Mini 1649: Jabberwocky Mafia (Game Over)

[Titus]

@AxleGreaser, why did you pick those players?

I would guess pirate mollie is one of the heads of VM.

How long have you been playing? Meta links?

[Titus]

Halloween was about 6 months ago...

[Titus]

@Witness, Which games did we play together? Also can you stop with the excessive posting?

@Mollie, who is the second head of your hydra?

@Elbrin, I like wallers if they are concise; think if then else format.

[Titus]

@Seraphim

you are a ye oldie(2008) player of the game. Styles and people change. Could you suggest a town and scum game that I could look at to get a feel for how you expect to play this game.
Also, same as for farside, choose third game too if you think that is a good idea.

I haven't played the game recently. I've been away for a while and just recently returned so my meta is pretty much non-existent. All I have is a recently completed scum game but I'm not alive very long because I got shat on.

Anyway,

Vote: Witness Protection

Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen.

Please use only English or translate. Thank you.

[Titus]

Please use only English or translate.

Crap, you mean I can't cuss people out in Kilrathi this game?

Only if you translate or context is obvious.

[Titus]

Don't do this at home, kiddies!

Look, this is perhaps the worst advice ever on the interwebs!!! If you must drink, nowhere is safer, or better than in your own home.

I hope we don't debate this point.

You are cut off.

[Titus]

VOTE: Tiershift

Sneaking so a cw forms on me.

[Titus]

VOTE: Tiershift

Sneaking so a cw forms on me.

1 vote is a CW.

jerk reaction noted .... vote stands.

No my goal was to get more votes on myself. I was meaning that to read...

I am just going to sneak onto this wagon so people vote me.

[Titus]

VOTE: Tiershift

Sneaking so a cw forms on me.

I'm like a genie. Rub me the right way, and I grant wishes.

VOTE: Titus

See this guy knows what I meant

[Titus]

One more vote on me and we'll have two competing wagons to analyze.

[Titus]

Witness Protection is likely town or scum with Tiershift. There is town red to be had (before I was overt in drawing votes to myself) in just throwing a vote on the tier wagon. He doesn't vote there.

I get similar town feels from you. The over explanation and hostility weaken my townread of you though. Most of the information I get from wagon analysis is later in the game. Since I know I am town, this creates a semi natural wagon analysis. Is it perfect? Nope but we are out of rvs.

We should have been out of RVS when Tier reacted negatively to one of my first posts. Yet he did not cast a serious vote against me.

Farside did cast a serious vote against me but I do not know why. (Please explain Farside)

[Titus]

Tier's lack of voting me I find very odd btw.

[Titus]

Looking like they want to end RVS. Getting a random wagon going is usually how that happens. Throwing a vote on tier does that. Yet we did not see that behavior. Why?

[Titus]

dDP has one post and TSO has not posted.

I cannot give an intelligent read on them yet.

[Titus]

Farside, you literally have described the opposite of my playstyle regardless of alignment. That puzzles e. Town lean for now with a dose ofwtf

[Titus]

I cannot vote if I haven't read the game yet

Why are me and WP likely the same alignment?

Claims not to have read...is asking questions vased on reads I gace...

And those reasons were given in the post he is asking about wtf

[Titus]

Axxle, I think most everyone says that my style of play is odd. Combine the sass of Sherlock with the aggression of Perry Mason the abrasiveness of House but the empathy of Kate Beckett.

[Titus]

I usually lurk my way out of RVS. I felt like trying something new. I could only pull that stunt here because any other site would cry jester.

[Titus]

Beli, you seem to resist a lot of wagons for this being so early?

[Titus]

Big words. Big wrongs.

Sorry but the Tier wagon is justified. Handwaive more. Or you know you could explain why the reasons are bad?

[Titus]

Tier thinks I made a bad post. Refuses to vote me.
Tier has posts denying he has read the thread while selectively responding to content. #91
Tier has provided no content.
Tier has refused to vote me despite being the only player he reacted negatively to.

[Titus]

Bel is playing Devil's advocate to some of my Town reads. He has some good points that haven't been addressed by others that I'd like to hear addressed too.

Such as?

Is there anyone you do not like?

[Titus]

This feels wierd.

I don't think farside is scum bc they would not push something blatantly false.

[Titus]

This feels wierd.

I don't think farside is scum bc they would not push something blatantly false.

Can you point to a game we've been in with you as active from the get go?

I'm pretty tired of people saying something is false were I have no experience with you this way before.

That's the problem. I am hyperactive in every game as everyone here is telling you.

[Titus]

Oh shoot, I just want to make everyone aware of this now, cuz I just realized. Beginning March 5th I'm going to have to V/LA until March 9th. I'm shipping up to Boston with some friends for, among other things, a geeky videogame con thing. I'll only have phone access and will try to keep up when I can, but I'll have no computer access and obviously a diminished ability to post/contribute. Apologies to all. :/

Bold so mod notices

[Titus]

Tier is scum, far is just a player who is wrong.

[Titus]

Yeah Farside is likely town. She has a nasty habit of scumreading disagreement as town.

[Titus]

Okie dokie... rock n rolly

[Titus]

Pretty sure Tier's scum now and he's doing the wagonlurk.

@TSO, I see what Brantz is posting as pretty town. There's a chance I townread his personality but I can understand alarm at immutable townreads 5 pages in. Even then, VM isn't 100% immutable in practice as either alignment so I shrug it off.

[Titus]

Ok. I will rephrase.

TSO, scumreading Brantz for being concerned about fixed townreads so early isn't bad. I just think it's wrong. Superfixed townreads can be very confident town or scum. Mollie falls into the latter and even she moves from them.

TLDR Brantz posting is fine but I see why people think otherwise.

[Titus]

WP, Please pick a major deadline. You asking me to rephrase for a third time feels like reaching for towncred since I am widely misunderstood.

Brantz was worried about VM having superfixed reads so early.
TSO scumreads Brantz for his concern.
Superfixed reads means very confident town or scum.
Brantz picked VM scum. TSO picked VM town.


I am taking VM town but understanding that superfixed reads can be used to protect a weaker buddy.

[Titus]

What are your doubts on my slot and when did they start btw?

Also I am not going for a lurker lynch. Who do you think is scummier, Brantz or Tier?

[Titus]

Blaaahhh...Why is there a trend of having hydras with player names in them? It makes people think I am talking about only one head when who posted it is irrelevant.

[Titus]

@Witness Protection, You did say you had doubts on me. I am asking you again, what caused those?

[Titus]

@ Titus You being so quiet overall, but it's hard to rebut silence. I've got better leads to work on while letting you post. Remember you've fooled me into supporting you (as scum) before. I'd worry more if I didn't have suspicions of you.

Are you seriously high right now?

[Titus]

VOTE: Brantz

Why are you giving me towncred for the Tier wagon before he flipped?

[Titus]

V/LA ends. Lets get a lynch through plz. Thinking about the game over my vacay, I'm less optimistic about BRantz flipping scum. I've been stalking (reading) a game that he just happened to be in, and he flipped town. His play there reminds me of his play here. It's not much, but it's not nothing. Mostly my gut says BRantz isn't scum, whilst my head says he's doing scummy stuff so he is scum. So far in my time on this site, my head has never been right.

I see a lot of people sitting around twiddling their thumbs going "Guh I'd lynch Seraph, he's super scum, but good golly gosh it's so close to deadline". K so vote Seraph then. We can compromise on Seraph instead of letting him lurkfuck his way out of playing this game. Literally no one has contributed less. It has been 2 weeks. 14 days. He has 7 posts. If you'll read his ISO, you will see they are as follows.

-1 vote on WP for "talking too much", and 1 follow up post promising that he will ignore him and advises that we all do the same, which makes zero sense if we are trying to work together, but makes a lot of sense for a scum trying to divide us
-1 vote for Belisarius for quite literally zero reason. This is never explained beyond "gut" when I prompt him later.
-3 promises to contribute/post more in the future

That's it.
Like it's not just the number of posts. When there is a post there is zero substance. No content. It is shallow. It is nothing. I am not going to play with him. I don't care what faction he is, he is dragging this game down. Seraphim needs to replace out or be killed, because if he's town scum won't kill him and he'll be lynchbait the whole game, and if he's scum, well, self explanatory.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Seraphim

I have the exact opposite issue with Brantz but ~ongoing~.

[Titus]

Again my concern is that you brought up the subject by comparing it to yourself, which made me think meta, but perhaps that is a matter of semantics. I feel my "playstyle" is the same regardless of my alignment and so isn't a tell either way. That's obviously a statement that only I can agree with.

We all start with ourselves as a baseline, which is why I find behavioral analysis so shitty.

Normative players read each other quite well with that and err towards townreading each other, but players who are wierd generally become difficult to read.

That's something worth acknowledging which is all I've seen TSO do.

[Titus]

@WP, That's true. So don't focus on forcing themselves to trip up so much. That's one of my earliest mistakes. I'm much better at this as scum, but people generally trip over themselves.

[Titus]

I fear if Sera gets replaced, we may lose a chance to kill a scum. Remember DP's play in Walrus? I see big similarities.

Different game, different players. But play that looks very much the same.

This post makes me think WP is scum and Sera is town.

Even if Sera was scum, town should want a replacement to get associations from Sera.

Mod: Sera's status please

[Titus]

Oh and I guess you buddied me so there's that

I did?

Both Witness Protection and Titus keep (purposely?) missing my questions and I'm really mad about that since I don't have a superb read on either.

Talk to me!

What did I miss?

[Titus]

@Tier, The lack of a vote was scummy because it had appeared you were scumreading me in that post and thus should have been out of RVS. Thus, you should have voted.

I do find selective responses scummy as well. Your recent play has improved. You're still a scumread but I am not 100% certain you are scum.

[Titus]

only to 13 but my wagon is asinine.

There are literally 7 posts from my slot in the entire thread - nothing there at all to justify a case. The lynch is essentially a PL because of lurking. Lurking that has been identified as a player did not have time for the game (hence the replace). Are you really telling me that town is going to ignore any scum hunting for a PL?

This makes no sense.

Will give some scum reads when I finish off the thread. (should be up shortly)

This is why I hate your lynch in a nutshell.

[Titus]

Mollie, name one thing scummy the slot did other than lurk.

This lynch is bad.

[Titus]

Tier and Beli need serious looking into tomorrow.

Ready for hammer.

[Titus]

Ok. If FAQ misses that, use your judgment.

[Titus]

Farside, brantz doesn't just give up as scum. I have proof of that. As town he does what he thinks is best for the town.

This is obviously the latter situation; he's accepting his lynch, not claiming something extravagant in the hopes of making the night. Even in his claiming post, he admits defeat. It's not 'now that this is out of the way, can we please lynch faq?'. Instead, he just takes the bullet.

Faq has a pretty decent chance of flipping scum imo with his latest post, muuuuuch much more likely than brantz flipping scum.

Disagree with this wholeheartedly.

[Titus]

Mod: What is the suicidal mafia?

[Titus]

What was his trigger to committ suicide?

VOTE: Tier

[Titus]

@Flum, You are not subtle.

[Titus]

VOTE: tier

only because I want you to townread me

I can catch your back.

[Titus]

Does suicide replace regular mafia kill?

[Titus]

Why would you even want to know that, Titus?

The doctor if any has a clear if the mafia still had their kill.

[Titus]

You seem to know a hell of a lot about the suicidal mafia modifier Tier. Maybe you can tell us?

[Titus]

If you want to work together, try and convince me of your reads.

[Titus]

Suicidal combines with deathproof maybe?

[Titus]

nah, scum always talk to each other in an attempt to distance.

Bad. Scum can suck or wifom.

[Titus]

This whole talk better Tier and Flub makes me insanely uncomfortable.

[Titus]

Elbrim, who were you scumreading at the end of yesterday?

[Titus]

I've considered that Axle's role made him suicide if town was lynched d1, but that doesn't explain why scum didn't powerbus him d1 for town cred.

It seems extremely likely he was vigged.

I have thought that powerbussing might have happened though hence why flub is awkward.


@Elbrim, Because I want to be insane town Titus.

Let's lynch farside.

[Titus]

VOTE: Farside

[Titus]

Mollie, you never like me.

Tier seems to know a lot about a suicidal role that the mod is conviently unable to clarify.

[Titus]

@Farside, I don't do vca until day 2 or 3 usually. Plus I wanted to know what Axle knew when he imploded.

[Titus]

That role is different than the suicidal modifier. That has a wiki page.

Suicidal bomber would not implode on night 1 when universally townread. I had that role. It was my favorite scumgame ever.

[Titus]

Oh actually, I don't think Axxle killed himself.
I think I know exactly what happened but I won't be discussing that for now.

Can you say what you think his suicide condition was? If the scumteam still had their kill?

[Titus]

I couldn't care less about his suicide condition.
All I care is that he most likely didn't kill himself and was killed by different factor.

I care where his scumkill went.

[Titus]

@Elbrin, If Flubber is scum, your assertion is wrong.

[Titus]

@Elbrin, If Flubber is scum, your assertion is wrong.

I don't think Flubbers vig claim matters, even if he's lying scum, there's totally a vig in game.

...Or a Serial Killer.

Oh lol Flubbers a Serial Killer, I get it now.

It does because if Flubber knew that Axle would die...at some point.. then claiming Axle should be vigged is excellent play. It establishes a scumread preflip.

[Titus]

Elb: if all your going to do is snip out my comments and not read the full quote, don't expect me to be nice after towards you.

Like for example why is titus voting me over beli if you scum read both of us.
Why is vm who scum read titus and promised some meta suddenly not pushing that or showing that scum read.

But hey you want to continue tunneling be my guest you saw where that lead with brantz.

I has reasons. :p

[Titus]

Vote Belisarius, or explain why you're not doing so.

Beli + far buddies?

[Titus]

So are you saying scum shot Axle deliberately... ROTFL.

[Titus]

I can read you know.

I kinda always figured it was a loving hug that made Elbrim all better but if you want to call it butt fucking fine.

I like it this way. I can hammerz you know.

If you think Beli is scum, you should bus. :p

[Titus]

I can read you know.

I kinda always figured it was a loving hug that made Elbrim all better but if you want to call it butt fucking fine.

I like it this way. I can hammerz you know.

If you think Beli is scum, you should bus. :p

So you avoid the wagon just to butter up to Elb and produce a vote on me because ??????

You know I'm trying to figure out scum maybe that is why the vote.

So why no interaction with VM there. She had this secrete scum read based on meta you never responded to bac on day one?

Cuz I want reaction. Your reaction scummy. I vote you no case. You desperate to have my vote off.

I said "Mollie, you never like me". Lolz. That's a response.

[Titus]

Stop pushing that bullshit line Far.

I said I replied with Mollie never likes me. I am not arguing my own meta when I think meta is worthless.

Also the whole not talking to Mollie is also laughable. Sounds like you are desperate to save you and Beli.

Why haven't you focused on solving him?

[Titus]

I am solving the game. I think you and/or Beli are scum. Beli wagon took off so I voted you.

Mollie is not defending me.

Mollie's mindfucked due to Hilariously unbalanced.

I do not even get the last question.

How do your actions solve Beli? They just seem focused on creating a cw.

[Titus]

My hugs. My hugs. My lovely lady hugs.

[Titus]

Oh intent to hammer.

[Titus]

Titus, can you tell us where your Far scumread came from? Again, my reading of Day 1 shows that you townread her. What changed?

She'll never explain and she had no interested in figuring out Beli, that much is fact.

I literally just told you. No hugs for you.

[Titus]

Nope. I want reactions based on my hugs.

[Titus]

FAQ2 if one condition, lookat my hugs again. My hugs.

[Titus]

Good. After scum kill me it will be obvious. It makes sense after my death.

I do think that the suicide was done after kill prevented as FAQ2 suggested.

[Titus]

I am not sure about how I feel about him suggesting that theory but it fits...

[Titus]

Elbrin's most likely town barring roleblockers.

[Titus]

You can help by voting.

[Titus]

Great then what do you want to discuss.

I want your thoughts on Farside and FAQ2 today.

[Titus]

I am fine with it.

I know the PRs in this game most likely. Beli will claim vt or scum. :p

Oh there's a soft guilty.. gee I missed that. Rolefish much?

[Titus]

Beli claim.

[Titus]

Requesting Axle gets Copped or something.

yeah. you are not the cop.

Vote Belisarius, or explain why you're not doing so.

you better explain why you think beli is scum then cos "oh I thought he looked scummy on d1" isn't gonna cut it.

Lol. Yes fakeouts don't happen ever. Tracker or watcher also work. Stop rolefishing.

[Titus]

TSO do you want a hug tonight? I like hugging.

[Titus]

Yeah. I do. Hehehe. My hugs show all. Hugs are awesome.

Say hi to guy for me.

[Titus]

So guy is letting you make a fool of yourself.

[Titus]

And that's why you're brainfucked or scum.

I was manipulating everyone in unbalanced but failing miserably at the end.

[Titus]

I think you got it. Do not hug me. It will get confusing.

You should punch Farside IMO.

[Titus]

I have been threatened by blacklist a lot. It never happens.

What's that annoying?

[Titus]

Beli is getting lynched.

Punching corpses is stupid.

[Titus]

There is no claim safe for Beli. That is why he will not claim.

@Far, I have answered you just not directly. It's best I do not.

[Titus]

Nah I already know the PRs. All Beli claiming will do is cause more chaos.

[Titus]

@VM, I am not throwing.

@Beli, So you are claiming PR then? Or trying to sell us a VT claim?

[Titus]

He's only at L minus 3 because of people wanting discussion.

He should have claimed when I did intent to hammer. Unless town has 4 plus PRs, all the actual PRs have claimed.

[Titus]

Nope.

[Titus]

So why haven't you cced any of the claims?

[Titus]

Beli there's a guilty on you so you can stop the grandstanding and fishing.

Mollie also saw someone claiming a guilty so yeah..

[Titus]

Plus I am as dense as a doornail and I saw the claims.

[Titus]

Tough shit Mollie. Stop stalling.

Unless you CC TSO right now, the play is to vote Beli.

[Titus]

TSO check Mollie.

@Beli, Denying a guilty won't make it go away.

[Titus]

Tough shit Mollie. Stop stalling.

Unless you CC TSO right now, the play is to vote Beli.

It's role related reason that I absolutely need to do this. Either I do this or tonight turns reeeeeally ugly.
And I'd rather not see tonight turn ugly.

Bullshit.

[Titus]

@Titus: meta TSO and recalibrate your bullshit sensors.

Meta can kiss my ass.

[Titus]

Mollie, if that post actually gives you relief, you should CC TSO or vote Beli. Stop stalling.

@FAQ2, not mine TSOs.

[Titus]

Actually, not even, I just reread that scum pt and you said nothing of the sort. so you're trying to discredit my thought with something you never even said, and if you had it would only have made my argument stronger.

Beli lynch now plz.

I support a Belisarius lynch. I don't really know or care why Elbirn does, but I was scumreading him d1.

VOTE: Belisarius

Vote Belisarius, or explain why you're not doing so.

sweetie, I'm not softing anything. that should be clear.

There you go FAQ2.

[Titus]

If you are CCing TSO go all in Beli. Result.

@Mollie, Four PRs with a suicidal scum is absurd.

[Titus]

He already did. Why do you think the wagon took off?

Beli has already CCed TSO. Why is he stalling on the result?

[Titus]

I am not rolefishing. You are backing out of a claim.

[Titus]

He didn't recant.

Go ahead and try to lynch me Mollie. You know by now I refer to hydras by what name I please. You want me not to use a name, do not do that in your hydra.

[Titus]

No massclaim. We lynch Beli. Beli flips scum.

[Titus]

TSO didn't claim, TSO tunnels, and the only way TSO could have a guilty on me is if my role PM is made of lies.

There's Beli's CC.

Now if you will excuse me, I have real life scum to fry.

[Titus]

As I said - I am a pretty straight forward guy. I was not picking that up as a hard claim but now I see where you are coming from.

As it is pretty much in the open, would you mind confirming TSO for those of us in the slow class? You are positive that beli is scum?

Also, at this juncture I do not think that it is unreasonable to mention that I am also a PR (scum have so many targets already) so I am not so sure that mollie's claim is all that unreasonable. I would point out that this is an unreviewed setup with the use of suicide role modifiers and from the OP:
"This is an unreviewed setup so if it's shitty I can't blame it on anyone else"

It is quite possible that there are a ton of PR roles in this game. It makes me wonder what powers the scum have though and how many there are. There is going to have to be some power behind them in order to make up for all of the roles on the town side.

Agreed. Too many PR claims and hints already and scum is very nerfed.

[Titus]

I don't think I'm comfortable with all this role fishing and PR speculation. Regardless there's no way that all of these hints/barely claims are all true.

Titus, you are now either insane scum or drunk town, cuz a lot of what you're saying doesn't make sense but I can't see how it would help you as scum. Beli hasn't CC'd anywhere, and I'm not even sure I buy the idea that TSO is claiming a guilty.

Stone cold sober thank you. I never do "dumb" shit as town.

TSO has a guilty, I'll push it until the end of the earth.

@GIF, I don't care. I call your hydra Mollie because it's an easy name for my simpleton brain to remember. If you sign, I will start to care. I called Mollie's other hydra ika because it has ika in the name.

[Titus]

You just think it's dumb. :-p

[Titus]

Actually there's a plenty of scum motivation for doing that.

Quick hammering beli will guarantee her death tomorrow because how much people likes to lynch her In general. Sticking with "TSO has a guilty" grants her (1) she doesn't need to do anything and just coast on that (2) can hide behind "I thought he was guilty" reasoning after beli flips town.
^
Faq2
I just got ninja'd by mollie

LOL. I'm not dying to town. You're going to have to do one hell of a job muddying me up. Considering you've softed a CC to ME, that's when you're going to lose.

You see, we can't hug it out.

[Titus]

So if anyone wants to explain why titus doing that is town feel free to.
I won't take "because it's top cray as scum" because it's not crazy at all and is full of scum motivation while having no town motivation. Besides, she has proved that she can be crazy as either alignment.

I'm forcing scum Beli to claim after a cop guilty.

Period.

No massclaim. No nothing. You don't get rewards for defending caught scum. Sorry.

[Titus]

guy you are supposed to be playing the good cop did you forget your role????

plz don't make me play good cop. bad cop is so much fun!

~ RoleFishies 'R' Us

To do that, you'd have to interrogate me. You can't though because you have to defend scum Beli.

TSO claimed cop.
TSO claimed a guilty. "I ain't softing"
We train Beli.

I try to force a claim.

We don't out cops for no reason.

Beli claims or dies.

[Titus]

@GIF, I don't care. I call your hydra Mollie because it's an easy name for my simpleton brain to remember. If you sign, I will start to care. I called Mollie's other hydra ika because it has ika in the name.

who said anything 'bout the name?
I'm addressing that both of us are scumreading you and simultaneously posting to call you scum.

Who cares?

Mollie is in your hydra name, I am calling you Mollie unless you sign. Deal with it Mollie. I am not dealing with figuring out which head is talking since your both ignoring the cop claim.

[Titus]

LOL. I'm not dying to town. You're going to have to do one hell of a job muddying me up. Considering you've softed a CC to ME, that's when you're going to lose.

You see, we can't hug it out.

Oh cool
cos I'm claiming vig.

Prepare to be snicker-snackered tonight.

Nice try, that's Elbrin/Fluff.

[Titus]

You see, they already softed Vig. Both of them. Unless you're claiming Elbrin/Fluff are leet scum, you're just wrong.

Who did you shoot last night FTR Mollie?

[Titus]

Oh FTR, obviously not claiming Vig.

[Titus]

You see, they already softed Vig. Both of them. Unless you're claiming Elbrin/Fluff are leet scum, you're just wrong.

Who did you shoot last night FTR Mollie?

Axle wad snicker snackered last night.
sninker snacker is a vig kill flavor.

Also whether they softing vig or not is irrelevant, at least in this game.
The relevants will know anyway.
You will get to learn why after you die. I just don't want you to learn the secret and babble in the scum pt.

That's the problem. I know you're not the vig. Anyone can claim vig with matching flavor.

I know one of the softed vigs is town, unquestionably. So you can't be the vig. Period.

[Titus]

Wrong. It's totally relevant, because if you are a vig, you are a huge idiot and cannot see what is staring you in the fucking face. Yet, I doubt you are, otherwise, I'd claim all my info and make you look like the idiot.

[Titus]

Elbrin/Fluff, care to CC her?

[Titus]

I'll prove you're town if you do and we can lynch her.

[Titus]

Then we'll have 3 conftowns, you/me/TSO and we can roll this shit. Then we lynch the other of Beli/Mollie tomorrow.

[Titus]

VOTE: Pirate Mollie

There we go.

[Titus]

Never figured rolehunting could come in handy but ika's right for once.

[Titus]

Why don't you realize that everything you have said has also been said by Elbrin/Fluff/the mod first? If so, why didn't you attack said posts...

[Titus]

@Elbrin, If Flubber is scum, your assertion is wrong.

I don't think Flubbers vig claim matters, even if he's lying scum, there's totally a vig in game.

...Or a Serial Killer.

Oh lol Flubbers a Serial Killer, I get it now.

AxleGreaser was

snicker-snacked

Night 1. He was

the Jabberwock, Suicidal Mafia.

One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went

snicker-snack

!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back.

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Suicidal

Okay, so here's my interpretation of events.

Axl was suicidal. I realize that it might be a bit foolish to take a bastard role at face value, but I must assume that his suicidalness follows the mechanics of the above linked wiki page. Meaning it was time based, either after X amount of night phases or after he made X amount of posts. Somehow, I can't see a scum being timed to die after *one* night. I also can't see how scum being timed to die = replacing scum factions night kill, because that is so town sided it's ludicrous. Furthermore, if Axl killed himself, why was he "Snicker-snacked"?

Here's what went down.
1. The Beamish Boy (Vigilante) took his Vorbal blade in hand, and slayed the Jabberwock.
2. We have either a JailKeeper or a Doctor who prevented the NK

For Mollie, before you steal thoughts, at least make sure its not obvious.

Second, if you believe the cop claim, why has your slot been defending Beli so hard.

Basic mafia 101 says lynch the guilty not the cop.

[Titus]

oh yes, other vig, don't mind hiding. You can claim.
then we will blow titus's mind together.

When he claims, your mind will be blown at your bad gambit. You see, I have already crumbed that the "other vig" ain't scum.

[Titus]

Your claim Mollie conftowns Elbrin. No ifs and or doubts about it. Even if I'm reading him wrong and you're the actual vig (unlikely), he's still conftown. So by shooting me, even if you are that moronic, you create a conftown.

[Titus]

Try adding 1 and 1 together.

Vig/SK shot Axle.
Elbrin is conftown because of 1.

What is the missing premise?

[Titus]

*snore*

titus is still scum guys

lets lynch her so then we can get on with vigging tso for that awful fake cop claim on beli.

So did he claim cop or didn't he?

[Titus]

I explicitly revoked Vig.

Here's a hint.

865 hugs. Hugs for all. My hugs make the world a better place.

[Titus]

Oh I'm not saying that elbirn is not a vig at all.

I am.

[Titus]

You two get together.

Talk to me when you've solved 865.

[Titus]

Then realize the fact that Elbrin stated that the kill was a vig kill before you claimed it. He forced Flubb to revoke his vig claim as well.

[Titus]

Not to mention that Elbrin agreed to kill Farside.

[Titus]

Well shit.

Elbrin's still fucking town.

I'm the doctor and I HEALED Elbrin.

That's why I buddied him and I wanted to follow his scumreads. That's because scum wanted to fucking kill him.

[Titus]

If the Vig/SK shot the dead scum, then Elbrin is totally fucking town.

[Titus]

My hugs are my healing action.

You happy now Mollie?

Can we lynch the scum?

Or do I have to be any more direct with you.

[Titus]

Elbrin said it before you. We had a whole discussion on who he should kill. (Punching = killing) So yeah I thought he was the vig and didn't buy your claim.

Since I thought he was the vig, him claiming would conftown him and we would net a scum.

Of course, my rolereading skills suck.


Yet, with me/TSO/Elbrin, there was no room for your vig claim either.

So now it can look like me/Mollie/TSO as the PRs.

Of course, since Beli's still claimed PR, we lynch him.

[Titus]

What can I say, I'm not subtle, but with a vig claim that's plausible now, I had to claim.

I wasn't going to outright claim when Farside was getting frustrated, but I literally did say EVERYTHING in the thread.

[Titus]

Mollie, there is no other vig. Stop it.

[Titus]

Do you at least fucking get it now?

Or are you absolutely just driving me up a wall being obtuse for no fucking reason?

[Titus]

Oh yes there is.

Prove it.

[Titus]

Why the hell would the other vig claim? That would just tell you to shoot them?

That's why I told Elbrin I'd conftown him if he claimed.

[Titus]

Also, where the fuck would their kill be?

[Titus]

Where's your evidence two players shot Axxle?

[Titus]

Mollie, put it in plain engligsh.

You shot Axxle

Other "Vig" shot ???

Scum shot Elbrin.

[Titus]

Then explain the evidence for it.

[Titus]

You explain the two vigs first.

Me/Elbrin are 100%
TSO is 90%
You are about 80% because you keep dicking around and not being straightforward.

[Titus]

No hints.

You know I'm town and Elbrin's town. If the game is breakable, just fucking break it already.

[Titus]

Le sigh.

So you shoot, take the sword and pass it?

[Titus]

Do you know who passed you the sword?

[Titus]

Can you submit yourself?

[Titus]

Well, now we just need TSO to confirm if he has a guilty on Beli.

If and when he does (less confident because Elbrin wasn't vig), we can lynch Beli. He'll become conftown.
The vig who actually shot Axxle can claim. They'll become conftown.

So then it's me/first shooter/Elbrin/TSO with Mollie as likely town. GG for the scum, get wrecked.

[Titus]

Now, I can get on board with that.

We start with Beli.

[Titus]

I'm out.

[Titus]

You should totally claim that unspecified PR.

I don't think there is a town motivation in doing so. It is a weak PR but town knowing really does not help but it does help scum somewhat if they know.

If enough town wants it then I will claim.

Claim it. Now.

I need all the info to determine my heal target.

[Titus]

Not necessarily. Claim.

[Titus]

FAQ should be vigged if Far or Beli is town.

VM, have you ever considered that you are offbase? Elbrin was obvious town. That is why I healed him. You missed obvious doc crumbs that were obvious to everyone else. Scum thought he was a good shot. So why did they? Beli or Far is likely scum.

[Titus]

That's when I started crumbing. how else do you think I got townread so hard?

Also the wagoning myself worked well not to be nked.

You know why I go to great lengths, because of constantly being dismissed.

[Titus]

If Faq2 is claiming that, then it's even better.
His role can create more conftown
we'll be like the ultimate

sex

Town machine

Unfortunately, that's why is claim is fake. He claims it Day 1, the setup is broken.

[Titus]

My bet is he is lynchproof if SCUM have the item.

[Titus]

Explain. TSO has a guilty and you want to lynch elsewhere. That's really fucking annoying. Doubly so when you can vig him.

Yet you reach for conftown play...why?

[Titus]

Except if you're scum with FAQ then we've proven nothing.

[Titus]

We lynch Beli. We vig the lynchproof.

[Titus]

Except if you're scum with FAQ then we've proven nothing.

why yes, we are scum with faq2 and far and who else do you wanna add in there

tso is not the cop.

*eyeroll*

Then we still Vig FAQ2 rather than wasting a lynch. We don't have to worry about you two being buddies.

If TSO is not cop, we lynch Beli or Farside.

[Titus]

Wrong again. Vigging FAQ nets a confirmation of your alignment. With me and Elbrin being confirmed town, that's 3 conftown.

If he flips scum, the game ends Day 3.

If he flips town, we have 3 conftowns in Day 3. 3 of me/TSO/you/Elbrin. Still victory confirmed.

He directly stated he wasn't crumbing. Twice.

[Titus]

So yeah if tso indeed have guilty, with my plan the game ends no longer than day 4.

Game ends Day 3. We lynch the fucking cop guilty.

Seriously did ika teach you nothing?

[Titus]

Ask Mollie if you should always lynch a guilty.

If FAQ is town telling the truth, his desire to self lynch is a desire to confirm you as town. If he's scum, he wants to confirm you both as town. Scum governor makes a hell of a lot of sense with a suicidal scum.

[Titus]

You also would not push for FA lynch if you were not aligned with FA.

[Titus]

Governor overturns a lynch Mollie.

[Titus]

By Mollie I mean VM.

[Titus]

I'd total support my own lynch to have people stop sheeping players that don't scum hunt well too by the by.

That by definition is terrible scumhunting.

[Titus]

I want Far's flavor kthx.

oh and VM: I wasn't being catty towards you I was making a catty comment.

I'm sooooo no following the player that tunnel's and can't be reasoned with that thinks they know it all.

vote: Tso

fake scum guilty bro?

Who would that be?

Oh and we are not lynching TSO.

[Titus]

So conftown suspecting you isn't enough by itself?

How about your petulant hosility?

[Titus]

Then why did you not fucking say so? You were hard claiming a guilty.

Most people with faced with stop softing cop admit or revoke.

You can be policy lynched TSO if you do not have one hell of an explanation.

[Titus]

Claim while you are at it.

I will reassess when not pissed off.

[Titus]

And Beli better fucking claim too since we are fucking massclaiming.

[Titus]

@Elbrin, your theory is off. My flavor isn't even in your poem.

I am the head celebrant. O frabulous joy is in my pm.

[Titus]

Lynchproofs are vigged. Period. I will not vote to lynch you FAQ.

[Titus]

VOTE: Beli

Mollie stop being bribed with illusions of conftown if you are town.

A scum governor confirms no one as town.

A lynchproof claim should always be vigged.

That claim is literally the perfect way to get us to no lynch.

[Titus]

Governor works by making a lynch into a no lynch. :nod:

If that hsppens, we have confirmed nothing.

Also Elbrin is confirmed town and so am I.

[Titus]

Nobody uses the wiki definition of the governor bc 1-shot lynchproof does it better.
I've seen governors and none of them followed the wiki definition.

Well you have just provided two reasons why lynching FAQ2 does not confirm you as town.

Wiki governor AND 1-shot lynchproof.

So why is lynching a claimed lynchproof a good idea?

[Titus]

The wiki governor is the one I see routinely.

[Titus]

Or we just vig him and scumhunt.

I am not a fan of wasting lynches.

Of course scum would want us to waste lynches on someone that cannot be lynched.

[Titus]

The sword seems like the perfect way to counter lynchproof scum.

If I had enough conftown, yes.

If it's Mollie speaking, even the cop can be scum.

[Titus]

If we count faq2 as scum, then we have a modified vig (utility) that can grant scum a double kill if poorly used, doctor (protective), and... that's it.

You forget you have not forced Beli to claim.

The sword is immediately leashed upon town being aware of it. It's a double lynch regardless of who has it.

[Titus]

I also would vig a cop if I had enough conftown.

[Titus]

Then there's no way that FAQ can be a cop role.

The game devolves into follow the cop.

[Titus]

Fine I guess we will compromise on not vigging him but if we hit lylo and you both are still alive, I am lynching you. Period.

[Titus]

Now vote Beli to force him to finish this massclaim.

[Titus]

I agree I likely die.

Mod: What happens if the person carrying the sword dies?

Btw, Beli is at L minus 1 and still has not claimed.