Tales of You (Endgame)

[penguin_alien]

Hey, AP!

So no way am I getting a handle on this in four days, but I'll do what I can. Let me know if there's anything in particular you want me to address/look at.

[penguin_alien]

So I've read the Titan ISO and if Tammy's scum playing me I give up on this game. In reading her ISO I've gotten bits of the game when clicking out for context. Which, between that context and Tammy's frustration with mastin and reading the last few pages as I replaced in, made mastin my next priority.

I'm on my tablet right now and won't have good access for case-making for several hours, but this is scum-mastin. I thought when I first started in on her ISO that she might be harangued town, but that fell apart pretty quickly. The sense of trying to boss town around, be believed without relevant support. There's a lot of words, but it goes off on tangents to disguise the lack of immediate relevance. Big speeches about sincerity and conviction, nothing that leads anywhere.

VOTE: mastinSSK

I'm pretty sure I'm going to get an earful about how I can't read mastin, how recognizing her as scum in Resistance and 172 was just happenstance and that I should sit down, shut up, and swallow whatever corrected version of her scum meta mastin wants me to believe.

Not fucking well buying it. I almost got lynched in 172 because I wouldn't step up and take a stand. Heck, I think Nero would still happily lead a post-game wagon on me over there given half a chance, and if scum hadn't killed him/AP hadn't been gunsmithed I'd have eaten a mislynch there. Third time's the charm, this is scum-mastin, and so help me if y'all generate another ten pages of content before lynching obv-scum I...will complain bitterly to Tammy all night.

F-16, as far as your reads wall, I need to get a better sense of some of the players myself before I judge your motives completely, but I get the feeling this might be town-you just because in contrast with Wicked you're pulling your observations into current game events more than drowning people in things they wouldn't follow. In my navel-gazing I'm thinking that I got seduced by your focus on analyzing me and Cabd and lost the outside perspective that it was pretty damn targeted. This feels more accessible and so more like you're trying to be pro-town.

One thing that caught my eye in your wall was PV. I personally have a lot of trouble sorting him until endgame, and sometimes even then. Again, pulling out 172, ffery came in and was a significant part of derailing the wagon on town-him, and if it hasn't come up I'd like to hear her take on him.

I'll compile a more cohesive explanation for why this is scum-mastin when I'm home with proper access to cut and paste functions again and not trying to be coherent in between hands. I'll also prioritize getting that read on BRO Tammy wants, but I also want to look into AP. I don't think I've been good at reading AP before *cough165cough* but coming off 172 if he's scum with mastin I'd like to think I won't be totally oblivious.

[penguin_alien]

I'm pretty sure I'm going to get an earful about how I can't read mastin, how recognizing her as scum in Resistance and 172 was just happenstance and that I should sit down, shut up, and swallow whatever corrected version of her scum meta mastin wants me to believe.

Not fucking well buying it. Third time's the charm, this is scum-mastin, and so help me if y'all generate another ten pages of content before lynching obv-scum I...will complain bitterly to Tammy all night.

Like, no fucking takebacks, here, PA.

You're town? You quote this post-game.

And admit it.

I was telling you the fucking truth as scum.
And that your tell is fucking bullshit.

Third time really is the fucking charm. For you to be wrong, oh SO fucking wrong. Commit 100% to that tell of yours. That I'm really that obvscum. That I'm scum doing an appeal to emotion. That I'm scum trying to make you think you're less competent than you actually are. That I'm scum who is desperately trying to cover up a legitimate flaw in my scumplay. That I am scum bullying players, especially you right now.

I want to hear those fucking words said officially rather than just implicitly.

Oh, I don't feel bossed around now at *all* here. Wait...

(And I never said you were bullying anyone; that's a word choice I'd take seriously. Although I think this:

and you can go fuck yourself since my posting has been essentially nothing but fucking passion to the point of detrimentation and yet you've fucking scumread me in spite of that.

and this:

Fuck you, you little shithead. TRhat psiot hwas made with me being as pure as I fucking can be you absolute asshole. I meant every fiucking weord of it.,

mosey on across the line from bossy to intimidation.)

Sure, I'll put it out there. You couldn't be more obvscum to me if you took out a billboard in Times Square to show off your scum role PM.

You fall back on emotion when you're being pressured and lack cogent arguments, and while I'm still working on not being suckered in by people playing on my positive emotions, I've made a hell of a lot of progress in not being made to feel guilty by other people remonstrating me for scum reading them. More relevant to my read on you, you use emotion to try to make people feel like they should be falling in line with your opinions,

even

especially when they're unsubstantiated.

I know for a fact that you think I'm a mediocre town player at best, as you've made clear in several scum QTs, and an easy mislynch/pawn at worst. So yes, I'm utterly not shocked that you'd try to make me doubt my ability to read you, past experience to the contrary. Don't document opinions you don't want to be called out on--I read scum QTs from most of my completed games, and so I know exactly how you continue to think I'm the next best thing to a VI.

I never said that you were trying desperately to cover up a flaw in your scum play, mostly because it's quite clearly not covered up here.

Never have been so fucking happy to be scumread.
Because I've been fucking pissed off at that tell PA's used.
And explained every fucking time that it is a fucking bullshit tell.
And every fucking time that it wasn't actually a fucking tell.

You missed a line: 'And every fucking time PA was right that I fucking well was scum, damn it.'

Also, I'm sorry that my perception of your scum game doesn't match your own view. It doesn't make that perception invalid. You don't get to dictate what thoughts of mine are allowed and which ones aren't, and you don't get to make me ashamed of how I arrive at my conclusions.

Detailed explanation of why this is mastin-scum incoming.

[penguin_alien]

@ Penguin, looking forward to hearing your case. I'd also like to see where you are at with the rest of your reads. Have you and Tammy discussed BRO's meltdown post yet? I was hoping to hear your thoughts on that too whenever you are caught up and get around to it.

Saw this in preview when posting my (partial) mastin thoughts. It's 3 AM, so this won't be comprehensive. Tammy and I haven't discussed it yet, except that she wants my read on BRO.

I'll say straight up that based on everything I know about BRO via playing Mafia with him here and offsite and hydraing, there's no way he fakes that. If (and that's a big if from reading 3020) he's scum, he's still genuinely upset at the way mastin is going after him. I will say that from my experience with scum-mastin, she can go after teammates in very unproductive ways (see: Open 541, where we almost blew LyLo because mastin thought it would be a good idea to push Mhork while ignoring all the planning in the scum QT).

HOWEVER.

Much as I know BRO shakes up his scum game and makes some strange plays as either alignment, this doesn't feel insincere at all, or to be more precise, coming from anything other than frustrated town. To be honest, I almost feel like just snipping this post out of my mental calculations, because it feels way intrusive for the game to have put him in a situation where he felt that he needed to share it. I won't, because it also feels wrong to disregard his forthrightness.

I'm sorry, there are some things in his ISO that I noticed while skimming for the 'meltdown' post (although I'm not really comfortable calling it a meltdown; heaven knows as someone who's dealt with issues that were hard to discuss I know exactly how painful it is to reveal that stuff, and calling it a meltdown feels condescending, to be frank) that made me think he could be scum and some things that made me think town. My very brief overall impression is that BRO came into the game excited about the player list and anticipating a fun game. There's some banter-type stuff that feels alignment-independent and so in my paranoia might make me think scum-BRO. But as he keeps posting, there's super-genuine sounding posts AND, more importantly, posts that read like the insightful BRO I'm used to watching work in-hydra when I darn well know his alignment.

I'm on the verge of conking out, but hopefully that gives you an idea of where I am. I may not be good at reading BRO as a mafia player, but I'd like to think I have a sense of his personality well enough that I know him hitting a limit wasn't staged. Maybe I'm presuming too much, given that we're more Mafia friends than 'dish about life' friends, but that's how my brain works. I'll read the other 300+ posts from the JSU hydra after I get some sleep and try to get a sense of their alignment here.

Because, F-16, as much as I respect your play and would like to work with you if you're town here, if we hadn't misread BRO in Wicked I'd have neighborized him over you-Ghatokaca in a heartbeat, and I know town-BRO can game-solve like a maniac.

P-edit: I'm sorry, I can't react to everything that's elapsed since I started writing this up...tomorrow.

[penguin_alien]

I'm hitting the highlights here because it's late and I'm tired and I'm already probably not going to get to read all of JSU, AP, and CF in that priority order before the end of the day phase.

None of my reads are jokes. Not even the ones on the players who haven't posted. ("...What." Yes, you heard it. Dead-serious townreads even on the players who haven't posted. Why? 'Cause I said so.)

Translated: my reads should be taken seriously, even if they're clearly inexplicable.

Her reaction to AP replacing in in 1008: looks to me like mastin panics. Maybe she's scum with AP and was freaking out because of 172, maybe she's scum not with AP and was trying to be preemptive. But the random quoting with the 'trust me, this is AP-scum' isn't how she'd go about pushing an actual scum read on AP.

The problem with actual obvtown entrances is that they're often not tangible. Like...I know I am obvtown. But I can't tell you why SSK was or why I am. I know it's true. I can't point to it being true.

You...are. Basically, actual obvtownness is not solidified; faked obvtownness can be pointed to.

Here's more supposed inability to explain a read. And she doesn't even try. Which is the damning part.

To CF:

And you wonder why I scumread you.

Quotes a random post, doesn't elaborate, says it's obv-scum.

Go ahead. Because I already have. Do me a favor, BROseidon. If you're town? Never sign up for a game I'm in again, because your arrogance. You making the same fucking mistake. Game. after. fucking. game. Is godfuckingawful.

I dare you to tell me this isn't bossy at a minimum. It boggles my mind, quite frankly, that you believe you have the perspective to call people like BRO and Squirrel Girl bossy/arrogant/etc. (yes, I kept reading the post-game of Mala's Charmed game and I disagree with you 100%) And as far as what you say in 1264 about trying to control one's arrogance? There is no such thing as trying here. You either do or you don't. I'm not giving you any points for supposedly trying to control your arrogance when the outcome shows no impact of said claimed efforts.

I'm going to be blunt.

Today, we're lynching one of {Just Sheep Us, The Fox and The Hound, AngryPidgeon}.
RBD is going to gladiate one of the two survivors.

I'd be OK with someone laying things out so clearly, except there aren't any arguments for any of these people except for 'I believe it is so, fall in line.' No proposal to the thread that people refocus here. Just that's what'll happen. Oh, and RBD? You get to use your ability as mastin dictates. Have fun...

I wasn't before, and I was fine with a push on me. But when you tried to get a Rancid mislynch, that I couldn't let go through. So I took command. I'll step down when I have good reason to do so. But for right now, I am in control. There are others who have influence. I am not a soul tyrant. But ultimately, in spite of me being the one person who has no vote, I am the girl with the most control over the votes.

See, here, mastin's slipping. Fancy words aside, she's not interested in working *with* anyone. It's her way or the highway.

AP's just scum.

I've admittedly wavered a bit here and there. But he's just...not town.

Oh, hi, persuasive logic. He is scum because he is not town.

1675: more trying to look like a naturally developing town read, instead ends up being very disinterested in persuading anyone, which given his hesitance to give Tammy a town read, is scum-mastin mounting an easily dismantled argument.

OK, I can't keep my eyes open any more. I'll keep going when I have more time in the morning or afternoon; I know we're near deadline. Sorry...

P-edit: Now I'm really tired and kind of sad, actually. I think a clear head will help.

[penguin_alien]

Damn it, I've probably entirely lost people's willingness to listen to me after my botched mastin read, but please hear me out anyways.

This is F-16 scum. I was debating it overnight with Tammy, but him coming in here and going way over the top freaking out when she accused him of being scum is so very evocative of scum-F-16 from Micro 264: Resistance Mafia. I thought he was scummy and he went way overboard on calling me scum. Like, citing ridiculous things, pushing me past all rationality.

Reading through today's posts, I also really hate that he's basically repeating the same events we've already seen. Have a 'meltdown' on a necessarily accelerated timetable, claim that only scum wouldn't react sympathetically. Heaven forbid I accuse anyone of a lack of sincerity, but there's a difference between BRO being under pressure for days and cracking and F-16 being voted by one player who he supposedly didn't read as 100% town anyways and becoming incapable of typing.

Also, LMAO that I'm scum for pushing the mastin lynch. That he spent the whole fucking game pushing. Without voting. I have no words. Not polite ones at any rate. And amused as hell that he thinks I'm scum for being too towny. The contortions there, they amaze.

BRO, I know I don't read you well. That doesn't mean I'm not going to try, especially when my almost certainly town neighbor is requesting that I do so. I realize I misread you in Wicked, but as far as I can tell you're not trying to draw the scum read here, thank heaven, so that part's out. I could be wrong. This could be more of me having trouble thinking badly of people when there's some type of history there or a feeling that they don't think I'm an idiot. But I'm inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt and try not to let paranoia take over. I really really really like that you talked about doing VCA today, given that your VCA in Street Racers hit the overwhelming majority of the scum team. I also think that scum-you would have had your bad period, seen that people were backing off, and taken advantage of that somehow. I can see town-you just washing your hands of the whole thing for a bit. I've told Tammy what I'll be looking for going forward, so we'll see what happens.

Tammy-wise, I can confirm that that's what she claimed to me. I've also now effectively fullclaimed to her, and no, I'm not a Watcher. Clyton made some interesting moves, but unfortunately I'm disinclined to continue deceiving town even for their own good. I will not be claiming in-thread. If Tammy wants to out my role, that's her prerogative.

Other reads so far: magenta coming in and trying to sidetrack the discussion into the adult-child question was bad. Role-wise I don't know how a governor --> cagefight maker works for scum, but the nonchalance pinged.

AP feels oddly detached. The soft push on the claimed vig isn't great, but if he actually wants to work with BRO that might be a decent sign. Street Racers was on and off in his willingness to work with BRO, so I'll be watching how that develops. I didn't have a good sense of him in 172, and he kept trying to steer me there. I don't trust him putting ffery in as a cop choice, and I also have to give some credence to mastin's read on him post-town flip. Waiting to be wowed.

I want to see Nacho do more than play wise mediator for Tammy-CF. I'm particularly interested to see what he does with me (yes, self-centered, deal with it) given how he played me in Wicked. I also can't remember my last game with town-Nacho (NY 164?), but I know that scum-Nacho always takes me a while to find and then I doubt myself horribly (HP: CoS, X-Men)

I remember nothing from RG or F&H. That can change any time, please and thank you.

Current reads:

Town: BWS, Tammy, PV (for claim; I'm assuming we'll get an explanation for the lack of shot timing issue)
Lean town: JSU, Cupcake (pending where he's going with all this capsrage)
Null: RG, F&H
Lean scum: magenta, AP, Nacho
Scum: CF

Y'all apparently wiped out Tammy for the night, and I want to talk to her more about stuff before deciding where to vote.

[penguin_alien]

Penguin, I explained why I reacted the way I did. My push on you in ETL's resistance didn't make any sort of sense whatsoever and I said that part of the reason for the push was to confuse people and create chaos.

I make "over-the-top" pushes as town too. Did you already forget the "tragic penguin pictures" from Cowardly Hider?

I explained why I freaked out over one vote because I was paranoid that it was part of a larger scum plan. I legitimately have finals and am really, really behind and that's making me irritable and prickly overall because I'm playing this game as I watch more time fly by instead of studying.

It feels like you suddenly reacted to me accusing you by pushing back on me. What scum motivation is there to accuse you when I learned from ETL's Resistance that you would prevail? I respect your abilities and if you are town in a game where I am scum, I target my game towards you and try my best to fool you because that's what works. Going after you never did and I wouldn't expect it to. I am not Mastin and the way I view you when I am scum couldn't be more different.

Your over the top push on Tammy comes from nothing reasonable I can see. And I did what you asked overnight and read through your ISO. Part of what I discussed with Tammy was that I wasn't seeing strong town-you in it, so while I can maybe see that my read on you comes out of thin air, rest assured that it's been building for the last couple of days.

I remember your tragic penguin pics (my soul hasn't recovered, TYVM) but even there you had an agenda with being OTT, like you did in Resistance. Trouble is I don't see the town agenda here for flipping out on Tammy. I'd say it's emotional, except let's face it, neither of your past OTT responses have been anything other than strategic, either trying to paint me as scum or figure out if I'm scum.

Although interesting that you posit that you wouldn't have changed aspects of your game post-Wicked whereas I would have.

On a side note, seriously, I know it's the end of the school year for semester people (yay quarter system) and there are important non-Mafia obligations. This is a game. It's been really intense from what I've read, and I think it feels ramped up with how high emotions have been running. If I'm wrong and you're town, and you're stressed enough to be helping generate a dozen pages of content in like eight hours from one vote, take a deep breath and step back. We have time. I'd much rather play with you when you're in a conducive place than have us death spiral tunnel each other for out of game stressors.

[penguin_alien]

Not 100%. I've read the major events, obviously everything since replacing in, and ISO'd Titan, JSU, mastinSSK, and CF pretty closely. Those ISOs add up to...a bit over 2000 posts. In ISOing, when things caught my interest I'd click out to read a page or two in context. That plus the last 35 pages, and I've probably read 60-70% of the game? I haven't read front to back, and I probably won't, since there's time for me to interact with people. I'll probably pick and choose other things to read as they become relevant again.

[penguin_alien]

I want to talk to F-16 more here before the day ends, but here's what I see.

Katsuki is on one side and AP-JSU are the other. We either have one scum and two town nailed here, or one town and two scum. If we lynch Katsuki, if he flips scum it's a 0:1 town:scum effect. If town, we get a 1:2 effect of known town:scum. Either way we get one more scum than town flip.

If we lynch one of {AP, JSU} in the event they're town we get a 1:1 town:scum result; if they're scum we get a 0:2 effect.

I personally like the guarantee of netting one more scum than town at this point. My best town read in the group is JSU. And the risk of losing one of a tracker and investigative role versus a delayer is pretty clear.

P-edit: F-16, it was 3 AM in the morning. I was trying to give a read on someone with hundreds of posts. The major post was the 'meltdown' and seemed to be key to people's reads. Whatever people might think, I'm not actually a bitch IRL, and my knee jerk reaction to seeing someone upset isn't to pick at them. So reading that post, it took a lot to remain as objective as possible. Yes, I hedged. I didn't have a good sense of his overall play. But if you stop damn well cherry picking it, you'll see that I'm leaning town on him even at that point. Overnight I read up more closely and concluded my instinct was right and he was town. I spent a decent bit of time talking to Tammy about that.

I've been suckered a lot the last six months by artificial words, and I'm trying to step back and not sidle off when something hits my positive emotions. So I considered all the angles. Why are you trying to act like my laying out the possibilities

before I drew my conclusions

is scummy while ignoring those conclusions?

[penguin_alien]

Yes, F-16, I claimed my real role in the neighborhood. No, I'm not claiming it to you.

I was confident on mastin being scum. I'd just come off a game where I found scum-mastin and hedged too much. I took a lot of shit for it on both sides, both having my read undermined during the day phase and then being told that I wasn't firm enough about it after the scum flip. So yeah, I came in here determined not to make the same mistake. Ended up making a different mistake in the process, and I'll eat crow for it in post-game.

Do you seriously want me to do a PBPA of you? Because quite frankly that sounds like hell on earth. And I don't get to touch anything you've said on D3 because you weren't logical? The hell?

AP, I'll answer your post later tonight. But I did answer how much of the game I've read. Seeing as my ISO isn't hundreds of posts, I think you should be able to find it.

[penguin_alien]

Yes, F-16, I claimed my real role in the neighborhood. No, I'm not claiming it to you.

I was confident on mastin being scum. I'd just come off a game where I found scum-mastin and hedged too much. I took a lot of shit for it on both sides, both having my read undermined during the day phase and then being told that I wasn't firm enough about it after the scum flip. So yeah, I came in here determined not to make the same mistake. Ended up making a different mistake in the process, and I'll eat crow for it in post-game.

Do you seriously want me to do a PBPA of you? Because quite frankly that sounds like hell on earth. And I don't get to touch anything you've said on D3 because you weren't logical? The hell?

That's not what I was saying at all. I don't expect a post by post analysis of my ISO. I expected some sort of accusation based on why my body of work pointed to scum as opposed to "

the back and forth you had with Tammy looks scummy and here's why you've been illogical.

"

I've done a whole bunch of things I wouldn't be able to fake:

1) Counterclaim miller on the most notoriously difficult to lynch player on the site and push a wagon on them. Why the heck would I do that? And how would I know that they are not actually a miller? If I did that as scum, I would expect to be vigged immediately upon their miller flip because I would expect them to be telling the truth about their role.

2) Spend a ton of my effort pushing Mastin when as scum, I usually go with the flow and don't overextend myself - you've seen this in Wicked. Mostly, I let town dictate who they want to lynch and take the fall for it.

3) Most of my D1 analysis is nothing like my analysis as scum either and above the level I can convincingly fake as scum.

Your reaction to me was much different from your reaction in Cowardly Hider though where you immediately tried to placate me and get me change my mind and I'm not seeing that here at all which points to you being town. But I can't for the life of me figure out why you are shutting down all of my questions the way you are doing ("do you want me to do a PBPA?" "I can't bring up D3 because you weren't logical?" etc) because that's not what I meant at all.

On tablet, sorry for massive quote.

I don't know about the miller part. You're right that that is pretty odd. I can think of scenarios that explain it without you being honest either. But I want to step back and think about them first.

Your analysis...I think we saw how well you fake analysis as scum, or don't fake it, as the case may be.

Frankly your not being on the mastin lynch looks exactly like you not overextending yourself.

I need to take a deep breath, calm down, and think things through.

[penguin_alien]

I am really paranoid about the "unfiltered thoughts" and the

pointing out things about me she doesn't like.

Reminds me of how sure everyone was of Ghatokaca-town in Wicked based on the neighborhood.

It feels like she is saying all these things in secret and the rest of us can't see what it is.

Re: the bolded, that's...kind of how neighborhoods work? Useful relevant stuff is showing up here, things that I want to watch for or think Tammy should watch for if I die are staying there.

And are you surprised you were a hot topic of discussion for us, given the start of the day? I realize it probably feels like it's middle school and we're gossiping about you behind your back, but really...

OK. Thirteen pages, and what did we learn. Most people's roles. Well done.

Sorry, head reeling. More convinced than ever that Cupcake is the scum between {JSU, AP}. Before it was more my town read on JSU and the guaranteed payoff of getting one more dead scum than town; now I want a Cupcake lynch because his behavior here is scummy as hell and AP is looking damn town.

I have no problem hammering this lynch within a couple days, but I'd like to make sure anything else that has to be said is said. CF, are you planning to make another neighborhood?

I'll mull this over, but at this point either Katsuki is scum and we have a great jumping off point for reeling in the scum team or a town-Katsuki means the scum team got narrowed down right quick.

Elsewhere PV mostly feels town, I want more on record from RG, Fox and Hound are walling and I keep forgetting what they say, and I need to get a real read on orcinus-Mara pronto. The dissent I see among everyone re: the towniness of their cagefight is notable.

[penguin_alien]

Penguin, no two non-AP players have claimed to be in the same neighborhood so I probably won't activate one. But it is compulsive and I have to pick a title each day so I'll probably pick a random one that AP isn't in.

You said in your post before the previous one that you wanted to talk to me. What did you want to discuss?

Don't remember. Will say so if/when I remember. I missed Tammy in neighborhood, so.

[penguin_alien]

Oh dear lord, notscience. Read the game and put your vote somewhere useful.

Although after all the attention Nacho showered on me in Wicked, I'm feeling a bit slighted here. Not sure what I'd do with Nacho anyways, since his 'reads me right when he's town' and 'makes at least a cursory attempt to lynch me when he's scum' moves are officially out of date.

AP, you had questions for me at one point. If they still apply, you're welcome to ask them again. It's Saturday night and I'm too lazy to go rummaging through this ridiculous thread.

CF...I think I'm tabling my read on you pending how today goes down. Yes, it's wussy on my part, but given that when I was reading last night I went into full-blown paranoia mode that you had read-access to our neighborhood that you were concealing, I think I'm past being very rational in reading you. I'll recalibrate with Tammy, since she's currently the cool-headed part of the neighborhood.

notscience, hit me. And the tl;dr version is that AP claimed an innocent result on ffery, Katsuki claimed to have messed with AP making AP a liar, and JSU claimed seeing that AP had in fact visited ffery and was also non-replica or whatever. So lynching Katsuki means that we're guaranteed at least one more scum flip than town flip even if we're all wrong about Katsuki. Which, given that I have a town read on JSU and ffery in that side of the chain, I doubt I am.

So.

VOTE: CupcakePanda

Possibly L-1 again.

[penguin_alien]

notscience, after Micro 289 I don't trust your supposed 'bleeding towniness' and now that I think about it, I remember I don't like your recent play after Micro 324. I see nothing here so far that's a major improvement over that.

[penguin_alien]

notscience, why am I not surprised you don't remember the recent Strange Idea game where you voted a claimed town tracker for zero reason and used your role that checked for aliens after an alien was lynched Day One to check the absolute least likely person to also be an alien despite knowing a tracker was in the game and that said target was a likely NK?

I've voiced my opinion of Wicked, so I'm not going back to that apple cart.

You get no free town reads from me, and that you're asking for one makes me wish I had a vig shot. But that's apparently PV's department. And I doubt Cabd will let me flip the 'A' in 'PA' to give me the shot instead.

[penguin_alien]

F-16, this isn't fitting into my understanding of your town play. You're always really logical and fact-based, where even your 'emotional' reactions are designed as means to an end. But that's obviously not happening here, so I have to decide if it's an aberration as you say or if you have a motive I'm not seeing.

When you bounce all over with stuff like saying that your role PM implies multiple cops and being suspicious that we have multiple cop-like roles claimed, I get worried.

Let's look at our games: town-town in HP: CoS, and you misread me enough that I couldn't really work with you. scum-town in Resistance and you went OTT strategically. town-scum in 295; I don't tend to take notes on people's town play when I'm scum; I'm too busy trying to screw them over. scum-town in Wicked where I massively misread you.

So I don't think I'm any great shakes at reading you, and I'm sure as hell not going to be arrogant enough to think I can after being crushed in Wicked.

I am willing to step back, listen to whatever Tammy's thinking, and reevaluate. That's my best offer.

P-edit: notscience, too bad, I hold you responsible for your slot's play. That game was a quick read, and if you didn't choose to read it, that's on you. I spent the whole time from when I replaced in until I got lynched screaming at people to apply some fucking brain power to the game and got nada. You not reading doesn't redeem you one iota. Seriously, when you can't be arsed to check flips in the OP when dealing with mass claim...you don't get to come in here and demand I town read you on your say-so.

[penguin_alien]

notscience, let's just leave it at my wanting to see you do something here. Personally I'd rather you not be caught up yet, take the time to read, and form whatever updated opinions you get from that. You want to be town-read. So say we all. I'm more interested in what you're doing to figure out the game.

F-16, I think my problem here is that for whatever reason your play here isn't fitting into what I've seen from you before, and it's leaving me without a good reference point. I'm trying to be more upfront and transparent as town, since apparently everyone likes me more when I speak my mind, even though it gets me mislynched. I'm personally uneasy about the whole thing, since my natural habitat is that of the wallflower, but. So I'm giving it to you straight: I don't know what to make of you, I know I'm susceptible to people's emotions, and I don't trust my own reactions.

[penguin_alien]

OK, working on catching up here; ran out of time/energy yesterday. Still not 100% current, but through page 263, I'll say that Tammy's paranoia wasn't out of left field. Elaborating further would be anti-town at this point.

Mod, I'll be V/LA for the next two days. Thanks!

If I can catch up in the next two hours I will; otherwise it'll have to wait. My apologies.

[penguin_alien]

OK. Basically caught up (sorry, lots of IRL stuff to resolve), and we have a goddamn scum lynch for today.

VOTE: CarbonFiber

a) There is absolutely no way in hell town-F-16 was reaction testing obvtown-Titan for that long.

b) I completely believe that he's scum who wants town-Tammy dead via lynch today and no later.

I'd lynch magenta or JSU, but I think CF's the scum flip that's going to break the game open for us. And really, JSU would be for information to confirm AP and BWS.

Tammy, I'm assuming when it's not 2 AM your time and you have a minute we can chat, but for the love of absolutely everything that is holy, stop trying to get yourself lynched, FFS.

Also thinking this is town-Nacho. I want to think I'm seeing PV-town here in the way he's presenting his thoughts, but I'm not sold yet. And even though info from a JSU flip is a thing, I really still want to town read them, so I have zero problem lynching a supposed miller who spent absolutely ages trying to lynch Tammy while cheerleading other town mislynches and not voting them. There's a difference between being slow to vote and goading other people into voting in your stead.

So town reads on Nacho, BWS, AP, JSU, Tammy --> scum = CF, magenta, RG...PV/F&H? Not sure about the fourth slot, but I'd lynch any of the first three happily.

...and posting this, incoherent as it is, because I'm zonked and just glad to be done dealing with V/LA stuff.

P-edit: Tammy...talk to me when you're not toasted.

[penguin_alien]

Well gee, after you so accurately nailed me to the wall I just set myself on an ice floe and consigned myself to a tragic death.

Or waiting for you to get a better fake freak-out posted.

Or flirting with the mod on Skype to see if I can get a day vig shot and save us all a lot of trouble.

Pick one.

[penguin_alien]

I have no scum QT. Wait! Better idea: ramp up flirting skills, become fifth scum team member, and jump ship from this dumbass town that won't lynch you.

[penguin_alien]

:puts on best Marilyn Monroe impression:

Happy unbirthday to you
Happy unbirthday to you
Happy unbirthday Mr. Fox and Hound
Happy unbirthday to you

...I really should go to sleep. Although Nacho's totally missing me going all fatigue-driven unfiltered where I speak uncensored truth.

[penguin_alien]

Like in this video: http://video.nationalgeographic.com/vid ... aining-lex

A) That would be a seal they're mislynching, not a penguin. If you're going to play this like you're town as per Micro 295 again, I demand more accurate visual aids.

B) I suspect Cabd is rather attached to his Tales theme here and has no interest in recasting you and your scum buddies as killer whales.

I like how I got V/LA for a weekend, and 2/4 scum go for the miller mislynch over the end of the investigative chain mislynch.

So you really think that town-F-16 decides it's an excellent use of his time to tunnel the extremely town Tammy? I could see him pulling that move for a bit to see what shakes out, but not to the extent he did.

Pedophilic roleblock/stop. we couldn't have done anything to you, even if we wanted to, pigey (and Orci did try N1 so...)

I have no idea what this is. Who's pigey? Are you reading the game? Or is your scum team just feeding you crappy summaries?

@ Beli, JSU, PV, and Nacho (if you are town), let's consolidate our efforts on DV today.

Ooh, ooh, I know how this song goes! Let's push a lynch and not actually vote for it! Isn't it a lovely tune?

[penguin_alien]

F-16, I realize that at this point whatever I do you're either going to interpret it as scummy or playing to my town meta as scum because you're convinced I'm not town here. But seeing as Tammy's freaking out and I'm getting increasingly lost, can we try resetting?

I really don't get your push on Tammy if you're town. Explain it to me like I'm an idiot, please.

And explain to me why F&H is the lynch for today. Because all I see are walls and walls, and at the end of it I have no idea who's sincere and who's spamming up the thread.

I'm kind of hitting the wall here in terms of brainpower to figure this out, and I'm stressed and tired. Throw me a bone here.

[penguin_alien]

Mod, I will be V/LA for a week (through 6/4) due to personal issues. I apologize to you and the players; if this is too long a V/LA for the game, I understand if you need to force-replace me.

[penguin_alien]

More or less back, catching up, on page 315 for a couple of things.

JSU, I went nowhere last night, as I had no action to take. If it helps, the only person I targeted all game was Titan.

Penguin, please explain your townread on Nacho in-depth.

I thought his drive-by posting sounded more like his antagonistic stuff from when we hydraed in the last Cabd game than the Wicked stuff where he was more 'lull into complacency' in his attitude. Also didn't think he'd pull the 'tell us your feeeeeelings' crap on me twice in a row as scum. Supreme irony being that I'm currently in my 'spill guts' state and he's in his scummy afterlife unable to enjoy it, poor dear. Didn't hurt that I agreed with him on things like mastin being scummy, etc.

So I lack further depth. Continuing to catch up eventually, maybe tonight, maybe very late tonight, just don't know. Sorry for being such a flake...

[penguin_alien]

Totally lost here still, but claiming, right.

I'm Gaius, Town Charismatic King

I have four sub-people who I sent out on paired missions: Presa-Wingull to watch-track the same player on sequential nights (N1 no one visited Tammy, N2 Tammy visited no one). Then Agria-Jiao to deliver a present-do something to me on N3/N4 respectively. The second action doesn't happen unless the first one is successful; otherwise it's automatic. I told Tammy about the present before delivering it, but there is zero reason to claim it in-thread. And Tammy, stop self-voting FFS. My present isn't going to kill you, so knock it off.

Claiming the second pair of actions more specifically is a really bad idea. If Tammy wants to straight-up claim, I won't stop her, and I've told her that in the neighborhood. I think. It's been a while. But seriously, if I was going to give her something bad, I wouldn't TELL her I was giving her something. Sheesh, not complete idiot, TYVM.

I'm an adult male, citizen of Rise Maxia? From Xillia.

RG-F&H looks weird, but if we hit scum today we can sort them later. Leaning Magenta, but I want to read their ISO again, and I don't want to leave it open for them to self-hammer and end the day before JSU can post their thoughts.

...which is to say my vote won't be going somewhere more useful for now.

BWS, how do you feel about lynching Magenta rather than RG-F&H?

[penguin_alien]

You finally voted a lynch wagon and it was for scum. Cutting you some slack for now.

I'll vote Magenta tomorrow once I hear from BWS at least.

[penguin_alien]

Make them alstroemerias and you have a deal.

VOTE: Magenta

L-1, yadda, yadda. Give me flowers.

[penguin_alien]

for now I want to lynch PA or RG and I don't really care which.

My understanding is that your stance is that RG is 1v1-ing you from yesterday. Why are you trying to derail that supposed 1v1 onto me?

F&H's claimed result on CF seems to line up. But it was claimed, so eh. Was there any mention of the neighborizer thing?

I'm not sure about this. RG's claim is weaker, but F&H trying to avoid the 1v1 is shadier.

Titan's the only one I feel solid on. CF is weak town maybe. That's wavering after his grandiose push to lynch Magenta, but then it's my fault too for not being connected to the game.

I'm leaning F&H right now, but I don't want to vote lest scum go nuts if I'm wrong. Stupid XyLo games.

BRO, did you ever delve into the VCA stuff?

[penguin_alien]

Caught up but still being indecisive here. Fox & Hound aren't making me think they're town, but then RG isn't doing much at all. I'll figure out where to go when I have time in a few hours.

[penguin_alien]

VOTE: Red Gyarados

[penguin_alien]

My total faith in you to penguin in the neighborhood had nothing to do with her alignment and me having faith in her ability to flirt to get what she wanted :/

...I have no flirting skills. I used to smuggle Star Trek novels into school dances in my purse to avoid participation in any such shenanigans.

Thanks for the game, Cabd! And I had a blast with the whole scum team. (and still sorry to Tammy...)

I'm definitely taking a shot for every time in thread or dead PT that mastin called me cheeky scum.

I would do this for every time mastin insisted I was town misreading her/bad town/etc. but I don't think blacking out would be a good way to start my drinking life...

It's somewhere in the scum PT, but I was reading a bit before I was asked to replace in, and based on the ten pages before I joined I couldn't figure out why Nacho and AP were so badly misreading obvtown mastin(!) Burden of proficiency is a thing. (for them, not me; I'm rarely competent as town, let alone proficient)