The Reckoning III (Math is Hard) Holy crap, perfect town win

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: Eleven

We are 95% sure they are scum.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: Eleven

We are 95% sure they are scum.

=) this is certainly not an awkward opening post

I know. It's pretty awesome, isn't it?

Are you mad we caught you already sucks to be you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Tammy, can you go have a fit at Faraday so we can be obviously town and I don't have to pay attention to this game?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

EVERYONE.

VOTE TAMMY.

SHE'S DEFINITELY SCUM.

YOU SHOULD DO IT.

TRUST ME.

(I'm the worst hydra partner ever. )

Also fuck you, AngryPidgeon, you know red is scum.

Ooh. Explain the context behind this quote?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Go away, Eleven.

Then I got my role PM this game and immediately assumed we were scum because it was red, then I read the whole thing, and realized the PMs were just AngryPidgeon fucking with people just like he does in the other games.

You didn't ask the mod this? You just jumped to the assumption it was poking fun at that convention?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

JUST LET THEM FUCKING ANSWER. Can't you keep your mouth shut for five...

Never mind! Carry on, Faraday!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I MEAN, ABOUT THE FLAVOUR EXPLANATION. DID YOU THINK OF THE FLAVOUR FOR WHY TOWN WAS RED YOURSELF.

I asked the mods when I saw my role PM, and they actually answered me (and I think might have slipped that there's only one scumteam).

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The reason being, I think the flavour would be much more obvious if you knew the colours for town AND scum. Less so when you only have the town colour.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The fact you were the butt of the joke makes it less suspicious that you picked up on the flavour with only partial information. But I need to double-check something with the mods.

Faraday, what made you decide to use the eleven of hearts instead of the image ActionDan linked to?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Someone find me an avatar.

I see you making people do your dirty work



UNVOTE:
VOTE: Eleven

Oh, wait. Cheery Dog, why did you choose this image for Eleven?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Maybe I'm dramatically underestimating how obvious the flavour is because I hated F2F so much. But I never would have got it just from seeing "town" in red.

Actually, I just realized that Reck townslipped if anything.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(I'd have picked Empire, personally, it might have taken me slightly longer to read the fear in his tone)

Also, why'd you change from the black card to the red card?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Myself, read your own posts before repeating ourselves!

Faraday's explanation is plausible (I was expecting something else).

#97 is the silliest post in the world but Waffles can be town for it.

That's the least town thing I've posted, particularly if you've missed enough of the context to think it's silly. Why am I town for it?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Wow, tammy's post still suck Too bad I can't 1 v 1 you until tomorrow. (Don't kill me, plz)

I am awesome. But, I'm not going to let you troll me this game, so.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Mollie - do you feel out of step and not recognizing things in the context of the game and what's been said? Cuz you feel like that to me.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Mollie - do you feel out of step and not recognizing things in the context of the game and what's been said? Cuz you feel like that to me.

fuck you tammy you don't even know what the hell I mean when I use that tell

pretty sure I am not the 1 out of step pretty sure you are

have you just resigned to be scum and have decided to just troll? that usually means you are being bussed!

Um. Mollie.

Take a step back and readdress me.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

But sure, if you are THAT CONFUSED.

You claim that cdb shouldn't have taken his vote off you if he thought you were scum though as far as I can tell he never voted you.

Apparently you missed the entire red black card conversation or you wouldn't have asked Mina the question about why Faraday changed his card. I mean it's a really really obvious reason she asked if you take into consideration the red black conversation.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

But sure, if you are THAT CONFUSED.

You claim that cdb shouldn't have taken his vote off you if he thought you were scum though as far as I can tell he never voted you.

Apparently you missed the entire red black card conversation or you wouldn't have asked Mina the question about why Faraday changed his card. I mean it's a really really obvious reason she asked if you take into consideration the red black conversation.

HOLY SHIT WTF

I DIDN'T ASK MINA ABOUT WHY FARA CHANGED HIS CARD I ASKED WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF THE QUESTION COS IT WAS PRETTY DUMB AND HAD NO VALUE I MEAN DOES SHE THINK SHE IS GOING TO GET HIS ALIGNMENT FROM THAT

VOTE: waffles

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I could weird especially if kittymo continues with this whole dumb trajectory on me cos it makes me wonder if kittymo is trying to fake her f2f meta but so far feeling townvibes

zee irony.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

so mollie, are you at any point planning to stop acting like an angry person on pms because the hostility that's dripping from your posts since entering this game is ridiculous. Saying "fuck you" for asking you a question about how you feel and your whole demeanor is not only off putting but feels really fake. Quite frankly I have no desire or intention to interact with you until you calm down.

But, thank you for voting for me, I do so much appreciate it!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

so mollie, are you at any point planning to stop acting like an angry person on pms because the hostility that's dripping from your posts since entering this game is ridiculous. Saying "fuck you" for asking you a question about how you feel and your whole demeanor is not only off putting but feels really fake. Quite frankly I have no desire or intention to interact with you until you calm down.

But, thank you for voting for me, I do so much appreciate it!

are you going to cry about it so that every1 can feel bad and not lynch you?

^ see that was a bit hostile! just so you have a frame of reference.

I have seen you say "fuck you", tammy? so why is it bothering you now? where did this new found sensitivity come from? I am not going to quake in the face of your tawdry attempts to emotionally manipulate me nope it isn't going to work!!!!

in other newz I got 2 new pets today!!! a dog and a cat (their owners couldn't keep them anymore and did not want to send them to the pound and neither did I!!!) the cat we were "cat sitting" for (her owner has not checked back with us since august but I am giving it a year before I call the tailless kitty our own) and the 2 cats are having a standoff they are perched on either side of the tv and are giving each other baleful looks and occasionally growl at each other and hiss at each other and the dog is like wtf is your problem and tries to lick them and then they gang up on the dog until they realise they are on the same side then they freak and run to their spots it is pretty funny!

Nope, not gonna cry today.

It's bothering me because there's no reason for it. I don't just tell people to fuck off or say fuck you for no reason, I mean maybe I do sometimes but I do have reasons. I certainly don't do it when someone asks me a question because they're trying to determine my alignment, and quite frankly if I do, I'm probably pissed off.

I'm not trying to emotionally manipulate anyone, I don't have any need to. I don't get your reaction to me asking you about being out of step because you did and you do still feel out of step with the game. It's like we're playing two different ones here.

You asked the question about Mina asking faraday a question about the cards, which you know you asking that question is just as stupid because what alignment relevant information do you think you would get from her about that question? And any question especially in the early game is perfectly fine because it gets people interacting and that's a good thing. And she had a really valid reason for asking the question.

I'm just super confused about your whole take on this game if you're town because it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Mina was ridiculously obviously town in the first few pages of the game, and I'm surprised you didn't see that. You pride yourself on being able to differentiate between mindsets, and for you to come away from reading her whole thing about the cards and getting paranoid and thinking she had caught Reck, and then realizing that actually he had probably town slipped was incredibly town. Then if you're following her whole train of thought, and I jumped in and asked the same question to Faraday because we both noticed the same thing. His card went from black to red. Here the scum are black and the town are red. Like, even if you don't like the question, how you can't see the town motivation in asking that question is beyond me.

So, yes, because you didn't pick up on that and instead focused on a question that makes so much sense in the context of the conversation that followed felt really out of step coming from you. I, additionally thought your CDB vote was odd based on the reasoning you provided not matching the thread.

Your then reaction to me saying you felt out of step was to yell at me that I felt out of step.

Mollie - do you feel out of step and not recognizing things in the context of the game and what's been said? Cuz you feel like that to me.

fuck you tammy you don't even know what the hell I mean when I use that tell

pretty sure I am not the 1 out of step pretty sure you are

have you just resigned to be scum and have decided to just troll? that usually means you are being bussed!

This makes no sense whatsoever either. Why didn't you ask me why you felt that way to me? Why the weird immediate aggression?

Also, I'd love for you to provide the context for the trolling means I'm being bussed accusation. The only even semi trolling I've done in this game was trolling Mina/Faraday with my first post and Faraday in my second, and those two are pretty good indications of me being town so.

Who is bussing us in this game? The overlords are the only ones voting us, and you've declared them town. (We agree they look very town.) When have I been bussed and just decided to troll a game?

also, the irony is you saying someone else has a dumb trajectory on you and that it could potentially be suspicious to you while you're having a dumb trajectory on us.

I'm glad you got new pets though Also, just so you know, voting us is actually voting for my cat.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Must resist...temptation...

Nah.

VOTE: pirate mollie

CDB's first posts (in particular, the OTT white-knighting of mollie) sucked, but I liked the paranoia in the latter half of this post, where he reevaluates on mollie as he's writing it. (Granted, I've faked something similar as scum...but his post looks townier, and also, people townread me for it, so that means I'm a sociopath and it's a towntell!)

I'm

95%

more confident than I should be this early on that Eleven is town. Also have a few other preliminary townreads there's not much point in naming yet.

Iecerint, if someone gets to L-1, will your name appear in the votecount as the hammer?

Then how about you go check before we kill you?

Looking at the playerlist makes me realize I am the weakest player in this game, hands down.

So I will probably just sheep whoever convinces me they are town.

Also, I can't read anything Fate says anymore without hearing it from his voice. He quite literally posts how he talks.

Why are you wasting your breath talking about Fate's voice? Faraday asked you to check your flavour, since you apparently have the memory of a goldfish. Where is your flavour?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Iecerint, if someone gets to L-1, will your name appear in the votecount as the hammer?

Role PM does not specify; I will ask our Mods.

(Why are you bothering to ask about something so inconsequential...?)

Because claiming when it's not public means you get town points for claiming. If you claimed when your vote

is

public, the action is completely null. Duh.

(You can still get town points for claiming without checking, I guess, although it's less provable.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Why was there a point in specifically naming me?

P.s. what made you ask the mods about the colour, it's something I'd certainly assume they'd not answer (even though I've asked and they did, I guess) but I was slightly weirded out you asked. What do you think of mollie's vote on you and calling your slot obvscum?

We'd been voting you, so I wanted to make it clear we expressly did

not

approve of the wagon. Also, it was partly an artifact from my first version of that post, because I'd started listing all my town reads, but then realized midway through most of them were pretty weak, anyway. (I had concrete reasons for your read.)

I wasn't even expecting a serious answer. I just saw my role PM and went, "Oh, why are town in red?" while replying to it (since it seemed like a random colour choice). I'd rather change the subject at this point, because this is starting to feel skeevy, and no one ever gave me a straight yes-or-no answer on whether I was

allowed

to say anything because AP is V/LA.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh mollie mollie. I came across this post earlier and thought you might be town:

if I can find 1 town I will be happy. just 1

is that too much to ask

JUST 1 FUCKING TOWN READ THAT I CAN STICK WITH AND BELIEVE IN

FUCKING A IT WAS 73 DEGREES YESTERDAY AND NOW IT IS SNOWING

I mean you can say this as scum, and I suppose if you're trying to burn your town meta it's something you would say, but it felt somewhat townish. Mina and I talked about it to and she saw the possibility except she's having a bigger problem than I am coming to terms with your posting and reads so far this game. Her big problem is that to her you've seemed somewhat more collected than you do here because the reasoning for your scum read on us makes no literal sense whatsoever and doesn't actually look like you're trying to read either of our heads. Mina's questions weren't pointless; you might not have understood where she was coming from but that doesn't make them pointless. If you can't see the burgeoning paranoia in her question to faraday then I don't know what to tell you, but considering that you tend towards paranoia that lends itself to moon logic at times, I'm surprised you didn't sense what was there.

This makes me more concerned about you because it feels like you decided that you were going to push us as scum and have warped your entire narrative around that goal even though it doesn't make a lick of sense. You're not recognizing the things that should make you doubt that sure fire scum read you have on both of our heads and you don't feel like you're actually reading the game and trying to parse alignments. The things you missed is similar to you missing things in the Mario bros game where you were out of step there too because you didn't pick up on town tells in the game because you didn't have a town role pm so you missed the narrative.

And I mean, did you actually use as a scum reasoning for me that I used a phrase you don't think is in my toolbox? That has got to be the most convoluted crap I've heard. I probably don't mean the same thing you do when you say it, but I'm pretty sure I remember in Skype one day you saying you thought we scumhunted in a similar way or had a similar playstyle or something so idont get this how dare you use a phrase I've never heard you say because only nacho and I use it. And if something has creeped into my toolbox that nacho uses, perhaps it's because we hydra together and have talked quite a bit. I'm pretty sure there are things I've drawn from everyone I've hydrad with. (See faraday don't you want to hydra with me now even if I don't sing for you? You can impact my scumhunting.

are you still reading my wall?

)

I'm not really going to respond to anything else from that wall because I found so much of it contrived and this wall is already big enough and if you can't realize I'm town by the time you finish reading this post, then you never will and me pointing out why none of that made sense will help in that regard.

But I do want to know why you sidestepped this question:

Also, I'd love for you to provide the context for the trolling means I'm being bussed accusation.

Who is bussing us in this game? The overlords are the only ones voting us, and you've declared them town. (We agree they look very town.) When have I been bussed and just decided to troll a game?

You keep talking as if you have authority for my scum game, but you throw out nuggets like this as if this is something that has happened and is happening in this game, and I can't for the life of me figure out where you're getting this Tammy scum meta. I mean sure your other part is right, I have, in fact, manipulated people as scum. Who hasn't? I'm not manipulating anyone in this game and my posts haven't even slightly been manipulative.

I think I would just feel so much better about you in all of this if I saw a hint of paranoia because I'd be able to recognize that as town with a bad read, but when I read you, your stuff just feels contrived.

Also, while looking for you pirate case to show Mina that sometimes you do go a bit irrational as town, I came across this:

Re: Tammy. I'm not good at reading her. But, she seems pretty emotional this game, moreso than in the one I was in with her as scum. But, like she said, her posting tone correlates with her mood sometimes, so it's probably not necessarily alignment indicative.

Something about this post below bothers me for some reason though, but I can't figure out why:

Spoiler:

omg mollie's Post 358 is something I can empathize with so much but in inverse, if that makes sense. I'm no good at day one; I find day one's a lot of noise and more games than not I feel like shit about my reads because I feel like I put the puzzle together better when there are pieces flipped. This means that some games I take a back seat role and look at how the arguments play out to see what makes sense, but in some games I feel like it makes sense right away. And my game is really largely dependent on my mood first.

I was telling empire not too long ago that I wanted to change my meta because I felt like what people expected from me was actually causing a distraction in games because people aren't actually reading me based on what I say in games but in really superficial things that are partially alignment aligned but are also mood aligned. So for instance, no I don't always joke around and be exciting at the start of the game. If I do, I'm almost definitely town, but if I don't, I might just not be in the mood. I'm getting a bit tired of people pushing me for reactions instead of looking at what I'm saying, which I think is way more relevant than anything ever. I mean I get that it might be amusing for people to just try to make me mad, but I don't think that makes an enjoyable or productive game, so I've pledged to do my best to not react to unwarranted suspicion until people start reading what I'm actually saying, especially when they aren't people who have bothered to understand me enough to see where I'm coming from.

I realize this might get me a few mislynches in the near future, but I'm considering it an experiment and hope it will help.

/complete weird tangent

That's you not only saying you don't know how to read me, but is also showing you actually trying. I'd like to know how you go from not knowing how to read me to being so super sure your right on your read here? We have no completed games since that game that would make you have a revelation, and the game we played on Skype a few days ago had you quick voting me in lylo when I was town. I'd like to know why you're not actually trying to read me here.

And what makes you so confident, you feel certain enough to reply to this the way you did:

I cant actually ever remember you having a read and being that convicted about it but I'm going to trust Faraday's read for now

mine is better

What makes you think you're better at reading us than faraday? Also unless I'm misreading, he called our slot obnoxiously town. You know how nacho is pretty damn good at reading me? Yeah, faradays better. (Look faraday I'm buddying you!)

Anyway, this wall has been bigger than I meant it to be and I lost a good chunk of what I wrote trying to submit it when the thread was locked and now I can't remember what I said but I'm sure it was better than this! Basically this boils down to me thinking I see glimmers of you as town but I also have issues with seeing you as town because it doesn't feel like you're actually trying to read people, but I also am having trouble seeing scum you so doggedly asking people to vote for us especially when you know how unlikely it is to go through, but I have had scum attacking me for weird things lately and you have ny backup in that regard because it feels like that to me. I know I might not be the most objective about this but it doesn't feel like a town attack, so if you are town can you make it obvious, please?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

That's okay!

It's not there for you to read :tonguewag:

We need better emoticons.

(Also, faraday shouldn't act like he didn't read it!)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

We're probably not going to read Tammy's post or the reply.

tl;dr: "Mollie, I (Tammy) think you're town but you can't read me and you know you can't read me so wtf you doin'?"

At least that was my impression of it.

VOTE: ActionDan

Mostly along those lines. More like I think there's a possibility you're town, but here are some issues, but... the rest of what you said.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Don't talk to me for the rest of the game thanks.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

FTR Mollie - I didn't "barge" into a game I don't belong in. Mina lost her first hydra partner, who was a reckoning attendee!, and asked me if I'd hydra with her because she didn't have time/didn't want to do it by herself.

I didn't misapply your scumhunting tool. I even literally said I probably don't mean the same thing you do by that phrase and told you what I was referring to. And quite frankly you're reminding me of when you were scum in mario bros and I complained that the town wasn't working together and you went all look at you preaching town should be working together you're doing that to copy me because noone else tries to get town to work together!!!!!

I didn't lie about that post. I thought it was you because it doesn't make any sense for it to come from Bert. I have fooled Bert as scum before but Bert actually does know how to read me. We've literally talked about my tells in more than one game. Also, in Attack of the Titan I said something very similar to what whoever wrote that post said bothered them and Bert quoted it and said that he really liked that post, so to me it doesn't make any sense whatsoever for it to be coming from Bert. (Also you didn't scum read me the whole time unless by scum reading you including me as part of the town who was going to bring it together for town. I can quote that post for you if you like; I'm quite sure I'm not missing that being Bert.)

But it's okay! I hope you're scum in this game because maybe that will explain your whole demeanor and that would make it okay; you're doing what you're need to do. Regardless, I never want to play in a game with you again. I just thought you should know that. I'd just replace out of this game but I'd feel like the biggest jerk of a friend ever to do that after I said I'd hydra, so I'm probably just going sit back seat for a bit because this is getting ridiculous.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

What the fuck is it with pirate mollie and my hydra partners?

I've been admittedly pretty disengaged so far (in part because hydraing with Tammy gives me some leeway to be lazy). Now I'll start taking the reins a bit more, since Tammy is only staying in this slot because she's too nice to replace out.

For that reason, I find someone scumreading me for my early posts plausible...if that someone was incapable of following the plot and missed I was practically confirmed town for the underlying reasons behind, e.g., my questions to Cheery Dog.

I did tell Tammy it was better if she responded herself, but in retrospect, we shouldn't have taken the bait. Because now it's easy to dismiss this as "two emotional people yelling at each other." There's actual weird shit about mollie's play that I'd have liked to engage with her on, but she's acting in a way that discourages anyone from touching her with a ten-foot pole.

Sorry to everyone for our part in the drama.

~Mina (only a few of the RVS posts have been mine)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

*sigh*

Mina (and everyone), last thing I'll say, promise.

Mollie - I wasn't being deliberately mean. I don't even think I have a *deliberately mean* bone in my body; I'm way too empathetic for that kind of thing. I had a scum read on you and was trying to determine your alignment. That was my way of explaining what felt off about you.

If you go back and read both of my walls to you, or heck any of my posts to you, with the mindset of someone who is trying to explain to you what they are thinking, not only about how they are reading and seeing you, but how you're interpreting them, maybe you'll see where I'm coming from. I'm just still rather shocked that you could read the last paragraph of that post I wrote you last night and come away thinking I'm baiting you.

Anyway, I was still pretty convinced you were scum until Post 416 so it's whatever, but if you're reading me in the way you've been describing me you're coming away with the complete wrong impression of anything I've done so far.

Faraday - I'm sure we'll do something else soon, now that I'm pretty sure mollie's town I can stop being distracted by that. Also, I'm going to step back anyway and reset.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

desperado you are killing me.

I just got to reading mollie as town.

Yeah, me too!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I independently agree with myself's turnaround on mollie. (Good thing the mod never counted our vote!)

Faraday, I'm kind of distracted with other things and not feeling great right now. (Week 4 on an empty stomach was not a good idea.) Can I wait until tomorrow or at least later this evening to actually scumhunt?

I know I'm forgetting loads of people, but where my reads are right now: CDB (I liked his appeal to the people townreading him), Iecerint, and maybe Prozac (mostly for the bitching at us and his reaction to the thread being boring) are town. Fate looks vaguely town, too. Reck (I didn't like his sitting out of the Waffles vs. Mollie thing, although it's not as scummy if Mollie is town) and you I'm less sure of than before, but still leaning town. (I'm treating Fate calling Reck scum as completely null based on previous games I've skimmed that start this exact same way.) Ythan I don't think can be scum unless there's either an unlimited town vigilante or a shitload of other town power out there.

I don't have any strong scumreads yet, although I haven't actually read ActionDan's posts that closely. No clue whatsoever on UT. Gamma has been

weird

this game, although I don't know if it's scummy weird. I'm not actually sure what the I wasn't liking Nuwen at first, except I kind of found the weird logic for the Beloved Princess thing townish (even though I know it's a null thing to speculate on--I don't know, it felt kind of genuine?) And Triforce is scummy aside from like one post where I liked the irritability. Cheery Dog I liked for being active in RVS, but his DeathNote vote was weak. Mollie-town makes Cheery Dog and Eaglekit look worse, also. (p-edit: oh, crossposted with a lot of Eaglekit stuff--at least their turnaround came at the right point?)

*breathes into paper bag*

what is weird about my play? and your lack of engagement has a lot to do with why I am scumreading you guys. your questions didn't seem to have a direction nor did they seem like you were trying to determine any1's alignment by asking them.

this is an honest to god reach out btw

I don't suspect you

and people will kill me if I interact with you

anymore, so I won't go into what I found weird--mostly the hostility and overreaction, which seems like a misunderstanding. And my questions did have a direction.

When I'd asked why town was red, I was told it was because of the "town = red card, scum = black card" convention from the Reckoning (and Reck being confused when AP dealt them the wrong way).

That's why I asked Cheery Dog about that avatar. He'd voted Faraday in the same post as he'd suggested he use an eleven of clubs. Hey, Cheery, did you choose it for Faraday because you were calling him scum? It's a weird connection to make.

I'd also thought Faraday using an eleven of hearts instead might have been him jokingly protesting that he was town by using a red card.

Incidentally, Reck's minor townslip was that he'd implied the colours were

reversed

(i.e., that red was town instead of Mafia, not that the colours fit the standard playing cards).

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh, the only people I forgot were Axxle and Pie. (Both are weakly town.)

Actually, I'm feeling better now, because that post took me ages to write.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

tammy if you are town I never want you to shut up. ever

and yes on some level I still feel like you were baiting me! feelings aren't facts and if you are scum this is really sleazy play! call me scumburned or butthurt or whatever. call me names but plz don't misrepresent me or my play which I think is what you are doing.

if you are town then I am sorry you are the recipient of a mollietrolleytrack and it is hard for me to knock myself out of. like I am really sorry for that if you are town.

you wall as scum and it isn't that I am only scumreading 1 head it is 2. <--- I can't seem to shake this.

I am trying to do a hard reset too fwiw but gahhh

we will do our own thing I guess

eta: xposting

<3 you're in luck then!

I wasn't baiting you though. I was trying to get you to react to my question in a way I could determine your alignment, you're just misinterpreting it for me using your meta or scumhunting tool against you when it wasn't anything like that. You felt off because you didn't see what Mina was going for and thinking. I mean I realize she's my other head so confirmation bias and all that jazz but I thought it was pretty obvious that she thought she caught a string that was leading somewhere which had some paranoid elements to it. It struck me as odd that you missed that because of the type of player you are; I thought even if you didn't recognize what she was doing, you see the town elements in it.

It's okay! We are town, you'll see it eventually. I did feel like you were being deliberately mean to me though.

Gah when are people going to realize my posting reflects my mood? Some days I'm a short posting gut based reader, and some scum games I try to emulate that. Some days I have more to say and am in a more thoughtful, reflective mood, and some scum games I try to emulate that. Some days I'm in a crazy silly hyper mood, and those days you get stream of conscious wacko posts, I've never tried to emulate that as scum. I actually write more walls as town though, I think?

Pedit: do you really have a scum read on desperado? I left Mina a bunch of messages in Skype about him because earlier I thought he was bussing you, but now that that seems wrong do you really think he'd come after you as scum when he could just try to manipulate you instead? He seemed kinda eager about that scum read.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday, some of your paranoia of me reads as fake. It's not like our slot is any harder to read (at least, for

you

) if Tammy is doing most of the posting.

Reck (I didn't like his sitting out of the Waffles vs. Mollie thing, although it's not as scummy if Mollie is town)

why

like you guys alone have provided like four pages of spatting back and forth and getting pissy and emotional. I'm choosing not to waste my energy on parsing it since there's a likely chance it wouldn't help me glean any sort of useful information

I didn't like this post, in particular, the lazy part about how there was "probably scum in there." If you think you're not going to glean anything useful for it, then you can't backhandedly imply that the people involved in the bickering are scummy. I much preferred Prozac's reaction.

In retrospect, skimming the argument was the right move, because mollie is town. But I felt that Tammy didn't start out as all that pissy, and there were valid reasons to scumread mollie at that point. Mollie's buddies would have had a huge incentive to stay miles away from that and write it off as "lol crazy chicks!"

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So, Faraday, when you picture me scumhunting do you imagine I look like this?



Also, thanks for thinking my towntell isn't something like Tammy Gets Mad.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

because now we have to deal with a beloved princess LATER in the game.

Nuwen. Please. Pull your head out of your own ass.


kthx

^ missed the revelation. Regardless, known chronic lurker who claimed Miller is a fine D1 shot. It's what we would have done.

We like EagleKit too. The mollie vote is terribad.

Vote: Eaglekit

Oh wait before I crash. Why do you have a problem with eagles vote on mollie in particular and not cheery dogs, who voted her a few posts later?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Second CDB's and Triforce's questions to Reck (how can people not manage to find a single town OR scum read this game when some people are gimmes?); also:

Also Gamma is givin me the willie nillies not because he's scummy but because he's being useful which is anti gamma meta. like it's not town or scum it's just not gamma

WTF? Leaving aside that I have the exact opposite impression of Gamma's meta, he's being a complete flippant troll. Normally I find him a lot more analytical.

On that note, Gamma, your CDB vote is terrible. Why are you being so weird this game?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(Gamma's weird Eleven thing might actually be either a towntell or Eleven-buddy tell, though.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Allow me to channel my other head a sec...

AAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Desperado you are continuing to kill me. See that huddled mass in the corner there? Look closer. Yep, that's me and nope I'm not losing my religion, I'm crying for my fucking mommy.

I felt really good about mollie!scum until last night when I started reading her as town and then you show up and have my head spinning.

Here's the thing. I'm having a big problem seeing eagle as scum. Trifocals kinda insinuated with their question to eagle that he was following my read on mollie and I just can't see scum!desperado doing that to town!mollie. They've played a good number of games ogether and hydra together so there are certain expectations that mollie has for how desperado will behave and interact with her. It would be much easier for scum!desperado to give mollie what she's expecting from him and manipulate her instead of turn the eye of mordor on him by voting her and coming after her. I would just really expect in the situation that was unfolding for him to agree that yes I looked really scummy or maybe try to mediate or something. Idk, just not what he's doing. I mean I'm not the best reader of desperado, but the eagerness of his scum read feels really genuine.

I suppose some of this might fall apart if this is multiball, but Mina got the impression that it wasn't so I don't know.

ANYWAY I think eagle kit is town right now.

I don't. Like action dance, triforce, than or cheery dog and would be happy to wagon any of those. Mostly my dislike of cheery comes from not liking triforce and feeling a bit twitchy at them mentioning that eagles mollie vote was terribad and not even noticing cheery dogs vote too. Also cherry interaction with mollie felt kinda weird. Action dan is a hard person to read these days and I wish he'd go back to his old playstyle because he was easier to interact with than he is now, but I've developed a couple markers for town dan and he's shown none of them so far. Yah tan is just gut.

I'm confused by people's scum reads on reck because he doesn't feel anything like my partner in the red wedding, not in tone or activity.

I think Nuwen is town mostly because she had a post that said Nya Nya boo boo or something and it made me laugh but I didn't understand one of her posts, it had // and --> with people's names and this is mostly here as a reminder for me to ask her to translate that post, maybe.

Fates town, iecerent is town, faraday is probably town (I think you're town faraday, I just don't feel as confident as I did last weeks game), oh and ut is probs town.

Starting tomorrow I'll stop sucking at being a hydra partner, but I'm juggling too many things right now.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Fate, iec, Ythan, Waffles, mollie
Gamma, Axxle,, Nuwen (basically cos fate says so but)
PORO/UT/PIE/CDB
Triforce/Eagle/GAY
Action, Cheery

Huh. Sorting it out like that, I feel fairly confident/town as fuck in some cases about the top 2 lines and like confidentish for the moment about line 3. Some minor disagreements in order between us but that doesn't particularly matter.

(Hey, Mina, kittymo doesn't actually think you're obvtown, how about you start making good posts so I can give her something beyond "tammy's being a bit mental and the PM thing at the start seem Mina town". PLZ raise the standard of your posts, tyvm)

Um what's keeping kittymo from reading me herself? In last weeks game, week before last?, she said that she felt like she read me better than most on Skype and was able to read me based on my voice.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I guess the one thing that does seem weird about reck is Grimm? Not posting. Am I wrong that he hates being scum and isn't very good at it?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh yeah gamma feels kinda like he did in the wizard game, so um yeah don't know what I'm feeling about that but not too alarmed by his posting.

And I still like cdb

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Um what's keeping kittymo from reading me herself? In last weeks game, week before last?, she said that she felt like she read me better than most on Skype and was able to read me based on my voice.

Actually the voice clips you've posted so far don't work for us; I think that's the thing she's struggling with, mostly. (Nothing's "keeping her from reading you", other than she's deferring to my read. Oh, and it was a good chance to throw a barb at mina about her posts, since her LOL FAKE PARANOIA last night was stupid)

Oh okay

Carry on, except don't act like you don't tremble! It's very manly to admit it.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Yeah, I guess, but his push still feels like something he believes.

And hopefully mala feels better soon! Though I'm not sure I'm any better at reading her :/

Pedit: it's all been desperado.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

What did you think about what I wrote about my thoughts on the way he's been pushing you?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

It sounds nothing like mala. Mala has been v/la since Sunday. I haven't talked to her in days because she's been sick.

He said last night, "and she even knows it's me."

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Here's the thing. I'm having a big problem seeing eagle as scum. Trifocals kinda insinuated with their question to eagle that he was following my read on mollie and I just can't see scum!desperado doing that to town!mollie. They've played a good number of games ogether and hydra together so there are certain expectations that mollie has for how desperado will behave and interact with her. It would be much easier for scum!desperado to give mollie what she's expecting from him and manipulate her instead of turn the eye of mordor on him by voting her and coming after her. I would just really expect in the situation that was unfolding for him to agree that yes I looked really scummy or maybe try to mediate or something. Idk, just not what he's doing. I mean I'm not the best reader of desperado, but the eagerness of his scum read feels really genuine.

Read that mollie and tell me what you think of my take on it.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also don't really think eaglekit's posts were like actually scummy but just there. Actually kind of surprised that mollie didn't freak out @ their vote or call them out on it or just do anything given how obviously prickly she has been.

she knows it was me too which makes it even worse

you should vote her

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

waffles exists and really the only thing that pinged me about them was them jumping on the 'gammas being weird' train after other people had starting pointing me out

Oh yeah gamma feels kinda like he did in the wizard game, so um yeah don't know what I'm feeling about that but not too alarmed by his posting.

And I still like cdb

Can you point out how me essentially saying that you kinda feel like you did (as town mind you) in a recent game, so I'm not alarmed by your posting, but essentially dont' have a read on you is me 'jumping on the gamma's being weird train'?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

@waffles

On that note, Gamma, your CDB vote is terrible. Why are you being so weird this game?

Oh I should read my other head's posts, I guess.

but it's mina who cares what she says?

She was probably coming at it from the cdb vote. He's one of the people we both had as town early on. I think.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

OH I just realized what YNGO is :/

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: actiondan

comandeering our vote.

also, i still think reck is town.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

No, I've been trying like hell to figure out what pie or whoever has been referencing with YNGO.

I just realized it.

I'm not proud of how slow I am.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Y (our) N (ew) G (ay) O (verlords)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

- Eleven: "Don't actually believe Reck's claim". Ok... why? Nope. Nothing.

Pretty obviously a fake claim + flavour seems like a bunch of bullshit I'd say? Not sure you need reasons beyond that (Plz don't FAKECLAIM AS TOWN)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Let's see, let me guess. Can't be the second part, already said that. Can't be the first part since I'm right. OKAY.

Why is it a bunch of bullshit. Speak slowly I'm barging in this game as I didn't go to the meet. I mean if it is a fake claim, it would come from the mod, no? I mean I was in a game with Reck when he came up with a fake claim and asked the mod to give him flavor to fit it, so it would come from the mods.

Also, just his demeanor reads town, so I'm a bit thrown off that you're SO SURE.

Plus what's the benefit of claiming a day one beloved princess only.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Speak slowly I'm barging in this game as I didn't go to the meet

so I want to lynch this now

AHAHAHAHAHAHA

HEHEHEHEHEHE

HOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO

I'M GOING MAD.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Thoughts on waffles, prozac and gamma Cheery Dog?

All 3 are on my "meh, I'll develop a read later" list. (and so is practically everyone else)

Tammy, you skyped as twice while we were there, therefore you can be included as some form of at the meet. (even if what I remember about the skype calls was kayne)

<3

Thank you cheery dog!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also at the risk of sounding completely self-absorbed, I found it odd that triforce started grilling the hell out of cheery dog after I noted that it was odd that they didn't think cheery's vote on mollie was weird and that his interaction with her felt off.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Let's see, let me guess. Can't be the second part, already said that. Can't be the first part since I'm right. OKAY.

Why is it a bunch of bullshit. Speak slowly I'm barging in this game as I didn't go to the meet. I mean if it is a fake claim, it would come from the mod, no? I mean I was in a game with Reck when he came up with a fake claim and asked the mod to give him flavor to fit it, so it would come from the mods.

Also, just his demeanor reads town, so I'm a bit thrown off that you're SO SURE.

Plus what's the benefit of claiming a day one beloved princess only.

Hmm. Tell you what, just ask mina what she thinks? Surprised she hasn't like actually discussed the claim with you since she had such a hard on for reck early. I don't think you need to have been at the meet to see that someone being hated and a beloved princess is somewhat contradictory, though. (Like, sure getting lynched Day 1 = hated? That's fine, I buy that. Getting lynched Day 1 lots = beloved princess is iffy....but both together seem conradictory to me)

If I ask the mods to give me flavour for ":D smiley, depressed townie", I'm sure they'd do it, it doesn't mean it'd be as convincing as their actual prewritten flavour for actual roles, so that point seems silly.

Also not sure how AP handles fakeclaims, I checked his 2 micros earlier for roles and such (I already knew he liked millers as he ran a game with 2 of them) and he had a habit of not posting full role pms at the end (at least in sabotage I think) which was irksome, so it doesn't seem that impossible he'd not even provide flavour just a list of safe things to claim ala a lot of mods.
(Last question is silly, it's a free day 1 get out of jail card, which isn't the worst claim in the world as scum, + me and reck have claimed vengeful as scum and survived it, sometimes you don't really think these things through?)


Anyway, zzzz. What does Mina think of your actiondan vote? Did she get around to reading him?


Anyway, pretty sure if I was super sure I'd be voting him! I do think it's LIKELY a fakeclaim though! He does seem tonally pretty town at times though, so yeah. *shrug*

I have no idea what mina thinks of my action dan vote. Since my question to her if I could vote him has gone unanswered anyway.

The majority of what we've talked about has centered around mollie. she thinks she's town town town and I have some reservations. And eaglekit, she thinks I'm overthinking my town read on him.

THAT'S IT. Oh wait, I've also apologized for being the worst hydra partner ever and promised promised to be better starting today. I've also complained about someone that I'd rather not start yet another argument with, so that's pretty much the gist of our conversation.

The barging in was a joke based on the continued ridiculous assertions by someone I'm not going to get into another argument with but think it's fun to passive-aggressively assert my frustrations. That's probably be deliberately mean too. Who knows.

She hasn't said anything about his claim, so wooooo idk, when she signs back on grill her about it? I think anyone who's ever played with me knows that role claim issues aren't my strong suit so how you doin?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Speak slowly I'm barging in this game as I didn't go to the meet

so I want to lynch this now

AHAHAHAHAHAHA

HEHEHEHEHEHE

HOHOHOHOHOHOHOHO

I'M GOING MAD.

take your fake self-pitying bullshit somewhere where people give a fuck

it's sure not doing what it's designed to do, at any rate, but if you want to keep scumtelling be my guest

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

UT - If I didn't already think you were town, I'd call you town right now just because of how hard you made me laugh.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

That's not a very good reason to call someone town.

It's the best reason!

UT - If I didn't already think you were town, I'd call you town right now just because of how hard you made me laugh.

Your buddying offer has been: Accepted

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday, Tammy and I have almost never been online at the same time over the past few days. We mostly just play telephone tag on Skype with a handful of unexplained reads

and complaints from Tammy that mollie mischaracterized her

. (And to be honest, I still HAVEN'T reread ActionDan, but I think I'd tacitly approved a vote on him by PoE before she asked me.) Also, I've completely put this game on the back-burner, because I'm a terrible slacker and a much worse hydra partner than Tammy is.

The bulk of my opinions have been the same town reads everyone else has, so I felt like it was pointless to chime in when Tammy was already posting until I 1) had a better handle on the scummier players, and 2) was jumping headfirst into the action and had an active lead to follow. (Nothing has really changed since my last longwinded post, except that Gamma is looking more town and UT/Fate are increasingly obvtown. I never had an active

scum

read on YNGO, but disliked quite a few of their posts; that said, I know Reck can be pretty sloppy as town and see twinges of engagement and genuine frustration. Also, Tammy seems really confident that he's town.)

But coincidentally, before seeing your last few posts, I did just tell Tammy, "Um...actually, Reck is probably just gambiting, because upon reflection, the flavour is ridiculous." Except I didn't actually want to say this in the thread, because we're still not lynching him D1 no matter how annoying it is, it's not even an alignment tell for Reck, and I didn't want to encourage certain people. (Now it doesn't matter anymore.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Anyway, thanks for the shitty bus vote on AD

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(although I think you know I wouldn't make a shitty bus vote like that so yuck yuck yuck)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh. Also, I buy Triforce's survivor claim--the annoyance sells it. And I guess some hydra dissonance over Tammy's Eaglekit town read--I admittedly don't know either Mala or Desp as well as she does, but I think she's really overthinking it. And I found it weird that they switched between finding mollie town again after Tammy called her towh and then suspecting her again without missing a beat.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Guess which posts were me and which were Tammy!

To give your theory even more fuel, Faraday, actually, checking the Skype logs, I didn't even mention ActionDan to Tammy since like before we even voted mollie, and it was a really offhanded "he COULD be scum." So...never mind. Also, as much as I actually sympathize with your paranoia this time around, go away. Tonight is a really bad time for me to start playing the game.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also,

as much as I actually sympathize with your paranoia this time around

, go away.

Wait a minute. Never mind. I actually just ISO'd my slot. I don't sympathize at all. It's

Tammy

. Why are you even going through the motions?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

If youre actually town I might strangle you

Please don't strangle mina she's a girl too and it's not nice to be brutal to girls didn't your mother teach you anything?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I'm admittedly gullible when it comes to this kind of shit, but the claim is just oddly specific, and the way they claimed (talking about not surviving until endgame and wanting). It also feels as though they came clean.

So you sympathize with my paranoia but then reread to make sure. Right ok. Ignoring you until near the end of day. Go away until I decide if that's fake stupid or just you making no sense whatsoever.

Okay, it's obvious you're genuinely annoyed, so I'll leave you alone.

I can sympathize with you being paranoid of

me

. For one thing, notwithstanding the colour thing (which I was evasive about), I haven't actually done anything this game, and I could have totally faked what I

have

done. And my memory of Tammy's most recent posts was that they were somewhat trollish and fluffy, since she was a goofy mood, so I could maybe buy a scumread. But then I ISO'd myself to see your PoV, and was confused by why you of all people didn't pick up on certain signs in Tammy's posts. (On a side note, am I the only one who ISOs myself? Am I just really self-absorbed?) You have the right to question us, but I wanted to know where your read was coming from and how sincere/organic it was, particularly when you were one of the first to declare us town, had us in your top town tier, and crowed about your 100% Tammy reading accuracy.

Also, if you really think about it, me doing nothing in a Tammy hydra should make you less paranoid! Just take a deep breath, relax, and realize that it doesn't matter at all this game that I could hypothetically play you like a fiddle if I were scum. ^_^

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I didn't proofread that. Gah. What I mean is that all the stuff about debating claiming right away etc. looks real. This might sound like crazy hippie talk, but I also feel like the tone of their posts became more

relaxed

after the Survivor claim, which is a sign they're being more honest/transparent than before the claim.

I'm kind of tempted to use Triforce as a doctor on a leash, actually.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh. Also, I buy Triforce's survivor claim--the annoyance sells it. And I guess some hydra dissonance over Tammy's Eaglekit town read--I admittedly don't know either Mala or Desp as well as she does, but I think she's really overthinking it.

And I found it weird that they switched between finding mollie town again after Tammy called her towh and then suspecting her again without missing a beat.

that's pretty amazing considering it never happened

I think she's referring to when you responded to me telling you that you were killing me because I had just read mollie as town when you started calling her scum and you said that the posts on that page looked better. She probably took that as you town reading her at that point because you dropped off and left the thread after that.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So you sympathize with my paranoia but then reread to make sure. Right ok. Ignoring you until near the end of day. Go away until I decide if that's fake stupid or just you making no sense whatsoever.

Okay, it's obvious you're genuinely annoyed, so I'll leave you alone.

So, why didn't you assume Tammy was OBVTOWN, isn't that her whole meta as town? Instead you were...just sympathetic? Kay.

Um are you reading our posts? Because she quite literally already answered this:

I

I can sympathize with you being paranoid of

me

. For one thing, notwithstanding the colour thing (which I was evasive about), I haven't actually done anything this game, and I could have totally faked what I

have

done. And my memory of Tammy's most recent posts was that they were somewhat trollish and fluffy, since she was a goofy mood, so I could maybe buy a scumread. But then I ISO'd myself to see your PoV, and was confused by why you of all people didn't pick up on certain signs in Tammy's posts. (On a side note, am I the only one who ISOs myself? Am I just really self-absorbed?) You have the right to question us, but I wanted to know where your read was coming from and how sincere/organic it was, particularly when you were one of the first to declare us town, had us in your top town tier, and crowed about your 100% Tammy reading accuracy.

Also, if you really think about it, me doing nothing in a Tammy hydra should make you less paranoid! Just take a deep breath, relax, and realize that it doesn't matter at all this game that I could hypothetically play you like a fiddle if I were scum. ^_^

Oh wait you had to read that part because it's just under the part that you quoted. IN CASE that wasn't clear. Mina feels like she's been somewhat scummy because she hasn't gotten into the game yet because as she said before she's been lazy and let me take the lead mostly. Oh my gosh she's self-aware, must be a scum tell, killitdead...or you know it's just Mina. Like I don't get any of this post because none of it makes sense coming from someone who knows either of us.

And she didn't assume that I was obvtown, partly because last night I was being somewhat trollish because I was in a silly mood, which is a bit of a town tell for me just so you know. (She also thinks my reading people as town is silly, but I think she has no soul because it's a slam dunk town tell I mean have you ever played with me?) Also also, most of my messages to her on skype are me apologizing for being a terrible hydra partner this week and promising that when the weekend comes I'll be better.

Oh, what's your (slot or otherwise) READ ON ME. Plz don't waffle just give me an answer xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox because my alignment is definitely not obvious at all but even so your whole post just now spoke to me like I was town which is strange even if I was hypothetically TOWN AS FUCK (which I totally am definitely not obviously town)

This is like the laziest tell anyone uses. (See I can use that word too!) Town talk to other people like they're town all the time even people they suspect. Imagine that! Also, her being polite and recognizing that she might just be annoying you isn't strange.

I'd say considering that in my reads list in Post 568 I called you town, though not with the same confidence I had in the game a couple weeks ago, and that Mina talked about her town read on you (you should remember that one you were all oh why'd you call me town specifically. Also, why is it weird that you would be someone we'd want to sort first? Seems an odd question) that we're prrrrrrrrrrobably reading you as town. Not sure though you can check back later!

Mina has had some faranoia of you here and there but thinks it's unwarranted due to some of your actions not making sense from a faraday!scum game.

(Also tammy's scumhunting has looked lazy and half hearted most of the time?)

No it hasn't. The only only thing you can say is that I'm not being really active and that's even stretching it a bit as I feel like I've been pretty active even with all the things I was juggling this week and the other commitments I've had. That and there are a lot of big personalities in this game who are clashing at the moment, and when it's like this, this is how I play. I'm still trying to figure out what I think about mollie because I don't think she looks as town as everyone else does, but it's not something that I want to get into because i don't know how much it's based on confirmation bias of an early scum read or the fact that whenever she does mention me it's to say again that I was deliberately mean and catty when how the fuck anyone can think that because I was scumreading her literally drives me out of my mind ESPECIALLY when you take into account the fact that twice she's expressed that I shouldn't be here and is the one to literally personally attack me. And no, I'm not completely still over that, maybe I would be but since she doesn't drop it and keeps on with the "Tammy's mean!" shtick. I'd say the fact that I'm stepping back and not letting her bait me again is pretty damn awesome of me and not lazy and not half hearted, and I mean i guess that's somewhat negated by something I said last night and this here but hey Mina gets to listen to me complain about it why not you too!

Oh, that secret scumread. Wasn't a him. Plz start squirming tamina!!! (Dw,there's like your whole buddies to lynch in a row first anyway?)

CONGRATULATIONS!!!

How does it feel to be

WRONG???

There's nothing to squirm about because we're town and quite frankly I'm surprised you don't see it. Maybe other people wouldn't see it but you know your 100% ability to read me correctly kinda takes a hit when you don't see what makes me obviously town here.

But gosh I expect a lovely tunnel to come and won't that be fun. It's been awhile since that happened. Do you have your wife beaters ready?

Or you know you could skip all that nonsense, read me correctly, and then have all the fun!

Oh. Yeah. Why ARE you guys voting ActionDan?

Because as I said in my reads list you apparently didn't read, he was one of the people I had scum reads on and wouldn't mind wagoning. I think Dan is hard to read, but I've developed a couple markers that I think denote when he's town and he hasn't done any of those yet. Also, posts that say nothing but beep boop don't inspire me to think they're town when they're doing literally nothing else.

Gosh this was a fun chat, I look forward to more posts about you telling me I'm the scum I'm not.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I'm gonna let it slide because we're buddied up and everything

but come on

yay! we're town buddies though...you'll see the town part eventually.

Also there was nothing wrong with that post. I don't agree with Mina, and I think she made an assumption, but I can see where she was going with it.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

And she didn't assume that I was obvtown,

Yes, that is indeed curious.

I"m not going to talk to you if you insist on annoying me. And I'm not going to let you troll me into screaming like a lunatic.

But is it too mcuh to fucking ask that you read the entirety of sentences. If I'm going oh I'm sorry, I'm sucking as a hydra partner I'll get to this game at the end of the week, then why would she automatically assume that.

Like can you read the entier thing?

And stop annoyin gme please!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

But is it too mcuh to fucking ask

Ask what?


I think eaglekit is probably scum, now. I don't really like desp's narrow focus, I don't really know how that impacts mollie's alignment but he doesn't seem to particularly care about his wagon, he's just parking his vote there sort of lazily atm.


Oh, was also thinking survivor might be less likely (or third party in general) given the red/black and there not like, being a third colour of card but I've no idea how that was handled f2f so it's whatever.

Still want Action Man dead though. I mean, his lynch is just a gimme at this stage.

*shakes fist*

I'm not particularly concerned about that right now. I looked at a few of desperado's games earlier, and while he was more engaged in most of them, he was more engaged in his games as scum as well. He's got a pretty decent scum game, so I don't think the narrow focus is necessarily a product of alignment. I do *think* that sometimes he has a slow start in large games. I still think those string of posts the other night look town from him. The eagerness of pushing mollie sounded like he thought he had something and was going after it. It's unlike how I've seen him as scum in a couple games. Hopefully he'll start being more engaged or mala will get better and catch up and make that more readable, but I still think town. Although Mina will probably agree with you though; she doesn't really like my town read there.

I have no idea about the survivor role stuff. Mina will have to talk to you about that.

~~~~~

Oh look one of my suspects is voting me. How quaint.

We're still town UT. That's not going to change.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh I forgot, Gammas recent posting sounds more townish and Triforce sounds town-minded if not explicitly town.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Tammy, I'm not going to log into Skype right now because then I'll never wind up doing my running, but I'm pretty sure UT was talking about Triforce. And yes, that was exactly what I meant about Eaglekit's posts--he comes in continuing to push mollie's lynch, we say that we're actually finding her town now, and he says, "Uh, yeah, mollie's posts got better on this page" (implying that his scumread on her has weakened--I did agree with him that the "bitch" post was roughly the dividing line between scummy-mollie and townie-mollie). It's pretty obvious that he's agreeing that she's

less

suspicious. But then he comes back and seems to be merrily scumreading mollie again without reflection. Eagle, what changed? And I still think outright

townreading

Eagle in this game based on his mollie stance--or anything he's done this game--takes too much mental gymnastics.

That was an interesting vote, Cheery Dog. (Eleven, you should totally join the wagon!) Define "sappiness." Why do you think it's a scumtell?

Still want Action Man dead though. I mean, his lynch is just a gimme at this stage.

Is it because he's lurking, because we're obviously bussing him, or because of a deeper reason?

(Also, Tammy responded to your posts better than I could have. But I thought you getting that pissed off at me for discrediting your questioning of us was a towntell. And why is it that shocking that I didn't realize she was "obvtown Tammy" until I reread? I wasn't all that caught up with the game, I knew she was too busy to post really actively, and her most recent posts were calling UT town for

making a joke

and posting trolly reaction GIFs. Then I saw the full picture and was paranoid that none of this registered for you. In particular, I think her

conviction

that our slot was town should have been a clue. Your reasons weren't as silly as UT's, but I still feel like you should have known better.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Actually, I like Tammy's new and improved reasons for liking Desp better than the "he wouldn't attack mollie" thing.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh. Also, UT's AIDS infector theory fits pretty well. (A win condition of making everyone wear green shirts fits more than Shea randomly being a survivor.) So yeah, they're probably lying through their teeth about aspects of their role, and possibly the doc protection part, too. No idea if AIDS-infector type roles win independently or along with a faction. Lynch wagons on a claimed ambiguous third-party just feel lazy, though.

(I could see black = scum, red = town, green(?) = third party, so it's not completely impossible.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Ahem. I already had town read on UT. I said if I didn't already think he was town, I'd think he was town for making me laugh.

Funny people are town. I don't understand why people have a problem with this.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Counterexample: mentat.

</split personality disorder>

Something I noticed based on the rules:

NOTES FOR THIS GAME SPECIFICALLY

1. Your alignment will not change over the course of this game.
2.

Anti-town factions will be given relevant fake roles and flavor.

3. Sample VT role PM

Bold added. I think this makes it very unlikely that Triforce is scum because TriforceScum probably has a town fakeclaim.. It is possible that Triforce is actually a relatively anti-town 3rd party, but it is not likely that they are scum.

Eh. I think that means stuff like Mafia Trackers having Town Tracker fakeclaim. Triforce could be a Mafia goon with a VT fakeclaim who invented this themselves. I still think it's much more likely they're an AIDS-infector variant, though.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I 100% do?

flavored doctor sounds plausible on its own, why even bother with the survivor part? it's needlessly complex (aka likely the truth).

This is actually a good point.

I think

UT is stoking the flames and adding a new layer of Stuff To Fear.

unvote

for now

Hey, Nuwen, can you just come out and say, "I am scumreading UT," rather than throw around this kind of soft shit?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

People are just making me sad this game.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I 100% do?

flavored doctor sounds plausible on its own, why even bother with the survivor part? it's needlessly complex (aka likely the truth).

This is actually a good point.

No, it isn't. Put on your Mafia 101 cap and take a wild guess as to what happens on N1 to the claimed protown protective role.

Not including our win con would have been suicidal.


As an aside, I'm p sure that role would be stupidly OP of it were protown. Every night it either protects a town player or makes itself immune to a scumbag? Seriously, kids.

You do realize that the point she's agreeing with is that the way you claimed sounds like it's the truth, right?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

But it's been used in other games too. Quadz/UT used it in Anything Goes, which Angry Pidgeon played in. So, it is possible, I guess but I'm not the role specialist, that's Mina.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I wonder if the green shirt recipients also give green shirts to whomever they target? Cuz that's along the lines of the aids infector.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I 100% do?

flavored doctor sounds plausible on its own, why even bother with the survivor part? it's needlessly complex (aka likely the truth).

This is actually a good point.

I think

UT is stoking the flames and adding a new layer of Stuff To Fear.

unvote

for now

Hey, Nuwen, can you just come out and say, "I am scumreading UT," rather than throw around this kind of soft shit?

Why is your tone hostile in this post?

I'd maybe call that aggressive (I'm a lot less "sweetness and light" than you'd expect in forum Mafia), but not hostile. Now answer the question and commit to an actual stance on UT. I don't 't think you've had many opinions that aren't tangential sideswipes or null dis

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I still haven't got the hang of this new phone, so it was easier to just submit that. EBWOP: I don't think you've said much that isn't a tangential sideswipe or debating the merits of vigging a miller vs. a beloved princess.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I have to say, this is the first time I've ever heard someone call asking questions too AGGRESSIVELY a scumtell.

The reason your comments provoked that tone is that your comments were

scummy

. Yes, you think UT is trying to "spook the cattle." What are his motives for doing this? Why did you feel the need to

post

that he's doing this? What should the town do about him doing this? Has your opinion of UT changed at all because he's doing this?

Without any context or anything resembling an actual

read

on UT (or on anyone), that post sounds suspiciously like either filler to look busy or backhanded undermining of him. Instead of turning the question around on me, why don't you answer me and prove this interpretation of that post wrong?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

^@Nuwen, obviously.

Fate, why is she town?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

*twitch*

Okay!!!! This game! ^___________^

ActionDan seems like he's given up at this point--his posts don't even have the tiniest spark of town rage or genuineness. This feels kind of like an inevitability, but there are a few people I'd be

very

interested in hearing weigh in on things first.

^@Nuwen, obviously.

Fate, why is she town?

shes easy to read...

you can try to crosskill her if you want

*twitch*

*twitch* *twitch*

^_______________________^

I'm going to be a lot nicer than I want to be in response to this, and ask you once again to

please

persuade me that Nuwen is town and that you're not either completely ass-backwards about everything this game or scum who can fake looking really town while stoned out of your mind. Entertain for five minutes that we're town who ACTUALLY want to lock this read in and not obvious scum due to this Mina/Tammy hydra being so uncharacteristically waffly.

I think Waffles is more likely to be scum than triforce, triforce is likely to be a third party (but any other part of their claim might be horseshit, like the protection), and that UT's erraticism is genuine but not pro-town in the case I pointed out.

I haven't heard anyone speak the same words, Icerint. I definitely haven't read a case f Waffles, except for Faraday's winks and jovial hints. If I missed it, link me because I'm at the skim + narrow focus reading stage.

I think Iecerint was talking about "Don't-lynch-the-claimed-third-party." Also, does your confident scumread on us stem from that single sentence, or is there more to it? If it's the former, consider me sceptical, particularly considering the timing and the stretchy reaction to what I think was a pretty normal reaction to have to that post. I mean, I know your reasoning tends to be idiosyncratic, but usually in an insightful and astute way. This is pretty below par for you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Ythan, please play in a way that doesn't make "scum dayvigs are OP" the only reason to townread you.

Anyway, Waffles are pretty not obviously scum, just pretty not obviously town.

Huh. This isn't the reaction I was expecting at

all

from you to this post.

Also, why do you find Cheery Dog's read shift on us more notable than Fate's or Nuwen's?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(Okay, in all fairness, "scum dayvigs impulsively shooting lynchable town millers for middling town cred are stupid" is also a decent reason.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

You should probably vote me. YOUR VOTES ONLY MAKE ME STRONGER. (Not literally, by the way)

P.s. why did you guys change your avatar? Did you notice people townread me for it and tried to do the same?

We thought the face-kitty avatar would make people think that we were on the Spooky Kitty faction. So we changed it to the Sleeping Kitty faction to signal to our towniness...

...fuck. Uh, what I meant to say is, I asked the mods, and they volunteered the information that the Spooky Kitty faction is the scumteam this game! (Phew, that'll

definitely

work.)

Also, why do you find Cheery Dog's read shift on us more notable than Fate's or Nuwen's?

Easier mislynch of the 3, I felt.

Fate's town, and you/nuwen is an interesting thing I'm going read with EYES PEELED. (Worth pointing out you seemed fairly fine with Nuwen's contribution up until the point she called you out, was it

that

scummy?)

Wait. I called

her

out first for that pointless post about UT. Then she called out my calling out of her for "hostility" and "hyper-aggro."

I had like a weird "playing kind of scummy, but oh, this wacky role spec post gives me kind of good gut vibes" "I've only skimmed the game once" nullish read on her early on. But then her play continued to be pretty lacklustre and focus on really irrelevant aspects of the game. It's not IMPOSSIBLE she's just really disengaged, but the pattern is more unsettling the longer it continues.

(That's the only time I even mentioned her due to my inactivity. Unless it's hydra dissonance, because Tammy called Nuwen town...for saying "nya nya boo boo," so you can completely disregard her opinion.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

See, on the one hand, I feel bad pressing you too much on this when you got so pissed off the last time I implied doubting our holy towniness was a scumtell. And your read on us is a lot more nuanced and less superficial than UT's/Cheery Dog's/Nuwen's/Fate's/mollie's.

On the other hand, I still find it kind of weird that you're

not

townreading Tammy. Because I frankly feel that regardless of "oh, no, Mina's tone is KIND OF BLAND HERE,"/"She could totally FAKE this reads list!" paranoia, there have been certain, um, pretty obvious markers that we're town. And I think it's somewhat plausible that other people might miss them (or latch onto stuff like "OVERDEFENSIVE!" "WAFFLING!"), but you know Tammy like the back of your hand.

I'll stick to just ignoring you for now.

p-edit: I did ISO myself, because Tammy messaged me to go, "I called Nuwen town, so that's probably what confused him," (she can't respond herself). What's wrong with that?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also, does your confident scumread on us stem from that single sentence, or is there more to it? If it's the former, consider me sceptical, particularly considering the timing and the stretchy reaction to what I think was a pretty normal reaction to have to that post. I mean, I know your reasoning tends to be idiosyncratic, but usually in an insightful and astute way. This is pretty below par for you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(Actually, we may get back to you on Nuwen now that I'm ISOing someone who

isn't

myself for a change.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I feel compelled to admit that I now remember the lines of questioning and posts that I liked tonally from Nuwen (also, I like that she

picked up

on the fact that I'd ISO'd myself). Still want her to elaborate on the scumread, and to see what happens when she's more invested in the game.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Desperado - you keep killing me. I'm thinking way too much about mollie as it is and when I convince myself she's town, you come in pushing her as scum. I feel all aaaaaaaaah. I want mollie to be scum though, so you're making it hard. At the end of day I had her ad most likely scum, then I read her reads list and went town, then read Olympian gods and went scum, then read you guys iso in street cars and decided she was town. I don't know what to think at this point.

Okay you guys are weird about what post someone voted in being scummy.

Also nuwens point about gamma voting her before she posted being a coincidence is weird, I don't see the point. Although Mina came around to liking the tone of the post I called Nuwen town for, but we would still like her to answer the question Mina asked her twice yesterday. Her post today is kinda eh.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

UT is pushing way too fucking hard for this whole inactivity around the dan lynch thing being where we hunt

Dan wagon definitely had bussing on it and the surrounding nonvotes on the dan wagon seemed to come from a place of apathy? Yesterday ended pretty abruptly iirc (at least I remember checking the thread again and going 'wtf day is over?')

pedit: @Eleven: Uh what? Really wasn't fakeclaiming. We're effectively VT now. That's actually our role. Though you seem to be very upset about it so I don't know what to tell you. This will probably result in Faraday making this exact post at endgame:

well uh reck+grimm's role was pretty dumb and im not sure what the point was but ok?

R u upset ur gonna be lynched today????

You actually think Reck is fakeclaiming

scum

now (as opposed to just fakeclaiming Reck), Faraday? This is a turnaround from yesterday.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Eleven, it's a very productive use of my time, because I found that post

scummy

if I'm interpreting it the way I think I'm interpreting it. If I'm wrong, now is when you backtrack and explain what you totally meant instead.

But ooh, go ahead. Do you want to push a lynch on us? Do it. Do it! I bet it'll DEFINITELY work!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The wcs of lynching reck yesterday is very different from the wcs today.

My point is that I thought Faraday was implying that it was an alignment-null fakeclaim on D1 (which is what I thought, knowing Reck). Now he's interacting with Reck in a weird backhanded way that feels less like standard Faratrolling than like leaving himself open to joining a wagon if one develops. (FTR, I reread the beginning of the game, and although I've admittedly been fooled by Reck before, I don't actually think he looks scummy here.)

Faraday, you can read us like the back of your hand. I think you should 1v1 us!

(We were actually going to vote Axxle, and I feel like a terrible person for actually being dissuaded by the self-meta post--I think there's some truth to it.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

@Iecerint: you ninja'd me, and I think it's less Axxle's meta (I know nothing whatsoever about it) than I just think scum in general are less likely to call attention to themselves like that.

@Faraday: was I that obvious? Mostly because I was planning to

hardclaim

(at least partially) today, anyway, so I figured I might as well have some fun first.

Ooh, before I infodump, what do you think I'm softclaiming?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So I'm going to put my other head and faraday in detention if they can't get along.

Faraday I know you're not reading us as scum because of the way you interacted with us yesterday, but Mina is concerned about you because other than early in the day you didn't actually proclaim us as town so she thinks you're holding back on that and it's one of the things that is making her paranoid of you.

We're not an innocent child, but once we claim our alignment will become obvious so sorrynotsorry for any Waffles are scum who bussed AD posts that are in the works. Mina has things she wants to do and we do need to claim it before the end of day, so no ending until that's done!

waffle moar

you should see our skype chat!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday, you're being a pretty huge dick, because I think my question was reasonable and you blew it off (also, maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get the impression at ALL that you seriously suspected Reck; also, you thinking CDB isn't obvtown is a scumtell; also, I think you expecting ActionDan to flip town looks fake because ActionDan was FUCKING REALLY REALLY REALLY OBVIOUSLY flipping scum after he'd self-voted), but anyway:

1) We are a JOAT variant. (Seems like Dan would've been screwed if he'd ever claimed, but anyway.) Explaining more would give away our flavour, and see 5).

2) We shot Triforce last night. (Sorry for auto-losing you the game, guys! We mostly believed your claim, but you were a huge distraction and we were too big pussies--pun intended--to go for a flashier kill with the short D1. Besides, you were dangerous with Iecerint's role.)

3) We are claiming partly because it's useful information about the set-up (both because it tells people there's only one scum faction and because it helps evaluate Ythan's role--FWIW, I think both are compatible, particularly given a certain aspect of ours I won't claim yet), but mostly because:

4) Our second ability is a one-shot modified hide. If there are two deaths tonight and one of them is us, you can basically be sure that we targeted scum. (Due to the "modified" factor, it's not COMPLETELY impossible if we're the only death, but I checked with the mods and hides can't be roleblocked.) Unfortunately, we won't flip as a hider, which is why claiming rather than leaving an obvious breadcrumb like, "IF I DIE, TAMMY IS SCUM!" is necessary.

5) At the end of the day, I will post a list of all the players in the game next to letters of the alphabet. We will say something like, "The first letter of the first X-letter word of our flavour name corresponds to our target." If we die that night, the player next to that letter is the person we targeted. So if there are two deaths and one of them is us that night. (I checked with the mods and hides can't be roleblocked, but there's an element to the "modified" that wouldn't make it completely impossible our target was town if we were the only death that night. It's not the likeliest event, but I don't want to unwittingly frame someone postmortem.) This way, the scum can't try to take us out by killing our target.

6) I feel like we should probably be close-lipped today about our suspects to make whoever we target more unpredictable, but it might be hard for us to keep this promise.

I'd say, "Any questions?" but I probably won't answer them. Have a nice day!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(Oops, I repeated myself. Way to ruin the glorious effect of my claim post! )

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Hey, Faraday, Tammy says dickishness is a scumtell for you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday, I think you're really overreacting to us just occasionally looking at you sideways once in a while. But there's not much point continuing this.

If there are two deaths tonight and one of them is us, you can basically be sure that we targeted scum.

(Well, unless our breadcrumb points to the NK victim, obviously. In which case, WELP!)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday, I think you're really overreacting to us just occasionally looking at you sideways once in a while. But there's not much point continuing this.

Ok ty for the life advice xoxo

so glad you guys are getting along now. thank you for taking her advice!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Shush. I'm a confirmed town PR in a hydra with Tammy. I don't

have

to read the game. .___.

(On that note, I have *thoughts*, but I'm afraid to say what they are and make our action predictable. Faraday, can you sell me on Axxle!Town, though? I didn't like his Triforce and mollie votes.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

IIRC Nuwen and some other people kind of ignored the ActionDan wagon for no reason and kind of pushed other things. I think this is the way to lynch today.

I will review D1 sometime and find these people.

I ignored the fuck out of it because nobody ever actually gave me a good reason for voting him.

like the only person who actually engaged me regarding dan was Faraday who just went PROVE HE'S TOWN

Well you don't count anyway because you have a really good avatar.

I forgot to mention this before, but ahem, there is no better avatar than mine. That is my cat. Look how cute he is and go awwwwwwweeeeeeee.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get the impression at ALL that you seriously suspected Reck

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p5730166


plz DO read my posts. townies should read EVERY post and not be anti town.

I will vote someone when I'm more sure, CDB. I don't really know who's MOST LIKELY scum with Dan yet.

I still think day 1 townreads are probably all right, I'm less sure on Pie due to POE and he sorta of felt fadey as the day went on a bit but other than that I'm trying to POE it. Well I was also trying to step away from the game a bit since I'm angry at people suspecting me, since it's really fucking retarded (IN MY OPINION ) and I don't want to ruin any fun kittymo might be getting from the game.



I definitely think the axxle wagon is bad though, idr get why anyone suspects him other than the fact he makes some weird posts.

Will a hug make everything better?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also, does your confident scumread on us stem from that single sentence, or is there more to it? If it's the former, consider me sceptical, particularly considering the timing and the stretchy reaction to what I think was a pretty normal reaction to have to that post. I mean, I know your reasoning tends to be idiosyncratic, but usually in an insightful and astute way. This is pretty below par for you.

NUWEN

Now that your answer can't be "lulz I don't talk to my scum readz" do you think you could answer mina's question here, cuz I'd love to see your thought process.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

(basically what we would like to see is elaboration on the scum read.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So Mina thinks my inability to get a townread on mollie is emotion-based. I think it's partly the Ruth, but also think it's on her not actually trying to figure out the game.

It's a quandary.

Hopefully the mala head of evangel will start posting soon!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So Mina thinks my inability to get a townread on mollie is emotion-based. I think it's partly the Ruth,

but also think it's on her not actually trying to figure out the game.

It's a quandary.

Hopefully the mala head of evangel will start posting soon!

LIES!

put eagle things back into scum

what does my wanting mala to post have to do with eagle's alignment? At the end of day yesterday you called them scum, at the beginning of day today you called them town, why are they scum now?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I was thinking if waffles was scum, then the way in which they posted pointed to possible cosying up.

Serious question. Are you reading the game?

Also, translate this into English? If we were scum (and if you think this you aren't reading the game therefore my earlier statement that you aren't trying to figure things out completely stands), would we be more likely to "cozy up" to town or scum?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Waffles, I thought your self-consciousness and attention to your own details betrayed a pretty nasty amount of concentration not congruent with game's actual state. You were hyper interested, hyper invested, and very nervous about your OWN posts. Those are scum slanted qualities. I don't know why people read extreme investment as town, because in my experience town are bored/most disinterested Day 1. You read like proactive scum.

Faraday says you're town and that's fine enough for me, because Faraday is town

I thought it had to do with the hostile tone of Mina's question to you? (Have you ever played with Mina before, she's pretty self-aware regardless of alignment.)

(What's amusing is I can pretty much pinpoint Faraday's paranoia on me maybe not being town because I wasn't as invested on day one and I had a bit of a slow start this game.)

So, your read on us is based on Faraday's read, there's nothing else impacting that? Faraday thought we were town yesterday.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I was thinking if waffles was scum, then the way in which they posted pointed to possible cosying up.

Serious question. Are you reading the game?

Also, translate this into English? If we were scum (and if you think this you aren't reading the game therefore my earlier statement that you aren't trying to figure things out completely stands),

would we be more likely to "cozy up" to town or scum?

why would you need to cosy up to scum?

like srsly that does not make sense

you guys are not right

eta: 1 is probs scum were they giving you a reach out

Are you allergic to answering questions?

1.) Are you reading the game?

2.) Are you calling us scum cosying up to eaglekit?

3.) Are you calling us town needing Mala to post and that's why you changed your mind in that one post that eaglekit was scum?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So Mina thinks my inability to get a townread on mollie is emotion-based. I think it's partly the Ruth,

but also think it's on her not actually trying to figure out the game.

It's a quandary.

Hopefully the mala head of evangel will start posting soon!

LIES!

put eagle things back into scum

what does my wanting mala to post have to do with eagle's alignment? At the end of day yesterday you called them scum, at the beginning of day today you called them town, why are they scum now?

ALSO MOLLIE ANSWER THIS.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Nuwen - What does you and mollie not being on the wagon have anything to do with it? And why when you point out a townsperson like you wasn't on the wagon, you need to also point out that a townsperson like mollie wasn't on the wagon?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: mollie

Sorry mina I can't. I just can't.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The only way mollie is town here is if she's literally sinking the hell out of her town game so she doesn't get caught so fast when she's scum because this is her scum game.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

wow shooting mollie would have literally been more pro town

You don't know how close she came to getting a vig shot in the face. If it would have just been me, I probably would have, but we went for the more practical take out the claimed survivor route because that would have been a distraction for today.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

this really isn't a good time for me so if you are town back the fuck off if you are scum carry on

You blew my care-o-meter for what time it is for you Yesterday. You don't get to ask me to back off anymore. Not this game, sorry.

You can start acting like you're town though. That will get me to back off, until then. Nope sorry. But have a good day

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I am a person; I'm a person who's fed up. You don't say the shit she has to me this game, then post this when I ask her questions. Then ask me to back off. Yeah, nope sorry. You don't start shit, then go it's a bad time for me can you lay off?

this is why you are scum: asking stupid shit that has already been covered but you are not asking in a sincere way

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Please don't ever sign up for a game I'm in. Thanks in advance. Have a nice day.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

i still don't really know why you think mollie is scum though tammy, she just seems off the wall completely wtf...i mean i guess it could be sort of fake bit it///s a very weird strategy idk????

The problem is she's not trying to figure out the game. When town, Mollie puts a great deal of thought into the game and even when she has off the wall reasons for thinking someone is scum you can still see her thought process. You can still see it's coming from town. She tends to get paranoid of people and suspect them based on that paranoia but you can see when the paranoia is there. Do you remember your upick? She got paranoid about Thor and decided he was scum for a little bit because he agreed with something she said and since he usually argues with her and says she's not logical, him agreeing with her on something had to mean he was scum.

I'm not seeing that type of paranoia here. I'm seeing just flat out off the wall/wacko/mean-spirited hostile play. She's just throwing out scum reads; I don't get a sense that she actually believes anything she's saying. She seems more like she's trolling the game than trying to figure it out. My claim should have and I believe would have given her second thought if she were town. She's playing much more like how she played when she was scum in Mario Bros than when I've seen her as town in our other games.

I do think she has the potential to be a traitor though because the way that Fate and Nuwen are kinda buddying her is weird.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Please don't ever sign up for a game I'm in. Thanks in advance. Have a nice day.

^ bitchy

I have said the exact same words a couple of times and every time I knew I was being a bitch.

things changed and the people I said this to well we have made up.

I don't think we will tho.

Nope we probably won't because it would take you recognizing something you refuse to.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Other waffle here briefly.

i still don't really know why you think mollie is scum though tammy, she just seems off the wall completely wtf...i mean i guess it could be sort of fake bit it///s a very weird strategy idk????

I think Tammy is being much more aggressive/hostile than she needs to be (although you haven't exactly been a bucket of charm at certain points yourself), and I'm also a bit worried she's not entirely objective on mollie because of their fight. But according to her, mollie DOES play this loopy and completely off the wall (and also shamelessly fakes AtEs) as scum. I'm going to read the Mario game myself tonight and see how it compares.

By the way, as much as I'm still kind of bitter over some of the stuff Faraday said and a teensy bit tempted to fake paranoia just to piss him off, I might as well come out and say I've lost my Faranoia, since I just realized my reasons for not wanting to share a town read on him don't work when I actually think he's town.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Waffles are confirmed town fate, they vifged triforce


I had a town read on them at end of day anyway but mina/tammy are fun to not explicitly say that to.

meh I still think some of their posts have been pretty questionable

and mollie says there are still two scumteams. maybe each scumteam has a scum Joat and Mina wants to ride on the conftown status for awhile?

At the risk of sounding self-absorbed, can you elaborate on the bolded? You were pretty vague about it on D1. And why are you taking mollie's word for the two scumteams (the JOAT theory is unnecessary for us to have crosskilled Triforce, by the way)? Also, why is Gamma not in your town tiers?

(Guys there's not even an eleven of hearts in a deck, how crazy is that!)

I'm embarrassed to admit I didn't notice this until now.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I was going to ask that question, but decided to drop it, but fate actually pushing a two scum team theory is so lol it makes me worried about him.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday - you want to stand by that fate town read?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

He actually believes that fate!town would peddle the multiball nonsense? Yeah no, sorry, I don't buy it.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I want to ram my head into several walls right now.

I...just...

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Waffles are confirmed town fate, they vifged triforce


I had a town read on them at end of day anyway but mina/tammy are fun to not explicitly say that to.

meh I still think some of their posts have been pretty questionable and mollie says there are still two scumteams. maybe each scumteam has a scum Joat and Mina wants to ride on the conftown status for awhile?

I have too many townreads is the real problem

This says he is.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Waffles is likely lying.

This is what's up.

And if this is because he dayvigged someone then I partially get it, but.

If this is the basis for the "they're lying" then either our death tonight while handing you scum on a platter will confirm our telling the truth or we're alive with a confirmed town and can talk about it then.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: ythan

That's a lie

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

UNVOTE:

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I haven't voted you yet because I haven't determined whether we perhaps shared in the kill. But I can account for it and so it does not confirm your claim.

When we were discussing it last night, Mina did wonder if their was another VIG out there, they would likely shoot triforce. We were trying to figure out a scum read to shoot and were going to reread, but site went down so we couldn't.

I did joke about shooting faraday, and wanted to shoot mollie but Mina thinks I'm unobjective there.

ANYWAY if we're alive tomorrow we can make this more clear, and if we're dead there will be no need.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Huh. Well, I feel like they're still probably town for the claim and stuff seems super unnecessary as scum. At the very least I would suggest they don't need to full claim until tomorrow, since they have this hider thing to do.

Pedit: Unless you've a 1-shot CPR doctor how do you know he's lying? <_<

Why wouldn't I assume he's lying? He had a dayvig, that I'm already worried about being a scum dayvig. Why would I assume he could dayvig AND night VIG in the same day/night phase?

I still think that's sketch.

Besides, why the hell would we open the day with "we shot triforce" if we didn't. Seems fucking moronic and not something either of us would do but hey what do I know?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

If you had that discussion then I doubt you would immediately assume a cc was a lie.

You already shot during the day. I already am concerned you're a scum dayvig. Why would I think *you* would also be a night VIG who can shoot on the same day.

Yes, I thought you were lying. Yes, I'm still a bit wary of you. Do I think it's impossible? No.

And it wasn't until after you said we might both share the kill that I remembered that Mina did suggest it.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Well Mina thinks he's town because passive hammered and survivor exist so he's probably not a scum dayvig.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

If you had that discussion then I doubt you would immediately assume a cc was a lie.

You already shot during the day. I already am concerned you're a scum dayvig. Why would I think *you* would also be a night VIG who can shoot on the same day.

Yes, I thought you were lying. Yes, I'm still a bit wary of you. Do I think it's impossible? No.

And it wasn't until after you said we might both share the kill that I remembered that Mina did suggest it.

Cause I claimed it and the players paying attention know I'm town ie not lying.

Right back at you babe.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh. Also, I buy Triforce's survivor claim--the annoyance sells it. And I guess some hydra dissonance over Tammy's Eaglekit town read--I admittedly don't know either Mala or Desp as well as she does, but I think she's really overthinking it. And I found it weird that they switched between finding mollie town again after Tammy called her towh and then suspecting her again without missing a beat.

Yes, we believed the claim. Yes, we shot the survivor because even though we believed them and believed that they had town interests, that they would be a distraction and the lynch today anyway.

So, riddle me this duck. Why would we enter the game immediately taking credit for a VIG shot?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: ythan

That's a lie

smells like caaught fucking scum


TWO SCUMTEAMS

THEY SHOOT TRIFORCE

YTHAN SHOOTS TRIFORCE

GAMBITS


THEY WANT TO THROW DIRT ON FATE FOR PEDDLING "NONSENSE"




CAN WE


CAN WE PLS


PLS FARADAY

YOU KNOW DEEP DOWN

White knights are supposed to stay on their horse.

But you're probably scum so it's k.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I'm implying that he's fallen off his horse.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Like anyone who actually believes this game is multiball when there is someone who claimed an any time vig and us is kinda loopy.

What is wrong with this game?

Faraday - You can retract that Fate town read any day now. See how he's peddling that? I don't believe that's town Fate trying to figure out the game. This is scum Fate offering up the biggest distraction ever.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Oh look at cheery dog bringing the burn.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Faraday - You *still* want to stand by this town read on Fate? Is this really what town fate looks like? I dont' think so.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I'm implying that he's fallen off his horse.

OH NO FUCK THIS BULLSHIT

FIRST IT WAS FATES SCUM SAYIN NONESENSE

NOW ITS

FATE
PLEASE WHITE KNIGHT US DONT KILL US NOOOOOO`~

I wasn't asking you for a white knight. I was making a joke in reference to this post:

I can't beat Tammy scum mollie...thats just how it works

hydra with mina too?

I don't think you understand

how much white there is to knight in this game

you can't lynch them

So, yeah.

So, if we hide behind you tonight, will we be alive tomorrow? I'm guessing no.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

VOTE: ythan

That's a lie

UNVOTE:

I haven't voted you yet because I haven't determined whether we perhaps shared in the kill. But I can account for it and so it does not confirm your claim.

When we were discussing it last night, Mina did wonder if their was another VIG out there, they would likely shoot triforce. We were trying to figure out a scum read to shoot and were going to reread, but site went down so we couldn't.

I did joke about shooting faraday, and wanted to shoot mollie but Mina thinks I'm unobjective there.

ANYWAY if we're alive tomorrow we can make this more clear, and if we're dead there will be no need.

Does anyone actually believe these posts come from a town train of thought?

First its "oh shit gotta stand by our claim to the end!"

Then Ythan goes, "hmmm, what? I didn't vote you."


THEN THEY IMMEDIATELY BACKPEDAL AND GO: "ahhah well yeah we THOUGHT there couldve been a vig and they wouldve shot Triforce! Now heres some other jokey things about our fakeclaim!"


Holy shit

this game

is literally

over


and scum will shout me down

but I need you fucking townies to open your eyes


one time

Um yep. Anyone who's ever played a game with me will know that's exactly a town mindset. Also, if you've been following along with the game, you'll note that yesterday I had a gut scum read on Ythan. Hmmm...wonder why that is. Maybe it's because I have a vig shot and was worried the day vig was a scum day vig. Nothing I was going to push too seriously because lol large theme and I guess it's possible plus Mina said it was possible.

And yeah, I voted him on the impulse based on him calling us probably liars, then saying he took the shot, and not voting us because to me it looked like he was lying. Then he said that it was possible that we both took the shot which reminded me that mina had suggested that it was possible, but I've never seen someone who could shoot during the day and at night before, so it wasn't something I was thinking about.

If you're town here, you're the one who needs to open his eyes. We couldn't be more town.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

So if we die tonight while handing up scum on a platter, I'll accept a .jpg apology

So will I!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

It's multiball isn't?

You could be on the other team, couldn't you?

OH guess you don't believe it's multiball then.

Or more importantly, I allow for the possibility I'm wrong.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I'm also allowing for Faraday to be a better reader of you even if I doubt him.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Mina here.

My paranoia over Ythan right now actually has more to do with his play being horrendous (both his activity/stances and the way he's handling the not-really-but-possibly-a-1v1) than his claim (which, on balance, is more likely to come from town). Ythan, flavour for why you're a day+night vig?

By the way:

Ythan I don't think can be scum unless there's either an

unlimited

town vigilante or a shitload of other town power out there.

There's a reason I specified "unlimited" here. And you can tell we're wary of Ythan from our later interactions with him.

Hey, Fate, the way you're treating us here looks a shitload like your ridiculous stance on Tierce in Scummies Invitational, FYI. Also, this might be the least of my problems with you, but when I asked about your reasons for suspecting us here, it's because I wanted to read

you

and see what you'd try to justify it with. (It's not like we'll need to defend ourselves much for the rest of this game.)

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Waffles, please stop doubting Ythan. That makes me want to vote you that much more and I really don't want to be that stupid. Why would he counter claim you as scum. Please let me know any possible scenario he'd do that.

How does you "wanting to vote us that much more" and "not wanting to be that stupid" really coexist?

And I mean I'm one of the most contradictory people, and I'm shaking my head going agaduhagaduh

First you need to ask yourself, in what possible realm do we come out at the start of day going "We vigged Triforce" as scum. And then draw your stretch out from there. Why wouldn't he counterclaim us as scum, who has already proved a dayvig? We're someone who have already indicated a hide ability, which means we have a really good chance of delivering up scum tomorrow. You're saying there's absolutely no chance scum would want to shut that down?

You're also saying we can't be sceptical about someone having the same power we have? Like, we're not even voting for Ythan. Mina thinks power-wise he's probably town, while I'm by play and what I know of power going he might be scum. We're looking at all the possibilities, why wouldn't you want us to?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

...I don't know how to respond to that kind of laziness, but it Nuwen's world that's a town tell so congrats!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Like, we're not even voting for Ythan.

You're really going to say this. Seriously. You voted for them right out of the gate after he said the littlest thing doubting you and you're going to say you're not voting for him at this moment.

I haven't played with you Tammy, but from your behavior in this single game I think you'd be bold enough to do pretty much anything.

... and then unvoted him like 10 seconds later. He said he killed triforce after already killing someone during the day. If you can't see my immediate reaction being wtf you're lying, I don't know what to tell you. I'm still not sure but practically everyone else is like if it walks like town duck and it quacks like a town duck then it's a town duck let's not even question the weirdness at all.

but thank you *hearts and flowers and gummy bears and honey bears like honey right?* I'm actually not bold and really conservative, but thank you, I appreciate you thinking I could just do pretty much anything. That means a lot.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

We're someone who have already indicated a hide ability

You claimed that. And really. In what scenario would we be able to verify anything. If you *die*. and in that case it doesn't fucking matter what you are. You picked a role that seems on the surface to be easily verifiable, but in reality is not.

So, if we die tomorrow night, you're just going to discount the code we leave behind?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

OH MY GODS IF YTHAN COMES BACK SCUM I WILL LITERALLY LAUGH IN EVERYONE'S FACES. EVERYONES.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

since when does tammy spell skeptical "sceptical"

LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE MINA

I'm pretty sure I told you to stop interacting with me or talking about me thank you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

FARADAY.

FARADAY.

FARADAY.

These are the people you're calling town???

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Like you can't all be scum. But at least one of you are.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

What a constructive "dayvig"

So, which one of these chucklefucks you gonna lynch when we flip what we said we are????

HUH???

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Lynch in no particular order: Mollie, Nuwen, Fate, Axxle, Ythan. There will be your scum.

There is no way, no literal possible way anyone with a rational brain thinks we're scum. None. Don't you let anyone tell you otherwise.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

And you know what.

I don't care if this gets me lynched.

Like is everyone who posted here this evening a literal fucking moron? Like fucking seriously. You can all go rot in hell. No one I'm sorry no one with half a brain comes into the day and say hey that vig shot was mine when it wasn't. THEY FUCKING DON'T. Anyone who tells you otherwise is being completely disingenuous. (Oh and Axxle is pulling up the most remarkable bit of "I've never played with you tammy but I think you're ballsy" WTF anyone who knows anything about me knows me and ballsy don't fucking go together BUT OKAY WHATEVER YEAH I AM FEAR ME RAAAAAAWWWWWWRRRRRRRR)

And everyone else who's town, don't you for one second let them go "welp we thought it was possible" NO you hold them accountable for this fucking bullshit. You do that. this is fucking bullshit.

Eaglekit - You make sure you lynch the hell out of mollie. She's fucking scum. Don't let them say her emotional bullshit means she's not, she totally fucking is. She's not trying to figure out the game, she's not scumhunting. And you know YOU KNOW she would actually be trying here. And you know she knows I'm town here. You know this.

Faraday - I don't understand how you think these people are town, I really don't.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

since when does tammy spell skeptical "sceptical"

LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE MINA

I'm pretty sure I told you to stop interacting with me or talking about me thank you.

did you do me the same courtesy?

I'M PRETTY SURE I DID YOU SCUM FUCK.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

'literal fucking moron'

if the shoe fits...

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

since when does tammy spell skeptical "sceptical"

LIKE THAT SOUNDS LIKE MINA

I'm pretty sure I told you to stop interacting with me or talking about me thank you.

did you do me the same courtesy?

like i'm pretty sure i left a phone call you joined to do *you* the courtesy to not have to actually be around you, so yeah.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

^ so protown gosh i don't know what I was thinking by being suspicious of him...someone should smack me or lynch me, yeah.

rawr the ballsy one

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Sir Waffles Wafflington (3) Axxle, Ythan, pirate mollie

There is scum on this fucking wagon. Mollie is one of them. Is she the only one???

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Mollie - I don't give a flying flip what you think of me. I don't ever want to have to get stuck in a game with you again, in skype or talk to you or anything. I used to think you were a really awesome person, and then I just realized you're just plain nasty, and I don't want anything to do with you.

I was scum reading you at the beginning of this game, and asked you a question to try to figure you out. You went ballistic on me and went off about me baiting you and being deliberately mean by hitting a sore spot I don't even know exists. Then you called me a bitch (after mind you I explained my whole thought process to you and told you that I wanted you to be town.) You then twice said I don't belong here, and even after I thought we cleared stuff up, you continued to go "oh Tammy was deliberately mean...she's baiting me, blah blah blah."

I tried Mollie. I fucking tried.

I now want nothing to do with you.

So, lynch me. Fucking lynch me I don't care. If it removes me from this game and your fucking bullshit, good.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Sir Waffles Wafflington (3) Axxle, Ythan, pirate mollie

There is scum on this fucking wagon. Mollie is one of them. Is she the only one???

REALLY?

COS I AM NOT?

KNOW THAT IF YOUR TEAM WINS THIS IT WAS NOT WON CLEANLY

I AM FUCKING TOWN.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

^^&^^^^^ THIS IS NOT TOWN BEHAVIOR, YOU ALL ARE BEING BLIND.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I wasn't baiting you. I was never baiting you. I was never being deliberately mean. I was scum reading you and asked you a fucking question.

You called me a bitch. Like you literally personally attacked me when mind you I explained my whole thought process to you and said I wanted you to be town.

You said I don't belong here. After I thought we cleared things up you kept going Tammy was deliberately mean.

If you can't see that you calling me a bitch for no reason whatsoever and then continuing to go Tammy's mean! how can you guys no see it is you keeping something going then I don't know what to tell you.

I wish you hydrad with Nacho, because at least he'd tell you that I don't have it in me to be deliberately mean for no reason and maybe you'd stop with your damn crusade.

I do think you're scum. Problem is my other head doesn't. The only people who believe me that you're scum are desperado and cheery dog. That's it.

And this is it. This is the last interaction I will make with you ever.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

For the record, even if someone doesn't think our claim doesn't 100% make us town, Tammy is ACTUALLY confirmed town to anyone who's ever played her meta. You can pretty much blindly trust Faraday on this one. She's one of the easiest reads on this site as town. This is how she gets when people suspect her as town. We hydra'd together as scum before, and you can see it was nothing like this. There's a reason I did most of the posting in

Anything Goes

. Even when she gets genuinely mad at BBmolla-the-traitor!usurper, you can see the vitriol is nowhere

near

the same. Untrod Tripod, how didn't you pick up on this at

all

?

(And yes, Faraday, some of my laziness WAS being a PR, but I think being a VT with someone who--in

theory

--makes us an innocent child would also have been enough to make me lazy.)

The only reason I'm not throwing my own tantrum is that I have confidence that people will see it, and also, Tammy is raging enough for both of us. Unlike her, I think there have to be at least 2-3 townies attacking us (are scum really THAT afraid of a one-shot quasi-investigation?). But I'm still EXTREMELY wary of Fate (despite some early townish-looking posts), because this is worse than his stance on Tierce in Scummies that made him obviously guilty when I was following along.

Dismissing it as "lol, Tammy is being annoying, so I'm lynching her" or "lol, Tammy is SO OVERDEFENSIVE and EMOTIONAL UNDER PRESSURE" is scrub-level play. Look beyond the surface, and it should be obvious we're innocent.

If you want, I'll tell Tammy not to post for twenty-four hours until she calms down, now. I don't blame her frustration, but it's irritating to have our slot's reads dismissed as crazy psycho people screaming at each other. Mollie is genuinely scummy this game!

Waffles, please stop doubting Ythan. That makes me want to vote you that much more and I really don't want to be that stupid. Why would he counter claim you as scum. Please let me know any possible scenario he'd do that.

I feel guilty for starting this whole mess with that post (when I mostly thought Ythan was town--I was just kind of paranoid and wanted a flavour claim from him), but...

Him counterclaiming us as scum makes literally AS MUCH SENSE AS OUR CLAIMING THE SHOT IN THE FIRST PLACE. AND HE'S FUCKING DOUBTING US. AND YOU'RE DOUBTING US. If you believe one is possible, you can also believe the other is. Or if one is impossible, etc.

Scum!Ythan theoretically might have figured counterclaiming would ruin our confirmed townie status, and also cover his ass by saying, "Oops, I guess there

were

two vigs!" when we flipped town--there actually would have been no downside. It's unlikely, and I'm still strongly leaning toward him being town (unlike Tammy, because I think Tammy is OMGUS-ing), because I still don't see a scum dayvig, and also, there's an element to our role that doesn't make it inconsistent with a day-and-night vig. However, paranoia/healthy sCepticism is pretty reasonable in our shoes.

For us to be scum, we set up a vig claim back on D1 and either claimed a vig shot that we knew an actual vig was responsible for (potentially prompting a bullet in the brain that night) or it's multiball and we wasted our factional kill on taking out a survivor...even though people will know for sure that it's multiball by D2 or D3.

Also, there's a FLIPPED SURVIVOR, only TWO DEATHS last night (one of which was the aforementioned survivor, which no second scumteam would ever shoot and two different vigs are claiming to have killed), town are red and scum are black (except for the green survivor)...so this is really, really, REALLY obviously not multiball. REALLY obviously not.

Also also, saying that someone is ballsy enough to do something as scum because they seem ballsy in this current game has...uh...an obvious flaw in it.

~Mina

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Also, tammy let's unite Cait Sith <3

<3

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Eaglekit so you both admit Tammy is quite a competent player and good at scum faking their town meta but are willing to be fooled by it here


yeah ok no thanks

she's talking about mollie you fucking idiot, tammy has NO SCUMGAME certainly not one that's capable of maintaining this level of vitriol.

she fooled me and I'd like to think I'm not a fucking idiot to be fooled by some scrub, thanks

When? The only time I remember even being scum in a game you were in was Abarat in which I replaced in on day three and you were already long dead. The only other times we played together, I was town.

As far you calling me competent scum in an early post, thank you very much if you actually believe that. I'd love for that to be true; I really would. I hate playing scum and only occasionally can pull out a halfway decent scum game.

Faraday knows I'm not capable of doing what I've done this game as scum because he's modded/played in enough games with me to be able to tell when I'm actually scum. He wasn't scum reading me yesterday. He did get a bit paranoid of us but by the end of day that wasn't an issue anymore. You can tell by the way he interacted with me before day's end that he thought I was town.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

yeah I mean I skimmed them before and I didn't think mollie really said anything out of line this game...

Sure there was the "bitch" line but thats just mollie being comfortable with that language.


I'm pretty sure it was all blown out of proportion and that's more likely to be done by Tammy scum wanting some substance to add to the game than Tammy town just wanting to fight?

I don't *like* to fight as either alignment.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

wanted a flavor claim?

You EXPLICITLY SAID "THATS A LIE" AND VOTED HIM

there was no inquiry

there was no curiosity

there

was

scum

fucking

caught

That was me who thought he was lying. It's me who's more paranoid of him. It's me who had the gut scum read on him yesterday.

Mina is the one that wrote that post wanting a flavor claim.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

I think Waffles tone is scummy in assorted posts, but am conceding to someone who can read the slot better and is town. Claimed power not going to be lynched Day 2, too much interest in *science*. Waffles' hot/cold reactions to Ythan seem pretty opportunistic:
1)They are aggro at Ythan Day 1 'because of their role' -> I think this is a VERY WEAK explanation for wanting to lynch Ythan, because vig bullets

are a negative utility

. Town on town crime is much more likely to occur than a successful scum shot.

We never said we wanted to lynch Ythan yesterday? I had him in my list of people I wouldn't mind wagoning because I had a gut scum read on him based on the vig thing, but it's also possible we both exist as town. Mina asked him to start playing like town so that the only reason she had to town read him wasn't scum dayvig too OP.

2)Quick kneejerk vote in response to his counterclaim indicates no pause to consider that he is also town. Waffles' slot self-examines every move (have said this before), so I think when it acts quickly we are seeing behavior that breaks her composed introspection with raw motivation.

Hi! Impulsive head here. While Mina might self-examine every move or be a bit self-aware and talk about it, I am less so. Well, I mean I am pretty self-aware and look back at things after the fact but I'm way more impulsive and liable to move on something quickly without thinking and then have something settle and think about it. If Mina had been the one posting at that time, she probably would have questioned him about it and asked for a flavor claim like the way she did when she posted last night. He said he took a shot we took. I've never seen a day+night vig before, and he didn't vote us when saying we lied about it. It looked like a scum claim to me. It wasn't until after he said there was a possibility that we both took the shot that I thought maybe it was possible.

3)Emotional engagement with Mollie is way over the top. Provocative, inflammatory, and useless are all words that describe the many many posts directed from Tammy to Mollie. I have a hard time believing that such a supposedly self-aware team would continually harass/counter-harass someone for weak play. The 'cat fights' have allowed Reck to excuse himself from playing, because he'll take any excuse not to actually read a Mafia game.

Has nothing to do with weak play, and if you don't see her jumping in with Ythan to antagonize me unnecessarily last night when we already haven't been getting along this game and while I was trying to get Axxle to talk so I could follow his thought process and try to get a read on him as really scummy then welp, i don't know what to tell you.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

2) We shot Triforce last night. (Sorry for auto-losing you the game, guys! We mostly believed your claim, but you were a huge distraction and we were too big pussies--pun intended--to go for a flashier kill with the short D1. Besides, you were dangerous with Iecerint's role.)

wow shooting mollie would have literally been more pro town

You don't know how close she came to getting a vig shot in the face. If it would have just been me, I probably would have, but we went for the more practical take out the claimed survivor route because that would have been a distraction for today.

Oh. Also, I buy Triforce's survivor claim--the annoyance sells it. And I guess some hydra dissonance over Tammy's Eaglekit town read--I admittedly don't know either Mala or Desp as well as she does, but I think she's really overthinking it. And I found it weird that they switched between finding mollie town again after Tammy called her towh and then suspecting her again without missing a beat.

Yes, we believed the claim. Yes, we shot the survivor because even though we believed them and believed that they had town interests, that they would be a distraction and the lynch today anyway.

So, riddle me this duck. Why would we enter the game immediately taking credit for a VIG shot?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The way I view vig shots is if you don't have a strong scum read, you don't just shoot haphazardly. I view vig shots as taking out people, preferably who have already claimed, who are likely to be the lynch the next day anyway. We talked about potentially shooting a scum read and tossed around a couple of names. We were going to reread the game together but the site went down and we couldn't. Triforce was a claimed survivor, likely to be today's lynch anyway, so the vig shot there was practical no matter what our desires may or may not have been.

Why wouldn't we use that day one to take out the distraction for day two?

We couldn't use the hide last night. Mina had gotten permission from the mods to do her code thing and we had thought about potentially using it yesterday but the day was cut short anyway. Hiding yesterday would have been useless. If we lived great, we have a confirmed town. But if we died, no one would have any idea why we died. We will flip JoaT, not hider. We didn't get a chance to even crumb or claim that. It would have been a complete waste if we died. Also super glad we didn't, because if Ythan is telling the truth and vigged Triforce, if we would have died last night too by hiding behind scum, there would have been three deaths today and you guys would be running in circles thinking the setup was something it wasn't.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

We couldn't use the hide last night. Mina had gotten permission from the mods to do her code thing and we had thought about potentially using it yesterday but the day was cut short anyway. Hiding yesterday would have been useless. If we lived great, we have a confirmed town. But if we died, no one would have any idea why we died.

We will flip JoaT, not hider.

We didn't get a chance to even crumb or claim that. It would have been a complete waste if we died. Also super glad we didn't, because if Ythan is telling the truth and vigged Triforce, if we would have died last night too by hiding behind scum, there would have been three deaths today and you guys would be running in circles thinking the setup was something it wasn't.

Wouldn't your flip have cleared it up?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

We have something else and if we're still alive tomorrow we can talk about it then.

Is there a reason you don't want to claim flavor for why you are a day and night vig?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

The way I view vig shots is if you don't have a strong scum read, you don't just shoot haphazardly. I view vig shots as taking out people, preferably who have already claimed, who are likely to be the lynch the next day anyway. We talked about potentially shooting a scum read and tossed around a couple of names. We were going to reread the game together but the site went down and we couldn't. Triforce was a claimed survivor, likely to be today's lynch anyway, so the vig shot there was practical no matter what our desires may or may not have been.

Why wouldn't we use that day one to take out the distraction for day two?

We couldn't use the hide last night. Mina had gotten permission from the mods to do her code thing and we had thought about potentially using it yesterday but the day was cut short anyway. Hiding yesterday would have been useless. If we lived great, we have a confirmed town. But if we died, no one would have any idea why we died. We will flip JoaT, not hider. We didn't get a chance to even crumb or claim that. It would have been a complete waste if we died. Also super glad we didn't, because if Ythan is telling the truth and vigged Triforce, if we would have died last night too by hiding behind scum, there would have been three deaths today and you guys would be running in circles thinking the setup was something it wasn't.

you guyz didn't think they were a distraction when trying to work with them?

this is what I don't get, if when playing a JOAT investigate first, vig kill later. <--- right?

I don't know why this is so hard to understand. It doesn't matter that *we* believed they had protown interests. Nobody else did. They were almost the lynch yesterday. They would have been the lynch today. They would have been a distraction. We removed the distraction. This is like optimal vig strategy.

I don't even understand the problem here. A third party claims. We have means to remove third party. We do that.

If we hide and die behind scum, we can't vig kill later? Because we're dead.

Anyway, I'm done. I don't know why I'm even trying. I'll let someone else explain it to you. I've reached my maximum limit and I have a party to go to.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Just to nitpick, we will actually flip ____ of All Trades. (The ___ gives away our flavour, which is awesome, and is why I said we're a modified JoAT.) Need to talk about whether to reveal more with Tammy when I get home.

Also, what part of "the thread closed before we could claim or leave a breadcrumb" don't you understand?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

HEY TAMMY GET RID OF YOUR AFRO

Working on it!

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Ythan, I cannot BEGIN to describe how pissed off I am with you right now. So in case you're not bluffing, I just want to tell you in advance...if you vig us and we die, ignore our breadcrumb. (I won't even bother arguing with you not to vig us, because I can just guess how well that will end.) The "modified" part of the hider means there's a very real chance your shot will actually hit us. There's a reason that when I claimed, I was so insistent that you don't treat our breadcrumb as gospel if we're the only death tonight.

I would much rather say this now than have it lead to a clusterfuck later on.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Fate you never answered what game I fooled you as scum in?

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

OH hey guess what?

Folks. Fate is lying.

I've never fooled him as scum. The only time I was scum in any game that had anything to do with Fate was Abarat which I replaced into a couple days AFTER he died.

Gosh it just sucks when you make up experience you don't have.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

Okay Waffles, I won't shoot you because secrets.

I'm not surprised that's your reaction. I was pretty sure it'd just make you 100% guaranteed to shoot us if you could, given the kinds of reasoning you've been using in this thread.

However, I'm just telling you this in advance. If you shoot us tonight and we wind up dead, it will probably be because you shot us, and NOT because we targeted scum. I don't want to frame someone with our deaths.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

LOL

We have very different color hair though

I was very confused though. Me and competent at scum don't get put in the same sentence very often at all.

All right Party Time.

[Sir Waffles Wafflington]

if you were to unglue yourself off of your scumread on me where would you look?

Fate and Nuwen (not sure if they work together just because of Fate's buddying). I can't read Reck (although Tammy says this is different from his Red Wedding scum play), but it wouldn't completely shock me if YNGO was scum, since they're almost exclusively focused on self-defence. Maaaaaybe Pie if he's playing really, really well as scum. Axxle and Cheery Dog both just have scummy-looking playstyles that I can't really read, but also a couple of weakly town posts. Eaglekit looks kind of townish, but I guess it's not impossible he could be scum. And UT's engagement with the game looks really town, except he has some weird stances that prevent me from being 100% on him. Everyone else looks town for their play, with the exception of Ythan, who just looks town for role reasons.