Mini 1579: The Great Flavor Caper (Game Over)

[reinoe]

VOTE: Elyse

Random vote in the house y'all!

What's everyone's flavor? I taste like butternut squash.

[reinoe]

Why do you need links josh? You have my word, which is even better than links!

Links? I'll do you one better and provide pictures!!!



Bar-b-q at my place y'all!

[reinoe]

Damn I think RVS is slowly coming to an end. Time to put on my thinking cap.

RVS analysis: Useless or useful?

Personally I think it's useless and I've heard of people using it to find scum, but I've only ever seen it used once after two lynches, and that person admitted that they would have been wrong on things.

[reinoe]

Damn I think RVS is slowly coming to an end. Time to put on my thinking cap.

RVS analysis: Useless or useful?

Personally I think it's useless and I've heard of people using it to find scum, but I've only ever seen it used once after two lynches, and that person admitted that they would have been wrong on things.

So are you actually going to get into the game or just keep sidelining?

This one line post is actually full of information.

Bacde: I ask questions to gather information. The question I asked is about how seriously people take the analysis of RVS. This question is obviously relevant to the issue at hand. I expressed my opinion on RVS. I also invited anyone else to express their opinion on the question.

But there's your reaction to the question too...Not only did you brush off the question, you then proceeded to imply that the question and my participation was irrelevant. Not answering the question also provides information.

VOTE: Bacde

[reinoe]

P-edit:
@reinoe

Instead of getting pissy at bacde for calling you out on sidelining, would like to comment on Josh B or knife?

It's not sidelining if people are discussing the merits of RVS and the analysis thereof.

Josh B? His posts aren't great and it looks like sloppy scumhunting. At least he's making an effort.

Sharpest? His vote is only the third on josh so it's no big deal.

Unrelated: I like Mirhawks thought process so we're on the same page there. It considers several possibilities instead of just of just locking into conclusions. With that being said.

[reinoe]

@Elyse

I think that me being apologetic is not being scummy. It's just that since this is my first game I feel a little guilty because I feel like I was being influenced a little too quickly at the beginning of the game and posting too quick before thinking out my posts and I just don't want to annoy people so I'm trying to think it out a little more before I comment. That's why I also mentioned that for now I want to hear more comments before I take a vote.

So is this nervous town red herring lynchbait?

[reinoe]

What makes you think he is nervous?

It's his first game, but just to be sure...


Chaoslord...do you have any mafia experience anywhere else online?

[reinoe]

Wordy? Yes

Nervous? No

I dont see it. If he was nervous i doubt he would be as forthright as he has been

I think it's first game jitters. But I do agree that he's town for a different reason. Newb scum would have opportunistically tried to push Josh.

[reinoe]

P-edit:
@reinoe

Instead of getting pissy at bacde for calling you out on sidelining, would like to comment on Josh B or knife?

It's not sidelining if people are discussing the merits of RVS and the analysis thereof.

Josh B? His posts aren't great and it looks like sloppy scumhunting. At least he's making an effort.

Sharpest? His vote is only the third on josh so it's no big deal.

Unrelated: I like Mirhawks thought process so we're on the same page there. It considers several possibilities instead of just of just locking into conclusions. With that being said.

You do realize your bacde vote is terrible, right? Are you going to pretend to stubborn and pretend to believe in it or are you going to remove it?

Also, if Josh B's posts aren't great and it looks like sloppy scumhunting, then why would you assume he is town? (This is in reference to saying newbscum would go after him)

Furthermore, if you think newbscum would go after Josh, then why isn't knife's vote on him troubling?

1. Your vote is on chaoslord and it's a red-herring vote, so you're the last person to talk about "bad votes".

2. How do you know I'm assuming he's town? You see the part where several people are waiting on responses? That's the proper thing to do. I don't think Josh's post are so bad that he deserves to be at L-3: which I personally feel is a tipping point on a d-1 lynch. You do see the part where I said "at least he's trying" right? That doesn't mean I think he's town or scum it just means he's putting in effort.

3. I didn't like bacde's response. You do realize people have differing opinions on things right? You're being really presumptious and pushy too. You're making all kinds of assumptions about other players.

4. Newbscum would put Josh at L-3, that previously mentioned tipping point. The fact that chaoslord wanted to wait before putting down a vote suggests that he's not newbscum.

5. And I don't care that Josh had three votes because he's "earned" those three votes. His posting isn't great but I don't think he deserves to have a developing wagon: at least not before he clarifies a few things.

I'm fine with being asked questions but you make several leaps of logic in these questions. The fact that bacde and I agree on chaoslord for independent reasons suggests that my vote on him may be a bad one. Then compare that you your leaps in logic to build a case and well...

VOTE: Elyse

[reinoe]

@Slandaar
Could you tell us your thoughts on the game?


@mirhawk
what are your thoughts on Elyse and Sharpest?


p:edit

Yo dude you are working really hard to not have a read on josh

Saying that chaoslord is town because he didnt vote josh implies that josh is town, yet you claim to have no read on him?

I disagree. You're going to have to walk me through that logic.

[reinoe]

it wasn't his RVS that gave him away. There are some other patterns there too that are interesting.

What is this?

it wasn't his RVS that gave him away. There are some other patterns there too that are interesting.

What is this?

I would also like an explanation of this. It looks like you were expecting bacde to continue the push and provide the reasons for you.

TYR I think you bring up some great points, before I cast my vote though I want to hear Josh_B's defense.

So Mirhawk, Chaoslord, and Slandaar are all either scum or town because they've chosen to wait for clarifiction?

[reinoe]

"CLARIFICATION".

[reinoe]

Besides even if slandaar was purposely ignoring reinoe's question, so what? What would be the scum motivation for doing that?

Yes, what would be the scum motivation for depriving the town of information..

By your logic who cares if Josh doesn't answer your questions since I don't care about what you asked him. m i rite?

[reinoe]

What is this? You're pushing JoshB for more of an answer and you left this hanging?

Yes?

I can want clarification of an answer to my question while not wanting to answer a question asked of me.

What are the circumstances in which you will cooperate with the town and answer questions?

[reinoe]

stuff.

I think it's rather remarkable that you can't see the scum motivations for someone withholding information.

[reinoe]

What is this? You're pushing JoshB for more of an answer and you left this hanging?

Yes?

I can want clarification of an answer to my question while not wanting to answer a question asked of me.

What are the circumstances in which you will cooperate with the town and answer questions?

VOTE: Slandaar

[reinoe]

@Sharpest
I think we've had a breakdown in communication. I was under the impression that the "great post" of yankee's that you were voting because of was post 55. Your vote isn't nearly as bad if its taken in context to post 48.

@Titus
I don't care what slandaar does with the information. I seconded the question because I wanted it answered. If you can't tell the difference between those then that's your problem, not mine.

I'm also curious as to how this is a defense of slandaar. I'm pretty sure the closest I've come to that is stating that I don't care if slandaar answers reinoes question or not.

Why is your vote on chaoslord?

[reinoe]

What are the circumstances in which you will cooperate with the town and answer questions?

I didn't say I wouldn't answer questions or that I won't answer yours in time; obviously at some point I will post my opinion I just don't want to right now.

Besides I did answer, with a smiley, if you are unhappy do what I did with Josh or ask why.

Titus has failed to answer this so you try (shes scum); What is scummy about wanting my questions answered while deciding not to answer yours?

I did ask "why". What are the circumstances in which you will answer questions? When will that time come? When you develop a meaningful wagon? When you think I forget (I won't)? When the world cup is over? If you actually think answering with a smiley is satisfactory then I have to let you know I am not so easily satisfied. I scum hunt by asking questions. Townies rarely have to hide what they're doing. An opinion on the game is not some esoteric question.

Bacde already called you out on your lack of contributions. Now you're trying to be coy and pretend I didn't ask "why" when I clearly did.

[reinoe]

No particular reason.

I left it there originally while I waited to see what way sharpest and JB were going to jump, but neither of them has done anything to warrant me moving it yet.

If you're asking about my opinion on chaos, it that he's likely town.

Mirhawk, could you help me out and put your vote on Slandaar. It looks like he needs pressure and he's also engaging in the same evasive behavior that Josh is engaging in.

[reinoe]

When did i ever call out slandaar?

Post 85

[reinoe]

When did i ever call out slandaar?

Post 85

What is your opinion on slandaar's deliberate effort to not contribute, answer questions, or cooperate with the town? He also wont elaborate on the circumstances, conditions, or timing in which he will begin contributing.

Why do you think slandaar could be town?

[reinoe]

That wording is so slimeball-esque.

The word you're looking for is "accurate".

It correctly identifies your behavior this game. If you are avoiding participation as a reaction test, then this is the reaction you get. I don't know what game of mafia you think you're playing but in this game I look forward to players working together to lynch scum. Your actions are standing in the way of that and I cannot think of any town motivation for your conduct.

[reinoe]

Vote: Josh B[/]

reinoe's using negative reinforcement to make things that aren't all that scummy look worse then they are.

I find someone not answering questions and then not answering why pretty damn scummy. More scummy than someone who answers questions poorly. Both are scummy but at least the person answering poorly could be confused. I can't think of any logical excuse for what slandaar is doing.

[reinoe]

If you can answer this question to my satisfaction I will switch my vote to reinoe, so make it good.

His answer is ehhh I don't see it as completely town like Bacde but I'll probably move my vote anyway.

[reinoe]

My vote on reinoe has nothing to do with Slandaar or you.

It doesn't have anything to do with logic either.

[reinoe]

Was that supposed to be funny?

No. This is funny...

If you can answer this question to my satisfaction I will switch my vote to reinoe, so make it good.

His answer is ehhh I don't see it as completely town like Bacde but I'll probably move my vote anyway.

You see my signature? That's you in a nutshell. I'll answer your derp wall but I'm gonna need some alchohol first...

[reinoe]

Spoiler: drunkpost and a wall so spoilered

Chaoslord is cautious, that pretty much sums the whole thing up. Also, we both know what Chaoslords response will be and you'll have to unvote him afterwards anyways so why drag it out?

I actually don't know what his response will be.

And in the end it didn't matter what his response was. You acknowledged that chaos' response wasn't great but that you were removing your vote anyway. Scumpoints get awarded to Elyse!

I agree that Reinoe's vote on bacade is weak, but why is he your back up vote?

Haven't liked anything he's posted.

@Elyse
I first thought that Bacde had a strong argument only because his was the first in the game and since this is my first game I thought about it and realized that it sounded good but before I had a chance to vote I saw how many people starting commenting how it wasn't a strong argument and Bacde himself said that his argument was a weak one at best in post 43 and he also pointed out that I was taking the first page a little too serious so I decided that I shouldn't vote for Slandaar yet because people had already pointed out he was not actually being scum. That's why I'm taking my time before I vote now and why I did not choose to vote for Slandaar.

@Mirhawk
If you were expecting this answer ^^ from chaos then good job I guess but I wasn't expecting something like this. I didn't know what to expect. His answer is ehhh I don't see it as completely town like Bacde but I'll probably move my vote anyway.
UNVOTE:

1. Your vote is on chaoslord and it's a red-herring vote, so you're the last person to talk about "bad votes".

Say what? My vote on chaoslord isn't a "red herring" and even if it was that doesn't make your vote good. The strength of your vote is shown when you change it in this very post.

Hey and the strength of your vote is shown when you change it despite chaoslord not even meeting the criteria you laid out by your own admission. Whoops. I guess chaoslord was getting too many townie points for your vote to look credible without some serious explaining required.

2. How do you know I'm assuming he's town? You see the part where several people are waiting on responses? That's the proper thing to do. I don't think Josh's post are so bad that he deserves to be at L-3: which I personally feel is a tipping point on a d-1 lynch. You do see the part where I said "at least he's trying" right? That doesn't mean I think he's town or scum it just means he's putting in effort.

I said you assumed he was town when you said newbscum would go after him. Unless you are insinuating newbscum would go after their own partner?

I didn't assume he's town. Could go either way with josh. Let me explain it to you in simple terms.

Newbscum would go after josh. Newbtown would wait before pushing a vote. Just because chaos is town doesn't mean josh is town or scum. How is this hard to understand?

3. I didn't like bacde's response. You do realize people have differing opinions on things right? You're being really presumptious and pushy too. You're making all kinds of assumptions about other players.

"Presumptious" (presumptuous) and pushy aren't scum behaviors and what kind of assumptions am I making? The only one I can think of is that you are townreading Josh because newbscum would go after him. I'm only assuming that because it doesn't make sense if you think he's scum.

OMG TYPO!

Newbscum chaos would have pushed josh which would have indicated that josh could be town. Newbtown chaos did not push josh at the time. So that means that josh' alignment is ????

4. Newbscum would put Josh at L-3, that previously mentioned tipping point. The fact that chaoslord wanted to wait before putting down a vote suggests that he's not newbscum.

This is just silly. An arbitrary tipping point and specific behaviors you decided do not make someone scummy or not scummy.

This just in: everyone has their own personal take on scumtells, analysis, and how the game should be played. These determinations are made completely based on a person's personality and take into account any number of circumstances up to and included "gut reactions". Up next: could this actually be Elyse's first game?

5. And I don't care that Josh had three votes because he's "earned" those three votes. His posting isn't great but I don't think he deserves to have a developing wagon: at least not before he clarifies a few things.

So if someone put the fourth vote on him, you would care? Is that because it's past this "tipping point" you've created?

VOTE: reinoe

At the time? Yes I would have cared. Because at the time while I was fine with josh being at three votes. Three votes is not a serious wagon. Someone being at four votes on page three when it's not rvs? Yeah I would have had some concerns about that because I didn't believe chaos would have deserved a flashwagon. I hate flash wagons that are not RVS.

Because chaoslord not voting josh being a town move only makes sense if josh is town. If josh was scum, and chaos was scum, wouldnt not voting josh actually be more of a scum move?

Reinoe you never responded to this properly. This is why I am assuming you are townreading Josh. Your reluctance to state your read on him looks like you keeping your options open to vote him.

I have a feeling that because of your confbias there is no correct answer to any of your questions. Just like how it didn't matter what chaoslord said you were switching your vote anyway. As exemplified by you switching your vote despite admitting that chaoslords response to your question wasn't great. This is why I had to get liquored up to even bother with answering your derpwall. It's a complete waste of my time trying to satisfy you but the information highlighting your flippant hypocrisy is something the town should consider for later.

The tone of Elyse's posts suggests a soft attack on you without taking a solid position. Her vote on chaoslord was ridiculous, especially seeing as how she told him exactly how to remove it. If feels to me like she was looking for a place to temporarily place her vote so she wouldn't have to commit to one of the serious wagons.

I think I took a solid position when I said I would be voting reinoe.

I never told chaoslord how to make him remove my vote and what are the "serious wagons"? Josh? Is that it?

I'm entirely uninterested with Slandaar v Titus and would be ok with lynching Josh or reinoe.

No, actually you did tell chaoslord how to get him to remove your vote. You acknowledged that he didn't meet your criteria. And then you switched your vote anyway. Your vote on me is even more ridiculous than your vote on chaoslord.


Sorry about the formatting errors, I had to get liquored up just to bring myself to respond to Elyse' tripe.

[reinoe]

Also from reading through the posts, I still feel that although Josh_B is coming off a little questionable, I am starting to question which side Titus is on so for now I am going to remove my vote.

Unvote: Josh_B

Titus is town.

[reinoe]

@Bacde
You know what to be honest I was about 6 to 7 pages behind so I kinda skimmed through quickly to try and get the gist of it so I could make a comment. I must have missed some of your points.

@Reinoe
Why do you feel that Titus is town?

Because Titus and I want open communications in the same way. But more importantly. The same things are clicking for us. Take for example Slandaars conduct.

What are the circumstances in which you will cooperate with the town and answer questions?

I didn't say I wouldn't answer questions or that I won't answer yours in time; obviously at some point I will post my opinion I just don't want to right now.

Besides I did answer, with a smiley, if you are unhappy do what I did with Josh or ask why.

Titus has failed to answer this so you try (shes scum); What is scummy about wanting my questions answered while deciding not to answer yours?

This is so ridiculous I'm surprised more people aren't voting for slandaar.

@slandaar:
What's scummy is that you're gaining information without providing any. You're willingly and intentionally not providing any. You have so far refused to elaborate on the terms, conditions, timing, or circumstances in which you will be providing information. It's in some nebulous time off in the future. Your post allows you to defer indefinitely, possibly in the hopes that I forget.

[reinoe]

The answer to: When will I post my opinions on the game: When I feel it best to do so.

Which is some far off unspecified moment.
You don't mention the conditions of "when you feel it is best to do so".
You don't mention the circumstance of "when you feel it is best to do so".
You don't mention a timeframe of "when you feel it is best to do so".

So yep. Everything I've said is true. And again, this isn't some esoteric non-game related request. This is a question asking you about the current state of the game.

Are you actually suggesting as scum I wouldn't post any opinions ever?
(this requires an answer)

Well look at your conduct. I've seen scum get away with some bizarro world shit.

[reinoe]

@Anyone who's played with slandaar before:

Is this normal behavior for him? Does he normally do this?

On one hand I find it hard to believe scum would just be so brazenly evasive: on the other hand only myself and Titus have issues with this.

[reinoe]

I'm not going to respond to reinoe's entire wall because it boils down to this:

To say newbscum would go after JoshB and newbtown wouldn't is ok, but you have to take into consideration JoshB's alignment. If JoshB is scum, then what you are saying doesn't make sense. So you assumed JoshB was town in your statement, and that is scummy because it looks like you already know he is town.

How do I assume josh B is town? Let me break it down in a rudimentary chart...

Chaoslord newbtown=doesn't vote josh at the time because he wants clarification
this has no bearing on whether josh is town or scum.

chaoslord newbscum=does vote josh at the time because it's opportunistic
this would make josh town.

I really don't know how to say it any other way. You're the only person who's insinuating anyone knows anyone's alignment.

p: edit. If I know josh is town, and I'm scum why aren't I now pushing for his mislynch!!! josh's responses have certainly been shaky enough for more votes. Good god, why don't you point those powers of perception at yourself. I'm not sure on josh and I'm certainly not going to put a vote on someone I'm not sure on.

Oh wait, if you're sure both me and josh are scum why aren't you voting for josh. OMG OBSCUM TEAM IN SLANDAAR/ELYSE.

[reinoe]

edit: omg that post is full of soppy formating and weird wording. I'm hungover you guys. No more posting today.

[reinoe]

I'm feeling a little better. More votes on Slandaar please.

[reinoe]

I'm gonna get scumread for this, but I've been thinking this game seems kinda multiball because it's faction fighting the whole game.

Meh.

This is an interesting comment in light of Slandaars "claim". I'm not scumreading you for the speculation.

If slandaar is a serial killer it can be used to justify two kills in a night. Sometimes SK don't show up as scum if a cop investigates.

My problem is that slandaars overall play has still been quite unhelpful to the town.

@wake & mirhawk
what do you think about slandaar's claim in light of TSO's speculations.

@bacde
you say that this is not "town slandaar". What is different about this game than the previous game. Could you provide me with a link to "town slandaar"?

I'll unvote for now as this is an interesting revelation.

UNVOTE: slandaar

[reinoe]

I can't be bothered to argue so here is my conftown claim good day.
(translated)

How is that not a claim?

Because you threw a three letter abbreviation for your role in the middle of a sentence. Most people who claim try to make it as obvious as possible.

[reinoe]

That shit is not a claim. That's why. Rather, it looks like an express disavowment of being a vig. He really wants me dead.

I debated ccing Slandaar due to the obvious bs nature of his claim, but I won't. I won't lie to catch scum.

Dude he obviously claimed vig

There are better way to deal with scum lying about bring vig than lynching them outright

How would you recommend handling that then?

Having slandaar shoot someone and dealing with it tomorrow

And if slandaar is SK?

[reinoe]

And if slandaar is SK?

Remove all scum
Slandaar loses.

Not really rocket science.

SK is scum to me. So if you're SK fake claiming vig it would be in my interest to eliminate you. And again, you have not exactly being a helpful contributor to town.

[reinoe]

Plus chances are I get shot tonight soooooooo.

Reinoe is scum though already knew this.

You've called everyone who questions you scum.

[reinoe]

No I think I have called 2 people scum in this game.

I thought I hadn't been posting any opinions though? Wasn't that your argument?

Hrmmmmmmmmmm

You haven't been helpful to the town. For example you still haven't shared your opinion on the state of the game.

HRRMMRMMMMMMMSMMMRMMMDDKDGLGFDODSAGD

[reinoe]

Slandaar could easily actually be a vig, too, seeing as he hasnt exactly scumtold and vig has every reason to play it cool and analyze everyone else's actions

This is interesting in retrospect though. Is that typical vig play, to hang back a lot? Actually if it is then it would make sense that he would not be interested in giving his opinion on the state of the game.

Throws hands in the air.

[reinoe]

There are a few easy ways to verify vig claims and none of them involve lynching him d1, reinoe.

Oh I understand. I'm just a little frustrated. I unvoted slandaar. My prolonged skepticism is just due to some meta reasons that I'm not allowed to discuss because of ongoing games, but Sharpest will understand.

[reinoe]

Vote Count 1.18

Slandaar (5): TheYankeeReaper, Titus, reinoe, Bacde, Josh_B
Josh_B (4): evilpacman18, Mirhawk, Elyse
Bacde (1): Wake88
Titus (1): Slandaar

Not Voting: T S O, chaoslord54, Sharpest-knife-on-tree

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Deadline in (expired on 2014-06-25 16:00:00)

@mod:

There are three people on Josh_B but he's being listed as having four votes. Is the VC accurate?

Got it, thanks ~phok

[reinoe]

I have absolutely no intent to pressure a lynch on slandaar. As I said earlier my prolonged suspicion was due meta reasons.

Elyse is spreading paranoia and has lost all capacity to look at my posts objectively because she's confirmation biased to the max.

[reinoe]

Josh, reads list and an explaination for each person's placement now please.

[reinoe]

EPM: I will do TSO read later
Titus: nice deep TSO read
Sland: Titus read EPM's post
Titus: WAHHHHHHHHH

Anytime now. Anytime...

Titus' comment was sarcasm dude. This is why I trust Titus, because I totally get her and she is definitely town.

[reinoe]

@Evilpacman, I am pretty sure something got lost in translation, maybe perceived as being crazy.

Can you respond to my early post where I raised concerns about you?

TSO has a real deep read.

---->Lol<----

Slandaar, this is totally obvious to me, unlike your "I totally claimed vig, why didn't anyone see it".

[reinoe]

I doubt that slandaar doesnt have a kill, though

My gripe is that he's scumreading/OMGUSing people who challenge him: and the people challenging him are me and Titus. That kinda pisses me off because he's probably going to shoot one of us and we're both town.

Also he says that "he's free to play his game" but his game is still the same from what I've seen.

[reinoe]

I don't know how josh missed post 569.

JOSH THIS IS INTENT TO HAMMER. YOU NEED TO CLAIM NOW.

[reinoe]

Titus. I'm sorry for the vote but this is BS and nobody seems to be reading the game. I know that sometimes I have to put my vote on a town to get my point across.
The shallow OMGUSing and flash wagoning isn't going well for me. Please read my post and we can be friends, not enemies.

I am a Doctor. I didn't want to lynch Bacde because I think he hard softclaimed the gunsmith, in his post about Researchers(investigator) need a Peer Review(PR= Power Role) and the old game that he brought up had a gunsmith. So I've been trying to keep people from lynching him. If I could keep him alive tonight, and keep other people from lynching him today. Any other lynch is alright from my PoE. So that he could bring back that information.

The worst part is that I think this is possibly the most coherent post you've made all game. Waiting for any possible Counters.

[reinoe]

I didn't miss post 569. Wake88's lynch isn't going to wake people up. Titus's would. My lynch is scum heaven, I'm sorry Bacde that I outed you like that. I'm at serious L-1, so this is the only way that I can still try to save you at least for one night.

And finally the vote. "everyone is saying that josh is scum, so I'm going to also even though I put an empty vote on him earlier and haven't read the game
because it makes me look town." Stream of consciousness is a town tell, but saying it is also a buzzword to justify your crap reads so that you can come back later and say "oops I was wrong, he he he."

If you didn't miss 569, then why were you complaining about Wake's vote on you? Wake's vote clearly wasn't on you then, is it? Your wagon is most definitely not a flashwagon. It built up over 20+ pages.

p:edit I can go for a wake lynch but I want to see if there's a counterclaim.

[reinoe]

EBWOP: ISN'T instead of WASN'T. UGH.

[reinoe]

When was I complaining about wake voting me? I'm having to ISO Wake ever voting for me. Oh, he never did. And I never complained about him voting for me. The only thing I've said about Wake is that Mirhawk was trying to scum read him for pushing an idea that he started on Chaos.

I meant to say evil pacman. My bad there.

[reinoe]

@reinoe
Pretty much the same question I asked TSO, except I'm curious as to your opinion on SKOT.

Sharpest isn't the person I wrote the most about...

Spoiler: Chaoslord

I think he's town. He's been open and I understand where he's coming from. He asks questions. He's had a rocky start but for his first game he's gained confidence in what he's saying and doing very quickly.

Spoiler: Wake

Tons and tons of words and yet so little content. I don't know how someone can post so many words and so little content. And he's still doesn't even seem caught up with the game. The seems quite unreal to me. It's like a longwinded prod dodge. For example in post 691 he express concern about post 73. Like are you for real? 600 posts later you realize you're concerned about something like that? That is some fake concern right there. Interesting things I learned about that claim...

Backup cop is a convenient fake claim. It shows up so infrequently that it's unlikely to be counter-claimed. The role is now called "Deputy".

"Backup Cop" is a phrase that hasn't been used since Mini 1266

. It looks like he just looked at the mafiascum wiki and grabbed the name without considering the reality of it. I'd be willing to lynch him despite his claim.

Spoiler: Sharpest

His early criticisms against Josh were pointed and valid. Sharpest has some 62 posts. Practically the first 30 of those are him and josh going back and forth. But then after that he just pivots away from josh simply because slandaar asks him to. Wtf? And his 571 vote is just pure OMGUS. I can just see an old British woman saying "Oh Sharpest, have you no shame". There was practically no buildup to that vote on BACDE.


His posts look like careless scum or bad town, but it sounds like his posts always seem to look that way. Basically his scum game is just as good as his town game and both are indistinguishable.

We can afford to lose him but I'd much rather lynch Elyse or Wake.

Spoiler: Elyse

Way nitpicky and she seemed overly focused on my posts outside of everyone else's. She started resorting to correcting typos and criticizing me for simply having a different playstyle. Careful observations will reveal that she's not doing any actual scumhunting or generating content or information. I tried getting a better read on her by interacting with her but the confirmation bias was too much to take. I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt that this was just a personality conflict between she and I so I started lurking just to see how she would react.

The less I post the less she posts. The more I post the more she posts. She's the type of person who's hiding in the back of the class poo pooing ideas without coming up with any of her own. Furthermore she's scumread only the most inexperienced players: first chaoslord, then myself, then josh. Very opportunistic. I've seen enough with my little lurker experiment to be comfortable with her lynch. Her crap is not a clash of personality: she's scum.

Spoiler: TSO

His first 10 posts seem cluttered but that's not surprising since he was catching up and we are generating a ton of posts this game. His posts have a townie feel. Unfortunately I have trouble analysing that style of posts. He makes a lot of one sentence posts and that's hard for me to get a handle on. My gut says town.

Spoiler: EvilPacman

If our vig must shoot someone please shoot him. Lurk-a-derp isn't helping us and his reads list was incomplete. WTF is that? Can't even say "TSO is null" or "Sharpest is null". That feels like scum catchup post and not town catchup post.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Elyse

[reinoe]

There can be a backup cop without a cop. Millers/Godfathers without cops is a similar thing.

If there is no Cop in the game, the Deputy is essentially a Named Townie. Use of a Deputy with no Cop in the game is often considered to be bastard modding.

@MOD

Is this game a bastard game?

At this point if there is a cop/gunsmith they can investigate me n1 so voting me is beyond bad, Bacde.

Gunsmith

Notably,

--->Serial Killers<---

and Doctors do not have guns.

I'm increasingly thinking the possibility of Slandaar=SK needs to be discussed. He's recommending investigations that will fail. Wiki is my friend.

[reinoe]

Fuck it. Actions speak louder than words.

VOTE: slandaar

[reinoe]

Fuck it. Actions speak louder than words.

VOTE: slandaar

UGH. I was confused.

UNVOTE: slandaar

VOTE: Elyse

[reinoe]

Reinoe, a gunsmith returns neg on sks positive on vigs. It also has positives on scum barring a scum doctor.

Yeah I realize I was confused. Like how when someone goes to the doctor's office and you hear "negative results" for an illness and you think it's bad.

I'm willing to give Wake the benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately we've outed three power roles.


@Wake...
I don't believe your claim. It's a role that hasn't been worded that way in a long time. Do you expect me to just blindly believe all PR claims without at least investigating it? I investigated your claim to the best of my ability. I looked through old mini-normal games and noticed that the role is almost always called "Deputy".

And no, your concerns don't feel genuine, but maybe you are concerned about a post from nearly 20 pages ago. If you're busy it makes sense because you serially replace out of games.

[reinoe]

@Reinoe, Would you believe Wake's claim if he said Deputy instead? When drafting all my mock setups, I used Backup rather than deputy. Mod gaming the mod is dangerous. I don't care for this push on Wake. Can I be sure he's town? Hell no. This push stinks, especially with Pacman herpa lurk no content shit which the major pusher on Wake is townreading...

Spoiler:

If he said Deputy? Yes I'd find it more believable. It's like I said. It looks like he just looked through the wiki to conjour up a safe fake claim and presto! Instant power-role with almost no chance of counter claiming.

For example:
Slandaar's claim. This is a claim that's more verifiable than I initially thought after finally figuring what I was looking at in the wiki.

Josh' claim. A ballsy claim because he could out a doctor on a fake claim but the fact that he didn't get counter claimed given the frequency of doctor's suggest the claim is genuine.

Wake's claim: There is almost no chance that this claim would ever get cc'ed. And then he uses some weird wording to boot.

For context...
In Newbie 1485 one of the most experienced players gave FoS to a player who was generally not that scummy.

The case on that player being scum was weak and the case on another player was quite a bit stronger. We voted for the FoS player and he turned out to be scum. This is a similar situation. You believe Wake is not scum and I think the case on him being scum is kinda strong. But sometimes you have to take a leap of faith and trust townies. The people who think he's scum are going to have to make the case.

@BACDE, MIRHAWK, and TSO:

Spoiler: Elyse is scum

Way nitpicky and she seemed overly focused on my posts outside of everyone else's. She started resorting to correcting typos and criticizing me for simply having a different playstyle. Careful observations will reveal that she's not doing any actual scumhunting or generating content or information. I tried getting a better read on her by interacting with her but the confirmation bias was too much to take. I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt that this was just a personality conflict between she and I so I started lurking just to see how she would react.

The less I post the less she posts. The more I post the more she posts. She's the type of person who's hiding in the back of the class poo pooing ideas without coming up with any of her own. Furthermore she's scumread only the most inexperienced players: first chaoslord, then myself, then josh. Very opportunistic. I've seen enough with my little lurker experiment to be comfortable with her lynch. Her crap is not a clash of personality: she's scum.

Elyse is scum: y/n?

[reinoe]

@Reinoe, What do you think of Elyse, Chaos, and Pacman if Wake is town?

Pacman I think is scum.
Elyse I'm pretty sure is scum.
Chaos is town.

Assuming Wake is town, it means that I have two scum leads.

@josh
When I say "make the case" I just mean someone else is going to have to push for his lynch.

[reinoe]

Wake is that type of player though. I've played a fair amount with him, and he's mostly been town. I've scumread him for the same reasons you (Josh and Reinoe) are. Look at the other votes on Wake. They literally suck.

@Reinoe, then can we vote the scumreads we agree on and save Wake for later?

I think we agree on Pacman and Elyse.

[reinoe]

Vote: Elyse

Please tell me this isn't a real vote.

Oh noees, Princess Elyse, who hasn't done shit all game, is faced with the reality that you can't sit in the corner and criticize other people all goddamn damn.

You haven't done much to interest me aside from your claim.

Town try to understand players and get reads on them. Once again we have Elyse sitting on the sidelines trying not to draw attention. The only time she does anything to understand players is sort post 71. Then she spends nearly half her posts trying to challenge Titus on her town read on me. Which isn't actually scumhunting.

I think your frustration makes you lean town but I don't have much else to say.

And yet when I have to get drunk just to address your posts you label me as scum. OBVIOUS DOUBLE STANDARD IS OBVIOUS. LYNCH HER PLEASE.

[reinoe]

I meant to say "all goddman game" but "all goddamn damn" actually expresses my frustration more accurately anyway.

[reinoe]

Yeah Wake. It made me think you were a VT. The will you believe me now? Indicated that hey PR claimers Day 1 get away with murder, so I will claim to be one even though the claim is bad. No one ccs and we have a convo about scummy PR claimers

...

Not sarcasm. Frustration.

The tone's pretty commin to you but you foreclosed that.

That's news.

Wake are you VT?

[reinoe]

Wake are you VT?

No. Why do you ask?

I was starting to think you may be a VT who fake claimed to save himself.

Whats your take on the Elyse - Titus throwdown?

I've paid little attention to it. Elyse seems to be ignoring my presence, while my gut somewhat feels Titus is Scum. On the latter, I'll have to see more how she shifts to and fro in the wind.

So in this you suspect Titus eh. So why would "scumtitus" defend you from getting lynched when several people were saying your claim was fake? Also why do you think "scumtitus" would play against her win condition?

[reinoe]

Wake are you VT?

No. Why do you ask?

I was starting to think you may be a VT who fake claimed to save himself.

Alright. Why?

Whats your take on the Elyse - Titus throwdown?

I've paid little attention to it. Elyse seems to be ignoring my presence, while my gut somewhat feels Titus is Scum. On the latter, I'll have to see more how she shifts to and fro in the wind.

So in this you suspect Titus eh. So why would

"scumtitus"

defend you from getting lynched when several people were saying your claim was fake? Also why do you think

"scumtitus"

would play against her win condition?

My gut does, and somewhat. Why the bolded, please? Because my gut feeling is a gut feeling, I can't say exactly why Scum-Titus would do so. Scum-Titus is wily, so I can't practically explain her actions outside of the realm of a somewhat gut feeling.

Yeah Wake. It made me think you were a VT. The will you believe me now? Indicated that hey PR claimers Day 1 get away with murder, so I will claim to be one even though the claim is bad.

This made me think you were possibly VT, so I figured I'd ask you directly. As I explained, Backup Cop is an extremely safe and unverifiable fake claim.

[reinoe]

As I explained, Backup Cop is an extremely safe and unverifiable fake claim.

That fact is true.

Also, Deputy is a flavor name for a Backup Cop.

Out of curiosity, when you received your role PM was your role high-lighted in bright green? If so, which color code did you receive?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=15732
And I researched your claim. Most mods go with "Deputy". You do realize you did exactly what I was accusing you of earlier right? You just went to wikipedia and called it a day.

[reinoe]

Most mods go with "Deputy".

This one didn't.

You do realize you did exactly what I was accusing you of earlier right?

Walk us through this please.

You just went to wikipedia and called it a day.

Forgive me for checking.

I believe you since Titus believes you. This conversation is really not productive. Can you vote Elyse?

[reinoe]

@MOD

Is it against the spirit of the game to ask the color code of a role pm? If it's not then I would like to add that to my scumhunting strategies in the future.

I knew exactly where Wake was going with that question so if it's fair game I'm going to ask it a lot.

[reinoe]

Not to mention there's a sample PM in the OP for this exact reason

OMG LOL, I didn't even see that, I just went straight to my pm.

[reinoe]

Oh yes it did.

Vote Count 1.18

Slandaar (5): TheYankeeReaper, Titus, reinoe, Bacde, Josh_B
Josh_B (4): evilpacman18, Mirhawk, Elyse
Bacde (1): Wake88
Titus (1): Slandaar

Not Voting: T S O, chaoslord54, Sharpest-knife-on-tree

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Deadline in (expired on 2014-06-25 16:00:00)

Josh, no it didn't. The post you're quoting is a me quoting an old vc because the most up to date one.

Titus is right

@mod:

There are three people on Josh_B but he's being listed as having four votes. Is the VC accurate?

Got it, thanks ~phok

Oh yes it did.

No, that's me quoting an old vc. I even remember that one because the most up to date vc was still pending at the time. Titus is right , that was just a rush post. Josh, more accuracy before an accusation please

Posting from my phone.

[reinoe]

Although, Elyse is in my list of suspects, she isn't one of my top three preferred lynches. Actually, she's number four, unless I take wake off, and then I can talk myself into it. I like all of the people on the wagon so far- (most of the people on the wagon anyways).

VOTE: Elyse

p-edit. hmm VT? No, I'm going keep my vote.

If you're town please stop shit posting and looking scummy for fucks sake. I'd hate for it to get to the point where I actually want to lynch an uncountered doctor.

[reinoe]

So who are the three other people who are scummier than Elyse and it looks like you have suspicion on possibly someone on the wagon. Who are they.

[reinoe]

I had that post written for a long time. I don't know why I was holding back. If all claims are true, there's really nothing else for anyone to claim except VT. Wake's claim looks the most suspicious to me, but for one second, if I believe it's true. based on gameplay, elyse is still suspect.

1) Is English not your primary langauge?

2) Are you dyslexic or something else?

3) Are you on medications?


Help me understand how your posts can be so bad?

[reinoe]

I mean I knew you wouldn't be unvoting in your next post -_-

Are you trying to build a case on someone not unvoting a scumread because you asked?

Evilpacman you should vote Elyse.

[reinoe]

I mean I knew you wouldn't be unvoting in your next post -_-

Are you trying to build a case on someone not unvoting a scumread because you asked?

Evilpacman you should vote Elyse.

Yes.

No.

Evilpacman you know how I knew you were scum? Because I already knew that you weren't gonna unvote by the time I was done asking you to do so. I think if you were town you would have voted to lynch scum.

Unassailable logic is unassailable.

[reinoe]

I mean I knew you wouldn't be unvoting in your next post -_-

Are you trying to build a case on someone not unvoting a scumread because you asked?

Evilpacman you should vote Elyse.

Yes.

No.

Evilpacman you know how I knew you were scum? Because I already knew that you weren't gonna unvote by the time I was done asking you to do so. I think if you were town you would have voted to lynch scum.

Unassailable logic is unassailable.

Oh, I kinda fucked that up, but the point is made.

[reinoe]

We can't have a cop themed game without me... reading now

Titus, I'm pretty sure we all knew when you came in like a wrecking ball.


Please just claim so we can move on to the serious business of lynching Elyse.

[reinoe]

Or maybe it was just me who knew because we are so in sync.

[reinoe]

If we don't massclaim by tomorrow I will not unvote you Titus

1 night

That's what you get

OK, but I hope you consider that she popcorned to a lurker slot.

[reinoe]

@MOD

Yankee hasn't posted in 2 days 17 hrs. Time to prod/replace.

[reinoe]

I'm not sure what the benefits of a massclaim are tbh.

Let's say hypothetically that all claims are true. That means that outing the cop just gets us a dead PR when the game has been designed with a cop in mind. We could be facing a single juiced up scum team or perhaps two scum teams. And we lose a cop.

If one of the claims is fake then that just depends on which claim is fake. The fact that this massclaim is supported by Elyse and EPM (and Bacde but he's not scum) makes me think this could be a ploy to get our PR's dead. Seriously, how many more PR claims are there really going to be: JUST ONE. POSSIBLY THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE.

[reinoe]

Step 2: I ask you to be reasonable because this lynch is too easy and in a town that can't agree on shit, that almost certainly means scum are pushing it along

How is the Elyse lynch "easy"? It's coming after THREE PR CLAIMS. You seem to have come out of the woodworkd after lurk-a-derping all game just to offer some chainsaw defense.


@BACDE&WAKE
Please tell me you guys are seeing this. Elyse is scum.

[reinoe]

reinoe's UNOFFICIAL Vote Count

Elyse (5): reinoe, Titus, Mirhawk, Sharpest-knife-on-tree, Josh_B
Wake88 (1): chaoslord54,
Titus (3): Slandaar, Elyse, evilpacman18
Slandaar (1): TheYankeeReaper
TheYankeeReaper (1): T S O

Not Voting: Wake88, Bacde

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Deadline in (expired on 2014-06-25 16:00:00)

OMG U GUISE DAT COUNTERWAGON ON TITUS HAS THREE PEOPLE WHO ARE CONSISTENTLY BEING SCUMREAD AT VARIOUS POINTS IN THE GAME, LIKE OMG U GUISE. AND TITUS TOTALLY SOFT-CLAIMED COP TOO

[reinoe]

For those of you who don't speak "valley girl": Titus counterwagon is fucking shit.

[reinoe]

Well I just went along with the mass claim idea. Do you know why?

You want our power roles outed and killed?

[reinoe]

Well I just went along with the mass claim idea. Do you know why?

You want our power roles outed and killed?

They did a good job of doing that themselves

Well we still have an unconfirmed cop out there, but a mass-claim can solve that pesky problem.

[reinoe]

take one for the team

The scum team? I don't think our cop should take one for them.

[reinoe]

I am so much happier now I have claimed I can actually play my game.

Titus read EPM's post.

Slandaar, how has your game changed from pre-claim to post-claim?

[reinoe]

hmmmm TYR with an outstanding post...

RVS a serious thing, seriously...

vote JoshB-

add on TYR's outstanding post and this is no brainer.

For now I'm retracting my random lynch vote

Unvote:Sharpest-knife-on-tree

TYR I think you bring up some great points, before I cast my vote though I want to hear Josh_B's defense.

TSO, walk me through it. What pinged you here?

Here's Titus looking for a pattern that TSO mentioned.

JB's lurking is paying off, as it appears that now half the town has forgotten about him. In post 40 you claim your vote was on other "patterns" and not his RVS vote. Why did you say that seeing as how you've decided that the reason now is completely his RVS vote?

Bacde is fine, I'm more worried about reinoe and Elise. I get scum vibes off both of them.

Mirhawk, I haven't. Scum are copying a strategy I used in another game.

A) Two scum attack each other early with weak reasons then town read each other Day 1. (Venmar + Titus) compare to (Bacde + Slandaar).

B) Lynch an easy target, preferably one that makes himself easy. (TheSilverBard) & (JoshB/EvilPacman)

C) After that, create chaos and buddy with leader status.


Textbook mini 1539.

Here is Titus noticing a pattern.

Except bacde and Slandaar aren't attacking each other, you're the only one who's voted for pacman so far, and the only real buddying I've seen is between you and reinoe. I don't think these games are as close a comparison as you think.

Did bacde say those things about pacman? Cause I don't remember that.

Titus, whats your position on JB? Half the discussions in town revolve around him but I don't think you've touched him.

Bacde threw a oneliner that Pacman maybe scum cuz lurk. Elyse thinks that's sound, not just valid. It's not even valid.

Bacde opened with an attack on Slandaar. They are moving towards the townread each other stage.

JB is town mislynchbait.

Here is Titus following through on a pattern she mentioned earlier.

I'll keep it in mind, but it wasn't his RVS that gave him away. There are some other patterns there too that are interesting.

So basically, you pressured me for a link for no reason?

No. I pressured you for the existence of the link, not necessarily the content of the link. But the content of the link suggests that you are still a little sour about that game, and possibly trying to use it to invent scuminess when there isn't much to go on. Until, I feel like there's more likelyhood that what you say is true, or I feel like there isn't anything else to go on, I'll be looking else where and consider you on the block if he flips town.

UNVOTE: UNVOTE

I find it curious that you've taken Bacde's D1 vote on Slandarr so seriously.

It was apparent to me that he was fishing for reactions and the initial argument on Slandarr wouldn't make it past 2-3 pages. Your last sentence also bothers me "...and consider you on the block if he flips town." It seems to me you're giving yourself convenient options for a vote down the line if a Slandarr lynch were to occur.

RVS is a serious thing, I admire the skill of other players who use it as a scum hunting tool. My initial PoE is that Bacde was using it to OMGUS and then asking that I totally trust him. The only thing I feel like I can be sure of right now is that Bacde is not on the scum team with Slandar.
The meta that Bacde provided seems legit if it wasn't so old and out of date, but I'm going to be looking for partners so I moved my vote off for now.

]

How would i be sour about that game? It was over a year ago and town won

Then why would you bring it up?

VOTE: bacde

Obvtown posting.

His whole ISO is like that. So fuck off.

Formatting errors are in the post, but it's another post recognizing a pattern.

Nothing has been scummy about Josh B. Sure he's inarticulate and reached one wrong conclusion.

Here is Titus recognizing a pattern with Josh's posts being inarticulate. I mean, yeah it's an obvious pattern, but I'm just bringing it up because many of the people who were voting for josh were voting him because his posts were shit but not explaining why they were shit.

[reinoe]

I suggest no-one post anything except prod-dodges until Reinoe does so I can gauge his reaction.

What if I responded with one of these...

Are you scum or are you going to be sheeping me?

No I certainly won't be sheeping you. Especially seeing as how you want to lynch a townread of mine.

[reinoe]

What?

Just ignore Reinoe's post I will vig him.

Titus you are up.

So you demand I find patterns in thought, I find them, and you vow you're going to vig me?


I'm fine with a compromise lynch on Slandaar now.

1) I doubted his claim from the beginning.

2) It's possible he's serial killer

3) Even if he's the Vigilante he's admitted he's not going to be reliable.


VOTE: slandaar

[reinoe]

@slandaar, I'm not reinventing the wheel when reinoe already did answer your question about where I pursued patterns. It was poor form to garcia me though.

So, let me just confirm, you agree with Reinoe's post?

Why don't you refute my post instead of telling everyone to ignore it.

[reinoe]

I suggest no-one post anything except prod-dodges until Reinoe does so I can gauge his reaction.

What if I responded with one of these...

.

Answer this question Slandaar.

[reinoe]

If Slandaar's what he says he is, let's control hinm like a Serial Killer.

I've never played with a vig: is it normal to have an outed vig just announced they're going to shoot people whom most people don't want shot? I'm still playing mafia 101 in this regard, but shouldn't vigs just shoot lurkers?

Is slandaar just trying to get a reaction out of me, then yes he got one. It increase my suspicion that he's serial killer and not vig.

[reinoe]

OK, fine. I'm overreacting. I figured it didn't make sense to shoot someone who's contributing just because they disagree with you when there's a two lurking spots just sitting there, one of which is being scumread.

UNVOTE: slandaar
VOTE: Elyse

[reinoe]

Oh my god

Yet another example of Elyse refusing to accept there are playstyles than her own.

[reinoe]

I have to say I'm enjoying slandaar's reactions a lot in a "lolwut" kinda way.

[reinoe]

I'm surprised you can access your computer from so far up Titus' asshole, reinoe.

When I'm crawling up one of my top townread's ass I always make sure I bring my i-phone 5 with 4g coverage.

[reinoe]

So, who wants to give me the low down on the scummy-like people and short explanations? I'm going to skim the past few pages when I have time, of course.

Elyse-No scumhunting. AtE when she become the next viable lynch after a number of PR reveals. Since she's claimed vanilla townie she should at least be scumhunting like crazy but has since resorted to her regular behavior. Functionally Anti-Town.

Pacman-lurker. Terrible reads list that wasn't even complete. Was posting in other areas while he was lurking here. Came out of the woodwork and increased his activity and offering chainsaw defense when Elyse started getting run up.

[reinoe]

Titus stop having a meltdown. Elyse is scum but she never pushed for Wake's lynch.

And I can definitely understand Titus frustration since she did rally to prevent Wake's lynch and this would definitely feel like a betrayal. The misrep is unfortunate and Titus should explain it but I still see where she's coming from.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Elsye

[reinoe]

@MOD
Why was the vt reset?

Can't reveal that, sorry.

Was it mod error?

[reinoe]

I think I found what's happened under the mafiascum wiki "voting roles"

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Gladiator

All votes are reset. Only two players are now votable, the Gladiator and his target. It is almost always one-shot.

@Mod

If the gladiator ability has been used, shouldn't we be told whom the two players are?

[reinoe]

Step 2: I ask you to be reasonable because this lynch is too easy and in a town that can't agree on shit, that almost certainly means scum are pushing it along

How is the Elyse lynch "easy"? It's coming after THREE PR CLAIMS. You seem to have come out of the woodworkd after lurk-a-derping all game just to offer some chainsaw defense.


@BACDE&WAKE
Please tell me you guys are seeing this. Elyse is scum.

That's not true, I was gone for the first 25 pages or so and have been here consistently since. My Elyse defense is like 3 pages new.

And the Elyse lynch was easy in first of all the speed it grew, the inherent complacency in many of the votes on it, and the lack of any substantial arguments against lynchin Elyse besides her own until I defended her.

C'mon people, heaven and earth doesn't bend over backwards to protect a fucking VANILLA TOWNIE. This shit is unreal.

[reinoe]

I want to hear evilpacman tell us more about how Elyse is an easy lynch. I would also like for him to provide us with a link so that I know what a "difficult lynch" looks like.

[reinoe]

Slandaar are you dayvig?

[reinoe]

Or you could vote Elyse. The count mysteriously reset when she hit L-1. Somebody tried to shoot somebody else using the dayvig. Somebody hasn't claimed being the 1-shot bulletproof (possibly because maybe they're totally bulletproof). But a BP claim would show whom was shot and then we can ask "who would want them dead".

[reinoe]

Lol @"too scummy to keep alive".

VOTE: slandaar

[reinoe]

wait

what

Dayvig resets the votecount. Whomever is the dayvig didn't feel fit to use the ability earlier on our two lurkers. They only saw fit to use the ability once Elyse hit L-1. However they wound up shooting someone who's bulletproof. If the bulletproof person claims we can ask "who would want that person dead".

I'm crazy suspicious of slandaar and Elyse right now.

@WAKE

What is your opinion on Titus diffusing the wagon that was developing on you?
VOTE: Elyse

[reinoe]

That conversation was awkward.

Chaoslord's posting style is always awkward.

[reinoe]

Well, I'll VOTE: Elyse to get a claim. Should a claim be had I'll retract my vote.

VT

Alright.

UNVOTE: elyse

C'mon Elyse stop being coy. I know when I say "L-1" I mean someone is seriously about to be lynched not "Kitten slapping L-1 with no real danger".

[reinoe]

Smh

What is "smh". I've seen that around and can't figure it out.

[reinoe]

So i've been getting insulted and didn't know it. I was wondering why people were asking me to "Shatter My Hopes" but that didn't make sense.

[reinoe]

Slandaar, it's already been revealed that Elyse is town.

[reinoe]

I have to admit her "fuck you guys I'm leaving" attitude is not that type of attitude a townie should have, especially not a plain old vanilla townie.

But I called her "Princess Elyse" because I think that self-entitled attitude might just be who she is.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Boon

The conclusion I came to last night was: Titus had to die.

Who did you protect Josh?

Of course you had to kill someone who softclaimed cop.

VOTE: slandaar

[reinoe]

I shot my top scumread... who did you expect me to shoot? (give a list) My list was pretty clear.

Nobody since the town was split on her, and she was a high target for cop investigation, much like yourself...

Let me help direct your gut: Wake, vote slandaar. Your gut said Titus was scum even though she rallied to prevent your lynch.

[reinoe]

My claim is verified and

the setup needs my role to be remotely balanced.

I'm a serial killer, that's how I know how this game is balanced.

ftfy

[reinoe]

@MOD the thread still says it's night.

Wake, please give us the results of Sharpest's investigations so far.

[reinoe]

VT, popcorn to whomever posts next.

[reinoe]

I've not been given his results.

What does the Wiki say about this?

It says that your "Backup Cop" is probably a fakeclaim...

Variations

An older variant is that the Deputy can choose to 'retrieve' the results of a dead Cop's investigations instead of becoming a full Cop.

"Backup Cop" is a rolename that is hardly ever used. It's almost always called "Deputy" and only the oldest games games called it "Backup Cop". If the mod is going to use old flavor I think it's strange that he would pick & choose which old flavors. This is leaning into the territory of "outguessing the mod" but my gut was right about Slandaar being SK...

VOTE: Wake88

[reinoe]

Alright, so Reinoe's Scum.

Guys, let's think this over carefully. If I were Scum, I wouldn't have outed myself in the first place. As it is right now Scum would benefit tremendously with the death of the Backup Town Cop.

I am not the older variant. I have not been given his results. Let me live until tomorrow, while the doctor protect me, so I can get an investigation through.

If you're going to say I'm making up shit that's fine and prove it. I'm going off of the traditions of the game and mafiascum wiki. All of these things are making you look bad and I'm not making shit up. Anyone can go look and see for themselves.

[reinoe]

Exactly what is making me look bad, reinoe? I'm certainly not lying, and I can see quite clearly that you're Scum trying to sacrifice himself to kill the last Town Cop. Gutsy, I'll give you that.

Town, I'll make a deal with you.

We lynch Reinoe tonight.

If he flips Town, you lynch me tomorrow. Assuming I live the Night I'll investigate someone, and make sure the result is stated at the very beginning of the next Day.

Does that sound like a good deal?

That's a scummy negotiation and brings us to MYLO.

What's your case on me? You want me lynched for doubting your claim? Kinda reminds me of slandaar...

I'm all for talking things out, but your responses right now are terrible. Didn't your gut say that Titus was scum? The same Titus that was rallying to try and prevent your lynch previously? The same Titus that you voted to get lynched?

[reinoe]

Where is everyone? Come in and post, please.

Reinoe still hasn't responded back as to why I'm such a Scumread to him, which I find Scummy as hell. His entire basis for trying to lynch me is "Oh, well, Backup Town Cop is rare so, let's you know, lynch him." No, that's bad play. When you have someone who claims Backup Town Cop way on, what, Day 1, you don't fuck around with that, especially after the Town Cop dies. To lynch me just because you think it's impractical for a Backup Town Cop to exist is extremely poor play. He has absolutely no good reason to try and lynch me. But he sure does if he's Scum.

Go on, Reinoe, walk us through this. Tell everyone exactly why I deserve to be lynched today.

And SNS, if you're Town, what are you doing? You call reinoe a VI and say you don't want to lynch a Backup Town Cop, you make up a bogus excuse of "Oh, I don't like his response, so I'll toss my vote on him and look innocent." I'm trying to ward off Town making a stupid mistake by lynching a Backup Town Cop. Think about it. Don't you question reinoe's reasoning at all?

post 1423 was a cursory case and for you to say I didn't say anything at all is b.s. But if you're looking for an in-depth case that's going to take time: time you are apparently not willing to give me before trying to say there's no case.

You've also failed to outline why I'm scum so you're not living up to the standards you've laid down. I'm assuming there's 2-3 mafiascum whom are they and why?

[reinoe]

EBWOP: AND also you're misrepping the cursory case I made in 1423. Panicky tone, scummy looking deals, a backup cop claim that doesn't look real according to all available information...FULL CASE IS INCOMING IN 24-48 HOURS.

[reinoe]

Wake case.

Manipulations???

Spoiler: Manipulations???

So this is where Wake starts making his first contributions to the game. When he starts wondering about Chaoslord's "unintentional manipulation". Now I had already noticed that chaos is newbtown so I found this whole conversation boring and bizarre and I didn't want to step in it at all. What's really interesting is that Wake then votes for Bacde in post 261. Now you can call it whiteknighting or chainsaw defense or whatever but Bacde also recognized that chaos is newbtown and Wake's push could totally be scum motivated to keep someone off-balance hoping that they slip up. This could be a particularly effective tactic if someone is newbtown. Now we know that Bacde is conftown so his defense was completely town motivated.

263 raises red flags though. Defending someone and trying to get them to move on to important things that really matter is a very town motivated thing to do. And then Wake just keeps on truckin' on this issue of "unintentionally manipulating". The entire conversation is boring and I'm slogging through it all the same. 277 actually sounds town though. But still he really does need to move the fuck on sweet jesus and he doesn't. He just keeps on trying to pck at this "unintentionally manipulation" for six more posts.

Spoiler: Obvious case is obvious

His case on evilpacman is obvious and easy. Like none of the points he makes are wrong, but there was already some suspicion on epm, so he's an easy target. And of everyone Wake made a case on why is EPM the only person he made a case on? I was looking forwards to more of these types of posts but they never came...Since it was the only case he made of this type, I have to conclude that he was just going after low hanging fruit. To re-iterate, it's not a bad case, but the fact that that's the only one he did a case on is suspect. He did a case on a perpetual lurker who probably wouldn't be around to defend himself makes the one case he did like this look opportunistic

Spoiler: redundant

post 710 ugh. He's still considering trying to pursue "unintentional manipulation".

Spoiler: In general

It's like for every post that could look townie there's like 2 posts that are actually fluff or questions that look like trying hard to look active.

Then there's post 899 "I don't scumhunt well on day one", which could be copout(no pun intended)

I do like these "annihilator beam" posts.
But then he ruins his townie momentum in the post sequence of 936/937/938

I don't particularly like 1281/1376/1379 sequence. 1281 is him trying to line up lynches. Tons of suspicion on slandaar, doesn't trust the slandaar vig claim, but he doesn't place a vote. It looks like he wants to sit on the sidelines so that if slandaar does turn out to be vig, he can say "oh I told you so".

tl/dr...lots of awkwardness ESPECIALLY when it comes to his "Backup Cop" claim. Wavering on lynching slandaar when there was no good reason to, Wasting time on some non-issues.


Despite the case I've presented on Wake I've come to the realization that it's NOT in our best interest to lynch him today. If he's the Backup Cop we're going to look really stupid in lynching a pr, when this game is stated to have a lot of pr. There's 2-3 scum and they're probably have abilities to balance everything. So I'd like to look elsewhere for a lynch. He could be scum but there's 1-2 other scum out there and we should try to find them first.

UNVOTE: Wake

[reinoe]

Yeah, you don't want to look even more foolish.

Back off and let my investigate someone tonight.

Doc, if you're out there protect my ass.

Yes, lynching you if you're telling the truth would be really foolish...So whomelse do you think could be scum? There's usually a convergence on one or two players that the town actually agrees with. Instead of trying to kick me for admitting to what could be a tactical error can you give us your scumspects and why?

[reinoe]

Could our day it, if you're a one-shot, please claim and explain whom you shot and why?

[reinoe]

Day-vig sorry posting from my phone.

[reinoe]

he reset. I didn't even know what a day vig was before. Titus brought it up, and I had to look it up. Him being bulletproof was the only reason that he would have claimed Vigilante.

Well this is BS then because I had you as town by role. That means there are three different Killers in this game. Scum, Slandaar, and a Dayvig. You not being the dayvig means that your questions are role fishing. The dayvig is the only possible power role left to claim. And you want him to out himself?

VOTE: Boonskies

I didn't ask the day vig to claim...Reinoe did...

My vote stays.

Hey, posting from my phone. I said dayvig should claim only if they're one shot.

[reinoe]

It doesn't explain who shot who and who was bullet proof, though. You are saying that Titus being scum dayvig shot someone to keep him from being lynched? What if he was a town dayvig? Titus would only make sense to shoot Slandaar or Elyse, which means either one of them could be scum as well. Keep in mind, Slandaar had claimed to be vig, so Titus shooting means that Slandaar's claim was obviously false. And it is detrimental to claim Vigilante as a regular pro-town member, because you will definitely get shot in the night by scum. Slandaar falsely claimed to protect himself from the townsmembers, and he knew he'd have no worry getting shot in the night, because he's scum. A bulletproof scum, might I add. He's too scummy not to lynch.

I believe that we lynch him this round, and tomorrow we lynch either Titus or Elyse, depending on what Slandaar turns out to be.

Okay I think you have a good point. Boonskies and I can compromise with that.

Vote Slandaar

Chaoslord is now my biggest scum read. Why would you compromise with that? It was a very scummy thing of me to say, so as scum, you easily wanted to hop on that knowing that neither of those three were scum. Slandaar flipped SK, so that didn't help with the Elyse/Titus at all. I forgot I used this to try and fish people out, and I think I successfully did.

Hey phone posting again! A lot of people alive and dead called slandaar a serial killer. Chaos could be scum but I don't see it based on this.

[reinoe]

Also even though both wake and josh look suspect, can we not lynch a pr today? Also I would like to at least hear more from Mirhawk and Sns. Sorry, just want to be cautious and also I'm a little paranoid.

[reinoe]

Hey guys, sns is posting in other areas of the forum but not here, helping us sort this shit out.

VOTE: sns

[reinoe]

UNVOTE: TSO

Why exactly SNS?

Lurking isn't a good enough reason to lynch someone. I've lurked and won as Town many times.

It's not just lurking. He's active in "other areas" of the forum. The type of "other areas" that I'm not allowed to get specific about, if you know what I mean.

[reinoe]

So only Scum do that?

Let's Have An Honest And Open Discussion About Lurking

-Scum choosing to lurk. Scum choosing to lurk do it for strategic reasons--it's normally not a desire not to contribute, at least, not in that sense, as people seem to think. True scum lurking is basically reading what's going on (generally done offline), seeing how things develop, and then, having seen them develop, posting in a manner to divide rifts between towns. This type of lurking, as it is clearly meant to achieve a goal, is often able to be read.

That's from Mastin, of Mastin MD fame.

Let's look at the evilpacman/sns slot.

Evilpacman was posting in other areas of the forum and not posting in the game. This is a verifiable fact. He was lurk-a-derping almost all of day one until Elyse started getting run up. Then he pops up out of the woodwork and starts chainsaw defending her and trying to push for Titus. Now this might have seemed townie at the time because he was defending whom he thought was a townread. But if evilpacman was scum it wouldn't matter to him? He could have just jumped on whichever wagon had less momentum and started pushing for another person. This defines his entire D1 play. He lurked, then he pushed for a wagon (if he knew both were town it didn't matter).

Remember that reads list he created? He couldn't even be bothered to send in a completed one. Ridiculous.

Now let's look at sns' play. He lurks and says he's "getting caught up with the game", despite the fact that the night phase was delayed 24hrs specifically so that replacements could get caught up. He makes 2 posts on day 2. He has three posts on day 3.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p5955353

edit: also (as llama already touched on), scum tend to lurk through critical points.

Will catch up tonight. Dont think much has been posted though.

So this was on Monday you guys. It's Tuesday night. I think this can qualify as a "critical point".

[reinoe]

The reason I don't trust you is that Mastin says this:

"True scum lurking is basically reading what's going on (generally done offline), seeing how things develop, and then, having seen them develop, posting in a manner to divide rifts between towns."

Which isn't what SNS is doing, from what I can see.

Besides, it's overrated to quote so-called Mafia professionals as canon. Means nothing to me.

But it's most DEFINITELY what evilpacman was doing. Oh, to be sure you don't have to believe everything everyone says. On this instance however I'm trying to judge everything by the slot. sns is doing what evilpacman was doing but less extreme.

[reinoe]

So you're voting SNS for the actions of his predecessor. That's not suspicious.

Perhaps a debate over judging a slot this way is in order elsewhere.

Your reasoning for voting SNS is weak at best, dubious at worst.

I'm beginning to suspect you're Scum.

What do you mean elsewhere? Why can't we debate it here in this game? And yes I have to take into account the actions of his predecessor, which I was also scumreading. Now sns, I'm scumreading sns.

You say my reasons are weak ok. Explain how and go into the town motivation of sns posting in other areas of the forum while avoiding this thread.

You know Wake, you suspect everyone who's ever tried to defend. I'm not saying you owe me anything of course, but that's kinda bizarre that you've now twice implied that scum are willing to play against their win condition.

Also didn't you place a naked vote on TSO?

[reinoe]

ebwop: ever tried to defend you"

[reinoe]

So you're voting SNS for the actions of his predecessor. That's not suspicious.

Perhaps a debate over judging a slot this way is in order elsewhere.

Your reasoning for voting SNS is weak at best, dubious at worst.

I'm beginning to suspect you're Scum.

What do you mean elsewhere? Why can't we debate it here in this game? And yes I have to take into account the actions of his predecessor, which I was also scumreading. Now sns, I'm scumreading sns.

You say my reasons are weak ok. Explain how and go into the town motivation of sns posting in other areas of the forum while avoiding this thread.

You know Wake, you suspect everyone who's ever tried to defend. I'm not saying you owe me anything of course, but that's kinda bizarre that you've now twice implied that scum are willing to play against their win condition.

Also didn't you place a naked vote on TSO?

It would be a distraction. We don't want that, correct?

Say his slot is suspicious. Not SNS himself. Same slot, different people.

You fail to note that your definition of lurking is different than Mastin's.

Your positions are weak and Scummy, because they don't make sense to me.

I never said SNS had Town motivation. My contention is you saying he's Scum for lurking, especially when your definition is far different than the definition you quoted from Mastin.

Funny that you bring in my Scumhunting certain players who "defended" me. Not to mention you're wrong. Do you think "defense" of me should be rewarded in a dastardly game of lies and deceit?

I certainly did. It's called gathering reactions. Also known as Scumhunting. You should try it sometime.

You have no reservations about a distracting gameplay debate here.
You judge SNS based on EPM's actions, when you need to refer to the slot instead.
Your definition doesn't mesh with Maston's definition you quoted.
You assume I said SNS had Town motivation for "lurking."
You make an off-topic jab saying I suspect everyone who's ever defended me.

1)I said I was scumreading evilpacman. I said I'm scumreading sns. Sns is doing what evilpacman did in a less extreme fashion.

2)I never defined lurking but I'll do it now for your convenience :lurking just not posting. Which holy crap that's what sns is doing and it is infact null all on it's own! However, if you followed the thread I linked to you'd realize that there were discussions on how to tell scum lurking from town lurking, or are you suggesting that I'm arbitrarily scumreading a lurker for no reason?

3)My positions are weak and scummy because they don't make sense to you? Well part of that is because it looks like you're trying to read things into it that aren't there.

4)Really I'm wrong? Ok well I recall Titus calling you town and then you immediately got suspicious of her and started voting to get her lynched. Also Titus was town. If you don't believe me say so and I'll provide links. No I don't think defending you should be rewarded but I would at least like it if you would say "hmm what is the town motivation for this person trying to prevent my lynch? What is the scum motivation for this person trying to prevent my lynch? Like really I would expect you to do that much.


And I'm certainly learning a lot by your reactions, but I can barely believe that they're actually happening.

[reinoe]

BEFORE I FUCKIN BLOW MY LID....

Okay, Im somewhat good. Why the FUCK are people voting me when Chaos and Mirhawk HAVENT EVEN POSTED. Not once all of Day 3. I had to catch up on 50 fricken pages. Jeez. Where are they now? "Well obviously not lurking". Reinoe is being a VI a bit with his vote on me. He should know better which makes me think hes scum but probably just not thinking. We just finshed LoTR Mafia and I posted like once per day until the end. I was town and managed to help secure a town win. Reinoe on the other hand had a town PR and hammered himself Day 1. The fact that he has made it this far is alarming. What has changed in just a couple weeks. Anyways. Rant over. Will actually contribute later.

I don't handle getting flashwagoned well. Nothing's changed otherwise.

sns is attacking people for "not posting" even though they're on V/LA.

[reinoe]

Speaking of V/LA I'll be on one 'till Monday.

[reinoe]

phone post
tl/dr mirhawk I though your post was a reality test to see how people respond because I scumread slandaar for most of day 2.

[reinoe]

*reaction test* and *most of day 1*

[reinoe]

VOTE: wake88
reasons later but I think most of you knew I've been suspicious for a while

[reinoe]

The reasons come down to balancing. A multishot dayvig won't be scum in a game this size, especially if there's a serial killer as well.

The serial killer (not to mention the dayvig) makes for a quicker trip to lylo, so I figure there must be a smaller scumteam. Two scum is weak though so they probably have a PR of their own, I'm thinking Roleblocker as it would also substantiate the reason JB couldn't protect SKOT. Not to mention that a doctor makes sense with two anti-town killing roles and meshes nicely with a town Dayvig.

That gives town a Cop, Doctor, and Multishot Dayvig. Which is actually fairly powerful.

Backup cop is a weakish role in that it requires the cop to die before use. When the dayvig was oneshot I was willing to buy into it, but not with a multishot.

That's something I can accept. It also explains the Change in opinion on Wake.

I was starting to suspect only a two team mafia because the Serial Killer had full bulletproof and not one shot bulletproof.

sorry still phone posting.

[reinoe]

Chaos, you seem to be online now, what are your thoughts on Wake?

[reinoe]

Josh what are your thoughts on Wake?

[reinoe]

I'm always suspicious when someone says "oh sorry I'm catching up" and then it takes them forever to catchup up. There been hardly any activity since chaos went on V/LA.

[reinoe]

I'm always suspicious when someone says "oh sorry I'm catching up" and then it takes them forever to catchup up. There been hardly any activity since chaos went on V/LA.

Reinoe are you talking about me in this post?

Yes, why aren't you voting for wake right now?

[reinoe]

I'm always suspicious when someone says "oh sorry I'm catching up" and then it takes them forever to catchup up. There been hardly any activity since chaos went on V/LA.

This post alone screams scummy. You and Wake's arguments take time to read over and evaluate. PLus, you know it was a holiday weekend. Just because someone doesn't make a decision exactly when you want it is a pretty lame reason to try and call suspicions on someone

You should Change your vote to Wake. Why do you think I want wake lynched with your vote?

[reinoe]

YEP, LET'S THROW CAUTION TO THE GODDAMN WIND.

WAKE IS AT L-1, IF YOU VOTE WAKE THEN THE SCUM TEAM WINS. WHY DO YOU THINK I WANT YOU TO VOTE WAKE????

[reinoe]

lol game. although I can't see how you won it playing like that -_-

God I'm stupid.

speaking of which

fun fact: I had to replace out because chaoslord over here was POSTING IN HIS SCUM QT IN FRONT OF ME AT WORK and so I knew he was scum

omg lol!

[reinoe]

I was just happy that mirhawk provided the vote we needed because he only logs in once a day or sometimes once every other day. So we had plenty of time to make the "quicklynch" happen.


:edit: that's hilarious evil...
when I saw that you replaced out and then signed up for a new mini-normal I pushed to have you modkilled.

[reinoe]

Game's not technically over 'till the mod says so.

[reinoe]

Not to mention there's a sample PM in the OP for this exact reason

OMG LOL, I didn't even see that, I just went straight to my pm.

HEHEHE

[reinoe]

Sorry 'bout that Wake. There Wake...

Also Reinoe is yet again trying to run up wake over that backup cop / deputy business. Despite the fact that it's wrong. Backup is a modifier on any role, and it's not outdated. Deputy is either a flavor name for backup cop, or another role altogether. You keep claiming to get this stuff from the Wiki, but honestly none of that shit you keep saying is in there.

I suggest you read post 1442 again.
When you're done with that follow this link that I've already provided but you clearly didn't read the first time.


Game 1400: Bubble Tape Mafia
Moderator: Dunhamganger
Current Update: Town Win

Players
1. zipperflesh, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 3
2. Klick replaces Cybertronix, Mafia Godfather, lynched Day 5
3. mastin2 replaces Leonshade, Town

Deputy

, killed Night 2
4. Thor665, Town Vanilla, killed Night 5
5. kushm4sta, Town Vanilla, lynched Day 2
6. killerjester replaces MaverickMaestro, Town Vanilla, survives
7. qwints replaces Devourer359, Town Vanilla, lynched Day 4
8. Jake from State Farm, Town One-Shot Commuter, survives
9. Kthxbye replaces SafetyDance, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 6
10. d3x, Town Vanilla, killed Night 4
11. Dave168, Town Cop, lynched Day 1
12. Rondar replaces DoubleJD, Town Vanilla, killed Night 1
13. AngryPidgeon, Town Vanilla, killed Night 3

Game 1338: Cyborgian Reenactment Mafia
Moderator: Timeater
Current Update: Town Win

Players
1. BBmolla replaces Mallard, Town Vanilla, killed Night 1
2. Oversoul, Town Vanilla, survives
3. HezLucky, Town Vanilla, survives
4. AGar, Mafia Traitor, killed Night 5
5. Elmo TeH AzN replaces kondi2424, Town Compulsive Neighborizer, killed Night 3
6. Kdub replaces Moneybags, Town Vanilla, survives
7. Peabody, Mafia Jack-of-all-Trades, lynched Day 4
8. Ant replaces knox who replaced Tajun, Town Vanilla, lynched Day 2
9. Oman, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 5
10. mykonian replaces Common Man,

Town Deputy,

killed Night 2
11. Nisani201, Town Cop, killed Night 4
12. Arugula replaces thesteelego, Town Vanilla, lynched Day 1

Game 1159: Powerrox93's Mini Normal I
Moderator: Powerrox93
Current Update: Town Win

Players
1. Jase, Town Vanilla, survives
2. Uncle Pain,

Town Deputy,

survives
3. tarsonisocelot, Town Vanilla, survives
4. C-Worl replaces andrew94, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 2
5. Me=Weird, Town Vanilla, survives
6. bvoigt replaces yabbaguy, Town Vanilla, killed Night 2
7. Zdenek, Mafia Roleblocker, lynched Day 3
8. DemonHybrid replaces StefanB, Town Vanilla, killed Night 1
9. imaginality, Mafia Goon, lynched Day 4
10. Setael replaces RangeroftheNorth who replaced Prox who replaced mist7676 who replaced GroupThink
11. [L], Town Vanilla, lynched Day 1
12. mastin2 replaces chkflip who replaced redtail896 who replaced Surprise_Carcinogen, Town Bodyguard, killed Night 3
13. Pine replaces crazypianist1116, Town Cop, survives

Game 977: Mafita in Acapulco, Mexico
Moderator: Shepherd_of_Wolves
Result: Town wins

Players:
Empking (Townie)
havingfitz (Townie)
Moospiker

(Deputy)

Netopalis replaces Super Awesome Mega Pimp! (Townie)
Unsight replaces IH (Townie) - lynched Day 1
Merkabah replaces Hero764 (Deputy Director/Cop) - killed Night 1
Hrezs (

Mafia-infiltrated Deputy

) - lynched Day 2
Profane Confusion (Townie) - killed Night 2
Battle Mage replaces flashstorm (Goon) - lynched Day 3

Game 838: Jeopardy in Jefferson
Moderator: Jeffcole1
Result: Mafia win Cobalt, saberwolf, yabbaguy

Players:
Cobalt replaces Nameless
saberwolf replaces CoCo who replaced Shikahake7
yabbaguy
MonkeyMan576 (Sane Cop) - lynched Day 1
StrangerCoug replaces Scott Brosius (Townie) - gunned down Night 1
Tjoe Min Ja (Townie) - lynched Day 2
Chaco

(Deputy)

- gunned down Night 2
tracker (Bodyguard) - gunned down Night 3
peanutman (Townie) - lynched Day 4
dramonic replaces Tonkatsu (Townie) - killed in Endgame
EriktheRed replaces Duke_Banks227 (Miller) - killed in Endgame
MightyFireball (Insane Cop) - killed in Endgame

Game 737: Hack Poetry Mafia
Moderator: TonyMontana
Result: Mafia win Budja, don_johnson, Goatrevolt

Players:
don_johnson (Mafia Watcher)
Goatrevolt replaces therobz (Mafia Goon)
Budja (Mafia Roleblocker) - lynched Day 1
fhqwhgads (Townie) - lynched Day 2
Jebus replaces WolfBlitzer (Doctor) - killed Night 2
RedCoyote (Tracker) - lynched Day 3
Lynx The Antithesis (Cop) - killed Night 3
sekinj replaces Plonky who replaced magisterrain (Cop) - lynched Day 4
Ice9 replaces fhqwhgads who replaced hohum who replaced millar13 who replaced Ice9 (Watcher) - killed Night 4
Rhinox replaces Deuxieme Octopus who replaced Azhrei

(Deputy)

- lynched Day 5
springlullaby (Doctor) - killed in Endgame
Spolium (Townie) - killed in Endgame

Game 417: Dueling Gods Mafia
Moderator: livingod
Result: Not completely sure -- but the two live ones must've at least

Players:
Elias_the_thief (Jack of Spades/Goon)
Sweenytodd replaces SPAG who replaced Sandy (King of Spades/Goon)
cokebottle (Queen of Spades/Roleblocker) - lynched Day 1
Cogito Ergo Sum (Deuce of Spades/Doctor) - killed Night 1
omg_im_innocent_wtf (Queen of Clubs/Roleblocker) - lynched Day 2
Nyktorion (Ten of Spades/Cop) - killed Night 2
Great Sir Utnut (Ten of Clubs/Cop) - lynched Day 3
Kison (Ace of Spades/Godfather) - killed Night 3
PlaysWithSquirrels (King of Clubs/Goon) - killed Night 3
Nocmen (Ace of Clubs/Godfather) - lynched Day 4
videoguy (Deuce of Clubs/Doctor) - killed Night 4
Sage (Jack of Clubs/

Deputy

GF) - lynched Day 5

Game 403: 101 MPH Mafia
Moderator: Arafax
Result: Town wins

Players:
Hemisphere Dancer (Townie)
Jack (Cop)
Kenji (Townie)
Yamahako (

Deputy

)
Riverwind23 (Townie) - lynched Day 1
Patrick (Townie) - killed Night 1
pablito (Mafia) - lynched Day 2
omg_im_innocent_wtf (Doc) - killed Night 2
Adele (Mafia) - lynched Day 3
M4yhem replaces Shamrock (Townie) - lynched Day 4
scotmany12 (Nurse) - killed Night 4
Ectomancer (Mafia) - lynched Day 5

Game 311
Moderator: d_rouge
Result: Town wins

Players:
Der Hammer (Cop)
Glork (Townie)
Save The Dragons (Townie)
thedocsalive replaces Pink Princess (Nurse)
PBuG (Townie) - shot Night 1
GreenLiquid (Traitor) - lynched Day 1
CoolBot

(Deputy)

- shot Night 2
Zindaras (Townie) - lynched Day 2
mangaguy (Doctor) - shot Night 3
VitaminR (Mafia) - lynched Day 3
Nightfall (Mafia) - lynched Day 4
Primate replaces theabstract (Traitor) - killed in Endgame

Game 266: The Siege on Harrogath
Moderator: ~deathsquiggle~
Result: Mafia wins draygn_mage, Thesp, Urza

Players:
Thesp (Shenk/Mafia Overseer)
draygn_mage (Fanatic Enslaved/Mafia Goon) - lynched Day 1
jajsoccer (Nihlithak/Cop) - modkilled Day 2
Urza (Fanatic Enslaved/Mafia Goon) - modkilled Day 2
PolarBoy (Barbarian/Townie) - modkilled Day 3
Kerplunk (Barbarian/Townie) - lynched Day 3
Cogito Ergo Sum

replaces Iammars (Barbarian/Townie) - lynched Day 4
Green Crayons (Barbarian/Townie) - killed Night 4
The Shadow (Malah/Doctor) - lynched Day 5
Akonas (Anya/Cop) - lynched Day 6
mith (Coin-flip Nurse) - killed in Endgame
VisMaior replaces Mastermind of Sin (Coin-flip

Deputy

) - killed in Endgame

The last time "Backup Cop" was used is mini normal 365.

Game 365: Thinking Mafia
Moderator: vikingfan
Result: Town wins

Players:
bloojay (Mason)
Mert (Sane Cop)
Pink Princess (Roleblocker)
omg_im_innocent_wtf (

Backup Cop

) - lynched Day 1
Arafax (Mason) - stabbed and shot Night 1
Lowell (Mafia Goon) - lynched Day 2
Rosso Carne (Doctor) - stabbed Night 2
Twomz (SK) - shot Night 2
RandomActs (Lyncher) - shot Night 2
Cogito Ergo Sum (Mafia Framer) - shot Night 4
Colonel Kurtz (Vigilante) - shot Night 4
Elias_the_thief (Mafia Godfather) - lynched Day 5

ost #0 (ISO) » Thu Aug 17, 2006 1:15 pm

Eight years ago.

[reinoe]

This was quite a fun game to follow. I definitely had Josh_B down as scum early in the game, but didn't come around to reinoe until much later. At that point I stopped following.

An outsider was following the game? I'm flattered. What gave me away?

[reinoe]

1602 is something I had prepared but didn't wind up using so please forgive the out of place tone.

Pretty sure it's boonskies. You can tell by how the shooting went down.

[reinoe]

Whew. 2-0 with completed games and I've never lost a partner. Almost lost josh though. I really did want to hammer...

BTW, did you guys know that I told everyone to claim

Deputy

if one of us got run up???? It's a perfectly safe, unverifiable claim....Irony of Ironies, josh either defied me or forgot and then claimed doctor.


BTW, Chaoslord and Josh...
Do you guys want to release the scum QT?

[reinoe]

It's certainly swingy though. A more accurate Vig could have turned everything around.

Also, if Boonskies outed himself right away then it would have led to slandaar getting lynched on day 1 instead of a town mislynch. No way would someone be a bulletproof vigilante. Also it looks like too many people were on to me and josh to hold out much longer.

hmm...looks like Boonskiies play had a significant effect on how things wound up...

[reinoe]

I apologize for the swinginess of the setup and how scumsided it appears to be now (in my defense though, I did have a town doc as well in the original setup but it was removed during review)

pedit: And also for the confusion over "deputy" and "backup town cop", didn't think the role name would be debated like that

Yeah, as soon as Wake claimed "Backup Cop" instead of Deputy, I was going to try and discredit the shit out of that claim. I had done research on which roles to possibly fakeclaim and Deputy shot straight to number one. Even in a game with no cop it's safe.

[reinoe]

If you consider convincing one person, one gullible idiot who was handed a great role, the peak of your scumplay, then well done.

If I had the Dayvig, I'd have shot you to shit d2.

Wouldn't you have been too busy lynching the fuck out of slandaar or do you think you could have multi-tasked that?

BTW, slandaar, I already read the dead PT, but that nightkill on Titus was a godsend for the scum team. We eliminated a threat and it allowed D2 to fly by very quickly without generating a lot of information. We actually considered killing Titus just to frame you.

[reinoe]

If I seem bitter and bitchy, that's because I am. We didn't play terribly this game. Out of 3 lynches, we hit anti-town in one. We should not have the potential to lose if our dayplay is of that level.

People assume Dayvig is a strong town role BUT UNLESS SOMEONE WHO IS GOOD HAS IT IT STRONGLY BENEFITS SCUM.

He hit scum 50% of the time too. He just shot you on day 3 and you were kinda scummy...

[reinoe]

If I seem bitter and bitchy, that's because I am. We didn't play terribly this game. Out of 3 lynches, we hit anti-town in one. We should not have the potential to lose if our dayplay is of that level.

People assume Dayvig is a strong town role BUT UNLESS SOMEONE WHO IS GOOD HAS IT IT STRONGLY BENEFITS SCUM.

He hit scum 50% of the time too. He just shot you on day 3 and you were kinda scummy...

disagree.

you were posturing in your qt about how scummy I was, blah blah, but Josh voted me and you and chaoslord were rather spineless about it. and Josh wasn't convincing either.

I don't think any of the scum really played a part in my death.

I had to attack you organically. If we all came out after you it would have been obvious. You're starting to come off as bitter and there's no need for that.

[reinoe]

It looks like to varying degrees that one of our team was escaping notice.

Sorry for fooling you Titus. We really do both use moonlogic weirdness, we just happened to be on opposite teams.

[reinoe]

that would explain why you shot Titus and not Josh, yes? Because if you knew the Doctor was lying and was scum, and you wanted towncred, you shot Titus why?

Slandaar is indulging in revisionist history because he's clearly bitter. He was getting called a serial killer halfway through Day 1.

[reinoe]

Josh was obscum but you nk'ed Titus...

Also weren't you caught before josh?

Nk'ing Titus directly led to your lynch.