. [Well...most of the time.] A town-me...hasn't. To the point where my scum-self even began mimicking that lack of explanation because it became such a strong towntell. And I'm sick of that. Of, frustratingly, having been off my mark. Time. And time. again. Of maybe eventually getting nightkilled, but having been nightkilled more out of pity and respect for my theoretical capabilities rather than for my actual skill. You don't know me. As AP said, I know me, better than any other player knows themselves. So, yes. I know I am different. Not only from my town-self, but also different in general, in that I'm intentionally sending off a completely different vibe.)

"I'm completely different now, so if you have a scumread on me, it's because you haven't figured out the new me yet~!"

Except...I've said

exactly

the opposite. "I'm completely different now, so why the

hell

are you townreading me?!?" Seriously. You can't miss it. It's literally painted throughout my iso, with sekai's and GIF's reads on me in particular. Their townreads on me made zero sense, because there was literally nothing to be townread. I can sort-of see someone townreading me now. (Especially vezok. He might not have said so as wordily as others, but I

get

his reasoning. I know why he's townreading me in spite of a lack of detailed explanation.) But there was no reason. Absolutely none. To townread my earlier posting, which was null, weird, and/or scum of me to have posted.

He's all over the place.

Which is part of the reason he's town. When you get an insane player like me or AP, sure, yeah, being "all over the place"

can

be a scumtell. But generally? Generally, a person being all over the place is a town player who hasn't gotten into their element, rather than a scum player lashing out at every possible target.

Lastly, in 320, I want to point out mastin continually beating players over the head with the "I'm different now; this means you can't scumread me". mastin isn't saying those words exactly, but doing just enough to get you to arrive at that conclusion on your own.

Again, except

that's the exact opposite of everything I've been saying

. I've said AS EXPLICITLY AS CAN BE, "I'm playing differently, so

why the

hell

are you TOWNreading me?!?

" That doesn't run both ways. That's not me saying I can't be read, that I should be null and neither town nor scum. It's me saying that I shouldn't be a townread. Not that I shouldn't be a scumread. Bluntly, players who know me SHOULD have been scumreading me, and the way that Thor, AP, and Nero did so was all incredibly town. If their accusations had been unjustified, I would have called them out on them. But simply put, they weren't, because they were right.

Your case on vezok is entirely wrong, too. As is this.

If I had to pick, it would probably be BB.

BBMolla was asked to make himself obvtown within 48 hours...and he delivered. This is his towngame. Not his scumgame. It is there, in his mindset, in his posting. Ignore the amount of words. BBMolla's never been much for elaborate wording. As others have said, I can extrapolate the words and expand them out into a mindset. And with that in mind, by reading Molla's content, you can tell that he's thinking like town and not like scum

The jury is still out on

Majiffy

,

Alpazard

and

Sven

. I've got them in a null territory.

Majiffy and Sven are both scum. Alpa's a dead-null of mine.

[

Town

]------Aegor-Toog----Rubicon-----AP-Bulb--NC-pidgey---Alpazard-Sven-[

∙

]Majiffy--GIF-Thor--SC-Pere--Zde--sekai-AD-dopog--BB----vez--mastin-----[

Scum

]

The first good reads you have here are sekai and Dan; everyone further down your list I can guarantee is town. Zdenek being right there in (presumably) nullscum territory is also bad; Zdenek's one of my strongest townreads. PeregrineV is, too. ChessBall is another one who's also town, with a town-oriented mindset and content. As is Thor. That said, there's only one townread of yours that I actually disagree with, that being Rubicon. You're essentially townreading Rubicon because you're scumreading me. You might not think that's the case, but it is; your entire reasoning for having Rubicon as town basically resolves around me flipping scum.

As I said. Would be much simpler if you were scum, because these reads would then be justifiable. (Having scumbuddies be mostly in null, for distancing purposes, but keeping them from being scumreads.) But sadly, you're town. Just...town who is very, VERY wrong on most of these things.

[mastin2]

Oops.

Mod: please delete the broken version above

.

^ AH HA, THE TRIED AND TRUE

PHONEPOSTING
WORK
LURKER

SITE-CRASH SCUMTELL. SCUM DETECTED.

What you say with irony, I say with sincerity. Scum using the excuse of lost posts not to contribute is exploiting the site crash for its maximum value.

I'm waffling on Vezok. I won't let mastin persuade me just yet.

Would it help or hurt your read if I

fake

claimed masons with Vezok?

Vezok lynch is pretty bleh.

Indeed.

Alright, I just read up the game. I don't expect anyone to read over my notes word for word since I will sum everything up at the end, but you should read through them if you want a better idea about how I'm arriving at my conclusions. I would also like it if you read the questions I ask of you specifically.

GAH.

I want to call RC scum for this. I want to say that he's misrepping, that he quote-stripped and removed context to paint a scummy picture, and that there's absolutely no sense in his reads. I want to say that this is a scum-him. This game would be SO much easier if he was actually scum. But no. He's not. I'm pretty dang certain that this is a town-RC. Just an RC who might be accurate in some areas but is otherwise completely and entirely off-base.

I think he would draw more attention to himself by voting himself (even though he's the second player to do so) than he would by joining the leading wagon.

Then you don't know anything about players looking back on RVS wagons. They do so immediately, analyzing the size of the wagon and determining who (if any) the scum are on it...and

they never stop

. They come back to that same RVS wagon throughout the entire game. No, seriously. I see it done, time and time again, across all games. The easiest example to cite is in Xenogears, where there was an eight-person wagon in the early-stages of the game on TiphaineDeath. All nine players were analyzed to death (literally, death) on that wagon--not just immediately. But continuously throughout the game. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out. That's why it was a scumtell from Rubicon.

(Yes. I am fully aware that I intentionally avoided the Aegor wagon, too. I pointed it out then, too, that it was a scumtell. If I was playing like my town self, I would have mindlessly jumped onto the wagon, in spite of my townread on him.)

Not everything I'm posting is

actually

serious. It's just meant to look that way.

Everything I post is at least

semi-serious

, in that

I do have reasons for it--but

I do exaggerate

.

I despise this entire post, but this segment in particular seems very forced.

Except the dialog you paint below is explained in the second half of the quote. Ignore the word "actually" and use the more accurate "entirely". Throughout that post (and all subsequent posts!), I make it crystal-clear that's what I meant. I've even bolded the relevant parts, emphasizing it. No, my dopog townread was not entirely serious. Yes, it was still somewhat-serious, in that I picked up the vibe that dopog would be lynched this game, and that it was more likely to be a mislynch. I explained this. It's present throughout my posting, that semi-serious-but-not-entirely-serious mindset. My entire RVS presence was meant to look serious because it was meant to be taken seriously. Yet if you bother to read those posts for more than a second, you'll realize exactly how transparently semi-serious (rather than entirely serious or entirely joking) they are.

And if you think that being semi-serious in the RVS is a scumtell for me or for anyone, you can go straight to hell because that's a fundamental scumhunting technique that I've used even when I was a VI in 2009. It's carried over throughout my games over the years, and likely influenced other players to act similarly. (For instance, AP's posting in Anything Goes started out semi-seriously. He was not entirely serious...yet he was not entirely joking, either. It was a mid-way between the two, scumhunting in his own unique way.)

...I specifically went out of my way to

avoid

doing those things.

Eh, cop out. I don't buy it.

Then you don't know me. At all. It's right there. In my posting. That painfully-obvious effort to not be the same person. There are elements of my posting that are still Mastin-in-general. There are elements of my posting that are a town Mastin. And there are a

lot

of elements in my posting that are a scum Mastin, intentionally so.

(Why? Because bluntly...my scum game is currently better than my town game. As scum, I have a plan, and my plan always works, or comes close to working. As scum, I can control the system, manipulate the strings, and make town players do my bidding. But my town game

hasn't

been going that well. I've been making the wrong calls. I've been becoming mislynch-bait. I've been a mediocre-at-BEST player, who can only hope to provide moral support to the town players actually effective at hunting scum. I'm sure of the wrong people, and paranoid of the wrong people. I want the magic of my scumgame to apply to my towngame. I want to bring my towngame back up from the brink of extinction. I want to stop sucking. I want to stop being a bad town player. So I'm deliberately playing partially to my scum meta. Explaining all of my reads in as much detail as I can among the more obvious things that I've done differently. Because a scum-me can do that. [Well...most of the time.] A town-me...hasn't. To the point where my scum-self even began mimicking that lack of explanation because it became such a strong towntell. And I'm sick of that. Of, frustratingly, having been off my mark. Time. And time. again. Of maybe eventually getting nightkilled, but having been nightkilled more out of pity and respect for my theoretical capabilities rather than for my actual skill. You don't know me. As AP said, I know me, better than any other player knows themselves. So, yes. I know I am different. Not only from my town-self, but also different in general, in that I'm intentionally sending off a completely different vibe.)

"I'm completely different now, so if you have a scumread on me, it's because you haven't figured out the new me yet~!"

Except...I've said

exactly

the opposite. "I'm completely different now, so why the

hell

are you townreading me?!?" Seriously. You can't miss it. It's literally painted throughout my iso, with sekai's and GIF's reads on me in particular. Their townreads on me made zero sense, because there was literally nothing to be townread. I can sort-of see someone townreading me now. (Especially vezok. He might not have said so as wordily as others, but I

get

his reasoning. I know why he's townreading me in spite of a lack of detailed explanation.) But there was no reason. Absolutely none. To townread my earlier posting, which was null, weird, and/or scum of me to have posted.

He's all over the place.

Which is part of the reason he's town. When you get an insane player like me or AP, sure, yeah, being "all over the place"

can

be a scumtell. But generally? Generally, a person being all over the place is a town player who hasn't gotten into their element, rather than a scum player lashing out at every possible target.

Lastly, in 320, I want to point out mastin continually beating players over the head with the "I'm different now; this means you can't scumread me". mastin isn't saying those words exactly, but doing just enough to get you to arrive at that conclusion on your own.

Again, except

that's the exact opposite of everything I've been saying

. I've said AS EXPLICITLY AS CAN BE, "I'm playing differently, so

why the

hell

are you TOWNreading me?!?

" That doesn't run both ways. That's not me saying I can't be read, that I should be null and neither town nor scum. It's me saying that I shouldn't be a townread. Not that I shouldn't be a scumread. Bluntly, players who know me SHOULD have been scumreading me, and the way that Thor, AP, and Nero did so was all incredibly town. If their accusations had been unjustified, I would have called them out on them. But simply put, they weren't, because they were right.

Your case on vezok is entirely wrong, too. As is this.

If I had to pick, it would probably be BB.

BBMolla was asked to make himself obvtown within 48 hours...and he delivered. This is his towngame. Not his scumgame. It is there, in his mindset, in his posting. Ignore the amount of words. BBMolla's never been much for elaborate wording. As others have said, I can extrapolate the words and expand them out into a mindset. And with that in mind, by reading Molla's content, you can tell that he's thinking like town and not like scum

The jury is still out on

Majiffy

,

Alpazard

and

Sven

. I've got them in a null territory.

Majiffy and Sven are both scum. Alpa's a dead-null of mine.

[

Town

]------Aegor-Toog----Rubicon-----AP-Bulb--NC-pidgey---Alpazard-Sven-[

∙

]Majiffy--GIF-Thor--SC-Pere--Zde--sekai-AD-dopog--BB----vez--mastin-----[

Scum

]

The first good reads you have here are sekai and Dan; everyone further down your list I can guarantee is town. Zdenek being right there in (presumably) nullscum territory is also bad; Zdenek's one of my strongest townreads. PeregrineV is, too. ChessBall is another one who's also town, with a town-oriented mindset and content. As is Thor. That said, there's only one townread of yours that I actually disagree with, that being Rubicon. You're essentially townreading Rubicon because you're scumreading me. You might not think that's the case, but it is; your entire reasoning for having Rubicon as town basically resolves around me flipping scum.

As I said. Would be much simpler if you were scum, because these reads would then be justifiable. (Having scumbuddies be mostly in null, for distancing purposes, but keeping them from being scumreads.) But sadly, you're town. Just...town who is very, VERY wrong on most of these things.

[mastin2]

Welcome to the game, RC! RC is town (call it gut for now).

Odd. If it were my gut, RC'd be scum. It's my

logic

telling me RC's town this game, because it's the same RC from Walking Dead. You could say...it's a

dead-ringer

.

Because it still feels like hes avoiding doing anything that he personally finds interesting. It feels like hes just trying to go with the flow. Not sure how permanent this vote is, but I want to make a point at least.

I actually picked up a similar vibe, in that pidgey's posting doesn't seem to be making an impact, in that pidgey's stances seem highly convenient and not particularly original. However, I kinda remember having thought the same of pidgey in HP/MGS, until pidgey got pressured and was forced to play more aggressively.

Guess we can wagon pidgey to find out if he does so, but my read on pidgey is still basically null, and I like keeping my vote on scum.

GIF/Sekai/pidgey.
These are people I'd like to see pressure on.

Towncore as of this post: Zdenek, Toogeloo, Thor, AP, Red Coyote

I'm okay with all of this. Add in Nero to the towncore, though. And Aegor. Bulb's not a bad addition, either. Also, BBMolla should be in there. If I had my way, you'd also add in dopog and vezok, though I can understand your reluctance. Still, though. You've got no reason not to add Nero/Aegor/Bulb/BBM in.

Random note--I feel like Alpa's the replacement-counterwagon to the scum-Sven wagon. Vezok didn't gain momentum because having me defend a player will typically have that effect. So, instead of wagoning a townread, they wagon a nullread--not just of me, but of most players, so that there is very little resistance against the wagon, and that the wagons on scum players like Rubicon and Sven and Majiffy are completely and entirely forgotten.

[mastin2]

You could say...it's a

dead-ringer

.

ITT mastin is scum for making bad zombie puns in a zombie game.

[mastin2]

(This image is awesome, by the way. Totally stealing it for future reference.)

[mastin2]

You are either confirmation biasing about this or just assigning scum motivation to Majiffy's post because you are scum.

No. I can read Majiffy, and I can tell that he is scum.

No, no. You are expecting people to scumread you for your early game posts, remember? RC posting this is expected and :goodposting:.

Yes, I expect people to scumread me for the right reasons. RC's scumreading me for all the wrong reasons. And my statement about him being entirely wrong isn't mainly about me, either. It's about his reads, too. Basically, most of my townreads are on the wrong side of his null-line, and my scumreads are way too far up his list. I seriously want to know what RC was smoking to come up with something which (while accurate in some areas) is entirely wrong in others.

Mastin your posts are TERRIBLE this game. You should strongly reconsider your life choices if you are town (you aren't).

Me reconsidering my life choices is precisely why I've gone down the route that I'm going down right now. I'm giving you reads, with more reasoning than I have given in the last half year or so. (Maybe more! It could have feasibly been a full year since the last time I explained in as much detail as I am where I'm coming from.) The reads aren't bad. They're solid. They're unusually-acquired, but these reads are not inexplicable gut-reads that will turn out wrong. They are firmly grounded in reasoning (albeit not fully logical), and well-backed. I can go into detail about every single one of them, and to some extent, I've already begun trying to.

I'll turn your words around. You're heavily into confirmation bias, and it is tainting your other reads. Because we've agreed on so much. You're refusing to listen to what I'm saying. You're refusing to work with my reads, when I've gone out of my way to reach out to you and point out how they're similar and how we should be coordinating them. I'm listening to your reads. I'm listening to your reasoning. You're not doing the same for me.

You keep promising to fix this. Its not like their ISO is enormous.

So vig me. I'm a slacker. Doesn't change my alignment.

And re Town core: No. This town core is a town core. not a place for bullshit willynilly reads on people like Molla who certainly havent posted enough to be probably town yet.

And yet, they're all reads that you have at least partially if not entirely agreed to. Aegor's posting this game is ridiculously town. I could tell from the RVS alone, and it's carried through his posting. His reasoning is strong, his reads make sense, I can follow his mindset perfectly, and he's bluntly one of the most obvtown players in here. Objectively, he'd even be more town than you. (Subjectively, though, you're conftown to me and he's just obvtown.)

Nero is a player I really know. Admittedly, it's been a while since we've had a good and proper game together. But that doesn't change the fact that I've become intimately familiar with his thought process--not just as town, but

also

as scum. I know how he thinks, and who he would attack as scum. His posting does not match that at all. The only concern is that he hasn't been spamposting. That's literally it. And even then, that's explained by the short timeframe of the game, his V/LA, and him not having had a chance to. Other than that, I can see where his thoughts come from, and they are town. They're filled to the brim with town paranoia and caution. Not scum trying to mislynch anyone they please. (That IS a scum Nero trait, by the way!) Town who has every reason to be weary of the exact players he is treading carefully with.

BBMolla is also a player that I know fairly well. I can't remember his scumgame (even though I've seen it before), but I do remember his towngame, and vaguely can put together the differences between the two. (Anything Goes does not count as a scumgame, AP. You misread him as town there because bluntly, he wasn't scum; he was effectively third party.) He's sorta similar to MafiaSSK, except not. Putting aside a misread of him in a game where he wasn't actually scum, what do you think of him, hmm? His relaxed tone. His casual banter. His train of thought, what he's thinking, the effort he's already given the game. (BBMolla effort being more subtle than most.) That's not confident scum who has given nothing of importance. That's relaxed town who is playing naturally and giving content with the flow.

And then there's Bulbazak! Bluntly, it'd have been a scumtell for him to have townread me. This is exactly the type of trajectory (pardon me, ffery) that I'd expect from him-as-town with me. He's not tunnelvisioning. He's not being arrogant. He's treading carefully, but not absolutely cautiously. He's letting his thoughts be known, in an incredibly town manner, and analyzing solidly. His train of thought makes perfect sense, and overall, I really can't see a scum-him having pulled this type of stunt all of a sudden. Choosing this game of all games to fix his faults is, basically undeniably, a complete and total towntell for him.

All of those are SOLID reads, AP, and you darn-well know it. You'd be agreeing to them if you didn't scumread me.

Tell me I'm wrong.

Tell me, to my face, bluntly, that you wouldn't be townreading them solidly if not for me. They are town. You KNOW they are town. You should be agreeing with most of this, even if not using the exact same reasoning, because you've seen the same stuff I see. They are town, and deserve to be in the townbloc.

[mastin2]

In what games have you had a town alignment and accurately read me as scum?

Admittedly, I can't recall off the top of my head games of yours where we were both town aside from when we were masons together. However, I can tell you that (including alts) I don't think there's a single scum game of yours that I've been in where I read you as town. For instance, in Gears of War, my memory says you were nullscum. Actually, I think I remember investigating you, specifically because I didn't think you were town. (And died immediately for my trouble. >_<)

It's something that IS a bit difficult to fully explain. The difference is subtle, involving your tone, how you approach the game, your mindset, your scumhunting, and your reads. But basically...who you've attacked has not been players a town-you would attack, who you've scumread are players that a town-you wouldn't be scumreading, and your reads are overall highly convenient to what is best for them to be for you, rather than what you want them to be.

...Okay. Reworded, simply: flowchart. You're not taking control. You're letting others take control, hanging in the background.

[mastin2]

Uh. Are you honestly trying to tell me that your endorsement of them is affecting my view of them? Its not.

Coulda fooled me.

So, on one hand, there are some players you'd like to see some pressure on.

You talking 'bout pidgey? 'Cause I said I'd be okay with pressuring that for very specific reasons (pidgey-pressure allows for reading of pidgey), but that I'd prefer voting scum. Who are where I'd prefer to be pressuring. Thus, my votes.

But a null read of *the entire player base* is not one of them because, hey, that must be a scum counter wagon.

Yep! Alpa's nulltown to me now, thanks to the very nature of being null to the entire town. Not wagoning that, 'specially since I don't see them having their alignment revealed with pressure yet no lynch.

A counterwagon generated by...me and GiF...neither of whom you're calling scum.

GiF read isn't town. And the wagon's support doesn't exactly seem town, either.

And stop just posting 'I'mma scum, I'mma scum!' with every post - it's not healthy regardless of your alignment.

Habits die hard. It'll lessen after I've calmed down.

Why aren't you sheeping me - man who isn't advancing much worth yelling about?

(Because he's scum.)

Him not being aggressive is .. not a tell?

So the wording isn't right, but the reasoning is. Majiffy's not posting like town Majiffy.

Inner Town Circle: AP, RedCoyote, Thor, Zdenek, Toogeloo
Outer Town Circle: BBMolla, Aegor (candidate for inner), Bulbazak, Peregrine, dopog
Rather not lynch today: Nero Cain, Rubicon, Sven?, Vezok?

These people really need to step their game up or get dunked: DGBKid3, ActionDan, Alpazard, Majiffy
Lynch, die, scum: mastin2, GIF, pidgey, Sekai

Stop sucking at this game.

His townreads are solid. Their only fault is not being more trusting of the first three (maybe also dopog). It's only after that when they begin sucking.

Inner Town Circle: AP, Thor, Zdenek,

mastin2

, GIF,

pidgey

,

Sekai

Outer Town Circle: BBMolla (↑), Aegor, dopog, RedCoyote, Nero Cain, Toogeloo,

Majiffy

The Rest (Including not-so-town and loldidn'treads): Rubicon, Sven?, Vezok?, DGBKid3, ActionDan, Alpazard, Bulbazak, Peregrine

...

Vote: GuyInFreezer

.

[mastin2]

Ffery why is GIF town?

Very well could be scumbuddies.

[mastin2]

Why did you bold these names in GIFs llist?

Because they're absolutely horrible to have where they are, especially with no reasoning?

[mastin2]

1) GIF has provided reasoning for at least a few of these (if not in this exact post).

Not enough for them to be where they are, especially me.

2) So why didn't you bold Vezok (obvious town) and Bulbazak (probtown) who GIF managed to misplace.

Actually, I almost bolded Bulbazak, but then ultimately decided that he could legitimately have Bulb there. The reason isn't because his reads aren't the same as me. It's that the reads aren't where they should be from his content on them. His posting has been that I've been town (albeit for crappy reasons), so I can be town, but top-tiered town? Hell no, that's a faked read. Same for the others.

Somewhat explains the next one, too.

Molla is townreading you for no adequately explored reason but hes SO FREAKING TOWN according to you.

Yes, because I can understand Molla's townread on me. He hasn't made his reasoning explicit, but he doesn't need to in order for me to get it. GiF, on the other hand, hasn't done that.

[mastin2]

Mastin needs to be lynched fucking yesterday. I want her dead as soon as is physically possible. If anyone is a dayvig please take care of this, thank you. Unless ActionDan said something super awesome during the downtime he's probably scum. Majiffy is also a mild scum read for me. There was someone else who seemed scum in the lost posts but I'm gonna have to wait until those come back.

Question, since I don't actually know Rubicon that well. How fond of bussing is Rubicon?

[mastin2]

Your application for the Townblock has been received and is being rpocessed, thank you for your consideration!

I'm actually open to that, too, if I get a good answer on Rubicon. He basically named all of my strongest scumreads in his scum list, so either he's a powerbusser or my read on him and/or the others is wrong.

[mastin2]

Lol fuck you Ap you are probably fkn scum your case on me is "o he has easy targets" what the fuck is that shit and why are they easy no one is even moving their votes to them

Okay. pidgey's town. Abort pressure wagon plan.

The "i'm trying to play differently" could be reactionary to some of the players in this game who know mastin's meta pretty good.

Screw that. As scum, know what I do in order to try and manipulate players I know? Play to their expectations of a town-me. Experimenting with breaking from a scum-me never works. Obfuscating scumplay by acting differently is--by its very nature--going to backfire.

How do you feel about this part of Mastin's reply?

And if you think that being semi-serious in the RVS is a scumtell for me or for anyone, you can go straight to hell because that's a fundamental scumhunting technique that I've used even when I was a VI in 2009. It's carried over throughout my games over the years, and likely influenced other players to act similarly. (For instance, AP's posting in Anything Goes started out semi-seriously. He was not entirely serious...yet he was not entirely joking, either. It was a mid-way between the two, scumhunting in his own unique way.)

It raised a flag in pieguy's mind. I'm wondering if you see a similar issue.

It was the scummiest part of the reply. It was badly worded. I knew it was badly worded. I knew it was something people would scumread me for. But rather than being a case of "screw that, I'm posting it anyway", in this case it was just that I couldn't think of a non-scummy way to say it, but I needed to say it anyway. (...Okay. I guess that is sorta 'screw that, post regardless' anyway.) It hit a very sensitive note. I couldn't let it go unsaid, even though it would have been easier to have left it gone unsaid.

I certainly didn't call somebody obvious-town who had yet to post and then backpedal over the inherent seriousness of my statement.

There was no backpedaling. My stance never changed. Look at my early posting. And I dare you to tell me that it's either serious or joking. Knowing me as a person, not just some random girl. Tell me that I was not serious. Or tell me that I was completely, 100%, dead-and-entirely-serious on every single thing I said. Can't do it with a straight face? Yeah, because that actually WOULD be something completely and entirely not-me. (In hindsight, I shoulda done that, rather than the semi-serious-meant-to-look-serious. Woulda been entirely foreign. Ah, well. Next game.)

[mastin2]

How did you get to this?

Because, like AP, I read the wall in its entirety, and it comes from a town-RC, not a scum-RC. (Begrudgingly.) It's the same him from Walking Dead.

[mastin2]

Bite me

Alpa's gone from a mild townread into a full townread. Never lynch that.

GiF, why are you town reading me?

Because, more likely than not, he's scum?

Vote alpha with me. He's gonna either hilariously obvtown himself or hilariously obvscum himself.

Hey look, this is the exact sort of thing I post when Im scum (Antihero Mafia) and that I have used to find scum before.

Then stop scumreading me for having the same thoughts as you and start realizing that I wouldn't be doing this type of distancing act with a scumbuddy.

you didn't actually refute any of it. it's p obvious that's what he meant.

Refuting a point implies that the point was invalid. It wasn't. Rubicon, I refuted. RC, I refuted. Nero, AP, Thor, et all, I did not.

although now that you bring this up this seems like a case of townreading the person scumreading you so they back off

Though this is a tactic that I'll employ as scum, it's simply not the case. I already explained it, several times. It's not the act of them scumreading me that's making me townread them. If it was, Rubicon woulda been a townread. It's the WAY they went about having done so. AP did so in an INCREDIBLY town manner. Thor's handling was also quite town, as was Nero's. RC's way wasn't town, but the overall post he made

was

town. There are people townreading me that I am townreading; there are people scumreading me that I am scumreading. Because the two are entirely separate. This isn't some reverse-OMGUS. If you bothered looking at my posts, you'd see that.

this is too abrasive to be town mastin.

You already know this isn't a tell from me. Additionally, I already explained my feelings on the matter, in that RC hit some very sensitive notes that I was ticked off about. I also was legitimately ticked off at him--because he's a player I know and respect. Because I've been playing with RC since before he joined MS.net. (He was among the top EM players in our day. I was also fairly good.) Because he's someone I expected to be better, and then he presented those absolutely-crappy reasonings and scumreads.

Dead serious, my first impression of that post was that it came from scum, specifically because it wasn't as good as I was expecting from him. Specifically because the reasons were crap and the reads were mostly crap. So, yes, I'm "downplaying" RC's skill. Because RC is better than what he presented, there. As I said before, legitimately wondered what he was smoking in order to have created the train of thought that he did. I will not discredit RC as a player, because I respect his talent. I will discredit his reads, because they do not match the level that they should for him.

mastin is all about working and interacting with other people.

And I did so in that post. There's more than one way to work with others and interact with them.

not only that but she's implying RC is worse than a VI bc she's saying that was a scumhunting technique she used ever since she was a VI.

wat.
Seriously, this makes no sense.

not only that but she's being suspicious of RC without actually trying to figure anything out about his alignment and she instead writes him off as town.

Double-watt.

[4] Alpazard: GuyInFreezer, Thor665, PeregrineV, sekai no ki
[1] GuyInFreezer: mastin2
[4] Svenskt Stål: ActionDan, Alpazard, Bulbazak, Zdenek

Much as GiF may be scum, I got distracted by the shiny.
VOTE: Sven the Staller.

He notices that Mastin has a gut town read on someone who hasn't posted yet, has since not mentioned a read on Mastin, but has defended Mastin's reads, and he's been voting other people.
Basically, with the strength of read on Mastin that he should have picked up from the first observation, he should be exhibiting much more suspicion of Mastin than he is.

Frankly I think this is because he's buddies with Mastin and doesn't want to bus, but it's scummy in it's own right.

Um, Z, if you think I'm scum, you go for me, first.

Thirty pages and not one hint of game-decimating paranoia.

Umm...read his posts again? They're filled to the brim with paranoia. Okay, so maybe not game-decimating paranoia. But there's paranoia present. For instance, his read of me. Depending on your viewpoint, either really-paranoid of me being scum, or slightly-paranoid of me actually being town, but either way you slice it, still paranoia.

Thirty pages and not one hint of game-decimating paranoia.

Very intentional.

Now you're just taunting me. >_<

(:P)

Every time someone talked about wagoning the Alpaca, mastin would go out of her way to say "let me get back to you about them [the Alpaca]".

And after doing that multiple times, she just apparently decided she didn't care and is now calling them dead null.

Um, actually, I already was calling them a mild townread. Now, they're a serious townread.

Read the last ten pages. Was bored.

Conveniently enough, being bored is one of the motivating factors of me progressively reverting back into my normal self. The post where I explained it fully is currently lost, but basically: while I'm enjoying a LOT of the new stuff, and like the feeling it's given (people are actually treating me like a normal player, rather than some higher-tier master), it's becoming a bit boring to do, and I'm considering adding life to my game.

In particular, there's one thing I could do to instantly become obvtown, and I've been holding back from having done so.

[mastin2]

The same can be said about Mastin and I. Are we scumbuddies together?

Weeeeeeeelll......

Mostly the last sentence.

Umm...just need to say, I said "obvtown", not some other word you

may

be thinking about, AP.

And frustrating me this game.

Well, you frustrate ME to no end, so it's about time for some revenge......
(But in all seriousness, I'm progressively going to be less frustrating this game.)

help me understand your actions, thats all, your activity and some of your posts i really like, but then you make leaps i dont uderstand that has me hesitant,

i just want to understand

Oi!

This is MY scum tactic! Don't go stealing it, Sven!
(Read that post. Imagine it being written by me. Try figuring out my alignment from it. It theoretically could come from a town-me, but is basically a signature scum move of mine.)

(Page 33 = Sven and sekai are scum together, by the way.)

I

really

want you to die.

Well, I'm already undead, so, wish granted.

so your read on him was entirely BOP?

My gut-reaction-read? Yes.

how in any way was this post intended to tell him to step it up, or reaching out to him to fix said read?

Admittedly, was probably not worded as well as it needed to be, because it was emotionally charged and frustrated.

this also makes it so you don't actually have to respond to anything he's saying which allows you to just sit there and avoid having to take heat for doing anything

Except I responded to everything?

except this means fuck all bc he came up with this AFTER he found out I didn't like it. it seems like an excuse he just made up so he could justify it to me later

If you're scum (you are), congratulations, pie. You're playing to your wincon spectacularly, because you're ticking me off. Severely. I told you not to be doubtful of your abilities. But IF (BIG FREAKIN'

IF

) you were town, you've way. WAY. Overshot it. Into arrogance. If you think. seriously, legitimately. think. That I made that up. in specific response to you. That you think it was an excuse. That you think I was lying. That you think I was giving you so much as a second of thought when typing that. There was none. NONE. And you damn-well know it.


Side-note. But I'm really freakin' sick of people reading me from one or two games of one alignment and assuming that's a trend across all of my games as that alignment. If you read the ACTUAL game rather than reading the game through the lens of previous games, my alignment becomes clear every single time. People make the mistake of townreading me when I'm scum and manipulating my meta. (AP's right. I am fully self-aware of my own trends as both alignments and capable of utterly destroying and/or reversing them.) People frustratingly scumread me when I'm town because I happen to be doing something that resembles one game vaguely in some manner that never crossed my mind--or did, but I said "screw it" and went with it anyway.

I wrote all kinds of guides on it, and all of them say the same dang thing: that's how to meta not just me, but any player, WRONG. Meta's a means to an end. To understand the players. But if you arbitrarily assign alignments to a player off of their past games, you're not reading the current game. You're reading the past games and superimposing them on top of the current game, biasing your read. Read the current game, the current players, the current mindset, the current posting, and use meta only as a means of having some sort of baseline for that mindset.

[5] Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer

, Thor665,

sekai no ki

, Toogeloo, AngryPidgeon
[5] Svenskt Stål: ActionDan, Alpazard, Mastin2, PeregrineV, Bulbazak

The only possible scum name I see on Sven is Dan. All others are town. In constrast, the Apla wagon has both GiF and sekai on it. It is scum-driven.

/34.

[mastin2]

[quote="In post 857, sekai no ki"ffery told everyone what I didn't like before mastin said anything about it.[/quote] Yet you're claiming that there's no way I could have thought it worth commenting on without that. Her post was just the first to bring it up.

and even then she didn't explain shit and just said "herp derp that was the scummiest part of the reply. oh well"

I did anything but that. I explained everything about it, in as much detail as there is. Like, I could put more reasons in, but they'd be BS. I spoke my heart.

I pegged the fuck out of mastin for this same thing (abrasiveness/forcefulness) before.

And I already know it's not a tell, and swear that you've seen it from a town me, too.

^ #scumposting

Indeed. If you don't think the Sven wagon has potential, we can always switch to making a sekai wagon.

Mastin why are you to en reading this so much. Are you REALLY sure about this one?

Not Mastin-gambit sure, but pretty dang close to it.

DGB on a scale of yes to very yes how scummy is mastin.

Scummy but not scum, soooooo, yes.

Would you believe me if I told you I haven't read any of mastin's posts and I'm just faking having an opinion?

>_<
(Yes. I would.)

[mastin2]

Happy RL-scumday, Bulb!

And mastin outs sven as her alt.

Technically, it'd be Sven outing himself as my alt.

But are you seriously calling notsci town
Even after all the scumclaim he made
Just because of the shoddy "vca without flip"
You're ignoring all the scum-notsci reaction

Except his reaction looked incredibly town?

I have this feeling that both Alpa and Vezok are town, their wagons having formed to make us forget about wagoning actual scum. :/

I think you may be scum, too.

Vezok is town. He's totally not self-conscious. That's not scum.

Much to his credit, he's reading AngryPigeon correctly as scum.

Where'd you get your information from, HUH?
You think that you can front when revelation comes?
Yaaaa, you can't front on that.

So whatcha whatcha whatcha want?

Amazing how much an avatar can have a subconscious influence. If you were using your old avatar, this and the following might seem odd to me. With your new avatar, it somehow seems natural.

[mastin2]

Mastin
Have you played with town notsci before

Yes. Several times. Theatre Mafia among them. Which was an Alp game.

dopog is ridiculously town. I think I can actually explain it now, but I'm wondering if I even need to, since it's kinda self-evident why in his posting.

Zdenek townread has waned, too, since DGB's right, "lol, you failed at reading me this one time in this one game" is absolutely an awful response.

UNVOTE: Vezok; VOTE: DGB

If you come to battle bring a shotgun

Yeah, but shotguns are a weapon for killing zombies, which is what DGB is.

[mastin2]

So where exactly did notsci looked town in this game?

In reaction to you. Additionally, posting minorly leans that way.

Vezok who RC, aside from Mastin, argues most strongly against in his posts appears highest in list before we get to the lurkers. The only particular thing he had a problem with regarding Sven seems to be that Sven gave him a town lean in one post and then said that no one should be giving those a players a town lean. Well okay, it's not a lie, but its pretty clear that Sven just went to Activity Overview and made a list of low posters - it's thoughtless, but I don't see enough scum intent there to justify RC's stance. As far as I can tell his desire to lynch me is an attempt to buddy with Toogeloo, but I'm biased. He doesn't give any reason to read dopog as scum, so I assume that has to do with lolzy connections with Mastin. As far as his read on Mastin goes, the fact that it lacks any subtlety probably means that it's bs.

Indeed. If anyone actually bought the BS in his post, I'll bother addressing it. But I just went through this BS with sekai. I'm not going to go through it again with RC.

[mastin2]

ill call you sabrina from now on

That's the name of one of my closest friends.

Can we just flashwagon sekai now? Its like half the thread has realized shes scum but would feel bad about actually lynching her because shes ffery.

Sure thing, if the Sven wagon has fallen apart. Basically,

Personally, I still want to get Sven lynched, but if a Majiffy or Sekai wagon started really building up, I'd switch in a heartbeat.

What does bs stands for?

Baby Spice.

IDK, my overall feel from his wall is that he's intent on tunneling on mastin and his other scumreads are less interesting to him. He definitely prodded Sven a bit (even if he didn't outright call him scum). I don't really see where his read on you is coming from and iirc dopog was also not explained that well. But neither was the Vezok read?

I see why this looks scummy to you (and I -could- see this coming from scum), but I really don't think its as bad as you are saying?

I see someone tunneling on mastin and catching up on posts without really having an agenda in mind (other than the tunnel on mastin). Him being behind and just focusing mastin as an easy way to be involved could be a scum thing, but I could also see this being from town.

You know, everything you're saying here basically can be summed up as "Should be a scumread, because that's what the evidence suggests, but for whatever reason, isn't".

What's your current reads on major wagons?
{Vezok, Sven, Alpa}

Town Scum Town.

In other news: PeregrineV

might

be scum.

Ok caught up.

If this were true, why no posting leading up to getting caught up? And no posting right then after having got caught up? Was there nothing interesting to read since he fell behind?

Is Aegor still town?

Yes.

Would both of you support an Action Dan being eaten plan?

Yep!

If alpaca flips town, I'm policy lynching GIF tomorrow.

Why do tomorrow what you can do today?

Skimming, but Alpa's still looking ridiculously town in response to the wagon on them.

So Alpazard is probably town.

Indeed.

I'm not actually a vig btw

Scumclaim, 'cause

every

town player is a vig.

[7] Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer

, Thor665,

sekai no ki

, Toogeloo, SweatingChessball3, Aegor, AngryPidgeon

Not liking this wagon. I mean. It's made up of townreads aside from two names. So I really shouldn't have an issue with it. But I'm really, REALLY not liking this wagon, at all.

[8] PeregrineV: dopog, BBMolla, SC3, Alpa,

GiF

, Zdenek, pidgey, Aegor
^The fact that GiF sheeps the person he was previously scumreading should itself be a warning sign. Still don't like this wagon, though; it's a quick wagon, with no reasoning, and mostly lesser reads.

Side-note. The only thing freaking me out about Bulbazak is exactly how in-line his thoughts are with mine. He's ridiculously town aside from that single piece of paranoia.

Don't worry about Aegor, hes the scum that will sneak by to D3 or so before people realize hes just hovering around the thread w/o actually doing anything.

Wasn't that BBMolla?

God knows what Peregrine is

> Some Humans have the saying, "God is on our side."
> If that were true, then God would be aiding them.
> Humans are the enemies of zombies.
> Thus, God is the enemy of zombies.
> Thus, invoking Him is a scumclaim.

Reminder: ffery is scum.

Indeed.

/skimmed, but caught up.

[mastin2]

Oh right Majiffy is scum in this game.

For the fact, yes.

We're going to

VOTE: Vezok

Consensus-wise we are pretty much equally happy with a PV lynch.

Sekai remains opportunistic scum.

I'll claim to stop this bullshit wagon on me.
I'm the female boomer. Instead of sending 3 people to the list I can send only one. There may be more people that have my role.

For those not following along at home, this is conftown. It's the same role mechanic from Walking Dead: influencing the zombie horde, to 'vig' a player. And as he himself stated, it's not a simple possibility of there being more than one; it's a probability.

Rubicon remains a scumread.

WTF is Pronoun: He under my avatar

Partially my doing. Go to site ideas and read topic "Other" Gender Option. Gender turned into pronoun, since it's more effective.

Too many people are getting cleared for flavor/softclaims and my reads are becoming a mess.

That's an issue with Venmar games, AP. The scumteam had the same problem in Walking Dead: too many players becoming conftown because of their roles. I considered not joining this game for exactly that reason, in fact: I knew this game was likely to have a similar problem, and if I rolled scum, I'd be doing the exact same ranting I did last game. But I decided I'd roll the die, hope to land town, and trust that Venmar wouldn't actually let that happen.

By the way, my list would be (pick three):
Dan, Sekai, GiF, Jiffy, Sven, Rubicon. In approximately that order.

Of course, we could flashwagon sekai because PV just obvtownned himself and the wagon on him is pretty bad.

VOTE: sekai no ki.

[mastin2]

Or flashwagon Dan, since he's appearing in everyone's vig-lists but for some reason not lynch-lists.

[mastin2]

Or flashwagon Dan, since he's appearing in everyone's vig-lists but for some reason not lynch-lists.

AP, which do you think?

Sekai, or Dan?

Those should be our two options, but we can't divide ourselves between them; we have to settle on one right now. Sekai's a stronger scumread, but resistance to the lynch would likely also be stronger. Dan's a much weaker scumread across the board, but IS a scumread across the majority OF the board.

[mastin2]

VOTE: Dan

Oh. Well, then.

VOTE: Action Dan.

[mastin2]

Go ahead and flashwagon me. There were a couple reasons why I didn't put a vote down right away after unvoting Vezok and one of those reasons was to see who (besides AP) would show some appetite for lynching us if the PV wagon wasn't nudged.

ITT, we learn that sekai's a goon and Dan's a mafia PR.

[mastin2]

Bulba tell me what else I am being called so you can get comf town status.
It starts with H.

You do not start with the letter H unless there are multiples of the same infected

Urgh, mastin what do you think of this post?

Well, vezok explicitly said that multiples of his role could exist, and I buy that. I also think that Dan could have a scum equivalent power, and that special infected is his fakeclaim, thus, he can post something like this. Bluntly, I see it as nullscum. It can come from town, but also easily scum, and in fact I think it is more likely to come from scum.

Also, thoughts on Thor being scum-distancing-Dan? Because Thor's had Dan as scum, yet now that we're flashwagoning him, is clinging onto the dead PV wagon.

[mastin2]

Given that there could be an equivalent fakeclaim, why would vezok's claim be accepted while Dan's is not?

Because Vezok's a townread and Dan's a scumread?

(Also, Vezok claimed first.)

No, they clarified that Vezok and Dan are claiming different things.

Where? I didn't see that.

[mastin2]

Oh. Well, then. Dan's probably town.

VOTE: sekai no ki.

[mastin2]

VOTE: SweatingChessball

Even if they are scum, AP, a wagon isn't happening. They're not a scumread of mine, either. They haven't done much to keep a townread, either, but they're still a decent townread overall of mine, sooooooooo, talk to me on D2 about it.

[mastin2]

Okay, talk to me now about it. Just don't expect the talk about it to actually reach me UNTIL D2, where your continued talks about it can be more convincing.

[mastin2]

Mastin, Sekai isnt getting lynched Today. Even less so than DGB.

And why the heck not? There's plenty of people scumreading them. Throw in sheepers, along with maybe a busser or two (especially if a scum PR is among the counterwagons), and it's viable.

[mastin2]

P-edit: I've tried, its not happening.

Try again. Last time, you were doing it alone, and there were people still clinging to dead wagons unlikely to have gone through, well away from deadline. Now, you have me, people are looking for lynches that will go through, and are sick of the day having gone on for as long as it has. There's enough support. You'll still get some clinging to wagons that won't go through, but they'll be swayed eventually. All it requires is not getting distracted by some other flashy wagon, and to stay on it for a while. You gave up on sekai in less than 24 hours. Give it that long.

[mastin2]

This is the game you've chosen for subverting your scummeta isnt it.

Yes, but I'm doing it with a town role PM.

How does that make any sense? What have SCB done to keep a townread at all?

What that means is that SCB's content early-game was strongly town, but recently is now only weakly vaguely town. The read's degenerated to be more minor, but still exists.

Rubicon is also a solid option

A much better example than Rubicon.

1) mastin has played intentionally scummy which makes it difficult to get an RVS read on her and allows her to coast to later in the Day on a flimsy excuse. This could be from town, but its anti-town if so since mastin has obfuscated reads on the slot.

You're not thinking bigger-picture, AP. The literal content I provided early-game was in fact intentionally scummy at a glance. But if you look at the mindset, it becomes much easier to see the town-me in there. Especially considering how I've been progressively cleaning up my act.

2) There are plenty of people scumreading mastin.

Which you know would never actually happen if I was scum.

3) The posts are all fairly forgettable and nothing rings extremely genuine (could definitely be scum).

? They've been plenty memorable.

4) Connections. Mastin's hollow assertions and reads will be a goldmine if she flips scum.

Hollow assertions? I've been going out of my way to try and give details! Also, ask yourself what connections you gain from my townflip. Answer: not very many; all you get is my D1 scumreads which are likely not anywhere close to perfect.

5) Mastin is making no effort to compromise this game which makes her dead weight.

WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK MY POSTS HAVE BEEN DOING?!? Sekai. GiF. Dan. Sven. Jiffy. Rubicon. Heck, even PV! I've been compromising on all of them. I've been considering them, working with you on them. I'm even open to RC, and DCB. That's anything BUT unwilling to compromise; you could make a better case for me being scum on me having done nothing BUT compromising.

[mastin2]

Bulbazak is so town, every time someone votes him, I cough up blood.

As grand as that vote (I mean ffery's heart really isn't into her scumgame right now and its obvious), I don't think we can get enough people to vote her?

You could if you stopped your damn scumread of me.

[mastin2]

Mastin, why do you still have a scum read on Rubicon?

Because he's been posting like scum? I explained the scumread a little bit already, but I don't have the time to explain in full right now.

[mastin2]

For me, it's the complete lack of attention to key details in the game thread as the last minute wagons have risen and fallen. Someone who's town should not be missing the stuff Mastin has glossed over.

Except the only detail I missed was something easy to have misread, and me being largely skimming, and me also being typing as others are posting and ignoring pedits. Otherwise, I've addressed every detail I've deemed relevant.

[mastin2]

Keep calm and lynch mastin.

I only actually have 3 scumreads and I hope to have even less before the end of the Day. Im waffling on Thor in order to make him look sketchy when I end up getting lynched and flipping mafia.

:thumbs up:

AP, your scumreads on sekai and myself are incompatible. The latter is correct. That's how I read the post, too. It's basically a scumclaim from sekai. So why the heck are you wagoning me when you yourself SAID that we don't share the same alignment? If you think sekai's scum and are suspicious of me being scum and recognize that both aren't true, analyze which of them is stronger, dang it. And you know it's that sekai's scum, because you also know that I'm town.

[mastin2]

This was BS since Mastin had a town read on Thor and Peregrine - the two people who joined the Alpa wagon (aside from GiF who was on it before.)

BS implies it was something I was faking. It was called a random note because it was exactly that: a random thought I had. Random thoughts? Are rarely if ever backed up by me actually checking the facts to see if they're true. In that case, you're right; it wasn't true, at that time. But if you look at the later Alpa wagon's size, it very, VERY easily could (and probably is--I need to double-check that to be sure) be true.

[mastin2]

Misrep/lie.

Actually, neither. Misremember. I thought sekai was among the names you listed in "is town after Mastin flips scum" list. (Which you DID make.) I just checked, and it turns out you're right, they're not in that list. My bad.

...But if you think I'm scum bussing, you might as well sheep me. A scum lynch is a scum lynch, right?

[mastin2]

Sven and Alpaca are both probtown after a mastin scumflip though.

(The post I was thinking of.)

[mastin2]

Did my research.

[2]

Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer, Bulbazak

[4]

Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer, Thor665, PeregrineV, sekai no ki

[5]

Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer, Thor665, sekai no ki, Toogeloo, AngryPidgeon

[5]

Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer, Thor665, sekai no ki, Toogeloo, SweatingChessball3

[7]

Alpazard:

GuyInFreezer, Thor665, sekai no ki, Toogeloo, SweatingChessball3, Aegor, AngryPidgeon

All the Alpa wagoners.

GiF, (Bulb), Thor, PV, sekai, Toogeloo, AP, SCB3, and Aegor. All members of the wagon at one point.

Sekai is scum who hopped onto the wagon. Otherwise, my statement was in fact wrong.

[mastin2]

I didn't like how in her one catchup post she said our reaction was town but didn't actually quote any of our posts.

Nobody asked. Your iso's short enough that I can pull 'em up in a bit. (Actually explaining them will take longer, though.)

[mastin2]

Bite me

also, I'm not Sakura.

aka that's the biggest pile of bullshit I've ever heard regarding how to read me

pedit-

Too bad

(This one, not as much as most I'm quoting, but still to some extent.)

You all are so full of fucking shit

jesus fucking christ

See, it's shit like this that makes me want to selfhammer because fuck the rest of you.

But I wouldn't do that to pitoli.

So instead I'm going to sit here ranting about how you're all so full of shit for the worst wagon of the decade

Special seat for those asking for a premature claim, however.

pedit-

Alpa is racking up votes because people are stupid as fuck

That being said I'd love a game to stick it to GIF who says he can read me by my tone

Pedit-

See, I'd be helpful, but I'm more in the I-can't-believe-the-wagon-on-me phase.

A bit pissed seeing as people are asking for a claim and both of us have to catch up to give reads and etc but what's the point if we're going to be lynched anyways? You guys think you're god-walking, you should be fine without us!

Look at scum me like EVERYWHERE

When I'm about to be lynched I either get in an adhom tunnelwar or I shut up and lurk harder

Town me kicks and flails and screams til you realize I'm town

pedit-

I was going to be getting back into it today then I saw this bullshit wagon and am more worried about averting it on the only fucking person I know to be town than finding scum

PEdit2- fucking lol

Pedit3- I'm like 95% sure. I occasionally get fatalistic as town but most of the time when I'm getting wagoned as scum I either freak out panicky or lurk. I don't thrash around.

He's too busy tunneling me to give a fuck

GIF you're so full of shit

I really fucking hope you're town so I can link this game every time you claim to be able to read me

And don't give me that 'oh he's not giving reads it's a scumclaim" because you and I both know that everyone would ignore them anyways

All of these? Town reaction posts. Now, if you want me to additionally quote other town posts, there's more than just the reaction for why you're town, but the reactions here are in fact town.

[mastin2]

Your attempts to distance from RC were pretty good.

I've distanced from RC, alright, but I'm still convinced we share the same alignment. Albeit only weakly. He's a townread. Not much of one. I could be swayed fairly easily into reading him as scum. But he's never dropped below the null-line.

I'm not sure what your angle has been this game, you might be a godfather or something?

If I were a scum godfather, you can bet your ass the scum would be trying to save me. Not condemn me. Mastin? Strong scum player. Godfather-Mastin? Dear god, invincible scum player because THE largest downfall of a scuMastin is PR claims that condemn me. No, I'm town.

Stop being an idiot, AP. You've entered into confbias mode over literally nothing. Step back. Breathe. Reevaluate without that bias. Reads to evidence, not evidence to reads. And look again. I'm town. Sekai's not.

[mastin2]

FTR, quoting Alpaca's ISO and saying that all the posts in it are all town does not make your rolecard any more mafia aligned.

True, but it does help illustrate why Alpa's not mafia, either. (Which you think anyway for some strange reason, in spite of the fact that a scuMastin's attitude towards Alpa is classical scuMastin attitude towards a scumbuddy.)

[mastin2]

Mastin, what similarities are you seeing between RC in this game and Walking Dead?

Thought I already explained it. If not, then I'll have to do so later.

f I were a scum godfather, you can bet your ass the scum would be trying to save me. Not condemn me.

Oh, so you ARE being bussed? Sekai and ... Majiffy?

Yes. You can help me vote either of them. They've both been scumreads of mine since the beginning.

[mastin2]

Majiffy is the only possible scum of the early competing wagons.

Well, then, you should be more than happy to let me bus my scumbuddy, now, shouldn't you?

[mastin2]

Seriously, AP.
THINK.
THINGS.
THROUGH.

All of my recent scumgames? I half-assed. Lurked. Intentionally gave the town nothing to work with. Manipulated subtly. This...isn't that. Why wouldn't I do that if I was scum? For the heck of it? Know what another fundamental part of my scum meta is? Sticking to what works, in spite of it having been identified as part of my scum meta. If someone calls me out on it, they can't actually get me lynched on it. (At least, not this early.) Yet I'm not doing that. I'm being active, giving a good 90-95%, and making my thoughts as crystal clear as can be. No barriers. Just transparency.

You're seeing the quirk I had in my posting as being a scum tactic used to obfuscate people's reads on me. Yet you damn-well KNOW that I wouldn't do that as scum. You KNOW that it's just something I'd randomly do as town. You KNOW that there's no scum motive for it and plenty of town motive given recent events around me. You KNOW that I do things as town just for the heck of doing them, and this was just the latest game in my long line of games where I chose to do it. Just in this game, of me being extra-wordy, rather than like in Gundamn, having been succinct. This is just something that I DO, and you know it, dang it.

STOP. CONFBIASING. AND ACTUALLY LISTEN TO WHAT I'M SAYING.

[mastin2]

[7] Mastin2: Nero Cain, sekai no ki, AngryPidgeon, Majiffy, ActionDan, Aegor, Rubicon

Sekai's scum. Jiffy's scum. Rubicon's scum.

DGB's right.
This. is. a. scum. driven. wagon.

And you dang-well KNOW it is. You've even admitted it! That sekai and Jiffy are scum. You know they're scum. Which is simpler?
That in spite of my policy on not-bussing, my scumbuddies decided to entirely discard it and wagon me, when I'm an incredibly strong scum player...
...Or that I'm town and they're scum pushing a mislynch?

USE. YOUR. GOD. DAMNED. REASONING.

[mastin2]

You said that it's the same, but not why.

Alright. Outta time (actually, 15 minutes past out of time), so not now, but later, will try.

[mastin2]

You said that it's the same, but not why.

Alright. Outta time (actually, 15 minutes past out of time), so not now, but later, will try.

Do note, though, that the RC read is weak. There's a resemblance that makes me think town, but it's not such a strong read as to be absolute.

[mastin2]

Okay.

Then we should lynch me. Nero is a complete shot in the dark given what's in the game thread.

My flip will resolve a ton of misconceptions.

My ONLY concern about flipping town today or tonight is worry that town dumbasses will lynch GiF tomorrow.

UNVOTE

IF SEKAI WERE TOWN, THIS WOULD BE BACKED UP WITH A SELF-VOTE.

[mastin2]

^You want scum manipulating?
THAT post by sekai is scum manipulating.

Get your head out of your ass, AP.

[mastin2]

^You want scum manipulating?
THAT post by sekai is scum manipulating.

Get your head out of your ass, AP.

Yes, no shit, she starts a wagon on you and then tries to dismantle it. Scum. With you. GG.

AP.
STOP BEING A MORON.

You KNOW me. You KNOW this isn't my scumgame. You KNOW that sekai's being highly manipulative. So help me lynch them, dammit. Like I said...get. your. head. out. of. your. ass.

If you stepped back.
STEPPED. BACK. FOR. ONE. FREAKIN'. SECOND.
JUST ONE.

And read the damn things you were posting. Read what you're saying. Thought of the narrative it's telling. YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO TELL HOW FULL OF SHIT YOU'VE LET YOURSELF BECOME. Sekai is scum. I am not. There's no distancing. Just sekai scumposting and you not listening. Refusing. Absolutely stubbornly rejecting the notion of hearing. That I'm town. So sheep me, dammit!

WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON.

My best MS buddy is derp-mislynching me when he himself thinks who I'm voting (sekai) is scum. More or less sums things up perfectly.

I feel like Im beating my head against a brick wall.

AND WHAT DO YOU THINK I FEEL LIKE?!?

[mastin2]

For the past 5 hours, I've been pretty happily settling on a mastin2/sekai/majiffy/you/RC scumteam and have been confbiasing about it a little.

A little?
A LITTLE?!?
YOU CALL THIS A LITTLE?!?

Your head's so far up your ass it's back up to being on your neck.

I've in general felt pretty damn lost in this game.

THEN TRUST ME TO BE TOWN AND LYNCH SEKAI.

I think I feel pretty good about my last list of Don't lynch / rather not lynch people.

And with one or two exceptions, pretty much everyone on your list I agree with, AP. YOU. ARE. IGNORING. OUR. READS. BEING. SIMILAR. YOU ARE STUBBORNLY REFUSING TO SO MUCH AS THINK THAT I COULD BE TOWN RIGHT NOW.

I'm not 100% sure mastin will flip scum, but there is a shot.

LISTEN TO THIS, AP. There's a shot I'm scum. NO FUCKING SHIT, SHERLOCK. Of course there is. But it's just that. A damn shot. STOP. BEING. AN. IDIOT. AND.

LISTEN

!

In fact, I'm pretty stunned that mastin is so opposed to being lynched when I know town mastin will often admit fault.

IF THERE WERE FAULT TO BE HAD. There is none. I've explained where I've come from. I've explained my actions. In great detail. You're rejecting all of that.

I think mastin is the

correct

lynch, even if town which I have made clear. That mastin has ignored that part of my platform makes me feel even better about the lynch.

THERE. IS. LITERALLY.

NOTHING

. GAINED. BY. LYNCHING. A. TOWN. ME. That you ignored MY response to your point is proof of how blind you're being. I said it before. All you gain from lynching a town me? Is my D1 scumreads. Which are of questionable accuracy.

TELL ME I'M WRONG.

The entirety.
ENTIRETY.
Of the gain from lynching me.

RELIES ON ME FLIPPING SOMETHING I WON'T.

Sekai is probscum for being upset at me and then dropping it regularly and picking it up again later.

SO HELP ME LYNCH THEM.

I feel like most of the wagons have been on town today which is why the game has been derping around.

And yet? YOU'RE SCUMREADING ME FOR HAVING THOUGHT THIS SAME THING AND TOLD YOU IT. I told you Vezok was town. Thought PV was town. Thought Alp was town. WE'RE THINKING THE SAME DAMN THINGS, DAMMIT. And you're ignoring that. In favor of confbias.

[mastin2]

1. Majiffy
^Scum. I already explained the basics behind it, but basically, Majiffy's posting here is entirely scum-oriented. The best of his posting is "meh", when almost all the rest of it is scun. He puts on a good act, but this is his scumplay.

2. Toogeloo/Newplayer
^I'll need more content before this solidifies, but I remember Toog being fairly town, so a decent townread. Basically, posting seems fairly genuine and looks oriented on scumhunting, rather than manipulating.

3. Sekai no Ki (Fferyllt/Pieguyn Hydra)
^Scum, through-and-through. I've been pounding this one in, but the simplest way of saying it is that their entire posting has zero scumhunting in it, and is entirely focused on manipulating things. They're survivalistic and using basically every trick in the scumbag's handbook.

4. SweatingChessball (DrippingGoofball/Chesskid3 Hydra)
^Also a decent townread. Though they haven't been posting as much as I'd prefer, and their content as of recently has been slightly lackluster, they're still a fairly decent townread, because their thoughts seem to be coming from a town player. Both of them have stances that are easy to see and relate to. Basically, just by extrapolating their posting, you can see that they're town; they've got a clear trajectory that is easily followed, and I can easily understand what gives them their reads.

5. PeregrineV
^Basically conftown thanks to his reaction to being wagoned.

6. RedCoyote
^A minor townread. His posting looks to be his Walking Dead self, in that I can see him thinking those things as town and it has the same basic tone. However, this is not a strong read, because RC's content is absolute crap and he's basically been a hardcore lurker--even active-lurking, because his massive walls? The content in them is mostly useless, and disjointed from his reads.

8. Alpazard (Pitoli/NotScience Hydra)
^Strongish townread. I really liked their reaction to pressure, but beyond that, they've got some good posting which looks to be unique. They strongly look like town who's thinking things through, and coming up with their own reads and reasoning. I've shown some of this, but not all of it.

9. Aegor
^Solid townread, but admittedly a bit of a stale one. Aegor's posting strongly looks town overall, coming from a town mindset. There are parts of the game where when I see his posting, I think "meh". But as a counterpart to Majiffy, that's the WORST in his posting; there are other times where I can clearly see the town in his posting.

10. GuyInFreezer
^Also a decent scumread. Basically, GiF's posting, pure and simple, looks like it comes from a scum mindset. It doesn't look like he's analyzing things. It doesn't look like he's scumhunting. It looks like he already knows the answers, and is posting around that. His reads make no sense from town, either; they use bad reasoning and all-in-all, he comes across as being highly fake.

11. Bulbazak
^One of my strongest townreads. Bulbazak's posting is basically pure town essence. His thoughts line up nearly perfectly with my own. His reasoning, I can see. His read progression and evolution is natural, and not forced. He's analyzing. He's scumhunting. He's not manipulating players; he's trying to figure things out. Add in his early (but highly genuine) AtE, and you've got a solid town player.

12. Thor665
^Probably town. I've really liked Thor's posting overall, but like several others, this is mostly from the beginning. His recent posting is more null, but the only player I can see him as being scum with is apparently town, and even then, that was just a brief theory. His reasoning, I can follow. I can see where he gets his stances from, and actually agree with a fair bit. Though I'm admittedly not good at reading Thor, I do believe that's still a strong indicator of him being town.

13. Svenskt Stål
^Weaker scumread. Sven's largely dropped off my radar. He's been lurking. His earlier posting was bad, and his best posting has been highly "meh". His stances make no sense, and overall, he reads as being highly survivalistic, and also manipulative. However, I CAN see him as being town. Especially given my much stronger scumreads.

14. Rubicon
^Decent scumread, but near the bottom of my list. Rubicon's posting has all been awful. It's just been entirely anti-town, without a shred of pro-town thought. The closest he came to having pro-town content is the post where he basically called most of my suspects scum, and that's another reason I've doubted my scumread on him, since him being scum and me being right about others being scum would require him basically turbo-bussing. HOWEVER, his content since then has gone back to being lurking pieces of trash, not productive, and basically, not town.

15. ActionDan
^Though he was a minor scumread of mine, his claim apparently means he's town, soyeah.

16. Vezokpiraka
^Even without the claim, he was a strong townread. With it, he's conftown.

17. BBMolla
^Identical to Vezok, albeit slightly weaker on both accounts. BBMolla is town.

18. Pidgey
^Nulltown. Pidgey's posting has seemed town at points, but it's entirely lacking, overall, and he has a lot of bad interactions.

19. AngryPidgeon
^Frustratingly, town. This is a town-AP, through-and-through.

20. dopog
^Also town. I've REALLY liked dopog's posting this game. It's unique, it's original, it strongly looks like town forming their own opinion and analyzing things, rather than scum trying to manipulate.

21. Nero Cain
^Though he's gone V/LA, the content Nero's posted has seemed solidly town. So, overall a decent townread, albeit not a strong one. When he returns, I'm fully confident he'll obvtown up in his own unique way.

22. Zdenek
^Among my strongest townreads. Zdenek's posting this game has been right on the money. His thoughts are easy to follow and raise REALLY good points, a lot of which I've agreed with. And even the ones I didn't, I could understand where he came from. He's strongly analyzing things and trying to figure them out, working with others, rather than manipulating them. Bluntly, the only concern I could have about him is that I don't remember a town him having been this competent. That a "too townie to be town" fallacy is literally the only way he's not town should give you a good idea of just how strongly town he is.

[mastin2]

You know damn well it would be silly to never switch up your scumgame. I think you distancing from a buddy or 2 is not so fucking bizarre/unexpected that Im dumb for suspecting it.

In

principle

, yes. But you're ignoring literally everything else (AMONG THEM CONTEXT AND THE CIRCUMSTANCES) in order to push that. Theoretically, sure. In practice, heck no, and you should dang-well know it.

She could still be town and you scum if I AM wrong about thw 2 of you, so?

BUT WHY NOT THE OTHER WAY? Why can't I be town and her, scum?

You haven't posted anything outrageously town.

LIKE HELL I HAVEN'T. It's right there in front of you. YOU'RE NOT LOOKING AT IT.

[mastin2]

Like, seriously, AP.
ISO ME, DAMMIT.

It's right there. That town. YOU'RE NOT SEEING IT BECAUSE YOU DON'T

WANT

TO SEE IT.

Alternatively, look at our similar reads. WHY DO YOU THINK THEY'RE SO SIMILAR? Because I'm scum buddying you? FUCK no. You KNOW better than that. You know me, and that I wouldn't do that. (That's for when we're both scum. ) THE. STARS. HAD. ALIGNED. WITH. YOU. AND. I. And you're refusing to listen to their signs.

[mastin2]

mastin.

I will vote for the player you want me to vote for.

Just name that player.

Well, if I had my way? Sekai.
But my RC townread isn't strong at all. Can you present your reasoning on him? 'Cause he's basically nulltown to me at this point, and there's a lot of players I think are town supporting it, including you.

How you can call me survivalistic given the crap that YOU are pulling is beyond me.

Our posting is NOTHING alike. You've been survivalistic whole game. I'm not trying to survive; I'm trying to lynch scum. And so close to having a scum lynch, only to have it divert onto town?

So help me god if mastin doesnt vote RC in his next post I am going to slap someone.

Strongly considering it.

GiF and Sven do taint the wagon, though.

Like, almost everyone is a town read, which sure i mean statistically speaking i dont think she'd hive us half and half town and scum.

But like, its just words saying stuff but not really any context, like take a look at her SCB: "Also a decent townread. Though they haven't been posting as much as I'd prefer, and their content as of recently has been slightly lackluster, they're still a fairly decent townread, because their thoughts seem to be coming from a town player. Both of them have stances that are easy to see and relate to. Basically, just by extrapolating their posting, you can see that they're town; they've got a clear trajectory that is easily followed, and I can easily understand what gives them their reads."

Like ok, i can take that, but that's mostly everyone. There's nothing like, "i think you are scum because you did exactly this post saying this thing". Also the scum reads seem a little safe.

(Pidgey's town, though. This is a town line of thought, even if it's entirely wrong.)

Scum heap: RC, Chessball, mastin, sekai, gif, dopog, majiffy,

AP.
You're not townreading me. But you know why you're not townreading me? Logic, no. Gut? No. You're not townreading me not because you think I'm scum, but because you're not seeing town. And you know why you're not seeing town? Because you're refusing to see that town.

Seriously, AP. Sekai, GiF, and Majiffy are all in my scum pile. RC's such a weak townread that he could easily go there, too. The only players in my scum pile not in yours are Rubicon and Sven, both of which are my weakest scumreads anyway. WE. HAVE. ALMOST. THE. EXACT. SAME. READS. Yet you're calling me scum anyway. You know better than this. I know you do. What the hell's wrong with you?

Have people started stealth-town-reading Majiffy or is he just slipping through the cracks?

Slipping through the cracks. I'd suggest flashwagoning him, if, y'know, that wouldn't dissolve the wagons on sekai and RC.

[mastin2]

Because your posting can quite easily come from scum this game.

WE'VE BEEN THROUGH THIS BEFORE. Can, yes. CAN.

Can

. It

COULD

come from scum.
NOT DOES.

Of course my posting could come from scum. You're AP. You should have that paranoia of me. I know you, you know me, I expected as much. That's the problem, though. "Could" be scum normally means just that--paranoia of me. But in this game. For whatever reason. "Could be scum" doesn't mean "town, buuuuuut", it means "scumread". That's not "could be scum". That's "cooooooooooooooould be town...".

Cheer lead some wagons half-heartedly, assert that you aren't playing to your scummeta, buddy up to me.

Bluntly? The only reason I'm not paranoid of you by now is your softclaim. I read you as town for your entrance. I read you as town for your initial stance on me. I read you as town for your reversal of me into not-scumread, but your flip back into having me as super-scum made absolutely no dang sense and is a signature of a scum-you. I can see the town especially given the way you softclaimed. (I caught the softclaim before you had actually softclaimed, for the record. You might be subtle to others, but not to me.) But your play here makes no sense.

As for half-hearted pushes, that's true because my read is half-hearted on RC. And you know DANG good and well asserting I'm not playing to my scum meta isn't a scumtell from me.

And nothing you've posted is convincingly town at this point.

WHAT. GAME. ARE. YOU. READING. It's not this one, I can tell you that. Because all the town stuff is

right there, in front of your eyes

. And you're discarding it. My point wasn't that you were going "meh = scum". My point was that you were going "meh" when you have EVERY reason NOT to be.

Bulbazak:

What's your read of RC?
Same question for Vezok and Thor.

[mastin2]

He is saying that he does not find your posts as if they were coming from a town player.

THAT'S MY PROBLEM.

HE

SHOULD

BE!

FTR, mastin's herpaderp about "Well I would be scumreading AP if not for the softclaim" is some shit. Scum motivated shit.

Like hell it is.

Your reads in general are fine. Your claim augments it. Your read on me, however, is objectively terrible. That single factor. Undoes basically most of the good. Objectively bad play from a player who is better, and all that. You're better than this at reading me.

VOTE: Red Coyote.

[mastin2]

You know, I knew BBMolla was a PR that was going to get a bad result on me. A cop, tracker, or watcher. I knew it. Really did. So I suppose I kinda am regretting not having taken care of that, but it's

so

worth it, because I get to do something I've never gotten to do in any game, ever:

Troll the FUCK out of you as confscum.

[mastin2]

You know why the scumteam's going to win this game?

'Cause we're the only ones in this game with BRAINS.

[mastin2]

What do you call a witty grim reaper?

[mastin2]

What do you call a witty grim reaper?

A deathpan snarker.

[mastin2]

What was the drowning scientist's last thought?

[mastin2]

What was the drowning scientist's last thought?

"Oxygen has water in it, right?"

[mastin2]

Why did the chicken cross the road?

[mastin2]

The horde lumbered and moved as one, shuffling and moaning as they moved, their heads hung low, their legs dragging behind them. They looked around, glancing at one another, trying to pass the time, because what else is there to do when you are a zombie? They didn't know. They all held their arms in front of them, slightly bent, in a perfect 90 degree angle. RedCoyote seemed to have missed the memo, and had his arms only at a 88 degree angle. Disgusted, the horde took his head off.

RedCoyote

has been lynched Day 1, he was a

Common Infected (Vanilla Townie)

*Moan*

---

Night 1 has now begun. Deadline is March 12th (Tuesday), at 10:00pm PST. If you have a night action, please submit it to me by the end of the night.

Do not forgot to submit your lists to me by the deadline as well! If you have any questions, feel free to ask!

[/area]

I realize that having my scumbuddy claim the guilty on me is a really, really huge risk, especially given that we don't know the town's PRs and BBMolla could get caught, but I really think that this time, it's going to work, because last time, TIP did it on a whim. This time, I came up with the idea, soyeah. I'm just going to sit back, enjoy the day, and let Molla claim all that towncred.

[mastin2]

Shit shit SHIT.

That was supposed to be a PM.
FUCK.

Ah, well. If I continue trolling hard enough and spam here, people will assume it was just the latest in my line of trolling, when I legitimately did just did a major scumslip. (Hey, it worked well enough for AP in Antihero!)

[mastin2]

Why did the chicken cross the road?

Because the chicken figured that the road would backstab it sooner or later, and the chicken decided to strike first.

[mastin2]

What was the last thought of a person going down in an airplane?

[mastin2]

What was the last thought of a person going down in an airplane?

"OH, SHIT!"

[mastin2]

Guys, guys, GUYS.

[mastin2]

I just had a

brilliant

idea.

[mastin2]

Why don't you run someone else up to L-1? If I don't hammer them, you've got a scumbuddy of mine!
It's brilliant. Can't fail!

[mastin2]

What do you call a witty grim reaper?

A deathpan snarker.

Alternatively, you can answer Yates.

[mastin2]

Oooh, oooh!
I had another idea!

[mastin2]

Why not leave me to the zombie horde at night? Clearly, I'd die, so you can lynch someone else and get more info!
Can't fail. Honest.

[mastin2]

mastin I thought you'd get shot by vigs last night, why would I check you LOL

That's right, you couldn't have a guilty on me. Because I'm actually Bill, who is cannonically dead, and thus, a mafia godfather. So, your result on me couldn't have been real.

[mastin2]

No, no, no. I swear. I'm actually the witch. I left a 'crumb in my iso for it. In actuality, that means I'm a PGO; nobody could have visited me and lived!

[mastin2]

Actually, I'm the smoker. Remember my posting about RC smoking? That was totally a softclaim on my part.

[mastin2]

Actually, my role is God.

You would

think

that'd be a scumclaim, especially given my earlier ramblings, but no. For proof that God's a zombie, you need only look at the real world we live in right here and now, as we're typing. The world couldn't exist like that if God WASN'T undead.

[mastin2]

Alternatively, you can see an angel having come down to earth, been bitten, and spread the plague among heaven.

[mastin2]

Great idea, Sven!
VOTE: pidgey.

[mastin2]

Alternatively, you can see an angel having come down to earth, been bitten, and spread the plague among heaven.

Or, OR.
Being zombified is not considered a sin, so zombies killed in the apocalypse are not disqualified from entering heaven. Where they can still infect residents. And God got infected that way.

[mastin2]

Actually, I'm not God.
I'm the secret computer that controls the strings. You know, the one that basically determines the difficulty for the survivors, punishing them especially on harder difficulties? Yeah, that secret computer. I'd have to check

the TVTropes page

my role PM for the exact details of my role, but basically, I'm a treestump, who also has an influence over the horde. I'm basically the ultimate infected, effectively the God of zombies, so my previous claim was only half a lie.

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

Quoting this for top-of-page emphasis.

[mastin2]

Hey, AP.

Scale of 1 to ten. Ten being kuribo. A five being Else. You being seven or so.

I want your rating of me when I join ya.

[mastin2]

Sven: Mastin is still scum lynch him dog

Speaking of dogs, we actually killed dopog, randomly, to throw you guys off of our trails. Somehow, the horde managed to eat AP last night.

[mastin2]

Oh, right. That's because all of us actually have an ability allowing us to influence the horde, and we selected the same three targets from all of us. Which AP was among.

[mastin2]

You know?

There really is something liberating about being confirmed scum.

[mastin2]

You guys are gonna kill me tonight right?

Maybe, maybe not. I wouldn't have claimed confscum if I didn't have a counter to any PR I could see taking me down, after all. Probably not, though. We have larger fish to fry.

[mastin2]

but just so you know molla, i will hold you accountable if this goes sideways

You should totally hold him accountable anyways, since I'm just a goon. We have a member with a sniper rifle, ninja-killing players.

[mastin2]

how would it go sidways, lol

If it went this way:

Or this way:

[mastin2]

[LYNCHED]

RedCoyote:

Svenskt Stal, AngryPidgeon, GuyInFreezer, PeregrineV, Vezokpiraka, Mastin2, BBMolla, Aegor, Pidgey, dopog, Zdenek, ActionDan

Looks like I'll be going to the right, rather than the left.

[mastin2]

Aegor next please.

Seriously?

Seriously.

Yes, Aegor next, please.

[mastin2]

disregard the vote obv

No, no. The vote's the most important part! After all, I sheeped it, and my word is the word of God!

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

[mastin2]

Damn. I'm really an amateur at this. I'm already running low on material.

[mastin2]

Actually, I want to write a song called "My Brains", but I won't have time to finish it before you guys speedlynch me.

[mastin2]

mastin i thought you were a good player, but you are you just tye to much for anyone to care enough about actually reading you

Well, yeah. I type too much. That was part of my plan. Because my play woulda been transparent to players knowing me, otherwise.

[mastin2]

WHOOPS.
I JUST REVEALED WE NIGHTKILLED AP.
CRAP.

[mastin2]

Fun fact: L4D is one of the only theme games I've signed up for where I've actually been familiar with the theme.

[mastin2]

Also, this will be the second large theme Venmar game in a row which will have a town lynch after a long D1 and a scum quicklynch on D2.

[mastin2]

Which, really, makes a ton of sense, considering zombies and all.
This game actually has a ton of uncanny resemblance to that one, no trolling, though obviously, I'll leave it to others to figure out how.

[mastin2]

Let's play a game.
It's called "who will actually quote Mastin's D2".
You take a shot every time someone quotes any of my posting from D2 and tries to use it in any way to find scum or town.

[mastin2]

Alternatively, the game could involve taking a shot every time someone quotes someone having quoted my D2 posting, and they simply go, "STOP USING TROLLING FROM CONFSCUM AS VALID EVIDENCE!".
Or if you can really hold your liquor, both.

[mastin2]

i can teach you the sven art of short incoherent oneliners, misspelled and with subpar grammar, its a weekend course

Actually, I took that course before you joined, just on an alt.

[mastin2]

Also, this will be the second large theme Venmar game in a row which will have a town lynch after a long D1 and a scum quicklynch on D2.

i still dont understand, did you slip somewhere? are you scum for real lol?

No, I'm actually an innocent child trolling to get a wagon on me. I sent Venmar a PM; the next time he comes online, he'll reveal my alignment to be town.

[mastin2]

My secret goal is to get to over two pages in my iso, and to also troll to page one-hundred. Let's see if I can pull it off.

[mastin2]

Mastin's list of pulled posts from players defending Mastin

Not necessarily all scummy, but for posterity:

Spoiler: mastin connections

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

While simultaneously praising a Mastin post.

Vote: Rubicon

PITOLI WHY ARE WE VOTING SVEN

I'm seriously townreading mastin GIF and Thor, leaning town on Nero Aegor and the Valentyndra

GIF is town
I'll go BBmolla town, mastin town

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

this feels like flow-going. anything else you have to say?

and if you could sum up your scum read on majiffy that would be dandy

When the posts come back I will try to do this.
Strong town reads: mastin and dopog.
Townish : Toog.

As for everybody else I haven't made an opinion just yet.

Molla, read on mastin?

I think she's town?

LOL to the above quote.

Hot Topics

Mastin=scum?

Maybe, maybe not. He gets much easier to read as the game progresses, not a good day1 lynch.

I read ONE mastin post and she's town. Like, totes town. I know it's just one post but it's a mastin post. It's like I burned through the old testament in 5 minutes.

AngryPidgeon is the standout scumbag on the player list. He's "reading" super-townie sekai as scum, vezok as low-hanging fruit fake scum read, and us as OMGUS fake scumread. I guess he's decided to shoot for the low-hanging fruit and NK us.

Hi! Sorry to see you are still stuck in the freezer, but can you quickly give your top 3 scum and top3 (not-you) town?

As town goes, Sekai/AP/Mastin.
As scum goes, I have one scumread on my own (Alpa) and currently secretly sheeping the majority shamelessly on (vezok). Rest of the ppl are either lean town or unsorted.[/quote]

mastin is totally town. Count me out.

This is a scum-driven wagon if I've ever seen one. I am ashamed of any townies riding it.

Anyway, I'm pretty far from sold on a mastin lynch. There are a couple of points in her ISO that need clarification, but generally she seems legit.

explain to me how its benefitial to lynch mastin day 1, like must consider yourself able to read him

tl;dr

: SCB, Vezok, and PereV should all be killed with the blazing fury of a thousand burning suns.

[mastin2]

tl;dr

: SCB, Vezok, and PereV should all be killed with the blazing fury of a thousand burning suns.

Ooh, ooh!

We could totally lynch them first!

Because we know Mastin's alignment, why not wait? Why not lynch players who're unknown?

[mastin2]

tl;dr

: SCB, Vezok, and PereV should all be killed with the blazing fury of a thousand burning suns.

Ooh, ooh!

We could totally lynch them first!

Because we know Mastin's alignment, why not wait? Why not lynch players who're unknown?

I mean, sure it's a risk, but I really think this is a gamble that could pay off for us.

[mastin2]

tl;dr

: SCB, Vezok, and PereV should all be killed with the blazing fury of a thousand burning suns.

Ooh, ooh!

We could totally lynch them first!

Because we know Mastin's alignment, why not wait? Why not lynch players who're unknown?

I mean, sure it's a risk, but I really think this is a gamble that could pay off for us.

Err...by which, I totally mean the town.

[mastin2]

I should REALLY stop scumslipping.

[mastin2]

Don't like you having Fferyslot as a strong town read. I think it makes sense with Mastin.

Of course it does, that's because they're my designated mislynch target.

[mastin2]

I think I should really be given the chance to do analysis.

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

[mastin2]

I think I should really be given the chance to do analysis.

Surely, you all owe me this much!

I mean, what harm could it do?

[mastin2]

I think I should really be given the chance to do analysis.

Surely, you all owe me this much!

I mean, what harm could it do?

I mean, as scum, I could give things away to help you mislynch my scumbuddies.

As town, I could give you legitimate analysis and insight to use after my mislynch.

[mastin2]

Damn. Way short. I'm only at 145.

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

Oh shit. I just realized this comes across as being a second-hand copy of Elyse.

Crap.

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

Oh shit. I just realized this comes across as being a second-hand copy of Elyse.

Crap.

Fuck, this is also a scumslip because Elyse did it for a list from a town player that contained scum players in a lynchlist.

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

Oh shit. I just realized this comes across as being a second-hand copy of Elyse.

Crap.

Oh, heck with it. I might as well run with that.

Daykill: sekai no ki

.

[mastin2]

if amstin actually flips scum i´d hate it couse rereading her for spew will drain my will to live

Ha! This is a scumslip, 'cause if you were town, you wouldn't be alive, and thus, could not be drained of life!

[mastin2]

Oh!

Just realized what I needed for that kuribo touch. Gimme a sec to pull up my role PM.

[mastin2]

Hey, guys.

I'm actually Redmond Mann. You might think me being a human would make me human-aligned, but no. I'm a heartless bastard, just trapped in the wrong universe, so I don't give a damn about the survival of humanity; I'm only in it for myself, and thus, am a third party survivor. I win if I can demolish a survival shelter, which will weak the scum by removing their daytalk. So I'm actually a fairly pro-zombie third party.

[mastin2]

To emphasize,

Claim: Redmond Mann, daytalk remover.

I just need to target scum in order to remove their daychat. Seriously, I'm here rooting for the town. You should totally let me live.

[mastin2]

Aegor's list of pulled posts from players defending Mastin

Not necessarily all scummy, but for posterity:

Spoiler: mastin connections

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

While simultaneously praising a Mastin post.

Vote: Rubicon

PITOLI WHY ARE WE VOTING SVEN

I'm seriously townreading mastin GIF and Thor, leaning town on Nero Aegor and the Valentyndra

GIF is town
I'll go BBmolla town, mastin town

vote rubicon

He OMGUSed mastin with only 3 voets on him and still in RVS. That seems like scum over-reacting.

this feels like flow-going. anything else you have to say?

and if you could sum up your scum read on majiffy that would be dandy

When the posts come back I will try to do this.
Strong town reads: mastin and dopog.
Townish : Toog.

As for everybody else I haven't made an opinion just yet.

Molla, read on mastin?

I think she's town?

LOL to the above quote.

Hot Topics

Mastin=scum?

Maybe, maybe not. He gets much easier to read as the game progresses, not a good day1 lynch.

I read ONE mastin post and she's town. Like, totes town. I know it's just one post but it's a mastin post. It's like I burned through the old testament in 5 minutes.

AngryPidgeon is the standout scumbag on the player list. He's "reading" super-townie sekai as scum, vezok as low-hanging fruit fake scum read, and us as OMGUS fake scumread. I guess he's decided to shoot for the low-hanging fruit and NK us.

Hi! Sorry to see you are still stuck in the freezer, but can you quickly give your top 3 scum and top3 (not-you) town?

As town goes, Sekai/AP/Mastin.
As scum goes, I have one scumread on my own (Alpa) and currently secretly sheeping the majority shamelessly on (vezok). Rest of the ppl are either lean town or unsorted.

mastin is totally town. Count me out.

This is a scum-driven wagon if I've ever seen one. I am ashamed of any townies riding it.

Anyway, I'm pretty far from sold on a mastin lynch. There are a couple of points in her ISO that need clarification, but generally she seems legit.

explain to me how its benefitial to lynch mastin day 1, like must consider yourself able to read him

[/spoiler]

tl;dr

: SCB, Vezok, and PereV should all be killed with the blazing fury of a thousand burning suns.

why are you ruleing out the possibility of mastin trolling as town?[/quote]Sven's post broke the site, so I'm quoting it to continue the annoyance.

But to answer, he's ruling out trolling as town because trolling as town to this extent is utterly and entirely worthless?

[mastin2]

That's a low, even for me. I won't do that again, sorry.

[mastin2]

There is no way mastin would do this as town unless she's planning to siteflake

I wouldn't ruin games even if siteflaking.

I do troll as town, though. Just not like this.

[mastin2]

Also, I'm a she.
SHE.

[mastin2]

Okay, so technically I'm not a female character, soooooooo, not she-by-role.

[mastin2]

158?
What the hell, how can I have posted so little?!?

[mastin2]

Seriously, shouldn't be that hard to get over 200 posts; I used to do that even without spam-trolling!

[mastin2]

Damn. I knew I wouldn't get a ten, but I was hoping for at least an eight. At this rate, I'd be lucky to get a six.

[mastin2]

Ooh! Ooh!

I got another idea!

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

[mastin2]

Ooh! Ooh!

I got another idea!

Blatantly lying!

[mastin2]

Like I wasn't lying already.

[mastin2]

Post more, mastin. Then this game can make the records page for longest eva.

I wish.

You realize that Fire Emblem was well over 300 pages, right?

[mastin2]

Like, I'll try.

[mastin2]

I'm good.
But I'm not

that

good.

[mastin2]

I'm good.
But I'm not

that

good.

SHIT, THAT'S A MOVIE QUOTE FROM A HUMAN.

[mastin2]

Speaking of movies, did you know that Zoe and Colorado have something in common?
Genre savviness of zombies that aren't entirely right.

They're not

allowed

to be that fast.

[mastin2]

Rather, they are, but they shouldn't be.

[mastin2]

Derp. I misremembered the names. You know who I'm talking about, though.

[mastin2]

OR SHOULD, IF YOU CLAIM TO BE A ZOMBIE FAN AT ALL.

[mastin2]

Actually, that gives me a neat idea.
A zombie-fan. Not a fan of zombies. Literally, a fan that's a zombie.

[mastin2]

I'm good.
But I'm not

that

good.

SHIT, THAT'S A MOVIE QUOTE FROM A HUMAN.

Zombie movie, to be more specific.

[mastin2]

Please do. We are almost a third of the way there. And it is only Day 2.

Sure, I'll do my best. But there's only so much I can do by myself. Like, I can prepare a ton of material, but my mind works faster than my keyboard. I need posters to help jumpstart it.

[mastin2]

Though, I really, REALLY want to get the time to write "My Brains".
You'd think this would be easy to do, but the rhyming scheme isn't an even one. It has a unique one that I need to create.

[mastin2]

Yes, I am surprisingly well-versed in zombie pop-culture. Call it an obsession of mine.

[mastin2]

Zombies totally do have culture, by the way.

[mastin2]

Consequences of zombies being the main species on earth:

[mastin2]

Why intelligent zombies spell the death of humanity:

[mastin2]

Though, I imagine Madagascar is still fine.

[mastin2]

[mastin2]

(Still wanna get that impossible badge some day.)

[mastin2]

Can we end this day already, please?

We can hordekill ADan or someone.

[mastin2]

kk

THIS IS YOU, NOT HELPING ME BY GIVING ME MATERIAL.

[mastin2]

Hey, guys.

[mastin2]

Lynch all liars, right?

[mastin2]

Not putting your money where your mouth is, definitely a scumtell.

[mastin2]

Like, he said he'd do it, but he's clearly not.

[mastin2]

That's borderline hypocrisy.

[mastin2]

VOTE: Aegor.

[mastin2]

'Cause I need to do that in order to not by hypocritical myself.

[mastin2]

Oh, hey, 193. I'm actually kinda close.

[mastin2]

In all seriousness, I'm totally a legitimate zombie. Just not from the L4D franchise. I'm R.

[mastin2]

In all seriousness, I'm totally a legitimate zombie. Just not from the L4D franchise. I'm R.

SHIT, THAT SOUNDS LIKE A TRAITOR CLAIM.

[mastin2]

I'm actually a named zombie. My name's Luda. I'm otherwise just a common zombie, though; it's just a fancy title for a rolecop to pick up on.

[mastin2]

(Still wanna get that impossible badge some day.)

Going to bed, but do not even get me started on that infernal badge.

Oh, please do! Love that talk.

[mastin2]

Hey, it's not called an impossible badge because it's something you can do quickly and easily!