Mini 1630: Edgar Allan Poe uPick GAME OVER!

[Faster Than Light]

Hi team

Orci here. I’ve always wanted to try this style of play and now is a great time to break it out. I’ll be posting only once or twice a day, and I will only post substantially. I’ve wanted to try this for a while to reduce my dependence on realtime interactions and it’s always fun to break up playing habits.

A few things to start the game. Firstly, we are a loverizer, meaning that we get to choose two people and make them lovers. We plan on using this on the two scummiest people somewhere down the line, so keep in mind that we have this option available. It’s basically a vig shot activated by a lynch in our opinion. We saw a lot of positive benefit in claiming early because 1) since we’re loverizing two scumreads we want input on that 2) it doesn’t really matter that scum know/don’t know about it 3) we might not even end up using it because of how swingy it will make the game.

Secondly, we have an ability to send a message to town after we die. I personally suspect that all townies have this ability and I just wanted to claim it first to get that sweet sweet towncred.

Also on the topic of towncred, we totally thought we were SK and were confused for a long while.

A few general remarks about this game. We have a shitton of hydrae, meaning that keeping the thread uncluttered and easy for people to catch up is a must (part of why I’m debuting this playstyle in this game specifically). Please don’t spam this game up.

Rule 4 is interesting because of the “don’t

talk

about any mod-received PMs” and the line about flavor. Take care.

Thanks.

You are now an IC.

Sonic says hello!!!!


also nice using varsoon's avatar ~.~

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Is there a sample VT role pm?

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VOTE: lynxkuroneko

Lynx is scum.
I've used up all my shots.

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Lynxkuroneko

Are you a miller?

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Is there a sample VT role pm?

Why did you want this, Faster than Light?

@Lynx: Do you think there are scum on your wagon? If so, who do you think they are?

my faction looked scummy but i knew I was town so i had to double check

orci's first post reconfirmed me but i had to triple check

[Faster Than Light]

Is there a sample VT role pm?

Why did you want this, Faster than Light?

@Lynx: Do you think there are scum on your wagon? If so, who do you think they are?

my faction looked scummy but

i knew I was town so i had to double check

orci's first post reconfirmed me but i had to triple check

Can you explain how you knew you were town? I know how I knew that, and the rest of your explanation makes sense, but I'm wondering if you deduced this in the same way that I did.

Firstly The win condition resembled that of standard town wincon rather than scum wincon. Secondly I couldn't find my scum qt if I was supposed to have one

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Why nobody comment on purloined letter ghost status??

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omg Krystal bald is cute !! <3

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Wish mollie was here!!

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Wish Varsoon is here too... *ahem*

*pages Varsoon *

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I HAVE ARRIVED.

Spoiler:

Policy Lynch is town. (Although seeing my avatar always makes me double-take--discussion of his role is pretty town)
Lynx Kuroneko is town. (Given discussion of his role and the early morbid claim, I am willing to say this is town)
Purrloined is likely town. (Same reason as bookitty)
Bookitty is likely town. (Reading our role confusion and asking for the sample pm as town after our earlier response strikes me as town in same boat)

My rationale for these townreads lies a lot in the confusion over the Morbid faction. As it read, it seemed like a scum/third party faction but I quickly deduced it was town. However, given the way people have talked genuinely about their confusion, I have to figure they were in the same boat as me.

Krystal is strange, but strikes me a bit as town. I don't want to be quick to judge because of the maybe-restriction. High functioning scum? I don't know. I think this will sort itself out soon enough. The same goes for Purloined's ghost status which I am not going to write off as 'too negative utility to be scum'.

kthxbye's hop onto Lynx and quick jump to the copper wagon pings hardest to me. There's probably low-level scum there. The quick defense of self after only two votes pings too.
CaskofAmontillado is maybe scum. A lot of the pointedness from the slot is not reading genuine to me.
Catastrophe is pinging a little for me, although I don't have anything substantial other than tacked-on interest in why we asked for a sample pm and then no real substantial followup on that (unlike bookitty)

I do not know what to think of Medea, Ghato, Brantz, or Copper.

Regardless, I'll be trying to post less as well. I don't want to turn this game into a mess and I think that cogent-Varsoon actually is needed here to keep things from becoming a total clustertruck.

As always, I am open to questions and discussion and such. Just bold my name or something.
(did you know my first crush was a girl I talked to a lot on AIM after school but she shot me down one day by saying 'please stop, you are annoying. kthxbye'? Well now ya do know that. I hold a grudge against the phrase.)
VOTE: kthxbye

-V

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Copper, how do you feel about your wagon/the people who have voted you?

-V

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Yay, I got a brilliant smile!

Not much to comment on here. Still dunno how to feel about Catastrophe.
Still feeling how I'm feeling pretty much everywhere. Game slowed down a whooole bunch.

-V

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Dunno how to feel about Cask testing the waters on a lynch on me.

-V

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I'm trying to run an experiment with this game.

A theory I've been thinking about and in fact discussing it with people at another site:

Long D1's are actually detrimental to town because of the mass of analysis that is poured into the game D1 with low information and flips creates long and boring back and forths.

Later on, when the information is available through flips, people are likelier to be burnt out, not analyze and read as thoroughly, and "wing it." Personally I've winged decisions more closer to endgame if I've been burnt out from stress (Tales of You) than if I've held back on that energy. Think long distance race with burst of energy at the end which you would only have if you are preserving it.

Extrapolating it to games in general, my theory is that town have better win rates when D1 and potentially D2 have been low volume days. This leads to more active future days. Analysis late-game will always be higher quality than early game analysis because of more information. By limiting the size of D1 and early days, we increase the potential for town winning.

My first thoughts upon seeing this playerlist with the multitude of hydras was that it would be a spam D1. I'm pleasantly surprised that we are halfway to deadline with only ten pages so keep up the good work.

I'll be posting a list of my early reads and substantial contribution by the next few days.

this guy is town

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My town reads:

Policy Lynch: The claim in his first post, plus most of his posting since (especially 126). Though I am sad that they have basically "checked out" on the game at the moment.
Tiershift: I can't see a treestump being scum, but especially given the way he revealed his role, feel like he has to be town.
LynxKuroneko: I don't know what I can add here that hasn't been said already. I will say that I do think he is probably underestimating his living power, but if his dead power is as strong as he seems to think then there is no reason we shouldn't help him help us.
Bookitty: I have just really liked her posting. She has been promoting discussion on relevant topics, which I find to be very town.

This is a poor post. Brantz is likely scum.

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I'm only having Tiershift as town because we can't lynch him if he's scum.

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*Raises thumb and forefinger of right hand*

*Winks at Krystal Bald*

*Raises left hand, palm open*

*Moves left palm to my lips, then slowly moves left palm in the direction of Krystal Bald*

*Winks again*

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@FTL: You have no intention of actually being a contributing member of the game at all do you?

moo

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quack

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Poor poor sonic
You can't lynch me regardless of my alignment, lol.

If you're scum then you cannot be killed except by vig. That makes you unkillable and autowin.

whatever, i have a townread on you, if you are one of those people that get uppity about people townreading you, please let us know

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i have a suspect what lynx ability is, but like all guesses its probably wrong.

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would also explain why he is so tight about revealing the ability

i guess we gotta trust him


this game is non-bastard i think? so no jesters.

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we lynch lynx today.

i'll wait for varsoon to shift the vote, but my hypothesis tells me that i'd rather not be on the lynx wagon.

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i know that sounds hypocritical but i dont want to be voting lynx.

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Fine guys, Lynx is not getting the necessary support and after all the hints he has dropped this must be the play for today as far as I'm concerned so here's how I'm reading it.

Lynx is hinting at being a self watcher at night and

a self sensor if lynched

.

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VOTE: lynx

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I'd like bookitty, copper, ghato, brantz, krystal,

ftl

and maybe tiershift to vote for me.

check yo privilege

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Gah~
I've been so busy visiting home and modding my own game.
Lemme catch up.
UNVOTE:

-V

[Faster Than Light]

Caught up. Here's the quick read-ons:
Policy is totes town, especially with that catchup.
Brantz almost certain scum, awkward shift of votes considering MS interaction
Tier feeling more town.
Good vibes from Ghato.
Bookitty is playing really strong towngame especially when walling to CoA.
Cask is scumming it up. inb4 someone says this is an omgus read.
kthx feeling better but still a leanscum. Mostly due to claim and later input.
Krystal probably scum. I could see faking/hiding behind that PR. I don't like the vote/input.

I mean, if you weren't known to replace tactically I'd be less inclined to just run you up for the fun of it.

-sthar8

I replaced once. If that means I am 'known for it', then I guess you should have WotC'd me harder. I got banned for 3 weeks of new games for that play, I'm not going to do it again. I -will- note that other people have used replace outs and AtE's in a VERY similar fashion and gotten town-read for it without a ban (big difference is that they did not carry through with the /out). So, please, I'd like it if instead of being bitter over something that doesn't affect this game at all, you'd engage with this game a little more and base your reads on me over my actual play in this game.

I'm now on page 7 and I think there's an excellent chance of Bookitty being scum.

-TTH

I think that I want a 1v1 between you and Bookitty. You really let this fall to the wayside, imo.

I did not like these posts very much. Despite the fact that COA is my best scumread right now, I would be open to listening to them discuss why I should lynch this instead.

-Ceph

If you weren't getting a free pass today for being essentially a claimed vig, this would be scummy af.

I just said I wanted to policy lynch varsoon, so whatever case you get out of me is gonna have a healthy dose of 'irrational' and 'non-game related.' IME he's a liability to town and there's a decent chance he'll just quit under pressure leaving us with sonic, who is much easier to read.

I think it's awkward that you're giving huge favor to softed claims but talking loud about a policy lynch on me. Furthermore, if you think I'm a huge liability or that I will just quit game, your opinion of me is legitimately wrong. If anything, my replace-outs (since sitejoin) have been due to having things come up in my life (once) and in the game you mentioned (which is moot here since I'm town, so if I was to do a similar replace out, it -wouldn't- be a detriment to town for about a thousand reasons but mostly: This is a hydra, if I was scum replacing out that'd be another ban for what I now know is bannable behavior, and replacing like that as scum would actually be beneficial since you think I'm a liability and difficult read anyway).
Basically, what you're saying here is that you want a lynch on me because of policy that doesn't make sense, and also because I'm a liability to town--that's an admission that you know that I am town, essentially. I win most of my scumgames on-site, for the record. Furthermore, while I have played poorly and off-the-wall as town, I am not doing that here at all. You're proposing that I'm a liability independent of my actual play, which is pretty damn scummy. I'm not even going to parrot the points other players have brought against you, either.


VOTE: Cask

I'm fine with being on/off the lynx wagon, but that's up to Lynx.

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Furthermore, anyone basing their read on me for putting a vote on someone I thought was scum and then not being around should change that immediately.
I wasn't around for several reasons, none of which are game-related. I've been visiting friends and family for the holidays and this is the last time for a long time that I'll get to see many of them. Between that, the few times I have been on-site have been on my main account, spent moderating the game I am running.

I'm sorry for my absence so far. I'll try to be more active. If you have questions for me, please put my name in bold when asking.

-V

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Tier, you just tryin' to rile me up?
-V

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Because I'm ready to defend pretty much all of my points. If believing what I believe makes me shitty, then I'm fine with being a lord of shit.
-V

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@Boo: <3
I did not anticipate it, really, since I still had internet access.
I think that Cask has been spending a lot of time testing the water of who could be a push. He did it with me and he did it with you.
It's thanks to the Lynx shenanigans that we aren't even scumhunting anymore here. It's annoying, in a way.
Here's my list, regardless:

TOWN
Policy Lynch
Tiershift
Bookitty
Ghato
kthxbye
Catastrophe
Copper
NOT-SO-TOWN

Does that work?

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I think that if we're going to go ahead with the Lynx thing (which feels real anti-town, imo), then let's get it dealt with.

-V

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@Brantz: MS reported to me that you felt very scummy, and when catching up it was weird to see you guys as standoffish and then your vote went to Lynx.
Skimming your ISO now, in reflection of Cask's weird pushes/testing the water, you were also a bit a victim of that. Dunno how to read that.
You're not my scummiest read by far, but last time I talked to MS he really wanted you lynched.

-V

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Oh, also, Brantz, I find when people accuse other people of only coming out to post when they get mentioned, it's just a form of scumpainting. Mostly null, but lean scum. :/

-V

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@Copper: I was asked to give a top-7 players and we don't (as far as I am aware) have a for-sure idea of how Tier's vote interacts with Lynx's whatever (assumed self-sensor).
I don't have a good read on you, because I'm internally waffling really hard. Your play strikes me as outspoken town, but I feel like your intent is scummy at times. I want to town-read you but I'm skeptical of my own read on you. I suppose that you can be on the wagon for lynx, if only to help sort ya.


@Bookitty: Fairnuff. Most the time, though, I find that I get prodded or I'm doing a catchup when people call me out like that and I'm all, "Yo dawg, Im town just not caught up jeeze."

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@Copper: You, if I had to give one.

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@Brantz: Part of why I wanted to be in a hydra with metal sonic is because I think he's a very strong player with a very stylized play-approach. It can be very polarizing, but the same was often said about me, so I felt like we'd be a good fit.

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VOTE: Cask

Scum found.
GG.

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More or less.
-V

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I still need to discuss with metal sonic how much we plan to claim outside of Cask being scum.
-V

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You're lying.
I am not a role cop.
-V

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Also, I'm town.
I'm cool with a 1v1 on you.
-V

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Not that case at all.
Do you have a passive ability I should know about?

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Oh, the detective?
Captivating.
I doubt we're on the same team, then.
I'm the Orangutang, from the same story.

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Orangutan, my bad.
I watched too many Tang commercials to ever spell that word correctly.
:3

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@Cata: I'm still discussing things with Metal Sonic. He's not around but when he replies I'll be way more comfortable. I know how I want to proceed, but I don't want to do something MS is against.

pedit: I told you, we're not rolecop.

-V

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MS does not want to claim right now.
How do we know that there was a scum immune to being hit by the sensor?
-V

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There is an amalgamation I can think of that allows us both to be town, but it requires very, very strange role interactions or far too much coincidence and town-power.
-V

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The simpler answer is that you're scum and you're lying.
-V

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@Copper: I'm 95% sure he's scum. That's better certainty than I can give for any other read, and, honestly, one of the best chances we have today.
His even-night investigative role is an easy PR to fake as scum, so I'm feeling it's bogus.

As for the awkward flip wording of 'at least one scum', I think that it's best that we operate under the notion that there's at least one scum in the lynx-wagon pool, but we don't use it to clear town. I'm unsure over the capacity for scum to escape sensoring.
It's not a game-breaking strat even if scum couldn't defend from it. The chances of a town wagon being 100% townsided, ESPECIALLY after announcing a self-sensor are very slim.

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If I've got this straight, then the 'kamikaze on CoA' theory that CoA has provided assumes that we're a scum rolecop trying to push him because he's an even-night investigative role.
The problem with that is that we're not scum or a rolecop.
So, if anything, CoA outted themselves with what seems like an awkward attempt at a power play.
I don't see town freaking out and claiming after two votes like that.
Not someone as strong as CoA.

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@Copper:
I targeted CoA with an ability last night. The shot of my ability was used, so I do not believe I was blocked (which usually makes the ability not use a shot).
I may have been redirected in some way or form.
I would normally rationalize that our flipped Rolestopper did a rolestop on CoA, but why would they? Their deathflip said CoA was their biggest scumread.
The only way for my ability to fail and the shot of it to be used up is if CoA has a passive that negates it (already claimed no passives) or if someone used an ability specifically that would change targets/results. I think that if we had that sort of ability town-side, it would be too strong from a setup perspective, ESPECIALLY if CoA is the role they claim to be.
It leaves me with the following:
CoA is lying and scum
OR
Some other ability exists that changed the target/results of my ability and forced my ability to lose its shot. This results in pretty much the following scenarios for me:
The ability is townsided and targeted me (no clue, we didn't crumb or anything iirc). If so, town should claim it so we don't potentially mislynch.
The ability is townsided and targeted CoA. If so, feels like this would be way too much town power especially if CoA is even-night-investigative.
The ability is scum-sided and targeted me. Scum lucked out.
The ability is scum-sided and targeted CoA. Scum defended scum, essentially.

So far, though, I am leaning very heavily on CoA just lying. Too many really coincidental things would have to line up and the random calling us a rolecop is a really strange play for town to make.

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I did ask, CoA.
Ffery said the shot of my ability was used.

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P-EDIT: I just wrote a huge post on how it would or would not have worked, but god damn it Brantz.

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P-EDIT: I just wrote a huge post on how it would or would not have worked, but god damn it Brantz.

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I'm not outing my role regardless.
Basically:
There's a significant difference from an ability that reads
'Stops a player from using their abilities'
and one that says:
'Prevents a player from being affected by any abilities.'

The latter of those two typically results in shots being used from a limited-shot ability. This is like how a 1-shot kill is used when a target gets doctor'd or how a 1-shot cop gets used up even if it hits a miller or a godfather. If you were rolestopped as the flipped rolestop ability reads, I would lose my shot.

I hadn't even considered that Cephrir meant they didn't use the rolestop at all. I thought he was referring to the Loverizer ability.

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Well, that pretty well outs me.
Yeah, we tried to vig him.
I thought he was bulletproof and bluffing.
Why would you doctor CoA?a

Oh.
Oooh, my vote is on Catastrophe?

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Lemme try this differently?
VOTE: kthxbye

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Mod: Is the vote-count you posted correct--IE: was my vote on Catastrophe despite me voting CaskofAmontillado intentional or a mistake?

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I tried to kill him. Thought he was scum.
Now I guess we're in a pickle.
Dude's still probably scum. /shrugs.

Also, I want to apologize for playing like shit in our previous games, Sthar8.
I'll defend my play in them even if it wasn't optimal, but I'm sorry that you had such a negative experience in them with me.

-V

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UNVOTE:

I think kthx is far too defensive of his role, for the record.
Also, I think we should lynch out of the pool on the lynx wagon. We're guaranteed at least one scum there. I tried to pick my Vig target last night out of people not on the wagon but I guess I botched that given the jailkeeping.
At least that clears Brantz, I guess?
/shrugs.
I'm probably gettin' gamed.

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Put yourself in my shoes.
I just wasted my vig shot on someone who very clearly didn't die.

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You weren't exactly the bastion of towniness either. I didn't think you'd get protected from a kill.
I still don't think you're town.
Boo's hop on the wagon is kinda totes suspect, so I'm taking a step back to think over this one.

You outed yourself. Remember that. Don't pin that on anyone but your own play.

-V

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Show me where I told you to claim.
You're being irrational.
You claimed at 2 votes deep.
I hadn't even revealed the interaction that caused me to believe you were scum (on top of your play).
I fail to see how this is my fault.

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Assuming this whole faux pas leaves us with me, Brantz, and CoA confirmed for today, shouldn't we lynch out of Tier, Medea, and Krystal?
So, shouldn't we lynch Medea?

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VOTE: Medea the Alien

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Tier says he can confirm himself and people are saying Krystal's Post Restriction/play is town, so Medea?
Right?

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Varsoon is not a four letter word. :3
-V

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I've returned. Boy, did this game blow up.
I still think we should lynch off the wagon, between krystal and medea.

@BOO:
1. Why did you think that a failed vig shot made Cask for certain scum?
I thought he was bulletproof scum, which makes sense from a balance perspective. Either that or scum with a protective ability scum-sided.
2. Why would the fact that Brantz jailkept Cask last night negate that read?
It doesn't, really, and I still have fair suspicion of Cask, but Brantz claim means CoA possibly is not a scum-role to counterbalance mine.
3. Did you consider bulletproof when consulting with Metal Sonic?
Yes. I was unsure of if we should claim or not because of the info available to us.
4. Why did you say that it was a guilty, more or less?
Between CoA's play, my failed kill on him, and the fact that he continued to insist on me being a rolecop (weird) and that he had no passives (like bulletproof), it felt way too suspect. Also, I like to go all-in on players who I think are scum, even if I don't have a guilty. Conviction is important.


Boo, I -really- -really- don't want you to be scum this game. :/

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Oh shit that slip.

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So... Copper lynch?

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VOTE: Copper

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It didn't read as a joke to me at all.

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Banana aligned could easily be read as a joke in context, especially with me claiming Orangutan.
:l

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Euphoric doesn't make any sense as a joke.

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It's just really awkward, Copper.
If someone flips Euphoric, you've got some backpedaling to do.

VOTE: Medea
I want to see what krystal has to 'say'.

-V

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I think everyone makes mistakes.
If scum didn't make mistakes, they'd always win.

[Faster Than Light]

AlleyOop.
VOTE: Kthxbye

[Faster Than Light]

Also, basically means Tier/Medea and I'm cooler with a Medea lynch out of those two.

[Faster Than Light]

So, I thought about it, and really, there's two things that could be possible and both net us a scum lynch.
Krystal is lying and scum and wants Kthx lynch because Kthx is a power role Krystal can't keep around.
Krystal is telling the truth and Kthx is just straight up scum.

No matter what, I think the Kthx lynch is the best option.

[Faster Than Light]

Here's the other issue:
Your entire defense relies solely on the effectiveness of a claimed role.
If we're believing in the power of claims, then Krystal claiming you have a strongman shot means you are scum regardless of anything else (unless you're a vig, ask Cask may have slipped?)
So you should understand that you should not be making an argument steeped in the capacity of your role.
Because anyone who cares about role-claimed arguments will likely side with Krystal here.

Forcing a player to be modkilled is bad. No.

-V

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@Cask: Why did you say town had two vigs?
Also, yeah, sorry for going all in on you. I did not say I had a guilty, though. In the end, we potentially cleared three town with that exchange, so I don't think it turned out poorly.

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Kthx, c'mon man:
If you're scum, just say so and stop dragging this out.
If you're town, then let yourself be lynched so that we can then lynch out Krystal, who is scum if you're town.

Isn't that easy?
If anything, resisting your lynch at this point is playing to a scum wincon.
If you're town, sure, you die, but then scum gets out'd.
Right?

-V

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I'm going to be flying in a few planes tomorrow, so if I'm not around it's because of infinite delays OR the plane crashed and I am dead. Or scavenging off the remains of other people in the jungle we crashed in. Something like that.
-V

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I made it back safely.
-V

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oh, shut the hell up.


nobody gives a shit about card flips. you're not that important. screw this shit


lets end the day so we can do more fun stuff tomorrow.





.... oh wait, we're waiting for ghato's updates from Lynx. okay. after he posts that please hammer

kthxbye

[Faster Than Light]

His acting isn't that good

I agree with this.

ALSO:
Metal Sonic, post in the hydra, please!~

I think Kthx is scum hamming it up.
I don't buy any of his shenanigans.
Lynch it, please. Then we can easily make informative lynches and decisions based on the flip, which is probably scum here.

-V

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Kthx is CLAIMED SCUM.
Kthx is just blowing up the game-thread and being noisy.
Your responses should either be a vote on Kthx, or justification for not voting Kthx.
That's it.

Hopefully, that settles things.
Also, for good measure:
VOTE: Kthxbye


-V